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Good Day

I have slipt down a board, just tolerating is probably an apt description.

 I have endured weeks of anger on the part of my pwBPD, external locus of control - blame everyone else for all his problems, of course I know this is a feature of the illness. He has tried to upset my family by sending nasty texts - threatens to tell all and sundry how evil I am, wishes me dead, only stays with me so that he can get my money when I die, oh and of course he cant live with my RAGES!, MY ANGER!, my ALCOHOLISM!

You might note the capitals indicate his behaviours not mine, amazing how projection works.

Now its not the first time it has happened, I suspect much of it is triggered by my setting clear boundaries e.g. I will not communicate with you if you shout abuse or threaten me, I will leave the situation until you have calmed down.

Anyway have pretty much decided enough is enough - I have no need for somebody like this in my life, its probably going to get tougher for a while but I will not be emotionally abused in my own home.

Hi ortac77,

Good day to you too! :)

I hear ya! When we get firmer about boundaries we often see even stronger eruptions!

What kind of plan are you putting together? Are you going to ask your partner to move out?

wishing you peace, pearl.

Hey ortac77, I admire your resolve and clear statement of your boundary about not being emotionally abused in your own home.  Or anywhere else, I would add!  Keep up the good work.

LuckyJim

Thanks Pearl & Lucky Jim

Moving him out may have to be the option, that still feels like the 'nuclear option', after all he is ill and I am a compassionate person. The good thing at the moment is I am away with work allowing me a bit of space.

What is clear is that things have to change, I am making those changes for me and so I can understand that this is going to lead to 'eruptions'.

Thanks for your support

Hi ortac77,

It's been a couple of days.  How are things going?

WW

Hi

I have been away with work for a few days so out of direct contact, must say its been good to sleep well and get a break - I am home Wednesday and will see how things are then?

Yes, work travel can sometimes be a blessing.  Glad you're getting some rest!  Keep us posted.

WW

Ortac77,

I would challenge you to be proactive about your homecoming.  What can you do that would reasonably be expected to "nudge" the relationship in a better direction?

I applaud you making changes for you.  It will pay great dividends!

FF

Hi FormFlier

I am trying to be, after a few fraught phone calls yesterday he has agreed a three way meeting with his CPN on Thursday - I am hoping that this might help us to find some common ground or at least re start a process of communicating. Certainly I am trying to keep an open mind and be calm when I get back later today.

He is still 'testing' - a series of earlier texts were not pleasant, he is looking forward to me bringing him duty free cigarettes but not seeing me - I have really stopped taking much notice of these texts now, do not reply and do not take any notice of the barbed comments.

So breath, take it slowly, listen if he is reasonable, exit for a period if still angry and abusive and continue to value me. Having re-read some of 'Walking on Eggshells' - I can really see that my sticking to my boundaries is promoting his escalating anger - I do know that I have to be consistent and stick to them.

Good Morning ortac77,

Yes, when boundaries are enforced, there is a certain degree of "blowback" most times... .like when a child has something taken away due to bad behaviors... .I have thought about this phenomenon a lot, this is like some kind of a mutually shared "drug" between the pw/BPD, and the non... .we seem to exists is a constant state of push and pull, ie’ when things are heated/steamed, and the air is thick with anxiety due to the BPD’ism’s… we are waiting on the recycle to occur, like holding your breath in a smoke filled compartment, or room.

Then the recycle occurs, and darkness becomes light again, a window is opened, and the smoke/toxic steam leaves the room, and we get to breathe again, the air is cleared, happy daze, happy daze… the rush of peace (perceived normality) between the non and the pw/BPD returns for a moment, this is what is called intermittent positive reward, and it only lasts for an amount of time until the inevitable BPD behaviors return again (colored black)… it’s a never ending cycle, and as I always say, quite exhausting.

This  red-flag“intermittent positive reward” red-flag is the drug you see, and the pw/BPD is providing the hit, the sip of the ever so exquisite liquor that we the non; so crave, being peace and tranquility within the relationship, albeit fleeting and only for a moment, until the hit wears off, and we are once more waiting for the next cup full of “intermittent positive reward” from our pw/BPD… sometimes the withdrawal is pretty rough for the non, as in ST, or raging, or whatever the BPD behavior may be… we once again wait it out, waiting for the “other” pw/BPD to come back to us again, the “other person” we supposedly love to love, the one who is “normal”, not angry, nice, sweet, and not in our grill 24/7… that’s the question, why do we put up with this never ending cycle ?

