BPDFamily.com

Here I am again, it’s been about 3 months since I was writing on here about UBPDH. This time is infinitely more serious than the last. The townhouse development that was a previous problem resolved itself because the people are very quiet, we never hear them.

I have actually written on here about this similar problem about 3 years ago, when H gave his daughter $200K WITHOUT telling me so she could build her dream home. He has been consistently going to see her because she is ‘depressed’ about breaking up with her boyfriend (she is 48) which was fine by me. I didn’t always visit with him because she can turn on us for no reason, get angry and start forcefully throwing pots and dishes into the sink.

Recently she has been saying how much she hates her job, blaming her bosses, disliking her colleagues, always gossiping about them criticising their lifestyle etc. She works from home except for one day a week, she bought an App which looks like she is onscreen for work (it moves the mouse) when in fact she is laying around looking at Tik Tok videos. Anyway, she resigned from her $150K per annum job, without having another job to go to while having a large mortgage to pay. My H (her father ) gave her another large sum of money, again WITHOUT TELLING me until now, when he begrudgingly also told me he is also selling the little getaway home we have in the country and giving her the money so she can keep her home and her two investment properties.

Context here is that he and I are both 75, health not good and I was glad I could give him the money to look after himself should I go first. eg retirement home care. He was a bankrupt when I met him and it has been my savings and work ethic from before, that has produced enough investment during our relationship to give him his own money and property in his own name. All his money will have gone to his daughter now … I mean before an inheritance situation.

During my intense reaction to this news, he screamed all manner of insults at me, that I am toxic because I am jealous of his daughter and I suppose I am jealous because this constantly not being put first or even second ( he has two daughters) in our relationship has gotten to me… finally I can see the injustice beyond my loving him.

Am I unreasonable to think this situation is unfair.? Isn’t this a financial betrayal? Should I once again try to be understanding that this is a mental disorder we are dealing with. Actually I am devastated and seriously considering divorce. I am fed up with not being considered in our relationship. There is so much more other unfairness going on, that I can hardly cope. He has gone to the country getaway, thank goodness.

It might be wise to seek advice from a financial consultant for the rest of your assets.  For example, a financial advisor might have advised you continue building your investments and to set up a will stating what you want your spouse to inherit rather than losing all control over it when you gifted it to your spouse.

His daughter has a mortgaged home and two investment properties?  Rather than dad step in, she could have been an adult, given up her other properties or sought a new job if she was at risk of losing her home.

I've often commented that we here in peer support are "too fair" far too often.  That might be why you felt you needed to share with your spouse, to show how fair you are?  Yet that didn't work out how you imagined.

I'm the last one to count on for financial advice, to turn five talents into ten talents (reference to Jesus' parable of the talents/minas - Matthew 25:13-40).

Thanks for replying Forever Dad.

Regarding the wills, he still gets a share of my estate along with my sons, not as much as them, but some. In his will he leaves me nothing, not that there will be anything to leave. He said that seeing as all his money goes to his girls he thought he’d save me the bother of having to pack up his belongings. A valid point under the circumstances I suppose.

I wanted him to have his own real estate and money in the bank because it was very unbalanced with everything belonging to me. It felt bad for us both. So I thought this was a positive step towards helping the relationship.

I am furious that over the last few years he has been able to save substantial money which has gone to daughter in this last ‘gift’. Whereas my savings are gradually going down because ‘somehow’ I end up paying for most things…like food, the cars, anything that needs doing around the house, insurances, rates, water Etc. He does pay Council fees and electricity at the country (his) place.
He manages to achieve all this with a combination of being very charming and kind as well as bullying and gaslighting. He is always ready with a ‘would you like a cup of tea’. I called him a ‘con’ man once and he laughed. I used to be able to live somewhat contentedly knowing all this but this time, the thought of he and his daughter scheming behind my back AGAIN is too much. The fact that she has taken the money should not go unnoticed.

There's more to this than a will. The main reason to financially plan for the future is for one's own needs.

I have an elderly BPD mother who is in assisted living. There were financial issues between my parents and her handling of money now is an issue. How she spends money is driven by her emotional needs. It's not possible to reason with her because it's an emotional need.

After my father passed away, all assets went to her. She's spent almost all of them, potentially puting herself in financial difficulty. Although I have power of attorney if needed, she is still legally competent and so is able to make her own choices, write her own checks, use her credit cards as she wishes. It's her money and she can do as she chooses with it.

Family members have not ever been concerned about a will. The concern has been about her meeting her care needs in her elder years. It's been a learning experience in terms of learning about Medicare, Medicaid, - what they cover, what they don't and the spending rules for qualifying for Medicaid if needed. I consulted an elder care attorney to gain information. It was well worth the cost.

From observing what my mother is doing, and attempting to reason with her (and it not being successful) I will propose that what your H is doing is driven by his own emotional needs. Yes, it is unfair to you and a betrayal of trust but I don't think reasoning with him on these terms is effective. Several people have tried to reason with my mother but when emotions drive a behavior, reasoning doesn't factor in sometimes.

