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Hello everyone

Almost 2 months after I broke up, and I have not been successful with the full NC. Just not comfortable with that, this is just not me, doesn't correspond to my personality.

I started working with a T and I see her for the 2nd time next Tuesday.

Which is a very good timing because I see my ex tomorrow for the entire day. He has some belongings to pick up at my place and he really wanted to spend time the all 4 of us (with his kid and mine who are really missing each other). I said yes because I have said no at almost every request from him and I thought that our kids would like it and that I can be around my ex of a day, it won't kill me. And I want him to take his belongings for good.

Then, the best thing after that would be NC. I am not sure I can do this.

I thought about LC. As my T suggested , I could answer without answering. Without giving any info on me.

Have some of you done the LC? How? What kind a LC? How did it go?

Thank you

I can talk only for my case. After the breakup I went to strict NC for 1.5 months. Then I contacted her when I was in a bad place emotionally. We met again, but I didn't want to continue r/s. We remained in LC for few weeks but I have recognize that she starts the same behaviour again, increases the intensity of our contact, adds romantic alusions to our conversations and I knew that I am not ready to handle any of these things so I went NC again.

My opinion is that LC is not so good idea for many reasons, some of them:

What is the point? You want to be friend or girlfriend to him? In any of those cases LC doesn't make sense. Do you have friends that you 'force' LC with?

I think he won't tolerate LC. He will paint you black. pwBPD will recognize LC, not fulfilling his needs fully as abandonment again

Thank you for your answer Blackbirdsong

What kind of LC did you get? Phone calls? Emails?

I don't want to be his friend and I don't want to be friends with benefits either. I would like to not feel bad whenever I will see him ( we live in the same area, our jids go to the same school and attend the same karate class on Saturdays... .)

I could have some news from him once in a while as I have had with some ex in the past, but that's it. Why not go with no contact? I am not comfortable with that.

Of course I count on my T or help me find a good strategy that will suit me... .

May the LC does the work little by little?

I tried LC for similar reasons that you listed in the original post.  Cutting people off isn't my style.  I believe strongly in forgiveness and reconciliation.  I try to be radically accepting of people.

It didn't turn out so well.

My ideals ran into the reality of his condition like a car running into a brick wall in one of those crash tests.  The first time I saw him after the breakup, it was wonderful.  He wanted to be close to me and to talk to me.  The next time after that, I expected things to improve even more, or for him to want to get back together -- something I still hoped for at that point.  But within five minutes of our next encounter, I angered him (very literally) by the way I looked at him.  He left the event extremely angry, on the verge of exploding, and wrote me a nasty letter a couple days later detailing all of my alleged offenses against him and how he never wanted to hear from me again.

A few months later, when I was seeing someone else and had moved on, he came to an event with our mutual friends.  I was worried about going to the event with him, but I went in order to assert my place in the group.  I avoided him like the plague, staying far away from him and avoiding even making eye contact with him.  I had a few friends acting as witnesses in case things went wrong.  It was an uneventful evening.  Then, when I expressed interest in going to a party at a mutual friend's home that he wanted to attend as well, he called me a "psycho stalker" and said that he wanted nothing to do with me or any of our friends again.  He hasn't been seen around any of us since . . .

In the meantime, he's been contemplating a restraining order against me -- for looking at him wrong and going to a party that I wanted to attend for other reasons -- which he would almost certainly get if he applied, since my county government gives them out like candy.  It would cost me $600 - $1000 to fight it with a lawyer, and since I'm a public employee, I basically have no choice.  Do I want to renovate my bathroom, or do I want to poke the bear again and see if we can reconcile?  Ha, easy choice.

Yeah, so much for altruism.  NC is best for me.

LC didn't work out very well for me with my uBPDexgf. I think the underlying context of our period of trying to be "just friends" was: "if everything was hunky dory between us, why wouldn't we just get back together?" That makes a casual platonic occasional friendship with LC pretty fraught. Nothing is "light" in a breakup.

Isa_lala, I have been LC for about a month now, after NC for two weeks. So I'm about six weeks from the end of our relationship. LC means that about a month ago I sent her an email -- one of those stock-tacking emails: "I'm sad things didn't work out, I hope we can remember the good times, I wish you all the best ... ." -- that kind of thing.

