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Relationship Partner with BPD (Straight and LGBT+) => Romantic Relationship | Detaching and Learning after a Failed Relationship => Topic started by: loz1982 on December 16, 2013, 12:43:43 AM



Title: Can I believe him?
Post by: loz1982 on December 16, 2013, 12:43:43 AM
I haven't posted on here for awhile, had been interstate having a break from my relationship and went back to Melbourne for some work. While I was away got calls and texts from my ex still blaming his behaviour on my parents and myself. I still had some stuff at his house so as I didn't have much faith in him to come around saying things like I'm happier now presumably as I don't have you lot in my life, your parents are controlling and bullies, you are not unified in our relationship etc I thought I had better go and pick up the rest. He had my stuff ready for me so I thought that was it! Then I started getting texts saying he has been reading up on controlling men and realised how he is one, that he is too rigid, how he is inflexible and a relationship is about give and take and he has just been taking. He said he realises that his significant others opinions are just as important as his. He wants to apologise to my parents and get help but he wants me to come back. To me that is kinda conditional shouldn't he want to do those things anyway whether I come back or not? I have been telling him these things for a year why suddenly does he realise them now? Maybe cause I am gone he has had to take a good look at himself and he has been talking to his parents a lot more about the situation so maybe they have given him some insight. Is it worth the risk going back? Does saying these things mean he will act on them?


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: Aussie0zborn on December 16, 2013, 01:39:09 AM
Hmmm. From my experience, the answer right now is no.

The first step to fixing a problem is acknowledging you have one and he's done that so at least you have one positive sign there but I would be cautious nonetheless.

If he suffers from BPD you need to read the actions and not the words.  Talk is cheap and you'll get a lot of it. Hopefully others will have a more constructive advice. Good luck.


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 16, 2013, 01:39:34 AM
loz1982 , Hi!.             First if you are on this board it must mean he has BPD ?

You seem to have come a long way? Why go back, what will change ?

Their words don't match their actions!  If he has BPD ,he ain't sharing a great discovery with you when saying he is a controlling man. He suffers from a serious mental illness called borderline personality disorder, he cant feel like you, love like you and act like you. If he would do get help, it would have to be for him, and for you to see results it would take time, the disorder will probably do its work on your relation. Did he tell you he is a manipulative man also ? Because he his. Who was saying this to you ? Is true self or the disorder ? One cant go without the other, run, live your life, dont go back there.


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: goldylamont on December 16, 2013, 01:54:19 AM
He wants to apologise to my parents and get help but he wants me to come back. To me that is kinda conditional shouldn't he want to do those things anyway whether I come back or not? I have been telling him these things for a year why suddenly does he realise them now? Maybe cause I am gone he has had to take a good look at himself and he has been talking to his parents a lot more about the situation so maybe they have given him some insight. Is it worth the risk going back? Does saying these things mean he will act on them?

no he won't act on them. he just wants what he wants right now, which is to engage with you more, which will result in him abusing you more. my ex and i talked through a lot of things maybe 10 months or so after our final breakup--she came to lots of "realizations" about her behaviors but stopped short of a full apology. but actually she hadn't changed and proved she would ultimately be disrespectful to me in the end.

whatever other women he is toying with--he's either bored with them or they are fed up with him so he's turning back to you. but trust that he's contacting other women at the same time saying much of the same thing. first one he can get a response from he'll start in with the abuse again.


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: Pearl55 on December 16, 2013, 02:20:22 AM
When a borderline tries to reconnect with you, is never ever about you. They use every possible tacticts to win you back and when you participate in their sick games, you will lose your power and going back to depression again. Even years of intense therapy won't resolve their issues.


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: loz1982 on December 16, 2013, 02:23:28 AM
Thank you very much for your responses, I started seeing a psychologist because I was feeling very depressed out of this and after telling her about my experience she said it sounds like he has BPD. I has never heard of it but I read Walking On Eggshells and it was about my life, then I found this website posted on it and no one has said otherwise! My ex has had a year to apologise but he hasn't as yet so that is why I hesitate!  My ex did go back on RSVP straight away which really hurt instead of spending  time getting help  or fighting for us. He has since come to his senses and realised  he doesn't want anyone else but me. Why didn't he realise this when he had me?  I know I've come a long way the hardest part is over and it's risking a lot to go back! He wants to make sure I'm coming back before he apologises otherwise I'm sure he wouldn't bother. I'm telling him I've lost faith I need to see actions to take the risk again but so far I'm interstate again I've seen nothing. I took a few weeks job interstate as I need to work as I thought we were over and he was upset, what's more important us or the work. I said you can't have a turnaround in 24 hours and expect me to stop my life and believe you when you haven't listened to me for a year. He said but we will grow apart if you do but what choice do I have at this stage. I want to be back but I'm scared! I feel guilty like I'm abandoning him


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: RecycledNoMore on December 16, 2013, 02:31:03 AM
I doubt it, the ex gave my mum the same treatment, called her a controlling b****, always hated her from the beginning,once after a physical assault, he wormed his way back by admitting he had anger problems, wanted soo badly to apologise to my mum, said she was a good woman who didnt deserve his abuse of her, blablabla

Promise promise promise

Sudden realisation that he was indeed a jerk

Sorry sorry sorry

Back in the r/ s

Bingo!