This is about your boundaries. You are trying to be fair, to show your H you are being fair and kind and considerate- hoping he will recognize this and reciprocate, but fairness is skewed when someone feels like a victim- as pwBPD often do. The spending is driven by an emotional need to feel important, validated. It's impulsive.

On your part, your H doesn't seem to have a sense of fairness or reciprocity and he could potentially put you in financial danger. He's also endangering his own financial situation by passing his savings on to his D. If you two are in the US and ever need to seek out Medicaid assistance, giving large sums of money to others can impact being qualified. For your own sake, it's evident that your H does not have boundaries with your assets. You will need to have them. If not, he could potentially drain them.

Your H won't protect your assets. You will need to do this. From what I have observed, I would suggest seeing an elder care attorney for how you can best do this- for the information about what you can do  to protect your assets and assure your needs are met.

@Townhouse,

There's a consistent message emerging here: Take care of yourself.

Hypothetical situation:

If someone in a "normal" relationship discovered that their partner sold or transferred sizable assets that were part of the marital estate, there would be concerns.  A family law atty would not be wrong to jump to conclusions:  This is what it looks like when someone tries to conceal or shift assets prior to filing for divorce.

In your case, your H may or may not intend to file. His actions may be motivated by a loyalty bind or some other codependent behavior tied up with his D.

In either case, where does that leave you?

Please consider the advice presented so far - it doesn't hurt to do some diligence and learn about your options.

Not Wendy, thank so much for your very thoughtful post. Because of your older mother you have an understanding of the issues at play here with myself and my H.
You are right, this is an emotional issue for him. He left his unhappy marriage when his girls were teenagers and they both have problematic lives. They both 48 & 46 are unable to have a relationship for more than 18 months to 2 years despite wanting one . The other daughter is a teacher and unfortunately keeps getting fired from various schools due mainly to her attitude. The other daughter with the houses, while has achieved financial rewards, has no friends as she is so hard to get along with….traits of BPD possibly full blown. This background of the daughters is leading me to saying that H feels very guilty about breaking up the marriage. Also he does know he is ‘unstable’ so also blames himself for the girls being like him.

He has a real need to try and help his daughters and I do understand this… but he has forgotten his own ( and my ) needs to look after ourselves in the future. When I tried to explain this to him he took 2 heated victim responses. One, that I was toxic to think his daughters wouldn’t look after him in his old age and Two that if he needs care when he’s older he will take a pill and pass away. The latter response , I can’t even put into words how I feel about it. The first about his girls looking after him, I tried to say that anything can happen… they might even get married and the husbands not want an old father living with them. Actually this startled him a little because he remembered at one stage his daughter with the houses was talking about selling everything and buying a new house with her then boyfriend ( as I mentioned, she has since broken up with him)
And Yes not Wendy, if he gives this money away he will have problems with what you call Medicaid…. I tried to point this out but he’s not listening.

As far as seeing a lawyer, I know I’m in danger of losing my home if we divorce. He has even threatened about contesting the will if it’s not satisfactory. It’s this knowledge that is particularly worrying if I try to end our relationship. It seems to me that it is unfair in that the person, who has the most money always loses.

Thanks to all for listening/ reading about my problems. Thanks for your response also Eyes Up…. It was very thoughtful of you to mention to take care of myself. It is so good to have this venue for this purpose.

One last thing. Do you think I should contact the daughter about the repercussions of her taking all her father’s money.? It may have the affect of stopping him from selling the country place which is an investment for him and his future. He of course will be furious if I do. And part of me just doesn’t want to get involved.

You've already gifted him so much over the years, likely he has no ethical or legal basis to contest.  In my state depending on the type of deed, the surviving spouse typically gets lifetime occupation.  If you're still the single owner of the property then a lawyer can detail what applies or not.

In essence, you decide what's in your will and to whom, not others, to some extent not even your spouse.

You may feel as though you're at a disadvantage - and likely your spouse wants you to feel that way - but you don't know the facts of the matter unless you consult with financial or family law attorneys who can express their legal advice and insight.

Be aware that you should investigate your options privately and confidentially.  You are under no obligation to "confess" to him that you're doing research for your future.  Telling him would surely result in sabotage attempts of some sort.

As for him giving so much to his daughter... you've already observed that she may have her own issues so getting in the middle might make things even messier.

Yes, I understand what my father was dealing with. To summarize it- my mother isn't concerned about the impact of her spending on herself or anyone else.

Take the concern over the will off the table. An adult child who cares about their parent would rather have their parent alive than any money after they are gone. An adult child who values the well being of a parent would not accept a money gift that could compromise the parent. If your H's D's are in their 40's and still coaxing money from Dad- they aren't thinking of his needs and certainly not yours. I wouldn't expect them to help their father if he were in need. As you are not their biological mother, they have no moral obligation to care about you. If you have children, they may be worried about you in this situation.

Your H is compromising your own financial well being. He isn't showing concern for that. If you don't protect yourself from this, there is no telling what he could do.

