BPDFamily.com

Where to start?  Could write a book about this but have to keep it at reasonable length (whatever that is) so someone will read it. Two-year relationship, best of my life, never felt so loved and in love, but she suddenly broke us up.  I’m mid-50s, retired military, she’s mid-40s, a nurse.  She suffers from low self-esteem and poor self-image though she is an attractive, accomplished woman whom I love dearly and want back.  We got along very, very well; I don’t think anyone ever treated her so nicely, thoughtfully or well as I did.  Am not bragging because I’m just an average guy but from all I learned about her life experience, and from my life experience, I truly believe that I treated her better than she had ever been before, very loving, decent and considerate.  A few times she would push me away, go quiet for a few days, and then come back.  She always apologized for these episodes, asked me to forgive her for being “nasty” to me when I was trying to be nice to her, as she put it.  Always forgave her, love her so much, just shrugged it off and attributed it to female emotions, monthly menstrual cycle and such.  

In March, 2018 after 15 months of seeing each other 2-3X a week I sang her a creative marriage proposal and gave her a promise ring; she didn’t answer the proposal but wore the ring with a smile.  Revisited the proposal in August and in October 2018 but didn’t get a response, just non-committal looks and didn’t press the issue figuring she was still considering it though she happily wore the ring.  We did talk of marriage in November 2018, even wedding rings and wedding bells before the wheels suddenly fell off the wagon in December after she got into a period of heavy stress with family members.  Heartfelt professions of “I love you!” and “I’m afraid you’ll never be able to get rid of me!” and “I want more of you!” which I joyfully received and returned, followed by a no-notice breakup. To her credit we talked about it a couple of times face to face before she distanced herself and refused to see me for four months, but we still kept in touch by text.  

Well, after my failed pleading efforts in the weeks after the breakup using logic and reasoning, largely ineffective with her emotions, I shifted gears and tried to give her time and space, but responded when she reached out, was there for her any and every time she reached out, mostly in text, validating her, empathizing with her in various life issues she brought up about family members, or even simple things of daily life, opinions on news stories, etc.  In these six months of limited text interactions, some were quite pleasant and offered hope of future improvement (she even sent me some sexy pics of her in lingerie) but some were also negative (on her part) things like “if you loved me we’d already be married” and “your love was a lie,” “I should just go away,” “you don’t need me, you can take very good care of yourself in every way,” “you chose this path” (the path not to be with her, which I protested) “you can’t fill the void I feel” and many more.  Only after the breakup she told me she didn’t take my singing proposal seriously, thought it was a joke, and didn’t recall me bringing it up again in the months after.  I countered her negatives with positive perspectives, validated and empathized with what she was feeling but asserted my feelings for her were serious and true.  
 
All of this has been so painful, coping with the breakup, trying to keep some form of connection alive, working on myself a lot, being there for her supporting her emotional and informational needs whenever she reached out.  I’ve done a lot of soul searching since the breakup, at first believed it was my fault she broke up and eventually concluded we both did or didn’t do things, did or didn’t say things that contributed to this outcome.  Been working hard to improve my knowledge and understanding of relationships, of women in general, communications skills, etc., so that if/when she comes back I can offer her an improved version of myself and a much improved relational capability.  A side note, at various times in the relationship I apologized for something I did or didn’t do that hurt her, like waiting so long to make my marriage proposal unambiguously clear to her, but she always seemed to say there was nothing to forgive and would not speak any forgiveness.  On the other hand she often asked me forgiveness when she hurt me, which I always gave her, in love.

And then came to find out that probably at least since April, only admitted in June, 2019 after her communications started to decrease that she’s reached out to someone else now, gone for a rebound (aka The New Guy (TNG) and from mid-June started telling me “It’s too late for us,” “it’s not meant to be,” “I’m beginning to regret the day we met, everything we’ve done” and “I doubt it was ever love” but “I cared about you and still do.”  She said she was just “talking” to this guy, and asked me if I would mind if she brought him to my church which she had attended a few times, that she didn’t want to make me feel uncomfortable – of all the churches in town why come to mine with him?  I said it’s a free country, go where you want.  The first time in late June the TNG walked out after 10 minutes with a grim look on his face and she ran after him, grabbed his arm and convinced him to come back.  At meet and greet time I made a beeline for her, hugged her and then introduced myself to the TNG.  Saw they were holding hands at that time, not just talking.  They didn’t finish service as he suddenly walked out again 30 minutes later with a sour look and she followed him a moment later with her eyes cast down, didn’t even look at me as she passed by.  A minute sitting in his vehicle and then they sped off.  Who knows what all they said.  Strange behavior, I never walked away from her in any of our interactions. What was that about? To me it doesn’t bode well of their future, which is fine by me.  

A week later she texted me that she wanted to return my gifts to her (not any of my personal things but my gifts to her), and I met up with her in early July.  Why is it only in July after months of separation she decided to return the gifts I gave her over the course of our two year relationship?  We talked for 25 minutes and I was in mostly active listening mode as she talked about our relationship, that she felt I “wasn’t serious about her,” that “it was a mistake” "all her fault" asked me to forgive her which I did of course because I love her - she again refused to forgive me. “We should just move on” and how relieved she felt to give me my things back - she may have misspoke when she said the TNG asked her to return my things; she quickly backtracked and said she had decided to give them back.  And how much she enjoys the TNG’s company, he’s there for her, understands her, supports her.  All the things I’ve been there and done for her throughout our relationship and now it seems she’s really splitting me into black compared to the TNG.  She returned the promise ring, the I Love You teddy bear she always hugged and a nice nurse’s wristwatch I gave her for Christmas 2017, among other things.  As we left in our separate cars she texted me twice to ask if I had been recording her, as I had put my cell phone down in between us when she got in my car to talk.  I assured her I didn’t record, had no reason to.  Worth noting is that she showed some suspicious tendencies through the relationship, in part reflecting her birth and early years living in a communist country in Eastern Europe, emigrating to the US late in the Cold War as a teenager. I could understand this and thought it was the source of her suspicions about situations, motives, trust and such.  

The next day in text followup to our conversation, I asked her why she couldn’t accept any gifts from me anymore as even friends give gifts, and what was I to her now - she said she didn’t want to give me any indication she wanted me to be more than a friend, didn’t want me to ask her hurtful questions (hurtful to me she clarified, not to her) and then she suddenly blurted out that she’s in love with the TNG – that really did hurt!  How the heck could that happen so fast, since April?  What happened to all her professions of love for me?

