Considering reconnecting with an exBPD

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

I'm not sure which board to post this on, so I posted it on both... .if the moderator feels it's inappropriate for this board, please take it off.

I broke up with a borderline about a month ago and only recently found out that she has BPD.  I've moved on (got a new GF, got my life together), but with my new found awareness I feel that I could be of more help to her, as a friend.

Problem was, after the break up I cut her off completely: I deleted her off facebook and other social networks and even asked some of my friends to cut her off (most of them complied).  She made an angry phone call to me soon after and I haven't heard from her since.

I am still in touch with some of her friends, and am considering reconnecting with her either directly or through them.

My questions are:

*Is this even possible?  Or am I more likely completely cut off?

*Has anyone ever done this or tried this?  If so, what happened?

*To what extent can I actually be of practical help (in helping her open up or helping her consider taking therapy) and to what extent am I fantastizing?

[hijodeganas]

I'm not sure which board to post this on, so I posted it on both... .if the moderator feels it's inappropriate for this board, please take it off.

I broke up with a borderline about a month ago and only recently found out that she has BPD.  I've moved on (got a new GF, got my life together), but with my new found awareness I feel that I could be of more help to her, as a friend.

Problem was, after the break up I cut her off completely: I deleted her off facebook and other social networks and even asked some of my friends to cut her off (most of them complied).  She made an angry phone call to me soon after and I haven't heard from her since.

I am still in touch with some of her friends, and am considering reconnecting with her either directly or through them.

My questions are:

*Is this even possible?  Or am I more likely completely cut off?

*Has anyone ever done this or tried this?  If so, what happened?

*To what extent can I actually be of practical help (in helping her open up or helping her consider taking therapy) and to what extent am I fantastizing?

[2010]

I broke up with a borderline about a month ago. I've moved on

You've "moved on."

I cut her off completely: I deleted her and even asked some of my friends to cut her off (most of them complied).

Your friends were asked to "cut her off."  For some reason, possibly to show their loyalty to you- they complied.

(got a new GF, got my life together)

A new girlfriend makes three in this scenario. What do you suppose she would think about your reconnection? You probably know the answer.

*Is this even possible?  Or am I more likely completely cut off?

*Has anyone ever done this or tried this?  If so, what happened?

*To what extent can I actually be of practical help (in helping her open up or helping her consider taking therapy) and to what extent am I fantastizing?

"Is it with greater kindness that you step away."

9) Belief that you need to stay to help them.

You might want to stay to help your partner. You might want to disclose to them that they have borderline personality disorder and help them get into therapy. Maybe you want to help in other ways while still maintaining a “friendship”.

The fact is, we are no longer in a position to be the caretaker and support person for our “BPD” partner – no matter how well intentioned.

Understand that we have become the trigger for our partner’s bad feelings and bad behavior. Sure, we do not deliberately cause these feelings, but your presence is now triggering them. This is a complex defense mechanism that is often seen with borderline personality disorder when a relationship sours. It’s roots emanate from the deep core wounds associated with the disorder. We can’t begin to answer to this.

We also need to question your own motives and your expectations for wanting to help. Is this kindness or a type “well intentioned” manipulation on your part - an attempt to change them to better serve the relationship as opposed to addressing the lifelong wounds from which they suffer?

More importantly, what does this suggest about our own survival instincts – we’re injured, in ways we may not even fully grasp, and it’s important to attend to our own wounds before we are attempt to help anyone else.

You are damaged. Right now, your primary responsibility really needs to be to yourself – your own emotional survival.

If your partner tries to lean on you, it’s a greater kindness that you step away. Difficult, no doubt, but more responsible.

  https://bpdfamily.com/bpdresources/nk_a109.htm

[hijodeganas]

Very appropriate response, thank you.

However, I have a girlfriend now, and I realize that I would be useless if not even damaging as a boyfriend to my ex (which is why I wasn't sure which board to post this under).  But I've considered being one (among several) who she could reach out to if she just wants to hang out or have someone to express how she's feeling.

