BPDFamily.com

I'm wondering how the extended times of ST have worked out for various individuals here dealing with BPD partners. My uBPDh has been pushing me away for several months, and is now not living in the house and moved his things out about a week ago. Since then he's found reasons to have to make contact with me, but the last communication was a day and a half ago and I responded yesterday morning. No response from him (I take that as success that my S.E.T.-based communication was well received since there was no snotty response like there usually is).

Now I'm just waiting. I read in here that ST can last months, and I wonder if that is complete silence, or if there are times when small contact is made? True silence between us has only (so far) been one day, so I guess I can't complain. And I know our experience is unique, but I'd love to hear the stories from others on how long it went and how you handled (either handling it well, or not-so-well) things during that time. Did it seem to end earlier if you didn't respond at all?

   


Trying to predict when it will end... .only makes it harder and worse on you.

The general goal is to figure out a plan for each day... .each week... etc etc that you will be happy with.  If your partner comes along... .great... .if not... .you have a plan that you will be happy with.

Slowly... .over time... .as they realize the ST is not "getting to you"... .they may drop it.

"Chasing" them... .trying to convince them to drop ST... .usually feeds the fire and makes it worse (long term).

FF

My wife used to average ST about 3 times a month lasting anywhere from 2 days to 2 weeks.

I was at a cookout about 7 years ago with my wife. I was talking to a buddy of mine about ST. Told him (Sarcastically) "My wife loves me SO MUCH she will give me "Vacation Time" in the form of ST. I can do what I want, Come and Go as I want, Watch what I want, Do my hobbies, hang out with friends, whatever... .  It's awesome !"

She overheard the conversation and in 7 years has only given me ST twice... .

Not trying to predict when it will end. I'm just learning from the experiences of others. I find it encouraging.

This is awesome! haha

Mine so far hasn't been full ST... .only for a day or two... .maybe a week, but I don't really consider that serious ST. It's been a day and a half (almost) since our last contact (text) so we'll see how long this one will last. I don't chase him. I only answer questions as they come, and then I give it some time before I answer. I try to make sure that the answers are brief and follow the ideas of S.E.T., etc.

Sometimes, I envy people who get ST from their partner  .  My wife usually goes into text message bombing and verbal assaults to the point where I have to turn my phone off.  It's only after I enforce a boundary do I get silence, which usually means limited contact for a few days.  Then she slowly starts with the quick and necessary communication, and the baiting communication where I feel she is looking for reasons to re-start her assault. 

Been there too. To the point that I would pretend I was on the phone whenever he was home, just so I could avoid being verbally attacked. Or I would make sure I was never alone with him (my adult niece lives with us and he was not staying in our room at the time it got bad). I feel for what you're going through! And you're right, the ST is a bit of a vacation!

Typically he gives me ST for 5 to 6 weeks. If left to himself... .6 weeks. He starts coming out of it. Wants to talk, pick back up. ST is usually set off by me being the recipient of something really crappy he did. I think he figures in 6 weeks, he can sweep it under a rug.

This time i cracked at 5 weeks. So i am guessing another 6 weeks. As far as a vacation... it wasnt one i wanted.

My best advice is not to go in his direction until it is clear he is coming in yours. Easy said, hard to apply.

How did you "crack?" I'm thinking about what 5-6 weeks will feel like... .yikes!

I had planned on saying nothing until he came out of ST on his own. But he did something someone told me about that had to do with me, and it really touched me, so I tried to talk to him. He sat on skype, moved himself from "online" to "invisible" then back to online, then invisible. If you use Skype chat a lot, you know what I mean. He refused to reply. And in the interim between yesterday and today has said nothing.

I see him logging in and out.

So basically I feel I cracked and rewarded him for his silent treatment to me.

Whatever enjoyment he got out of it, if any. I don't know. It's just validation to him that he has "power" over me. I could sit there and talk at him. He would likely read it, but refuse a response.

General consensus here on this forum is to go about my business until he gets tired of ST and wants to talk. I agree, but it's really hard to do.

This.

I feel your pain. But that's a long time, and you have incredible strength and love to endure. It's something different going on in their minds. We can't really understand it. I have explained it by saying it's like he feels if he can't beat me (emotionally) to the point that I MUST stay with him, then he can never be sure that I will stay with him. It's so backward, but that's how his mind seems to work. Like he can't trust that my love for him and my commitment to our vows is enough to keep me by his side through it all.

I'm not the typical BPD SO. I think we connected on this level because of how we connected, on the internet, and when I went to Haiti I was dependent on him and relatively quiet and under his arm since I didn't speak the language. Now he gets here and I'm an independent, established, hard-working person with a career and educational goals, and all sorts of stuff going on. He had an incredible shock. So did I!

So I carry on and thank God for this site so I can be encouraged.

Bless you!