After a few days, she responded in a series of texts and emails over the course of a week or so. The first one was along the lines of "I'm trying to move on with someone new, but all I can think of is you. I hate that you did this to me. I love you so much. I just want to forget all about you ... ." I tried to keep things sane by replying that I was in pain too, but if she's moving on and we can't make it work, why do we have to be hostile. The next day she sent an email apologizing for having hurt me (which was a big step! she had never acknowledged that any of her action caused pain), then the next day she sent emails reminding me of happy memories. I emailed her noting a few things she did that really hurt me and telling her why I think she's headed for heartache if she continues to relate to men the way she does (i.e. craving sexual attention from lots of men). She responded that she had read my email, but "was busy" and would have to reply in a few days. After a few days, she wrote that she was "too tired to say anything of worth or meaning", but would see whether she had anything useful to say the next day. The next day she wrote saying that she was sexually frustrated and missed doing XXXX with me --- basically she wrote me a very graphic email instead of addressing anything of substance.

What I take from all this is the following -- my ex is in some ways trying. But she behaves selfishly and manipulatively and doesn't seem capable of maintaining any effort at being friendly if she doesn't get the romantic/sexual ego boost she craves out of it. That hurts and makes LC hard at times. On the other hand, my ex is not nearly so cruel and abusive as some of the people described on this board, so it hasn't been a disaster. LC has been good for me, in the sense that it's allowed me to draw boundaries when my ex tries to pull me back in. Also we live in different cities now, so I don't have to worry about seeing her. So it's given me a sense of control to know I can respond sanely when she writes. At this point, I don't reach out to her. She's written a few more times, ruminating about our connection and her worries about losing that. It can be hard and disorienting, but at the end of our relationship she was so manipulative/unfaithful/angry that I would never seriously think of taking her back. I'm frustrated that she can't seem to make a sustained effort to leave things in a friendly place, but I prefer LC because it makes me feel like I'm true to myself and has given me a sense of being in some control of my emotions.

That's just my story! So much depends on how your individual ex is, I think.

I tried LC with my ex and she wasn't interested in being my friend, because she was still so angry at me and kept telling me she was still 'bothered' by what happened and every time she thinks about me she gets angry. There are no chummy feelings there between us. I'm a huge trigger for her and it wasn't sustainable even being low contact because I would have been the one reaching out to her while she did what she wanted, and she only would have come around when she had no one else, I'm guessing your ex would do the same.

The downside is that if you're not LC with them they probably will not think about you, because from what I've learned is that out of sight is out of mind for people with BPD. So, if your goal is to be friends and hopefully move past that at some point, I think the only way to do that is to be LC and hope she tries to recycle you. If you're NC then she will continue to not think about you and move forward.

That's pretty much where my attempt at LC eventually wound up as well.

Lc leads to increased contact, leads to recycle.

In my experience.

Yep. And you have to ask yourself do you really want to be a rebound or someone for them to fall back on when their latest fling doesn't work out? :/

I agree that it's very hard to manage the emotions that a BPD ex can provoke, that it can be very frustrating, and that often the best way forward might be NC. I would only add that LC does not necessarily lead to increased contact and to recycle. We're not completely passive participants in these relationships. I have decided only to reply to my ex's contact, never to initiate. She has reached out in emails and texts in different ways - anger, longing, dirty talk, happy memories, pain, ... .

Yes, it can be very manipulative and hard not to be provoked. I do my best to gently, but firmly, draw my boundaries. If it seems appropriate in response to what she's said in her email/text, then I point out that I'm also hurting and find the aftermath of our relationship hard, but I make sure not to give any hint that I would be interested in getting back together or into any kind of destructive cycle again. Of course, it's a huge help to me that I'm not in the same city as my ex. I do still find it hard to control my emotions, but I've also found it helpful to take those steps of being true to myself and expressing both that I hurt and that I care to my ex, while drawing the boundaries I feel I need. Again, though, I obviously understand that this isn't going to work in all cases, particularly if the ex is harder to deal with than mine. I just wanted to share one experience of LC that I don't think has to be a negative one.

I would add that it's important to know what you want out of LC. At first, I wanted to be friends - or at least stay friendly - with my ex, as I've done after other relationships in the past. But I realize now that - as 5tarla put it - there are no chummy feelings. There isn't any real basis for friendship between my ex and me. At least not now. But as angry and hurt as I am at times about how our relationship disintegrated and how cruel and cold my ex became, I really cared and felt a lot of love while I was in the relationship. And I still care for the lonely, hurting, sad person that is one side of my ex's self. What I want from LC now is not friendship, but just to be honest with myself and with my ex, while protecting myself with appropriate boundaries. Sure, I would love for her to come around some day and recognize that I really care and that she shouldn't have turned so cold, and maybe we can even be something like friends from a distance. But I do my best not to put any hope in that, and just maintain a kind of honesty with myself and my ex when I reply to her contact.

