BPDFamily.com

Hello! I am new to this site and new to the world of BPD. I am a divorced mother to a 19 year old daughter who likely has BPD. She lives in another state after an aborted attempt at college there. I traveled to visit her due to my concerns, and her therapist's concerns, for her safety and her descent into depression and BPD behaviors. I have been here for a week, taking care of her as best I can, and trying to find local mental health providers for her - a seemingly impossible task where she lives. She is refusing meds, refusing residential programs, and has given up. When she feels up to it, she does manage to go to her part time job at a grocery store. She wants to come home with me so she can do nothing and be taken care of. She came home during the first few months of the pandemic, and it was awful. She stayed in bed most of the time playing video games and binging on TikTok & YouTube videos, didn't take care of herself (rarely showered, brushed her teeth, or did laundry), and stated she would rather starve than prepare food for herself. Now I live in an even smaller apartment, which would cause even greater stress on me, and I work work full time from home. Her father (who has BPD characteristics) is a trigger for her, so she would refuse to stay with him (I don't blame her). Am I horrible for not wanting to bring her home with me?

You are certainly not terrible for not wanting to have her at home with you. Your last experience sounds exactly like my current one since PPB D came home from a domestic violent situation.

Such a dilemma isn't it? Somehow we always end up being cornered, unless we take a really strong step and cut them off. I'm not at that point but gosh I do imagine it sometimes because I am so tired of dealing with it.

You say you work from home. Is there any chance you can visit reasonably frequently? Sounds as though you have had some contact with her therapist - did they give you any idea about what steps you can take?

Sending lots of thoughts . . . .

You are not horrible at all. Us moms and dads have the constant guilt.  We do every thing to help them


Stay true to your feelings and past experience   That will lead you in the right direction.  Do what is best for you and your mental health.

Welcome to BPDFamily, happy to meet you, sorry you're here.

FYI I tend to be more judgmental than others, so while I offer an "alternate take on it", don't assume that everyone or even most here necessarily agree with me - it's just a viewpoint to consider.

"Am I horrible for not wanting to bring her home with me?" - No...and Maybe Yes.

The fact you don't want to bring her home with you is definitely understandable - even amongst the parents who aren't willing to say they feel that way, most can probably admit the thought has at least crossed their mind if not weighed heavily.

Ultimately what determines your own self is not so much whether you want to, as whether you do things you don't want when they might be the right thing to do. Think of this as a possible opportunity to give her a real-life example of what self-sacrifice can look like, what a focus outside oneself and the present-day can be.

You and her therapist are both concerned about her depression, BPD and subsequent safety, and you're not able to find her suitable mental health supports in her current state where she no longer feels she has any reason to be. In fact you describe it as "impossible" for you, who is higher-functioning than she, to find a suitable safety net for her in this region.

I do think it's great that you've spent a week out of state helping her, but if she's saying she wants to move back with you rather than her father - it would be a relatively major issue in her mind if she perceived you as rejecting her. BPDs are often insanely insecure and their suicidalism often arises from their perception that they are not valued in the way they hope to be. I believe BPDs already have the highest rate of attempted suicide even without accompanying depression and lack of meaningful relationships - so I'd say the risk is much higher for those in your shoes and mine than it is for our friends who may have similarly "failure to launch" children with whom they try "tough love".

If you look around the forum you'll find parents of 13-16 year olds asking whether it's realistic to hope that they'll live in their own place, get a degree, start a family - and the overwhelming number of answers say "anything is possible, but it's not likely - unfortunately you're going to have to prepare for the fact she may need care through her 20s the way an autistic or schizophrenic child will". It's really rough being a caretaker of a pwBPD - it's not like having a child who is simply a narcissist, OCD or avoidant personality disorder. Those aren't easy - but they don't require the same level of continued care due to a failure to thrive.

The only alternative I would consider, were I in your position, would be gently asking if she'd like help moving to a new locale other than your boring little apartment and helping her get a train ticket and first/last month's rent to go try seeking stimulation in Key West or San Francisco or Fargo; give her a few days to think about possible locations, look them up together and see if they seem fun - but be alert to her feeling rejected and be ready to back down. Ultimately the BPD's likely going to prevent her from finding an identity in those locations as well -  but it might buy you some time and make her happy for a few months and help "reset" her problematic behaviors.