Denial, backtracking,bulls***

Around we go again



Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 16, 2013, 02:36:24 AM
Again this is not about him, it's about you. Reread your post... .we will grow appart ? Is this the highest proof of love I've heard? Pffff keep facing the facts, stay here with us, don't go there. It will pass quickly. Make this about you! he will never be any good to you.

grow, set asside the magical thoughts, accept the obvious.

You cant fix IM, you will never be able to but he will leave you broken that is all the closure to gain.


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: Changingman on December 16, 2013, 02:52:42 AM
It's called 'bait and switch'.

You are being offered goods to lure you into the shop ( baiting ).

Then when you go to buy them they are unavailable and ( switch ) a more costly item is offered instead.

They cannot trust themselves, they betray themselves, they cheat themselves, they hurt themselves, they hate themselves, they are terminally doomed.

You get to taste all that yourself, and they watch fascinated.

AND it's not their fault, you knew what they were like, the way you treated them etc

They are sadly very sick, on such a confusing level for us.

They are very dangerous, emotionally, mentally, sexually and financially.

Disease ridden, mentally unsound, impulsive, angry, self centred to a pathological degree, vindictive then sad, crying, pathetic.

Letting them drive the relationship is folly.

Believing them? Come on!

For long term they need very compassionate partners, for short term anyone they idealise.

And they never stop, my xuBPDw is still 8 years later cycling through her crazy with her new SO and our kids, almost unaware of her abusive, manipulative influence.

It IS her.

Still if she 'goes off' on me I won't let her shame me, won't let her talk when it becomes about me. Since realising what BPD is, I've understood her motivations. She raged at me, and I said "I escaped you 8 years ago" first time she has ever gone completely silent, didn't even slam the phone down, just stunned. It was very telling.

Get yourself strong and find your joy







Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 16, 2013, 02:55:59 AM
In order for I'm to heal, he must not b engaged in a relation, at least not one that is already damaged. You can  only be a trigger for him jeopardizing is recovery and the relation. Nothing ... .I know its hurtful,sad... .But don't wait till he devalue ,split you black, betray you... .believe me. Then you will have a hard time putting words on the pain. Sorry, i myself tried to avoid these conclusions because part of me was not willing to accept the reality.


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 16, 2013, 03:00:59 AM
Believing them? Come on!



lololol!  Hahaha  Nice one  |iiii


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 16, 2013, 03:12:14 AM
One more things,do you have kids ? Or do you want kids ?

if so are you willing to bring all this drama and crazy making up on them ?

jeopardizing their own sanity, getting their little mind tormented ?

make this about YOU, don't apologize,useless he don't know f@ck all what this word means and run, don't look ba k and don't allow yourself pity for I'm. Let him be.


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: loz1982 on December 16, 2013, 03:17:40 AM
Wow recyclenomor your situation sounds very similar to you I guess I struggle with the what ifs, what if he means what he says and will make himself and my parents relationship better but after reading your post I realise my worst fears, what I fear the most, nothing changes! To find that out I have to go back but I think that bravery is beyond me now too much too lose!. I am a very compassionate person prob why I stayed around as long as I did when there were many times I could've left but even I have limits! I guess I am like a trigger but if I don't push him to get help who will I see the lost lonely soul that he is inside and it breaks my heart, I know he can't help it and it pulls at my heartstrings. Are they knowingly manipulative? The timing of his realisations  make me suspicious? Changingman when you say you now realise your  ex's motivations what are they? I'm still trying to understand their motivations. Was she diagnosed? marinro7 will he necessarily want to get help for someone  else  why am I the lucky one to be the trigger? Have you recycled with your BPD ex? Do you think the grow apart comment was a way to hurry me to come back? Just read your post no kids we were trying maybe it's a blessing we didn't have any cause they wouldn't deserve this! I thought maybe before I knew about BPD he would become more mellow when we had kids, he was so excited about having them!


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: happylogist on December 16, 2013, 03:18:43 AM
Is it worth the risk going back? Does saying these things mean he will act on them?

Even assuming he has no BPD or BPD is out of equation, has he done anything so far to decrease your risk taking chances? Has he talked to your parents and apologized? Is he willing to take time with you without your commitments and prove anything?

It is an utilitarian approach, but sometimes it helps to think about emotional matters with a BPDso from a perspective of a business venture. What are the questions you would be willing to ask to your business partner after a failed business? What should be the actions on both sides to diminish the riskiness? Are you ready to trust? Do you have enough previous experience to regard him as a person to be trusted. Just try to be neutral and ask him what are his further steps, what he is planning to do in the future with or without you? How is he trying to be less controlling in his relationships?


