BPDFamily.com

UPDATE:

I called her last night but she didn't answer the phone. Then i texted her "I called you just to wish you a goodnight".

Today she texted me something like this: "I don't want to hurt you, but i think we should go apart for a while. Maybe we could be friends sometime in the future. There are things that i try to forget but i can't and there are things that i see that cofound me even more. I am here as your friend if you need me. Kiss*"

I called her to ask what are those things that she sees that cofound her, and there came the jealous again. She said "Plenty of women in your facebook, some of them you said you didn't know and yet you have them in your Facebook." I asked what were those women, she refered one, that is an old friend of mine, and i told her "That is a friend of mine. I've never dated her, just friends. It's not new. I only have old people in my Facebook. Nobody new." She became quiet as i said that and then she said that we could speak later, because she was working, but she didn't want any fights. I responded that i didn't want any fights too. And we said goodbye.

I then texted her saying that there is stuff i can improve, but this in particular (concerning other women) is not one of them, because i've never had contact with any other women. I told her that I was sorry she was suffering for something that isn't real. And that i am here to solve our problems because I love her. And that's everything i could do.

And that's it.

She continues to burn in jealous. As i said before, i think jealous paranoia is the main fuel for her intent to break up, not other stuff from our past (altough that has role too), altough I've never had any sexual, romantic or similar contact whatsoever with other women. Her jealously is totally in her mind. And it always had an incredible, inexhaustible energy. I've never seen something like this before.

Plus, this phrase of "We should go apart and just be friends", in my opinion, it's just to hurt me. She did this plenty of times (threatening to breakup), when she had any kind of suspicion of cheating.

You are getting some excellent advice from once removed here.  He is our resident expert at dealing with breakups, which are unfortunately common around here.  My sense is that you are still overpursuing her.  Her recent communication about being just friends was very clear and respectful (which is nice, as many times our pwBPD's communications are neither clear nor respectful).  Being asked questions can feel threatening to many people, especially a pwBPD.  The safest route for a communication like the one she just sent about being friends is to accept it.  For example, you send her a short note saying how much you value your friendship with her.  You could pick an amount of time to give her space, say a week or two, and tell her you'll check back with her then because you want to give her space but also honor the friendship.

If you are friends with her, you'll still be in communication with her, and will still be growing trust and increasing your skills by working with us here.  What do you think?

RC

it is, in fact, very real to her.

when trust is broken down, it doesnt take much. trust has been broken down for a long time.

if she sees your facebook while you are courting her, and she sees women that you said you didnt know, she is going to default to the idea that reentering the relationship is not a safe or practical idea.

all of that i think is the case whether she is over the top jealous or not, and im not saying that she isnt. she wasnt shutting down your advances, but she was clearly very tentative. this is bigger than the jealousy. the jealousy is just icing on the cake.


as i said, im not saying its the case that she isnt over the top jealous, and that it isnt a longstanding, possibly irresolvable conflict in your relationship. if it is, it is, and your feelings about that are what they are. i could not handle my exes jealousy, and some of hers was valid too.

if you want to mend fences, though, the best (only?) move you can play here is not to tell her shes struggling over something imagined, not to argue with her, not to try to prove her wrong or prove your love, but to send a message that not only do you accept her position, but you respect it, and her. if you want to prove something, put your efforts there. it may build real and lasting trust like Radcliff said, and in the short term, it will tell her you "get it" and can hear it, whether you agree or not.

are you up for that?

UPDATE:

Like i said in my last post... .She texted me, i called her, and i texted her.

Later that same day, she texted me saying "i'm sorry, i don't want to hurt you, but i am really really hurt and i can't control it. I just want to move on with my life and be happy, altough with my limitations. Maybe that's the best for me and for you. I hope you will understand me someday."

I texted her back saying that i tough she was not being correct, by not speaking to me about what she is feeling. And by getting away like this, altough loving me. I tried to called her, but she didn't answered. And then i texted her saying that i would not bother her anymore.

I was very emotional at the time, and it was the best i could do. The best i could say at the time.

That was five days ago. I never went back to whatsapp again (it's where we interact for the last month) so I don't know if she answered anything.

