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Author Topic: TREATMENT: Medications  (Read 6993 times)
atwittsend
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« Reply #150 on: February 12, 2010, 12:19:56 PM »

It seems a common thing for BP's to smoke pot... am I right? It likely has something to do with brain chemistry (seratonin), and I certainly hope that researchers are taking this into consideration. My partner always says that all he needs is a medication that will mimic pot. He smokes on and off, when he smokes pot he is delightful, loving, empathetic and thoughtful.. . the problems come when he stops smoking, after smoking it for a few days. It has happened time and time again - when he stops smoking, he will go through what he himself calls a 'psychosis' where he will have uncontrollable rages, become irrational (much more than usual) and usually ends in him breaking our valuables and trying to get me to leave... basically the standard BP behaviour, just magnified significantly.

The thing is, in a rare moment of clarity, he told me what it is like when he smokes pot. He says that it allows his 'walls' to come down, and he is 'allowed' to feel and respond and accept, and the walls that he usually puts up to protect himself from hurt are removed, to allow him to 'feel'. The conversation was so heartfelt and in-depth that it made me cry, and makes me teary just thinking about the raw and rare emotions he expressed.

He knows he can't smoke pot because of the 'psychosis' he experiences when he stops. As I said, I assume it is a brain chemistry thing that makes him more (and I hate to use the word) 'normal', but what would cause the sudden and predictable 'psychosis' and rages as soon as he stops? These rages will last a couple of days after he stops smoking then he will go back to his standard BP self.

withdrawal from drugs is excruciating.  I used to smoke so much pot that if I ran out I would go insane.  I seemingly outgrew this.  I can take it or leave it these days. 

that said my ex doesnt like getting high she says.  but we did get high several times and it was amazing.  she laughed with her belly and was genuinely happy in those moments.  she never raged at me when high.  there were no eggshells.  it was just normal being high with a friend. 
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Andarial

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« Reply #151 on: February 13, 2010, 07:25:19 PM »

<chop>

she never raged at me when high.  there were no eggshells.  it was just normal being high with a friend. 

Yes! That is exactly what it is like - being with a friend! If only things could be like that for my partner even half the time without pot then I would be on my way to being happy. But I am thankful he doesnt smoke it often as the post-pot rages are the worst.
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dados76
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« Reply #152 on: February 14, 2010, 03:13:09 AM »

i think.. for some people w/mental issues.. weed can make psychotic features worse..

tho.. my partner has issue w/all drugs.. so.. could be him. i do know.. that most dbt programs.. require people be clean.. and not drinking.. bc drugs can mask features.. or make some things worse.. ends up.. being avoiding working on the underneath issues anway
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LOAnnie
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« Reply #153 on: February 14, 2010, 09:05:47 AM »

I found an interesting article from McGil University that might explain the behaviors you describe in your boyfriend.  Apparently THC, the active ingredient in marijuana does have an antidepressant effect but only in very low doses.  At higher doses, it has exactly the opposite effect

Here's the link to the study:

www.psychcentral.com/news/2007/10/24/mixed-results-with-thc-antidepressants/1447.html

I found this part of the article to be the most relevant to your boyfriend's behavior:

":)r. Gobbi and her colleagues were prompted to explore cannabis’ potential as an anti-depressant through anecdotal clinical evidence, she said.

“As a psychiatrist, I noticed that several of my patients suffering from depression used to smoke cannabis. And in the scientific literature, we had some evidence that people treated with cannabis for multiple sclerosis or AIDS showed a big improvement in mood disorders. But there were no laboratory studies demonstrating the anti-depressant mechanism of action of cannabis.”

Because controlling the dosage of natural cannabis is difficult – particularly when it is smoked in the form of marijuana joints – there are perils associated with using it directly as an anti-depressant.

Excessive cannabis use in people with depression poses high risk of psychosis,” said Dr. Gobbi."

From my family's experience, my elderly BPD/NPD mother was prescribed some kind of mood-altering drug by her doctor (I'd have to ask Sister if it was an anti-anxiety drug or an anti-depressant or an anti-psychotic or what) and after mom started taking it Sister said she noticed a remarkable improvement in our mother's behavior.   Sister said it was like a quiet kind of miracle.  But of course, our BPD/NPD mother didn't like taking the drug.  She said it made her feel "weird", so when the prescription ran out she didn't renew it.    Back when my Sister was in very frequent contact with our mom that drug (whatever it was) made a big difference to Sister, but now that Sister is in very low contact it doesn't matter so much.

All I know is that when I was in contact with our mom, I'd have to drug myself (practically knock myself out) with alcohol to be able to be around her for more than a few hours, I find her presence so anxiety-inducing in me.