My boyfriend is extremely intolerant of me feeling hurt when it is him who caused the hurt. So if I tell him I am hurting, he becomes impatient and angry.

I got caught up in my own emotions when I talk to him and told him that I am hurting. Stupid me  :'( Guaranteed now that he won't be talking. ANY show of pain from his actions and he is cutting me off.

On the other hand, if I cheerfully contacted him periodically he would probably start to feel very ok and come out to talk and pick back up.

Your husband will be showing up again. You are married and whatever his intent, you will get opportunities to engage and try to have a positive experience with him.

I'm taking that!

I think part of the problem is that he really doesn't have an OPTION to leave me. Not unless he wants to go back to Haiti. He's determined that no one (not even USCIS and Homeland Security) will tell him what to do. Somehow he thinks this will work out for him. Haha

Do you use Skype chat to communicate to other people?  Can you switch over to another form of chat (I use google more than Skype... .but I do Skype some)

Here is the thing... .I've gotten to know many different people that have gone through silent treatment or some other odd form of communication via the internet (skype, FB, google plus, etc etc etc)

I can't think of one example where it ended up being healthy for the person on the receiving end of ST to keep "watching" a FB page, or otherwise "participating" in the ST.

ST is an unhealthy way of communicating "something" to another party... .to me... .it falls in the realm of "mind games".  When someone else decides to play these games... .IMO... .the first big decision is whether to play at all or not.

So... .maybe you need to focus on the "principle" involved here... .and see if you should even be playing this game at all with him. 

Once you get the principle right... .then we can figure out what that looks like on a day to day basis.

These are all actions and decisions you can make for yourself... .he is not involved... .this gives you the power back over you. 

Thoughts on this?

FF

I have a lot of friends on Skype.

I have never used google chat.

I don't want to play the game with him. I never want to. Usually if it's a week of silence on his part, I can deal. After a week or so I can say "hey, are you there?" and he will answer and be ok. But this extended ST... .it's really getting to me.

He did it last summer for 4 months and I tore into him until he left Skype, about 2 months into it. Then I sat and felt really devastated he was gone. This time, I have been letting it ride.

I understand he may feel terrible and be trying to cope. At the same time, I feel I am being targeted. As I said elsewhere, it's really triggering off things for me. Not as bad as in the past, because the shock factor is no longer there for me.

Skype has a block feature. I can block him. He won't see me there anymore. My thoughts had been that since he was making himself present ( implied he is still there and wants to be there for me, but is too upset to talk) I also wanted to make myself available. Even if I said nothing. Problem is I said something, then am ignored, and that takes me really far down.

Sorry to t/j Ptilda 

 

Catch me up again on why you don't talk to him face to face... .or on the phone.

Still learning your story... .

FF

We are long distance. About 400 miles. He refuses to answer my calls since this happened. Thought of driving over but figured door would be slammed in my face. :/

OK... is there a plan for you guys to be in same city again sometime?

Why are you guys living apart right now?  Or has it been that way for a while.

FF

I will start another thread on this stuff:

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=279759.new#new

Don't worry about adding your questions, Daniell85. It's helpful for me too.

I just wonder if my best bet is to just be silent? Is there a point where I should reach out? I know that point wouldn't be now, but how do I make that determination? I'm new to playing by these rules.

Ha! I'm guilty of text bombing BPDh! I do it because actual conversations can become ugly. Plus, I tend to think he may actually read them, but when we are talking he zones out. I'd rather not have to text him like that, but in person communication rarely meets with good results.

I used to get ST way more than I do now. In fact, I have to watch myself that I don't slip into doing it, and I have been more recently. He does it to me, I'll do it back. Not a good thing, I know. It's not like he understands, or "gets it" when I do it. I always think he'll have a lightbulb moment, and be like "this must be how it feels when I do this to her", but of course he doesn't.

His ST rarely lasted more than a half hour or so though. I could never hold out past that either, because I always end up trying to address the real issue, but that usually leads to him dysregulating or getting defensive. I wish he could see we are on the same team, and that I'm not out to control him or any of the weird things he thinks.

I think the best thing you can do during ST is to act as if it doesn't bother you. If they know it bothers you, you'll likely get more of it.

I know what you mean. Face-to-face conversations are absolutely impossible with us. Have been for months now. No matter what is said, he finds a way to twist it into me having said something horrible even if I said the opposite. I find that texting and facebook communication is the best. Also, I like Facebook because I can control things a bit more there, taking my time to answer or even read the message. He can see that I'm not reading his message right away. But I feel that messages help to provide greater borders. I've actually refused to pick up the phone the past several times he called, because I knew it would be a fight. I blamed it on teaching. It's easier to calculate my response through text.

I'm convinced that the way we will resolve our issues are to have consistent guided communication for a period of several weeks until he can allow me to finish a sentence without interrupting. It's just not going to work any other way. He asks a question and demands an answer and either twists my answer, or interrupts before I can answer.

