BPDFamily.com

Had a BPDgf and when we were together, I found a condom on her makeup pile as if she set it there to remind herself to take it with her on an arrand run, went out to get nails done and came back 5 hours later with suggestive bruises on her inner thighs, hair was wet after coming back from a supposed hour long drive, caught her packing condoms for a girls weekend out vacation and so forth and so forth. 1 year relationship.

Even after I left her for these things amongst the abuse and other BPD traits, she would tell me for 6 months after I left how much she loved me, wanted me, but absolutly denies ever cheating on me. but couldn't and wouldn't explain any of this.

Even though now were all over, and we both agreed we have no future, and she's moved on, she still denies it.

Why won't she let me have closure on this and admit? and does she have any guilt or shame? Anyone go through this?

I sent her a closure letter to say I know she was cheating and sleeping around, but with no response.

She also sent me a text once that I had cheated on her and told her so, which I absolutly never said or did... .projection? relieving guilt?

Ah yes projecting. Thats what they do. To make sure they dont feel guilty they project their actions and feelings towards you. By doing this they also dont feel guilty because you're the one who "cheated", which makes you the jerk. Had they same thing with my own ex at the re-engagement, "you are always emotionally manipulating me!"  sure babe thats whats I been doing for 3 years  lol

LOL, mine also never admit it and I caught her many times with texts and IM messages I found where she would invite different men to have sex with. She just said coldly she doesn't do things like that... .WTH?  And she would rage at me after going too deep into that topic and tell me to go f#ck hookers.  ?

They wont admit it ever, 3 lots of cheating i endured and each time i produced the evidence to back up what i was accusing her of, yet still she denied it and even turned it round onto me saying if it were true then it was my fault or i should accept part of the blame...

Hey and guess what, i contacted the guys she was secretly txting and things and they all said the same thing ' she told me she was single'

when she decided she wanted me and i was trying to rebuild trust between us, no way was i allowed to ask any questions of why she did it, who he was, how she met him, i was just told to drop it so i got no closure...

They wont admit it because they have not done anything wrong in there minds, they can not handle guilt, they are purely focused on what makes them feel better, its all about them and they love and crave attention, it fills there emotional void to them.

Guess what tho, me putting up with that sort of behaviour made me guilty for allowing it to happen to me , all in the name of love eh... I cheated on me staying with her.

Its another twist in the twisted mind of BPD illness. If she was to have to look at herself as bad, it would probably start her on the quest of self hate, shame, and everything else, which could possibly lead to self harm. I had the opportunity to watch my niece (on my wifes side,whom had the same type of upbringing) which I suspect also has BPD (shows many of the traits ) She is only 15 right now, and just starting to deal with r/s"s, and not very well,YET. She is a beautiful young lady, and has always made suicidal comments, lack of selfworth, thinks she is ugly, along with rages,ect,ect,ect. The idea of intamacy and her fear of abandonment, has probably kept her from being sexually active, but I suspect this will change. After I was married to my wife for about 3-4 years we got into a discussion about all our former r/s. She then went on to tell me that her first consensual experience ( her uncle touched her at 4) was a onenight stand. WTH. Im going to post another thread on this because its very interesting to me.

Deny, deny, deny I think if they believe their lies they dont have to face the guilt. My counsellor has a 13nyr borderline patient who shoplifts. Probably a narc trait sense of entitlement.  She got a tape from one if the stores she stole from and showed it to her. The girl still denied that was her.

I wonder what would happen if you turned it around. A BPD will almost always accuse you of cheating as a way of projecting. Let's say you say: yes, you know what, I cheated on you. With lots of women all the time.

How on Earth would they respond to that? I bet that, in some weird fvcked up way, they would thank you for your 'honesty'.

Because of adandonment fears a BPD would get very upset if you were the one cheating. For them they feel its okay to cheat, but you better not cheat on me.

so true... in addition to that... if pressed they will say we were broken up or something else (insert how its your fault here)

hey alex, we didnt need to, they thought we were anyway. Saying that i once said i had met someone else after she painted me black in one our cycles, guess what, i then got all the soul mate txts, how devastated she was, how we were always firey and that was us ( dont remember ever telling her i wanted us to be firey' so when we did recycle she was nice as pie but it didnt last long, me doing that probably put her abandoment fears into orbit, so she lined up a new r/s and jumped.

I have never experienced anyone in my life who can swap one r/s for another. I still cant get my head around that even though i know so much... its just totally alien to me how they or people do it.

