BPDFamily.com

Ok folks, most of you may not know me. Ive been here for over a year, and at one time was a very active poster. But for now, I primarily read. I see alot of things going on here, alot of questions about what, why, and how Personality Disorders affect our life. Id like to open a discussion on what YOU have learned about YOURSELF, and what your role was in all of this. After all, it takes two to tango, and we all, at one point or another, put up with too much, or stayed for the wrong reasons. You see, there is something in us nons that is dying to come out. There is a void in every one of us that needs to be filled. It is what kept us in the relationship, and it is what hurt us so bad when it goes bad.

I have been out for 16 months now. I have been to therapy, read countless books, stayed on this board for way too long at times. I was depressed, and couldnt eat, sleep, or work. I was looking for the answer, the truth, the lesson in it all. I am in a good place now, and I see alot of people that need help. So here is your chance to learn, help others learn, and heal. Here is a chance to grow.

Lets start off by saying what you have learned about yourself and your role in this dysfunctionship.

I definitely had some codependency going on.  Prior to the relationship with a BPD, I was in a 8 year, unfulfilling marriage.  Stayed in that too long.  Stayed too long in with the BPD.  Other people's needs ahead of my.  A Sufferer.  Got used and cheated on (probably both times).  Separated from marriage in Oct 07, ended the intense relationship with the BPD in March 08.  Two losses in a year.  (Plus the BPD attempted suicide post break up.  I should be a basket case.)

I also figured out...with my T...that I have a problem with soft emotions.  I still haven't cried.  I've grieved a bit...but no tears have flowed.  Im not as concerned with this issue...Im really working on some things and moving on.

I was vulnerable during the separation - far more than I admitted to myself at the time - the BPD relationship supplied validation and self esteem (and much needed sex).  Unfortunately, the intimacy wasn't really there...I think I became addicted to this false intimacy and validation.  And sex.  Thats the hardest part about the post break up.

All that points out to the fact that I was not aware of my boundaries OR I totally ignored the weak boundaries I had.  I know my boundaries.

Finally...if it weren't for the relationship with the BPD...I would have never embarked on this self improvement.  I know so much more about myself:

What are my goals;  What do I want from life

What are my core values

What are my interests

What are my strengths;  What are my vulnerabilities

I am beginning a new relationship right now.  Its with me.  Im connecting with my emotions, my psyche, my intellect and my body.  Astonishing to say this...but because of a BPD...Im a much better person.   Hmmm.  No.  Because of how I responded to the end of a relationship with a BPD, I am a better person.  I'll take ownership.

Great first response mtn, and thank you. Id love to hear more like this.

You see, there is something we are all looking for in these relationships. There is something we all need out of life, and we are looking to others to give it to us. In all actuality, the answers reside in us. That is where we missed the boat, and we jumped ship. Our answers to all of our questions lie within ourselves, but we look to others to answer them for us. That is why we are all devastated by these things.

BPD/NPD/APD/HPD are all titles. In the spectrum of life, as it involves each of us, they are nothing more than a teacher to educate us (hopefully) as to what we are doing. All of these disordered people are people nontheless, and are capable of being loving beings, but are also capable of hurting us tremendously. We give them permission to hurt us. We believe in them more than we believe in ourselves. We fold into their lives, and we give up our own. It is a recipe for disaster.

There has never been a more true statement than this: Pain is the act of giving yourself over to someone else, and being dissapointed in what returns.

I agree on all accounts.  I had problems going into the relationship with the BPD.  She didnt create them...they were there.  She mighta exploited them.

The intensity of the relationship and all that happened - the denial of red flags, the supplication...the devalueing of my self esteem...Those happened in my marriage...but so subtley.  The relationship with the BPD burned so intensely that after the relationship evaporated, the light remained and shone on my issues. 

It was helpful to read here on these boards that we nons HAD a role in the relationship.  We go through the stages of recovering from the relationship - learn all we can about BPD, then turn to introspection (and grief, anger and acceptance).  I think this was the turning point for me.  Looking inward.

My role in the relationship

• I had self doubt in myself and thought she was right.



• I stayed for a long time for the children but it only got worst for all.



• I waited and waited thinking she would grow up and out of it.



• I enabled her more and more by avoiding conflict.



• I spent more time trying to understand her than myself.



• I avoided feeling hurt when I really was hurting.

What have I found out about myself

• I have a right and desire to be happy.



• I cannot change how other people feel, we must do it ourselves.



• I am my own best friend and didn’t realize it.



• I am a giving and loving person that others appreciate.



• I can live independently and enjoy it.



• I can do things by myself and enjoy what I do.



• I can change, adapt and be accepting of others for who they are.



• I am stronger and control my life now.

LA

Haven't been at this long, but as the FOG begins to clear (it will be a long process, I know)...

I participated by doing the following:

I let his intellectual abilities make me believe that he knew what was best for me and even what was inside my head.  I don't believe in mind reading, yet I believed he could get inside my head, and, in a lot of ways, he succeeded.  He's out now!

I let myself be drawn into the rage at least as a participant, if not an instigator.  I thought if I just explained myself better, it would make sense to him.  Nothing rational makes sense to him.

I unfailingly trusted everything he did and said about everything.  No one knows it all about everything. 

When I felt a twinge about something, like: "Something isn't right about this," I  (see directly above statement)

I ignored my gut.  Your gut is there for a reason.

I thought that, in the name of love and honor, I had to give up a great part of myself if it seemed necessary.

It should have never seemed necessary.  Nothing and no one should ever make you do that.

I thought that "what God put together, no one should put asunder."  God also gives us choices.  H chose to put it asunder by not listening to my pain and getting help when begged and it is my choice not to hang around and let him continue to hurt me.

Oh, there is so much more inside, but this is all I can take right now.  My heart is getting raw.

Again, just starting, but so far I have already learned that:

There's a person inside me that hasn't come out for a very long time.  She's ready.

The very things that he touted as my faults are actually my greatest strengths.

A good brain does not indicate the presence of a heart.  They are 2 different organs!

Beautiful sentiments on cards do not ensure that the feelings stated actually exist.  They are only words on paper.

Even someone who tries to see the best in people must, at some point, try to see what is actually there, or not.

You can fall in love with an illusion, or what you wanted so badly to be there.  I just did and it just wasn't.

There are a lot of bad things that happened to my H that I had nothing to do with.  I just accepted that he was right when he said I did.  That was a huge mistake.

I do not ever want to be someone's "project" again.  Even though I hope to always grow, I'm fine just like I am.

Marriage is not supposed to be a roller coaster with death defying (you hope) drops.  It can be just an interesting, if challenging, ride.

I'm worth a whole lot more than I've gotten from my H.  And I'm not a bad person for believing this.

And, I'm finding out that I am a whole lot stronger than I ever thought I could be.

I AM NOT A VICTIM ANYMORE!

Enough for tonight!

I’ll start with how we got together… I am the Poster Child for a Daddy’s Girl. My dad passed away when I was 22. At the beginning of our relationship, I spoke often about Daddy. Psycho Man mirrored my father. When I was with PM, I felt that same sort of safe, loving, affection that I had from Daddy.

My role in the relationship?

•   I was ashamed of my past and thought I could make things right this time around.

•   I allowed him to get in my head space and play on my insecurities.