Are we indeed rewarding these bad behaviors by coming back around, ie' recycle, .lowering the boundary a little so that the pw/BPD sees a way back to us, after pushing us away yet again,

A very perplexing conundrum of a relationship to say the least  .

Red5

ortac77,

Holding steady boundaries, and over time moving them to where we really need them to be in order for us to do well long term -- that's tough work.  But worth it.  There will be lots of noise.  But if we do it firmly, with deliberateness and compassion, it will work out for the best.

Keep us posted!

WW

OK time for an update, today we held a lengthy appointment with his CPN - I took the opportunity to set out what has been happening and also that I was establishing some clear boundaries for myself - this has taken a lot of thought but I have to live according to my values and beliefs. Its going to be an uphill struggle but I have determination. I am not really sure he quite grasps what I mean but his CPN was very helpful in explaining carefully what I meant by this.

I asked what he wanted and what if any expectations he had of me or the relationship, I was not particularly surprised that this produced little response, its a big change for him as well and he does not yet have the skills to work this out. I have said that he may remain living here, however on the basis of 'lodging' for the moment whilst he works out with his therapist what is in his own best interests and we can keep the situation under review. For the moment I will not support him financially (he is on benefits which are not generous but certainly sufficient to live on).

I am willing to give him time to work with his therapist to establish what he wants and how he wants to achieve it - in the meantime I have said that I consider myself as independent from him and will allow him space however any interactions are to remain calm and courteous.

I can see (for him) it is going to be a challenge working on autonomy and understanding the difference between support and enabling - it has taken me a long time to work it out!

He has agreed to resume therapy on a regular basis, that if he starts to experience any dysregulation that he is to call the therapist and not put it on me, I have made quite clear that any attempts to do so will be met with an understanding that he is emotional however I cannot and will not enter into circular arguments, leaving until things have cooled down when I would reconsider discussion.

I have been very honest stating that if the relationship ends I am quite prepared for that, of course it would be sad and after 13 years I am quite sure I would be grieving, but again I have given this a lot of thought and worked it through with my therapist. His CPN has suggested that he too consider whether he is better suited to living independently and made suggestions re possible housing solutions should he wish to do so.

In summary I am taking a 'tough love' approach, allowing him his choices whilst also reserving mine - no more delusion/denial or fantasy - it ain't going to be easy but whatever the outcome will be worth it

In peace

Ortac 77

Hi ortac,

I've been following your thread and just want to say that I'm really impressed with the level of commitment to change that comes over.  It can be so hard to adjust and stop ingrained behaviours and having read your update I think you are doing a tremendous job of tackling this very hard work.  I want to commend you on your strength and dedication to affecting what has been a very unhealthy dynamic, for recognising what you were dealing with and demanding better treatment.  Do you feel safe in this arrangement?

Love and light x 

Safe - its a good question, for the moment yes, that is something I have thought about as well. Last week I had a long chat with the Police and explained the situation, they have already liaised with local mental health services and I am on the 'vulnerable' list so instant response to any call.

He has been violent in the past, not recently but I am alert and and aware.

It's good that you have that marker on you.  In my experience they take that very seriously and are really quick to respond.  It certainly helped me to feel safer.  What do you have in respect of a safety plan and have you liaised with a domestic abuse advocate locally also? 

Something that I found reassuring was the knowledge that I had someone on speed dial who could coach me if I needed that, and having a plan of action present in my mind for if a situation got out of control.  The support I received from the advocate was tremendous and I'd highly recommend seeking out a service locally if you don't have that within your support network. 

If you haven't already, I'd encourage you to be open with this to a trusted friend and to consider having that friend be your 'go to' person if you need to leave for a short time at short notice - provided they are willing.  Luckily for me, I had a friend who lived nearby and her home was my escape place when I needed to get out.  Knowing where you are going and what you are doing when all normality is lost makes a huge difference.  It pays to be ready for any eventuality once violent behaviour has emerged. 

We have an excellent resource link here to the Mosaic threat assessment tool (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=304172).  It is worth checking this out to give you an indication of the sort of risk there is associated with your current situation and may help you when planning ahead.  I found it quite enlightening. 

Do keep us posted on how the boundary enforcement progresses.  You're incredibly brave to implement this and stick to your guns in the way you are.  I know it must feel uncomfortable at times, however it is for the best and will pay dividends, whatever the outcome for the r/s. 

Love and light x

ortac77,

Thanks for the update.  I'm glad you're working in a direction that feels healthier for you.  It sounds like you have some good support, and are not isolated, which is excellent.

WW

Thanks for the link to MOSAIc, I am not unaware that violence is a possibility. This is why I have already consulted with the Police DV unit so they are aware. I also have excellent support via two close friends and my immediate family.

