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Hello, I am looking for some advice or maybe experiences that will help me gain some much needed clarity.

My 13yr old daughter has recently told me that her stepdad has been inappropriately touching her. She has then also gone on to say that she has suicidal thoughts, sees monsters, hears voices and feels that she is ‘past help’ saying that what she is experiencing is far worse than anyone else and that not even a professional will be able to understand or help her. She has said that these feelings have been there for a long time and are not caused by the touching.

The allegations, for various reasons, do not add up and I am inclined to believe that they are more to do with her mental health. Please do not see me as a ‘mum in denial’ - I have reported it to the authorities, safeguarding is in place and the police are investigating. I just cannot shake the thought that there is more to this than what has been said - these doubts are based on my daughter’s behaviours/emotions, discrepancies in what she is saying happened and piecing together the last year or so.

We have been to the doctor who has submitted a mental health referral and we are waiting for that to come through. When speaking to the doctor I said that I was expecting a diagnosis more than regular teenage anxiety/depression - she said nothing but smiled and nodded.

Rightly or wrongly I have been searching the Internet for some direction in relation to her mental health, for your daughter to say she is suicidal is a massive worry and I feel I need to do something while we are waiting for an assessment. I have come across BPD and she does seem to have a lot of the traits and also the causes would be present too - a domestic violence relationship where the abuse was directed at both myself and the children until she was 5 and not seen her father since.

She is very clingy/possessive of myself and I fear that I may have enabled her with this. For instance, if I was holding hands with my partner I would allow her to split our hands apart to hold mine or sit herself between us on the sofa causing my partner to move. Due to the guilt I feel from staying in a DV relationship for so long, I try not to upset the kids over things and would be inclined to tell my new partner off for silly things that I worried may rock the boat but let the kids get away with things rather than upset them.

When I first met my new partner my daughter was obsessed with him and thought he was amazing, she loved having a new dad around and was sometimes more for him than for me and would not leave him alone. Move on a few years and puberty hitting her, then she started being the typical stroppy teenager who would sometimes ignore him or get in a mood around him - we put this down to normal teenage emotions and it would also happen with other members of the family too so saw no cause for concern. Even with the mood swings there would still be plenty of times when she would be all over him and wanting to spend time with him. At no point did she ever appear uncomfortable around him.

Over the last year she has said a few things to me about ‘not being ready for a new dad’, ‘a new dad being around bringing back bad memories of her old dad’ and ‘going back to just us as we don’t need a man’. This all started about 3 years into our relationship so at this point she was very used to having him around. Again I put this down to normal teenage/stepparent rebellion as she never said anything bad about my partner and it was more about her feelings/perception. Every time we talked it through which seemed to alleviate her concerns and going forward she was happy to be around him so I didn’t see any cause for concern other than it being normal teenage behaviour with the added complication of having had a bad experience with her own dad.

Now that this allegation has come out though I am thinking maybe she was trying to give me reasons to end the relationship and as this did not work it has now built up into this allegation now? I am also mindful that the abuse could have been going on and that these were attempts to get rid of him without having to tell me the painful truth.

I had suspicions that the allegation may not be the truth and that it either stemmed from unresolved issues with her real dad that she is now directing at her new dad or that she sees him as a threat to her relationship with me and wants him out of the way. After finding BPD I’m thinking there also may be a chance that she is scared her new dad will leave like her old dad did so is pushing him away or that she is so scared of losing me to him.

Her emotions at the moment are not what they usually are. Even when she is talking about feeling suicidal she comes across as very detached, like as if she is telling me of something that is happening to someone else and not her. She has been saying quite disturbing things about her mental health which worry me silly but then within minutes she is laughing about something else or acting as if nothing has happened. 

I would like to ask if anyone has had any similar experiences related to BPD or with your knowledge and experience if this could be consistent with BPD or am I completely barking up the wrong tree? If it is possibly linked with BPD, is therapy likely to reveal if the allegation is true or not? I am also worried that if it is BPD, will my health board be open to diagnosing this before she turns 18 so she can get the treatment she needs. Whether the allegation is true or not she is definitely in need of help with her mental health, I just worry that if the allegation is false but it never comes out as false then going forward she might see further allegations as a solution to difficult times in her life.

Thank you for any help or advice that you can give. In regards to the allegation that is all in the hands of the police but I am so worried about her mental health and getting her the right support.

Hi Purpleiris:
So sorry for what you are going through.  Sounds like you have thought through most possibilities.  It's good that you are taking her accusations seriously, but she could be making up things.  People with BPD/BPD traits tend to lie a lot.  Many believe their own lies.