•   I pushed friends and family aside in order to prove he could trust me.

•   I bought into the things he said were wrong with me because I equated his opinion with that of my Daddy’s.

•   I wanted to prove I could make a marriage work.

What I have learned about myself?

•   I do not need a man in my life to be whole

•   I do not need a man in my life to be whole

•   God loves me despite all I have done in my past

•   My children love me despite my human mistakes

•   It’s okay to give up and move on

•   I do not need a man in my life to be whole

•   No one will ever be able to replace my Daddy

•   My Mom DOES love me and IS there for me

•   I do not need a man in my life to be whole (Sorry, but this is a biggie!)

•   I am a compassionate person and need to not keep my heart walled up, just be cautious with it

•   I have a great capacity for love that I never knew existed

•   Although I have done horrid things over the years, in essence I am good

•   I do not need a man in my life to be whole

There are some other things I have learned concerning my weight and sex that I am not ready to talk about in an open forum. But let’s just say, although this relationship has been extremely traumatic and frightening for me, I am glad it happened. I HAVE learned so much about myself over the last 6 months that I probably never would have learned had I not married PM.

Chili


PS - SS - YOU GO GIRL!

I'm tempted to pull quotes from others' posts because they resonate, but I guess that wouldn't really be my personal inventory.

My participation:

1) I offered, and way too early in the relationship, to support her while she was in school.  It set me up to support her indefinitely.

2) I ignored T when she warned me of the above

3) I/we moved way too fast.  Spent the night on date 2 (no sex, just spent the night), then for the next 2 consecutive nights.  Proposed and moved in within 3 months and started supporting her.

4) Poured my heart out way too early - talked about previous crazy ex on date 1.

5) Didn't assert myself or my needs.  I was always more concerned with what she needed and wanted, and voluntarily put my own on a shelf to see to hers.

6) Was vocal about the above - she knew I put her needs above mine and would neglect myself for her.

7) Was too forgiving.  I didn't want to see the manipulation so I excused it.

8 ) Didn't enforce, or really maintain, boundaries

What I learned:

1) I was/am not as healthy as I thought

2) I still have a lot of unresolved anger and pain from my mother and earlier relationships.

3) Better than bad does not make it good

4) My past should make me less, not more, forgiving.

5) Pay attention to the "small stuff" - it's what the "big stuff" is made of.

6) I have friends that truly love me and will go to great lengths for me.  I already knew this, but was reminded.

I'll probably think of more once I have some coffee in me.

Also, I second Chili's PS. :)

Quick...I have watched a transformation in you and in myself over the last year or so...I can now look at my situation much more objectively...as much as I would love to blame him for everything, I know I cannot.  I allowed someone else to steer my ship of life, I allowed it...I had the controls and I turned them over...why, why would I do such a stupid stupid thing?  Was it my upbringing? My experiences, the lack of any really good male role models in my life...was it my exhaustion from always being the strong one, the one who handled everything?  I may never truly know all the reasons...but, I know this:

My role in the relationship?

•   I had been alone a long time and in a bad emotional place when we got together, I was not ready and should have known it, taken my time and waited, listened, watched for the red flags.

•   I settled...for so much less than I deserved, because it was still better than my past.

•   I ignorned my gut instincts about him and his negativity - NEVER IGNORE YOUR GUT!

•   I allowed him to get in my head space and play on my insecurities.

•   I pushed friends and family aside because of his behaviors

•   I wanted really badly to prove I could make a marriage work (to myself and others)

•   I really wanted/needed to be loved and let that overshadow all else to the detriment of myself and my children

What I have learned about myself?

•   I need to truly love me before anyone else can

•   I had/have alot of past hurts that still have not fully healed...working on this...

•   Eliminating the toxic people from my life is very important. - I need new friends...positive people who bring positive energy into my world.

•   I must be grateful for every moment, every single thing in my life that brings me joy, makes me think, nurtures my inner child...

•   My children love me despite my mistakes and I them despite their's...

•   I am a compassionate person and need to TRY not keep my heart walled up, just be cautious with it

•   I am worthy of love, just have not found the right person to experience it with.

•   I am the captain of my ship and the master of my destiny...it is in my hands and I need to make the most of it.

Over the past two years here I have started to become who I am truly meant to be, it is taking alot of work and I still have my down days...I'm lonely, very lonely sometimes...I hurt...and as much as I try to stuff that hurt down instead of "feeling" it...I know I must feel it in order to move on, it is a neccesary part of the process.

Damn you quick... :'(

There's probably alot more but, this is all I can handle right now...

Oh hell yeah..

Elphie xoxo

First of all, thank you so much for this topic.  I learn so much hearing from others.  I usually come on here during my lunch hour and this is like a "meeting" to me, ("Hello, I'm Patti and I'm a codependent/overeater/obsessive compulsive/exspouse of a BPD" It really helps keep me on track.

My role/participation:

1.  I never realized what a wounded inner child I had.  I grew up in a chaotic household, with a mother who was probably BPD and my relationship with Ex was two sided: I was trying to "fix" my brother, who was the black sheep of the family, and I also thought I didn't deserve anyone better.

2.  I was a perfect martyr.  I begged, pleaded, nagged, cajoled, etc., but Ex would just stand there like a stick in the mud and eventually, he won - I would just do whatever to get past the argument. And I reveled in my martyrdom because it erroneously "built" my self esteem.

3.  I encouraged him to do what he wanted and avoid responsibility- things like "oh, I know we need the money, but don't take that second job because I would rather you have a relationship with the kids" - then I would pinch pennies, take on ANOTHER part time job, wear old shabby clothes and live in a terrible run down house. And his relationship with the kids was horrible (as they tell me now).

4.  I allowed him to continue with bad behavior way too long.  I expected NOTHING from him and that's what I got.  And I never realized this until I got out and looked back at what a shmuck he was. Even when other people told me he was.

5.  I underestimated what a nasty, vindictive person he could be - when I made him leave, he was apparently in cahoots with his father (the meanest, nastiest, most vindictive person on the planet) behind my back - the man who ruined him, beat him, humiliated him - they tag teamed me. Sick, but true.

6.  I superglued my rose colored glasses to my head, ignored my instincts until they disappeared, disregarded my family and friends - all in the name of "believing" in him, supporting him, etc.  It's amazing to hear what my friends and my kids REALLY thought and what REALLY happened behind my back (and most likely in front of my face, but I was too blind to see.

7.  I allowed shame and guilt and fear to handicap me - I put it all on myself when others really didn't see me that way.

What I have learned about myself. . .

1.  With God's help, I can survive - I can be strong and honest and not crippled by shame or guilt.  I can get up in the morning and look at myself in the mirror and see a good person who isn't perfect, but likes herself.

2.  I am stronger that BPD Ex AND his evil twit of a father, the both of whom are the poster boys for The Man Behind The Curtain.

3.  I haven't damaged my kids as much as I thought I had - and that if I had stayed with their father, they would not have reached their full potential. They are both in emotionally healthy relationships and have decent jobs and great futures.

4.  I can get totally crushed until debt twice, but I have the work ethic to put my head down and resolve the problem.  I don't get frightened that it's bill collectors when the phone rings.  I don't live in fear when I go to get the mail anymore. I can support myself and help my kids and even spend a few bucks on myself only (WITHOUT GUILT OR FEAR).