Half a house is better than no house. BPD mother took out a home equity loan and didn't tell anyone. By the time we found out, half the value of the house was gone. We moved her to assisted living, sold the house and the proceeds went to her. That is gone now too.

Consuling an elder law attorney will help you know what you can do to assure your assets are available for your own needs.

As to why we moved her- we knew if she took out a home equity loan that she must have spent her savings. She had kept her financial information secret from us. She was close to not being able to pay the monthly loan fee and the bank would have repossesed the house. She needed assistance at this point too. So we hoped the move and freeing up the remaining equity would give her the funds for her care- but now it's spent- at a time when her need for care is increasing.

She still has some monthly income. Will it cover her needs? I don't know.

I am sharing this situation as an example of what your H could potentially do with your resources. Please protect yourself.

Thanks again Not Wendy and forever Dad.

I remain non contact with H. He text about a card to which I replied “Yes” I should have replied “Liar” because it was a bogus question.

I have taken this time to read all my posts on this forum. Good Grief!!! To have put up with his behaviour over these years it would appear that I am the one with the mental disorder. The times I have mentioned that he has dysreg, that he has yelled at me, sworn at me, called me toxic, given me the Silent treatment sometimes for weeks, not to mention the DV and these are only the times I’ve written on here.

@Towhouse,

Journaling was one of the most effective tools, for me, in coming to learn and ultimately accept what was happening with my relationship.

Writing here and periodically reviewing is similar.

Just a quick update .
I have received a text from H he said he hasn’t stopped work since he got to our country getaway and is exhausted and not in a space to communicate. “not in a space to communicate” are words I’ve heard many times before.

Anyway, I have made enquiries about a Family Law Solicitor and will get in touch after this holiday season.

I am enjoying the peace and quiet and occasionally looking after one of my grandchildren.

Husband arrived this morning for 1 hour. He fussed around getting things as he’s put the country house up for Sale. He didn’t have time to talk and rushed out again to go to his daughter’s house.

A few hours later I received this text message. 


Hi townhouse, I can see after visiting you today you’re in a great deal of pain and distress. This makes me very sad as I do not want to cause any hurt. I am sure we can work things out in our relationship going forward that we are both happy. I’m terribly tired after working in L……t all week and the journey down to G………d was exhausting, biggest traffic jam ever. Speak soon H…



At face value it seems a nice text…he likes to use flowery charming words to show how caring he is.  ??????

He is absolutely in a state… it’s like a bi polar surge. I have no idea why he had to rush down to daughters…he drove to our place for 3 hours then he’s driven for another 5 hours to get to her place when it is also a holiday tomorrow with probably less traffic. Didn’t want to stay and talk with me I guess.

Further update.
He and daughter had a big blow up. I don’t know what about. He rang and said he was coming home. Came in grumpy and tired.  I was having a meal and made him a plate which he appreciated. We often sleep in separate rooms and I went to bed early and closed my door.

Of course he's nice and charming. My BPD mother can be nice and charming too, when she wants something. Even if she also can be emotionally and verbally abusive, and threatened to leave, she was also completely financially dependent on my father.

My concern for you isn't about if he's nice in the moment, or not, or whether you want to stay with him or not but that he's not reliable with your finances. Without you taking steps to protect them, he could do anything with them.

You have children and I assume you don't want them to be worried about you. Even if our relationship is difficult, I am concerned about my elderly BPD mother. She has spent her savings recklessly to the point that she has compromised her needs in her elder years. Even if you and your H argue over a will- a will is irrelevant when there's nothing. It's about having what you need.

If you want your money to be there for your own needs, and his too if you two stay together- you need to take steps to protect it, whether he's being nice to you or not.

I know it's probably unhelpful to speculate, but...

He risked a lot with you by unilaterally selling his house to support his daughter.  Then he comes back upset.  I wonder if these actions didn't go as planned?  Perhaps his daughter didn't appreciate it as much as he hoped? 

So now he's come home seeking refuge.

He's likely hoping that whatever happened will be swept under the rug because he probably doesn't want to risk your rejection as well.

Again, speculation is rarely fair or productive, but if patterns hold - maybe something like what I've described is in play.

At this point, you don't necessarily need to confront him - no matter what has happened, a direct approach that can be perceived as criticism or judgement will rarely help.  However, you do need to continue to keep your self interests front and center.

Please continue to explore how to protect yourself - discretely.  Maybe it will be easier to do on some level if he's in retreat mode? 

He'll likely disclose something at some point.  If not, do you speak with the D?  Perhaps checking in with her in an open-ended and friendly way could shed some light on the situation.

Take care...

Appreciate your concern Not Wendy and Yes I still intend to visit the Family Law Solicitor.
Eyes up, he will definitely be wanting everything swept under the rug. He never wants to revisit a dysreg to discuss anything.