Something I am coming to understand with ST, is my boyfriend is using it as a means to enforce a boundry he thinks is being crossed. He feels he is being pushed around or controlled. So he decides to do ST to show that HE is in control. So if I say something, he ignores. And if I indicate I find that upsetting ( and he knows it massively upsets me) he will do it until he is absolutely certain I am placing no hope or expectations on him. At that point he feels that I understand it's HIS choice to speak to me. Then he does. First things he tells me is how terrible I am. If I resist agreeing to that, he goes back to ST.

It's infuriating. What he is resisting from me is my triggering over his having cheated. He feels I am forcing onto him that he was crap. And he then gets tired of me telling him he is crap. So he stages a situation where he can then bully and punish me with ST.

Round we go.

Honestly Ptilda, I would reset expectations of this resolving quickly or that you "have" to do something like trying to engage him so it can be fixed. Likely he needs time to calm down and when legitimate things need addressed ( mail and so on) and you get the opportunity to apply what you are learning here... .

I read somewhere on the site here that in the beginning, they have to learn you can be trusted on an emotional level. So you kind of take it for the team until he feels trust for you, and then you work from there.

What about YOU taking a little break for yourself. Unless he contacts you, give yourself a week or something to calm and recover, do things for YOU?

I know it's hard to refocus. I am trying to do that, myself.

I would make an effort to change the subject here... .make sure you a clear that you want to spend time with him... but aren't available now for hard or controversial subjects.  Don't say never... .just not right now.

If he persists... .make it about you... .and leave.  "I can't discuss this right now... I'll check in with you in a couple hours... ." 

Here is the thing... .you shouldn't be talking about how terrible he is... and vice versa... .unless there is an invitation from the other party to talk about "hard" things.  Even then... it should be sparing.

FF

The more time I spend here, the more I am understanding just why things have gotten so fouled up.

I feel like I should be a real go getter about all of this. But today I am bummed out about the whole thing. Maybe time to go do some gardening and clear my head.

Yes, I was just really happy to see him again and spend time and such. He was all about how he just wasn't sure, he didn't think Danielle had changed, and he didn't know. Just because he is immature to do ST for 4 months doesn't make him the moral authority. I am so tired of that.

As for me telling him is crap, for me after being called "substandard" a "sociopath" "mentally ill" and just outright bullied, yes, at times I have told him he is not exactly nice himself and I don't appreciate some of the things he has done.

Well I "get" now that it's all a waste of breath, emotion, energy, and time.

Why have these conversations at all? 

Many times it is better to "do" a r/s... .rather than talk about it. 

Pack in a bunch of good memories... then you have something to talk about.

If he is inquisitive about why you can't talk about r/s stuff... .you take ownership of that... .don't blame him. 

Thoughts?

He brought it up. Put it out there.

I understand your point of redirecting and no addressing baiting or whatever it may be.

The truth is I don't want to talk about it. Not because I think issues shouldn't be addressed. But because I can't talk to someone who begins raging, threatening and abusing as soon as he feels he is being asked to take responsibility.

Not only does he do silent treatment, he hangs up the telephone on me, he deactivates facebook, etc, in the middle of a conversation. He bullies, he threatens to dump me, to leave.

I am actually getting overwhelmed at this point because I think about all of these things and it hurts to have been struggling so much and feel so threatened. I appreciate that you are trying to help, though.

That is his choice... .

you have a choice to engage in the convo... .or not.  It seems these conversations rarely go well... .so... .don't talk about it.

Have you tried this?


Then don't talk.  Schedule a time when you will be fresh and ready... .that will give him time as well.  End/reschedule convo at the first hint of bullying.


Yep... I know the feeling... .let's break this up into small bites.

I would focus on not even starting conversations... .that traditionally go bad.  Or rescheduling them to when you are "fresh".

When is the best time for you to talk about things?

FF

No time is a good time to have them. He will speak up and let me know situation is my fault and he probably can't stay because I am so substandard.

Sometimes I just say, ok. It really is ok. Let's agree to put things down and move on from each other. He backpeddles.

He doesn't often try to start a conversation. Any discussion usually comes out of me triggering from his affair or catching him out in a lie.

I've actually been heading in the direction of ignoring a lot of things because to try and get a straight answer turns into a rage from him. And he doesn't actually scream and shout. He says a few controlled nasty things, threatens to block me or give me silent treatment. Or refuses to respond and does a disappearing act. He is furious when he does that. Very angry. I used to chase him around when he does that. Bad results. Last 9 months or so, I just let him go. He comes back and pretends nothing happened. I let it go.

Unless I actually have a major panic attack, I let it all go. Go about my business.