A week later another church service.  They were so lovey dovey, embracing each other now, it just made me sick to my stomach.  Why does she have to do that, literally right in front of me?  She really doesn’t seem to care about my feelings even if she asks whether it would make me feel uncomfortable.  She gave me more of my stuff back after service in a little paper bag, (not much to show for two years…) including several military patches I’d given her which she cut off a military style jacket of hers that she had sewed them on when we were good – I had asked her for the jacket with the patches on it in early July after she said she wanted to give my gifts back but she refused to give me the jacket, just cut my patches off of it and gave the jacket to charity.  She returned most of the gifts I gave her but kept at least a few small things, from what I can tell.  So I don’t know that she’s totally erased me.  I endured this church thing twice but since then started going to church elsewhere.

The day after the second church visit with the TNG I figured it was time to let go and let her and the new shiny object play out. So I sent her an email summarizing my view of our breakup, acknowledging her statement that her feelings for me, for us had changed, that I loved her even though she doesn’t seem to believe it or think it’s true. And stated why else would I have been there for her all these months since the breakup whenever she needed me?  That I would respond to her if something urgent came up but would otherwise respect her decision to reach out to someone else and remain quiet.  That if she changed her mind about us to let me know.  After she acknowledged receipt in text, I said I still loved her despite all that’s happened - she told me she loves the TNG.  Said I understood and goodbye.  It’s now been six weeks of No Contact, total silence from her and I haven’t initiated any myself though it tears me up inside day after day not to.  She even ignored me on my birthday at the end of July and that sucked.  

The breakup felt bad enough but now to deal with the rejection of her going to this rebound, the anguish level is magnified.  And I do feel bad for her because she wasn’t willing to verbalize her concerns, make the effort to work through our issues, real or perceived, and bailed out on us into what’s gonna be another train wreck for her - she doesn’t seem to have any awareness of her own internal issues.  And I doubt the TNG knows or is equipped to effectively deal with what he’s gotten into.  

It’s only after going NC, doing some more soul searching and deciding to talk with mental health professionals in late July 2019 that the possibility of her having BPD issues emerged.  She is a superb nurse and functions just fine in her profession - I never had an inkling she could be afflicted with BPD and how much that condition affects relationships.  This has introduced a completely new dimension and level of complexity to the issues of my relationship struggle.  I had no idea I’d been involved with someone potentially affected by BPD, but looking back at things I see a number of signs.  On top of the rejection, the rebound, awareness of my own issues, the BPD factor seems like an added weight crushing my ability to cope with and make any sense of all of this.  

I’m aware that I have issues of my own which I need to address.  And now to consider that maybe I have a BPD mother which is part of my challenge and what that entails for my relationship with my Ex.  I’m feeling awful anxiety about all of this.  I want my Love back even if she has BPD.  Many people advocate running away for self-preservation - I know that I didn’t cause it, I can’t control it and I can’t cure it.  But I love her and want her, even if I don’t need all the BPD drama.  How can I help or support her in some way if she reaches out again, though I don’t wanna be her doormat either?  How do you tell someone you love that they seriously need mental health help?  I don't think she would believe me, with denial enhanced by her being a medical professional.  Suggest that we both need therapy if we get back together again?  I’m aware I’m currently woefully under-prepared to deal with her BPD if/when she pitches back to me from this rebound - I wonder if/when she will after the idealization phase wears off with the insecure TNG?  If she does I want to be ready for her, regardless of what I ultimately choose to do, try again or abandon ship.  How to best prepare for her if she returns, even knowing she will be doing it for herself and not for me?  And of course to continue to work on myself and my deeper issues.  A lot of work to be done any way I look at it.  

Will ceasefire on the keyboard now, or this will turn into a longstory, though in reality there’s a lot more to it.  I can’t help but feel this relationship will affect me for the rest of my life, no matter what happens, whether she comes back or not. SMH, never realized there was so much to this relationship stuff, let alone adding the BPD factor.  Sometimes I just wanna shut down and disconnect from love.  This is a heavy thing to deal with and I need to learn the right lessons from it.  I want to become a better man, not a bitter one.

T-Bar,

Going through the exact same thing right now. Wanted to reach out and let you know that you are not left hanging...

It’s late and I need to crash but I will get back to you tomorrow with a detailed response...

CK

*welcome*

Let me join Coldknight in welcoming you.    It's good that you've come here for support and to learn more about BPD.  Here is a place to start:  What Does It Take To Be In a BPD Relationship? (https://bpdfamily.com/content/what-does-it-take-be-relationship).

RC

T-Bar,

Told you I would get back to you with a more detailed response.
I don’t know how many posts you have read of others but you will find your situation is so very similar to most of ours. I find it helps me to read

It is almost like clockwork how these relationships work. The abandonment/engulfment theme seems to be ever prevalent.
I understand them as I have them and through this journey I believe I may be borderline, borderline if not then I definitely have some borderline tendencies or abandonment issues.

It is so hard when you let someone in and you both seem to be on the same page and share a deep connection. I am sure you are asking yourself: Was any of it ever real on her part. Did she mean anything she said to me. The answer to that I don’t have for you or me. Maybe someone more experienced here has the answer or at least clues that may help.

As far as the church incident. Triangulation at face value. I have been the victim of that myself. There really is no logical reason for her to bring him to your church. There is no logical reason for her to tell you how good he makes her feel. All that does is cause you pain. Why would she logically want to cause you pain? We have to first understand we are not dealing with logical people. We are dealing with hyper emotional people. Is she doing it to purposely hurt you? Maybe. We would think she would know it’s going to hurt you but maybe she doesn’t. In her own mixed up world this may make total sense to her. It is all about how they are feeling not how you are feeling. It seems once they split you they could care less about your feelings.

Where go from here: Keep reading the posts from other folks. Seeing that your situation is very similar to most of us will help. Ask questions here. Post advice if you have any and help others if you can.

If I may ask: You mentioned a no notice breakup. Did she just start distancing herself, avoiding you, silent treatment and never told you it’s official over? That is kind of what I get from hour post.

Thank you Coldknight for your initial response and followup.  And to Radcliff for the welcome aboard and "What does it take..." link.

Yes, I have sometimes wondered if she really loved me but when I think back to how it was when we were good I believe she really did, as much as she could or knew how to.  For nearly a two-year period her words and actions consistently lined up demonstrating her love and I felt it deeply and profoundly, like never in my life before.  Having said that, I think at some point late last year she made a decision that I wasn't measuring up to her expectations.  So she began to split me black and devalue me, more so since April this year, in order to elevate the TNG to the status I had with her.  My shortcomings in the relationship, real and/or perceived, were unknowingly (to me) used against me to line up a rebound, instead of confronting me explicitly to tell me unambiguosly how she was feeling inside, that I wasn't meeting her needs and how I could do better, in order for us to work it out together.  Soo frustrating and heartbreaking...

