BPDFamily.com

What would you do if your BP recovered tomorrow?

We've talked about how much we wish things could change. But what exactly would be different?

• Would you need to renegotiate your relationship in general?



• How would your trust need to be repaired?



• Would you do things you have put off, not had the time or heart for? School, friends, going to the Zoo? Going to Paris? Sleeping for 48 hours straight?



• Other than your relationship with your family member, how would your life change; how would your family change? Would other family members get more attention? Your kids?

I am asking this partly because of the upcoming book, and also because I thought it would be an interesting topic.

If OK, I would like to use it in the book ANONYMOUSLY. I will assume this is OK unless you say so otherwise.

Randi

If the BPD recovered tomorrow it is obviously getting awfully cold in hades. :)

Seriously - there is nothing I would do differently except celebrate that S.O.'s kids will have a better chance at a normal life.  That is something to celebrate.

Oh - and get married to S.O. since BPDxW would no longer be a problem, legal or otherwise.

And then live peacefully ever after.

         Sleeping for 48 hours straight? The best thing.Ya i cannot sleep from my teenage .I havent slept straight 8 hours normally without pill in last 17 years.

:D     I'll sell our house and lands and shift to a new city. I'll try to reform my family business. I'll give up relations with some odd people who strongly believes I am a big idiot and naive person as my father have made them understand fabricated lies.

        Ill go to my dentist to treat some of my tooth problems which i am postponing for years. Ill probably give up smoking. Ill try to take new Yoga courses.

      I'll try to rebuild some relations which has gone down.


      I'll try to write a novel on human relations.I am trying to write it for last 10 years. Started in various new ways and never finished it more or less  20 times.


What i'll do is not the trule and ultimate thing (as man always thinks they can do such snd such things if such and such things happen to them ) the better idea could have been "what will happen to you if your BPD gets well ?"

If i become idle to do absolutely nothing even my BP revives some sure effects will probably come to my life.

eg :

My health will imporve dramatically.

My apetite will improve.

I will eat something which i am afraid to try nowadays like Junk foods.

My mental peace and personality will improve and get balanced.

Lot' s of supressed dimensions of my life like watching classic films, and reading classic books will come back. 

Fleetingly, I have wondered how things would change if mother became healthy.

Being near my twilight years, my feelings are most likely different now, than if I were still in my twenties or thirties.

Besides the obvious, that my life would be much less stressful, I don't see my relationship changing for the better with her. It's been too many years and too much hurt and damage. It's not that I couldn't forgive her, it's that I don't care to reach another plateau with her, in any form. I would still see her as she is now ~ I couldn't turn into a gushy loving daughter. So I guess that might imply I'd have to change too ~ that's too late. I have no desire to create with her what I most likely yearned for when I was a mere child.

Her becoming healthy would also not motivate me to make strides to change in my personal life. I'm quite content in where I am academically and financially. I do imagine there would be slight changes in my social life, with no longer being burdened with trying to maintain a tiny semblance of a relationship with her, which in a way is similar to dealing with any type of person who is low functioning. I could breathe much better and that would free me up to focus on me and my marriage in a way I have not had the luxury of doing ~ maybe ever, since she made herself a burden by the time I was married 3 weeks.

To put it bluntly, if she were to recover tomorrow, my feelings about her would be: "That is fantastic. Now, get on with your life. I love you, I wish you good health and happiness". I would have no interest for hanging around for the last chapter, if you will.

I would expect that I would show much less tension in my face. Feel less tension. Relax in a way that might astound me.

And I would think to myself, how sad to waste a life and damage others for selfishness and an unwillingness to not care enough to seek help when it would have been so much more advantageous for all concerned.

How would I expect other family members to change or react? I'd bet that my brothers would feel the same as I, and enmeshed sis would be forced to change, or simply act out. If mother were recovered, then I'd assume she would help sis, or hold her responsible to become recovered too.

Sorry to say this but I feel like saying it anyway... Pigs might fly.

There has been to much damage done between my mother and I. She had made all the emotional feelings that a daughter should have for her mother gone numb and hard.

I would hate anything to happen to her but I am really sick of all the abuse she gave me.

When I was sick, she cared for me so well. I appreciated that and I needed her. But when I got better... .she was straight back to her usual selfwish way. I have had it and I dont take and put up with it anymore.

So, what does she do... .she splits me black and we have no contact once again.

It will never be normal.

Thanks to her (not really) I attract these kind of people in my life and I am sick of it.

I want to be happy and loved again.

w2h

My BPD father will never get better as has not gotten treatment and he believes that he does not have a problem.

If, by the stoke of some magic wand, he no longer had BPD, I would still have a difficult time establishing a new relationship with him. There's been too much damage done over the years. His being rid of BPD would not magically transform me into a healthy and whole person. I would still struggle every day with my issues: the damaged trust that permeates every relationship I have, the feeling that I need to be perfect in every way, the shame and conviction that I am seriously defective, the low-grade chronic depression, the need to hide all of these feelings behind a facade of happiness and competency. In other words, it wouldn't change ME. I will be working to heal for a long, long time whether he is healed or not.

Perhaps I would worry less about his threats to commit suicide, perhaps I would let him see his granddaughter, perhaps I would even invite him to our house for dinner. Perhaps not.

. . . . bitter retort coming . . . . w2h makes a good point . . . .

pigs fly in dreams, not on this earth

My stepmother would have to be resurrected from the dead, to be "recovered", and my bio mom is now age 66.  How does one truly amend 66 years of abandonment, and emotional abuse?  For the time she has left on this earth, if bio mom "recovered", I would be open to true amends, nothing less.  I would make time in my life to receive amends and work on forgiveness.  Otherwise, I would change nothing.  That's it.  Pfffffff.

I won't be holding my breath.

m.

If my ensis recovered tomorrow, I don't think all that much would actually change in my life. 

I know that I wouldn't be No Contact. I think I would have a "normal" sisterly relationship, whatever the heck that means but one where we could tolerate being in each other's presence even if we are such polar opposites. 

Because we handle our needs so differently,and our world view is so drastically different from each, we probably wouldn't be the best of friends but at the very least a holiday together could be tolerable.

And of course if she were "recovered", her behavior toward me would not be so passive aggressive (who put the passive in passive aggressive?  :))

I am not bitter about it so much anymore because I have adjusted MY expectations of her.  I'm not even mad at her anymore.  I just know that if given the chance she will cut me to shreds and rip my heart out emotionally... .hence the no contact - purely a protective measure.  I think she must feel relief with the no contact also - she doesn't have to feel so intimidated and inadequate around me anymore (HER feelings, not mine).

I would be overjoyed at her recovery so that we could be in contact but also because of what it would mean for her - a fuller life, less anxiety, less dependency, less victimization, less hysteria, more reasoning and critical thinking.  She would be able to make a decision without having to poll 5 people.  And most of all if she were more secure in herself, her own person, and she wouldn't be so intimidated by me. She would be able to do a little self-analysis and that after all is the key to the recovery - getting beyond the tip of her own nose - the narcissism.

Also Randi, it occurs to me that in order to get some really "true" results, you should do this stricly by PM'ing and I'm sorry that I didn't PM this to you and of course now I'm to rushed to re-type this.  I'm only saying this because I have noticed that occasionally there can be a domino or gang effect when people answer posts.  What I mean by this is that someone can pose a question in a post and a number of people all answer along the same line and then somebody else comes along who posts an answer along another line and then people respond to the new answer - a kind of running from one side of the boat to the other, if you understand what I mean... .I guess we all pick up on each other's thoughts and I'm just thinking that to get pure results, it should be done privately.

Anyway it's just a thought, good luck with it,

Salveregina

IF my sister got better tomorrow, was cured, or made signifigant progress, I know I would try and reestablish a relationship with her.Both her older daughters, too. THey have said as much. I would take it slow, like a long lost relative that I did not know.

I have often thought about doing things different but then, I would not be who I am, married to the wonderful man I married 24 years ago. No, I wouldn't go back, just forward.

If he recovered tomorrow, I doubt he would come back.  BP's after they recover, experience something that is profound in terms of humiliation for past behaviors.  I do not think he would be able to look me in the eye again.

Could I sleep better knowing he were healthy?  I doubt it, because the memories of his abuse would still be there- the uselessness of so much suffering would still be a curse.

His recovery can not take my nightmares away, or heal my broken heart.  The memories will always be there.

I don't have any idea who he would be without the disorder- he might be someone I like even less.