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 16, 2013, 03:28:35 AM
Yes i have recycled tried left, when n/c 4 months than she came back crying, getting a letter from her mom, promising this, than that in the end she split me black bcause  it was all make believe, all about herself. I come to believe that you haven't had a taste of the intensity of theirs spliting ?  Do you what to go there and see for yourself? Crazy making ! And mine wasn't worst or less or... .she a typical BPD. You will stop caring about him. DO IT NOW!


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: loz1982 on December 16, 2013, 03:32:37 AM
The only thing he has done so far is tell me what he has learned about himself which I guess is the first step I have me mentioned BPD and congratulated him for recognising but said just recognising doesn't mean you can change these things these are ingrained you will need extra help from a professional so far hasn't. No he hasn't spoken to my parents if I assure him I'm coming back. If I don't promise him he wouldn't! Trouble is not sure if it will make a difference with my parents now as he has put them through hell so that's another thing to worry about as I can't not have my parents in our life. They will be in my life just don't want anything to do with him. No I can't trust him at this stage he has done many things and gone back on them sent an apology email taken it back with another email, went on depression tablets then went off them. A couple of weeks ago said he wouldn't apologise now saying he would. How can he become less controlling? Therapy? Or it's part of his personality that will never change?


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: loz1982 on December 16, 2013, 03:36:06 AM
marinro7 what does splitting you black mean? Then I can tell you if I've experienced the intensity of it? I want the anger you feel instead of feeling sorry for him, I can't understand why I feel sorry for him and not me!


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 16, 2013, 03:39:03 AM
The grow appart is puppy love fantasy b/s talk... .coming from a 4 years Old

They can't sustained a mature relationship. If feel rejected, no matter whose fault it is you are bad, than the next time you are badder! Seen her choked my chiwawa, hurt my cat while on the phone w/her to get attention than gas lighted all of it !


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 16, 2013, 03:47:57 AM
You know. What? I still wanna fix her... .I'm just getting were i start to feel anger.

he gives you conditions for you to meet so you get your closure ! See how unhealty and selfish the desorder is ?... .if i how you an apology i give it to you because i feel and recognize empathy within me,  they are unable to. Not some , but, or if... .They cannot its all about them... .


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 16, 2013, 03:51:20 AM
They see people has black or white, no shade of gray. A person cannot be black and white at the same time ei: bad and good... .the splitting is exactly Dr jekkils and M. Hyde


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: happylogist on December 16, 2013, 03:54:17 AM
Excerpt
No he hasn't spoken to my parents if I assure him I'm coming back. If I don't promise him he wouldn't! Trouble is not sure if it will make a difference with my parents now as he has put them through hell so that's another thing to worry about as I can't not have my parents in our life. They will be in my life just don't want anything to do with him.

It seems that he is negotiating, but at this point it is you who have to negotiate the conditions. If he has done enough to make your parents believe that he is not a good match for you, your "trying" with him and failing at anything would be again blamed on your parents and you. In his controlling eyes it would be loss of his own control - this is why he blames your parents, with whom I would guess you have a close relationship. At this point the situation is not going to improve, all stays the same. At the same time, my guess is him being sorry and apologizing is a way to show himself that he tried to save your relationship. If it is true, the things would be worse than before - now he is scapegoating you for the future mistakes by taking no action and confirming his change in words, but no actions.

If someone is controlling - realization helps, but also actions - giving control to others, not necessarily committing to therapy, but being able to be OK with giving out some control to others and acknowledging mistakes. So a person who is willing to change - would agree to wait with the decision, would try to improve ALL important relationships (and if he is serious about you - the future with your family).



Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 16, 2013, 03:54:39 AM
Take time to go trough other post, ask moderator for information on the different behavior and scare yourself to death!


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: DragoN on December 16, 2013, 04:04:53 AM
From experience my ex who lied frequently whether there was any reason to do so or not. Almost as if it were a compulsion. He would tell lies about ridiculous things that really meant nothing. He told lies to people who knew the truth as if he expected them to forget the truth and believe his lies. He openly lied to people while telling them what he was lying about and how he managed his lying.

I guess my point is you shouldn't be surprised your bf tells lies to his and your family and you. You are supposed to be his life partner, arguably his closest friend and confidante yet he lies to you. Telling lies is just one of those things that PD's do.

In short, Look only at his Actions. Anything else you can flush.


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 16, 2013, 04:06:58 AM
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=136462.msg1331266


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: Pearl55 on December 16, 2013, 04:18:54 AM
Most borderlines are pathalogical liars. They believe to their lies.


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 16, 2013, 04:23:12 AM
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=58298.0php?topic=62033.0https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/indhttps://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=68392.0ex.php?topic=87006.0


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: RecycledNoMore on December 16, 2013, 04:32:29 AM
The only thing he has done so far is tell me what he has learned about himself which I guess is the first step I have me mentioned BPD and congratulated him for recognising but said just recognising doesn't mean you can change these things these are ingrained you will need extra help from a professional so far hasn't. No he hasn't spoken to my parents if I assure him I'm coming back. If I don't promise him he wouldn't! Trouble is not sure if it will make a difference with my parents now as he has put them through hell so that's another thing to worry about as I can't not have my parents in our life. They will be in my life just don't want anything to do with him. No I can't trust him at this stage he has done many things and gone back on them sent an apology email taken it back with another email, went on depression tablets then went off them. A couple of weeks ago said he wouldn't apologise now saying he would. How can he become less controlling? Therapy? Or it's part of his personality that will never change?