Just before she blurted out that she was in love with the TNG in early July, she responded to my telling her that I believe her love for me was true back when we were good, before she said her feelings for me, for us, changed.  She responded by stating she wasn’t sure it was real love, or ever was, but that she cared for me, still does. Then she repeated verbatim some things about love I'd sent her a couple weeks before in mid-June (after she told me she was reaching out to this TNG to "talk" with him), that real/true "...love conquers all, forgives all, covers all, etc. It’s the most powerful thing in the world..."  

Of course having said that very thing to her in mid-June I validated and empathized with her, and said that's why I've been here for her all these recent months, and that the course of true love never does run smooth.  Her using my words on love seemed to imply that she felt our love wasn't real or it would have withstood the test of the last eight months.  I've read this somewhere about people with BPD being very good at mimicry, piecing together inputs they receive which they can then turn around and use as if their own.  Anyway, I've been here all this time ready and willing to make the effort on our relationship, communicating this clearly to her while she withheld effort.  Maybe she felt smothered by my efforts and I inadvertently drove her to the rebound?

She had been to my church a few times before and liked it, liked the praise and worship style and the pastor and the way he spoke.  In fact she mentioned that she really likes the pastor at my church when she asked me about going with the TNG.  So now I'm feeling like she's split me black, as you say.  You could be right, she may not even know or think of how it really hurt my feelings to see her with the rebound as she is so focused on the honeymoon feelings she has right now.  Have to learn more about this Triangulation thing you mention, and how that may relate to the possibility of her coming back at some point.  

At the same time I think sometimes this behavior shows she's being vengeful, maybe even subconsciously.  Maybe she is still angry with me about the breakup, feeling she had to do it though she didn't want to back late last year.  Back then she expressed angrily then that she had waited two years for me to talk more definitely about our (married) future.  So maybe she's still mad at me, easier to split me black if she is, I suppose.  Like rubbing it in my face with the TNG.  Like in her refusal to give me the jacket with the patches on it in July, also said she had thrown out a scale-model airplane I had given her, which she had built from a plastic kit during her medical convalescence last year.  Like in declining my requests for forgiveness in the relationship when I have asked (though she feels compelled to ask me for forgiveness on a regular basis which I do).  Is she trying to get some kind of reaction out of me by doing this or just enjoying it in some way?  Punishing me?  Or testing me to see if I will make some effort for her?  

At this point I don't see the need to change from my No Contact posture in effect for over six weeks now.  Even it kills me not to be connected with her, even though I wanna at least text her every lovely day, to let her know how much I love her, how much I care, that I'm here for her.  But so far I've not lost my emotional self-control and have kept in No Contact.  Trying to focus on anything useful is challenging though, feel like the winds is out of my sails, in the doldrums, though I continue to function and work on myself on a daily basis. Have started seeing a therapist to help understand this all, her, me, etc.  Life goes on.

There wasn't really a definite breakup date.  She just started drifting away and then just stayed away for a while.  The only definite break I could really identify was when she told me in mid-June that she was reaching out to the TNG.  

Will read more as I examine this BPD issue more.  Just received a copy of "I Hate You Don't Leave Me" today so will read that too.  Right now I kinda feel the "I Hate You" part of the title, wanna be ready in case she pitches back and gives me the "Don't Leave Me" part, even though at this point it looks like she's left me for the TNG.

Thank you again for your responses!

Books can be a good way to get oriented to BPD.  "Stop Walking on Eggshells," is another good one. 

That's good that you've got the support of a therapist.  What other things are you doing to keep out of the doldrums, as you say?

RC

Sir,

The most hated response for me is: just focus on you...dont worry about her...work on you...

And even though I have given that advice before it really implicates that you really have not control in the situation. As much as I hate to admit it...you don’t ...we dont...I don’t ...we ...you...they...I may have a little sway in their decision but ultimately it is they who decide and choose to go forward with or without out you...(queue u2 with or without you)

As much as I hate the “ you just need to work on you” cop out...and believe me I HATE IT! There is truth in it. You cannot change the way they feel. You can do everything right and still be wrong. That is a reality we all must face...

I love my girl more than i have loved anyone in my life but i know I cant change her and to take care off me I have to move on...

The pain I feel is dual...The pain of  missing her and the pain of not missing her...

Radcliff,
Thank you for the book recommendation - just ordered a copy.  Things I'm doing to try and get some wind in my sails again and get out of the doldrums include seeking therapy, taking out a gym membership and getting some trainer lessons as well, working on myself in various books, workbooks, videos, trying to be aware of myself and others with the relationship knowledge I've been acquiring since the breakup, and working on writing projects.

Coldknight,
Yes, copy all on the working on myself.  I'm accepting that I have no control over the way she feels about me or the situation.  If/when she comes back it will be in her own time, her decision for her reasons.  And that I have my own issues I have to work on as well as heal from this trial.  The self-improvement I'm making will help me whether she does or doesn't come back.  And if she does, it will help me to better interact with her no matter what follows - that will depend on the situation at that time whether to try again or not. 

Was already doing a number of things, including starting therapy before the assessment that she may have BPD, which I can see now as plausible looking back over things that happened.  This BPD development has greatly enlarged the volume of knowledge and skills learning needed.  I thought I had a lot to learn already to improve myself and relationship skills, and now this BPD thing emerged - it's a huge rock added to the rucksack. Which is the reason I searched for BPD information, found this website and why I decided to post here.

Like you, I love her more than anyone else I've ever loved.  And that may be the most I ever will.  Even healing well after this intense emotional/relational experience it's hard to see right now how I won't be either lacking trust in anyone else (keeping my guard up, holding back) or will always be comparing anyone else to her at her best.  Some scar tissue is forming over these emotional wounds...

Appreciate your thoughts on this situation.  On Day 48 of No Contact but hey, who's counting?

Question: What to do upon learning your Ex who you want back may have BPD

It's a very complex question on one hand and a simple one on the other.

Let's go with simple, first. You have to sort out all of what happened and make sense of it and then answer the question, who is she, who are you, and are you a good match.

If she has BPD, or more likely BPD traits, she is a highly emotive person (blues are bluer, greens are greener, blacks are blacker) and she fears her own emotional swings (because they can destroy her - this is the root of suicidal thoughts in BPD) and lives a life that protects her from that (this is where the avoidance comes in).