5.  I am learning to connect to my inner child, that little girl who grew up smiling no matter what but feeling terrified inside.  I am learning to nurture her the way I nurtured my own kids and to help her heal.  I keep a picture of myself at about age 5 in my wallet so I won't forget about her.

6.  I have learned to take care of myself.  About four months ago, I went to the dentist for the first time in over 14 years.  I get regular checkups and take my meds, exercise, eat more sensibly. 

7.  I am working on getting my instincts back. It's like they have been storched to the ground.  I have no instincts now so I rely on a few people around me that have only my best interests at heart. And hopefully I will get them back gradually.

8.  I forgive myself for whatever I did, and also for blaming myself for everything I could not control and fix. I realize that now and work actively at it.

Elphaba wrote about finally "feeling". The downside is that I don't stuff my feelings any more, piling food on top of them.  So I feel them and that's scary, but I keep telling myself I can handle it. And if I feel the bad stuff and can handle it, then the good stuff is the icing on the cake.  I like the "satisfied" happy feelings that I get. 

Just bumping this thread back up...for anyone who is ready to look at these things in themselves, it really does help to post your perspective as of today and take inventory of your role in the dance and where you are now...

So, C'mon...this is a very productive and healthy exercise...

You know folks, you can only do a couple of things once you plop yourself onto your seats and log onto this website.

1) You log on with the hope of learning all you can about these disorders, and changing things in your life to try to minimize and accomodate the disordered person in your life. But, then we would have to write a book titled "Advanced walking on eggshells." This would be enabling you, and not helping you. It would be like taking a person on fire, and instead of teaching them to stop, drop, and roll, we would all have individual bottles of lighter fluid, and as you passed by, we would give you a little squirt.

2) You could log onto this site and try to host your own pity party because of what your disordered person did to you, and how wonderful you are, and just how wrong it all was..ect...ect...ect. But you know, after the hour-derves we gone, most people would leave your party, and you would be there all alone. Kinda resembles most of us as we chose a username and password onto this site. It would distract you for awhile, but you cant run from the inevitable. There are things to deal with.

3) You could even log on, and stare in denial at the screen saying to yourself, "This isnt my life, Im going to be different." If this is you, please write down your username and password, and store it in a place that you remember. It will save you the time of reposting an initial post.

4) You could log on, learn what you can about the disordered, and finally realize that maybe it wasnt all their fault. After all, it was you that put up with all the lies, all the manipulation, all the deceit, and all the abuse. Did I say that? Could we actually have a part in all of this madness? The answer is yes.

You know, we laugh and joke here, and we try to help each other, but all we are, are really people who share a traumatic bond. We are all hurt and belittled to the point of reaching out to total strangers. Strangers that we instantly recognize that get us. People that understand, unlike the friends in our day to day life. People, who because of our nature, and capacity to love, are here for others.

Ill share with you something that may be shocking to some, but alot of you have entertained it in your minds. These "disordered" people that brought us here, are in fact people. They are terribly different than us, but they are people who do have feelings, pains, fears, and emotions. But, for whatever reason, they dont know how to use them, or control them like we have. It is because of their experiences and lives, that they are the way they are. It is our experiences and lives that have molded us into the people we are. Ive tried, unsuccessfully, to change myself to accept the treatment, and abuse, but in the end, it didnt work out, and I was crushed.

As my time went on here, I realized alot. Between this board, and therapy, and a few books, I began to realize that my desire to change her was about as effective as her chance of changing me. We are who we are, and there is not one of us that can change another. We may be able to influence, but change can only occur by the person desiring a change and working on themselves to do it. It isnt something we can do for another, even if we love them. If you love someone, set them free, if they love you, they will return. This phrase is really appropriate, but not for the reasons we think.

If you love someone, set them free. This used to mean that if I let her go, and she came back, then it meant that she loved me. Oh lord, how naive of me. She came back alright, about 6 times. She must have loved me alot huh? If you love yourself, set yourself free. We all set ourselves free at the beginnings of our relationship. We set ourselves free of clear thinking, rational thought processes, and respect. Thats perfectly ok. Its what we all do in the beginning of relationships. We put ourselves out there, and we let go of ourselves to make room to hold on to the person we love. But, after the relationship progresses, the person that returns to us is not the person we were. We become insecure, frightened, confused, baffled, and bitter. Not quite the person we let go of in the beginning. Is it? If they love you, they will return. If the person you were is allowed to perpetuate in the relationship, that person has returned, and that is a good indication that your partner loves you.

What im trying to get to in this round table is for you to openly, and honestly look at the person you were before the relationship, and then look at the person you were in it. Two completely different people? I know, I know, youre saying that they changed too, but in all reality, they didnt change, they just unmasked.

Actions VS words. If I could get everyone to follow this little phrase, it would be a different world. Hey, face it, we are all adults here. We all lie. Some more than others, and some are quite good at it. Some are master painters in the medium of untruths. It is life, for whatever different reason, if you have a pulse, you lie.

Now, what we dont realize, because we do it subconsciously, and everyday, is that our actions speak volumes, and we are never untrue to ourselves in our own actions. NOONE IS. We will all be true to ourselves in our actions, disordered, normal, or just plain stupid.

I challange you to look back at your relationship and remove from your memory banks everthing that was said to you. Every I love you, every I hate you. Every little detail about everything. Turn off the volume, and watch that movie like it was 1929. See it for only actions, not words. With the words removed, it is a different movie indeed. They, we, everyone can be judged solely on their actions. It is the lie detector of life. If a person says they would never steal anything, and you see them taking an ashtray from hooters, which is true? If a person says they love you, and would never harm you, then leaves you wondering where they are at 2AM and wont answer their cell phone, um, whats up with that? You know they are out.

I challange you to view any potential friends, or partners like that, and I bet if you do that, you will never be hurt again. But also, the key is loving yourself enough to care about yourself. That is something we all forgot. But Im sure, if you spend your time logged on here wisely, you will find the road to doing just that.

PDQ - my dear you have such a lovely way with words.  I could not agree more with your analysis of the situation and the role that we - the nons - play in the mess that comes with BPD.

Something you said made me think of this:

'tis better to have loved and lost than to have never loved at all. (or something close to that).

No matter how much we love someone and how healthy the relationship, there will be pain - one would hope that it is at a minimum.  It is when we recognize that we have a choice in how much pain we will allow in our lives are we able to remove ourselves from the horrendous pain that someone with BPD presents to us.

You are a dear, sensitive, and insightful man.  You are a gift.   :-*

PDQ, I second Oy's sentiments.  elphaba, thanks for bumping this.

Who was I before?  Briefly -

I was disordered.  I had been on meds for my Bi-polar for less than a year, and had only recently stabiized on them and truly understood the importance of taking them consistently.  I resisted medication, and continued to passively-aggressively resist it once I "accepted" that I needed it.

I was confused.  I had just moved out of the house I shared with my Bff.  I had become (no, must be honest with self.  was becoming increasingly ) confused and disordered while living her, and tried very hard to make our relationship into something it never could have, or should have, been.

I was codependent, and still am.  But at the time I was a lonely codependent.  And isolated.