-LOAnnie 





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midgelette
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« Reply #154 on: February 20, 2010, 07:34:33 PM »

Just wanted to add to this thread.

When growing up-early teens with my BPD/NPD(since childhood) older sis, I would revel in the occasions of her being stoned on pot. They were the times when I could exert my personality freely...it actually became a joke. She was very mellow and happy, not at all feeling threatened by me and I had some freedom to be. This was before I started to defend myself ofcourse.

In recent years, if my sis takes anything natural that may have some neurological benefit like cordyceps or Nuerozyme (Vitamin combinations), she will get totally whacked out for the day-often can barely function and that is that. It is the weirdest thing. Her brain must be so unstable. Of course she would never go on meds and more than one experience with any natural supplement for the brain, doesn't happen due to the effect she feels-out of control.

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anker
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« Reply #155 on: February 20, 2010, 09:19:25 PM »

Are there any actual medications that they prescribe for BPD? My ex had Prozac geodom and something else. A downer. None of it helped...(he smoked pot too but it didn't make a lot of difference)
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« Reply #156 on: April 05, 2010, 01:05:22 PM »

My stbxw, who has been dx'd with depression, ADD and bulimia (claims to be in recovery, but I still see bingeing) is on the following:

200 mg/day lamictal

90 mg/day cymbalta

90 mg/day buspar

2 x 20 mg/day adderall (xr)

.5 mg xanax prn

ambien at night for sleep.

Isn't this heavy duty stuff, and is it good/bad/irrelevant to BPD?

Comments from anyone with med expertise or experience would be appreciated.
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zero0zero0zero0
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« Reply #157 on: April 05, 2010, 01:20:13 PM »

I just saw this link posted by another member.  It's a start.   Smiling (click to insert in post)  www.healthyplace.com/personality-disorders/life-at-the-border/can-pms-trigger-BPD-episodes/menu-id-1459/

It says xanax is a no no as well...

Alexis
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Tenacious

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« Reply #158 on: May 04, 2010, 01:59:26 AM »



Just wondering if anybody out there as tried Homeopathic Medicines as a part of a treatment plan for their BPD.  And if anybody has...did it work to any degree? 

Just trying to consider all of my options. 

Tenacious
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JDoe
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« Reply #159 on: May 12, 2010, 12:32:02 PM »

My BPD DH takes Vitamin D to help with SADD, 5HTP for depressive symptoms, melatonin and l-tryptophan to help with sleep, and many other vitamins for other things.  Nothing actually homeopathic, just natural things we use.   His SADD was better this winter, not much change in depression (lots of situational stuff going on, though), and his sleep starts out fine, but he awakens around 3 or 4am and doesn't usually get back to sleep.  He refuses to take the meds prescribed by the psych because he is afraid of their effects.

Are you trying anything?  How is it going for you?

God bless,

JDoe
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Tenacious

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« Reply #160 on: May 15, 2010, 03:39:54 PM »

I haven't tried anything yet.  My homeopath charges about $325.00 (includes meds) but I wanted to just put it out there if anybody else has tried anything with any success.  I have used homeopathics for years, and I know that the results can be amazing.  It's just right now between the psychologists, the boot camp I am looking into for the summer ($$$) and the possible boarding school for the fall ($$$$$) I'm trying to be very careful and don't want to waste the money if it won't be effective.   I also don't think that she would be co-operative about even taking the meds right now.  Tried some from the psychiatrist, and she would take them at our insistence,and then just throw them up. 

I'm feeling a little desperate in these days.  Thanks for your reply.  And good luck!

Tenacious
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« Reply #161 on: May 17, 2010, 08:30:19 AM »

He refuses to take the meds prescribed by the psych because he is afraid of their effects.

The way I look at it is: any substance with a powerful enough psychoactive effect to even possibly treat serious symptoms is also going to likely have side effects and risks.

It's not as if over here you have "natural" things that can only do you good and no harm, but over there you have "artificial" things that can only do you harm but no good.  Being cool (click to insert in post) 

In both cases we are talking (if there's any point in using them at all) about substances with powerful effects on the brain and nervous system.
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Steph
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« Reply #162 on: May 17, 2010, 09:09:00 AM »

 Happily, the most effective treatment for BPD is a therapy called Dialectical Behavioral Therapy, which is not a med regime.


Steph
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nichole79
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« Reply #163 on: October 03, 2010, 05:48:41 AM »

My dBPDm was put on this a few weeks ago.  She is strangely happy almost to the point of being inappropriate.  Her affect is weird.  She is giddy.  She has also been falling a lot.  

It is almost like a weird type of mania.  Still making terrible financial decisions, but that no longer is my worry.  

