BPDFamily.com

I don't know if you have any of these issues but here is a couple of mine in post-BPD dating, but here are a few of mine:

1. This might be a little narcissistic of me - but wow, it felt amazing that I was so important to her and that she thought so highly of me and I also thought I had won the companionship lottery with her. Finally, the universe was going to reward me for working my butt off and raising two little girls by myself. I get my second chance. The attention was heavy but somehow that just become the norm. I remember telling her in a light-hearted fashion to cool down with the compliments because they made me a tad bit uncomfortable.

2.BPD sex is not normal sex. I've heard this from so many other people on here, and I have to agree. They are not really in it for themselves ( which is a turn off after you realize this ) but are finely tuned in to your every need, as for them it's a tool to keep you hooked. I found normal sex to be a little lackluster.

3. The speed of relationships: BPD relationships usually go at breakneck speeds. Normal healthy relationships where you gradually get to know the other person - well they take time of course. Still, the slower speed doesn't seem normal.

4. The energy of the idealization phase can be really exciting. Mirroring makes sure that you have everything in the world in common with the other person. In healthy relationships, you will be two different individuals with his or her own interest, opinions, and personalities. This is great because it lets both people grow, but it might not be something you have seen in a while.

5. Loneliness. I have been through breakups before and yea, they aren't great... .but life goes on. This is not the same if you manage to make it out of a BPD relationship.

Between the traumatization from the rollercoaster of highs and low and the high amount of attention that you can receive, stepping into a world that is much quieter and peaceful can seem very bizarre.

I'm alright with this, but I have found myself not really depressed, but a little melancholic and restless at times.

Before; the only drink you have in your world is bottled water. Water is great. It’s really refreshing and quenches your thirst. You like it a lot. It makes you feel good drinking it... .

Then; whisky cola is added into your world. After years and years of water whisky cola blows your mind. The flavors are amazing and it makes you feel awesome. You feel confident and clever and handsome. It leaves such a good after taste... .you always have such an awesome time with whisky cola... .Then the drunkenness and you drink so much you make a fool of yourself but youre so drunk you don’t realize. You throw up. You can’t understand why you are so drunk and feel like the whole world is spinning.  The hangovers are terrible... .But whisky cola it’s so great... .as soon as you get over the hangover you are in the bar drinking whisky cola again... .

Then one day you wake up and all the whisky cola has been removed from the world and you have to go back to drinking bottled water... .It’s never the same again... .

Great analogy.

Its less intense but its kind of amazing by itself. I had been in the devaluing phase for over a year, where literally everything I did was wrong. I help someone move a few things and hang some mirrors and a TV and I'm the most amazing person in the world.

I move every one of my ex's belongings and put together her new place, and I get nothing but criticism for how I do it, eventually a begrudging thank you, and then I get to take her out to dinner. I almost don't know what to do with compliments at this point.

The other thing thats confusing is not having to handle someone else's needs continuously. Managing their emotions and blood sugar and levels of sleep and keeping it all in sync to avoid common issues. Then all of a sudden being with an adult who knows when they're getting hungry, and doesn't throw a temper tantrum. I keep waiting for that other foot to drop and am so surprised it doesnt.

Yessir. All are great advice on moving onto healthy relationships.

I find being in a reciprocal r/s different and awesome at the same time. Someone else mentioned being in one sided r/s, I can’t go back to that. What are your thoughts Super Hew82?

I too am trying to adjust and get back into dating. I could relate to
your points. One thing that came to mind for me was about sex. I felt a deep connection with my ex through sex, until she explained to me point blank that she separated sex and love. I couldn't believe her at the time, but she was revealing the truth, and it taught me a lesson about moving too fast. This is just my particular case, but I wanted to share. I thought we had something intimate , but were actually quite on different pages the whole time. Now, I feel pretty turned off to the idea of sex until I believe the other person is emotionally available. That's my take anyhow.
I relate to where you are coming from though--a lot of your points speak to the addictive appeal. The quick fix has its appeal, but I think you can get there with someone else. It just takes more time. Personally, I think we will appreciate even more a relationship that works, and what once seemed so appealing to us before will seem like a bad habit and an illusion. It's one possibility. Another thought is I think it is reasonable to enjoy someone adoring you. I think it is definitely possible to connect with someone who does and in a sustainable way. If it happens very quickly though, that may be suspicious.
These are just my personal thoughts. Your post helped me because I can relate, so thank you for sharing.