Happybunny

If my BPD sister were to recover tomorrow, I could go back to feeling that someone loved me.  The "fantasy" that she loved me was the hardest thing to lose when we quit having a relationship.  I am 56, and got divorced three years ago from an abusive marriage I stayed in for 32 years.  I reconciled myself to my BPD mother not loving me, then my ex-husband not loving me, but thought my sister and I would have a lasting bond.  (We had been estranged for decades.) 

This may sound very selfish, but I don't care.  I am human and humans want to feel loved.  My dog and cat will have to suffice.

Ethel

Ethel!   ((ethel))   I feel the some way with Luna C. If she ever got better first of all G-d himself will have to come down and tell me. To be completely honest and I feel a little slilly putting this here but anyway-I would want her all for myself. My sibs are very belssed in the fact that they have surrogate parent type people in their life. I was not so blessed in that area. I would want her love, to FEEL her love, and be able to believe in it. I would also want her to go back to every person she lied about me to and badmouthed me to and tell them she was wrong. In the small community I live in and have to live in for a while yet, her smear campaign has been pretty effective.

I hope I would find a way to feel safe again.

I think I would wish her peace and joy.

I can't imagine what recovered means re: mother.  Does that mean that the behavior that is so distorted and intrudes into every life that she touches would vanish? Would there be any lingering behavioral problems or would they magically vanish?  I suppose my question is what would she do? Would she acknowledge how much pain she's caused? Would she be sorry? The truth is I wouldn't know because after all that she's done to hurt me, there is no more contact. I can't imagine changing that.

When I first had my first who children (only 18 months apart), I would have done anything to give them the kind of grandmother I had. I wanted to spend these glorious years rediscovering things with my children and for that to span through 3 generations. I would have loved to have shared meals, holidays, shopping excursions with my mother. I would have loved to have a mother who wanted to see my children react to the beach for the first time (and each time thereafter), who wanted to take them to the movies with me, read to them, bake for them, teach them to cook. I would have liked to have had a mother who taught me to cook - or did any of those things with me.  I would have liked to have had the mother I never had but always dreamed of.  I don't dream of that any more. I only want peace away from her. I only want to be left alone. I would (and do) hope that she finds some happiness, some pure joy - if only for an instant. I would want her to be loved and to be able to love - just someone else. I would want her to understand that she's caused too much pain to be a part of my life.  My children will never know such pain - they won't even remember her.

I think that if my uBPD mother really recovered, I would like to learn to know the real her. It gets so difficult to learn to know someone who constantly lives her life through other people. I would really like to know where she begins and ends, so to speak.

To me it would mean a lot less stress if she recovered. It would mean that I wouldn't have to constantly watch my back with her and expect to get stabbed, used or painted black for whatever reason. The constant stress has been a real terror for me.

Reid

Dear Randi,

Interesting thread/question.

If my BPD daughter recovered tomorrow, I would resume the "normal" life I had always envisioned for myself but which has been seriously derailed in the past few years.

In spite of my daughter having BPD dxed by several psychiatrists, she and I have a good relationship.  She has never been prone to rages, she turns it all inside and gets depressed and suicidal.  But she is very "high maintenance" in terms of demanding attention and care.  Our world often seems to revolve around her and what would make her happy and what would "work" for her.

The main difference in my life would be that I would no longer have to worry constantly about whether she is going to be okay or not.  I would just know!  I wouldn't have constant anxiety about whether she's going to end up in the psych hospital again and/or try to commit suicide again.  I wouldn't have constant anxiety about whether she's going to need my full financial support in the future; I would be able to assume that like any other intelligent, able-bodied person she would be able to take care of herself and get along in society.  Also, I would save thousands upon thousands of dollars in medical/psychiatric care for her!  I don't know what I would do with that but it would help me to feel more secure about my future retirement as well as about her future inheritance!

My daughter and her sister might finally be able to get along and understand each other.  My daughter's father (my ex-h) and she might finally be able to get along and understand each other.  As it is now, both of them (other daughter and ex-h) are both too scared to understand my BPD daughter, and too dismissive of her as not being able to just change herself and get better.  We might even be able to get along seamlessly as I always hoped we would be able to.  My other daughter may even feel like she doesn't have to stay so "perfect" anymore to make up for the trials and tribulations her BPD sister causes in the family.

My psychic load as Mother would be a lot, lot lighter and my life would have a lot more joy in it if my daughter was cured tomorrow.  As it is now, I'm a fairly happy person and fairly "well-adjusted;" but my life has a deep undercurrent of sadness because my daughter is unhappy at her lot in life which she definitely perceives as a biological/genetic travesty.  She does not blame me or anyone in the family for her condition.  In fact her PGM and P-uncle have similar traits that again seem biologically based, and she is aware that she inherited extreme emotional sensitivity.  She is just so frustrated that it causes her so many problems in her social interactions and it all adds up to her having a great deal of difficulty liking herself.  It's so hard to watch your child suffer in spite of making every possible resource available to get them the help that they need and want.

So life would be better... .I would travel more (many plans have gotten cancelled at the last minute... .), develop more of my own social life, things I am working on doing anyway but there's always this nagging feeling in the back of my mind like, Am I really going to be able to do this or is something going to happen, is my daughter going to crash right at the moment I get ready to do what I want to do.

I am always thankful for all the good in my life and for the fact that my daughter is still alive and still fighting her battle with BPD.  But I would take great joy in a cure.  I hope some day there will be one based in the biochemistry of the disease.

SueH.

I think Oy-vey hit it right on the head,

stbxbpw was supposed to call the boys every other night. Haven't heard from her in 4 days, Ican't imagine what is going through the boys heads.     

Hi Randi,

Good question!

The BP in my life is a friend - so we are not connected romantically so to speak. But then friendships are relationships too, and this one is of course fairly intense and demanding. In fact I don't think it can be defined as a friendship at present, more a caretaking role.

I think for myself, after reading your eggshells text, and realising what a BPD goes through in their own mind on a daily basis I would have to say that if she recovered I would be rapt for her. To remove that daily torture and allow her to lead a relatively normal life - to give love and receive it - to TRUST people etc - this would be magic! Additionally if I was able to share that recovery in a great friendship - well bonus!

She is really a tortured soul - and yes as a result she treats me and everyone else in her life that way - but your text taught me one very important thing (Well many actually!) - none of it is personal - so i don't take it that way.

I would not want to live her life - so sincerely hope that she does sustain some kind of recovery.

Hope this helps Randi.

In the last couple of years my daughter has had two very good periods of time that have been of quite some length.

The first one lasted over a year and came to an end when she was under a good deal of stress. What we had thought would be a wonderful employment opportunity with my brother plunged her back into her old behaviors. Even though she was making much better money that she ever had, she could not deal with the stress of the move and the erratic nature of her schedule. Her frequent rages, suspicion of everyone and shortness with her children returned. One of her brothers was again painted black as was I.

When my brother told her this spring that she needed to find new work by summer she was very angry, but you could also see the relief.

Her last rage was in May, on her 30th birthday, at my house. She was furious that the afore-mentioned brother would only give her son some of he old baseball card collection and save the rest for his two sons. Mind you, her son certainly understood and was appreciative, but she threw a rage and left with the kids. We had just babysat for a week and as she was leaving she was telling the kids they weren't going to be coming back for a long, long time.

By June she was getting her act together in a way that I have never seen. Over the next few months she took on two jobs, arranged summer daycare for the kids, autumn pre-school and speech therapy for her daughter.She works at a pre-school during the week and picks up weekend hours at a gym daycare. She was thinking of moving back but realized that she needed to stay until the end of her lease and that the kids are doing well in the situation they are in now. She is carefully weighing the pros and cons of how this will impact the kids. None of this would have happened before.She would have decided she wanted to move back and be packed the next day. She would have found the lease to be irrelavant and justified moving the kids on short notice somehow. She is working three double shifts  in November to help pay for Christmas. She had three tickets that dropped of her record this month. She called her car insurance to see if her rates would go down. When they said no, she called around and found a company that is saving her $200 a month. Never before would she have done that sort of follow up. She would have just figured the universe was against her and let it go. We had a family vacation this summer and there were no scenes. Situations that I was expecting that she might react to, she stayed calm.

I had seen this once before, during that other good period of time. I had been so worried that she would ruin her brother's (the one she splits black) wedding, but she didn't.

This weekend all the kids and grandkids were here to go to the Pumpkin Patch. She invited her son's dad to join us, she was mellow, she wasn't short with the kids and we all had a great time!