She seemed to show signs of getting better, or at least understanding that she has a problem.  If she didn't, I wouldn't consider this.

Also, two caveats:

1.  It would be an offer.  I feel no need to "demand" that she maintain a friendship with me.  If she's already getting plenty of sympathy or help from others, fine.  I'll leave her alone.

2.  She would have to agree to get SERIOUS help as well.  If she just wants me to vent and whine to, then I'm not interested.  I'm only interested in helping those who want to help themselves.

Thanks for the response.

[yianks69]

*Is this even possible?  Or am I more likely completely cut off?

*Has anyone ever done this or tried this?  If so, what happened?

*To what extent can I actually be of practical help (in helping her open up or helping her consider taking therapy) and to what extent am I fantastizing?

I have reconnected with my xBPDgf numerous times and each time the pain was much worst than the previous one.

If you are cut off (which is unlikely due to their untreated abandonment fear) consider yourself a very lucky man as you will be able to really move on.

Personally, I am faced with the reality that people with BPD do NOT want to be helped and treated by a T unless it is their choice. We are not professionals and we cannot treat or assist them in any matter.

If a friend of yours comes to you with a serious injury, any effort on your part to heal the injury might make it worst, unless you are a qualified doctor.

[hijodeganas]

*Is this even possible?  Or am I more likely completely cut off?

*Has anyone ever done this or tried this?  If so, what happened?

*To what extent can I actually be of practical help (in helping her open up or helping her consider taking therapy) and to what extent am I fantastizing?

If you are cut off (which is unlikely due to their untreated abandonment fear) consider yourself a very lucky man as you will be able to really move on.

Personally, I am faced with the reality that people with BPD do NOT want to be helped and treated by a T unless it is their choice. We are not professionals and we cannot treat or assist them in any matter.

If a friend of yours comes to you with a serious injury, any effort on your part to heal the injury might make it worst, unless you a qualified doctor.

Those are very good points.

I don't have any fantasties about "rescuing" her or "saving" her.  My second caveat was there because I know that by myself I can't help her.  If she's willing to get help, and she's committed to it then I'd like to be part of her life.  Otherwise, I'd rather not be.

In any case, I cut her out, and she didn't seem to take it well, so I highly doubt that she'd want me back in her life anyway.

I have reconnected with my xBPDgf numerous times and each time the pain was much worst than the previous one.

[captainkirkz]

Understand that we have become the trigger for our partner’s bad feelings and bad behavior. Sure, we do not deliberately cause these feelings, but your presence is now triggering them. This is a complex defense mechanism that is often seen with borderline personality disorder when a relationship sours. It’s roots emanate from the deep core wounds associated with the disorder. We can’t begin to answer to this.

Great post 2010.

Just one point i would like to make. I know myself that i triggered my ex but i don't take it personally as it is emotional intimacy that triggers her and not ME as a person. The next emotionally intimate host, same outcome.

Every host will 'fire the gun' at some point.

[confused!!!]

2.  She would have to agree to get SERIOUS help as well.  If she just wants me to vent and whine to, then I'm not interested.  I'm only interested in helping those who want to help themselves.

Sounds like conditional friendship? Personally I wouldn't want a friend who imposed conditions on the friendship... .

Per my therapist's advice, if I want to (re)engage with someone, I need to be prepared to accept them exactly as they are right now. Sage advice.

[hijodeganas]

Understand that we have become the trigger for our partner’s bad feelings and bad behavior. Sure, we do not deliberately cause these feelings, but your presence is now triggering them. This is a complex defense mechanism that is often seen with borderline personality disorder when a relationship sours. It’s roots emanate from the deep core wounds associated with the disorder. We can’t begin to answer to this.

Great post 2010.

Just one point i would like to make. I know myself that i triggered my ex but i don't take it personally as it is emotional intimacy that triggers her and not ME as a person. The next emotionally intimate host, same outcome.

Every host will 'fire the gun' at some point.

Good point.  I think I can be objective enough at this point to deal with the rages and outbursts, now that I know what it's about.