I can relate to your melancholy. Very good choice of a word other than just plain depressed because it seems like it won't go away. And now since there's no more whisky cola, your just eating plain mana (The food God provided for the Jews when they were in the desert for 40 years).

Its been 10 months and it really doesn't feel that long. Everything you've described about how the BPD mirrors and idolizes you is so tempting to want again but we know its not real. I think what helps is knowing these symptoms and now its recognizable. I hope its making this easier for you.

Little over 4 mos. For me. Ice avoided any event my exBPD might be at in the past 4 weeks. Today is one I would like to attend, but I just can't say I won't be sucked in again. I still think of her daily.

Particular attention to my post "clingy" breakup behavior. Constant emails begging for reconciliation. Unsure how bad she felt, so I poured it on about my broken heart. I became the Borderline. She was the NPD. So suggests my T.

Now I'm experienceing the reverse.

I met a woman online for one coffee date. Great connection but no attraction.
I Texted her about a phone call. I got busy with work and Texted for a rain check. She said ok and suggested after this last weekend, thus, yesterday or today.

On Saturday night , while trying to sleep at 10 pm, I get a series of her texts about how I suck and broke her heart.
WT the heck?
I only met this woman once. Never gave off any signals (I'm an avg. guy and old)
Walked her to her car and kissed her on her cheek. Standard first meeting protocal in my old world.
Now I'm getting texts every night about breaking her heart.

Deja vu in reverse? But after only one meeting?

How long had you been talking to the person had you speaking online ? Had you had many in deep conversations etc ? etc

SuperJew82, great post, I agree with you. Since I have three children (D11, D9 and S8) and full custody, I cannot escape from the uxBPDw.

Now that I do understand much more than I did about pwBPD, I realize it was inevitable that the r/s would come to an end. I truly have no feelings for her as her court petitions continue for her quest for more parenting time, she has just become my most bitter enemy I ever had and assuredly will ever know.

I don't miss a thing about her.

Very little. 4 e-messages of where , when & what time to meet. Very innocuous e.g. "look forward to meeting". Absolutely no flirting. Nothing after the meeting other than setting a mutual time to talk via phone. Never did talk via phone.
 
Then she started a voluminous texting barrage of " you suck".

No "love bombing" like with the exBPD I keep recovering from.
Btw, I'm not attending the event she will likely be attending. It's outdoors and it's raining and cold. Plus, I'm done with thoughts of a reunion.

I've had huge help from this family, my Christian support group and my T.
I'm working on myself and my future, even if without a companion.

Looks like you're preparing for rain as per the movie "Facing the Giants".

beezleconduit,

That sounds way out of proportion to the way you described your initial interactions. I'd be triggered by all of that.

T

So, in my humble opinion, I'm going to say that after a BPD experience - you should be sure that your "cray-dar" (forgive me for this term I made up) is sensibly calibrated for future field use.

This is tricky because it can be easy to put the SNR ( signal-to-noise ) ratio way off and pick up on so many false red-flags that are not there in future endeavors. This can make you miss out on something good.

On the other hand, you do want to take your new wisdom and become aware of things that you turned a blind-eye to before to avoid going through... .whatever you would like to call your BPD experience ... .again. If you are picking up on something evident, take the safe route and avoid it. Talk about your experience with a friend to get a sanity check if you are not sure. Listen to your friends - that is one thing I should have done from the start. So many times my friends have tried to delicately try to put me in the right direction. I even distanced a handful of them from all of this.

I'm 35 and have fully recognized that the dating scene is not as wonderous as it was when I was 23. The prevalence of all sorts of disorders is at least doubled. Online dating is even worse.

With that being said, there have to be some wonderful people out there that not unlike me, are looking for their second chance and are capable of working towards a healthy relationship.

Mutt,

It's really hard to see that a relationship is one-sided or not when your in this position. When you are in the middle of it, it can seem just a bidirectional as a major highway.

I'm not in a relationship right now. I tried and went on a few dates and had some fun meeting new people, but I found out that my heart wasn't into it and it wasn't fair to myself and to others to date when I wasn't ready.

My exDBPD girlfriend, M, would get off of work at the hospital (Nurse) around 9 at night and have a cigarette outside on my porch. I didn't smoke, but I would sit outside with her and talk about all sorts of things.