After 3.5 months of no contact we went to contact again, got together for two weeks, then the push came and since then it's push / pull for two months. I spent the past 36 hours waiting for a response to a very kind whatsapp that I sent, seeing it unanswered while she's online several times a day. Pathetic , I know. So there's your answer.

I also tried LC and it has been a virtual disaster quite frankly. It’s turned into a 3 month break-up where he’s tried to recycle and manipulate me in numerous ways. He went from declaring undying love and wanting to get back with me to dating someone else in a short space of time. Blaming me for forcing him to find someone else. He now wants to be friends and use me as a shoulder to cry on while he mourns us. It hurts. I wish now I’d just gone nc and spared myself further pain.

Hi Isa-


There's some fuel for potential growth.  Here's a guy who abused you, disrespected you, violated your boundaries, and you had to call the police on, and you still want him in your life on some level.  That's interesting, and there might be great stuff around your reasons for wanting that, something to talk with your therapist about?

And as we know, for borderlines, folks who MUST have an attachment, there is always an agenda, there has to be, so any hope that the relationship will stay static at a distance probably won't be fulfilled, he's not capable, so either he will push for reconciliation or he will find another attachment, in which case his drive to stay attached to you may vanish.  I was completely done with my ex when I left her, and someone who treats me the way she did is not allowed in my life, he said after he woke up to the reality of what was going on, but there are plenty of folks here, some who've already posted, who tried some limited contact and pretty much unanimously say it was a mistake.  Now there could be folks who have an ongoing LC relationship with their ex and just aren't here anymore, because they aren't in pain and don't need to be, we wouldn't know.  But in any case, after considering your motives and acknowledging his, please make sure you do what's right for you and your son.  Take care of you!

I absolutely agree with fromheeltoheal that you have to take care of yourself first, and certainly any children in the picture. So if contact gets in the way of you finding your way back to health and happiness, I would think NC is the best way to go. I only wanted to share my experience of LC to suggest that there aren't any absolute rules.

I also really related to Isa_lala's feeling that NC is "just not me, doesn't correspond to my personality."

When I was with my ex, she would get so enraged about the fact that I had stayed friends with some of my ex-girlfriends, that I had built positive relationships out of break-ups, and she tried to convince me it was sick. And when we went through our break-up, she really tried to drag me down into that all-love or all-hate world. And finally there was one time when I responded to her provocations by saying, "you're not going to do that to me. If we can't be in each other's lives, fine, but you're not going to convince me that the healthiest way to move on from a break-up is to hate the other person, to just block them out and pretend they never happened." Or something along those lines.

In answering my ex's emails and texts, I'm really attentive to drawing appropriate boundaries and not feeding any of the pull-push dynamic. I keep a reasonably detached tone, while still acknowledging that I'm hurting and that I care about my ex. Because that's the honest truth. And while I'm still struggling with a lot of the pain and post-rollercoaster emotions, I've found some strength in acknowledging the truth even as I draw the boundaries I need. I think it really depends on whether this is a manageable situation for you - both in terms of how aggressively your ex reacts and your own emotional response.

Thank you

This is exactly the kind of "testimony" I asked for.

I see that LC doesn't seem to work well. Of course, it depends of the kind of person we have in front of us

I do not want to be friends. This is a question the T asked me on our first session and it was a question I had not thought of and the answer is no.

yesterday, he got back in his old way of acting by email. He misinterpreted something I wrote but I did not justify anything. I just repeated what I had said and asked what, in my writing, lead him to think that way. No response from him and I left it this way. Last night I wrote an email to know around what time he would be here today and I felt anger in his response so I just said that I did not want to have this kind of "discussion" that was not one and that we would speak the next morning (today) and I have not responded after to his emails.

So I see that I have more tools in my hands to deal with him and to protect myself.

Your question, Fromheeltoheal, is fundamental I believe. Why would I like this man in my life after what he did to me? I believe I excuse him a lot, because of the disorder, because that I had not been able to set up boundaries and respect them, so I feel a little bit responsible of what happened... .

Why would I go with LC? Because of him, not because of me. I think I still put his needs ahead of mine... .

This will be a good topic for discussion for the T next Tuesday... .