I still don’t know what the blow up with daughter was about… don’t forget she probably has BPD as well and has impulsively left her high paying job. She has 3 houses which,  although 2 are rented out she still has large bills to pay both to top up mortgages and rates utilities etc. plus her  own large mortgage. Although H has put the country house on the market it will be months before there is any more money to give her. He can’t get any of mine.

I’m not sure whether to start another thread because there is an additional subject I’d like to explore. Oh well here goes on here.

Cyclothymia… I’ve looked it up and found it is comorbid with BPD. Cyclothymia is a mild form of Bipolar sometimes called Bipolar111. This fits H’s manic phase at the moment. He was up at 5.30 this morning, woke me up banging and crashing around… moving things upstairs, and moaned to me that I have a lot of ‘stuff’. Then he cleaned his shower… first time ever…He’s rushing around doing little jobs. Cyclothymia is more fast acting than Bipolar which can take months in each phase, whereas Cyclothymia can spiral between manic and depression within a day or over several days.
Thoughts.

In a way, this could still be connected to the issue of financial risks.

Whatever the reason or explanation for his behavior -- whether it's BPD, or cyclothymia, or schizophrenia, or a TBI, or a developmental disability, or a bad acid trip, or... (note, I'm not suggesting it's any of those necessarily!), the issue is how it's impacting you. Whatever is going on doesn't seem to be treated, and one of the ways his "untreated ______________" is showing up is financially. Even if it were something "fixable with a pill", a key decision is in your lap: what choices will you make, that are under your control, that you can do to protect your own finances, regardless of how he feels about those choices.

Back to the idea of cyclothymia... one idea to remember is that people get help for what they see as a problem, not for what we see as a problem (from the very helpful book "I Am Not Sick, I Don't Need Help!" by Dr. Xavier Amador (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=61716.0)).

Finding common ground with him, where you and he agree that XYZ is bothersome and problematic and worth getting help for, may be more effective than trying to get him to accept something that you experience as a problem that he doesn't. I bought myself a copy of the book; it's incredibly helpful and I am trying to keep it in mind while stepparenting teenagers lol

What does he see as a problem right now?

...

Edited to add -- good to hear you made an appointment with the family law solicitor. Let us know how that meeting goes; I hope it's helpful.

Thanks for your thoughtful response kells76 and you are right, whatever he’s got it’s his business  but I guess I am so used to validating him that I try to understand where he’s coming from more than my own internal thoughts and feelings. The book you mentioned sounded good and was available on Kindle so I have purchased it and looking forward to starting it. I know I am so fed up with being told off whenever he feels like it. I will let this board know after Family Solicitor meeting.

Just now a catch up regarding daughter blow up and his rapid return to our house. I think from the occasional bits of information he has talked to me about is that she didn’t like all his suggestions of how he was going to give her money and what she would do in return. I think she may have felt he was being too controlling.

Also, to mask her own feelings of leaving her work she has turned against her sister, raging that the sister never helps her look after their mother… which is not true. H has stepped in on house owning daughters side asking teacher daughter to help her sister as she doesn’t have a job. This teacher sister does not know about house owning sisters new 4 bedroom home because it was their father that gave her the first $200K to enable the house to be built in the first place and he didn’t tell teacher daughter. I know it’s horribly complicated and really has nothing to do with me accept that it was our money for the future.

I cannot talk to him about anything as he will go right off at me. I feel like this little mouse scurrying around trying to keep the peace and I am not like that at all. My sons and friends know me to be a happy confident person.

While he has put the country holiday home on the market with a Real Estate Agent, he now questions ‘why am I doing this’ ? ‘Maybe I shouldn’t sell’ ? I don’t have any answers for him and just avoid talking about it  and hoping and praying that this particular crazy deregulation passes into a somewhat easier state of mind where I can have a small voice about things that affect me.
Thanks to all for listening. It really does help putting one’s thoughts down on paper.

An update on what is happening in my BPD world with my husband.
As I previously mentioned he had a blow up with his daughter after staying there and came home for a few days. Then he went to our holiday home to prepare it more in order for it to sell.  This was a week ago. Since then he has used silent treatment to ignore texts from me and won’t answer the telephone. This is worrying because he has given up taking his medication from the heart attack he had two years ago.
Finally, he answered the phone and acted like nothing was wrong… he seems to have forgotten the events of the last few weeks. He kept repeating to me that his daughter has lost her job and that his other daughter won’t contact him. When he was staying at our home in the city he went on and on about these two incidents but now it’s as if he’s just telling me something new.
He is obsessed with the house sale and is disparaging the Estate Agent that the house hasn’t sold yet ( it’s been 2 weeks) He has put the house price well over what I think is achievable in the current market and is ranting about no one has come to view the property. He doesn’t connect the house sale to his daughter resigning from her job.
I think his mind is actually going. I am still too wary of saying anything other than validating what he’s saying.

I'm wondering how that house is deeded.  Is it in his name only or is it jointly owned?

If joint ownership then from a legal perspective you would have an equal say in how the sale happens.