[hijodeganas]

2.  She would have to agree to get SERIOUS help as well.  If she just wants me to vent and whine to, then I'm not interested.  I'm only interested in helping those who want to help themselves.

Sounds like conditional friendship? Personally I wouldn't want a friend who imposed conditions on the friendship... .

Per my therapist's advice, if I want to (re)engage with someone, I need to be prepared to accept them exactly as they are right now. Sage advice.

to me, accepting a BPD unconditionally is the same as enabling it.  I'm not saying she has to change over night, that's unrealistic.  But if she's not showing me that she's making a genuine effort to deal with her problem then I don't want to enable her into thinking the way she behaves is ok.  If she just wants "hosts" she can find someone else, fine with me.

[yianks69]

Understand that we have become the trigger for our partner’s bad feelings and bad behavior. Sure, we do not deliberately cause these feelings, but your presence is now triggering them. This is a complex defense mechanism that is often seen with borderline personality disorder when a relationship sours. It’s roots emanate from the deep core wounds associated with the disorder. We can’t begin to answer to this.

Do you believe that this trigger(s) fades away with time (especially if there is NC) or is it ‘once there, always there’?

[Suzn]

Why is it that you think she has to show you anything? Why is it that you think she could possibly seperate you being an ex, one who triggers her, from a friend? Not to mention you have a gf who will be affected by this 'attempt' at a friendship? That might be all good if your ex wasnt BPD but she is. The potential for 3 people getting deeply hurt would push this idea far out of my thoughts.

[hijodeganas]

She doesn't "have to" do anything.  It's her choice.

I don't know if she could separate me or not.  Please realize, this is my first time dealing with this.  I don't know what to expect, hence the questions.

Why is it that you think she has to show you anything? Why is it that you think she could possibly seperate you being an ex, one who triggers her, from a friend? Not to mention you have a gf who will be affected by this 'attempt' at a friendship? That might be all good if your ex wasnt BPD but she is. The potential for 3 people getting deeply hurt would push this idea far out of my thoughts.

[captainkirkz]

Do you believe that this trigger(s) fades away with time (especially if there is NC) or is it ‘once there, always there’?

Having had 2 separate r/s with the same girl 14 years apart with the same outcome(Shoot me ) i would say that it is ONLY emotional intimacy that triggers them IMHO and my experience. We remained electronic friends(text/email/phone) in the intervening 12 years or so and she showed no sign whatsoever of me triggering her then. Only when it got to the stage where she felt that i had given my heart and soul to her did she start revealing her true self. The behaviour was so similar both times that it could have been taken from a script.

I did actually comment to her that, as it stands, that she seems totally together when there are no emotional triggers. I suggested that if she was happy that way(a lifestyle that would feel totally empty to me), that she shouldn't keep roping new hosts in in future as it quite obviously didn't work for her and to just live her life with some sort of continuity and to satisfy any sexual needs with some casual weekend stuff without getting involved.

That went down like a lead balloon as it does and just triggered her again. I saw the light and stopped offering advice and started concentrating on myself!

[hijodeganas]

That's an interesting insight that I've just recently started considering:

Most non PD people can, in one form or another, find love and happiness and fulfilling relationships.  Do you think this is AT ALL possible for BPDs?

I compared it to physical handicaps.  If you are paralyzed from the waist down it doesn't matter how badly you want it, you're never going to be a professional basketball player.  Is this comparable to BPD and finding meaningful, loving relationships?  Sure, everybody WANTS one, probably BPDs most of all, but is it simply just not viable for them and are they then better off just accepting that?

Do you believe that this trigger(s) fades away with time (especially if there is NC) or is it ‘once there, always there’?

Having had 2 separate r/s with the same girl 14 years apart with the same outcome(Shoot me ) i would say that it is ONLY emotional intimacy that triggers them IMHO and my experience. We remained electronic friends(text/email/phone) in the intervening 12 years or so and she showed no sign whatsoever of me triggering her then. Only when it got to the stage where she felt that i had given my heart and soul to her did she start revealing her true self. The behaviour was so similar both times that it could have been taken from a script.