I am always stunned at the similarities... .

The ex also tried antidepressants for his depression, I dont know if he actually had depression, but In my heart I think he only went to the doc to get in a government benefit, he couldnt hold a job for very long, kept getting into fights or having differences with people, anyhoo, after about a week he stopped taking them, said he didnt like the way they made him feel, so I encourage him to change to a different type, he agrees then nothing.

Actions speak louder than words

You do sound like a lovely compassionate person, and I think this guy knows it

And I think hes using that woderfull quality within you

Against you.


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: Changingman on December 16, 2013, 07:30:59 AM
Believing them? Come on!



lololol!  Hahaha  Nice one

pw BPD

I'll ALWAYS love you... .

... .Grrrrrrrrr... .Grrrrrrrrrr... .GRRRRRRRRRR... .GGGGGGRRRRRRRRRR


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: Pretty Woman on December 16, 2013, 07:42:36 AM
Being split black is absolute HELL.

Believe me, you do not want to experience it. Mine told me I was responsible for our relationship failing and that I was a toxic person. She deleted me from everything, blocked my number and it now dating someone I thought was my friend.

They will smear you to anyone who will listen and they will make YOU feel like you are crazy.

Get out while you can. It will never change and you will hurt more than you are now... .it is like someone ripped your heart out and shoved it in a meat grinder.



Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: heartandwhole on December 16, 2013, 09:00:13 AM
loz1982,

This is very tough to go through, it really pulls on your heartstrings, and I know how tempting it is to believe that he has "seen the light."  So many of us wanted to believe the words, me included. 

You know, he may have had an epiphany, but it doesn't mean he is suddenly, miraculously equipped to act on this realization.  He needs help (just like we do) to change those defensive mechanisms that he has been using his whole life.  That takes time and lots of work, loz!

Saying that he'll apologize to your parents only if you promise to get back with him says to me that he does not understand what true change entails.

If he wants to change, that is wonderful, and I hope he takes action toward that goal.  But wanting to, and being able to, are two different animals.  I don't believe anything would be different if you went back – not because he doesn't want them to be, but because he hasn't learned how to change his behavior/thinking/emotional regulation.  Again, time and work.

This is your time loz1982.  This is your healing, and you have come far.  Only he can heal himself.   



Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: amja77 on December 16, 2013, 01:29:03 PM
loz, all I can say is, be extremely cautious.

My current BPDbf did the same exact thing to me. I let him back in. Believed his promises, his apologies, his confessions, and his praises of me... .that I was right the whole time, I didn't deserve the abuse I endured, I was better off without him, blah blah blah.

But, a month later, after I let him back into my life again (after not communicating with him for 3 years - which were happy years, by the way) his demons and true nature resurfaced slowly but surely. It actually became worse!

I think the fact that we take them back makes us look weak to them, which enables even more abuse because they know that we will always give them a second chance... .they just have to say the right things.

But my mother would always tell me, if he truly loved and wanted to be with you, he'd let you go for your own sake and he would take a few years to get intense help. After being committed to treatment and being truly honest with himself, then, and only then, should you believe any other promise he makes.

I think sometimes we don't think rationally when it comes to them... .it's always our hearts and feelings that lead the way... .we rarely bring our brain into the equation, which is our biggest downfall.


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: loz1982 on December 16, 2013, 07:12:00 PM
Amja that is exactly what I'm afraid of that they are just words I asked him if he wants the number for my psychologist it will give much more faith if he starts getting help now while I'm still away but he said no time got a lot of stuff going on at the moment. If it was me even if I thought I didn't need help I would be making appointments! Are you still with him? So it was good for month then he changed back? My mum agrees with your mum! I believes he wants to be heartandwhole but worry he isn't capable of changing on his own! He know I am vulnerable and yes I think he plays on that! Mine at one stage said I also was the toxic one Earth Angel, such a devastating disorder!


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: goldylamont on December 16, 2013, 07:42:49 PM
Amja that is exactly what I'm afraid of that they are just words I asked him if he wants the number for my psychologist it will give much more faith if he starts getting help now while I'm still away but he said no time got a lot of stuff going on at the moment.

that's an excuse, obviously. i would reply to him (if you choose to reply at all) that you totally understand how busy he is. And for him to check back in with you when he's squared these things away and has made a therapy appointment. << set a simple boundary for yourself that you refuse to talk until you have *proof* that he's already in therapy--not that this is something that he simply wants to do.

I think the title of you post "Can I believe him?" points to a question that all of us have asked ourselves time and again--can we trust our ex? And my conclusion is no--I've had enough experience to know that she is untrustworthy. I think for you loz1982 you can use your experience from the past to reinforce that this person isn't to be trusted. You also have the option of bringing him back into your life, waiting for the abuse to happen and when it does then the depression/anger/anxieties that ensue will be there to tell you the truth that they are already trying to convey--that this person is not trustworthy.