*coffee break - will return with more later*

I was grieving.  I had lost my father less than a year earlier, and anly after his death come to the realization that I had falsely accused him.  He died the day I asked him to come to T with me.  I still had the images of cleaning his apartment fresh in my mind (he died in the tub and was not found for two+ days).  I was still wrestling with enormous guilt, anger, shame, and humiliation.  And I was still trying to understand what T meant when she said "HE never touched you."  Those words are burned into my memory forever.

I was on my own for the first time.  I lived alone, didn't have a trust fund, and had to actually work to support myself, pay my own bills, plan meals and buy groceries just for me, come home to myself, wake up with myself, etc.  It was freeing, but it was also scary and lonely.

That's as far as I can go right now.  I'll work on it more later though.

PD Quick, thanks for your observations.  I have printed out some of them so I can read them again later (which is another thing I do with posts from this board).  I do realize that Ex is a person.  He was screwed over by his father, physically and emotionally abused, just like my mother did to me.  We were two wounded, horribly immature people trying to connect.

The difference is. . . I would NEVER have done to my children and my spouse what my mother did to me, no matter how screwed up I was.  I learned what it was like to be abused, to feel the

white-hot shame crawling up my face AGAIN, the pit in my stomach, the fear, the wanting to run away and hide in the closet feeling while chaos was swirling all around me.  I never wanted to feel that again (although I did with Ex) and I never wanted my kids to feel it.  I took the brunt of what happened so my kids didn't have to. And although I never had the strength to do it for myself because I didn't believe I deserved it, but at the beginning, when he turned on the kids, I protected them and when it got too bad, we broke free.  There was no way I would let him hurt them.

No. Thank you. People in life are like ice cream. There are so many flavors out there. Some are very similar, and some are at the opposite end of the taste spectrum. We spend our youth figuring out what we like and dont like out of our ice cream. Trouble is, we sometimes accept walnuts in it when we hate walnuts. Find that flavor you like, and dont settle until you have a big tub of it. Guarantee you, my next purchase will not have a nut in it! :)

PDQuick - no thank YOU!  :) Last night when I got home from work, my daughter was having some doubts about her relationship - this is the D that Ex took everything out on, totally tormented, stole her clothing and cross-dressed in it - humiliated her.  This was the kid that I nearly lost and she doesn't trust a soul.  Fast forward three years later and she is doing much better, but she has a practically perfect boyfriend that she still cannot trust.  I gave her your post and let her read about actions vs. words, and we discussed how this young man treats her (which is - like a queen, both in words and actions).  I told her that because of her history of men leaving her, she needs to affirm that she deserves a decent, loving man in her life and when she is in doubt, to look at his actions and judge them like an outsider (rather than letting her mistrust guide her).  I was so happy that I was able to have your post to show her because I think it really is starting to get inside her head.

That is the coolest thing I have read in a long time. Im so glad my experiences could help someone. That makes it all worth it, and congrats to her!

Okay.  Thanks, PDQ...nothing like a huge dose of truth to get the ball rolling.

I was down to my last dime, the rent was due in two weeks, business had dropped to almost nothing.  My daughter had bailed me out already, and I had asked everyone in my family (birth family - that took guts, believe me) to help me.  They did not.  There was no where to turn. 

(and thanks, BananaHead, for reiterating the problems with being bi-polar, because...)

my psychiatrist slowly...slowly overdosed me 500% -- really --, certain that my problems were due to not enough Rx.  I had been taking 25 mg and she raised it to 150 mg.  I was not sleeping, I was in pain, still, from the car wreck, and I had this insidious rash all over my body.

The one and only real relationship I thought I would ever have during this episode of imbalance went flat, and all I could think about was jumping out the picture window of my 2-story apartment.  It didn't feel like suicidal thoughts, just like the only natural course to take.  My bishop could not help me (he told me to pray).  But for the firm-footed friends here at this site, I may have bought the farm at that time.

I was exhibiting all the manic signs of bi-polar, and telling no one, with indiscriminate sex to tide me over until I could get through this, but it continued to only get worse, and the partners were strangers I never saw again...

...and then he showed up online.  Out of the blue.  He was funny.  He was so nice to me, and he was horny, and I started laughing again.  It felt so good to laugh.  He said I didn't have to be afraid any longer.  Within three months I was living with him.  He mentioned marriage (now denies it).  He wanted "forever anddever".  My bills were not getting paid because I was not working yet, but he said, "Honey.  I'm gonna take care of you.  You don't ever have to worry about that."

I would like to say I stopped worrying, but I didn't.  I had no health backup, and when my Rx ran out, I just quit taking it.  I  lived without meds for a year.

The worry never completely went away.  We had been living together for six months before his rage showed up -- just BAM! out of the blue, over something trivial.  He scared the ___ out of me, but I was stranded...maybe it really was something I did.  I didn't have a soul to talk to...and I was complaining again, if I did.  Where could I go?  I was still not working. 

I sold my car because he wanted to buy me a newer model when I finally established my first practice...HUGE MISTAKE.  He said I didn't need the old one.  It was my last link to my Self.

In our second year, when I realized I needed to be on meds and began taking them again -- at the originally prescribed dosage -- my head cleared. I could see and hear and feel and know...and acknowledged to my Self the truth of what I had done.  Coming here, to him, was my choice, made while I was manic and out-of-balance...

Could I make the best of it?  Could I be magnanimous and forgiving?  Could I try harder, work harder, forfeit my thoughts and my life?  After all, he had provided me with a home.  If I acted lovingly, I could love him.  And he would see how hard I was trying, and how dedicated I was to making this work.

Ugh.  Plain and simple I was practicing my own form of control.  I wanted a home.  I wanted someone who wanted to provide me with a home.  The price is too high. 

I cannot tell you about him.  He is a stranger to me.  The more healing I get under my belt, the more calm I am, the more successful I am in my practice...the more this goes to hell.

I have always needed someone to rescue me...or thought I did.  The White Knight syndrome.  I do not know what it is to have a relationship --even a friendship -- with a healthy male.

I would be screaming ouch! and enough! to all of  this, except that these conclusions have come to be slowly over the last six months; maybe more.

We went through a bout of serious health problems for him just before that, and anything I had been considering about leaving him got pushed aside.

That's all I've got.

Thanks for the opportunity to be real again.

xoxo

OhS

PDQ, I have been a mixture of all 4 of your perspectives.  I was desperate for the "advanced walking on eggshells" course, that would allow me to accomodate my uBPD SIL and salvage the relationship.  I thoroughly enjoy a bit of pity party- it's so nice to hear someone say she is awful and I am wonderful.  I did, at times, stare at the screen and say "This is not what's happening in my situation.  Surely it's not as bad as all that.  I can figure it out."  But I am perpetually logged in and I kept posting and reading and thinking and learning.  So after nearly six months (a solid six days 10 hrs. and 9 mins. of which have been spent on this board, according to my counter) I am mostly camping in #4.  Yes, she's got issues but I can't worry about that.  I need to figure out why I let this happen and what I need to change about myself.

So what was my part?  Here's a few, but by no means all, of the items.

--I was deceitful.  I lied to myself and I lied to her.  I told her things she did were ok when they weren't.  I told myself things she did were ok when they weren't.

--I wanted the level of connection in the friendship to be real.  I rag on her for being a bulldozer of intimacy, but when it was happening, I ate it up.  I felt special for being that kind of a "best friend".