It's been over four months since I've seen or talked to her, but I still go outside at night after I put my girls to bed and sit in the chair underneath the tree and cry for a few minutes as I think about her.

When I stop doing that, maybe that will be a sign that I'm ready to move on. Letting go of the woman you loved the most hurts like nothing I have ever experienced. She may not have loved me in the same way that I loved her - but that doesn't change the fact that I did.

There will always be opportunities in the universe to recalibrate your craydar. Try at least talking to people who have finally also stepped out there when they've also finially stopped cryin, hollerin, and yodelin. The baggage and damaged goods, well, we all have some, but beware of the victim. the one who was always the one who repeatedly had to leave their past relationships. The "perfect one" who always talks about them, and their cray cray family just a little too much. red-flag Just recently had to throw back a good, so-called,  "perfect"catch.

Yeah, that does seem a little bit over-reactive. Something doesn't sound right about that interaction, sounds like she came into it with too much expectation or expecting validation. I wish you all the best in future dates and relationships

Im so glad to be reading this, as I have just had this exact same experience. It felt way too good to be true. She said how much of a people pleaser she was with her ex etc. Talked bad about her mother and father, messaged me the day after just replying to my text in a good way, then she completely changed, as if she was a different person as to how we were before. Sent her couple more texts, over next couple days as we arranged another date. Ghosted me and only replied when I said about meeting up for the date, then replied couple days later saying. I'm sorry this isn't for me and don't wish to continue this, I should of let you know sooner, sorry. She sounded very avoidant or ego boost or whatever.

I know we have to pay attention to red flags and things, however, i had some difficulties with family (BPD mother) and previous relationships (BPD ex). I know this has affected me.

These have both affected my self-esteem and self-acceptance which I am working on and only date people with the same morals to me and life plans/goals etc. If I have to avoid everyone with red flags, does that mean everyone is going to avoid me? I don't think its common now for people to have completely drama/trauma-free lives.

Having dysfunction in your childhood can easily teach you what is acceptable in a relationship. There was something wrong with my dad (not sure how to classify him) and a mom that wasn't strong enough to stand up to him.

I know I'm oversimplifying the mechanics here - but I'm pretty sure that kind of had something to do with me putting up with unhealthy behaviour for as long as I have in past relationships.

I really want my Folks here to check out the Jerry Wise Relationship System on UTube. He's a relationship expert for adults who had alcoholic, narcissistic, BPD, and all around toxic parents and caregivers. He has over a hundred videos on there. I've learned so much about the deficits in myself and why I went for crazy beautiful woo woos, the grieving process, and what to do when you see those fleas from your parents on yourself and others.

on the subject of "craydar"  :)

its also true that we can be hypervigilant in the aftermath of our relationships, looking for these things. this makes it difficult to be emotionally available and just get to know someone; we have walls up and are searching for dysfunction.

but i think these things dont have to be so scary if we arent drawn to them ourselves. for example, we often describe things like "mirroring" and "idealization" as "red flags". well, in reality idealization is very normal in the honeymoon stage of a relationship. its even normal in a therapeutic relationship, or it might be normal to idealize your MD. mirroring is essential for bonding; the mirroring from our mothers was crucial in our own development of a sense of self.

i realized, however, i had a strong need to be on the receiving end of mirroring in order to feel that spark. so it wasnt the mirroring/idealization that was a threat, per se, it was the effect that it had on me. taking that a bit further, i realized most of my exes pursued me first; my attraction was based more on how the other person made me feel than what i liked about them as a person. i focus my screening a bit more on the latter these days.

so, lets walk through these:


the idealization made me uncomfortable, too, because however highly i might or might not think of myself, i know im not a perfect individual, and no one lives on a pedestal forever. idealization is inherently over the top, even if relatively normal. if i had to guess (and i am guessing) i would bet that despite your discomfort, this made you feel both safe and understood in a way you hadnt felt before.  


i think theres no such thing as "BPD sex". theres really nothing about the DSM traits of someone with BPD that lends itself to being above average in bed. it gets interesting when you break this down member to member; views on sex, importance of sex, approaches to sex, etc. its fair to say, generally speaking, that sex is important in a relationship. like anything else, we can place too much importance on it. we can "get hooked" on it, and as you say, you find "normal sex" to be lackluster.