Silent treatment continues today. He hasn't actually shown as logged in since Friday. I believe that is due to me trying to talk to him the day or so before. If I am going to talk to him and he feels I am saying I feel bad or that he gets a whiff of "blame", he does a disappearing act.

I am guessing along about September   with no comments from me to him of any kind, he will get over the horrible way I have been treating him enough to give me another chance. ( I am cynical :)  

Can you write out some word for word on what this looks like... .


I'm thinking that trying to figure out why he logs in and out is energy wasted. 

Here is the thing... .being in a r/s with pwBPD traits can be exhausting... .draining... .  So... I recommend that people think long and hard about where they put effort. 

So... .instead of "noticing" he is on or off an online place... .and then working through things in your mind about why... .is there a way to skip that?

Where else could you put your energy... .that might help you feel better... .or more productive?

FF

I just work. Clean. Garden.

After last night's conversation with him, I feel doing anything else is better than thinking very much about why he does anything.

So we're on a week "blackout" communication wise.

7/7 he texed and asked why I gave his key back.

7/8 I responded: "I want to be certain that you have access to the house and to any important mail you might receive. It must have been very frustrating for you to have to wait for me to get the items to you when you needed them. In the future, you will still have access and won't have to wait for me to find time and a way to make the delivery of your things."

7/13 I took a photo of a medical bill he received and sent it to him. I've done that before and he understood what it meant, so figured that's the best way to let him know the mail is here without engaging conversation. No response, and the bill is still sitting on the island in the kitchen.

I am curious where he is living?

He has said he wants a divorce?

If I were you, I would look into what the requirements are for him to be here on his own, without being sent back to Haiti.

Either he has a plan, or he is reacting from impulse.

If he looks like he thinks he can hold out on you, divorce, and stay in the US anyway, then I would keep an eye on timelines associated with that. Because setting you up as a domestic abuser and making a paper trail may allow him to appeal to stay on asylum.

Beyond that, hugs to you, this empty air where they are supposed to be in your life can be hard to cope with when you don't know when it will end.

I don't know where he's living.

He has said he wants a divorce, but as far as I know, has made no attempt to file. He might be in contact with a lawyer, but that is uncertain. He also tells everyone how much he loves me but that he "cant be with" me... .and his reason? He's too proud to admit he's wrong. Seriously, he said that. When his friends push him and say that he needs to do the right thing and work it out with me, he just stops talking to them. But he un-blocked me on Facebook a while back, and he's made other efforts to remain in my life. He has also had some cordial conversation with my mother.

His options for staying here without being with me are:

1. Prove that I am abusive or "excessively cruel" to him. This cannot be done. I am verifiably patient and kind to him and have an excellent reputation for being level-headed and dealing well in conflict.

2. Prove that he has made a real effort to make the relationship work. This is also not possible at this point. He scheduled ONE counseling session which he expected me to miss (he purposefully told me about 30 minutes before hand where it would be, and I had to quickly reschedule my day to make it fit). He spoke over the counselor the entire time and didn't let me speak except when she made him stop 10 minutes before the session was over... .and he "patiently" waited for me to say 2 sentences and took over again until she ended the session. He confessed to her that he gets angry and cannot control his physical responses because it's like "something takes over my mind." This is the one and only session he completed (as far as I know) but I've been back to that therapist alone, and I've also had sessions with the Haitian pastor and his wife to help me see some of the cultural issues, and I'm working with another therapist on this. Since he started acting this way one month after arriving in the US, it looks exceedingly bad for him.

He reacted (past tense) from impulse and now has a problem coming back. He burned some bridges almost beyond repair (cutting off relationship with his friends and family and even with some of my family, and saying a lot of crazy things). Now because of his self-confessed pride, it's nearly impossible for him to admit he was wrong. He feels incredible shame for having the police called on him, which is why he changed the story to saying I beat him (but he already admitted to several people to having hit me, and there was a witness, and I had physical injuries when the police came). So his shame makes it necessary for him to blame someone or something else. I think he is in such shock at the way he acted, that he is afraid he'll get there again. I actually believe that he thinks he is saving me from him by leaving me. He keeps saying, "you can find another man and be happy."

There is absolutely no paper trail that sets me up as an abuser. The problem he is going to come up against is his honesty. His stories are greatly varied, and that is going to be clear to anyone who interviews him. He honestly has zero chance (at this point) of being awarded permanent residence if he divorces me.

I figure we'll give it a few months and see if things start to resolve themselves. If that does not happen, I'll look for legal council that will evaluate the possibility of sitting down with him. The problem is that he will simply not allow me to speak with him AT ALL. We cannot talk about anything even to the point of speaking about how we can divorce in a way that is beneficial to both of us, because he won't allow a single word. He either starts screaming or he leaves.

If it becomes impossible for me to get a civil meeting with him, then I'll look to the USCIS office and see what my options are concerning the visa. But that's a way down the road.