Excerpt
ABILIFY

Schizophrenia  ABILIFY is indicated for the treatment of schizophrenia. The efficacy of ABILIFY was established in four 4-6 week trials in adults and one 6-week trial in adolescents (13 to 17 years). Maintenance efficacy was demonstrated in one trial in adults and can be extrapolated to adolescents [see Clinical Studies].

Bipolar I Disorder

Monotherapy


ABILIFY is indicated for the acute and maintenance treatment of manic and mixed episodes associated with bipolar I disorder. Efficacy was established in four 3-week monotherapy trials in adults and one 4-week monotherapy trial in pediatric patients (10 to 17 years). Maintenance efficacy was demonstrated in a monotherapy trial in adults and can be extrapolated to pediatric patients (10 to 17 years) [see Clinical Studies].

Adjunctive Therapy

ABILIFY is indicated as an adjunctive therapy to either lithium or valproate for the acute treatment of manic and mixed episodes associated with bipolar I disorder. Efficacy was established in one 6-week adjunctive trial in adults and can be extrapolated to pediatric patients (10 to 17 years) [see Clinical Studies].

Adjunctive Treatment of Major Depressive Disorder

ABILIFY is indicated for use as an adjunctive therapy to antidepressants for the treatment of major depressive disorder (MDD). Efficacy was established in two 6-week trials in adults with MDD who had an inadequate response to antidepressant therapy during the current episode [see Clinical Studies].

Irritability Associated with Autistic Disorder

ABILIFY is indicated for the treatment of irritability associated with autistic disorder. Efficacy was established in two 8-week trials in pediatric patients (aged 6 to 17 years) with irritability associated with autistic disorder (including symptoms of aggression towards others, deliberate self-injuriousness, temper tantrums, and quickly changing moods) [see Clinical Studies].

Agitation Associated with Schizophrenia or Bipolar I Mania

ABILIFY Injection is indicated for the acute treatment of agitation associated with schizophrenia or bipolar disorder, manic or mixed. "Psychomotor agitation" is defined in DSM-IV as "excessive motor activity associated with a feeling of inner tension". Patients experiencing agitation often manifest behaviors that interfere with their diagnosis and care (eg, threatening behaviors, escalating or urgently distressing behavior, or self-exhausting behavior), leading clinicians to the use of intramuscular antipsychotic medications to achieve immediate control of the agitation. Efficacy was established in three short-term (24-hour) trials in adults [see Clinical Studies].

Special Considerations in Treating Pediatric Schizophrenia, Bipolar I Disorder, and Irritability Associated with Autistic Disorder

Psychiatric disorders in children and adolescents are often serious mental disorders with variable symptom profiles that are not always congruent with adult diagnostic criteria. It is recommended that psychotropic medication therapy for pediatric patients only be initiated after a thorough diagnostic evaluation has been conducted and careful consideration given to the risks associated with medication treatment. Medication treatment for pediatric patients with schizophrenia, bipolar I disorder, and irritability associated with autistic disorder is indicated as part of a total treatment program that often includes psychological, educational, and social interventions.

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Silver08
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« Reply #164 on: October 03, 2010, 04:38:37 PM »

My uBPD mom also has depression and was given Abilify about a year ago.  She reacted the same way.  It was over the top, but better than the alternative.  It was very short lived though.  I'm not sure if she went off of it or if the initial effects wore off.
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UKannie
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« Reply #165 on: October 04, 2010, 03:56:03 AM »

My dBPDm was put on this a few weeks ago.  She is strangely happy almost to the point of being inappropriate.  Her affect is weird.  She is giddy.  She has also been falling a lot. 

It is almost like a weird type of mania.  Still making terrible financial decisions, but that no longer is my worry. 

I'm not a medical doctor but those sound like the kind of side effects that the physician who supplied them to her should know about. I am not BPD but I reacted to a completely different psychoactive drug once in a similar way as my system would not tolerate the drug. Staying on it longer made me more and more ill.

I don't want to alarm you - but I think a doctor should be made aware of unwanted side effects. He/she may see them as temporary, and view that they will pass, but they should still know. Maybe you could write and let them know. I know there are confidentiality issues (ie they will not tell you whether they plan to change her treatment or disclose anything about her condition) but at least you will feel you've done something constructive. Or you could write down the changes you've seen in your mother since the meds on a piece of paper and ask her to read it out to her doctor. That way, she gets to take responsibility.

I know drawing boundaries with BPD parents is hard, so I don't want dictate what anyone should do, or where their responsibilities lie. Also note: I am coming at this from a perspective of experiencing the UK health system where you sometimes have to be very demanding and very informed to get the level of treatment you need. My parents are both mentally ill, and even though their behaviour has been abusive and neglectful in the past, I feel very protective of them (and angry on their behalf) when I feel they are not getting the medical care they need.