--I willingly conformed to her expectations.  She didn't force me with magical voodoo power.  I made incremental choices to accomodate her until I was asking myself what she would think before I made a single move.

--I allied myself with her.  I like who and what she liked and hated who and what she hated.  At first I would challenge her perception, but eventually I stopped fighting.  Again, my choice.

These, and other things, are a reflection of my own underlying insecurity, need to be needed, and fear of rejection.  I have always defined myself through the approval of others.  It was working reasonably well when I was surrounded with mostly healthy people.  But my uBPD SIL came along and rocked my world to its foundation.  There is no doubt that she is ill.  But the combination of her illness and my weaknesses is what made this such a volitile situation.  BPD merely shined a spotlight on what I need to acknowledge and change about myself.

So I am learning to take responsibility for my own mental and emotional health.  I am learning to do just what you suggested, seperate what she said and did from what I said and did, and focus on my half.  Asking myself what I need to do differently in the future.  Learning to listen to my instincts and not give away my power.  Commiting to telling the truth, to myself and those around me.  Finding balance. 

 My mom was a borderline, before there was this dx. She raged, she threw stuff, she belittled us, beat us, etc. Right there sets me up..

When I met dBPDh, I was a raging codependant, looking back. I didnt know it. When the crap started, I "saw Mom", got angry, withdrew and tried to fix it. We all know how that goes. I shut down my own feelings, except for the biggest ones      ( like terror and panic ) and concentrated on trying to fix him.

Once he got some recovery under his belt, I learned how destructive my own behaviors were. It was quite eye opening, to say the least. Certainly, I didnt cause his BPD, but I played right into the rages and his serious frustrations with me and how I was. It was very hard to see that I was at all responsible for making things worse. After all, I was the practically cannonized Saint..

  Working on codependancy for myself has been profoundly enlightening. Not reacting to him in that manner is freeing and so much better. I feel lighter, I love keeping whats mine and handing him what is his. Its awesome. Its hard. its another addiction I need to let go.

  Have a great Saturday, all!

   Steph, who is only responsible for making her own Saturday a good one  :)

Quick - thanks for starting the thread. Where to begin? Ive learned that :

1)my co-dependent cross was a little further off the ground than I thought.Jumping down and working on me has been a little scarey but a real blessing .

2) I am seeking first hand validation ...you either like me ...for me.. or you don't. No more secondary validation for being the long suffering good guy who put up with her B.S.

3) the co dependent need to be liked,needed, and "right" ( seen as smart) has been a life draining pain in the ass. 

4) The latest and biggest revelation is that the spiritual peace and enlightenment i've always thought I wanted ( I always wanted the "instant" kind.. ya know, just add water and you're Ghandi) CAN NOT happen without psychic/mental peace . My T told me that my STBX's therapist is helping her re-build/re-parent herself so that she can sit comfortably with herself. This really stuck with me as a NON ( trust me I've asked numerous times if I am BPD or anything else... he finally said no ..but you're a little obsessive.. I said Obsessive! Aha ! yes obsessive ! LOL) .  How can I sit comfortably with the God if I'm uncomfortable with myself ? ONce I work through my co-dependency issues ,I'm betting my spiritual quest  will be easier .   

5) I've gone on a few dates and it's been fun and frightenening..most of all ,it's been a challenge to just enjoy the moment and the person and not try to manage or script the process .

Noah- the work in progress 

PDQ and Everyone,

This has been the most interesting thread to read.  I don't really know how to write what I am feeling, probably because I don't really know yet what I am feeling.  I can tell you what happened.

I joined this board more than a year ago because I had an on-line emotional affair with a man with BPD/NPD.  I later realized why.  Right under my nose, my current husband - very soon to be Ex was so disordered that I didn't recognize it. I was starved for affection.  My husband is very Passive Aggressive but controlling and sometimes overtly aggressive. In recent years he has taken hoarding to a new level. (probably an OCD/Anxiety thing)  The more I told him to put me first, the more he refused.  In fact, the more I told him anything, he would do the opposite.  Oh yes, I almost forgot, we are supposed to talk about our roles in this   

In the process of freeing myself from the BPD/NPD I learned that I am important.  I have always valued other's opinions of me more than my own.  In fact, the last person's opinion is usually the one I take...until I get another opinion.

I am filing for divorce this Wednesday.  I realize that I had been living with almost non-stop verbal abuse this past year.  Before that I almost lost myself as I just went along with the flow of what husband thought was right.  In the process, we got in debt, our house could have been condemned, and I had gained weight, becoming more and more of a couch potato as I gave up more and more control.  He was doing the laundry and the cooking.  Why?  I DON'T KNOW.  I had asthma, (just a little)  One day I inadvertently climbed out of my boiling frog pot and said "Wait just one darn minute here."  He had the house before we were married so it was always an uphill battle trying to do anything with it without him stopping me.  I was trying to clean a moldy room by getting things off of a mildewed rug downstairs.  He raged at me because a couple of his books were missing...and then left before our 25th Wedding Anniversary.  Before that, I tried to clean the freezer out and he hid the key. After he left I started selling valuables to get us out of debt.  I got new carpet, painted, and was working my way through the house.  When I finally had a yard sale though, he went "postal" screaming for everyone to get off "HIS" property - which caused me to call the police. He told them I broke into "his" garage and was selling his stuff.  Since they couldn't do anything because a divorce had not been filed, I am finally going to get a divorce.

An old friend of mine...has come into my life that found me on Classmates.  We have known each other since we were 14.  He believes I have probably been depressed for some time.  I told him "I don't get depressed".  I have an optimism that can't be killed.  That may or may not be true.  However, somewhere along the way I lost myself, or just gave up.  I brought baggage from a previous marriage to a NPD and didn't realize that right under my nose was the worst problem...my seemingly easy-to-get-along-with-husband.  I am still waking up from the nightmare.

When I file for divorce this Wednesday am I going to get my life back which I have been quite rapidly regaining in the last 9 months since we have been separated or am I going to give control to the "Classmates guy" who wants to rescue me?  I know...it is hard to know because I can't trust anyone, but can I trust myself? Yes, I believe I can. I have survived this and will continue to regain my sense of worth.  The problem with "Classmates guy" is he is married.  I know.  Why does he want to rescue me, when his wife probably needs the attention that he has been lavishing on me.  I hate to say it, but I guess my main weakness is that I cannot quit being a ":)amsel in Distress".  People want to climb out of the computer screen to rescue me.  When am I going to rescue myself?

Cindy

Over the six months, I feel like my head has exploded.  In a good way.   :)

My role in the relationship?

I really tolerated a lot of bullsh!t.  Not only did I tolerate, but spoke sincerely of my want for "Please Sir, may I have some more?"   ::)  My role?  I stayed.  I stayed, and I tried to logically explain away the retardation I was willfully subjecting myself to.  It was abusive and I acted like I had two choices: stay or leave.  There was a third I hadn't considered:

To accept that I had made a ton of mistakes and actually learn from them this time, and not run away crying my little bruised ego out.  Strength--the other choice.  It wasn't a simple have or have not situation, and I had regarded it as such for so long because of the starvation economy I had been living on unknowingly.