When i found out about her affairs, I was joking around and said so this is what you want an open marriage?  I said okay i am going out on Friday. She said i am not okay sharing you and gave me the silent treatment for two days. Yes i think it proves the point they want their cake an eat it too. I feel its all about control.

Many nonBPD's cheat and don't admit to it - this is not unique to BPD.

Looking at BPD as a mental illness, keep in mind they tend to see things (including themselves) as either all good or all bad.  So if they admit or look at themselves as having an affair - the shame they would feel will be quite overwhelming.  It is during these shame times we see very destructive behaviour (cutting, drinking, etc.) Can you see how hard this would be for a pwBPD to actually confront without having proper therapy in place on how to deal with these emotions in a healthy manner?

Regarding your closure, now that you have written your letter - are you at a place to let go of her and contact of her so that you can heal yourself?

That was my problem. My BPD EX would cheat - almost exclusively with married men - and deny she was doing it... .till I dropped hard copies of their email exchanges in her lap.

Finally when the last married man she cheated with was a good friend - (with a pregnant wife at home who's baby shower my EX was slated to host) - I realized she would cross any social and moral boundary and it just didn't matter. I caught them in-the-act and she *still* denies it happened to everyone around her.

Combine all that with her refusal to manage her illness responsibly and I HAD TO walk. Enough was enough. She's not sociopathic, she knows right from wrong, she just doesn't care who she throws under a bus.

Glad she is gone. Life is soo much better now for me without her.

Everything posted in this thread I have experienced with my ex.  She has accused me of cheating numerous times and said I do not act with intergrity and honesty, yet she is the one cheating.  Absolutley amazing!

Two yrs ago when I knew my ex was cheating, I physically caught her kissing the guy.  They were 10 feet in front of me and there was no denying it on her part.  She raged on me, threatened, and became vicious.  A month later she came running back.

My ex is cheating now, yet again.  Same projection crap.  What would happen if I physically caught her again?  What actually happens when they cannot deny and must face their guilt?  :)oes her rage get worse because her guilt level is higher?

How did your ex react to the emails?  :)id she accuse you of breaking into her email or invading her privacy or try to twist it back onto you somehow?

It broke my heart to have to come to the conclusion that in order to prove to her that I *knew* about her affairs I had to spy on her. That was a terrible position she put me in... .spying on the woman I loved so much.

Her reaction was exactly that... ."How dare you spy on me, you have broken my trust, you are evil BraveTwoZero, I don't know if I will be able to forgive you." Her affairs and breaking my heart wasn't the issue, the fact that I had to prove she was doing it was the crime in her head.

It was a no win situation. She knew what she suffered from, I was her rock in a storm, supported her 100%, yet after the third time she did it to me - (knowing full well that it was unacceptable) - I ended it. Enough was enough. No more doormat and enabling for me.

This is true, but when you confront a nonBPD with picture proof they are not going to deny it. Its the guilt and shame BPD's are not going to confront.

Thanks BraveTwoZero.

That's exactly the dilemma I'm facing now.  I can access her email and show her indisputable evidence of her cheating, but I just know she will react the same way your ex did.  It will all be twisted and she'll accuse me of being dishonest.

That's why I think the one time I physically caught her with the other guy, she couldn't twist it back onto me as much (she still tried though).

At the end of the day, I think what's the friggin point though part of me wants the satisfaction of showing her how guilty she is.  Such a no-win situation, it only re-affirms she is not the one.

I caught her the last time in-the-act too. At our own home, while her step son and I were sleeping inside! On the spot she could not deny it.

Yet, the very next day, and every day after that, she - (and scumball married man with pregnant wife) - swear I made it all up... .because, quote, "I am the one with a jealousy problem."

Hell, I even saw the text on her phone the very next day after I busted her where my ex-good-married-friend and her were meeting up to quote "work on their story."

Betrayal upon betrayal upon lies... .at that point I *knew* my life had to change and it was going to change by dumping her. It was so painful because I loved her and had been her safe port in so many storms over 7 years together.

Yet everyone has a limit, and enough was enough.

Interesting.  I actually did that out of frustration once. It wasn't a lie but rather an attempt to show her how absurd her accusations were. It was more of a sarcastic response because nothing else was working. I had kept a record (and still do) of how I spend all of my time. It would have been impossible for me to have had other women. I have "witnesses" that can vouch for what I do, there are logs and records. I run my own business and keep records of phone calls and what I am working on at any given time.