And a question for the ones,who tried LC: what were your real motivations behind the will for LC ?

For me it was validation. First thing she told me after we were NC 3.5 months was "you were right" and "I'm sorry" and "I stopped dating" and "I just watched our pictures".  My very serious depression was lifted in 5 seconds.

For about six months I couldn't sleep for more than 4-5 hours. I'd wake up at 4:30 am. Now I sleep like a baby. Was totally worth it.

After that, it was some fantasy that it could work between us.

The more I think about it the more I see how much of this was a sexual addiction. I was living in a porn film with her. She's that wild. Who wouldn't want that, right?  But it's amazing how long this holds me, we didn't have sex since August 2015 and I'm still hooked. Those chemicals are powerful.

Double post

Yes, we are responsible for not establishing and enforcing our own boundaries.  I've allowed plenty of people to violate my boundaries in the past, although I forgive myself now because I just didn't know then, but now what?  People who barge across peoples boundaries and see what they can get away with are not people I want in my life anyway, so no need to try and establish boundaries now, and for others I've found it's a lot easier to establish boundaries right away than try and establish them once they've already been violated.  And if that someone has a personality disorder, one that doesn't recognize boundaries because to them we're one person, boundary setting would be very difficult if not impossible.  So moving forward, most folks don't have personality disorders and now that we know what we need to do with boundaries, how bright will our future be when we populate our lives with folks who respect those boundaries?


Good awareness, and now what?  Extreme selfishness is a good thing at times like this... .

One man's opinion Isa, I look forward to hearing how it goes with your therapist on Tuesday.  Take care of you!

We shared a group of friends that both of us still had the desire to see.  I was trying to keep the peace with the whole crew.  It didn't work, because his behavior essentially demanded that people take sides.  My friends weren't interested in doing that, so when he presented them with an ultimatum, he was the one who had to go.

My motivations were to ride out her anger and try to understand what happened so that we could repair the relationship and get back on track - by which I mean get back together. I honestly think that that was her motivation too, but I was the only one actually willing to do work that went beyond blaming and saying "well, you should change for me".

My motivations in the past including minimizing his behaviors in case he recycled me, still buying into his claims it was truly all my fault, and not wanting to lose face to myself. I thought that trying to be friends would be a lifeline back into the relationship.

That's pretty much what I did as well, although I stopped shouldering all of the blame fairly quickly. But like I said upthread, it basically boiled down to: "if things were going to be okay between us then we'd be together, so we can't be okay as just friends." And she went out of her way to make sure there were plenty of reasons to not be okay with each other.

I messed up the quote feature! Oops. What I wrote was this:

Yes, exactly. I think when I stopped shouldering all the blame, and chasing after him, the relationship was essentially over. I do think my ex wanted it to work. He was unable to take the most basic of steps to make that happen. Sadly, in the end, it was far more important to him to feel sorry for himself.

My motivations were first and foremost validation and closure. We never had an adult conversation when we broke up. Just a fight, and NC. I'm not sure if you've read my story, but my ex and I broke up after I confronted her about her lies and cheating. In that moment she painted me black and her excuse for it is during our argument 'I kept interrupting her' and 'tried to tell her how she feels.' Think I'm kidding? I'm really not. She went from being 'in love' with me to painting me black because of the things SHE had done to me. So a month had passed of NC and I reached out after finding out she had a replacement. I hadn't heard from her because in her mind she was pissed about me 'interrupting her' and 'telling her how she felt' and I was the devil. Being angry at me over something so bogus isn't even worth LC, because she acts like she hates me and I'm sure in her mind she does. That is BPD for ya.

... .

My motivation were to hang around and let her see that I wasn't rejecting her because of her disorder. We spoke and I blamed us both for making a mess of our relationship. I thought that if i let some time pass (about 3 months), things can be at least sibyl.  Which in some way it is.  However, I feel she still tells lots of lies. Of course I don't want to understand why she feels she has to lie to me when I don't care who she's messing with.  But I do understand.  I understand that it is all a silly unconscious/conscious game to pwBPD. So why tell the truth? right?

Instead of saying, hey I won't be meeting with you i've got something to do blahblahblah, she rather say My grandmother, my daughter, my sister is sick and I have to blahblahblah for her. I will call you later! But she never calls.  I know the drill.  When we were together she never called IF she said... .I will call you later.  Or if she says "call me", that means she's not picking up the phone when you do call.