It sounds like with your current partner, there were periods of idealization and now devaluation.

You indicate that your daughter's bio dad was abusive.  It's common for abusive people to have some form of mental illness, but it may not be diagnosed or ever treated.

Your daughter's mental state could be routed with the way her abusive bio dad treated her, but perhaps that is only part of the issue. Brain wiring & chemistry is commonly genetic.  Your daughter may have genetically inherited some mental issues. 

BPD rarely stands alone.  Anxiety & depression and other mental healh issues commonly accompany it.  Usually, other mental health diagnoses happen first and then BPD gets added onto the group of mental health issues.  The traits of BPD aren't unique to BPD.

Since people with BPD traits tend to believe their own lies, I suspect therapy won't prompt a different story. Unless you get a very good therapist.  Sometimes, it's hard to get to the truth and false memories can expand.

If you do a thread search for this particular board (son or daughter) and use the words "false accusations", you will find that it is common.  Be sure to use a time frame & perhaps search a year at a time.

[quote =Purpleiris] My 13yr old daughter has recently told me that her stepdad has been inappropriately touching her. She has then also gone on to say that she has suicidal thoughts, sees monsters, hears voices and feels that she is ‘past help’ saying that what she is experiencing is far worse than anyone else and that not even a professional will be able to understand or help her. She has said that these feelings have been there for a long time and are not caused by the touching.[/quote]

Hope she gets in for a psych eval soon.  Sounds rather complicated.  If she sees things that aren't there and hers thing that aren't there, you do have to question if her accusations against your partner are true.

How is your partner handling this?  Are you all still in the same home?

Hi naughty nibbler and thank you for your reply.

In regards to bio dad nothing was diagnosed but I am pretty sure he has NPD. I had counselling after I left him and the counsellor said he sounded highly narcissistic and when I looked it up it was like a light bulb moment, everything fitted and made sense.

You point out that a BPD trait is to believe their own lies, this is something I have been wondering as in herself she is adamant that it happened yet certain things she is saying do not make sense and could not be true. When I questioned her about the clearly untrue bits she became very emotionally agitated, probably the most emotion she showed during the whole discussion, and started backtracking claiming that she did not say the things that I highlighted. I backed off at that point as if there is a chance that she is telling the truth I do not want her feeling that I do not believe her, it is a very difficult situation to deal with.

My partner is absolutely devastated at the allegations and obviously scared of the repercussions, thankfully though he understands why I have to treat it seriously and has moved out while we deal with this. Him moving out safeguards them both because if this is a course of conduct to get rid of him then the next allegation could be an even worse one, if she is telling the truth then it safeguards her also.

I can’t help but think there is also an element of attention to it, she was adamant that she didn’t want to go to the police as she didn’t think they would believe her, yet when we did she seemed to enjoy speaking to them despite her previous reluctance and looked very pleased when they praised her for doing so well.

Hi again Purpleiris:
People with BPD/BPD Traits tend to split people (from black to white - good to bad).  Sometimes, someone can get painted black from the smallest slight.  You might want to talk to your partner.  Did some type of disagreement occur with your daughter prior to her making the touching accusations?  It could relate to her feelings being invalidated in some way by your partner, or maybe something happened that she wants to blame him for.  It doesn't have to be something huge, and you may not have noticed.  Perhaps she wasn't allowed to do something she wanted or to go somewhere.

Have you had a private conversation with the police (without your daughter) to advise them about her claims that she sees & hears things that aren't there?

You might find the article at the link below about why Borderlines & Narcissists lie so much:
https://www.bpdcentral.com/blog/?Why-Do-Narcissists-and-Borderlines-Lie-So-Much-24

He cannot think of anything specific that could have caused it, definitely no rows. He’s usually happy to please her so if she wants him to do tiktok dances he will, if she wants to put make up on him he’ll let her etc, there have been times when he’s said no and she’s been ok about it, other times he’s said no and it’s put her in a mood. She can flip into moods easily enough so like you say maybe it’s something we haven’t noticed.

I know she does find him annoying, agreed he can be annoying but in an overgrown child way and nothing malicious. He does my head in at times but after being in an abusive relationship I see it as something minor in comparison.  Maybe the annoyance is a lot bigger in her eyes.

I have spoken with the police on my own and made them aware of my concerns and the happenings over the last year so they are aware of the bigger picture. They seem to take it all on board thankfully and agreed that there could be more to this than what has been alleged.