Not sure I feel 'brave' but I do feel that I am taking the right steps, I am also dealing with this as compassionately as I can with respect to my partner, he must make his own choices but I am neither pushing or cajoling.

Thank you for all your comments and support

In Peace

Ortac77

It's great to hear that you have strong support around you with your friends and family.  That's so important during these tough times.  I'm glad you have those lines of communication open.  Good on you for being open about what you're facing. 

You certainly are taking positive steps and I hope that things work out well.  What would be your ideal outcome?

Love and light x

In a perfect world my partner will get the help he needs - just as I have but I know we do not live in a perfect world. I am keeping an open mind about the outcome.

What I do know is that this experience has changed me and that is for the good.I am prepared to move forward alone if that is the case, maybe just maybe my partner may learn to deal with his problems and make a better life as well. Whether together - we will see

In Peace

ortac77, this is good.  Until I was prepared for the possibility of going it alone, as long as I held onto the relationship before everything else, I was paralyzed, couldn't set boundaries, and wasn't willing to do healthy things that made my partner uncomfortable.  I think in some cases, being willing to risk the relationship to grow in a healthy way can save it, and in other cases it ends it.  In either direction, we end up better off.

WW

That is a very healthy attitude and with that outlook I see you achieving great strides.  |iiii

Do keep us posted on how things are going.

Love and light x

Nicely said, Wentworth.  Right, new growth involves shedding old patterns, which may make or break a r/s.  It's Win/Win either way, as you say.

LJ

So of course (no surprise) 48 hours on Im getting the 'blowback'

We spoke briefly last night and I said I hoped he understood that it was important that we continued to communicate that I would leave him to think through with his CPN & Therapist about our meeting the other day and then we could review the situation.With his CPN the other day we talked about how he has the right to make his own decisions and that in any relationship there has to be a clear distinction between 'me' 'you' and 'us'. She also was careful to point out that regardless of BPD he remains responsible for his own actions and choices.

Today I get a formal letter left in the kitchen which in precis essentially says:

I am being nasty because he is ill. (Both his CPN and I felt he would benefit from engagement with DBT)
Implication that my job is causing me to act this way (funny a few weeks ago it was my family)
He won't talk to me and I am not to act in any caring role (frankly I do not want to continue caring for somebody which actually in his case means 'enabling'
That he thinks I am militaristic and have too many 'rules' ( living in my house I think it is right and proper that he makes some effort to clear up and keep things tidy - hardly onerous). Actually I realise I have been living under his rules, I am expected to not wake him when he sleeps all day and never to ask for anything to be done around the house.

Jeez - they really do see black/white, good/bad no chance of negotiation or mutuality!

Ok - none of this is really unexpected so I have written a formal reply to his formal letter along the lines of:

I have a right to enjoy life in my own home with the expectation that he co-operates and if there is conflict we discuss calmly (won't happen - I know). If that is impossible he can live elsewhere.

That I will not tolerate abusive behaviour.(doubt he can keep to this either)

That he has absolute freedom of choice as to how he lives, whether he engages in therapy or not. I also have freedom of choice. That whilst for the moment he may stay if he finds my way of living something that he cannot accept that he moves on and finds alternative accommodation.

Ok so nothing really unexpected here, sent a copy of his letter and my reply to his CPN - its up to Mental Health Services to deal with him - I think I am pretty much washing my hands of this rs and whilst I will give him time to find alternative accommodation (for now) I know I no longer wish to continue and having found myself again I am forced to accept that I have tolerated the intolerable for far too long

In Peace

I just wanted to add 'external locus of control' because I think this is the toughest part of BPD for us nons to understand:

"Everything that ever happens is the fault of another person/persons/god/or the universe"

Having got my head around this somewhat belatedly of course I see he can never take responsibility for his own actions and therefore never function effectively in the real world due to the shame/guilt it would invoke.

How very sad to live so detached from reality and therefore unable to appreciate the real beauty of fellow human beings

just a thought

ortac77,

How might it have felt if you didn't bother replying to the letter at all?  If you'd just read it, and then moved on to some task that was valuable to you, or some self care?

Is there a particular reason why he needs to be woken up?

WW

Wentworth - good questions, it probably might have felt better to ignore his letter - I think the reason for the reply was more about 'refuting' his comments and therefore more about my own feelings? Perhaps also something about 'evidence' if things turn nasty? Some niggling fears there I know, I really don't like conflict.