having said that, where might BPD play into this: we all have our methods of courting and means of "hooking" partners we are attracted to, to lesser or greater degrees (some we are more conscious of than others). a generally insecure person will certainly have theirs. someone with BPD traits may use sex as a means to regulate themselves emotionally, they may use it as a means to feel closer to you (not inherently a bad thing), they may also use it to compensate for low self esteem.


all true, or at least mostly true. remember, though, that you said you found the speed uncomfortable but proceeded. speaking for myself, a slower pace is what i prefer, but it can also make me insecure and like my partner isnt interested enough. some pairings do move pretty quickly - plenty of rebound relationships, for example, have stood the test of time. why? because ultimately both parties are able to get on the same page, are compatible, and build trust and intimacy. its not the speed alone, its about both parties.

in other words, if you "check yourself" so to speak, live according to your values and boundaries, most of these things are nothing to be afraid of.

nowadays, "red flag" means, to me, stuff like criminal behavior, generally poor treatment of others, and a personal one is excessive jealousy/possessiveness.

Once - never to you cease to point out some very interesting ideas that make me look back and re-think things.
I wish I had more time in my daily life to invest in this forum - but one forward-thinking item that caught my attention was how I ended up with partners.

Yes, you are right. I very rarely pursue women. I might approach them, but if they don't show a certain level of interest in me - I kind of lose focus on them. My idea is that I only want someone who is interested in me. Going after someone seemed like a waste of time. Maybe it was a way to avoid rejection too?

This evidently has NOT been working for me. As my two relationships in the past decade have been with an Avoidant Personality Disordered and a Borderline Personality Disordered individual. APD is still a walk in the park compared to BPD ( as they are kind of totally opposite of each other ), IMHO.

sounds like youre onto something, SuperJew82. i can relate. at this stage in my life i dont have the confidence or the experience to approach a woman.

the lesson is really what this says about you, and the work is to figure that out, and it sounds like youre having an "aha moment" which is a sign to follow that trail and keep digging. in my case i turned up lots of things: fear of rejection, lack of confidence, and most eye opening, unconscious fear of intimacy.

the lesson is definitely not "if a woman approaches me it is a red flag" or, necessarily, "the way to avoid this outcome is to do all of the approaching". nothing sexier than a confident gal who approaches you!

the lesson might be the effect that this kind of attention has on you: if its not shown, you lose interest. you can become more mindful of this and make the necessary changes to get out of habits/styles that are no longer suiting you. you can start switching gears toward the interest you have in them. attention/idealization arent inherently a threat to anyone. if you put too much stock in them, you will struggle when things mellow out (idealization to devaluation: why we struggle https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=161524.0), or if the relationship crashes and burns. you might over compensate and be rejected and internalize that.

but what i keep harping on for a reason is that fears and habits like this can control our lives in ways that can be hard to see. the insidious thing is that we often choose partners that reinforce these fears, we become more fearful, the cycle perpetuates. its not as if there werent healthy gals that i pursued and who were initially receptive. ultimately i either found superficial reasons for ruling them out, or in most cases, i overpursued and pushed them away, which reinforced my fears and negative beliefs about myself. it doesnt have to be that way. we can learn, grow, change, and become the solution.

dont navigate the dating world with fear. build yourself into a powerhouse. be the guy that conquers the dating world  *)

I would like to comment on the "BPD sex" - It is true that there is nothing in the DSM traits that refer to above normal sex and pwBPD. For me, as a young man when I met my ex, it had more to do with how I felt to her reaction of having sex with me. Maybe part of the idealization or even mirroring? I don't think I was below average in the bedroom but if such a beautiful woman constantly wanted to have sex with me (2-3 times per day at the time), I must be awesome in bed right? My ex was probably no better in bed and maybe not as good as some before her but:

1) She was by far the most attractive woman that I was ever with and she constantly wanted to have sex with me!
2) She liked to have sex in adventurous (risky) environments. Like the men's bathroom at a bar or in an alley in
    large downtown metro area.
3) Not that I ever remember any of my other ex's telling me that they were dissatisfied but my BPD ex seemed over the
    top satisfied by having sex with me. Much more than any other partner.
Just my $.02

Again please excuse my anecdotal statements - but yes I would have to agree with you on the part that they used sex in a much different way than other healthier people have.