Is she recovered? I don't know. She has never gone to counseling. She is on amitryptalin (sp?) for fibro-myalgia (sp?) and that could account for the changes. I don't think she sees the connection if that is what is accounting for the changes. And she was already on the same medication during the time she had gone back to the rages and other BP behaviors.

For my part, I try to do a lot of validating and praise for the great job she is doing. I have to be careful not to go overboard. Keeping it low key seems to be better. I try to react to her choices like I do my other adult children. I no longer assume that a statement of an expense incurred is a prelude to a plea for money. If I keep the conversation at a "matter-of-fact" sort of level, it helps. 

It is hard to fully trust her or to quit feeling like it could all change in an instant. I know it will take a long time for her brother to trust her. Her sisters, who would never think of letting her babysit for them before,  have actually asked her to do so a few times. I think it makes her feel good that she is able to finally reciprocate.  She doesn't verbalize it, but I sense she is really happy that they trust her because she is aware that they are very conscientious parents.

She comes home with stories about the kids she is watching at the pre-school she works at. She really cares about and seems to have a good rapport with them. When offered a job at the daycare her kids go to, she thought it through and turned it down. Even though it would be more convenient, she thought it might be hard to teach your own kids and add to some complications at work. I thought that was very wise. She has a timed and structured cirriculum that she needs to follow and I think that works well for her personality.

While she hasn't ruled out moving back down, she is taking things slow and carefully considering which offers the best options for the kids. I think she would like to eventually be back down her for her son's dad to be able to more regularly go to school functions and sports. I sure can't fault her for that. He does a great job of finding time to travel up for certain events, but it is not very convenient. I am just so pleased that she is taking her time and not moving on her first impulse. Did I mention this would never, never, never have happened in that past?

I am sorry for the length of this post. I just felt like I needed to provide a little background and perspective for it to make sense.

That's difficult to answer. Almost 'magical thinking'.

Honestly, I don't think my wife and I could reunite. As much as I would like to and have our lives return to the days when things were what they seemed to be, I just honestly don't see the possibility. With the breach of trust at the level I experienced, the put downs, smear campagnes, crazymaking activities in an attempt to make me question my own santity, the deceptiveness, and heartache couldn't be overwritten in a simple diagnosis as 'recovered'. Too much damage is done. The effort and means necessary to rebuild a relationship and rebuild the trust would be a burden too heavy for my SO to handle and not something I would want to undertake managing myself.

As sad as all of this is and was, it just plain wouldn't work.

In the case of a Chosen relationship... .

I think that, if you accept the premise that you've never known your S.O. when they didn't have BPD, you have to consider the fact that if they, suddenly miraculously didn't have BPD, you wouldn't really know them at all.

It couldn't be a case of "getting the person you loved back".

You'd be left with either:

Your Non-ish, codependent self, trying to have a "new" relationship with a emotionally healthy person who simply isn't the person you "loved so much" anymore.

or

Your healed, and no longer seriously codependent self, who just isn't interested in getting to know that new person because there was so much water under the bridge.  I don't think a Non whose healed and grown would ever be willing to risk going back to situation.  Best case, in their own mind, they'd be reminded every day of how bad things used to be.

Wow Randi - That's one heck of a topic to start!

If my H recovered tomorrow, if he was completely healthy mentally - I would be beyond happy to see him healthy, to see him be able to enjoy life and not feel the pain he has his whole life.  His mother once told me in confidence that she wished he'd never been born had she known that he would live life in such utter misery.  It would give me absolute joy to see him not feeling and behaving the way that he has.

It's not like I think life would suddenly become problem free, every life, every relationship has it's bumps in the "yellow brick road" but, if I am to be honest with myself,  I would probably fall in love all over again... .and even if we were never able to get back what we had, I wouldn't feel like it was just a dream, just an illusion... .I think that everyone is brought into our lives for a reason, I have learned from him, I have loved him and if he did not feel so empty inside... .maybe we'd have a real chance.

Absolutely TRUST would be the main recovery point of even a friendship with him, because he has absolutely violated my trust... .and I don't know if all of it can ever be completely forgiven.  I am guarded now, detached, because it is the only way to save myself.  For me right now it is about my recovery as a non.

but, GOD, to see him happy... .healthy... .I'd gladly forfit my dream... .if that meant we were never ever together again... .it would still be worth it to see him smile and not see emptiness or pain in his eyes.

- Elphie

Recovered tomorrow?  Well, maybe we could have a reasonable conversation about college expenses for our son... .and he would magically remember some of the terms of our divorce decree pertaining to responsibility for these expenses.

How could I ever trust my daughter again?  She has slowly and methodically whittled away at any love I felt for her. She is a "blood stranger" to me now and needs to come with a warning label on her chest:  Warning, this person may be hazardous to your physical and mental health."

Here's a shortlist of what BPD momster did while sick:

Prevented me from finishing college (long story)

Smeared me to hundreds of relatives and friends, saying I'm mentally ill and abused her

Did major damage to my career and earning potential

Did major damage to my reputation

While I was a dependent, refused adequate medical care, clothing, and education

Repeatedly threatened my safety

Destroyed all my personal property, including professional references, prior to 2001

Told me that if I succeeded I was killing her

Raged at me for getting good grades, being athletic, being a community service person, and otherwise becoming an independent adult

Ordered my father to abandon me and he obeyed her

I don't care if she's recovered tomorrow. Just her face and voice are traumatizing. I want her GONE.

Tigereyes
I'm afraid I've reached that point as well.  Luckily, my self esteem only took a small hit (I'm pretty introspective, and I KNOW I'm a decent (too decent) person).  But my boys - I don't know that they will every fully recover.

What's sad is that I'm so non-confrontational that she probably doesn't even know that I feel this way.  I just leave when she slips into the negative side of BPD mode.   

What would I do, Randi?  That is an interesting premise.  You see, I don't have just one BP person in my life, I have TWO.

Both were chosen relationships, my wife and her daughter.  Neither were as bad when I'd first chosen the relationship

as they got as I got close to them as is typical with people afflicted with BPD.  Some of the people have replied with... .well,

what is actually understandable and natural for people that have put up with BP SO's and children.  They want nothing to

do with the person ever again- because of all the pain within them.  I do not place blame on them, nor do I expect guilt

from them for this.  I daresay that most people would find no faults and would be amazed at what they'd put up with and

why they didn't leave sooner.  Me, I'd draw upon the inner strength that has kept me going with all of this in spite of the

pain I've been made to endure this last nine and a half years and I'd at least try to reach out to them and forgive what

was done to me.

What would I do for my Stepdaughter?  If she wanted to go to a technical school or college- I'd pay for it and work however

hard it'd take to get her situated in her first real job ever.  I want her to flourish above all else and it hurts to the very core

of my being that I can't help her do that because of the illness.  If she were well, I could at least give her a fighting chance

in this world.  I'm not so sure she has that right now with her illness.

What would I do for my wife?  I'd hug her and not let go of her for quite a bit... .  Not some short hug; it'd be a long lingering

hug, probably with a lot of crying involved.  You see, while she's a BP, she's still in there- and the person I married is

still in there, it's just twisted and corrupted by a mental problem that won't let her think straight or seek the help she needs.

Then I'd try and save up money to spend a month or two back over in Scotland for a third honeymoon.  Instead of the whistlestop

tour we did on our second one over there, I'd take it at a liesurly pace, making sure to visit both our ancestral homes (Her heritage

is from out of Clan Gunn and mine is from out of Clan MacDonald... .) and to do a much more thorough visit of the isle.  From

there, I'd work on building the Horse Farm we'd started with one of our friends to be more than the 5 horses we have and doing

some trip of a lifetime every 2-3 years.  We'd have the money then instead of her having spent it on Dollar Store trips and the

like.  I'd try to retake my, no, OUR life before the problem really became apparent.

Hi Randi,

I'm sorry if this sounds like a non-response or even a rude response to your question.  The written medium is a difficult one to translate into what we would get if we had a face to face conversation.  Hopefully you'll be able to pick up what I'm saying here as being from the heart and from the experience as a child of a severely afflicted parent with borderline personality disorder.

I'll be honest and say that I wouldn't change a thing if my BPD mother miraculously recovered from her mental illness.  Nothing.  Her miraculous recovery would be undoubtedly false, flawed and x-x-x-xed up.  I know because she has claimed for the last 20 years that god gave her mental health.  He did not.

Your other questions seem to intimate that the BPD's "recovery" would somehow set others free to live their own lives.  Speaking as a child of a diagnosed BPD mother, I can say that I have had to work very hard to be free to live my own life and, most importantly, to realize that my mother will NEVER "recover" from her borderline personality disorder.  For me to even consider otherwise would be stupid folly and worthless dreaming for something that will never happen.