I did however then spend a very pleasant afternoon with some dear Al-Anon friends which helped me a lot to get grounded again and enjoyed a peaceful evening.

There is no reason to wake him, in many ways his nocturnal nature leaves me with peace during my day - my reference to that is the many times he asks me to wake him then gives me hell when I do!

Hi

The other thing I would add, read you are in an anon.  Have you done the steps, all 12. Are you in service.  Until I am grounded, in all 3, unity, recovery, service.  I can't rely on my thinking.

I am in al anon.  When i was thinking of breaking up w pwBPD in 2016, I had not finished the steps.  Was on #3.

Long story short, made a bad choice, asked my love to move.  It wasn't a well thought out decision.

After working w my sponsor, I see that my upset at his behaviour, ie. I was reacting, made me get to a decision that was wrong for me.  I found this out after he left.

This is what happened.  In al anon, it is suggested you make no changes the first year.

Anyway.  My experience is i need to pause.

I need to pause, make sure I am not reacting to the situation.

Sometimes there is nothing for me to do except make sure I am taking excellent care of myself.

If i am compelled to react, that is my red flag that i am not taking excellent self care.

blessings,  j

Juju 6860

Hi - Yes I have been in Al-Anon a long time, 12 stepped and without that I think I would have been quite insane by now!

A lot of what is happening for me at the moment is about 'pausing' at the same time it is about 'me' and that is of course a big change -hence my work on boundaries and taking some small but significant steps to see who I am, what I want and how I get there:-)

Having been together for 13 years, life with a pwBPD has been a long learning experience, for many years he was diagnosed with depression and then bi polar, it is only two years ago a clinical diagnosis of BPD was determined by the psychiatrist (after some particularly bizarre episodes).

I have learnt a lot from these boards and have read just about everything I can about the illness - it has still taken a long time to absorb the many lessons and I am but a 'work in progress' - cannot always get it right!

So I am taken a step back and looking at me, I am blessed by a career that takes me away from home frequently and combined with mindfulness am learning a lot more about me - I have had 3 significant relationships in my life and in hindsight know they have always been about 'rescuing and care taking' - I know I am co-dependant and am now working in therapy on this. I think I also know what in my upbringing has made into the person I am.

The focus is now on me, courage to change the things I can - in the meantime I have to accept that this is painting me 'black' with my partner - its tough but I am now on a journey that I should have started many years ago... .

In peace

ortac77,

This is tough work, but you are headed to a better place!  Glad to hear of your progress.

WW

Its tough work and really a big change from my default position. Having been away with work for a few days I did wallow a little in self-pity, all those fears of being alone... .It passed and having indulged in it for a few hours,I acknowledged it and I now feel stronger. I can and will move forward alone if thats is the right direction, I don't quite know where this new found courage is coming from but I am working to build on it whilst maintaining some compassion.

Home now and ignored his initial attempts to engage me in a circular argument, he is in a sorry state - it would be so easy to lie and say 'there there its alright!' - no he is not a child and I am not going to treat him like one. I have said that I am just taking time for me at the moment and as he is so unhappy asked him to consider what he thinks the solution might be - walk away and leave him to join the dots... .

In Peace

Ortac, congratulations on the way you are processing these emotions and finding your courage.  That's a big step in itself. 

It sounds like it took some self restraint to not try to solve his upset on your return home and it reads like an example of how to handle that type of situation without enabling.  Well done!   |iiii  How were you feeling when you said this to him?  I hope you are proud of how far you've come.

Love and light x

Ortac77,

After separating from my wife, my emotions went through several stages.  You'll likely bounce around a bit.  There will be loneliness, but there will likely also be a sense of optimism and freedom, thinking about what you can do with all the energy that was consumed by the relationship.  The loneliness can become acute at times, bit I found that it passes.  Then there is grieving, which I'm just starting to experience.  We'll both get to a better place!

WW

Hi

Harley - Considering how tired I was after a 12 Hour flight I am pleased that I did not react - I sensibly took a 5 minute deep breathing session before going in the door! I was feeling OK and got through the day despite his attempts to goad me, he wanted me to witness how he was tidying his rooms and this involved throwing out anything I had ever bought for him. His decision, I don't feel any emotionality about 'things'. TBH I don't really feel any emotions about him either, guess I have rather run out of caring, I don't wish him harm and have simply re-stated he may stay in my home for now whilst we both work out what is best for each of us - I then spent the day detaching each time he tried to engage which of course means 'blaming me' for how bad his life is. His truth = his feelings and my truth well I am starting to find that.