I think though, the fact that you have posted on this board shows you are very worried. Maybe if you 'hand the problem over' to a health professional you will feel you have 'done your bit' and can rest easier.

I don't want to preach so please feel free to ignore this...

Annie
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Auspicious
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« Reply #166 on: October 11, 2010, 11:06:38 AM »

I'm not a medical doctor but those sound like the kind of side effects that the physician who supplied them to her should know about. I am not BPD but I reacted to a completely different psychoactive drug once in a similar way as my system would not tolerate the drug. Staying on it longer made me more and more ill.

I don't want to alarm you - but I think a doctor should be made aware of unwanted side effects. He/she may see them as temporary, and view that they will pass, but they should still know. Maybe you could write and let them know. I know there are confidentiality issues (ie they will not tell you whether they plan to change her treatment or disclose anything about her condition) but at least you will feel you've done something constructive. Or you could write down the changes you've seen in your mother since the meds on a piece of paper and ask her to read it out to her doctor. That way, she gets to take responsibility.

You can always communicate with the treatment professionals on a one way basis ... or try to, anyway.

Leave them a phone message, send them a letter, fax them a note. You can't make them listen to you, and they don't have to tell you anything in return, but you can communicate the info.
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« Reply #167 on: January 18, 2011, 02:59:36 PM »

Is medication enough to treat the aggressive behavior/acting out? Many posts indicate that BPDs have too much emotions. Looks like we all liked the "good" loving behavior and dislike the "bad" negative emotions.

My ex was put on anti-anxiety drugs and got much better for a while. It helped him focus and reflect over his actions and it certainly calmed him down. He stopped taking the pills and then the raging and mood swings started again.
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« Reply #168 on: January 19, 2011, 02:50:32 PM »

Is medication enough to treat the aggressive behavior/acting out?

The general consensus in the psychiatric world seems to be that medication alone is not enough for treating BPD.
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peacebaby
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« Reply #169 on: March 11, 2011, 07:45:34 PM »

Hey all. My partner has BPD, has done lots of DBT, and is doing quite well. Lately she's having some serious issues with agression, and is looking at potentially changing her meds. She wants to handle it on her own, but does not want to end up in jail, so figures she needs extra help. Right now she's just on risperdone, and her psych dr has upped it, but is suggesting a mood stabilizer as well.

Anyone got any experience on what medication helps people with BPD with their agression and impluse control?
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SadOne

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« Reply #170 on: March 14, 2011, 01:19:30 PM »

Very happy to find this post.  Hubby in a weeking anger management program for about 2 months, but therapy alone is not working.  Having a hard time finding a doctor to treat my husband as he is an extremely difficult patient. Also the docs he has seen do not seem familiar with these meds.  Anyone know a doc in northern nj?
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Randi Kreger
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« Reply #171 on: March 14, 2011, 05:04:56 PM »

The best source of info on meds is www.BPDDemystified.com. See the section on meds.
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ccb1991

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« Reply #172 on: March 29, 2011, 07:47:33 PM »

Has anybody ever tried or heard of lithium carbonate for BPD?  I was just reading about it being used for impulsive behavior and rash judgements.
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« Reply #173 on: March 30, 2011, 12:08:04 PM »

Back when I was in-patient (and that's a good 35 years, kiddies Smiling (click to insert in post)), lithium carbonate was the drug of choice for bipolar, called manic-depression then. There's a lot of overlap between BPD and Bipolar. Its a HARD drug. very ugly side effects, and I remember the people on lithium all had "the walkies", where they rock from side-to-side or sort of march inplace because they couldn't be still. Also they tended to get a flat effect (little facial expression). However...as is often the case with psychotropic meds, for SOME people, lithium was a godsend. Oh, and I remember a doc telling me that lithium was the definitive test for wether or not a patient had bipolar- if you give them lithium and they get better, then your dx was right...if you gave them lithium and it made them worse, you dx'd wrong. That same sort of philosophy is still in play, tho less specifically. reassuring, no?

There are new gen drugs that usually are preferred over lithium, these days.

vivgood
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tiredmommy2
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« Reply #174 on: March 30, 2011, 12:32:21 PM »

Hi ccb,

My BPDd was on Lithium for a while.  At first, it seemed to help, but she was back to her normal self (out of control) in a few weeks.  There is no drug that can help my d right now - she's too determined not to get well. 

Vivgood is right - there are newer drugs that doctors like to try first, but Lithium can be used when all else fails.  People taking it can experience some pretty nasty side effects.  In addition, routine lab work must be done to make sure the Lithium level is therapeutic.  If the level is too low, it doesn't work...A high level can lead to toxicity. 

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