Trust me when I say that I did try, many times, to believe she was recovered.  I tried, many times, to "do things differently" based on her "recovery."  I even moved to many different states here in America in hopes of creating the distance I thought would give me freedom.  Those moves did not give me freedom.  Primarily because I did not choose to see that the mother I had was an empty well and that no distance could ever control her behavior of forever trying to suck me back into her sick world for her own sick needs.

I suppose I'm in the minority of your responders here.  I just cannot and will not allow myself to fantasize about a BPD mother ever recovering.  Its not going to happen, and honestly, as you are the author of "The Book" on BPD, I just don't understand why you would pose this question.  Perhaps your writing is taking a broader approach... .I don't know. 

I can honestly and assuredly say, as a 39 year old child of a mother diagnosed with BPD many times in her life, that nothing would be different in my life if my mother "recovered."  This is because I spent many years of my life (and my teenage daughter's life) trying to build a relationship with a mother that claimed god healed her from BPD.  I wanted to believe it and I worked my ass off to make a healthy relationship with my mother.  It did not work.  My mother constantly treated me horribly, with BPD tendencies in relationships, and I finally realized that I just didn't have a strong enough spine to stand up to her crazymaking.  I reached a point, repeatedly, of asking myself what was wrong with me that I couldn't build a healthy relationship with my mother.  Granted, she left me alone with HER abuser who became MY abuser in every way possible.  But I STILL TRIED TO HAVE A RELATIONSHIPS WITH HER.  Until she stole my child.  That sad event showed me a reality I had overlooked for many years.

Since then, I haven't based my life options upon her recovery.  Instead, I've had to base them on the cold hard reality that my mother will NEVER recover, heal or be normal.  THAT is a shtty lot in life to accept, and is the hardest obstacle to overcome in an "unchosen relationship" with a BPD.  Every child (and then adult when they grow into one) deserves, needs and is worth a loving parent.  BPDs cannot give this because they are completely and irrevocably incapable of this task. 

The mere suggestion that I would live my life differently if my BPD mother "recovered" is laughable.  Its pure folly to think that recovery would change the painful, lonely, and terribly hard work required of a child seeking to live a healthy life after they've been cursed with a BPD parent.  It won't happen, so why ask the question?

I hope that you are able and willing to address some of the questions I've raised, because honestly I'd like to have more information to help me build a healthy and whole life apart from my BPD momster who is a true monster.

Soldier

I would have to say... .I need to work on myself now, after neglecting me for so long.  Crappy thing is, I have to do it alone. So I couldn't be with her anyway.

Randi,

After what she has put me through I could never go back and risk it all again.

Anyay, she would be a different person, and now, so am I.

B2

"I think that if my uBPD mother really recovered, I would like to learn to know the real her. It gets so difficult to learn to know someone who constantly lives her life through other people. I would really like to know where she begins and ends, so to speak.

To me it would mean a lot less stress if she recovered. It would mean that I wouldn't have to constantly watch my back with her and expect to get stabbed, used or painted black for whatever reason. The constant stress has been a real terror for me."

What Reid said.  I think if Mom "recovered",  I'd be willing to work on improving our relationship, provided Mom acknowledged her mistakes, and made genuine amends for them.  But I'd be tentative, without any gushiness.

But I wonder what that would be like, to feel relaxed around my mom, instead of either on edge or disengaged?  Oh well--guess I'll never know!

I can't imagine BPsis recovering, she's allergic to both hard work and accountability. But if she did... .My daughter and my DH and I could have Tgiving and Xmas with the family! Other than that, not much would change- I wouldn't be interested in having a personal relationship with her outside the 2X/yr the whole family gets together. I don't even think I would or could return my relationships with youngest sis and my parents to what they were before Hurricane BP blew through... .just too much damage and loss of trust. Mostly due to the nature of BPsis' "crimes"; if she slept around or drank or stole cars I might be able to put it all behind us, but child abuse, to me, crosses a boundary that can never be erased. I can't ethically justify being around a child abuser if I have any choice. Maybe that's just me.

If my daughter recovered tomorrow?  I would thank God over and over and over again.  I would smile again.  I would laugh again.  I could stop holding my breath.    I could look her in those beautiful blue eyes and know that she wasn't go to "go off".  She could have a normal relationship with a boy.  To be able to trust her and communicate with her on a normal, adult level would be a blessing from God.  To know that one day we could sit down and plan her wedding and enjoy it - not dread the day when she comes to us and says she is getting married.  We could have a family holiday or birthday without it turning into a disaster.  I could stop going to therapy.

If my daughter recovered tomorrow?  We would love each other and we could do things together and I would no longer envy my friends who have wonderful relationships with their daughters because I would have that also.

I will continue to pray and Thank God for those who do try to understand.

If my uBPH recovered tomorrow (& I'll assume for the sake of this hypothetical that he'd also be healed of his dysthymia, NP style, being alcoholic, codependent, & type 2 controller!)... .I'd be so happy for him! I don't believe for a minute that he has any hope of really being the person he's been put on this earth to be nor do I believe he can really love/receive love while he is this ill. Maybe he'd want to go to marriage counseling then so we could save/restore our marriage whereas now he has no interest in such & keeps threatening divorce. But - all this said - I realize he may indeed then be a different person than who he was (or probably more accurately who he portrayed himself to be) during our courtship, so I hope we'd still actually want to fall in love w/ each other again.

Can't hurt to dream, can it?

What a thought provoking question! 

If my BPsd was cured tomorrow, I would be overjoyed.  Our whole family would change. 

My husband would no longer go through the bouts of depression triggered by her rages and crises, his blood pressure would not be nearly so problematic and he could most likely stop taking antidepressants, which he secretly calls his “hit__ medicine”.  (Fill in the blank with her name.)

My wonderful stepson would agree to spend time around her.  He distanced himself from her a few years ago, when he was in his early 20s.  It was a very healthy thing for him to do.  His fiancé would feel much less nervous about their upcoming wedding, as she knows that BPsd will do whatever it takes to be the center of attention and is terrified of what she might do at the wedding for attention.

Her grandparents would be much happier, and healthier.  The stress that she places on them and the way she treats them have caused them to have stress related health problems.  At times, their doctor has forbidden them to see her, but they love her so much that they cant stand it.  They are very much aware of her problems, but cant stop trying to fix them.  (As their daughter, BPsds mother, is deceased, they have a very strong desire to see her well.)

I would feel like someone lifted a large building off of me.  My marriage would be so much better, as hubby wouldnt feel like he was stuck in the middle with his heart being torn to shreds.  He cannot face her problems and sees things the way he wishes they were instead of the way they are.  Im the one stuck pulling his head out of the sand at times … when things are to the point that they simply cannot be ignored by him anymore.  Obviously, this places great stresses on our marriage.

I would consent to spend time around her, and actually enjoy it!  Due to the way she has consistently treated me for many years, now that she is out of the house for good, I will not spend extended periods of time around her.  I have been very upfront about this, and if her behavior changes then she is welcome to be around.

Holidays would be so much nicer!  As it is now, everyone is tense, just waiting to see what sort of fit she will pitch to get everyones attention.  One year she came for Christmas, laid down on the floor in the middle of the room and went to sleep … yelling at anyone who talked loudly and woke her (there were 20 people there) until she finally stormed out of the house and left.

All in all, our family would be able to spend really happy times together.  For so many years, all of our family times remind me of a song played on a piano that is badly out of tune.  Some notes sound beautiful, but there are always the clunker off key notes that make everyone cringe. 

Im sure that without realizing it, all families dealing with a BP get to the point that the stresses and strains become an integral part of their lives.  If this part was removed, I would think there would be some unpredicted adjustments to be made … sort of like living near a noisy airport and then moving to the country and being uncomfortable with the silence at first.  When you are used to being defensive, it is hard to change.  But, I would think these changes would be made by most with little problem.

For me, it would take some time to be able to trust that BPsd had really changed.  The longest I have ever seen her maintain any attempt at positive change is 2 months … then she blows.  Even during those 2 months she had mild rages, etc, but no major crises affecting the entire family.  I think it would take a good 6 months with no raging, manipulation, lies or crises for me to begin to trust the change.

I love this topic.  It is the stuff that daydreams are made of!