For those of you unfamiliar with starvation economies, it is basically accepting what you have without much question because you have been without love, acceptance, family for so long.  I heard WOMO mention something to this effect about his Forgiveness tank being completely used up--I didn't even realize there was a darned meter.  In my FOO, someone scratches off your meter.  You accept your family entirely, because it is your family.  No one ever explained to me that this paradigm can be left behind, but honestly someone had to...and then I had to understand it intrinsically.

To wit, I felt like the Great Re-engagement of 2007 I was being controlling...you know, even with boundaries and agreements, there can be that element of control.  I asked him to stop drinking and see a T.  I feel like I set myself for inevitable disappointment.  It was a really nice thought, that something so broken could be fixed.  But really, within two months he started to let everything slide, and the first time I expressed my hurt he twisted the whole situation on me and I buckled--totally.  I hadn't "gotten" my involvement in the system and how deeply-seated it really was.  It was a minor miracle of sorts that I managed to get it at a fairly crucial moment, but I did.  I was sitting in front of my computer after having received an email from him about why he had given me the silent treatment for another four weeks.  I began to cry, one of those really soul-withering ones.  And all of a sudden I just stopped.

I wiped my eyes, lit up a smoke, and went back to what I was doing before I read the thing.  I watered my plants.  Remembered who I was, who I had always wanted to be.

What I have learned about myself?

I'm not afraid of being alone if that means I will never have to compromise my integrity and self-worth ever again.  And I have no time nor tolerance for lying.  I would much rather be somewhat disappointed because of the truth than wounded and disrespected by dishonesty.  Never will I accept, knowingly, that mockery of a relationship; not with my daughter, not with my lover.

I learned my strength as a woman; I learned what it really meant to be one.   8)

Isnt it really amazing how blinded we all were in our own relationships? Now that we are looking hard at ourselves, we can see the roles we had. Congratulate yourselves and each other, you all have done something that our partners couldnt. And the best part of it all is, we have given ourselves the gift of knowledge about ourselves, and if we act on what we have learned, we will be more aware, and less likely to hurt in the way we did. Isnt that just the coolest thing you could do for yourselves?

Carry on, Im really enjoying this trhead, and thank you to all who have posted.

Crap, you ain't lying, PDQ.  One good turn of events (well, good being a totally flexible definition) and the whole house of cards comes flying down.   :)  Thanks for starting the thread, my friend.

Wow, this really blows me away...I feel, as always, and as someone said before me, that I could quote from so many of your posts!

Well, what I learned about my role in the relationship:


I allowed myself to be "saved" and carried on by a fairytale love (he was after all, my HS sweetheart and first love)! If I was BRUTALLY honest, I was totally into the awe of getting together with someone I had had a relationship  with 25 years before, and thought I was a love story for Oprah to have on her show! Geez, I told the "romantic" story so many times of us getting back together, that when things got bad, I told the story over and over again, partially to see other people's melting looks, and to keep convincing myself that my niggling suspicions and gut telling me something was wrong was NOT there.

I LOVED the attention he paid me, and how loving and TOTALLY wrapped up in me he was. He'd do ANTYHING for me at the drop of a hat..that made me giddy and I suppose, selfish, in a way- This blinded me from seeing reality.

I made  so many excuses over and over again and covered for what I deep down knew was WRONG. (where were my standards?)

I put him above my kids in situations when I really should NOT have, but I thought nobly that I should put my husband first. (my kids were from my first marriage- he died of cancer)

I KNEW what made a good and normal marriage, as I had one for 14 years, but my desparation to be "a normal married woman" overrode my instincts!

I shouldn't have jumped so readily at getting married, especially when I was still recovering  from my mentally abusive second husband and barely divorced. (do I sound like a soap opera yet, LOL!)

What I have learned about myself in the process:

I am stronger than I think I am.

I LIKE who I am at the age I've come to, and have come to realize, I am okay by myself, and don't need a husband to complete me.

Sure, I'd like to have someone like my first husband of 14 years, but I DID have that, and some people NEVER do, so I am blessed!

Whatever comes my way, I will take one day at a time, one moment at a time if I have to.

I have come to realize I have a lot to give others, and having suffered much in my lifetime, I have a deep well from which to draw from and give comfort and friendship. It does come back a thousandfold when you do the right thing, and live the right way.

I am lucky to have so many friends and family!


Thanks for the eye opener. Perhaps I will have more things come to mind and be honest about as I read and ponder others' posts...

Wow, just found this thread and read through it all. Very enlightening and potentially cathartic. 

It is tempting just to say, "ditto" to what many of you have written, but that would be cheating, wouldn't it?

So, here goes:

My role in the relationship--

-being hypersensitive to criticism, thus being an easy target

-trying to "fix" things constantly to avoid any conflict

-defensive

-overachiever at work, but absentminded and underproductive at home, thus contributing to a volatile situation

-providing money and making excuses for why he didn't work, setting up a growing resentment inside of me

-becoming alcohol dependent (like him), no doubt making things worse at times

All of these (and probably more behaviors I haven't listed) are solid co-dependency traits. I got my own "fix" from feeling that I was needed, smoothing away tears and defusing arguments, bringing home the paycheck (stbX being chronically unemployed made this a biggie), being supportive to a fault, enabling harmful behaviors to escalate.

What I have learned--

-that I have been subconsciously reenacting scenes from my childhood with two excessively demanding parents, to whom I was never perfect enough

-that I ignored red flags everywhere, which are now etched firmly in my mind and will never be overlooked again

-that having a man in my life is an option, not a necessity

-that it is not too late to change my own behaviors

-that being strong about going through with divorce is making me feel better than all the years of "helping" him

As others have said, there is more to post, but it does help to get started. Thanks for the thread!

Optimistic

Boy oh boy. I've been avoiding sitting down and doing “step 4” and even trying to ignore this thread but I guess it's time . . .

I've learned that I'm a co-dependent love addict but I came by it honestly as I was raised by similarly "damaged" personalities that taught me love means pushing your own needs aside and taking other people’s garbage with a smile and feeling “grateful” for the privilege. I'm working on forgiving them for the lack of unconditional love and nurturing in my childhood - a person that doesn't love themselves can't truly love someone else either. I include myself in that statement and am working to fill the void within myself with self-love, self-care, good spiritual light . . .

I've learned that I can't "fix" anyone but myself. Everyone else has to recognize their own problems and be willing to do something about it themselves. I’ve learned to recognize the “head over heels” feelings I can get for someone should be taken as a warning siren, at least until far into the future when my “picker” has been greatly modified to recognize truly good people vs sick people. I know that won’t happen until I’m better.

I've learned that by trying to "help" many of the people in my life and giving them the time and attention (I've wanted someone to give to me,) I've only allowed them to dig themselves in deeper and think there's nothing wrong - if I'm willing to put up with poor behavior, low self-esteem, "poor me" pity party attitudes and try to prop these people up, as long as they have a punching bag or someone else carrying their load for them what incentive do they really have to change?

From one of my "thought of the day" emails: we attract the people and situations that will help us grow the most.

I have learned that I will no longer chase after emotionally unavailable people who ultimately don’t really care if I live or die but are happy all the same to play some games with my feelings so long as it serves their own sick dysfunctional needs.