Even the bpdfamily.com articles mention this in the " How a BPD relationship evolves article

https://bpdfamily.com/content/how-borderline-relationship-evolves

But most of this, just like the idealization phase, is most likely temporary. When we were "stable" for a few months or more - she would avoid sex and even telling me how I was forcing myself on her and " Is this how your ex-wife felt " when I would try to subtly initiate something etc... .

I predict it would have only been "awesome" during the recycling / cycle phase.

i dont think we have a disagreement that people with BPD traits may use sex in an unhealthy way SJ. but to reiterate, someone being above average in bed is not a threat. if you meet someone great in bed, whats going to happen? will you be hooked? will you determine they have BPD and "run"? will you be evenly matched and on the same page?

the question here is whether or not we use/used sex in an unhealthy way ourselves. two people using sex in unhealthy ways creates a messy bond.

i think the challenge before you now, as you navigate the dating world, is to explore this.

here are some really great places to start:

TEST | What has been your Sexual style (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=299932)
The Role of Sex in Dysfunctional Relationships (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=299970)
Passionate Marriage - David Schnarch PhD (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=299659)

This is more of an observation for me, nothing I'm really worried about. I'll read the articles of course.

All I want is a companion, someone to talk to, someone who isn't going to send me into a downward spiral of confusion.

I might not ever find anyone and that's not the end of the world. Although I'm single, I'm never alone!

At this point, just being with my friends makes me content right now. I need some more of them! I kind of neglected my social life over the past couple of years - I need to "make SJ great again" :P

-roger

Okay a little out of scope here - but I was skimming over some post and found Sherly Crow tells the story just right:

"Strong Enough"

God, I feel like hell tonight
Tears of rage I cannot fight
I'd be the last to help you understand
Are you strong enough to be my man, my man?

Nothing's true and nothing's right
So let me be alone tonight
Cause you can't change the way I am
Are you strong enough to be my man?

Lie to me
I promise I'll believe
Lie to me
But please don't leave, don't leave

I have a face I cannot show
I make the rules up as I go
Just try and love me if you can
Are you strong enough to be my man, my man?

Are you strong enough to be my man?
Are you strong enough to be my man?
Are you strong? My man.

When I've shown you that I just don't care
When I'm throwing punches in the air
When I'm broken down and I can't stand
Would you be man enough to be my man?

Lie to me
I promise I'll believe
Lie to me
But please don't leave

*** No, I'm not strong enough. I shouldn't have to be that strong.

Yes. SJ.
Time to move on with new knowledge of what to be aware of when meeting someone new.

I've come to the realization that God's plan may not include another woman in my life. That is not how I am to define myself. It must come from within my own soul.
Thanks for the insight.

Hi Beezle,
  Your posts here have resonated with me. My H of 10 years filed for divorce in August, and I was emotionally devastated, i.e.: sliding down the wall, crying kind of devastated.
  Luckily, I've been seeing my therapist/coach for the past seven years, and in between crying, I told her that, given my age (I'm in my 60s), and given the need to heal from all the s**t my H put me through, I'd be 70 before I'd even want to date, let alone remarry.

Her response? To work on my healing as the divorce process goes forward, and who knows, maybe I'll be ready to date the second the ink dries on that final decree.

My response? To go out onto dating sites for older people to see if I can even attract someone at my age. Kind of got hung up on it, actually. Then, after I reassured myself that I was indeed still capable of attracting men to me, I realized, as you seem to have realized, that maybe there'll be a relationship in my future, and maybe there won't. And I'm okay with that.

I have friends, kids, grandkids, and more animals than any person ought to have, and I am content being un-partnered for now.

TMD

Did I say "Months" ? I meant "Years".

TMD
I'm happy for you.
It's alright to know validation of oneself is a quest for inner peace by looking within instead of outward at material items or other human beings.
I've made a fair share of mistakes, but now learning from them and appreciate the battle scars.
My ex wife is remarried. I'm happy for her. I was so desperate to validate myself I latched onto a woman that unfortunately suffers from a PD.
I learned a lot from the experience. Never knew anything about BPD or even considered myself narcissistic capable. Now I know what I need to work on for myself and my remaining life. At 57 I thought I was being a gentleman to my exBPD. She was 45, gorgeous blonde that I treated like a trophy, not a human with emotional challenges.
It all works out for us if we are willing to look inward at ourselves.
TWD , I bet your a gorgeous woman, inside and out, that will attract men when your ready. If we lived in the same town and I met a woman with your self awareness? Well, it would be a nice conversation. Good luck.