Southern Gal

If Mother were to recover she'd be a complete stranger to me because I have no idea who she is. She'd be a complete stranger to herself as well. Does this mean she'd have to start life over from say about the age of four? Because that's where she is mentally most days. Every life experience she has ever had has been through BPD eyes and ears. It's affected every relationship, every goal, every conversation, every everything she's ever experienced. I just imagine a suddenly cured Mother would be as emotionally, physically and mentally raw as a toddler who is taking their first steps and speaking their first words.

Also, would she have any memory of all the things she did and said over the years? Could she recognize her role in the broken relationships in my family? Would she be able to accept accountability and responsibility and make true amends for the abuse she handed out? Would she be sorry? Would she begin to experience empathy, humility, self awareness, a sense of humor? I just can't imagine her this way. There's no frame of reference. There's little to no glimpse of normalcy in my Mother that is free of manipulation, lies, shame and guilt.

While it would be nice to have a 'normal' mother for a change I'm not sure I could get over the pain and hurt she put me through over the years. I don't think I could trust that she was truly cured.

i have always felt, as a child & all of my adult life, i am 56, that even if my mother, father & sister, had changed when i grew up, that it was still too late.

the damage was done & irraparable.  i had absolutley no interest in them, did not like them, & adamantly never wanted to see them again in my life.

but, it it had ever been over, i could have had a relationship with my other 3 sisters.  they would have had an opportunity to know me.  i am a ficticious character to all of them, due to all of their insane lies.

i have four sisters, @ one time i adored 3 of them, but, they were part of the pack.

bp is about loss, there were no changes, & now it is far too late.

I agree with many others.

The damage is done and unrepairable.

Even two years ago, I dreamt that my BPDmother would be death and I could have a relation with my father. Now if she would be death or healed, I would not care, I would not change anything.

My BPDmother does not mean anything to me in a very long time. From my father I had to say good-bye this year. They are out of my life. I do not care anymore.

But this is similar to other relations I had in life. People behaved badly towards me and I suffered and was sad and after some time I realized and mostly it was too late.

You have to apologize in a limited period after you have damaged a person. If that does not come, mostly the relations are over.

Sam

My answer would have to be that if they recovered tomorrow I would do exactly what I wanted to today.

The difference would be that it would be appreciated and supported by them.

Right now, everything is threatening so any action causes my spouse pain.

I would love to just talk to my spouse. Just to enjoy the look on their face knowing they

see me as someone they can appreciate and confide in.

I would love the feelings that I didn't have to hide everything that might suggest I have a life

outside of our marriage, or carefully choosing every word to try not to upset them.

I would just hold them. Just to be in a caring and accepting embrace. I would never want to let go.

God it would feel so good to live again. It would feel so good.

Opened a can of worms with this one.

Half me says I'd be so happy I'd burst. I'd never leave her side and I'd learn to trust again and stop detatching all the time.

The other half would convince me she'd be safe to leave my kids with and I could just get my own life back, wish her all the best and move on.

I pray for the day. I feel immense pity for her situation and wish to God she'd see the world as I do. It isn't half as terrifying as she thinks it is. Unless you're married to a borderline, that is!

Wow... .what a topic!  What I would do, and what would happen as a result of recovery, as two very different things.  As a secondary non, I would  marry my SO, the love of my life.  While there is breath in her body, I will not expose myself to that, nor does he want me to. 

And I do believe that even if she did recover, which is virtually impossible to even contemplate, the damage that has been done is so deep, and so pervasive that it really wouldn't matter.  The damage has been inflicted, and the scars are always going to be there... .for all of us, but mostly for my SO's 10 y/o son. 

Randi,

I don't know myself anymore so I don't know what I would do.

I want her to recover so she can see what she put me through, no more, no less.


pizaluvr

It's a sickness and a disease. They are not evil or posessed. They are sick.

If he was cured I would marry him, love and cherish him to the end of my life and then some. I could let go of the trust issues that all of this has created because this is a disease and if he was 100% cured (a miracle, no doubt) then I could believe and open my heart again like it was in the beginning. I love him for his good qualities which would only be that much stronger once the corrupted negative thought patterns were gone. I would be able to witness the love of my life blossom out into an incredible person. I would be able to grow with him and nothing would be able to stop us. Despite everything I have been through with this, I still believe that love is the most powerful force in the universe. It's what keeps me going.

The hard reality of the situation is that there is no 100% cure for this disease. And without a 100% cure, there would be trust issues that would be very difficult to repair. That love also involves love of oneself. No matter what spiritual beliefs you have, the creator of this life we have has given each of us a gift. If you do not make good use of this gift, do you think the creator is going to feel like giving you more gifts that you are not going to appreciate? I'm stubborn and don't want to give up on the situation, but realize that there is no "cure". If there was, I would probably be one of the happiest people on earth.

Emy

If she did recover, who would she be?  The person I knew was fictional. I hope she recovers and that any one with BPD will recover also.  I have moved on and would not go back to the relationship.

To me, there is nothing positive to think about the "what if(s)?".  It would almost be the same as "what if I found a million dollars?", "what if I found Alladin's lamp?" ... ."what if I did something different, would I be in the mess that I am with my ex wife that may or may not be BPD?"

If my possible BPD ex wife recovered tomorrow, it would have to be as if the other "evil twin" never existed otherwise I would still be walking on eggshells the rest of my life.

At this point I would welcome her recovery and wish her well on the rest of her life.  Whatever I thought we once had is gone and I'm just as happy for it to be gone.  It's tiring to spend great chunks of your life remembering what never was and convincing yourself that what never was, was great. 

Mount Si

If he truly recovered tomorrow, I would congratulate him and compliment him for the achievement.  I would acknowledge him for a challenge not only well met, but also unique and rare.   Wish him blessings and God speed.

In my experience, there's no cure for this disease. For the sake of argument and this discussion, were a miracle to occur and a cure be found some time in the future, it wouldn't make one darn bit of difference. I just don't care anymore, and I've gone on with my life. I don't wish the person harm, just gone from my life forever. I'm done with that relationship, and nothing will bring me back.

Just reading the question made me cry.

I would be so happy!

Randi,

It was so many years that I lived with a wife with BPD, that I don't know who I am anymore.  I'm definatley not in love with her, and if she was suddenly miraculously healed, I don't think I would want to get back with her.  Just too many bad memories.  The trust is gone, and I would never know if she was truly healed or just having a good day. 

Wellby

Randi,

I discussed this with my psychologist. She warned me that this disorder is almost impossible to cure, especially when the person reaches a certain age. I had been dealing with this for over 24 years with my BPDW. I must admit there were many good times and I did love her very much (still do but from afar). Our love life was incredible, even after so many years. Still-

Even if by some miracle she were "cured" I feel we would fall into the same old relationship patterns. I don't know if she would accept me if I 'Stopped Walking on Eggshells'. If she were still deeply emotionally involved (in love) with me, I truly feel she would become "uncured" and fall into the same behaviors.

Finally, there is so much baggage to deal with, that we probably could not start fresh. I just pray that she will recognize her problem, deal with it professionally, and find someone else that she can start fresh with.

I had to rethink my position based on other comments.  It'd take a while to earn back my trust (unless I was in on the secret that she was cured).  But I guess if I knew it was true, it'd be "happy time" for me.  Could I forgive everything she's done to me for the last 9 years?   The first 9 were OK.  Yeah, I guess I could (but like stated earlier - only if I knew she was "cured".

Interesting question but it makes too many assumptions.  Recovery most always assumes that the person "in recovery" changes in exactly the way you want them to; for the reasons you want them to; and that the new changes have no attached negative baggage that doesn't guarantee your wished for outcomes.  I've got almost 40 years of experience in social service field that dictates this doesn't happen in the real world.  Oh we hear about it, but is it real?  Only if the person outside the recovery process accepts everything can only be absolutely what the recovered person says it is and if the outsider never evolve one inch themselves during the other's recovery process.  That's always the catch: No one changes for us.  They change for themselves or to keep us attached to them. The process of change is just that, a process.  It is not a static event.  Everyone has to be part of the process and with BPs that means living in hell waiting for something to happen.  When you're outside of the BP realm you are out of the process.  If you go back you're enmeshed in it.  There is not a middle state where you can remove yourself from the chaos, sit on the sidelines and then magically return into some healed state with the BP who has had no contact with you for God knows how long.     

Sorry for the bucket of cold water. If I heard that my ex was "recovered" I would run like hell in the other direction. 

   I wish it would have been that easy. Unfortunately, it was a long road filled with hard work, heart ache, and frustration.

   Recovery from BPD is possible, but in order to continue in a relationship, there has to be growth and dealing with issues both seperately and together, as the non in the relationship has their own issues to deal with. Then the relationship needs to be worked on together.