Thank you for your comments, it has reassured me that maybe I am thinking in the right direction and not just looking for a convenient excuse, it’s safe to say that my head is completely fried at the moment!

I'm sorry that you are going through all of this.  Ugh. I'm glad that you are working with the local authorities just in case.  However, I have a lot of personal experience with an ex-wife with BPD who lies a lot. My lying issues haven't been with my step daughter with BPD but with her mother who also has BPD.  The mother has engaged in parental alienation with the kids that she shares with my husband. She's made up terrible things about him and told them to the kids, like that he her raped her regularly, he tried to kill her, and that she didn't want them to come to our house because my husband abuses me. None of which are true. He's a sweet, gentle, and kind man. I have never seen aggressive or demeaning behavior from him. The boys didn't really believe her but the daughter did and it caused a huge distance between them.  Things are better now, because the kids are older and they see for themselves how their mother treats people and how their father treats people.

I think his ex wife often believes her own lies after a while, and your daughter may, too.  In my own few interactions with her, she's made accusations against me. She lies about what she tells me. I never said... or did ...  Fortunately, I only communicate through text with her, so I just screen shot evidence of her lies and send them back to her. Mostly now I just stop responding once any drama starts.

Hi Kbug

Thank you for replying.

This is my worry that if she has lied for whatever reason that it will eventually become a reality for her, maybe there is some part of her that already does believe it. I fully believe that if it is a lie there is a mental health reason behind it as she is not a malicious child, whether this is BPD related or something else I just hope that with the right help they will get to the bottom of it so she can get the treatment she needs.

Same here, my partner has never been anything other than caring and loving, always wanting to make us happy and look after us. Obviously with something like this I had to report it as there is always a chance no matter how well you know someone so I have given them all the facts so they can do a full investigation. My doubts though are coming from my daughter herself; her behaviour, discrepancies, her emotions etc rather than my faith in my partner.

I have never found my daughter to be much of a lie teller but she is known to tell tall stories, harmless stories but things that I haven’t believed or at least thought there was a lot of embellishment to. When confronted on these she would backtrack defensively just as she did the night of the disclosure, either saying ‘I didn’t say that’ or changing things to fit.

It is such an awful situation but I don’t feel I can do much more now, I’ve told the authorities of my concerns so they will be able to investigate with the full picture now. My focus is on getting her the support and treatment she needs and hope that whatever her diagnosis is we can get to the bottom of this allegation and move on from it.

You wrote, "Over the last year she has said a few things to me about ‘not being ready for a new dad’, ‘a new dad being around bringing back bad memories of her old dad’ and ‘going back to just us as we don’t need a man’. This all started about 3 years into our relationship so at this point she was very used to having him around. Again I put this down to normal teenage/stepparent rebellion as she never said anything bad about my partner and it was more about her feelings/perception. Every time we talked it through which seemed to alleviate her concerns and going forward she was happy to be around him so I didn’t see any cause for concern other than it being normal teenage behaviour with the added complication of having had a bad experience with her own dad."

Do you think that she's projecting the abuse that she experienced from her biological dad onto your partner? Or maybe her fears of a father-daughter relationship are intensifying as she gets closer to him emotionally and she's trying to find ways to push him away?

My step daughter often expects me to react like her mother does to things. She'll pre-emptively start a fight with me assuming what my response will be or makes assumptions about what I'm thinking. For example, she recently became angry with me for saying that her prom dress (from a few years ago) was beautiful because she thought I was criticizing her weight, which I wasn't. All I said was that her dress was beautiful-she made up the rest in her mind based on her own insecurities. Her mother has an eating disorder and often criticizes her children about their weight. so she assumed that I was doing the same thing.

Yes I wouldn’t be surprised at all if this turns out to be ‘dad issues’ manifesting in some way. Possibly that she cannot take any frustration out on her bio dad so directing it at the closest person to being her dad, annoyed at my partner for being the good dad that her bio dad isn’t, scared he will leave us like her bio dad did so pushing him away before he does. I’ve also thought maybe she’s overheard us having words and thought history will repeat itself so pushed him away in an attempt to protect me. I guess there are a lot of possibilities but I think there’s a high chance it could stem from issues with her bio dad.

That sounds familiar, my daughter will also assume what I’m saying and more often than not get it wrong, she will cut me off all defensive getting her side across, then there’s a bit of a battle trying to explain what I meant rather than what she thought I meant. She also does this if I challenge something she is saying about her friends or something she has seen on the internet, as if she doesn’t want to or cannot consider any other view than her own.