I did actually comment to her that, as it stands, that she seems totally together when there are no emotional triggers. I suggested that if she was happy that way(a lifestyle that would feel totally empty to me), that she shouldn't keep roping new hosts in in future as it quite obviously didn't work for her and to just live her life with some sort of continuity and to satisfy any sexual needs with some casual weekend stuff without getting involved.

That went down like a lead balloon as it does and just triggered her again. I saw the light and stopped offering advice and started concentrating on myself!

[captainkirkz]

That's an interesting insight that I've just recently started considering:

Most non PD people can, in one form or another, find love and happiness and fulfilling relationships.  :)o you think this is AT ALL possible for BPDs?

I compared it to physical handicaps.  If you are paralyzed from the waist down it doesn't matter how badly you want it, you're never going to be a professional basketball player.  Is this comparable to BPD and finding meaningful, loving relationships?  Sure, everybody WANTS one, probably BPDs most of all, but is it simply just not viable for them and are they then better off just accepting that?

That's the point though hijodeganas they WON'T accept that. They crave love and normality as far as i can see but(to use your own analogy) they are paralysed but from the neck up!

They end up chasing that ideal over and over to fulfil that overwhelming NEED, leaving car crashes in their wake.

[hijodeganas]

That's an interesting insight that I've just recently started considering:

Most non PD people can, in one form or another, find love and happiness and fulfilling relationships.  :)o you think this is AT ALL possible for BPDs?

I compared it to physical handicaps.  If you are paralyzed from the waist down it doesn't matter how badly you want it, you're never going to be a professional basketball player.  Is this comparable to BPD and finding meaningful, loving relationships?  Sure, everybody WANTS one, probably BPDs most of all, but is it simply just not viable for them and are they then better off just accepting that?

That's the point though hijodeganas they WON'T accept that. They crave love and normality as far as i can see but(to use your own analogy) they are paralysed but from the neck up!

They end up chasing that ideal over and over to fulfil that overwhelming NEED, leaving car crashes in their wake.

I had this realization while watching a video about a guy with no arms and legs who gives motivational speeches.  After one of his seminars he did an interview and the interviewer asked him ":)o you ever wish you had arms and legs?"  And he said "Sure I do, but this is my life; I just need to accept myself as I am."

In other words, even though basically everybody else gets to have appendages, he doesn't, and there's nothing he can do but accept that.

Then it occurred to me: Maybe people with PDs are in the same boat: Everybody else gets to have normal, healthy loving relationships, and they just don't, and there's nothing they can do but accept that (or, at least accept the fact that they won't accept it).  Complicated!

[hijodeganas]

Something occurred to me about my ex:  Other than her BPD, she was a really awesome person.  She was great looking, highly functioning, very intelligent, in shape, etc.  Other than the fact that she has a craving for being loved, she's otherwise a pretty normal person.  I wondered, if she could accept the fact that she could never have a normal romantic relationship, could she be "happier"?

But even before we were together she was obsessed with love.  She'd post quotes about love on facebook and ask all kinds of deep, philosophical questions about it; how to get it, what it meant, how to love someone and be loved, etc.

[captainkirkz]

Something occurred to me about my ex:  Other than her BPD, she was a really awesome person.  She was great looking, highly functioning, very intelligent, in shape, etc.  Other than the fact that she has a craving for being loved, she's otherwise a pretty normal person.  I wondered, if she could accept the fact that she could never have a normal romantic relationship, could she be "happier"?

But even before we were together she was obsessed with love.  She'd post quotes about love on facebook and ask all kinds of deep, philosophical questions about it; how to get it, what it meant, how to love someone and be loved, etc.

I would say the same about my ex. She made a fantastic friend to be honest which is why i went back for a 2nd bite of the apple.

They won't be happier will they? Living without that love they crave. Only we know how that feels and it totally eludes them. They would have far more stability living without emotional triggers but how empty is that?

[hijodeganas]

I don't know if it's empty.  I'm a psychology major and studies have shown that people who have a passion about something, whether it's music or sports or whatever, can be just as happy single as people in highly functioning relationships.  It's highly unusual but people can achieve happiness without having a SO.