Metaphorically, think of a beautiful horse - it's a highly reactive fear animal. People who have horses love them, respect them, and know that they have a much different personality and power than a dog or cat or parrot.  I have several friends who are horsemen/women and they have incredible relationships with their horses. Key to that is they understand them.

It might be worth noting that some residential treatment centers for BPD are horse farms. They use horse to teach people with BPD traits that others think differently.

My read of your first post is, more than anything, you are asking "who is she, who are you, and are we a good match"? You don't know.

So let go of the "how could she possibly..." and buckle in and try to understand the answers to the questions. What she does makes perfect sense to her. Just as what you do makes perfect sense to you.Just as what a horse does makes perfect sense to her.

The key to all relationships is self-awareness (know who you are and who you want to be), empathy (understanding others who think differently than you), and pragmatism (are you compatible).

Anyway, just some thoughts to get you ready for post #4.

Thank you, Skip,
 Yes, there's much to reflect on, process and understand about this relationship, about her, about me.

Throughout the course of the relationship I came to view our compatibility as high in every area I could think of.  In our feelings and regard for one another, emotionally, physically, intellectually, spiritually, in our interests, our values, I even thought we were that way in communication, being able to ask and share about anything.  In all these I came to view us as an outstanding match.

She probed me with more questions about myself than anyone has ever asked, including some uncomfortable subjects like asking for details on my past romantic relationships, did I remember these women, who was the best I did it with etc.  Maybe this was due to her anxiety and fear of abandonment.  Sometimes she would start with a "You might not want to answer this but..."  I always answered her questions to the best of my ability, though sometimes it was hard for me to open up and share given my own issues, anxious and some avoidant which I have since identified and am working on in self-study and therapy.  But honestly, I opened up to her more than anyone else in the world, shared things I've never shared with anyone else on the planet, though perhaps that wasn't enough to satisfy her or alleviate her fears.  I did confide to her that it was hard for me to talk about feelings but that I told her more than I've ever told anyone, said that she had opened me up more than anyone ever has and I was opening up more and more due to her, trying to encourage her to keep at it to open me up more in order to satisfy her need for emotional intimacy. 

But this past spring she told me she felt I was distant and not needing anyone, always able to take care of myself in every way as she discounted my love and ability to meet her needs.  At the time I was trying to give her space by limiting my text responses (since she didn't want to meet in person) to when she reached out to me.  I felt that she had pushed me away, was being negative in our communications and thought she needed time and space.  I don't know if that was a push-pull kind of dynamic going on, or a push-push.

Your analogy of BPD and horses is helpful.  I've always thought of horses as skittish animals, but never made a connection with people being that way so much, though how you describe it I can see now, especially now learning about BPD. 

May I ask what do you mean by Post #4?  Do you mean the fourth post on this page, the LESSONS post?

Thank you again, Skip, for your perspective on this situation.

Your 4th post as a member.

Hi T-Bar,

You mentioned that once you discovered BPD may be a possibility, looking back you could see some of the signs.

What were those signs?

Also did you see notice any “red flags” from the begging through when times were good. Not BPD red flags but just things that made you go hmmmmm that you chose to ignore. I certainly did.

You mentioned that you feel she may be angry that it took you so long to bring up the marriage conversation. Did that only come out after she started to pull away or had she mentioned that when times were good?

Stay strong...

ColdKnight,
Looking at the relationship and the DSM criteria for BPD, I can see some possible links.  For one she displays a lot of separation anxiety when we couldn’t be together for work (she works night shift), daily life reasons like family (both of our families are largely in the local area), how it was torture for her when we parted and she couldn’t stand it – she often said “I don’t want you to go...” in a pleading voice, even though we had to for work, etc, and would soon see each other again.  There were  times outside of our regularly coordinated meetings when she said she wanted to see me and I dropped everything to be there for her.  I didn't hold back in responding to her.

They say that texting kills attraction but in our case throughout most of the relationship, texting between us was at the highest volume of my life (and hers too I would bet) and a primary means of communication and connection when we were apart.  I don't know how strange this is gonna sound but the highest two months of the texting between us saw my phone send out over 7,500 texts, probably 95% or more to her.  Overall my cell text output averaged over 6,000 a month the first year and over 5,000 a month the second year.  In May/June this year it dwindled to over 500, though in June/July was about 1,300.  Haven't seen the August numbers yet but it's gonna plummet since there's been no contact since the first week in July.  Much of this texting she initiated and obviously was good with, unlike all the dating advice which suggests just text to set up a date.  I figured since she liked it to keep up with it at these high volume levels.  I thought we were just connecting deeply and didn't figure it could be due to anxiety on both our parts.  She would sometimes get snappy and anxious if I took too long to respond. 

One text incident last October stands out in my mind though as we were on a day trip sightseeing together.  I received a message from a female boss at a company that I was trying to help someone get a job with.  In responding to her text, I said “No sweat, Her name,” that my friend would get back to her.   My Ex saw that and read it as “Sweet Her Name” and got mad about it, me calling another woman Sweet.  I showed her the whole dialogue, clearly business related, and said that “no sweat” was not sweet (English is her second language though she’s very fluent).  Later in the day on the drive home she remarked that we were only friends, we didn’t make any promises to each other, to which I responded as best I could while driving on a dark night on a winding twisting small mountain highway trying to be safe with other traffic on the road.  It was an awkward thing for me to drive and talk on a serious subject that she was upset with, taking something out of context and making it an issue between us. 

Our relationship was intense, certainly I felt that way.  Look at the texting alone as a barometer, let alone the content of all those texts. 

She suffers from low self-esteem and poor self-image, making disparaging remarks about herself and her looks which I countered with praise and support because she really is a great and good-looking gal.  Several times after the breakup she made alarming suggestions that she should just go away, one time saying she should fill up the gas tank and leave and not come back and sending emojis of a car and then flames.  It seems when stress built up with her work, long hours, night shift, schedule changes, not enough rest between work weeks, and things in her family life with the loss of a dear grandparent and other things she would get very negative and chew on my ears even when I tried to cheer her up. 

After the breakup she expressed feelings of emptiness, that she felt a void, was in a deep dark hole she couldn’t crawl out of it.  Throughout the first six months of the breakup when she distance herself last Nov 18, there’s been a lot of drama. 

