BPDFamily.com

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/setting-boundaries-parents-adult-children-ano_l_6621942ee4b0868a1b903860

What a great find Zachira!  Thanks for sharing. :)

These are good boundaries.

When thinking about my own adult kids, boundaries were a process. There's the boundary- and then there's the communicaing that boundary and the relationship needs to be secure enough that the child feels able to discuss it.

For me, sometimes the "mom" factor kicks in. I noticed a sweater out in my child's apartment and without thinking about it, folded it and put it away. Followed by a "please stay out of my room, Mom". I am now mindful to not do that.

I can not ask my BPD mother to stay out of my personal spaces. It's not just the boundary but also I can't communicate the boundary in a way that she will comply with it.

I think by the time a child becomes an adult, the connection with a parent has been established and we are constantly re-establishing it. They are maturing and we are also adjusting to it.

What do you do when the boundary creates more work?

I'm not talking about extinction bursts where someone is testing the boundary. I mean more like telling someone you have a sore leg. Now they know where to kick you.  :(

The suggestions in the article are things I aspire to but if I'm to be honest, most of my boundaries are not stated directly because the fall-out creates a mess. It's like there is a game, and the game is for her to be center of attention. As long as she's talking and people are listening, then she's winning the game. If she feels like she's being ignored, she has to find ways to win again. Nothing is off limits. As long as it gets attention, it's fair game.


The author suggests saying the following:


I guess I wish articles would role-play more what happens after people assert a boundary like that.

Talking about family members is a problem with my mother. She is not a reliable narrator, for one. And she makes me aware that my family of origin dynamic is alive and well in my sibling's family. One niece is golden and the other is the garbage can. The scapegoat niece spent the last 4 years saving money from her dog-walking business so she could go to college. My mother, who never finished college, says things like "She's not the smart one."

If I were to say, "This conversation makes me feel uncomfortable and I won't participate in it," she would try to get a drama triangle going with my father (rescuer) to punish me (perpetrator).

It's been much more effective for me to change the topic or announce some kind of interruption or say nothing and let the silence redirect her. Even that can create drama, though. I sometimes think my mother's existence is entirely binary: either she's getting attention or she isn't. Anyone preventing her from getting attention gets punished.

If a boundary provides a way for her to get more attention, then she'll use it. If she thinks she learned a way to push my button, she'll just do it more.

Livednlearned,
I hear your frustration as people with certain personality disorders do everything to be in control and never seem to give up on testing their children's boundaries. This article is about setting healthy boundaries with parents. For those of us with parents who cannot respect the boundaries their children set, then we do have to be more discreet about the boundaries while enforcing them. I find it so frustrating and sad that with my disordered family members I cannot explain or justify my boundaries. I just do my best to enforce the boundaries and keep my distance from family members who have no respect for my boundaries. I am a work in progress accepting that my disordered family members have no capacity for genuine empathy and everything is about what they want.

The article assumes that discussing boundaries works and I think it does in many situations.  Since talking about them doesn't work well, what is left is action.

For the "don't gossip about other family members" - I have stated that I don't want to do that.  If BPD mother decides to talk about someone else, she doesn't get much response from me other than "I don't want to talk about ___________" and if she persists, I don't give much of a reply, or change the subject or excuse myself from the conversation.

The boundary is more "I don't want to gossip about family members". She might start doing that but if there isn't much response, the conversation isn't maintained for long.

livednlearned, This has been my experience with my dBPD mom and assorted toxic relatives. You make a very good point.  Having direct and honest communication as the article suggests goads my mother into vicious, abusive tirades against me because her sense of superiority is threatened.  I believe it's her way of extracting justice, setting her world order straight, to punish me for my infraction.

I'd suggest really think hard if direct communication of boundaries will work.  Start with a very neutral subject and say it gingerly and with a smile if you want to try it.

I've had real world consequences from direct communications without testing the the waters. I set respectful, but direct boundaries, with one of my cousins who is a terrible gossip. I thought it was a success until I learned she had turned around and gossiped about my violent and abusive marriage to someone who worked in the same company where I worked.  I guess score one for my cousin who probably has bpd I now realize.

Grey rocking or going no contact with a disordered person works best for me. Direct communication of boundaries does work well with reasonable people who are without a personality disorder.

livednlearn- I also don't verbalize boundaries with my mother. It seems that boundaries for her are like challenging her to try to go over them. She can be tenacious- and usually gets her way because it's emotionally taxing to hold them up.

One of my boundaries with her is to not discuss my father with her. If she was recalling happy memories of him, that would be OK but her discussions involve bringing him into the conversation to defend her position when she's angry at me and they are hurtful. I want to hold on to my own memories of him as I recall them, not as her interpretations so I told her "I don't want to discuss my father with you". Her response "you mean I am not allowed to talk about my husband?"  Turning the boundary into something else. She can talk all she wants about "her husband" but not to me.

If she brings him up in conversation, I just change the subject or get off the phone.

Talking doesn't work with my mother. Also it takes work to hold on to a boundary with her. Actions are more effective than words  because as in the example, she twists statements into something else  so the message doesn't get across. I have to choose which boundaries are most important to me- some, I just let go as it's not worth the effort.