So one day, out of frustration, I replied to the effect "Yes, between my phone calls with you that last three hours every evening, my work, the writing that I do,  my conversations with my sons, somehow I've managed to make sure there's a new woman everyday and she gets about a minute of my time."

Her reply was exactly what you predicted it might be: "Thank you for your honesty."

And the thing is - I am pretty sure that at some level, she doesn't believe her accusations otherwise, why would she determine to make up with me and carry on with the relationship?  It's like there is some kind of switch in her mind that goes from "on" to "off." And then back to "on" again.

wodering she is probably validating her own affair. If you are then its justified in her own mind for her to.

This is pretty much the exact scenario i was in... .I caught him red handed at 'her' house... .saw them kissing through the window... .took a picture of his truck at her house. God... .I can't believe i resorted to this sort of behaviour... .spying, it makes me sick knowing I actually did that. Once confronted he got mad at me and said "You were SPYING on me?" He turned it all around to make it look like I was the a-hole... .and he STILL denied it! He told me we were broken up (Uhhh... .I don't think so) and he could do whatever he wanted... .but the fact was he WASN'T with her... .never was... .she was 'just a friend', and I was obviously someone who couldn't be trusted.

I am glad that i am far removed from it all now... .now i just kind of shake my head and chuckle when I think about his twisted logic.

I believe this maybe the reason my ex started cheating on me. She was convinced i was cheating on her.

really good point. i actually think you might be likelier to get the truth out of them that way. the entire mountain of it.

i think everyone has pretty much answered this question to its satisfaction. they can't admit it, they can't even see it. and yes that's why they project as well. heaven help the person dating a pwBPD who gets accused of cheating, because it very well mean that their BPD is rampantly cheating. my ex was intensely jealous and kept me isolated from girls. i now suspect that she may have been doing all kinds of cheating.

there was a guy from her past she was quiet about. said she had a 3 month mostly sexual thing with him. then was turned off by him, broke it off. he was a neighbor. she said after that, he'd contact her saying he was drunk and coming over, she'd say no, he never ended up coming. low and behold like two years or more into our relationship, she freaks out one night, says he just texted her saying he's coming. she had deleted the conversation. she also still had his name in her phone. when asked why, cleverly she'd explain so she'd know who it was when he did this. this was a gigantic red flag, but i ignored it, because although it was HIGHLY suspicious, and i thought she might be lying, i did NOT think she would/had been cheating. so i let it go in hopes that she'd stop with her ridiculous paranoid jealousy with me and cut me some slack. oops. since getting out of the relationship i found a twitter account. some very suspicious flirting going on about a year, year and a half into our relationship. now i figure anything is possible. here's the thing. the reason im most suspicious about the guy from her past. we'd gone like 9 weeks without seeing each other. this is a girl who was constantly needy and lonely for me every night. even if we spent 5 days in a row together, spent it fighting, and NEEDED time apart. so weekends would come, and it'd kind of be no big deal, and maybe i'd even hear from her less. i think it was after this period ended, and we were around each other again, that this guy from her past popped up one of those nights.

looking back, if i hadn't been so damn relieved not to hear from her, and have her be busy, i probably might have been more suspicious of cheating during the relationship. but anyway, she constantly projected that i was a cheater, had nightmares of me cheating, accused me of cheating, spied on me (found my passwords and usernames written down in her closet), etc. all tell tale signs, usually, of a cheater. i think it's a very confusing blend of projection, genuine fear, and that this even CAUSES them to cheat, as well as JUSTIFY their cheating.

the reason i like alex's theory is i was a virgin (by choice) before this relationship. my ex honest to god managed to have sex with me repeatedly without my knowledge (you wouldn't believe me if i told you). after a huge fight, i broke up with her, and in one of the most bizarre behaviors i've ever seen, she shouted at me, as if it were some kind of weapon "OH YEAH WELL I'VE BEEN F****ING YOU THIS WHOLE TIME." i sort of imagine if you said "yeah, i cheated on you, what of it?" they would then HAVE to hit you with pretty much every single time they cheated on you and how bad they put one over on you.

oh. i stand corrected.

the fact is we all know what is going on. so why bother, i no longer look for validation from this person and have given it to myself. the anger is gone. i dont forgive this person but i do accept them for who they are and what they have. they make choices, and i have choices also. My boundries are reestablished, my self is making a comeback, and i will be a much better (healthier) person when the healing is complete. Dont try to put logic to crazy, it doesnt work. Its like a hamster wheel, get off.

Priceless comment there Vagabond!