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: loz1982 on December 16, 2013, 10:34:32 PM
I decided not to reply goldylamont I think that gets to them more than a response. I find I am not strong enough to make that boundary known, contact me if you go into therapy, my mum said the same thing, I know it is what I should say. I know what my head is telling me but my heart still feels and by saying that I might never hear from him again. I can hear people saying that is good  but I know it would hurt.

Help should be something he wants to do, if I was him I would be doing everything possible to get him back, I never knew how important trust is in a relationship until now. He said how am I going to know I trust him if I don't go back and see, part of that is right but I thought getting help and fixing the relationship with my parents would be a start in that process. Sometimes I just feel like I'm being too hard on him.


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 16, 2013, 11:29:39 PM
Hi ! So all this said, what does this implies?

Being to hard on him ? Come on !

you are being in constant ccontradiction with yourself.

fix the relation YOU have with your parents, they will make you better, him, ? He has already started his push pull manipulative acts.

Of course it will hurt if you don't walk on "eggshells" with him.

Stay with us, keep your parents because in the end he will easily figure out a way to push them aside of your life gas lighting is a gift to them from satan himself ! Lol


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: loz1982 on December 17, 2013, 12:04:52 AM
I do contradict myself hey I think because I know what is healthy for me and isn't i don't know why I fight it, I know I need to stick to my guns, I don't know why I'm making it worse for myself! I am too compassionate I think I'm what you see is what you get and can't begin to understand someone like this, maybe I never will hence no closure! Jekyll and Hyde describes them perfectly! I'm staying with my folks at the moment which is great for our relationship my ex thinks I'm choosing them over him, maybe I won't hear from him again them I won't need to be the strong one.  marinro7 do you still hear from her?


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 17, 2013, 01:46:46 AM
" marinro7 Do you still hear from her ? "

I do my best not to ,but  sometimes i want to. But since i have decided to stop sabotaging myself and working on my needs and issues. When i get these thoughts my mind keeps them at a place were it becomes easy for me to invalidate them and not womble into were they use to go,ei: i can fix her, she is my soulmate maybe i did this or that so she did this... .hard to put to words but this is happening because i came to realized she did not love me if so and so, i didn't know why i had feelings of love for someone who treated me like this... .so much crazymaking it disturbed my cognitive thinking, even my body this is true. And i came here and remember someone say to me " fell the pain, it will be there and you can't stop it, it is baby steps but you are going to be alright , so went with the pain, my guts hurted, i was obsessed with thoughts of us, her, my son(3),i cried all the time... .but i came back here, read and read again leaving no post than some to make a long story short i work on myself and decide to give my trust to people here and to myself.

the pain crying radically went down (though, remember some heal faster than other)

but i make it about me this is important ME. now is not a good time for me to see her .she did so much to hurt me,if you go trough my profile you can see my posts and get glimpse of my story. I did all this in little time, I was still a wreck last month. Now in great, sometime sad but i can chose if i stay or leave the moment, its not overwhelming were she would rent my mind constantly... i started imagining myself kissing, holding someone else and i'm great with it !


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 17, 2013, 01:57:11 AM
Should i mention, stoping using speed to numb the pain and relaxing on the booze  really made a difference.


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: loz1982 on December 17, 2013, 06:03:20 AM
Happylogist you mentioned about control that they don't necessarily need therapy but be happy to give control to others, be happy to wait for my decision etc. In a way my ex has improved I mean he has said recently he will wait for as long as it takes, is happy not to text me if I need time so as not to influence my decision. I mean that is progress right yet I still hesitate, still want to see more in his actions! He even said he finds it hard as he is not in control of the situation!

marinro7 I take strength from your posts as you seem to be coming out the other side so I know it's possible!


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: Aussie0zborn on December 17, 2013, 06:15:30 AM
Los, it would seem you have a lot to learn about BPD. Try reading the articles here and read as many discussion topics as you can, you will soon see the pattern. Ask as many questions as you like and stick with us.

But firstly, memorise this quote:

"They love without measure those they will soon hate without reason".

That's always how it ends. If you think you're hurting now you will feel a whole lot more hurt later. I would strongly suggest you run as fast as you can.


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 17, 2013, 08:02:04 AM
Let us be your conscience los... .!


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: loz1982 on December 17, 2013, 04:26:18 PM
I will marinro7 when I start to feel bad I'll get on here! Trouble is my ex has never been diagnosed I don't even know if he has BPD that's why I question his ability to change, what if he doesn't? I know despite if he has or he hasn't there are many red flags anyway! When he is good it is fantastic, for someone so complicated he loves the simple things in life I mean what guy wants to go grocery shopping or just walk around the shops, why does he have to ruin things by obsessing about things that aren't even a problem? So sad really I can handle a break up if someone cheats or doesn't want to be with me but not this!


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 17, 2013, 06:41:00 PM
why does he have to ruin things by obsessing about things that aren't even a problem?