However, the inability to relate to even friends or family could make it difficult... .

Interesting how you note you were fantastic as friends.  My ex and I knew each other for a year, and she struck me as really positive, outgoing and happy.  Up until we made it official everything, including the sex, was a blast.  Almost immediately after we got serious it changed, though.

I wonder, though: Would even a friendship have lasted that long?

Something occurred to me about my ex:  Other than her BPD, she was a really awesome person.  She was great looking, highly functioning, very intelligent, in shape, etc.  Other than the fact that she has a craving for being loved, she's otherwise a pretty normal person.  I wondered, if she could accept the fact that she could never have a normal romantic relationship, could she be "happier"?

But even before we were together she was obsessed with love.  She'd post quotes about love on facebook and ask all kinds of deep, philosophical questions about it; how to get it, what it meant, how to love someone and be loved, etc.

I would say the same about my ex. She made a fantastic friend to be honest which is why i went back for a 2nd bite of the apple.

They won't be happier will they? Living without that love they crave. Only we know how that feels and it totally eludes them. They would have far more stability living without emotional triggers but how empty is that?

[captainkirkz]

I don't know if it's empty.  I'm a psychology major and studies have shown that people who have a passion about something, whether it's music or sports or whatever, can be just as happy single as people in highly functioning relationships.  It's highly unusual but people can achieve happiness without having a SO.

However, the inability to relate to even friends or family could make it difficult... .

Interesting how you note you were fantastic as friends.  My ex and I knew each other for a year, and she struck me as really positive, outgoing and happy.  Up until we made it official everything, including the sex, was a blast.  Almost immediately after we got serious it changed, though.

I wonder, though: Would even a friendship have lasted that long?

Yes hijodeganas, i see your point.

The people you mention though, the ones that are happy without a SO and are passionate about a hobby/interest(assuming they are nonBPD). They have free will don't they, so it is a conscious decision to live alone whereas a BPD has no sense of self and therefore no free will. They are subject to the constraints that their illness places upon them and therefore cannot make the same choice as a non. They are slaves to their own jumbled emotions and act out accordingly. What do you think?

[hijodeganas]

That's a great question that I don't have an answer for.  However, right now it seems that although BPDs have a very burdensome disorder, they are STILL cognitive of their behavior and thus CAN change (although I'm sure most of them don't know HOW, much less BELIEVE they can; two requisites for the ability to alter your own behavior).

I don't know how debiliting the actual disorder is; I've never been BPD.  But from what I've heard and read it is an IMMENSE challenge, but they CAN take steps to start getting in control of their situation.  It is a lifelong process and it will NEVER be as easy for them as it is for a nonBPD, but from what information I've gathered I've come to the conclusion that it IS possible for them to control their behavior (not their thought process or emotions, though) to some extent.

I don't know if it's empty.  I'm a psychology major and studies have shown that people who have a passion about something, whether it's music or sports or whatever, can be just as happy single as people in highly functioning relationships.  It's highly unusual but people can achieve happiness without having a SO.

However, the inability to relate to even friends or family could make it difficult... .

Interesting how you note you were fantastic as friends.  My ex and I knew each other for a year, and she struck me as really positive, outgoing and happy.  Up until we made it official everything, including the sex, was a blast.  Almost immediately after we got serious it changed, though.

I wonder, though: Would even a friendship have lasted that long?

Yes hijodeganas, i see your point.

The people you mention though, the ones that are happy without a SO and are passionate about a hobby/interest(assuming they are nonBPD). They have free will don't they, so it is a conscious decision to live alone whereas a BPD has no sense of self and therefore no free will. They are subject to the constraints that their illness places upon them and therefore cannot make the same choice as a non. They are slaves to their own jumbled emotions and act out accordingly. What do you think?

[captainkirkz]

However, right now it seems that although BPDs have a very burdensome disorder, they are STILL cognitive of their behavior and thus CAN change (although I'm sure most of them don't know HOW, much less BELIEVE they can; two requisites for the ability to alter your own behavior).