It woke me up to a new reality! I have never cheated, it has never been in me to do so, even despite her countless affairs and denials. Yes, as with others here, I was to blame for snooping to get to the truth, even though I would much rather have heard it directly from her. Ofcourse part of the reality is that along with her BPD, she is also NPD, hence the "entitlement" to her.

But now I find that I guess I was a real slut for 18 years! LOL!(For cheating myself out of a healthy relationship with someone who deserved my fidelity.

It is so true, the only person I ever cheated on was the REAL me.

I feel my ex was the same way definately a sense of entitlement. Possibly how she gave herself permission to cheat in the first place. Her boss has given her a car every two years. Since i moved out he pays someone to mow the lawn for her. He is twice her age and its not about sex he pities her she is the helpless victim. I said why doesnt he do that for everyone in your office?  Her rationalization is because she works too hard and is underpaid. The office would crumble if i wasnt there and he knows that.


I actually felt like a slut with her. It waant making love anymore it was doing the deed.

So I dated a BPD.  She was very attractive and people who did not know her would tell her she looked like Angelina Jolie on the street in front of me.  Her mom is also a millionaire and I feel she is way out of my league.  I have a very low self-esteem and I have never been confident in my abilities.  I am always apologetic even when I do not need to be and I think personality trait attracts a certain type of woman.  This combination  made it difficult for me to end the relationship when the abuse began.

We had sex on the first night we met and this was best sex of my life.  I did not expect her to call me back two days later but she fell in love very quickly and wanted a relationship.  I thought it was very strange that initially she was always trashing her ex boyfriend from Washington and telling me he was abusive.  She told me he put a pillow over her face with the intent to strangle her after she slapped him in the face.  Then more red flags went up as she would call him after we had sex and argue with him while we were still lying on the bed naked.  This was weird but the sex we had was so good I kept my mouth shut initially!  Her sister called her a drama queen in front of me as the BPD seemed to crave conflict.  Every vacation or holiday we had together would result in her throwing a fit and the vacation being nearly ruined.  She would accuse me of cheating constantly and she would say terrible things about my friends and family such as ("your family is trash".  She would then deny saying these things or justify saying them and I would begin to think I was crazy and imagining this.  She did not like it when I did things alone with family members or friends and I lost contact with some of them.  She would have daily screaming fits in front of me, she would start horrible yelling fights with me and then when I would try to leave she would beg for me to stay at least 6 times a week.  Each night would end with her having AMAZING sex with me drawing me back in so the cycle would continue.  She would be physically violent, slap me, and she even pulled a kitchen knife on me.  She would follow me in a car if I left her house, censor my email and my phone messages while being very private and explosive if I ever looked at what she was doing on the computer.  I am 6'5" and she is 5'4" so I felt ashamed to even mention the physical abuse to my male friends because she was so small compared to me.

I got into the best national Nurse Practitioner program in the world she was completely unsupportive.  She told me that she didn't want to date a guy in a lot of dept even though I would be making 100,000 a year as a Nurse Practitioner.  She would start fights at work and did not seem to care how this reflected on me.  The night before one of my midterms she pressured me to take her out to a long dinner.  When I told her I needed to study she made me feel very guilty.  It was my fault I did not put my foot down but she was very good at making me feel guilty.  I ended up not succeeding in the program after just 6 weeks and in hindsight I wish I had dropped her long before the program started.  I learned the hard way that education and career are more important than a girlfriend and any girl who makes you choose needs to be dropped.

My quesition to all of you stems from my suspicion that she has cheated on me multiple times as I know this can be trait for someone with BPD.  She dumped me quickly one day after we just had passionate sex and took a last minute trip to Washington to "see a friend".  However, I knew that her ex was in Washington.  I asked her if she was going to see her ex as I was shocked that she seemed to break up with me so quickly .  She told me I was awful for even thinking this and that I was a horrible person.  2 months later after her trip she wanted to get back together with me and I found out that she did in fact see her ex in washington but she claims "we just went to have coffee".  When we got back together she was glued to me again and insisted on spending every waking moment with me.  Recently, After not succeeding in the Nurse Practitioner program she has been telling me she needs to work all the time and she does not have time to see me except for once or twice a week.  However, I found out that this was a lie as she claimed she was working until 10 pm at a job that she just now admitted she got fired from a a month ago.  So what has she been doing for the last month?  Now she is accusing me of cheating constantly even though I am confined to a house were I take care of someone with a disability.   She will even claim girls that I am cheating on her with will call her and harass her.  HOWEVER, I AM NOT CHEATING SO THIS IS NOT POSSIBLE!  She finally ended the relationship again when she established that I was cheating because I went out for drinks with one of my guy friends and now says she is going to start dating other men because I was cheating.  WHAT THE ~!