In late April I went on a business trip out of country for two weeks.  I had hoped to make this trip with her before the breakup, she knew about it, but I stayed here in-country for a while to try and work out our relationship before I decided to go. I was putting my life on hold while trying to be here for her and she was just being distant.  The day before I left she sent me a nice picture and said it was so far away and put a crying emoji on it.  Then she seemed to go cold and pushed me away when I tried to text her from overseas.  So I just gave her space at that point.  I let her know I was back home and then was mostly quiet as she didn't seem responsive - later she said she felt I wasn't serious about her, was doing my own thing, even though I told her it was just giving her space because she wasn't responding to me and that I was always there if she needed me. 

And then there was a period of a very strange occurrence in the first year or so of our relationship, where she said to me that she was receiving texts from an unknown number from what seemed to be someone at her work who knew about us.  The texts were said to be very insulting at first about me, calling me rude names, that I was just using my Ex, that I was a player, wasn’t serious about her, would only hurt her.  After a time the texts started insulting my Ex, calling her awful names, saying she was stupid not to see that I was just toying with her.  These purported texts (I don’t recall ever seeing one, she deleted them).  This went on for a couple of months, then there was a break for a while, then it would resume for a bit, and take another break.  Eventually they ceased.  I’m not so IT smart so could only tell her to ignore them, not to answer them and block the number but she said there wasn’t a number she could block.   And to reassure her that I wasn’t playing with her, was serious about her.  I have no idea who at her work would be so cruel to send these tormenting texts, which had the effect of putting stress on our relationship, and her doubting my motives.  Looking at DSM criteria number 9, transient, stress-related feelings of unreality or paranoia, I wonder if these texts were real or imagined?  At the time I felt they were real intrusive, unwanted communications, but now I begin to wonder.  Were they real or imagined?

Then I recognize that there seems to be this splitting going on especially since June this year when she said she was reaching out to the FNG.  She started painting me black, saying that she felt used and disrespected in our relationship and other things mentioned above, like beginning to regret the day we met, regret all the things we’ve done, etc.  And I was painted black I feel when she gave me back most of the personal gifts I gave to her two weeks after she told me about the FNG/rebound. She had kept all those gifts from Nov '18 until July '19...

So these are the kinds of things that come to mind when looking back.  As for red flags at the front end of the relationship, none that come to mind.  Though I did start to feel after a while with those intrusive texts that I was facing an uphill battle in trying to show my Ex that my love for her was real and true.

After about six months together she began to talk about moving our relationship forward, didn’t want to wait until she was 80 years old and lost her desire.  I said I wanted a long term relationship with her, but she defined that LTR was short of marriage and was irritated.  I said it included marriage, but that I had to work through some issues I had, one with the responsibility for caretaking for a sick family member whose condition was changing. 

having said that, in March 2018 I did sing her a creative marriage proposal using the lyrics and music of a love ballad I had written to her earlier, the proposal mentioned in my first post, and revisited it a couple times a few months later.  She never said yes and didn't seem to want to talk about it,  But by November we were explicitly talking about wedding rings and wedding bells before she hit another stress storm and pulled away.  Then I went into the chase mode to get her back and was emphatic with the marriage subject, to which she shot back that she didn’t say she wanted to marry me, she got mad that only now I was unambiguously clear to her about it,  and then another day and time that she had waited two years for me. 

Trying to stay strong with this, though I get almost paralyzed at times and lose motivation given the amount of information to work with on relationships, my own issues and especially now with the rebound/FNG and BPD added.  I’m much more aware of relationship dynamics in general than I was last November, and getting better in many ways with interpersonal skills, though haven’t had the opportunity to share this with my Ex given our limited interactions. 

And I actually felt that I was coping and healing before this rebound thing developed, now compounded by the BPD, that’s given me the worst anxiety ever, had a really rough in late June and July, the usual things like sleepless nights, acid reflux, loss of appetite, weight loss, diarrhea, though symptoms of emotional disruption are less as time goes by. 

The amount of energy and emotion expended on this relationship is phenomenal, never in my life has it been so intense or consuming.  I haven’t done so much homework/self-improvement work since college.  I don’t know how anyone can sustain this emotional tempo but am glad I found this BPD Family site and can find some more resources to help, whether she returns or not.   

Going back to Skip's point about pragmatism and how well matched you are, how does the material on the What Does It Take To Be In a BPD Relationship? (https://bpdfamily.com/content/what-does-it-take-be-relationship) factor in on the match question for you? 

RC

Radcliff,
Looking at the article, some initial impressions.  I can see that the most important predictor of BPD recovery is a trusted and supportive family member.  I’m willing to be that rock for my Ex, though I note the caution against ex-romantic partners not being well-suited to the role.  Self-awareness and other things I don’t know about yet may help to enable me to serve in this role, even if it is not considered well-suited.  Something may be better than nothing.

1. Strength.  If I have the opportunity to be her caretaker, I believe that based on the experience of two years together, and even the last eight months of turmoil, that I have the strength and am improving on my emotional stability for the task.  I’ve never felt my self-worth in decline, even though my ego took a hit as she’s found a rebound just now.  It’s painful, but I don’t doubt myself or who I am or where I’m going in life.

2. Realistic expectations.  The BPD knowledge I’m gaining should help identify what is realistic or not.  Honestly, I don’t know what this is yet.  This knowledge as well as my own emotional improvement and improved interpersonal skills will enable me to better engage my Ex in a relationship that will meet her needs and preserve my hide.  She already chewed on me a number of times without me really understanding the roots of it and I was able to keep perspective on it and not take it too personally.  Understanding BPD helps to set the context to better understand what she is doing and why, which should enable me to respond appropriately, e.g. validate and empathize with her, provide an optimum response and posture.

3. Accept the role of “emotional caretaker.” That’s a big responsibility and certainly a challenge that comes in a relationship with a BPD-afflicted person.  Those seven items in this section will take work, maybe a training plan for each point on its own, but I believe resources are available and that preparing to implement these points is possible.

A. Maintaining routine and structure will involve skills I learned in a military career, just need to translate them into the relational world. 

B. Setting and maintaining boundaries will be a challenge as I don’t yet appreciate this in regards to a BPD person.  Have to learn what do they need and what do I need.

C. Being empathetic, building trust, even if difficult times.  I’ve been on the empathy road for months now and add the BPD dimension to it as I learn.  In the relationship there were times she chewed on my hide, being nasty, ignoring me, and I didn’t lose composure when she did.  Trust will take time to rebuild, I understand, and at times this will be difficult, yes. 

D. Don’t tolerate abusive treatment, threats and ultimatums.  Whether her being nasty and me enduring it until it passed could be considered tolerating abusive behavior I don’t know and need to learn more about this.

E. In crisis, stay calm, don’t get defensive, don’t take it personally.  Have been through this a number of times already not really expecting or understanding it at the time.  Anticipating crises with her BPD, I can take a more objective posture and remain calm, refrain from going into the defense mode, and keep the bigger picture not to take it personally. 