Two days later, she liked a post of mine in my Facebook (that was three days ago). --> What the hell? If she says she wants to stay away, why this?

And nothing else.

I really feel that i can't do anything more. And maybe she will move on, because she can't get over her hurt.

I can't even try to reach her, i cannot do it anymore. The ball is on her side of the field. If she really misses me and wants to resume anything, she has to make a move. Because i tried.

It's strange, because she calls me 3 am to speak, she still has jealous, she says she wants to stay away ( i note that she is very angry when she says this things) but then she comes and likes my post.

Sometimes it feels like she is very angry and she wants revenge. She wants to make me feel that i lost her. Maybe she is pressuring me so I would agree to the things she wants ( delete my facebook acount, like i did before, maybe? ).

Do you think she can solve her pain and wants to get back? From your experience, is this normal, what's happening? Does it happens? How long does it take to solve the pain, usually?

I don't know. I think i have to do my grief of the relationship.
It's been more then 3 weeks that i don't see her.

And there's nothing more that i can do about.

Raddclif,

When she says she wants us to be friends, i think that is to hurt me, because she doesn't want that. Friends don't have jealous. And she only says that when she is very angry. She did said that several times in the past. Nevertheless, i can't go against what she is saying. I know.

I think there is nothing i can do. If she contacts me in anyway, i will try to respect her. I will not try anymore advances. I tried.

Talking about trust... .

She doesn't trust me because she can't trust anyone. She doesn't trust me because i have facebook and in her mind, i am chating with other women, dating them, etc.

Is it fair that i don't have any acounts on social networks in order to make her feel secure? Is it fair that i don't have any friends in order to make her feel secure?

All of her complaints since she broke up were about social networks and other women.

Even if i delete my facebook acount, as i did before, she will behave in the same way. She will start to complain about other things: that i have a false facebook acount, that i have other phones, that i receive SMS from others, etc.etc. All that happened before.

She never stops. If her fears are satisfied about one issue, she begin chasing another.

Trust wasn't broken, because there was never trust in the first place.

So, i don't think i can do anything to regain trust.

Yes, she is hurt, but the biggest issue it's not the fights we had in the past or other stuff. The biggest issue is a trust issue: she thinks that i cheat on her, that i am not trustable.

Yes, she is hurt, but the way she is trying to solve her hurt is perverse. She is not talking in a healthy manner about the issues. She is not being assertive. She is trying to hurt me and trying to pressure me to do what she wants, so she can feel more secure. But that is impossible. It's not my issue.

And yes, in her mind is very real! But what can i do?

Anyway, that's what i think.

pytagoras,


i appreciate that this is the most significant issue in your relationship as you see it. i had a jealous (deeply, and frequently) girlfriend, and i know that it can make a person pull their hair out.

i think you are seriously underestimating what broke down in your relationship, when, how it effected her, and what the most significant problems to her are, and how she sees them. i think this is bigger than you having social media accounts or female friends. that would be a problem, no doubt. i dont think its what led you here.

an abortion is a hugely traumatic experience for a woman, it often is for both parties. that trauma can last years, it can last forever. this happened very early into your relationship. ever seen a marriage that loses a child? quite often, the pain ends in divorce. its not exactly the same scenario, but it can be similar. she may have slipped into a deep depression, she may have felt loss, and shame. this may have hampered your relationship in those early months. it could easily explain why shes distant sexually.

it is possible that she did not feel adequately supported or heard before, during, or after that event, which would contribute to a decline in trust. it is possible that she felt pressured, and has continued to feel pressured, in a variety of ways. this also could contribute to a decline in trust.

and so yes, with a person prone to jealousy, who doesnt feel heard in the first place, you having relationships with other females, and being somewhat secretive about it, could also contribute to what was already a decline in trust.

on some level, at this point, she has partially grieved the relationship and determined that its best to move on. she may feel conflicted about it, but shes leaning toward moving on, and it would take a significant shift on your part to change that... .to show her that trust really can be built, that things can be not only better, but very different. i think pressuring her to share her feelings, telling her that this is unfair, and not really hearing her, are all telling her that nothing is likely to change.

where do you want to go from here?

once removed,

She was very depressed in the first few months after the abortion, and i did everything i could to be by her side. A few months later, she became warmer again, and she spent the first year happy, but with severe mood swings specially when she was suspicious of something, wich was almost all of the time.