About the LC, we when almost NC for about 6 weeks.  I would reach out now and then b/c I would sometimes feel bad for her and what she might be going through inside.  Haha! I was probably feeling sorry for myself b/c now I know that out of sight is our of mind with pwBPD.

I ask her if she ever thinks about me, she says... .I told you "sometimes.'  Out of a few times, one time she said something normal.  She said that when she drives by my neighborhood or when she's in an area that we were once in (or something like that).

I can't really say who she is now.  I don't see her much but I do see her once or twice a month (at her leisure). I noticed that if I a few hours have passed and I have not said even hello to her, she's sends these unnecessary text just to engage me in conversation.  Then she'll only text back one or two words, while i'm answering in complete sentences.  :)on't worry folks, I know what she's doing.  Just in case I'm not thinking about her anymore, she reaches out just enough to engage me.  Not because she needs to communicate with me. But that's okay.  I don't need her to need of me. That sh*t got me in so much crap the last time.  So we're good.

I now literally see her for who she is.  She is lost in her head. I can see that.  I like being able to sit with her and laugh now and then.  Not like before when we laughed a lot.  She doesn't talk much either.  Only about illnesses and mishaps that are happening to other people; including articles she reads on-line. When she does talk, she says things that makes me stare at her. Child like. Makes me wonder how she was able to hide it so well in the past.  

LC can be okay ( think) but I am not a mental health professional and I wasn't with this woman for years like some of you were.  I read somewhere that when they paint you black, they often time don't remember how they use to feel about you.  Still, if you decide to go LC, proceed with caution.  :)on't let her imagination take "you" away.  Talk about things you found interesting (some do like you to entertain them by telling fun or good stories.) Keep the subject short and sweet or funny.  They get distracted easily.  If the T.V. is on, comment about the show that's on. Don't always give the pwBPD what they want.  Find a subtle way to dismiss it.  Why would you anyway? you're no longer dating so it is not your job to fulfill his or her every desire. This person is going to bring up nonsense that you use to disagree on, nope! find a way to get out of that one.  I am making it sound more complicated that it really has been in my experience.

Also, any talk about getting back together? After what you've been through you need to think about that very hard before you can even think its okay to consider it.  yup! You can get out of a topic like that saying something like... .we made a mess of our relationship so I think for both of our "benefit" we should think on that for awhile or something in that sort.  But here's the most important part, say it with a sort of a unbiased smile on your face.

Why I do it? I don't know. but I don't mind her that much.  She does show me some degree of respect and affection.  Not in every aspect, but I don't need her respect anymore than I want her to disrespect me. I'm not indifferent about it.  I just know that it is not personal and I'm trying to be a grown-up.  I think my worse month have passed me.  I vaguely remember how she use to make me feel (idealization).  I do remember thinking that it was kind of too much too soon, and too crazy.  But it felt good to have someone look at me that way.  

I see the LC as being controlled by me, but at her leisure; if that makes any sense.  She use to call me and invite me to do things for her with her.  I declined every time.  Now, when we do meet, I ask if she wants to see me.  Most times she replies yes, sometimes she doesn't reply at all. If I was to never see her again, I would always wonder about her and how she ended up.  But if I don't, I have nothing to feel guilty or bad about.  Her reality was no match for my reality... .So she didn't stand a change in this relationship to begin with.  LOL... .that's how I look at things.  and when she does her thing, I won't say it is expected but she will never surprise me again.  I don't love her.  I don't hate her.

NC and LC - two different tools for different situations, each with pros and cons, and a uniquely personal decision one makes, neither right or wrong.

most of the failed experiences with LC described in this thread demonstrate the need for firm boundaries, and a certain level of emotional detachment if one hopes to succeed. not to monday morning quarterback, because even with firm boundaries and a certain level of emotional detachment, there are no guarantees. whatever we choose, it helps to be self aware of where we are in the detachment process.   (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=284223.0;all)

this is why we see the same failed experiences with NC all the time.

lets take BPD out of the equation for a moment. how often do exes go on to be friends? rarely, but it certainly happens; usually not right away. its a difficult transition and wont work if its forced. it helps for both parties to clear their heads, have some space, and get to, at least, a certain level of emotional detachment. no reason we cant have a period of no contact, or greatly reduced contact during this transition.

of course friends or not friends is only part of the equation. if you share children you dont have a lot of choice.