Sorry if I haven’t made that clear, the house is in his name only. He’s made it very clear I have nothing to do with this sale. He bought it from the money I gave him from a previous invest I sold. As I said previously, I thought at the time it made things fairer and better for us both if he had his own money and after all we are married.

Another update
Husband is back at our home and talking excitedly about the ongoing selling of our holiday home. He must drive the Real Estate Agent mad ringing him everyday. He is not quite as manic as before.

There is still a lot of tension between us because I am still,  I guess you would  say, seething about him giving his daughter these large sums of money without telling me. He is absolutely hopeless when it comes to money and financial issues.

His daughter with the homes is now furious with both her sister and her mother and has filed to have the mother evicted from one her (the daughter’s) homes. The mother had been living there for over 10 years, paying a large rent to her daughter from a Government pension, is 78 and about to become homeless because daughter has resigned from her employment and can’t pay the mortgage ( over and above the rent) plus rates and insurances.  I guess social services will step in and provide care in an Aged Facility which the mother has never wanted to do.

Thank goodness this really has nothing to do with me and I just listen as husband says how crazy both his ex wife and daughter are. 
I am pretty sure he won’t be giving daughter all the money from the sale of the holiday house and may even stop trying to sell it.

Once again, thanks for listening/reading, it really helps writing it out and getting it straight in my mind.

If I had to guess, your H may be slightly easier to get along with when his attention is focused elsewhere - in this case, with his D and X.  And it sounds like he's got quite a triangle dynamic going there.  Have you read about the Drama Triangle? 

Again, if I had to guess, before attention was shifted to your H's D and X, you were somehow in a triangle - even if not actively participating with your H and his D. 

If you haven't come across this yet, you may find food for thought here:  https://www.bpdfamily.com/content/karpman-drama-triangle (https://www.bpdfamily.com/content/karpman-drama-triangle)

You seem very clear about how your H's concerns with his D and X don't involve you - which is great.  Many of us attempt to reason, rescue, etc., and end up getting pulled in to these otherwise avoidable (and often artificial) conflicts. 

If there's a chance that the house - the equity of which you significantly contributed to - is not sold, I wonder if there's a chance for you to legally reclaim some of that equity?  In the states, there are some scenarios in which you'd be able to account for your contribution.  We typically see that all parties are under financial restraining orders from the moment a complaint or petition for divorce is served.  That restraining order blocks real estate transactions until the parties come to agreement, or until a judge rules and divides assets...  Even in the absence of divorce, there are some things that can be done to protect marital / shared / estate assets.  Not sure about this might work in the UK, although I imagine that there are similar mechanisms.  Have you had a chance to explore your rights?

Thanks for keeping us up to date - Hang in there.

Thank you for reading this further update.
Husband came back to our home from the country still dysregulated and in a manic state. Cleaned floors, did gardening ( which he never does… hates it ) We were getting along OK. Him talking about daughter getting her mother out of the house. Me not saying much at all, reading and cooking.

He asked could I drive him up to country home on Friday as he wanted to mow the lawn up there as there was going to be two sales inspections on Saturday. He said we would come back on the Sunday as I had to get the hire car back and pick up my car from repairs and he was going along with me to do this on the Monday.

No offers to buy from the inspections saw him Saturday afternoon starting to suggest why didn’t I go for a drive, better still why didn’t I go home and leave him there as he wanted the peace and quiet and solitude. I asked but “aren’t we going back Sunday to get the car Monday” No he doesn’t want to do that now and I am perfectly able to do it myself, why do I need him. I said “it’s what couples do”……… anyway full blown discussion lead to him saying he wants out of the relationship. It’s doing nothing for him he wants to live his own life. The relationship has run its course that he can’t give me the love I need. He says it wasn’t a true marriage anyway ( together 23 years ) because we had separate bank accounts.

It also came out that he had also offered his other daughter all the money from the sale of the country house when the house owning daughter said she didn’t want it. The teacher daughter said “Good I want to buy a Toyota top of the range and go on holiday to Poland.” He said he wouldn’t give her the money for those things but only to buy an apartment. So now he’s questioning what he will do with the money from the sale of the house ( IF and WHEN it ever sells) He says he will buy an apartment in the city….this just an hour after quoting from Carl Jung about wanting solitude.
It is all so stupid and twisted and contradictory. I can’t keep up with it and anyway anything I ask or say gets twisted around that I’m the terrible awful person and although he thinks that although he has a few problems from childhood trauma he thinks he really is the most wonderful and kind hearted person. I went to bed, unable to sleep, got up at first light and drove home.

I am terribly sad at this break up, but I can’t take anymore of the lies and rubbish he talks. He sits there talking so superior about his wants and needs as if only his words matter and anything I say or my life means nothing at all.

He could change his mind about the break up tomorrow. As you can see, he changes his mind frequently- depending on how he feels. If he's financially dependent on you, he's not going to manage a separation.

With his feelings going all over the place, if your feelings are a reaction to his- you will be feeling all over the place too. On your part, decide what you want- based on your own needs and feelings and also on reality. Don't base them on an if only "if only he would...." This is who he is, and if you wish to be in the relationship or not. He "broke up" today. Tomorrow he might be feeling differently.