This Is going to backfire at you! When he goes there, you reply in closure to soothe I'm. Remember this !... .Soon you will be asking for closure on something... ., even though he will see your distress, is response to this will be : why do YOU have to ruin EVERYTHING by obsessing about things that aren't even REAL?

Mark my words!     Been there, done that.

you know, i cant judge you at all, i did the same things and got further down the limb's, i became delusional ----------they bring you always closer to delirium.


Maybe he is not BPD he hasn't been diagnosed. Mine either, i was the one with BPD and she really think this. They have an ability ( its a curse for all I'm concern) to interpret and modify it. They are not quite aware of this. They do know something is wrong when it happens but like awakening from a dream,it slowly drifts away in little time were we go " ! Man!, i had this dream this morning don't really remember but it was intense!"  ... .Been there ?

that is all part off the splitting /DR.Jekill. Research suggests a similarity to Dissociative identity disorder (DID), also known as multiple personality disorder.

in their case, sufferers get to a point (usually in young age)they have no choice seeking or induced in treatment. In the case of borderline personality, the disorder  validate each and one of their behaviours and being able to change their thinking paterns,space and time,memories... .Yes they suffer, they know all this, but than again can modify it, than they are aware of it, but can gas light themselves and are aware of it, so they validate it by putting fault on one other an they feel guilt, so they modify the discussion they just had, they feel wrong, something wrong with me then split... .it goes on and on, all their lives, immense baggage of guilt intertwined in delusion... .They are poison and even though i felt, god know how much empathy for her, I'm no longer allowed down that part.  If i still yearn for her, love so much and desire her after all that happen, we can consider this disorder has one of the most serious.

I'm not a psychiatrist, so in no way i can tell you that from all you wrote, the behaviors, chain of events, things you mentioned that are pin point specific to pwBPD, my and all here experience, grieving,ptsd... .really couldn't

good luck though


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: loz1982 on December 17, 2013, 09:26:14 PM
My ex did tell me that I think too much and he obsessed on things and now I am the one obsessed so yes he has turned it on me! So deep down they know there is something wrong with them but are able to deal with this by gas lighting painting you black etc. That's prob why they don't have any empathy, my ex really struggles with the concept of apologising justifying in his mind why he wasn't wrong, is this a trait of BPD? He says he will apologise to my parents but I can't help thinking he isn't capable. I'm apparently the love of his life doesn't want any other girl yet doing nothing about it. Do they even know what love is? I mean when I saw him last he was drinking more took up smoking again so clearly is broken hearted! Did you talk to your ex about BPD, how did you find out about it?


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 17, 2013, 10:04:07 PM
Read between lines, i like to be sarcastic... .

I'm not a psychiatrist, so in no way i can tell you that from all you wrote, the behaviors, chain of events, things you mentioned that are pin point specific to pwBPD, my and all here experience, grieving,ptsd... .really couldn't

yes i told her, referred to so many times, she will not acknowledge it. The few times she did was to get me back in the sanitarium.

He doesn't want any other girls... .

i hope it is true for you but keep an open mind and be aware of any disappointment that may occur. I don't wish you this.

mine to was all over me i occupied her head for 4 years before she would start all the nasty name calling, heavy smear campaigns. Before it was bad but not has intense. The biggest ordeal started 2 years ago when i addmited that i loved her, even though. She had abused me before, my kids... .before that we were really good friend in an unhealthy relation, the sex was wonderful ( always been


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: goldylamont on December 18, 2013, 02:47:44 AM
My ex did tell me that I think too much and he obsessed on things and now I am the one obsessed so yes he has turned it on me! So deep down they know there is something wrong with them but are able to deal with this by gas lighting painting you black etc. That's prob why they don't have any empathy, my ex really struggles with the concept of apologising justifying in his mind why he wasn't wrong, is this a trait of BPD?

gaslighting and never apologizing or taking responsibility for the horrible things they say and/or do? YES loz1982 these are traits of BPD--no one here can diagnose your bf, but ya know... .


He says he will apologise to my parents but I can't help thinking he isn't capable.

this to me would be the easiest thing to do. you can find the truth here. he brought up apologizing, so if you choose to communicate with him (and kind of sounds like you plan on responding to him), then set him up. be kind, praise him for his courage and kindness in wanting to apologize to your parents. then tell him he should do it and you can't wait to hear their response and that you support his efforts.

then, see what happens -- my guess is that he'll try and divert things and get you to commit to him before he does any apologizing. my guess is that he doesn't really care at all about apologizing to them and is only saying it b/c he's at a low point and knows this is what you want to hear (and it seems to be working on you, right?).

but all of this is moot--you can find out just by seeing if he apologizes. when/if he doesn't, then you know it's a ploy to reel you in and it's not sincere; and it sounds insincere to me.

right now you are confused. your gut instinct is telling you he is not sincere in his intentions yet another part of you wishes he is. but you have many opportunities to find out the truth without putting yourself in too much danger.

Game Recognize Game -- meaning you are aware of and prepared for any possible motive of his.