LC need not be geared toward friendship either.

both choices are really all about being true to yourself, being self aware of where you are in the detachment process, clarifying your goals, managing expectations, and firm boundaries.

i think rfriesen has stated what it takes better than i can:

I see that motivations are different from one to another.

I don't particularly want to be friend with my ex. I wouldn't mind to be friends in a way That could help for our kids to see each other more often, but my ex has always said that he doesn't believe in friendship with exes. And I think it will not be different with me. So he will expect more from me than a friendship

I think that if I maintained LC, it will only be for him, not for me. I will see what the T tells me tomorrow and I will decide what I do.

I may start with LC and see how it works. It may be longer for him to detach than NC.

This definitely wasn't true in my case, but then I was probably doing it all wrong.

Briefly: our relationship was an affair that had been on and off for years, but always friendly. The pattern was that we would be on, then he'd get angry at me over something, and it would turn out that he was really angry that I hadn't left my bf yet. Then he would pull back from romancing me, but bombard me with promises of eternal friendship. He'd start putting me on a friend pedestal, saying how great I was. Then slowly he would start romancing me and we'd be on again.

Then, a year and a half ago, he went strangely cool for a few weeks. Then, over a gchat, he said asked if I'd be mad if he started seeing someone. Of course I couldn't object. What could I say? He had, as he put it, "given me dibs." I told him I would be sad but not mad. Then I asked if he was seeing anyone and he said no, but he he'd worked really hard to get over me, and he'd done it, and he was proud.

This was a total surprise to me, that he'd been doing this work and that it had been achieved-apparently during time he'd been distant with me? Signing off, he reiterated his usual "friends always" insistence. Then he went silent for a few days, and when I asked him if anything was wrong (over email), he told me nothing was wrong, he was just busy, and happy seeing someone else.

I know this sounds asinine but it came as a huge shock--and even more shocking was his response when I asked if we could talk about what was happening. Another silent period, and then a full-blown email rage attack. I could go f- myself if I thought I was any kind of victim (I hadn't said I was), he'd seen our situation for what it "really was," I had "no right to feel blindsided," etc. I was so floored and felt so guilty, couldn't argue with him, just told him he was my great love and I wished him well. He said, "You too, steelwork. All of it." And then he went silent for a month.

I was totally devastated. Why, you might ask, had I not left my bf for him if I felt so strongly about him? Topic for another day. Very complicated. But after what happened, I was so wrecked at the thought of losing him forever that I DID break up with my bf. I sent him an apology, a love letter, told him I had made the move he'd pressed me for, I'd chosen him and I would do anything to win his trust back. This got me a phone call in which he didn't even mention the fact that I'd broken up with my bf and moved into my brother's attic. Instead we talked about his abandonment issues and the fact that he felt like a "different person" and that he had replaced me with... .a woman we knew who he had always been completely dismissive of and made fun of, who openly hated me, and who was 16 years his junior.

Okay, I'm blathering on totally off-subject. The point is that there followed 2 months of low contact, in which he absolutely tortured me with promises of a real conversation, then deflections, changing the subject, whining about HIS life, evading, etc. When I finally put it to him bluntly that what was going on between us was not what I would consider friendship, he sent me a very mean and sarcastic email ("I didn't know about the terms and conditions" and disappeared forever.

So that was my experience with low contact. It was miserable. And it decidedly did NOT lead to more contact.

My ex and I had been best friends for years before the relationship. When he abruptly discarded me for his flatmate, he told me that he hoped I would stay his friend, because he 'needed' me. In spite of the callous way he treated me - like a thing, not like a person - and the unfairness of what he was asking, I said yes to that. I was very committed to maintaining a friendship even though I felt as though I was wearing pain like a second skin. Six weeks on, and I realised that it would not work. The effort of trying to maintain a friendship with someone who couldn't care less about me was making me ill and miserable. We'd gone from talking every day, multiple times a day, to him sending one-word texts or IMs in response to anything I sent him. Usually there would just be an emoticon. That was it. In those six weeks, he did not find time to meet once. He was always too busy (but not too busy to socialise with the new friends he had met through his new girlfriend). I only saw him once, when I ran into him accidentally, and he made it clear he wished I wasn't there (monosyllables, not looking me in the face, walking in the opposite direction without saying goodbye). And then I realised that when he'd asked for my friendship, what he really meant was my reassurance that everything was OK, everything was fine, he hadn't done anything bad. He just wanted me to sink quietly into the water without rocking the boat. He didn't actually want any kind of contact with me, just the knowledge that I was out there somewhere and he could call on me as and when needed. I went NC because this was extremely painful, being forced to witness on a daily basis how little I mattered to the guy who was still telling me I was his best friend. It was only when I cut contact with him that I started to feel better.