How someone handles money has an emotional aspect to it. So as you can see, his financial decisions are all over the place too- like his feelings. My BPD mother does this too. She may gift something very costly to someone, be very tight with someone else. We think of these decisions rationally but emotions are not rational. Money can also be used to keep someone attached or to be controlling as you can see what he does with his daughters.

"It's not a true marriage with separate bank accounts". Hmmm- makes me think he wants access to your bank account. You have seen what he does with money. Please protect yours.

If his daughter can evict her own mother, she may also one day do this to her father and also her stepmother (you). If you funnel money to your H and he gives it to his daughters, you are putting yourself in a vulnerable situation financially.

@Townhouse, you are getting very real, very good advice from Notwendy.

I also appreciated the comment re: your scrambled feelings are a response to his scrambled feelings...

Please carefully consider these words, and how you might prioritize your own feelings - not to mention rational thought outside of these feelings - in this jumble.

My speculative comment is:  You will soon hear accusations that you are financially controlling or abusive - if you haven't already - if you don't support his various wishes and demands.

The reality is that selling the house and giving money to the daughter will not make her love him, or make him love you.  Rather, it will put both you and him in a weaker financial position.

I imagine it's difficult to work on things while riding this roller coaster, but have you had a chance to speak with counsel - legal and/or emotional?

Thanks for answering Not Wendy and you are of course right when you mention that my feelings are all over the place. Right at this moment I am just grateful to be here in my own home without him creeping about.

I really don’t know how I truly feel. Being 75, the  expectation of facing old age alone versus being with a mentally sick conman are confusing LOL ( you’ve got to see some humour about this wholly serious situation)  Rest assured that my eyes are wide open as to who he really is. The trust I had in him is completely broken.

He actually can’t get any of my money  or my house unless he start’s divorce proceedings and  even then I do have a very good case of why he wouldn’t be able to get half of everything. His daughter certainly can’t touch me but Yes he thinks she will look after him in his old age but that is very precarious for him.

While I was typing my reply to Not Wendy, Eyes Up kindly added a post, and Yes thank you EyesUp I really do understand what Not Wendy mentioned and her comments are totally accurate.

You are also right when you mention about him coming at me about money issues. He said he wasn’t happy with my will. He was also going on about that he’s only interested in “looking after No1” himself.
I can see he really is dreadful. He claims to despise people with money in this world, goes  on and on about injustice and here he is threatening and belittling the one person who has had his back for nearly 25 years. The hubris and entitlement that emerges from him is amazing to watch. We say it and it’s true, he is mentally sick.

One more observation….I have applied to see a therapist but am waiting on call backs, apparently there are waiting lists, so I haven’t talked about all this with anyone except here. Sometimes I don’t know if my thinking is screwed the wrong way but I take it that you Not Wendy think it’s bad/ horrible that husband’s daughter is evicting her own mother as I do.

“ If his daughter can evict her own mother, she may also one day do this to her father and also her stepmother (you). “

I think it’s terrible that she’s doing this to her mother as she also has another property, an apartment which is even more expensive to upkeep which she could sell to relieve financial burden since she resigned. She is evicting the mother because she went to tell her mother she’d been made redundant ( not true… she resigned ) and the mother said ‘well you probably brought it on yourself “. So daughter is punishing mother by evicting her. My husband understands this reasoning and is actively encouraging daughter to do this. This is what people with BPD do after any slight to their fragile persona.

Quote from Not Wendy “He could change his mind about the break up tomorrow”

Well I don’t know if he’s changed his mind but this text arrived a short while ago.

“”I don’t really like the way we left discussions. I was wondering since we’ve both had a break, can we talk about things without getting antagonistic? You might well ask what’s there to talk about since we both assumed our relationship was over. Things get heated. I must admit I do think sometimes I’m a bit of a man servant to you, generally though butlers don’t set the agenda. So there seems to be a contradiction there. I think I would like to talk about this and other matters but not in such a heated way. I might have trouble listening, most probably have but I want to try and see where we go from there if we can listen to each other and hear what the concerns are. “”

I guess the manservant line refers to him always making me cups of tea. Certainly he does nothing else like cooking, washing, cleaning etc… although as I mentioned just the previous week he had been maniacally washing the floor and doing things in the garden which I was in complete bewilderment that he was doing these things. Surely two days of chores doesn’t mean he’s a manservant but who knows.

I replied asking how he wanted to do this? I sure as hell wasn’t going to drive there again. To my astonishment he said he’d drive the old Wagon truck down on Wednesday. He hates driving that truck for more than 20kms,  so I guess he really wants to talk. Of course next will be that he’s not confident the truck will make it and can I go up there. If he drives down I will be amazed.

Anyway, can anyone give me any thoughts on his recycling proposal text. I truly am in two minds about this.