   As far as the BP becomming who we want or expect them to be, is totally different than real recovery. No different than us nons growing and maturing, dealing with ourselves. It's not that they become totally different people, but from my expierence, it is the same person but who is in control of their emotions and thoughts, acting and reacting in a positive and healthy manner, but definately not perfect.

   Mark

The BPD person in my life is my child, now a young adult.  If she were miraculously cured, I would rejoice.  I would be incredibly grateful--for her sake and for the sake of the rest of the family members.  I wouldn't feel this undercurrent of worry all the time.  I wouldn't endure verbal abuse and constant accusations.  I wouldn't feel guilty when I don't handle things the right way.  Her siblings wouldn't be so affected by her illness and could spend time with her without wondering when she was going to blow up at them or go into hysteria.  I would have some confidence that she could parent the baby she is carrying. 

I don't think I'd let her live with me, though.  For a long time, I'd still be fearful that we'd be back where we started.

Also, if she miraculously were cured, I don't know who she would be.  She's lived with this illness all her life, so she's never had a chance to think correctly about situations, or practice flexibility, or develop the skills she needs to have a successful life.  Her whole personality is caught up in depression, anxiety, anger, and immaturity.  She'd literally have to start all over building a healthy personality. 

This question left me sad because it reinforces how impossible the situation seems.  I can't even imagine how getting to full recovery would work.

Kathy

I would send a nice flower arrangement.  Obviously she is dead.

I'd sit her down and pour out 13 years of pain and hurt. Just so she understood what we'd been through. What she'd put my kids and I through. This would be the best therapy for me I believe, but sadly, it ain't ever gonna happen.

Oh, and I'd make sure she went out to work, paid her own debts, hell, paid some of mine and well... .you get the picture...

But how about this question Randi, would our recovered BPD's want to be with us... .? :)

Best wishes to all... .my update coming soon... .!

BOD

Still sleep with one eye open and one eye shut.  It would scare me.

Well, in time-frames relative to those spoken of in Genesis (the world created in 7 days... .what is a 'day' in God-terms? - 24 hours? ... .24 million years?), our daughter has shown a great deal of recovery. Almost enough to warrant me wondering if she really has/had BPD in a clinical sense!

The past 18 months we have proceeded with caution - my husband and me; so has Daughter. Our other two younger girls also exhibited their own style of caution, but allowed the joy at having their big sister 'back' boost their innocent love and acceptance. It has been something to observe, with fear and reality-checks for them, but also with wonder.

We have ignored the few family members' exclamations of "It's a miracle!"... .us knowing that there was little divine intervention - at least not without a lot of mortal diligence, a certain amount of letting go, a whole bunch of hoeing the toughest row any of us have ever conceived of (including bpDaughter), a constant spark of hope, and the learning experience only those who live it could ever believe. I think we all find gold in small moments and comments now... .

The hurt and bitterness cultivated over past years' events still pops up in our minds and psyche - how could it not?, but we are hopeful enough about the 'new beginning' that we try to remain cognizant of what we want to accomplish here on out rather than insisting upon making amends for anybody's past choices and the detrimental tangible results and negative feelings borne of them.

Daughter and I have only touched on some of the horrible things and results our family has endured due to her BP'ish behavior and actions. A part of me craves wanting her to be aware of the extent of the part of our nightmare she was oblivious to because she only started the fires, she didn't stick around to witness the ashes, y'know? But I easily resist this compulsion because I see in her eyes and hear in her silence the limits to what she can take responsibility for, especially right now. Her plate is full as she moves forward as a 20 y/o single mom, starting a new career as a medical assistant with plans for psychiatric nursing, dealing with a very BPbio-mom whom she lives with for now, not to mention her baby's irresponsible father, and... .the past as she experiences/d it.

When I try to explain it to those who have stuck by us and cared and hurt right along with us while we floundered, I say I don't know what-the-hell I'm doing, but I'm doing what feels 'right' to me... .I guess I finally can kind of relate in some small way to the ['nother biblical reference] fable of the Prodigal son. I'm doing what a parent does - offering love, and continuing to be available in a supportive sense, but not putting my whole self out there to be run over... .communicating in small bites, testing waters for stability or emotional rawness, trying to remember that Daughter has been handicapped... .Her actions and intentions have been impulsive, her reasoning hampered by an emotional pain I can understand, if not totally empathize with... .I can find some balance when I think of making sure our other kids' emotional welfare is safe.

It's a slow process; one that I sense cannot be hurried. I am not exactly at it's mercy, but have grown to realize that I cannot control everything and will have to be a more knowledgable, stronger yet flexible passenger on this journey of which I am only a part, not the whole enchilada.

~ jr

This is so wonderful.  Dreaming about how our life would change, I thank you for this opportunity to vission our life.

I and my husband would no longer have to pray & wonder:

             

a.  If our daughter was going to commit suicide again

b.  If our daughter would hurt or kill the baby our new grandaughter

c.  If our daughter was going to call with a desperate need for money and another outragious traumatic drama event

d.  If our daughter would hurt me physically, emotionally and legally (try and put me in jail or her dad)

e.  If our daughter was living on the street

f.  If our grandaughter was living on the street

g.  If our daughter has hurt or killed her boyfriend of the day

h.  If our daughter is on Meth again

i.   If our daughter has ran to another state with our grandchild

j.   If our daughter could not physicallys, verbally and emotionally destroy everyone and everything she touches

k.   If our daughter would live to be 30

l.    If the police were going to call again

m.  If CPS was going to call again

n.   Where are baby infant grandaughter is now

o.   If our daughter is laying in her bed unable to get out and our grandaughter is laying in her crib needing love

p.  If Christmas with the family would be fun and not an emotional screaming episode

q.  If Birthdays, Thanksgiving, camping etc. would be fun and not a screaming, bawling episode.

r.  If our daughter could keep a job

s.  If our daughter could care about anyone except herself

Well it was a wonderful dream and prayer!

I know it may be hard, but the only thing you should pray and wonder about is your grandaughter. Your daughter has to fix her life herself. The top most important items in this list are B,F,I,N,O. Baby, Baby, Baby. You have done right by your daughter. Now your grandaughter needs you.  :'( You love your daughter, but she needs to love you back. She can do that by loving her daughter as much as you seem to love yours. She has to seek and complete help.

God Bless

I think if a child was to recover it would be wonderful for the parents.  But I'm not so sure about a parent. Where we feel we owe and may have let our children down, we are willing to work at improving the relationship.  But when a parent, whom we depended on for everything that makes your life worth living, like courage and self-esteem, lets us down it's more of a betrayal and very hard to forgive and forget.

I would thank god.

for her to feel  contentment and occasional joy

For her to have friendships that she would desperately love to have and the confidence to speak to people and feel that she is liked by most

For her to have a huge reduction in her anxiety levels so life would feel more liveable. 

For me it would mean peace and less quilt

For our family it would be peace and a reestablishment of a relationship with her father and brother. 

It would be the desire to have her in the home and not the dread

Laughter

I would feel less responsibility and not have to constantly think about validating and boundaries.   I could just talk and do.

I could share with others stories of a normal 20 year old instead of having to keep this awful tale to myself

That she could care and raise a child lovingly

She would feel the desire to be independent from us and not this constant attachment to us.

Less tears

to know that this vicious circle would end and she could live in some peace and joy

thanks for the opportunity to envision

I would at least be willing to start dialogue.

But instantly getting back to a "normal" relationship isn't realistic. My mother would still have a lot to answer for, and it's not as though we can erase the past and start with a clean slate.

A lot of my own mental issues and problems I've experienced as an adult are a result of her behavior toward me as a child. Several times I've heard from her how we held her back, how we were a burden to her. Even after my dad divorced her she told one of my brothers that the reason she wanted a divorce was to get away from us kids. While we were growing up she was only around in a limited capacity, and when we visited her she always had some kind of chores of a project to do, and that seemed to be the only purpose she wanted to see us. I'm convinced to this day that she never wanted to be a mother until the hard part was over.

This was her attitude while giving us the big guilt trips about how we owed her since she went through the trouble of giving birth to us. Of course there's no guilt about the emotional and physical abuse she inflicted upon us and our father, or about the constant lies and manipulation she still attempts upon us now.

She'd have to make some serious amends for the wrong she's done.

Randi,

No way Jose.  If she recovered tomorrow. I would rather take a bullet!  I have grown so much as a man during this marriage and separation and divorce.  I deserve much better than someone who hates herself.  No more being a caretaker!  I am going to take care of my daughter, (age 12) and maybe someday think about a partner/mate. She will burn in hell next to her father who abused her.  She has a responsibility to get over it, and she won't do it.