I'm apparently the love of his life doesn't want any other girl yet doing nothing about it.

Well... .I dunno. I will say this; I know that I had a significant impact on my ex's life and she on me. Our r/s was the longest/deepest one that either one of us had (and I suspect one of the more stable ones for her). And sounds like you had a big impact on him also. Unfortunately though when someone with a PD wants something from you then they will say anything to get it, including that you are "the love of his life". I'm not saying that he didn't have this emotion; sure he feels you are the love of his life as much as he hates you and thinks you are worthless. But that's the problem, they swing one way or the other so you can't put much stock in their words. My ex told me all kinds of crap about how much in love with me she was and how much she missed and wanted to be with me, only to switch up the next day and say she wanted to be single. Who really gives a dang how she felt in the moment, in reality, it was a bunch of crap  :) Is this the first time he's made claims like this? If not, has he ever backed them up with actions? Or is it just talk?

Him saying "you are the love of my life and I don't want any other girls" means "loz1982, I want you to tell me that I AM the love of YOUR life and that you don't want any other MEN. This will make me feel like i won't be abandoned by you. And then since I'll have regained my power from hearing this, now I can devalue and abuse you with it."

I'm hoping this stuff isn't too heavy. Just want you to see a likely possibility. Game Recognize Game -- since you've been through this before you are wiser now and keener to his bag of tricks. If you're not sure, it's OK, means you need to verify. But no need to jump back in and verify this way. Just see if he gives a sincere apology to your parents and let us know what happens. I wish you the best loz 


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: eternalbloom on December 18, 2013, 03:10:29 AM
I agree with the majority here. Their words have no meaning. There's a possibility that things could get worse. Each time I let my ex back he told me how I was the abuser. In fact he printed out the definition of emotional abuse and hit me square in the face with the paper. Awesome right? Everything I complained about he projected onto me. It was like arguing with a very violent and strong 4 year old. Enough to make me go crazy. My head hurts just thinking about the hell Ive been through.


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: loz1982 on December 18, 2013, 09:59:44 PM
Yes Goldylamont he has already said he will apologise but I have to come back first. He should've apologised a year ago so I figure if he hasn't said it by now I'm holding my breath for nothing! If it was me I would be over to his parents in a shot, I feel I shouldn't be pushing him to apologise he is worried about the timing of it I said if it's sincere it doesn't matter when you say it. We can be together but will never be happy with this situation hanging over our heads, correction I won't be I'm sure my ex wouldn't care if he didn't see my parents again! Is it wrong to want my parents support in our relationship! Back in Aug he also said I was his soul mate and wrote a written apology to my parents after seeing me crying for a week but then took the email back a week later. He doesn't think before he acts I don't know if this is his personality or a trait of BPD. So no not many actions at all back up his words so have very limited faith in him anymore when he says things! Then to say I don't have time too see a professional really makes me doubt him. He needs to do that for himself but at the very least for me but as pattern in our relationship not for me either!


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 18, 2013, 11:26:55 PM
Nice to see you are beginning to see patterns here,... .wheel's in motion.

He doesn't think before he acts---yes they act impulsively without being considered of the fallout. Sad, the things she did and said... .all like a sword through my guts.

then if I would bring it up... .; it was all in my head, my little tales.


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: loz1982 on December 19, 2013, 02:10:37 AM
Did you ever get an apology marinro7 I got a personal one recently after so long he seemed sincere but it doesn't take back the words that hurt so much sometimes I think emotional abuse is just as bad as physical. You can forgive but not forget


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 19, 2013, 02:27:19 AM
Apologies are still words,and coming from her its worthless

and indeed this what happened.

life


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: loz1982 on December 19, 2013, 09:57:35 PM
My ex text mea couple of weeks ago with pictures of some new floor boards he has put in the house, funny he seems to be doing all this stuff when I am gone than when I was there probably burying himself in work to help with the pain. Anyway he told me they were going for a permit for some land so they can build double the amount of sheds they were having a meeting yesterday to see if it will go ahead. When I was with him this would affect me greatly as it would mean moving again as it has always been a dream of his so I was happy if he was. I had to be lucky I was happy with them as it is his way or the highway.  Anyway he text me today to see how my work was going and I asked him if they will be buying the land and he said no offence intended but I don't wish to share any more business details whilst things are the way they are and being separated. You are no longer within the family circle being estranged and wish to keep things private from now on. Is that just me but is that a form of emotional abuse? I know they are private people but he knows me and knows it would stay between us, besides if he wants me back like he claims doesn't he realise this could affect my life as well? Once again an example of him not thinking about me. I guess it is also a sign of immaturity which seems to be a trait of BPD sufferers! My ex is so suspicious of everything, I said to him a while back as my Dad is a farmer, I thought maybe in the future if you needed any help when you go on a bigger farm, Dad could help out. Just a suggestion, he totatally went off and said I knew your parents were trying to interfere in our lives, has he ever heard of being grateful?


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 20, 2013, 12:35:33 AM
guess it is also a sign of immaturity which seems to be a trait of BPD sufferers!