There is a push pull pattern to these kinds of relationships- and once he's vented/pushed- he either feels better after getting rid of some of his uncomfortable feelings and/or begins to fear the loss of the relationship and then "pulls". This is why I said he may change his mind tomorrow.

Money has been a long term issue between my parents and still is one today as it involves my BPD mother's disordered emotions. Reasoning with her, trying to talk to her about it, isn't effective. I think you can see where trying to talk with your H about it is difficult.

My BPD mother is focused on her own needs when it comes to money. She doesn't seem to care how her spending was stressful for anyone else in her family, and it's not because anyone wants her money. It's because we don't want her to put herself in financial danger and she's already compromised herself.

Your line, "mentally ill con artist" comes close although I think the behavior is driven by their needs and wanting gratification rather than to con anyone. Manipulation becomes one of their "tools" to get their needs met.

I think your H wants access to your money- and since you know he's not trustworthy with money, you need to protect yours and he doesn't like that.

As to the idea of being alone in one's elder years. I think that is something that is concerning to anyone. It's sad to see that my mother is alone in her elder years but it's been mostly due to her own behavior and her choices, not because of her friends or family.

One idea to consider is to have an honest talk with your adult children. Are your children able to be honest with you? I have seen my peers work things out with their elderly parents in different ways- the parents are not alone but also the children need to have their own boundaries as well.

"Talking about it" doesn't work with my BPD mother. An "invitation" to talk is an invitation to drama, circular arguments, and her trying to get her way. You already know your H isn't trustworthy with money and so it's important to hold your boundaries on your money for your own protection.

Further update

Husband didn’t come down in the truck… he texted that  the truck wouldn’t make it… it probably would, but anyway.
!!

Later he texted he’d had a terrible day with two groups of people coming through to view the house and one made a very low offer and could I please phone him. I did and he was totally out of it ranting about these terrible people who had been through the house and making a low offer. He  was making up stuff (delusional)about the Real Estate Agent and said he is working against him and trying to undersell it to the locals one of whom the RE was probably having an affair. He asked could I come up as he needed to see me and I said I would the next day.

I drove up in the morning and he seemed truly happy to see me… talked for hours about Estate Agent and finally said “can we go home, I can’t stand to be here it’s making me too stressed”

As EyesUp mentioned above

Quote
“.  If I had to guess, your H may be slightly easier to get along with when his attention is focused elsewhere - in this case, with his D and X.  And it sounds like he's got quite a triangle dynamic going there.  Have you read about the Drama Triangle?  “  …. 

So again we see the triangle only this time it’s with the Estate Agent as Persecutor, H as Victim and me now as Rescuer… Classic


So we came home. Nothing was said about end of relationship. I didn’t want to talk about it either nor the money. I need some peace as well. He will most probably take house off the market after a couple of weeks thankgoodness because while he still owns the house it is an investment and he can’t impulsively spend it or give it away.

I hope we can discuss a few things soon but for now I just want to let things calm down.

BPD mother kept her financial info private and so we had no idea how much she had or what her spending was. I do know that my father planned well and that they owned their house.

On a visit, we accidentally came across some papers that showed she had taken out a home equity loan some time ago and didn't tell us. We got concerned as this probably indicated she has spent most of her savings. She got angry at us for being concerned.

A while later she had spent about half the equity of the home and needed assisted living. We moved her to assisted living, sold the house and put the proceeds in her bank account for her expenses. Since she is still considered legally competent, it's her money and she can do what she wants with it.

It's all gone. All of it.

So yes, it is possible to leverage the equity in a house and spend it.

Well country house is sold. He was thinking of keeping it when Estate Agent told him one of the low offer people put their low offer up substantially to nearly the asking price, so he has accepted it. He is still really dysregulated but with the Estate Agent not me. I am white again. He would only deal with Estate  Agent via text, he says he can’t speak to him because he will lose his temper at Estate Agents. He is delusional, making up stories as to why the people put in a low offer first. He can’t understand it and it’s driving him crazy.

He has discussed with me what he intends to do with the money from the sale of the house, which is what started this whole dysreg, that is, he is giving it to his daughter, the one with the homes. I hope it works out for them I really do, but the writing is on the wall the way the daughter has turned against her mother and is evicting her because she “feels taken for granted”

I have spoken with a Solicitor and have had good and pleasant advice, that I have actually taken good steps along the way to protect myself financially ( trust Fund etc) and also his domestic violence against me and subsequent court case is totally adding to the situation against him should he try to divorce me.

He is being very nice to me and says things like “I don’t know why you put up with me” and “I don’t know what is the matter with me”. I haven’t brought up any of the things he said or tried to point out contradictions, lies etc, because…. what’s the point. I have peace again (till the next time) and I will take peace over the dreadful time of the last 6 weeks.

He has gone down to his daughters house to discuss giving her the money and will be there 3 days ( he was home here 3 days of rest) which has annoyed me but I try to stay calm and not set things off again. At least he is ringing me morning and night telling me what they are doing and what they are discussing. She has a lot of power in their relationship as she will increase the guilt of him leaving their mother 34 years ago whenever she wants to.