F. Don’t protect them from natural consequences of their actions - let them fail.  It will take discipline not to try and fix things or clean up the mess, but I understand it is necessary.  I’m working on that right now, remaining in no contact as she explores the fantasy of her rebound.  If/when she shakes out of that and returns, I have to consider what this means for the return and reintegration before the event happens.

G. Self-destructive acts/threats require action.  Having a plan is warranted.  Not during the relationship but after the breakup she mentioned going away for good, not coming back with a final end, so this is a factor that must be addressed in the relationship.

4. Protection. Will require better situation awareness to know in the moment when this digression is happening, and how best to respond.  Knowing BPD traits and past experience in the relationship should help get a better sense of this.

5. Preserving emotional health.  Yes, the reactions and the rage take a toll.  I do have healthy outlets that keep me grounded.  I think I would have cracked up already without them.  And knowing it’s needed, I can avail myself to more resources, e.g. continue on with the therapy I’ve started.

6. Understand why.  I’m already achieving some understand on the BPD and my own issues in our relationship.  I don’t feel the need to bail out at this time although I am aware that may be the best self-preserving option.  As for why?  I’m exploring my own emotional help to understand the dynamic we had in the relationship and improve myself.  With the past as prologue, I still love my Ex and am willing to make the effort on our relationship with skills, knowledge and awareness needed if/when she decides to come back.  I’m not ready to reengage her yet with this BPD factor now in play, but am making productive use of time during this no contact period.  And I realize the self-improvement and BPD education effort needs to continue if/when she comes back and we’re in a relationship again.  It will be a lifelong effort, I know I can’t just stop.

Anyway, those are some initial impressions on the article and subject.  Of course I don’t know what I don’t know yet, about the relationship, her with BPD traits and what that means for my understanding of the past and the added load on a future relationship.  Right now I feel overwhelmed with what’s happened and with the body of knowledge bearing on all of it.  Am doing my best to do something each day to make my way, whatever that will be in the future, with or without her.

You're putting all that military training to work! (I say this with a smile, as I'm ex-military as well ;)  Seriously, you're doing a lot of great work absorbing and organizing a lot of new information, and anticipating how things might go in the future and how you might respond.

There are a couple of areas that might get underemphasized.  I get the sense you're aware of them, but they bear highlighting.  Thing 1 is figuring out what's right for you.  With a "can-do" attitude, and a large capacity to learn and respond to difficult situations in support of one you care for, it is possible to carefully assess "Can I do this job?" and blow right by the question, "Should I do this job?"  Your heart, your life, your passion and commitment are immensely valuable.  Choosing a path that can bring you happiness, fulfillment, and a reasonable amount of serenity is important.  For things to be sustainable, both partners must have their needs met.

Thing 2 is trusting your gut and staying in touch with your feelings.  Men trained to analyze situations are pretty at risk for losing touch with their feelings, especially when continually presented with challenging problems to solve.  Being mindful of Thing 2 can help you with Thing 1.

RC

Thanks, RC,
Good to see you can relate to the military background and mindset, as well as the two cautions on under-emphasized areas.

Thing #1.  When we were good she met my needs in spades, and enough so that even in the times when she pulled back or chewed on my hide I could endure it until she pitched back in again and replenished me in love.  It was ample enough to keep me going indefinitely.  Challenge was I didn’t fully appreciate or understand her needs and how I could best interact with her to meet them before she threw in the towel on us and went for a rebound.  Am learning up on better meeting her needs and now with the BPD aspect, critiquing our relationship in this new light.  Am reasonably optimistic I can satisfy her needs if/when she gives us the opportunity.  And when we were good, I felt that I was living my life with zest, in my heart and soul, my passion and commitment were solid to her, to myself, to us.  Didn’t feel I lost myself in her, she never became my sole source for being, but I surely relished and welcomed her support for my work and endeavors beyond our relationship.

Yes, the “Can do” and the “Should do” are two different questions. At this point, still early on in the BPD understanding mode, I feel the two are aligned and sustainable.  I don’t know how useful time together is as a measure of endurance, but we made it two years without my appreciation of BPD and what she was experiencing on her side.  And I understand even with my learning and application, there’s no guarantee it will last a second time around.  It will have a better chance if she recognizes she needs help and is willing to get therapy.  I am already and would be willing to with her, and certainly support her if she wants to get it alone.  Her recognition of her condition and getting therapy to help will certainly add to improved odds the relationship will last.  Though approaching this subject of her recognizing her condition and needing therapy appears to be a sensitive one.  Maybe more so as she is a nurse and solid in her job, she may not think she has any issues or would have recognized them already. 

Thing  #2.  Yes, it a good caution here as it can easily be a case of looking at getting the Ex back like obtaining a military objective.  Feelings don’t matter when you have your marching orders and one can look at securing an objective in an emotionally detached manner.  Here I have work to do.  Even though my Ex opened me up emotionally more than anyone in my life, it wasn’t enough for her, and not for me either to be with her.  I have to resolve internal issues and I hope to make progress on this in the therapy I’m in now.  I was out of touch with my feelings in the relationship, heck, for my life when I look at it, and have to get well in this area which will help me with Thing #1.

Appreciate your perspectives on this situation.  Learning is occurring…
T-Bar

It sounds like you're very well dialed in.  Understanding about BPD can in fact be a game changer.  One of my favorite tools that brings quick results is learning not to “justify, argue, defend, or explain” (JADE) (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=139972.0).  There are a bunch more coping tools you can learn on this site.  They can make a big difference in BPD relationships as well as in relationships in general.

RC

Thank you, RC,
    Had started to note this JADE thing mentioned in different discussion threads on this site, not an acronym I'm familiar with until now - thanks for the link you sent.  Reckon I'll dive into this and grasp the concept and practice it as I learn more on the BPD trail.
Sincerely,
T-Bar

   

My second favorite early tool to apply is validation.  Learning how to apply validation can help reassure the pwBPD and makes a big difference.  To learn more about validation, take a look at this excellent page on how to validate and avoid being invalidating (https://bpdfamily.com/content/communication-skills-dont-be-invalidating).

RC

RC,
That JADE reading was helpful, thank you.  I can see where I JADEd with her in the past on many occasions.  Though I will say that in our last substantive face-to-face conversation on 1 July (25 minutes) I think I didn't JADE as I sensed it wouldn't help as I asked her to tell me more about her feelings behind some of her actions in leaving me, so that she could feel heard.  Even though she asked who needs to hear her - I did say I did and others who love her.  Seeing this JADE concept explained helps my awareness and I know I can make this work much better if/when she pitches back.