However,


I would enjoy the opportunity to meet you one day and give you a hug!

Rich

My immediate, off-the-cuff reaction is that I would feel cheated somehow, or maybe not interested in the person.  Not, I think,  because I want someone sick, but because I wanted to share the gradual experience of change, and to change myself in the process.  A suddenly recovered person would not be the same person, and in some ways no different from anyone else I might meet.  I'd have to get to know her all over, and see if I liked her, and even then I wouldn't necessarily have the same experience of shared self-discovery. I had an idea of how the relationship would progress, and overnight recovery was not part of that idea.

On second thought, if she really recovered tomorrow I'd like to meet her and see if we could make it work.

That is, if she Really recovered.

B2

Randi,

In your book you mentioned that IF the BPD in your life would take responsibility for her problem, most nons would take them back.  I'd probably be one of them.  That is a really big IF, though.  so I think I'm on the right path out of Oz.

The reason for this phenomena is that relationships, any relationships, get STRONGER after working through adversity, no matter what it is.  Anyone that has lived with a BPD knows adversity, of that there is no doubt.  When there was an honest recovery/healing between the rages, what you might call re-engaging, I got stronger, could put up with more, (which she no doubt took advantage of).  Setting boundries and sticking to them, getting out of the isolation, and having her in my life again.  She does have her good points... .somewhere.

As I said... .a BIG 'IF'. 

What color are the clouds in your sky?

Thank you for the book and this site,

Dan

If this is out of line tell me.  I would eat a live 5-pound frog if it would cure my wife's BPD.  Serious.  She might leave me because she then would realize I'm not such a good catch after all, but at least the rages would be gone.  She might become just another nice friend I have, which isn't so very bad.  I'll take friend over rages any day.

I am sad to say that I would take her back in a heartbeat. Take the BPD out of the BPD and she would be the woman of my dreams.  The interesting question is what will there be after the BPD is gone.  Will she be that dream girl without it?  I still can't even get my mind around the fact that all of the behaviors are the result of an illness and not the person.  But I love her still (three months separated after living together for 2.5 years).

I would be happier than a pig in sh@@t!  Seriously, it would perhaps be the greatest miracle to occur in my life.  I would get on in life with my wife.  We would do things much as normal couple do, travel, just simply have fun and enjoy all the things that we have never been able to to - very much in part due to her BPD and associated "issues".  Forgiving the past would be quite easy - it is, after all, an illness.  She did not choose to become this way any more than someone who gets a physical ailment.  We have no children (and its a bit late in our lives to start) , but quite frankly my wife would get a lot more attention from me than in the past.  I think of all the times I have gone running (literally and figuratively) just to get out of the house and some breathing room - these times would go away.  Perhaps I might be able to get some breathing room for myself as well, and be allowed to grow as myself - not for what is expected of me.  Its great to wonder "what if" ... .but now its back to reality and what is.

Hi Randy,

I moved out about seven weeks ago. If she were to recover, fully and totally, I would want to go back. I would have to continue working on myself though. It would be short-sighted to blame everything that occurred on her behaviour and I would not stop seeing my therapist for work on my boundaries and how I take responsibility for other people's emotions.

I have learned where I need to work on myself and if I can continue to do so, then I would go back. Whether that would be a wise decision I cannot say. But we do have a 20 month old toddler, a house together and when her behaviour has been less BPD we have had wonderful times.


Chris

My life was a living hell. There was NO peace 2 months after we moved in together. If he would recover from whatever mental illness this truly is, the damage is done. The suicidal threats and threatening to kill me crapped our honeymoon stage. You can't really get that back or the other moments he turned to sh!t. We were both married once before and I've heard comments about his alcohol consumption ruining his life and he managed to destroy this one too because of it. He has betrayed me countless times. Never seemed to stick up for me. It was all about him and his feelings. After you separate you get to deal with your own bitterness and anger towards them and the loss of the person you thought them to be. If he could be cured tomorrow, I would have had the greatest love of my life but unfortunately he is a very damaged man.

But hypothetically speaking: If our BPD's recovered tomorrow we could have one big wedding blowout! If they were the person we thought they were when we first met them half of us wouldn't be separated or divorced. It was over before it began. I choose being happy over being someones 24/7 caregiver. There was no HAPPY, just crappy. I had to get out of the quicksand before I sank.

There is highly NO chance for recovery. They can't even have a good, normal conversation. How unhealthy for a normal mind to struggle with them and their issues. Recovery would mean forgiving them and 'I' am not recovered enough to do that.

Broken,

hear hear!

Chris

I am still able to see a good person in my BPDh. If it were not for the disorder, he would be a great husband. We've been married for 22 years, but he is extremely difficult to live with, exhibiting some level of all 9 BPD criteria.

If he recovered tomorrow:

He would not have abandonment issues and all they entail.

He would be able to develop stable relationships that don't involve splitting.

He would have an improved sense of who he is and who he wants to be.

He would be less impulsive in terms of finance and sex.

He would be less inclined toward suicidal thoughts.

He would be less anxious and irritable.

He would have an opportunity to feel self-fulfillment.

He would no longer have inappropriate anger and rages.

He would no longer suffer from paranoia and misplaced jealousy.

Gee... .this sounds like the kind of man I could spend the rest of my life with.

Too bad that he has no insight into his problem.

spam

Spam, good insight into the turmoil. No wonder I'm exhausted! I never looked at the flip side of the illness and all its terrible components. The worst part is they DON'T SEE IT and if they do, it's still somehow made to be your fault. It's such a shame that mine admits he knows somethings wrong with him but still projects that I'm the one with the problem. The sad part is reading your list and realizing there are guys out there without these issues... .I was married before and he didn't have any of these issues... .he was a workaholic but the relationship was fairly good for the first 5 years before work was more important than family. Calm, not too many arguments, easy to talk to. A relationship with a BPD is like sacrificing your inner self and everything you are. It's hard to comprehend how complicated things really are until I read a post as yours Spam. To wait around for him to be one day 'cured' seems humorous to me in a not so funny way. Where the hell do you begin since he's been this way 'forever'. How come I feel so 'drained' even after being separated for 7 months. My ex told me last week it feels like I abandoned him. That word just was another to add to the BPD sayings pot. I can make one crazy stew. They really take the life and happiness out of you even from a distance. I hate this illness and what it took from me.

In 3 years of knowing him, not once has he took me to look at a sunset or simple pleasures in life. Everything is just depression and hell, how I criticized him or about wanting to die.

If he recovered tomorrow and realized life was good, I would go home in a heartbeat. But it's too much of a struggle for him. He is in constant conflict with himself to see the light at the end of the tunnel. What a waste of energy and love.

recovered tomorrow:  well then she would be the woman i would want to spend the rest of my life with however i think that this question should be "what if you and your bp recoverd tomorrow" the reason for this is after reading on here and swoe i have figured out that i am a 5-10 240lbs broken down man with the self confidence of a 14yo right now.  I need to work on me no matter what.  I love my wife and yern to spend time with HER not her evil twins(yes there are multiaple).  I love her so much its astounding eaven to me but my beleif still enlies in the vows i took and i am trying to deal with how to live on my own and raise two kids on my own after she leaves.  If she leaves

If he recovered none of us would know how to relate to him. We are used to avoiding certain subjects, wondering what he's up to, working around his issues that we would be out of balance. He has done fairly well for the past few weeks and since I'm not used to him being nice, I really don't know how to accept his kindness graciously. I keep wondering why he is acting nice... .what's coming. Isn't that sad? If his healing does continue, we will have to re-train our responses and thoughts in relating to him. I would have to let him back into my heart again, leave myself open and vulnerable again and I don't know if my mind will let me do that. I'm kind of un-attached right now - I feel like a bit player in a movie while he is seeing a T and trying to get better. I'm not at the point where I can let my defenses down.

Puddin

Randi,

I may not be the best to speak to this issue ... .because in retrospect ... .my experience is not as long lasting as others on bpdfamily.  I was only with her for a year ... .I fell madly for her ... .we got engaged ... .moved in together  ... .and I got out after to many fights and rages ... .begged her to go to counseling with me ... .to no avail.  Anyway ... .I do not have years and years of pain in OZ.  But enough ... .and researched enough to feel bad for her ... .and forgive what happened in the past. 

If she were cured tomorrow ... .I would probably hug her ... .congratulate her on her achievement ... .