Her jealous was hellish! Ever from the begining and always getting worse. In a daily basis and I did everything i could to make her feel secure. I did everything for her.

But after being very mistreated for a entire year, i became to be ressent.

I went to whatsapp now and found that she didn't said nothing to me. 5 days and nothing.

I really think that this is out of my hands now. That i can't do anything at the moment. Just let her be.
It's even likely that she is seeing somebody now. She always did that in the past.

I suffering a lot, but the best thing i think i can do is to just leave her alone.

Besides, the last thing i told her was that, if that was really what she wanted, i would leave her alone.

i certainly think space would be good for you, and for her.

is letting go what you want to do? what did you think of this suggestion:

Ok. I will try that.

only do it if its what you truly want to do... .

do you want to work out what you want to say, in this thread?

I texted her on Whatsapp, something like this:

Hi. How are you?  i am here just to say three things:

1- I'm sorry, i get a little emotional with our last conversation, but if you want space, i'll respect you. I want the best for you, even if i may not agree with something. If that is your wish, we can stay friends.  

2- You are more important to me then Social Networks.

3- I received two letters from you in my mail box. If you want, i can put it under the door of your shop.

What do you thik ?

Yes, i want to work it out.

How can i begin?

i meant write it here before you send 

what you sent was a good, strong move. now, i would back off big time.

let us know what she says.

Ok.

I will write here her answer.

And then maybe workout with you, the best answer.

Thank You

What do you think of me pass by tomorow at her shop, to let the mail. Just say hello and then leave ?

We dont see each other at more then three weeks.

Do you think it's a good idea and could wake up something in her?

Or is just pressure?

if you want to deliver her mail, id just deliver her mail. no less, no more.

Hey.

She saw the message yesterday but didn't responded.

She answered today.

She said "Kiss"

Only that.

( I also sent her a kiss in my message yesterday. It was the last thing i said in the message ).

She didn't answered to my  question of if she wanted me to drop her mail under the door of her shop. Nor anything else.

What do you think?

personally, i might just go ahead and leave the mail under the door where she can find it. i wouldnt try to have a conversation. that way, its a nice gesture coupled with giving space.

Right now, the more you reach for her, the further she is going to pull back. The further she pulls back, the harder this will be to resolve - and at some point the damage will not be recoverable.

It is never a good idea to over-pursue.

She is flooded emotionally and it floods her more. It can make her angry.

It's also not attractive.

She is saying it's over, but she is not acting like it's over - she is acting like she is overwhelmed with bad feelings that she may or may not believe are justified, but she is overwhelmed just the same.

Best this is to not make any global pronouncements of giving her space or doing her favors or anything - just back off and give her enough room to calibrate and start to reach back.

Make sense?

Skip, thk you for your answer

I agree with you.

I think i over-pursued her a little bit. But not much.

The update is in this thread:

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=331684.0

I now will back off big time and give her space.

What do you think of the development of the case?

I agree once removed.

It's just what i am going to do.

And then, I will back off and give her space.

I'm not doing anymore attempt to contact her.

This is a good place to leave it - and good positive place.

I personally wouldn't mess with the mail. If its something important paste a forwarding address on it and put it back in the mail. If it's junk... .don't do anything.


I don't think you should do anything "big time"... .I would think in terms of baby steps and taking steps that follow hers. Let her make the moves now and then work with your support group on how to get a constructive tempo with her.

You left it in a good place. Don't do anything to muddy that up. Give her room to reach out and then take a baby step toward her.

Can you wait this out a bit. if you don't hear from her for a week or so, are you OK?

"Back off big time" was just a matter of speech.

I agree with you. Going smooth now.

Yes, am i feeling more calm and confident since i think i did my part.

I can wait for her to reach me.

I know that if i try to contact her at this time, i would screw things up. It would be too much.

Baby steps... .I will follow that advice.

Thk You.

I will keep you informed

Why not poke around here and learn some of the tools so that you will have them when you need them.  Might be good to open a discussion on alternate ways to handle the Facebook confrontation.

Where do you sugest i start ?