I don't know how debiliting the actual disorder is; I've never been BPD.  But from what I've heard and read it is an IMMENSE challenge, but they CAN take steps to start getting in control of their situation.  It is a lifelong process and it will NEVER be as easy for them as it is for a nonBPD, but from what information I've gathered I've come to the conclusion that it IS possible for them to control their behavior (not their thought process or emotions, though) to some extent.

Well hijodeganas with that insight, you maybe one of a new generation of psychologists that offer BPD's the help they deserve rather than(from what i've read so far) them being ostracised from the mental health process. They need someone!

[hijodeganas]

Haha!  Sounds great, but honestly personality disorders is not my calling.  I have a lot of respect for psychologists who devote themselves to improving PDs' lives because it certainly FEELS hopeless.  But yeah, I'd like to hope for the best; I suffered from clinical depression for over a year, so I can somewhat relate to the feelings of hopelessness and powerlessness, and believing that you're just "stuck" with your debilitating personality.  It's not a good feeling.

However, right now it seems that although BPDs have a very burdensome disorder, they are STILL cognitive of their behavior and thus CAN change (although I'm sure most of them don't know HOW, much less BELIEVE they can; two requisites for the ability to alter your own behavior).

I don't know how debiliting the actual disorder is; I've never been BPD.  But from what I've heard and read it is an IMMENSE challenge, but they CAN take steps to start getting in control of their situation.  It is a lifelong process and it will NEVER be as easy for them as it is for a nonBPD, but from what information I've gathered I've come to the conclusion that it IS possible for them to control their behavior (not their thought process or emotions, though) to some extent.

Well hijodeganas with that insight, you maybe one of a new generation of psychologists that offer BPD's the help they deserve rather than(from what i've read so far) them being ostracised from the mental health process. They need someone!

[captainkirkz]

Haha!  Sounds great, but honestly personality disorders is not my calling.  I have a lot of respect for psychologists who devote themselves to improving PDs' lives because it certainly FEELS hopeless.  But yeah, I'd like to hope for the best; I suffered from clinical depression for over a year, so I can somewhat relate to the feelings of hopelessness and powerlessness, and believing that you're just "stuck" with your debilitating personality.  It's not a good feeling.

Yea, imagine being projected too on a daily basis by not one, but a whole army of different BPDs. Jeez those boys would have to be tough cookies!

Glad you sorted your own problems out!

[BlushAndBashful]

Have you asked your current gf how she would feel about this?

I like to think I'm pretty open, honest, forgiving, and go-with-the flow... .and I tend not to be jealous... .but I think I might be shooting pea green soup out of my ears if my bf did this. Just my 2 cents' worth.

[hijodeganas]

Have you asked your current gf how she would feel about this?

I like to think I'm pretty open, honest, forgiving, and go-with-the flow... .and I tend not to be jealous... .but I think I might be shooting pea green soup out of my ears if my bf did this. Just my 2 cents' worth.

Good question.  Yes, I decided to talk to her before I did anything.

She's an extremely understanding person; she also has a exbfPD, so she somewhat understands where I'm coming from.

She's naturally worried; she knows it was an intense relationship (my relationship with my current GF is much more peaceful and calm) and expressed worry over me being tempted to go back.

I understand her worry, but honestly she has nothing to fear: I'd rather have my manhood bitten off by a German Shepard than go back into a romantic relationship with that woman.

The only conditions in which I'd consider reconnecting with my ex would be if she can accept that I'll be her friend and nothing more AND she is making a genuine effort to get help.  Otherwise, I'm out of there, no looking back.

[captainkirkz]

This was part of my last email to my ex before going NC

"Whether you decide to live in the safe but empty bubble or enrich your life by ironing out your issues is entirely your call. It's your life and the only help i can ever be now is in the role i occupied before ... .as one of your greatest friends. I know a lot has gone on but my dearest wish would be for us to be friends again. I don't judge you. i never did. We all have things that we have to plough through, don't plough through it alone!"