And then make very intimate, slow, passionate love to her ... .to show what she has missed ... .and that sex is not to control or manipulate someone ... .but a very intimate sharing connection between two people.

Randi, my husband went through recovery a few years ago.  We now communicate differently.  We interact differently.  We argue differently.  We love differently. We play differently. 

Would I do the things I put off?  I rarely put off what I wanted to do even before he went into recovery.  The difference now, though,is that he no longer has a "hizzy fit" about it.

How would relationships with family change?  This changed A LOT. I used to lean heavily on my family of origin, on my friends, and on our daughter. They held me up during the tough times. I know it irritated my husband that I sometimes put everyone else before him.  I did it because I knew I could count on everyone BUT him.  Everyone else's behavior (unlike his) was predictable.   He wasn't a pleasant person to be in the same room with, the same car with, or the same universe with.

Now that my he has recovered, the relationship dynamic has shifted... .a lot!  I love our daughter and admire her commitment to getting her counseling license.  BUT, if I am in a position to go somewhere with her (she moved away from home 4 1/2 years ago) or with my hubby, I choose my hubby 9 times out of 10.   This is a big adjustment for our daughter. We used to be "friends", and now we are becoming what we should be . . . mother and daughter.  And I still see friends quite often, but I no longer crave the interaction with them like I used to.  I used to spend hours on the phone talking with friends, but I no longer pick up the phone to call them.  In fact, about the only person I interact with by phone anymore is an "old" Nook friend.  :-*   

Would other family members get more attention? No, now my husband gets most of my attention because I now enjoy his company.

He used to tell me (before recovery) that I cared about everyone else more than him.  Although I denied it, my actions probably spoke louder than words.  Now, since his recovery, we both KNOW he ranks at the top of my list... .and he works hard to stay there. 

Randi,

"What if" questions about the impossible are fantastical. If my BPD recovered tomorrow, I simply wouldn't trust it. I have experienced too many black to white overnight changes. I hope you don't waste ink on this topic.

A more valid question to ask us NONS is "What would you do if, tomorrow, your BPD recognized that they had BPD symptoms (or even that things were vaguely amiss in their thinking and responses) and they wanted to do whatever it took for recovery."

If you start a new thread (hopefully in all forums) with that question, I would love to think and write about it.

With gratitude and fondness,

Wil

I agree and think that their would be a lot less failed relationships if the BPD's took responsibility and figured this one out.

Both horrible and wonderful moments shared with a BPD are characterized by their intensity.

Recovering from BPD means loosing intense bad moments as well as loosing intense wonderful ones... .

Thus, and to be honnest, I don't think that I could share my life with my ex, without these very intense moments... .Intensity characterized our relationship.

However, I've learned from the suffering associated with the back and forth between the all-good, all-bad, that such intensities are unhealthy, no matter the side of the scale... .

I hope that next time, life will be more quiet.

But this will be with another person.

I would think it was just another re-engagement.  I would pinch myself everyday that her splitting was delayed.  I would be watching for the split, just around the corner - maybe with a slightly carefree comment I make.  I would be amazed that 'being myself' around her could actually last more than a couple days... .that I could forget about the eggshells... .

I would thank God everyday.

Sadly, reality tells me something different. 

Thanks for the fantasy of the "what if"... .it's a nice dream. 

Randi,

I've not been as much on bpdfamily as before . . . but I check in. I've taken myself out of that situation and moved on to have healthier thinking people in my life . .

If my BP really recovered . . and in no way would it be tomorrow . ... I was very commited to working on things for a long time, but because I had to draw the line and not be part of it anymore, if he ever really recovered, We'd be able to have healthy conversations. . . We could be friends. He made it very clear when we were together that it's not possible to have platonic opposite sex friends, so with him now I can't.

In the long run .  . . if people with BP recover, I do believe that some form of relationships can be repaired/continued.

Also from what I've learned here, recovery is possible! It is soo fully up to them! I've also learned that many of us that get entangled with that type of personality, have also gone through much of the abusive stuff that got them there. . .  Some of us are caretakers .  . .

I have a lot of compassion for those with BP and other personality disorders, but also what about us that are affected? They have issues because of deep reasons .  . .I do see this, but what about the stuf that puts on us? That's not what you are asking .  . but . . In my personal opinion, maybe ask also for your books, What major effect has this kind of personality had in our lives?

Thank you.

If my ex would recover, I would probably not recognise her.

She would not be the same person I once knew and loved.

I am pretty sure, IF I would fall in love with her again, I would trigger the same behaviour again.

For my two:

J, Little Bit's dad; He really has put our whole family through the ringer.  If he recovered tomorrow, if this was just something out of the blue and I didn't know it was permanent, I think I would end up having a nervous breakdown waiting for the crazy to come back.  I have shunted away my feelings for him so deeply, I don't think I could allow myself to feel them again for fear of being crushed in disappointment again.  Before I was able to break it off with him, get him out of my home, I made myself become numb to his abuse.  Even when he was nice to me, I wouldn't let myself feel joy because I knew it wouldn't last and it was always only because he wanted something.  Emotionally I was the walking dead.  If I didn't do this, I think I would be crazy right now.  I never want to live like that again.  It wasn't living.  I would always be waiting.

If I knew for sure it was permanent, I wouldn't be able to get over the past but I think I could begin to trust that he would be a responsible parent to the kids.  It would make things easier in that respect.  That is the only reason I still try to work with him now, the kids.

Little Bit's mom could just go rot in hell for all I care.  She nearly starved her daughter to death and she allowed her to be sexually abused.  I don't care what changes she makes in her life from now until her last breath, her daughter suffered and may always suffer.  There's no making up for that.

I think most are shell-shocked.  That's like asking if a soldier would go back and visit a country were he once fought.  Too much damage, no trust, all the innocence is gone.  The memories of the pain I experienced would never go away, they cut far too deep

If the BP in my life recovered, my prayers would finally be answered.  I would definitely want a life with him.  We would both see "color" again instead of black and white.  It would be one of the happiest days of my life.

I can't imagine what it would mean for my expwN/BPD to recover.

So that means he has no black/white thinking?

No need for narcissistic supply?

No Narcissistic injury?

No issues with engulfment fears?

No abandonment fears?

Etc...

If you mean he would actually have some traits, however, just a "normal" amount of traits...

Then what is a normal amount?

We all have traits of something... .to some degree.  (NPD, HPD, BPD, DPD, etc)

Who is measuring?  How do we measure this?

How do you strip a person of these traits when these traits make up their personality?

It is like trying to strip the wind of motion.  (Maybe there is a better analogy)

I like thinking about this. If my SO were to recover I would be so thrilled. It would mean that she would not be in so much daily pain and  would have a better life. Not everything would be a struggle for her.  I would love to see that. And we would be able to have healthy interactions and share the good things that life is all about.

I have never thought about this.

If my wife recovered, would she apologize for 25 years of abuse? 

What would that even look like? Recovery.

If she finally had the capacity to know what it feels like to be normal, I would tell her think about what she had put me through, and when she was done with that, to go F_-K herself and divorce her.

What is hardest for me in trying to muster the will to leave is the knowledge that she has an illness / disease.  A chronic, incurable disease.  If she was cured miraculously, I would leave.

Simple.

Surg_Bear

If my uBPDhusband recovered tomorrow, I would have considerably less stress in my daily life, and therefore fewer flares of my Rheumatoid Arthritis.

Our social life would improve as I would no longer be wary/embarrassed of inviting others to our home, b/c then home repairs projects would actually get completed and his behaviours would not be raising eyebrows.

We would have more conversations and less tantrums/silent periods. We would have more sharing of affection and intimacy because he would be bathing/taking care of his hygiene.

I would have better sleep as he would no longer be excalating at my bedtime. I would be better rested overall as he would  no longer practice intentional antagonism.

I would actually get to use the TV remote to watch my programs from time to time, fairly, b/c he would not be co-opting the remote all the time.

We would have more decisions negotiated as he would not be a control freak.

My sister and brother would notice he no longer minimizes me and actually might start liking him again.

But, I expect to see a pig flying first.

I can say it would take a while for me to actually trust that she "recovered".  And once I did actually trust it, I would:

- be happier, and live with less fear

- have more money

- have more free time

- see friends more often

- start a family

- get back involved in my hobbies.

BPD is really sucking the life out of me right now.  

I should add, the above would also be true if the r/s were to end.

If my wife recovered tomorrow, I would be ecstatic, yet cautious for a while.  It would take some time to get over the constant pressure and fear of the next time she dysregulates.  I would be excited about the future again.