My  kids used to act like this before they could understand basic behavior one should have for one an other, this was about the age of 2.

Do you really need all that drama and pain?

Is your life wonderful to this extreme where you have to mix all that $hit in to dilute it?

Get off, have faith in yourself and recovery, start soon. I promise you will get great fast... .acceptance trust me. Might be written words but they don't come from a BPD.

But take actions.



Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: arn131arn on December 20, 2013, 12:51:46 AM
Nice to see you are beginning to see patterns here,... .wheel's in motion.

He doesn't think before he acts---yes they act impulsively without being considered of the fallout. Sad, the things she did and said... .all like a sword through my guts.

then if I would bring it up... .; it was all in my head, my little tales.

I had something happen to me.  She left again (split) back in early September.  I'm ready to move, get attorneys involved, change the locks on my door.  What happens?  She calls me the day before I meet with her dad.  recycles me.  Tells me that we need to talk. 

She needs counseling (which she has been going to since) because she had issues.  She even opened up and admitted she couldn't trust anyone!  I was overjoyed.  Thought she was finally seeing the light.  Then she lied to me a week later and told me she was at a churrch prayer group, but she was at a concert with "friends".

She told me that she couldn't tell me the truth because I would get mad.  She NEVER gave me the chance on that one!  To not get mad?  Totlaly my fault, and I was at fault.  Besides, these are church counselors that she pays 10 dollars to see every week.  They are NOT qaulified to deal with her!



Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 20, 2013, 02:26:53 AM
----Besides, these are church counselors that she pays 10 dollars to see every week.  They are NOT qaulified to deal with her!-------





! I don't get this were a grown adult human being would seek cure or behavioral improvements through god praying, religion's psych interpretations bull $hit ?

So if I try  to resonate in a similar manner I would say that he would've have made her like that?

Or if he made you like this, it's is hiti#g business its useless to ask over and over why?

Or hey! He's around us he listens to our demands! Then why she's still £ucked up!


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: Pearl55 on December 20, 2013, 02:53:30 AM
marinro7

Borderlines believe they are not lovable. Some have strong tendency to religious beliefs. The more religious ones desparate to beleive god loves them. They only want to be loved even in their relationships.

Religion and ... .won't resolve their issues. So sad.


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 20, 2013, 03:22:47 AM
marinro7

Borderlines believe they are not lovable. Some have strong tendency to religious beliefs. The more religious ones desparate to beleive god loves them. They only want to be loved even in their relationships.

Religion and ... .won't resolve their issues. So sad.

Yah! ... .but anyway, it's about us and not them , right pearl?


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: Pearl55 on December 20, 2013, 05:10:33 AM
marinro7

Yes of course. Who cares about us?

They want us love them unconditionally, care for them constantly,validate them ... .This is a endless list!


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: loz1982 on December 20, 2013, 05:40:01 AM
I'm here thinking about my ex who I know is at a Christmas party tnite and will prob meet someone else. It happens like that they always find it easier even though they don't deserve it, seem to land on their feet. It hurts to think about him with someone else even though I know he is unhealthy for me. I have such conflicting emotions!


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: loz1982 on December 23, 2013, 01:09:34 AM
I got a message from my ex yesterday saying he misses me very very much and it pains him why he was so removed from my feelings and needs! Does that show a level of self awareness? I know they are just words and believe me I am skeptical but isn't it common of BPD sufferers to just move on and forget once you are gone from their lives. Why is he still wanting me back?


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: necchi on December 23, 2013, 01:21:56 AM
I got a message from my ex yesterday saying he misses me very very much and it pains him why he was so removed from my feelings and needs! Does that show a level of self awareness? I know they are just words and believe me I am skeptical but isn't it common of BPD sufferers to just move on and forget once you are gone from their lives. Why is he still wanting me back?

Hi! Loz, not necessarily the push/pull behaviors, testing you, guilt pitty game... .remember?

It's sometime better not to question and see what life has got ahead for us!


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: loz1982 on December 23, 2013, 01:56:16 AM
Do you think he is just appealing to my emotions? I just thought he would rebound to someone else but he doesn't seem to want to let me go! I hate that it tugs at my heart strings as I don't know how much of it is the disorder and how much of it is genuine!


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: DragoN on December 23, 2013, 02:04:08 AM
Excerpt
I don't know how much of it is the disorder and how much of it is genuine!

1. It's "genuine" if you take the bait, and then the same old crap will start up.

2. If you don't take the bait, the same old crap will start up much sooner.

That's a decade of experience with the "genuiness" of anything PD related. You may have better luck but I rather doubt it.

Get it in writing, but that won't save you either.


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: loz1982 on December 23, 2013, 02:20:36 AM
MeganK was your ex diagnosed? I guess I wonder if he actually had it sometimes without a professional diagnosis and he has been consistent in blaming himself for awhile now whereas in the past he has riverted back to blaming others. I guess I'm being naive!


Title: Re: Can I believe him?
Post by: Surnia on December 23, 2013, 04:31:43 AM
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