I have learned that it takes 2 to tango, that I will always bring half of the relationship with me, that I am just another side of the same coin. I have learned how sick I am for allowing these sick damaged people into my life and for trying to fill my own needs through them. I am trying to learn to forgive myself for allowing myself to be treated this way and for having to receive these lessons the hard way and move forward.

I have learned that I matter as a living human being just as much as anyone else and have the right to be here and be happy and live my own life the way I feel I want to live it. I have learned that being “family” or “being in love” does not obligate me to accept other people’s poor behavior.

I have learned that I have a lot of work to do on myself to learn to see people as they are, as they present themselves to be, not as the person I “see” inside them or as the person I dream of seeing them become, or as the person I make them out to be in my own mind. I have learned to accept that what is – is.

Okay, I'll play, though I am presently in and committed to my relationship with my DBPDSO of whom I am writing. This is probably way too long but I've edited it as much as I can, even still, I'm sure there's stuff I've forgotten.

Who was I before and why did I get involved with her?

--I was pretty self-aware and was pretty good at figuring people out. I met her at this hobby-related thing and we became friends. She clarified she wanted more, but I saw all these red flags telling me to stay away, so instead I played the role of wise, supportive friend, the one person who would not take advantage of her, the knight in shining armor friend. The longer I knew her, and the closer I got to her, the more red flags I saw. I knew she was a mess, but I didn't know how big. Not by a long shot. But she was a cool person and we were friends. We had fun together.

--I had this idea that I didn't want to have sex with anyone I wasn't in love with, partly because I can't get into it without the emotional attachment, and partly because I was concerned that I would get emotionally attached to whoever it was and end up in love with someone who might not be the right person). So, due to the fact that I did not manage to get involved with someone I was interested in, I didn't have sex for, let's say, somewhere between 5 and 10 years. I really wanted love more than anything, that feeling of being loved, giving love, having someone wonderful to share my life with, but by this time I was in my mid-30s and I'd only been involved with a handful of women--being gay does cut down on your choices--they say 1 in 10 people is gay, after all...

--So a few years after we met, my friend (AKA my present dBPDso) hit rock bottom and had to move home to another state. During this time she seemed to change, become calmer, acting out less, started taking prozac. Meanwhile I had gotten to the point where I was just going to have sex with someone and see what happened because waiting for the right person just wasn't working--this sleeping with her was supposed to be progress, get me back in the saddle so to speak. I had no desire to do it with a stranger, and I had two friends who had expressed wanting to "do it" with me, and I chose you know who. I didn't think we had enough in common to be partners, and she lived in another state, so I figured it was safe to give it a try when she came to visit. Suffice it to say, it was a wonderful, loving experience, and after she went home, within a few weeks, I was in love with her and she with me. Part of it was that she had indeed begun what I was later to realize was her recovery from BPD, and part of it was that now that I had experienced her as a lover, my knight in shining armor friendship morphed into the lover version. I remember this moment that first weekend when I told her, of course we weren't going to get serious, and she broke down, and it just pulled at my heart strings--I was going to love this young woman who had never really been loved and I was gonna make everything okay. Ah ha ha ha. And I knew it even then, it's there in my diary--not that it was BPD but that it was probably foolish. But there was this thing that kept telling me, when you feel love you either move towards it or away from it and after so long with no love in sight, I felt I had to move towards it.

What mistakes did I make at the beginning and in the first year of the relationship?

--So the red flags continued (wanting to get close quick, falling in love too fast, her idealization of me, her overly emotional relationship with her girlfriend--oh that's a nice slip--her roommate who she wished was her girlfriend--and we fell in love way too fast, that kind of love where you drive a truck full of your so's possessions halfway across the country after you've only been involved a few months. I knew it was stupid, I knew she was having trouble finding work and I had agreed to support her until she did--totally into the idea that I'd take care of her and heal her, love her like no one else ever had. But, you know the story, the love felt so right.

--More mistakes like letting her move in 'cause she didn't have money to go anywhere else, committing to her as a life-partner in a private ceremony. There I was "married" and living with her when I had wanted to take it more slowly.

--Supporting her emotionally as she started to fall apart due to our intimacy exploding the defenses she's created to block out her childhood abuse. Totally allowing myself to be made into the good mommy. And it felt so good. She basically had a nervous breakdown and I allowed her to totally fall into it, have no responsibilities at all, and basically took on the role of a parent as far as large parts of her life.

--I'd just gotten out of debt and started heading back in, due to supporting her.

What mistakes have I made since realizing the BPD/what bad roles have I been playing/played?

--I figured out she had BPD early on, after coming from the compassionate place about her recovery from childhood sexual abuse, I have been way too compassionate and patient, enabling her to continue to be lazy in many areas of her life while she is working so hard on her mental illness and behavior due to it.

--At times I've let myself become totally obsessed with her and her illness and trying to make her better. Putting money towards therapy for her instead of therapy for myself.

--I've allowed her to treat me in ways I never imagined I'd allow anyone, and used the explanation of her mental illness and my love for her as an excuse.

--I've been messed-up and immature at times, feeding into her psychotic rages.



Who am I now/what have I learned/what issues have I realized I still really have to work on?

--I already knew that my childhood of keeping my family "okay" playing my mother's partner in social and emotional ways after my parents got divorced, and taking close care of my (some kinda social anxiety disorder) brother set me up to be the caretaker in any relationship I would get into.

--I've realized I tend to surround myself with friends who are damaged people, ever since I was a "weird kid" and the less-apparently-damaged people don't tend to hang with the weird kids. This has culminated in having a mentally ill life-partner. I think I have done this so that I don't feel so f-cked up and I don't have to force myself to continue to grow in certain areas--look at everyone around me--in comparison I'm in great shape without having to move a muscle.

--I've realized I identified more with my father even than I'd previously thought--I thought I had his romantic POV on love, but really I have his attraction to women with BPD. My mom's okay, but his 2nd wife was CLASSIC WITCH BPD and I lived with them for a while in my teens. Even though I did 9 years of therapy on this, I still got involved with a woman with BPD (though quite different from my UBPDstepmother) who even reminds me of her physically and sexually and I've known that from the start, always wondering if I'm trying to cure my father's wife through this or I'm trying to make my father's life turn out okay. (She completely sucked his life from him and he died at least ten years too early.)

--I have allowed my partner's stunted growth to give me permission to be lazy about my own emotional growth. I've allowed myself to remain passive aggressive and lazy and unmotivated and moody and btchy, with the excuse of taking care of her being more important or "waiting until things are less crazy" to do whatever.

--I've also realized that in lots of ways throughout my life I've put others needs/desires in front of mine, and that I need to focus really hard on what I need and want from life and figure out how to motivate myself to get it.

--I've allowed myself to be involved with a woman who can steal and lie, a woman who doesn't know what's going on half the time, who I have to take care of in lots of ways, and who can be abusive to me. Not being able to completely trust my partner has taken a toll. I am not sure exactly how yet. Sometimes it makes me very sad, and I've had PTSD and anxiety symptoms I never had before this relationship.

The bad parts of why I continue to allow myself to stay:

--I know I shouldn't be involved with someone who abuses me, and part of me can't believe I am. Why am I, other than all the reasons about loving her and knowing it's transference? I think because I've watched so many movies and TV shows like "Xena" and "Buffy" where romantic couples kill each other and physically fight each other, that I've found a place in me where this is an acceptable kind of epic romance--look how dark and painful this is but they still love each other and will make it through.