I have found a therapist whom I like and we are going to be discussing about why I choose to radically accept him. Thanks again for reading/listening.

So his troublesome daughter is booting out her mother. Seems to me her mother is the one that needs a home.  Of course, how dare you to even mention that idea to him.

So, if he can do that with a house, he can do it with the rest of your money if you were to let him have it. I am glad you met with an attorney to see it's protected, but he also may pressure you for more.  Yes, of course it's the realtor's fault, not his.

He cannot actually get at any money but yes he can try to wheedle more from me but that is my choice and after him giving away his money to his daughter, my eyes are totally wide open. As regards him trying to convince me to sell my house, that is an unbreakable boundary just as if he were to be unfaithful (never has been)that too is an unbreakable boundary 

I thought I would keep this thread going to keep informing anyone who cares to read about developments regarding my BPDH . He is still being very nice to me. He says that we are “ all good “ and just had a bad argument.

I’ve been to a therapist twice now and I’m telling her that although I know he doesn’t love me but at my age I’ll take it. We discussed co dependency and Yes maybe that’s me. I just want peace and as much as this last dysregulation really upset me, I think it kind of rocked H as well because he was faced with having no where to live except with his daughter who is in the process of evicting her 78 year old mother from another house. This daughter didn’t talk to her father for at least 4 years a few years ago so I guess H figured his chances of being able to live there permanently were not good.

The daughter has filed with the local authorities for this eviction, visited her mother again and has said things to the mother that has really upset her. The mother contacted the teacher daughter and that daughter has threatened to get the Elder Abuse Dept onto her sister.

Also, the sale of the country home fell through… the people didn’t get their finance. H is now more paranoid ( literally )about the Estate Agent, he’s insisting that the Agent planned all this to get at him. I try to be realistic throughout his rants but I am fully aware he could turn on me if he hears something he doesn’t like.

I hope he's seen what his D is doing and is glad he didn't put his financial future in her hands.

If your H does sell the house, I'd encourage him to keep the proceeds and invest them for his own security. Now, whether he agrees to that is another thing but is D is a very poor security investment IMHO.

It’s been 5 months since I last posted on this forum and I wanted to give an update as to how things have progressed in my relationship with my BPD husband. I have chosen to use the same thread as it would be very difficult to recap what went on all those months ago.
Put simply, the country house was finally sold. In the end husband told me to negotiate with the Real Estate Agent as he couldn’t or wouldn’t speak to him. REA and I plus husband managed to agree to a sale at a very good price with a very quick settlement. Husband went on to give nearly all the money from that sale to his daughter with the properties and so the daughter stopped evicting the mother.

The daughter has now left the big 4 bedroom home she had built and has moved back into another of her other properties when that tenant left and has rented out the big 4 bedroom one. She is  still not working because she has all father’s money in the bank which reduces her mortgages and allows her living expenses.

I have not interfered or said anything against their arrangement.

Husband is quite calm at the moment, living with me at our townhouse and is actually being very pleasant to me. I understand completely our relationship and accept it for what it is in the name of Peace.

Probably the more important thing is- how do you feel about this? Are you OK with what he did or do you feel resentful?

Not Wendy, I do feel resentful and if I let myself think deeply, I suppose I feel used. I wouldn’t feel this way so much if there was some acknowledgment or perhaps a ‘thanks’ of my role in providing all this ‘help’ ( he calls it) he’s been able to give his daughter.

The sorry saga drags on as daughter is showing no sign of getting employment which is slightly annoying her father.

One thing I learned in 12 steps CODA is - when am I being co-dependent, or not having boundaries, and when am I not?

The same action can be either or. The difference is if I feel resentful or not. An aspect of 12 steps is to shift our focus on to ourselves and pay attention to our feelings. (this doesn't mean being self centered- it's that our feelings are information for us- what are they?).

Although when we give someone something- it becomes theirs to do what they want to it, I think we can see the results of that and check in with our feelings. A house is a very generous gift. I think if most people gifted a house, they'd want to see the recipient appreciate and take care of it and be mindful of the value. If the recipient didn't do that - the gifter would likely feel resentful. Any further gifts would be adjusted based on that experience.

There are some quotes that I tend to think of in certain situations. One is from Maya Angelou- "when someone shows you who they are, believe them".  Now, you see what your H has done with your gift. He is who he is and you can't change that- but if someone shared your story in a 12 step group- the question would be to ask you- how do you feel about this? ( as I did) because  by focusing on you, you can see how you feel and what you will do next.

What interests me is that someone with BPD can be ungenerous with one person and overly generous and co-dependent with another. My mother tends to give outrageous gifts to some people and is stingy to others. People with BPD can be co-dependent and enabling too. You see this with your H and his daughter- but this isn't anything you can control- he's going to do what he's going to do. The boundary then needs to be what you do. Knowing that if you give him something of value- it's possibly going to go to his daughter, and you don't want something of yours to go to his daughter- then you don't give it to him.