The offer is there with boundaries in place and i won't break them!

N.B. It would be a strictly electronic friendship, no physical presence!

[hijodeganas]

Yeah, that's essentially my goal.

Initially I just wanted to go completely NC, cut her off 100%.

But I watched this guy's videos on you tube and changed my mind:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1o2tORz1tc

www.youtube.com/watch?v=Do6owMR1hSY&feature=relmfu

I thought I might actually be able to help, but only if she's as motivated as this guy seems to be.

Have you heard from her since that last email?

This was part of my last email to my ex before going NC

"Whether you decide to live in the safe but empty bubble or enrich your life by ironing out your issues is entirely your call. It's your life and the only help i can ever be now is in the role i occupied before ... .as one of your greatest friends. I know a lot has gone on but my dearest wish would be for us to be friends again. I don't judge you. i never did. We all have things that we have to plough through, don't plough through it alone!"

The offer is there with boundaries in place and i won't break them!

N.B. It would be a strictly electronic friendship, no physical presence!

[captainkirkz]

Have you heard from her since that last email?

No mate. Not a peep! I don't really expect to yet and i'm not holding my breath at all. Her past form says she will at some point though.

[hijodeganas]

Have you heard from her since that last email?

No mate. Not a peep! I don't really expect to yet and i'm not holding my breath at all. Her past form says she will at some point though.

Hmm... .I'm wondering, it's been about 2-3 weeks since she called me to harass me about asking my friends not talk to her.

How long does it usually take for BPDs to re-engage?  Do BPDs often go NC?

[captainkirkz]

Hmm... .I'm wondering, it's been about 2-3 weeks since she called me to harass me about asking my friends not talk to her.

How long does it usually take for BPDs to re-engage?  Do BPDs often go NC?

Well, it's been over a month since that last email was sent and as i said not a peep as yet.

I think i said that i have been through the r/s with my ex twice 14 years apart. The first time we split she waited 15 months before re-engaging me and she came back at me as if NOTHING had happened. Very selective memory when they need to.

Judging by the comments of the good folks on here it can vary greatly from a few days to years depending on how much they think you have to offer THEM at that point. Nothing to do with your well being no matter how they dress it up!

[hijodeganas]

It's very believable that they would re-engage when it suits them and their needs, no surprise there.

I'm very surprised to hear that it can be years later though.  I figured if several weeks/months go by, that's it.  You're forgotten.

Guess I'd better be prepared, then.  Thanks.

Hmm... .I'm wondering, it's been about 2-3 weeks since she called me to harass me about asking my friends not talk to her.

How long does it usually take for BPDs to re-engage?  Do BPDs often go NC?

Well, it's been over a month since that last email was sent and as i said not a peep as yet.

I think i said that i have been through the r/s with my ex twice 14 years apart. The first time we split she waited 15 months before re-engaging me and she came back at me as if NOTHING had happened. Very selective memory when they need to.

Judging by the comments of the good folks on here it can vary greatly from a few days to years depending on how much they think you have to offer THEM at that point. Nothing to do with your well being no matter how they dress it up!

[captainkirkz]

No probs! Be prepared ... .she's coming!

[ItsAboutTime]

My ex and I knew each other for a year, and she struck me as really positive, outgoing and happy.  Up until we made it official everything, including the sex, was a blast.  Almost immediately after we got serious it changed, though.

You've hit on one point regarding a person with BPD. As soon as they know they have you, they withdraw. They begin to devalue you. They don't want to be abandoned so they do things that will be effective in making you leave them first. Sounds so bizarre, but that's how it goes. THEY take control of the departure by leaving first emotionally. You actually become the enemy, their nemesis.

Someone has already pointed out the fact that since you are in another relationship, how would any re-engagement or reconnection with this ex affect your current relationship?  It's a natural thing for us non-BPD's to want to 'save them' or help them realize they're mentally ill and seek help. We've been there too. No, it can't at all be compared to someone who's physically handicapped. A person that has lost the use of limbs or mobility will usually work very hard at rehabilitation because they genuinely have the desire to improve their physical function. A BPD does NOT understand the depth of their mental disability and will not seek any professional help. Even the small number of those who will agree to therapy will never recover because they will manipulate even the most highly trained Psychologist.

