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So I just got done reading The Fear of Intmacy board under The Psychology of BPD.  Someone sent me the link yesterday in one of my posts.  I want to make sure though I understand this pertaining to my own r/s with my exBPDbf though.

We had a whirlwind of a r/s with him pushing for us to get closer and closer.  In the month prior especially, now looking back to before I've since found out he started seeking my replacement on a online dating site, he was becoming especially needy wanting me around constantly.  He had been talking about us moving in together and had even asked me if I'd consider getting married again.  He kept telling me he'd love me forever and would ask me to say it back to him.  I mean he really picked up the pace on pushing for even more closeness and intimacy between us.  It was pretty intense.

Come December I let him know that I couldn't constantly be at his house when he'd ask me to come over.  I work a week on and a week off on 3rd shift, we live an hour apart and I have two children of my own and Christmas was coming.  I only had so much time on my off week so we didn't get to be together as much as we wanted to be. For a long time too, now that I think about it, he wanted me to switch to 1st shift so we could be together more.  He hated it when it was my week on.  Well anyway, in the beginning of December,  I noticed he kind of started playing games like not answering the phone but texting me at the same time so I knew he could have answered.  And I let him know that ticked me off.  I hated texting.  He seemed sad at times and others like he was using what I just described to provoke a reaction like my sympathy so that I'd come rushing over by his house but I didn't fall for it. I was getting a little ticked because it felt kind of manipulating so I resisted his little games.

Was he trying to pull me back in with his little games?  When I refused to play that game, is that when he started maybe mulling over that maybe I possibly might leave him?  Plus I had been also talking about visiting my BFF who lives 800 miles away soon and I know he wasn't happy about that.  Before I met him, my plan was to move there and throughout our r/s he'd ask me sometimes if I'd ever leave him to move there  and seeking my reassurance I wouldn't just leave him suddenly to move away.  I'd tell him no of course not!  I had stayed here BECAUSE I met him and loved him.

So now I see a link between when his little "tests" came up, the things he may of been thinking that he feared might make me leave and the fact that I was spending less time with him beginning in the end of November,  and about the time he must have set up his profile online to start seeking my replacement around the beginning of December.

On 12/29 he called me and insisted that the following week I was off, we finalize plans for me to move into his house.  He said he wanted a commitment from me and to have me there every day.  He was adamant about it.  By 12/31, I was dumped for my replacement. On 1/1, that's when he called and raged at me saying he hated me and never wanted to see me again and that he'd bash my face in if I were in front of him.

So if intimacy = fear of abandonment and fear of abandonment means he has to abandon first, then he bolted because he wanted all these things from me but was afraid I'd leave him  because lately I hadn't  been "feeding" him as much so to speak? So he had to get me first?  It was so brutal the way he did it, was I also being punished because he perceived the above things as hurtful and mean towards him?  Where does fear of engulfment fit in like a few people have mentioned in my other posts?  Even though I don't think I have this totally right here just yet,  I might be catching on soon.  His actions are kind starting to make sense to me now when looking at it from his perspective.  It's kind of a relief in a way.  This wasn't me then.  They don't really want to reject us do they?  Their thought processes mean they have to for their own emotional protection?  Correct me or clarify where I need it please.  I feel the need to understand this to help let go.  Maybe I shouldn't feel that way but I do to be honest.  Thanks and I am feeling a bit better today than I was yesterday btw.

Hi mjssmom,


My understanding is that for people with BPD (pwBPD) intimacy and familiarity can be a trigger for their disordered feelings (i.e. fear of abandonment).  As I see it, you can only be abandoned by people whom you depend upon.  You cannot be abandoned by a complete stranger.  Also for pwBPD, they have other reasons why they experience this fear in a more exaggerated (and disordered) way.  When they are with you, and they experience this fear/anxiety, they demand that you demonstrate your commitment and prove that you have no intention of leaving them.  But because they also *lack object constancy* (consider looking this up) when we are not immediately with them, they experience much much greater separation anxiety than anyone would expect from an adult.

I don't think one can *ever* give them enough security to abate their fear of abandonment -- because the root cause of their fear and disorder has nothing to do with us.  Even if you could be glued to the hip to him for several months, you would only be prolonging the inevitable (in my opinion).


He had to avoid his *imagined* abandonment.  And he avoided abandonment by being the one who abandons.  What he perceived as hurtful and mean towards him has little or nothing to do with what you actually did.  It's like, he experiences an pain and hurt for reasons he doesn't understand that has something to do with being hurt and put in pain by someone he once depended upon and deeply trusted in his past (i.e. a parent or guardian), and you are the most available target to project these feelings onto.  When you are not around, and he goes through the same pattern, he will blame the next person he feels this way towards.  In the past, it was someone else.  This is one of the diagnostic criteria for BPD: a pattern of intense and unstable interpersonal relationships.