I know in my heart that I need to end this before any more damage is done, but I cannot seem to break away from her.  In a month or so she is going to want to get back together and I hope I am strong enough to resist her.  My question to you all is do you think she is cheating from what I have told you or it impossible to know for sure?  Also, how do you recover from the abuse in a BPD relationship and break away from it?




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it is impossible to know, but the signs are all there, from my experience.

1. secretive of her own business (phones and the like)

2. projection. its not a 100% guarantee, more like 90. i've seen some people i believe to be borderline accuse of cheating, and i would bet fortunes they never cheated.

3. your gut is telling you this. when it comes to a borderline, ive found your gut doesn't lie, no matter how crazy it seems at the time.

4. the washington trip, and her "we just had coffee" ring very familiar.

5. that "busy so i can only see you on this day" rings very, very familiar. that's similar to what i got, which only further convinces me in my own case.

6. the projection usually escalates when they are actually cheating. i believe it did for me.

7. shes made you out to be a cheater, so of course its okay for her.

i don't have definitive proof either, but lets just say i have more than suspicion. again, when your gut tells you something like this with a BPD, it never lies. regardless, she's been dishonest with you, repeatedly.

its a horrible, awful feeling to have to even consider    . my advice is dont prove it to yourself, but assume that its true. that's always worked for me. i believe i've dated 4 borderlines, all of whom i am convinced cheated on me. but for some reason, that's never hurt me much, i guess because i tend to find out/realize after the fact, and in two of the cases, had no definitive proof.

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   She would just say that you guys were really split up, or that in her mind you were through, or any number of excuses to twist it in her mind, and this is the kicker, SOMEHOW BELIEVE IT, IN HER MIND ( this is the illness working). The dymanics of the illness, causes this much dysregulation in the brain, from her childhood trauma. This is what gives us the  ? momments. The stuff we cant wrap around our heads, because we cant make sense of it, and some never will.

    As I have been going through my recovery and self help. I see now, how I was raised by, somewhat, emotionally unavailable parents. Left to figure out things, way too much on my own as a child. I became a thinker, when navigating through life, not a feeler. I believe having a balance of this is key. Too little or too much, of anything is rarely good/ healthy. After meeting BPD, she allowed myself to pull all these wonderful emotions, from my inner child, that I craved to feel, to the surface. Giving me this illusion, that she was the one. I now know, I dont need BPD to have this.  PEACE

I don't think the "not admitting to an affair" is exclusive to BPD. Honestly, I think that's kind of standard behavior for a lot of the "normal" world out there.

Not that it's right, mind you. But neither is the infidelity.

As far as my dbpex- I don't think he really had any physical affairs or one night stands. His infidelity was emotional. Since day one, he covered up running around with another woman (who was totally "safe", and we could have been really good friends if he stopped with the lying, omitting, hiding... .oh, and painting me black so she hated me).

The one time he did have a one night stand, I'm still pissed at and it hurts like hell. We were married but he had decided to file for a divorce. He hadn't talked to me in two months, came home from Iraq, and then slept with someone. In his mind we were broken up (which, um, I guess we were... .even though his PTSD, combat stress, and BPD was what pushed him into a really bad place where he wanted the stupid divorce).

I know this is a old thread (don't kill me!) But I noticed the same with my exBPDgf... while not in a relationship any longer... holy cow if I said anything about I had more then the number of women I originally told her she would flip out on me and this is with the not dating status she would be like "you better not be telling me more lies!" it seemed a bit extreme for not being in a committed relationship.

I've had similar... .The projecting by my GF that I'm cheating... .Her Disappearing for hours... .Her afternoon showers and the inner thigh bruises that mysteriously appear... .I'm done and happy about it. I finally found the strength to open my eyes to the reality of how toxic and one sided the relationship was after I realized that I had shifted attachment styles from secure to anxious before meeting my BPD GF.  I shifted due to becoming a widow and loosing my wife of fifteen years to cancer... .Through therapy and reading about attachment styles I've been able to build myself back to a secure place and now see my live in GF as a lying, manipulating cheat that's uses verbal and emotional abuse to gaslight and split the truths... .And to hide from me her life of lies and drug addiction.

Move on my friend as you can do better... .

TG