No doubt loving someone who doesn't love you back is the worst thing in the world.

We just need to accept it. If you care about him then you shouldn't have a problem just getting those small signs that he's ok and alive... .while you move forward. What's better, LC or NC, probably NC but in my case it's worse, I think if I go NC again I will again sink into depression. I rather hear her voice once in a while.

As you quoted me, I presume you're referring to my post when you say, "You shouldn't have a problem... ."

I spent months during my relationship telling myself that my feelings weren't valid. That if I cared about him, I shouldn't have a problem when he threatened suicide and then deliberately went incommunicado for two days in order to frighten me and punish me for not being saying the right things. ("He's unwell, I should be more more understanding of what he's going through." That if I cared about him, I shouldn't have a problem when he called me evil or sneered at me when I was crying or told me I didn't deserve any kindness from him. ("He's a lovely person really, I shouldn't focus on the things he says when he's unwell." During the six weeks that I tried to maintain the friendship with him, I used this exact same line of reasoning. But it's damaging and it doesn't work, because it involves suppressing perfectly human reactions and denying the validity of perfectly reasonable expectations.

It was reasonable for me to expect that he would not start seeing someone else while he was still romantically and sexually involved with me. It was reasonable for me to expect that anyone calling me their best friend, and asking me to stay that way, would make time for me in their life. It was reasonable for me to feel that my needs mattered as much as his and to be hurt when his behaviour didn't reflect that. Accepting that he doesn't love me was necessary, of course, but acceptance isn't the same thing as guilt-tripping myself into not minding his selfish callous behaviour ("If I care about him, I shouldn't have a problem with it!". Not helpful at all.

I may be in a different situation from some people here. I have left my BF because of his behaviors that i know wouldn't change, but also because the love i had felt for him was fading away... .

he is seeing a T each week and if he had done that even 1 year ago, i believe I would have been supporting him and loving him more. But it is kind of too late.

so HE is the one who is in demand of staying in contact with me. He still believes he can seduce me and have me back in his life. Because he cannot imagine his life without me (until he finds another source of attachment... .)

for the moment, I don't miss him, I don't miss the family life we had, i don't miss anything. I think it is because i am still in the healing process. All what i hated in our relationship is still very fresh in my mind, and takes the all place. No place for the good memories for the moment.

it is where I have to decide if i go with LC or not... .seeing my T in an hour, I will let you know what she suggests

it seems counterintuitive, but blocking or going silent on someone can often result in that person upping the ante so to speak, drive stalking behaviors, revenge, any desperate behavior designed to get a reaction or response from you. im not saying that applies to your situation, but it does in many. in those cases, giving that person an outlet, while gradually withdrawing, disengaging, being boring or non responsive can often achieve a goal of no contact better than a sudden cut off.

it is exactly how I feel. I think the most important here is never forget to ask myself how I feel in each situation. And act according to MY needs and not his. With that in mind I think I can have a sort of control on our contacts.

balletomane, I'm nodding vigorously to this. This is exactly the trap I had to pull myself out of via zero contact. My expectations of even minimal friendship weren't being met with the form of LC he was capable of. My expectations were totally reasonable, and he was trying to have his cake ("I'm a great guy!" and eat it, too ("I can dump my hostility on her when it suits me!"

When you've been intensely focused on being the bigger person, it's so easy to invalidate yourself, never mind setting yourself up to be invalidated and abused by someone with (at the very least) a childlike level of emotional maturity.

Same here. I spent ten months in LC - and yeah, I was occasionally demanding or needy or pushy or angry or whatever - trying to transition into being her friend, hearing that I was important and that she "wanted to keep me", and dealing with her dysregulation and push/pull games and majorly showing up for her, only to have her eventually turn around and say that she never wanted to be friends in the first place! "I never wanted to be your friend, I wanted to be with you, but now we can't, so ... ."

It's just not worth it - unless you want to continue to suffer in order to finally detach when you've finally had enough.