In the final analysis, we had children - our children may not have turned out how we hoped, may even be the antithesis of how we tried to raise them - but ultimately don't we feel a debt to them especially when they are still "young"? Again as a disclaimer, I've seen a few comments suggestive that I'm more dismissive of the importance of "taking care of yourself first and foremost" than others think I should be - so it's just my stance, there are others. Assuming you don't have BPD and depression and are in similar straits yourself, then this isn't an issue of "affix your own oxygen mask before assisting others" - it's about triaging to each according to their needs. And pwBPDs have insanely high needs, unfortunately.

Don't forget that the world today is not designed the way it was when you or I were her age - to buy herself a car would require three times as many working-hours as you worked to afford one, college rates are up 1000% and she's inundated by social media and corporations that will attempt to brainwash her into acting like a child without impulse control because that's where their profits lie.

Many 19-year olds today are more comparable to what we considered a 16-year old when we were growing up, or our parents considered a 13-year old to be - ready to start babysitting on their own, maybe flipping burgers a few days a week, but mostly interested in comic books, actresses and discovering new bands that are super-cool. So even without BPD, look at https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20130626005441/en/How-Old-is-Too-Old-to-Be-Living-With-Parents-Gen-Z-Says-Age-28-Would-Be-Embarrassing (https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20130626005441/en/How-Old-is-Too-Old-to-Be-Living-With-Parents-Gen-Z-Says-Age-28-Would-Be-Embarrassing) - average teenagers her age (without BPD) say it's okay to live at home until they're 28. One of my dBPDs (yes there are multiples, happy, happy, joy, joy - it might be why I'm a little less  :love-it: and a little more  *) than others here - but in my defence, all still alive and not institutionalized) is currently 31 and just re-enrolled in first-year community college transitional courses like "Study Habits to Succeed" and "Learning to Schedule"...and it's not likely she'll end up with a certificate muchless a degree - but it's important that she feels supported and loved and that she's making great strides and improvements (and never finds my account on this forum).

So, with that out of the way, what suggestions can I offer?

I'd say her behavior you describe last time she's home is indicative that the depression is overwhelming her - and that's curable whereas BPD is only manageable...so shift some heavy attention onto the depression. Meds are one obvious avenue if you can convince her, otherwise you can try to inject some ambition into her cocooned life. Ask if she'd make a Youtube/TikTok channel if you bought her a webcam, or you promised to appear in every fifth video she made, promise to take her out to her favourite restaurant when she has a video with more than 100 views, etc. Cash bribery doesn't work well with depression because it requires effort to go turn it into something you want and it usually just ends up as 10% more food/alcohol/Disney+ and then disappearing.

Obviously if she's struggling with substance abuse (as many BPDs do), that can heavily impact her depression - so again, consider a "You can move back in with me and don't need to pay rent or anything just so long as you promise to attend the AA/NA/Therapy sessions as scheduled" or something.

Per the BPD, while I'm a believer that medication works more effectively than behavioral therapy conversational techniques (again though, I'm likely in a minority there) - there are two common routes; either "Here's a pill every morning that will make your day less BPD" or "Here's a pill but just take it when you feel an anxiety attack or fit of rage of self-harm episode coming on, you don't need it every morning because you're more healthy than most people!" (though they're actually different meds, but hey, she doesn't need to know that detail - pump up that self-esteem). It's possible she'll consider the one if not the other, or will promise to keep a few alprazolam in her wallet "just in case" and you'll never ask her whether she's taken them, etc. (They do tend to fear judgment or admitting they have a problem, since their identity is so shaky and they think something like BPD is the sum total of who they are).

I wish you and her the best, and hope you're both able to emerge successfully on the other side.

It is good to look at things from different angles. I'm not sure Pearls before has taken into account what happened when your daughter was living with you. Even though she sees that as the answer, it was not a good situation at all (it is the situation that I have currently). Under the same roof can be a retrograde step.

If you look at things purely from what is in your daughter's best interest - it seems to me that you supporting her in her place might be preferable to you supporting her in yours (whether she is in the place she is in now, or moves to another place where there is more help available).