Will chew on this Validation lesson now.  I have in my mind to pair validation with empathy, been doing a lot of that for her since around March this year, though none since I've gone no contact in July.  All things considered, even with her drama, I miss her terribly...
Sincerely,
T-Bar

Yes, JADE is huge.  I came out of my FOO as a big time JADE guy.

Thinking of JADE, validation, and empathy together, one of the things that has helped me the most is to look at the pwBPD who is upset and realize that it's not about the facts for them in that moment, it's about the emotions.  When I've realized that in the heat of the moment and made a quick decision to set aside my bias towards facts, logic and problem solving in favor of focusing completely on the pwBPD's emotions, it's been extremely successful.  This tactic can also be successful in other situations.

RC

RC,
Great perspective on JADE and being able to refrain from it in the heat of the moment.  I was at a disadvantage earlier when she acted in a certain way, kinda confused, deer in the headlights look and reflexive response at what was happening, didn't understand her in the moment.  Well, I think with all that's happened, including my most recent interactions with her, working on myself, info and advice from you and others here, I'm better able to take a step back when she does and/or says things and see the bigger picture, focus on the context and not the content of what she is saying or doing.

Right now I'll keep working on myself with all this in mind.  She's still in the honeymoon/idealization period with the rebound now. We're near two months of no contact, though I remain ready and willing to respond to her if/when she reaches out to me.  Not sure how long this idealization stage will last, if there are any averages.  I know every situation is different, every person is different. 

Do you think sticking to no contact indefinitely is the best course of action?  Let the rebound fantasy play out, so to speak?  Or to reach out to her at a certain point (and when/what might that be?)?  Just to let her know I still care and am still here if she needs?  She was splitting me black as described above in the last few weeks before I went into no contact.  Does a person with BPD traits, and she has depression too I believe, think that we've abandoned them if I stay strict no contact?  So they would be less likely to reach out if they thought this?  Does this feeling change if they've painted you black?  Of course she's distracted with the rebound now, and having split me black, for a while anyway, she may not care at all that I still care and am here for her.  I don't have any way of overtly knowing if the rebound is foundering or has ended (she doesn't do social media and I'm not a stalker), and/or if maybe I am becoming white in her mind again.  I guess one overt sign would be if she reaches out... 

With all her wellness issues unaddressed (e.g. BPD, depression), I think it's just a matter of time before a rebound train wreck occurs, at either her or his initiation.  I doubt he has any idea what he got involved with.  Don't know if she will reach out to me when that wreck happens but I hope so, and I'll be better prepared if/when she does.  It must be at her initiation; I do understand she has to want us to be together again and I know I'll need to take things slow. 

The JADE and Validation lessons are quite helpful in looking at future opportunity.  Appreciate any other suggestions for our prospective reintegration if/when she pitches back.  I wanna try and minimize my reactive responses to her when this happens, aiming to be informed on interacting with her BPD and depression, to anticipate and proactively prepare as much as I can even knowing there will likely be unexpected curve balls thrown at me...

Yes, for certain take it very slowly.  Overpursuing is a common error among "nons" trying to rekindle a BPD relationship.  Have you blocked her on texts or phone calls?  If she wanted to reach out to you, could she?  Has the two months of no contact been completely voluntary on both sides, or has one person or other instituted blocks on communication?  When you communicated, how did you typically do it?

RC

Hello, RC,
No, I haven't blocked her at all.  Yes, she could reach out to me if she wanted to.  Our primary form of communication was via text, email secondary, phone call tertiary.

The two months of no contact has apparently been mutual as I have not initiated any contact, nor has she.

At last word in early July I texted her that I would respond to her and promptly if it was something urgent, otherwise in light of her choosing to reach out to someone else (the rebound) I was gonna be quiet.  Haven't heard from her since then.

Copy on the over-pursuit. I dood it, didn't know she would feel smothered by my expressions of love and attempts at reasoning us back together - will deliberately and consciously with awareness throttle back on the next go around...

The safest form of contact is a short message that's just slightly warmer than neutral, and makes no demands, not even a question that calls for a reply.  Something like, "I was eating spaghetti tonight and smiled thinking of those Italian dinners we enjoyed together.  I hope you are well."  You're the best one to make the call on when it makes sense to send a message. 

RC

Thank you, RC,
That short message idea, making no demands, no question seeking a reply, sounds fitting.  There are so many things everyday that remind me of her, but have to think of something that will resonate with her, a happy memory for her that might not be easy for her to paint black.

It would certainly test the waters to see if the line of communication is still open, though I understand there's no indication to the text sender when you're blocked by someone.  If a phone call goes right to voicemail immediately or after one ring it's an indication of blocking, so I understand, but I don't want to call her.  After the breakup I tried several times to call and talk with her and she thought it very unusual as we usually texted - she wouldn't answer and just texted me back.

Going back to a question for a moment, how do people with BPD and depression look at a partner who goes no contact with them for a reason?  Do they perceive it as an abandonment?  Even though in my case she essentially abandoned me (though she said she saw me as a friend, still cared for me - but what does that mean if there's no contact? Just a lie, telling me something I wanna hear?).   Anyway, just trying to reflect on this in any decision to reach out or not...

Appreciate your enduring my rambling and offering helpful suggestions...
T-Bar

They are quite likely to perceive the situation differently, and not understand the reason for no contact, even if the "non" partner explains it to them, and they are likely to feel abandoned.  This is one of the things that can make it super tough for an empathetic caretaker to break up with them, or to set boundaries with them.

It's likely that she genuinely meant she saw you as a friend when she said it.  Her emotions may have shifted, or she may simply be unconsciously avoiding you out of fear or anxiety.  Or perhaps even out of a measured decision to keep her distance.  Many folks initially want to remain friends after a breakup and find it difficult.

RC

Thank you, RC,
This seems so confusing and contradictory to me.  On the one hand she reached out to someone else, replacing/displacing me.  Yet she might perceive my silence as abandonment.  I can see how this dynamic would make it hard for an empathetic caretaker to set boundaries or break up with them.  Although in this case she broke up with me, and might still feel abandoned by me in this no contact?  Maybe the no contact feeds into her narrative that "our love wasn't real" as she split me black.