When things started to go wrong between us, I was terrified that he would cut contact with me and never speak to me again, the way he had with so many of his exes and former friends. (Or the way I thought he had - now I know that they may have been the ones to end the contact.) I didn't realise it, but he is unlikely to have done that: he wanted me around as a punching-bag, much as you describe. I think he also liked the idea that he still had an option in me, even if he didn't consciously phrase it that way to himself. But I had a suspicion that once he was confident in his new relationship and the new circle of friends that excluded me, he would react in the MapleBob experienced and decide that he didn't want me as a friend either. I felt like I was outliving my usefulness for him, and the only way to stop being an object that got used was to terminate this state of affairs myself, rather than waiting for him to do it. As I see it, LC allows too much room for the manipulation to continue.

I just read this article about no contact https://bpdfamily.com/bpdresources/nk_a110.htm

That helps me to better understand what no contact can mean

I believe that the most difficult part for me in going LC is that I cannot help from answering his emails. I don't answer all of them ( I can receive 20-30 emails a day) but I answer several and try to make him understand me. And it is useless... .He will always think about HIM, and will never care about what I want, what are MY emotional needs... .

I really to control myself and answering without answering as my T suggested and repeat always the same thing, like a broken record... .

Then, if I see that I am not able to do that, I may go NC.

But the thing here is really about us, not about them... .

Hey Isa-


Yes it is.  Which feels weird when we've been in a long-term relationship with someone who is all about themselves.  Selfishness is your friend right now.

So this has been going on for a while, and I know your kids are friends, but this can be valuable, to look at why you continue to have versions of the same conversation with him.  I know there's fear there, not knowing how he will react, and I know the police have been involved at least once, and what else is there?  What part of you still enjoys the interaction, if any?  It's pretty easy to have your email software delete emails from specific addresses when they arrive, so not getting any emails anymore is easy technologically, but what would that mean?

Hi isa_lala. Separating in any situation is tough, especially where children are involved. I'm my case, and this is my experience, what I found worked for me. I gave good years of my life to make things work. Relationship wise ( before I knew what a pd was). Friendship and good coparenting wise and none worked. We are just a source for them to suck dry. It's not easy , they don't want to be your friend. Until I went NC it was emotional hell, now I have more positive energy. Ex BPD tries to knock me off balance bc I use to react and respond to everything. She doesn't ask anything personal any more but she is knocking my access bc that is the last thread of control she has over me or I should say had over me. In the past I let her control my access to s9. Beware of the nice BPD. They are not nice, they can't help them self, they are mentally ill. Do all contact by text or email so you have a written log of events, keep answers very short and to the point, don't respond to texts that are hurtful or meant to get a reaction, do not defend your self. Take the advice you get on this board and figure out what works best for you.

Hello.

Yes, i do know that having the same conversations with him on the same topic, trying to make my point, is not worth it. It happens some time that I am writing an email and I finish by deleting it because I know that it is not worth the time I put in writing it.

He still wants to have sex with me... .He is obsessed by that. So we talked yesterday a few times about that and of course all the good arguments I had didn't go through. He is too obsessed with his thoughts to even listening to my points.

So now, I will try to answer in a monosyllabic way and use the advice I found in the link I posted here... .

For the emails he sends me, they directly go into a folder. I haven't not deleted them in case I would have to show that to the police.

And you are right I don't enjoy any of the interactions with him. I could if I knew that he got over me and that he is not wanting anything from me but just see each other with the kids.

That is good advice. If I answer some emails, I try to never answer to the one that are hurting or not nice and I try to respond to practical questions that need to be answered

I try to not give any information on me.

I will have to deal with his insistence ... .But when I see that it takes too much nerdy from me, I just lock all the communication means and focus my energy on me and my son.

My ex BPD wife called yesterday, I only answered bc I thought it was s9. She started about changing my access to s9. I took the control away from her so she it squirming hard trying to figure how to get it back. I listened politely, she kept on, than she started pushing for a commitment to change access, I brought he back to the origional question, very short, to the point, she kept pushing me to get me talking so she could start twisting my words, get me reacting, get me defending my self, knock me off balance, again I brought her to the origional question, it held her accountable for her actions, she wasn't passing her negative feelings on to me. She started raising her voice, I said, I gave you my answer, thanked her and hung up. As I took the phone away from my ear to hit the end button, I could hear her raging. I use to let her get in my head and twist my words around, she would have me going in circles. They don't call to converse, they call to drain, pass on there toxic poison, they could care less if you fell off the face of the earth. Keep the BPD out of your head.

Sorry to read that

But I least you know her by heart and know how to react

Same here

I strongly try to not be caught in his attempt to have me answer him (by text messages or emails)

I know what you mean when they try to make us talk just to twist our words... .In their advantage

Sick