This illness takes us round and round - two steps forward, one back. If possible I think it's good to hold the ground and work on the issues from that point of view.

Welcome, Snow.
As you have gathered by now, there is no one size fits all answer to our adult  kids' BPD journey.
You are a caring mother who has been helping your adult daughter , while being realistic to what has transpired in the past with her.  I agree with what has been posted thus far-that  you do have a right to your feelings.  There are no judgements here.  However, this must be looked at: you did have her live with you before and the result was she got worse.  That can happen-It happened to my adult son in spite of everything .  I am so very sorry you are faced with this.
 
I can't tell you what is right for your situation, but If you do ultimately decide to take her back in, I strongly suggest taking these points in consideration :
~ Has anything changed since the last time she lived with you ?  You've mentioned she has a therapist now , in your state?   
~This is tricky since your daughter is an adult - but if there is some way your daughter  can give you permission to talk to her therapist in order to help you come up with living plan / contract if you were to help her?  Maybe this could even be a condition she has to meet before you agree to take her in?   The  contract would have to have boundaries and appropriate consequences spelled out if she does not keep up her end of the bargain- I would even get it notarized.   
~Are the consequences something you can live with if she does not follow through?
Please write back as you are able, we can be a sounding board as you think things through. You are not alone.








 

Thank you for all of your feedback - all very helpful and much appreciated. Over the past week I have found a local DBT therapist and groups skills program that has immediate openings and which my daughter is agreeing to try. She is now on a wait list to see a psychiatrist here, and now has a local GP. She continues to get therapy/coaching from another therapist she has been seeing for years. My daughter allows me to speak with her mental health providers, which has been very helpful.

However, she is still in really bad shape with depression, and is considering quitting her job as a result. I am considering moving to her location to provide her with the support she needs now, since the cost of living here is much lower than my town. To be honest, if she came to live with me and broke the contract, I'm not sure I would have the strength to toss her out. This is the primary reason I am afraid to have her come live with me.

I have another crazy question - have any of your pwBDPs tried micro-dosing psychedelics to help with their intense feelings of hopelessness and anxiety?

Thanks
 

One of my more distant dBPDs has tried psilocybin claiming it would help - but without much success. I'm suspicious the only "success" it has is the same success as alcohol, Taco Bell or Netflix...they become too lethargic to self-harm and thus consider the day a win. It's not a great solution in my mind, but again I've only seen it in limited doses (pun intended).

Glad to hear about the DBT specialist with an immediate opening, there are definitely a lot of people on the forum who swear it is the most helpful thing they've found (I'm not among them, but as mentioned, different strokes for different folks). I know DBT is designed to be taken by both BPDs and their caretakers, so as long as you're in town you might think about popping in for a couple sessions or at least looking up Marsha Linehan videos on Youtube or something so that you can "speak the same language" as your daughter as she learns new terms for coping strategies, etc.

Depression on its own rarely frightens me, but depression alongside BPD or Bipolar or Schizophrenia or whatever...that scares the heck out of me. Statistically speaking, we like to speak in statistics because it helps us remain detached from the reality of the threat facing them and us as their loved ones.

Getting depressed loved ones out of the house can be a huge help, bit of fresh air and change of scenery - if it's not a metre of snow where you are right now might consider telling her YOU would like/need to go for a 30 minute walk every afternoon and would appreciate if she'd come along and you can end up at a coffeeshop or something and then walk home. Naturopathic, if I'm to continue the puns.

Wonderful news, Snowed!
Re: micro-dosing with psychedelics... I tend to agree with PearlsBefore.  Please discuss with your daughter's therapist first. I am not sure all it entails  .
In addition, please make sure there is no addiction in the family-

My adult son  drifted to  LSD and psilocybin mushrooms in college, to" take the edge off". Unfortunately, he has the addiction gene and this all got out of control with a quickness. However, in my son's case, not only did he have a family history of this, but refused therapy . 

I also agree if you can manage to entice your daughter out for a walk , exercise ,etc, awesome...  Do what you can when you can. Me going out for walks with the son did help before he got too ill and dysregulated.