Wentworth - yes I am bouncing around a bit, I think the loneliness thought was one that has kept me tied in for too long and is not a good reason, I am glad I gave it headroom and have started to process it. I do feel a sense of optimism and freedom as well which is more like the old (pre relationship) me. I think my therapy will help a lot in processing these feelings.

I am working away a lot over this period, its a way of giving me space but also him - I am also starting to re-engage with some old interests and hobbies - I think I am doing the right things for me, as I said not being cruel but giving him space - but it takes a lot of effort to avoid his attempts to engage and blame me ... .thanks for your positive comments.

In peace

This is great!  Anything about your interests and hobbies that you'd be comfortable sharing with us?

Thinking ahead to the potential for loneliness, are there connections to others like old friends, family, those sharing interests or hobbies, etc. that you can think about building or strengthening?

WW

Hi Wentworth

Couple of ideas for the moment in an effort to use some of my free time constructively include volunteering to help at a local heritage railway (I like trains!) - hope it might lead to making a few friends locally as well. I am also making time to meet up with some other friends I have probably neglected too long.

In the longer term I am planning to retire at the end of next year, I thought of course originally that would involve my partner as well, I am having to work on reframing my thoughts of 'moving on' alone. Its still a bit terrifying at the moment but 'one day at a time' - he is determined to hold me back and I am getting the Silent Treatment now, so I am thinking:

F - Fear - probably some of my fears are quite natural, retirement is a big change but I have skills and energy so need to find what works for me. Fear of the rs ending has slipped way down my list.

O - Obligation - Needs to be for me, for far too long I have sacrificed my needs to meet the needs of somebody who cannot be satisfied and in fact my treatment of them has held them not accountable for their actions. This has changed and I can see that it cannot change back.

G - Guilt - So I am meant to feel guilty when somebody else in pain? No - the illness is responsible for that pain, I didn't cause it, cant control it, cant cure it - if I have guilt it is about how I did not have the knowledge then that I have now but that is not guilt just ignorance - I tried my best with what I knew and now know a lot more.


The loneliness aspect is one I am working on, I have faced the reality that I am actually more alone in this rs than I probably would be on my own.

In Peace

ortac77, this is quite a statement.  It really is food for thought.  You've made me reflect on my own situation!

You are doing some good work processing all of this  |iiii

Great to hear about the railway!  I love trains as well.  Volunteering is a great way to meet people who share common interests and a commitment to service.

WW

Wow ortac77!
I can echo that statement as well, one of the many behaviors of a pw/BPD in a r/s is too cut off all the non’s other relationships, family, friends, and in my case my u/BPDw the step mom has even started to alienate my other two children, S27 & D25, they don’t come round so much anymore due to u/BPDw’s constant behaviors... .and trust me, your relationships outside your r/s with pw/BPD see the marked negative and depressive karma that you give off due to the predicament of the BPD r/s... .

Trains... .my S31 autistic loves trains, oh yes he does !

Red5

So I am away with work again, whilst I was home he was giving me the ST, last night I received a few e-mails and texts and I did not reply. The texts were definitely of a manipulative nature so best that I did not react.

He is considering that he wishes to move away to another part of the country, I have now responded by email that I respect his choice to do so if that is his wish and that it is not my place to judge the decisions that he makes just to wish him well in the choices he makes - I am not sure if he is trying to make me feel guilty but its not working if he is. Just maybe he is seeing that space between us whether temporary or permanent might be best?

As an aside and just to be lighthearted for a moment the more I read these boards it is almost as if there is an 'Instruction Manual' for those that suffer from BPD! Thank god there is also an instruction manual of wise advice on these boards for those of us dealing with it  |iiii

In peace

Ah - just got another e-mail - he will move if I pay all his bills and rent to live somewhere else - sounds a little bit like coercion to extort money. Ok time to consult a legal expert.

It is always good to have legal advice.  Many threats may have no basis in legal fact.  It's good to get solid info as quickly as possible.  But the key is do our best not to let any threats make us anxious or distract us from our true priorities.  Thankfully, lawyers/solicitors charge so much it encourages us to spend as little time with them as possible, leaving more time for healthy activities!

WW

The legal advice is simply that he has no right to stay in my home if I wish him to leave so any threats he makes are just threats. In the meantime I have spoken to his CPN and pushed the problem back to mental health services, after all if he becomes homeless he becomes their responsibility.

Back to doing stuff for me... .

In peace

Do you have a moveout timeline in mind?

WW

HI Wentworth

Not setting a specific timescale, I am giving him a chance to talk these things through with his CPN and therapist, he has calmed down and I am allowing him time to figure out his options.

In Peace