--Because sometimes my step mother used to lose it on me and it made me feel like she loved me more--'cause she only lost it like that with me (sad). Both my mother and step mother were picky btches, so I'm used to living with someone who's picky and btchy. I've finally figured out how unhealthy my relationship with my brother was--us both just enabling each other to avoid moving on in life for years--and I'm hoping this will inspire me more to improve my present relationship.

--I really should be with someone more on my level who can help me with the "real life" parts of my life (like motivation and person growth) more than my partner is able to.


Okay, so there it is for today. I'm sure there's more. Thanks to anyone who actually read it all the way through!

Peacebaby

My role in the relationship -

• My role in the relationship was to play a "role."  At that time in my life all I knew was to play roles: the good student, the dutiful son, the loyal best friend, the social butterfly, the doting boyfriend.  It was a means of disconnecting from my internal strife and appear functional.  But really I didn't know who I was, I just wanted a fantasy:  someone to rescue, and in return would rescue me back.  I don't think I  had the wherewithal or motivation to do the personal development I lacked (thanks partly to momster).  It was easier to believe in romantic love, that I would be made whole if I only found the right person.

• When she painted me white, I was in heaven.  Of course she was able to create for me the fantasy I longed, she was a borderline.

• I willingly gave up just about all aspects of my life in order to be with her, my friends, family, interests, time and effort.

• I suppose I was co-dependent.  Here's what co-dependency meant to me:  as long as I was with my BPDgf, I didn't have to work on me.  I didn't have to take care of myself (she would pretend to take care of me), emotional, physically or spiritually.  She was my one-way ticket to avoidance.  Only it turns out, it was really just a deferment plan, and payback was a butt.


Things I learned -

• Fixing oneself is worth it.  Because avoiding is only a deferment.

• I am worth getting to know, and worth spending time/energy on.  Fixing other people instead of myself is a form of avoidance.

• I do not need another person in order to feel/be whole.

• I am the ONLY person who can rescue me.

• It is NORMAL to feel scared during the process of developing intimacy.  Instant intimacy (ie, BPD love) is an illusion.  Do not be seduced by illusion, the pain in the aftermath is not worth it.

• Pain is a diligent instructor, do not ignore these instructions.

• Emotions are not bad, having them does not mean you are a weak person.

   ... If at some point you lose touch with your feelings, it is because you are in too much pain.

   ... However if you can work past that pain, and "experience" all the bad feelings you have deferred (ie, avoided) then you might have an opportunity to experience other feelings (good feelings) provided you start taking care of yourself.

• Loyalty might be an honorable quality if it is truly loyalty you are expressing.

   ... just make sure it is not a rationalization to avoid doing what is hard (ie, leaving your BPD)

• There is NO SUCH THING as unconditional love (as least in the mortal realm)

   ... all love is conditional, just make sure you understand the conditions and they are fair and acceptable to you.

   ... anytime someone is saying they expect it of you, they are really expecting you to be their parent but without the conditions (ie, a child's obligation is to learn to become adults)

   ... and don't believe them when they say they are giving you unconditional love

   ... judge their actions not their words.


Schwing

i have learned it was not all her fault. much of it was me and my issues and the fact the we were both victims of addictive and unhealthy love



Love & Sex Part 1 - Dealing with Healing - Criteria Past (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pG-VwOJk2Fc&feature=PlayList&p=38D251949CB26D7D&index=2)

Love & Sex Part 2 - Sex, Love & my Obsessive Addiction (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-YkDvnvAwg)

Love & Sex Part 3 - Love Addiction & Childhood Sexual Abuse (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Hdlig-FTSE)


had it not been for my screwed up relationship with 'her'... i may not have gotten back into therapy.

Thanks for the topic.  I think maybe that I am in a certain 'stage' in the 'looking back' part of the recovery process: From obsessive looking back (can't turn off the replay button-he'll know I'm right this time! -in my own mind no less!) to forcing myself to look back to erase the denial and face the facts and emotions, to the relief of being able to not look back, to maybe now needing to look back again.  Tying up some loose ends...  At least the ones I'm aware of!

My role in the start of the relationship: 2 months separated after 22 years of marriage: lonely, looking for the opposite of exH (ding! wish granted) -

1. My complete codependency on him for my emotions, thoughts, and actions which allowed him the control he thought he needed and, frankly, I was more than willing to give it away.  I came into the relationship with no 'Self' (so much so I had to look up 'Self' online when my T asked who I was), a chameleon with most people I came in contact with (except those genuine people-the few true friends). 

2. The self I did have was full of guilt and hell-bent on proving I deserved whatever came my way.

3. So, to 'keep' him, the idealization and false love I so desperately wanted back to fill my void of Self, after the abuse started, I would lie.  Lie to keep the peace, lie so he would keep 'loving' me, lie to control the environment to placate him, lying about my horror at what he was doing.  Being the uber-emotional detector he was, he could sense this falseness and his radar went off, building things that weren't even there.  More abuse.  More lies.  Cycle repeated.  My way of walking on eggshells.

4.  Deep down, I wanted the drama; to make me 'feel'.  I pushed down so much.  I couldn't push this down. 

5.  Thought I could help fix him.  Thought it was possible that he could fix himself.  More lies, I guess.

What I have learned:

1. NEVER, ever, allow abuse in your life.  WALK -THE FIRST TIME. If you are looking at yourself in the mirror saying "Get out.  What are you doing?"  That means GET OUT.  NOW.

2. Believe someone when they tell you they are angry or jealous or unkind or violent. 

3. "It's getting better" is not good enough.  The only thing good enough is "It stops".

4. The 'perfect man', the perfect relationship, the perfect anything... Too good to be true is no cliche.  And at the same time, 'no one is perfect' is no excuse.

5. Now the good part: The hard-fought battles won: I exist.  I have intrinsic worth. I write my own life script.   I love myself, so the script will be a good one.  Everyone has has intrinsic worth.  Everyone is worthy of love.  I can love, truly love.  I am worthy of forgiveness, Grace.  Everyone is worthy of forgiveness, Grace.  I forgive him.  He was a gift. 

6.  I have a long way to go.

7.  I have learned that I cannot help but laugh every time I see the name Bananahead.

Bananahead, Bananahead, Bananahead.  :)

The name is in tribute to the brother of my daughter's Ex-boyfriend.  The kid looks like he has a banana head.  No joke. 

Foiles, your #1 is really true.  Don't allow abuse - physical, mental or emotional. Just because I wasn't getting hit didn't mean I wasn't getting abused.  It really shocked me when my daughter came home and showed me the essay she wrote for her GED practice examination.  The teacher had praised her and said it was a riveting story.  Well, it was all about a strong person she knew and she had written about how her mother had left her father because of domestic abuse.  I was that abused woman.  I allowed somebody to abuse me and I allowed my daughters to observe that.  Thank God we got out, all had a lot of therapy and they have good, decent boyfriends who don't abuse in any manner. I kick myself that I wasn't a good example to them, but they can learn from a bad example too.

My complete story is here, along with a whole bunch of good ones:

US: Stories: Why did we stay in a long term relationship with a Borderline SO? (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=72926.0)