I don't subscribe to the description of "fear of engulfment."  I see it all as fear of abandonment - I see them pushing us away as a means of avoiding abandonment.  But I think that "fear of engulfment" helps people understand why pwBPD might push us away.  Because for non-disordered people, when we experience intimacy and closeness, we are not triggered to experience fear that we will be abandoned **** UNLESS we have also had some experience of abandonment in our own lives.

As you recover from your experience, in the future when you start to consider being involved with someone, you may experience this fear.  When you start to feel close to someone, you will be reminded of your current vulnerability and it will cause you to hesitate and perhaps retreat.  This is a normal reaction.  But you will need to work through it in order to have a healthy relationship (if that is what you want for yourself).

This is my approximation to "fear of engulfment."


Their disorder makes it impossible (IMO) to have a sustained intimate adult relationship.  The only way to have a stable relationship with a pwBPD is to have compatible issues.  For example, if we are afraid of intimacy, then perhaps we would never get close enough to time to trigger their fear of abandonment to the degree that it makes the relationship unstable.  My parents, I believe, have compatible disorders; they've been together for five decades; I wouldn't want their relationship -- I don't think they are mostly happy -- but they are in a "stable" relationship.

I hope some of this helps.

Best wishes,

Schwing

Thank you for your detailed explanation.  I just feel the need to really understand this so I can put it in perspective.  It helps ease my own anxiety I'm feeling about what happened to try to think from his point of view. 

I do have to ask in regards to all of this.  What about recycling then?  My therapist and a friend who was treated for BPD thinks it's highly likely he'll try to contact me again once this current relationship is done. I don't think so myself but they do. I don't know why he'd bother with me again considering the way he threw me away the first time.  But my therapist feels I should work on being emotionally prepared for it anyway.

How do they pick whom they are going to attempt to recycle?  Why me for instance vs. another ex or just going out to find a new relationship?   Honestly I know next to nothing about his prior relationships until this happened with us and his sister told me this has happened before.  What's going on in a person with BPD head that they want to go back to the very person they nearly destroyed?

"So if intimacy = fear of abandonment and fear of abandonment means he has to abandon first, then he bolted because he wanted all these things from me but was afraid I'd leave him  because lately I hadn't  been "feeding" him as much so to speak? So he had to get me first?  It was so brutal the way he did it, was I also being punished because he perceived the above things as hurtful and mean towards him?  Where does fear of engulfment fit in like a few people have mentioned in my other posts? "



No, he didn't split because y'all became close and he thought you'd abandon him. Fear of abandonment brings them closer. He became engulfed (fear of/feeling of losing  oneself in another) the closer y'all got, which resulted in him being nasty to you to drive you away and then he split. When that subsides (engulfment), be prepared for his fear of abandonment kicking in, at which time he will likely contact you. I wrote this on another post of yours. If you decide to re-engage him, you will have begun a recycle.

Hey mjss,

I'm glad to hear you are doing better.  You also seem to be getting the gist of what BPD is for you and to your loved one. 


What's going on?  It's a good question. what do you think?

I do have to ask in regards to all of this.  What about recycling then?  My therapist and a friend who was treated for BPD thinks it's highly likely he'll try to contact me again once this current relationship is done. I don't think so myself but they do. I don't know why he'd bother with me again considering the way he threw me away the first time.  But my therapist feels I should work on being emotionally prepared for it anyway.

mjssmom,

I think that your therapist and your friend are correct. If your exSO's behavior is a result of BPD, it's very likely that he will return at some point, and very possibly before the new relationship has ended, so I wouldn't use that as an indicator of when to expect something to happen.

Their behavior is not driven by rational thinking; it is driven by emotional immaturity coupled with the inability to self-soothe/self-regulate said emotions. He quickly swooned you and discarded you because he has an attachment disorder. The discard is a maladapted coping mechanism that he has learned over the years. On the same note, he can just as quickly run to you and tell you that you're the love of his life----that too being a maladapted coping mechanism.

As far as a recycle, no one recycles unwillingly. If he attempts to re-engage you, it is not up to him if y'all will recycle; that is your responsibility. Take ownership of that now so that you can control it. You are on the right track with your therapist, getting emotionally prepared. This is a fine opportunity for self-discovery and growth.

If you ever understand them, please clue the rest of us in. LOL!

One thing you said - and man, I can identify with it - when you asked "sonit wasn't me then?"  No, it wasn't you.  You did have a role but not in his BPD.

They don't want to push us away, but they do.  Theirs is a constant state of opposite extremes - with the highest extremes accompanying the more emotionally stressful situations.  Chances are he did mean it when he wanted you to move in but then he split in his thinking and became convinced of the opposite.  From there the pattern of behavior seems pretty typical - and there isn't anything you could have done to prevent it.