She does have a lot of anxiety and doesn't want to be alone, I believe, as well as BPD traits and depression too.  She did express fear to me in her last text messages, when she said she didn't tell me all about the rebound because she was scared (she didn't explain though what she was scared of, I presume my reaction if she had told me everything, her fear that I might have abandoned her at that point?). In our last face-to-face talk, she refused some simple gifts I tried to give her (some tea and cookies), said she didn't want to give me the impression she wanted to be more than friends.  So I think there are elements of that "measured decision to keep distance" as well as anxiety and fear mixed in to her silence for the last two months.  Not to mention the idealization phase with the rebound.

This can sure bring one down, all of this.  I do make an effort daily to read and learn about BPD, etc.  But had a hard time wanting to get up this morning.  Like I could just sleep and make it all go away.  Then I got my phone and accidentally ran across a screen capture of a text from her with emojis asking me "...which is quicker, a flaming car crash or a gun?" from one of those times she was hinting at harming herself.  That jolted me and up and out of bed I was.  My poor Dear!  I'm doing my best to function, for myself, for others and to be here and ready for her if/when she reaches out.

Thanks again for your perspective, RC.  I see you responding to comments for other folks too, giving of your time and perspective to help others who are hurting.  Am sure they appreciate you too.
T-Bar 

   

Hi T-Bar,

I struggled with the same concern. If I am not reaching out will she feel abandoned and pull farther away. This was always on my mind during the second go around I had with her. The first go around I had no idea about BPD.

After she cut me lose in July of 2018 I basically was no contact. I’m the type of person who will move on and never look back. This would have been the case with her but I accidentally texted her when I was talking to someone else asking for advice on why they thought she left me.

Over the next year we saw each other at work. Most of the work run ins were positive but didn’t lead to anything. I sent a few reach out texts and she did too but neither pushed it any farther than a few back and forth texts then it would go cold.

During this time I learned about BPD and was doing a lot of research.

Almost a year after I met her I reached out and asked if she would talk. She agreed and I basically said I wanted to see her again. Nothing serious but I wanted her in my life as something other than a friend.

She agreed and we started texting again. Right away she began the push pull. I would text and she would not respond for days. I would try and validate her and alleviate her fear of abandonment by telling her “I’m still here for you” or “i’m not going away unless you want me too.” She would eventually respond but I was always the one who reached out.

I don’t want to bore you with the details but here we are after the second go around and we are over again.

So my point is. I did reach out and we did get back together for about four months. I took a chance and it paid off, however briefly. So was it worth it? Yes it was. I am in a much better place now than I was last year. I now realize there is probably very little I could have done to save this. Had I not had a second chance with her I would have always wondered.

Yes I reached out and it worked but it was almost a year before I broached the topic of getting back together. The other reach outs were small, non demanding texts.

I would not have reached out if she EVER said “don’t ever contact me again” I think that is where most people burn their bridge. They keep trying reason with the BP after this ultimatum and it just makes things so much worse. I think the only reason she was willing to keep communicating is because I backed way off each time. This go around when I asked her to get back together I told her to be honest with me. If she didn’t want to do It I would not hound her or bother her or make life miserable for her. She replied “I know, you just disappear!” She almost seemed to respect that I could walk away like that.

That is just my experience. I don’t know if it helps or not. 

Thank you, Coldknight,
That's helpful perspective. How long was it after you went no contact in July 2018 that you accidentally texted your exBPD?  How long was it until she responded and what was her initial response like?

In my case I haven't been given any ultimatum about not contacting her ever again.  In my mind the door is still open; not sure how she views this longest communications outage since we've known each other.  I'm doing all of what I can think of to understand what happened on our first go around and to make changes I need for myself and to be able to get back together with her if/when she pitches back.  Like you, I want to know I've done everything I could on my part to make it work.  Am noting how it was almost a year after you met her (again?) before you asked her to get back together again.  I know I'll need to take any reintegration with her slow, and keep all I've been learning in mind about BPD, etc.

It's been two month of no contact so far.  I feel at some point I'll want to reach out to her again (actually I feel that every day).  What response she'll makes remains to be seen, but may help me, help us, shape the way ahead, one way or the other.   And at least I'll know that I tried.   

It was only just over a week and she responded immediately but she was upset that i was talking about her to others. We texted back and forth over the next few days over the break up but she avoided giving me reasons why. 

She seemed to go cold one morning but then texted me a friendly flirty txt that night. The next night I texted her but instead of taking it slow I tried to rush things and ended up pushing her away again. I ran into her at work a week later and we talked on the phone that night and then texted later back and forth a few times. I texted something I thought was sweet and she never responded so I stopped reaching out.

After that we would run into each other once or twice a month or text once a month. From July 2018 to April 2019 we ran into each other or texted at least once a month and she seemed friendly almost flirty when I would see her but she would never text me after.

Yes it was about a year. There is a possibility that we could have gotten back together sooner but I was unwilling to pursue it. For instance she In October she didn’t return a call after I left a voicemail one time so i never called back or texted. Three weeks later she sent me a work question out of the blue. A question that could have been answered by anyone. I answered the next day very matter of factly and she responded with a pleasantly and I never sent anything else.

Maybe if i had been a little more friendly or reached out a little more things would have redeveloped quicker. I don’t really know. I was just unwilling to go the extra mile. If he stopped texting so did I.

One thing to note. Like you, she and I texted A LOT during our first go round. After the breakup I started watching all kinds of dating coaches who said texting ruins attraction and you should only text to set up dates. I tried this on the second go around and only texted once or twice a day. No major conversations.

I also tried to make dates whenever she reached out but it seemed like the more I tried to lock her into a date the more she would pull away. I think her fear of engulfment was stronger than her fear of abandonment.

Again I’m not convinced that there is anything I could have done that would have kept the relationship going. I could have done everything right (I did plenty wrong that’s for sure) and still ended up here...

Thanks for the amplification, Coldknight,
Yes, the push pull dynamic with pwBPD can be vexing and tiring.  Interesting that you perceive maybe her fear of engulfment overriding her fear of abandonment.  She knew you were there in the monthly interactions that took place but seemed unwilling to do more.

I did pursue a lot after our breakup, trying that logic and reasoning thing, which didn't work.  Then gradually decreased my reaching out, but was always responsive to her when she did which she did often for several months.  Then she reached out to this rebound, and so I went no contact.  It's a dice roll I suppose, choosing not to interfere with her decision and hoping she will ultimately realize that we are better together.  Time will tell if her decision or my decision works out best.  But it hurts to be like this...   
T-Bar

Having said that, I find it hard to deal with the anxiety I'm feeling, sweating it out in a way, while this rebound thing plays out. 

Am trying to keep myself busy but it's hard not to feel this anxiety and sometimes it is almost incapacitating.  Every minute seems like an hour, every hour like a day...

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