I believe, since you are new to this mental illness, that you would benefit greatly from reading every article here that you can. Knowledge truly is freedom when it comes to this illness. It goes far deeper than you realize right now, you've only scratched the surface.

My advice would be to let it be, leave it as it is for your own welfare. Re-engagement can be from days to even years, but it happens eventually. By preparing yourself with the tools and the knowledge gained here through the personal experiences of those who've been through Hell and back with a BPD, you will be able to survive this without too many deep wounds that would last a lifetime.

[FindingMe2011]

That's a great question that I don't have an answer for.  However, right now it seems that although BPDs have a very burdensome disorder, they are STILL cognitive of their behavior and thus CAN change (although I'm sure most of them don't know HOW, much less BELIEVE they can; two requisites for the ability to alter your own behavior).

I don't know how debiliting the actual disorder is; I've never been BPD.  But from what I've heard and read it is an IMMENSE challenge, but they CAN take steps to start getting in control of their situation.  It is a lifelong process and it will NEVER be as easy for them as it is for a nonBPD, but from what information I've gathered I've come to the conclusion that it IS possible for them to control their behavior (not their thought process or emotions, though) to some extent.

I don't know if it's empty.  I'm a psychology major and studies have shown that people who have a passion about something, whether it's music or sports or whatever, can be just as happy single as people in highly functioning relationships.  It's highly unusual but people can achieve happiness without having a SO.

However, the inability to relate to even friends or family could make it difficult.  

Interesting how you note you were fantastic as friends.  My ex and I knew each other for a year, and she struck me as really positive, outgoing and happy.  Up until we made it official everything, including the sex, was a blast.  Almost immediately after we got serious it changed, though.

I wonder, though: Would even a friendship have lasted that long?

Yes hijodeganas, i see your point.

The people you mention though, the ones that are happy without a SO and are passionate about a hobby/interest(assuming they are nonBPD). They have free will don't they, so it is a conscious decision to live alone whereas a BPD has no sense of self and therefore no free will. They are subject to the constraints that their illness places upon them and therefore cannot make the same choice as a non. They are slaves to their own jumbled emotions and act out accordingly. What do you think?

   Yes you did post on the wrong board, if you are searching for validation, on reengaging with BPD. I suggest you do some more research, as your knee jerk reaction, upon putting a name to her illness, is also typical. Most especially, if your intentions are not, to be with this person.

Your concern is most noble, just as many others on this site. We and most likely you, suffer with codependency. This would be much better time spent. Your current girlfriend can say what she wants, and you can believe, what you want to believe. Making a choice to add chaos to your life, is not going to benefit, anyone involved. If you belive so, please explain. The notion that your going to save the day, for her, is a pipe dream, and you know it, or hopefully, soon will. Your support will be misenterpeted. (its a 3-7 yr old mentality) You dont think like BPD. So your motives, and BPDs, is NEVER going to be the same. Even with extensive therapy, her warp thinking will only be curved, not healed, and by a trained individual, not you.  If you would like to answer a question that would benefit you and your current r/s, try this one, " What is it about me, that had me so attracted to, such a damaged person ? , It seems, as I read through all of these posts, you are getting, pretty much the same response, and also show, how this person, has/had you on an emotional roller coaster.  It also seems very apparent, that you are hell bent on FIXING IT.  PEACE  

[hijodeganas]

You've hit on one point regarding a person with BPD. As soon as they know they have you, they withdraw. They begin to devalue you. They don't want to be abandoned so they do things that will be effective in making you leave them first. Sounds so bizarre, but that's how it goes. THEY take control of the departure by leaving first emotionally. You actually become the enemy, their nemesis.

It was very bizarre to me at the time.  I had no idea what was going on, so I kept analyzing what was going on - what did I do?  what happened?  Did I say the wrong thing?  I'd been in healthy relationships up until then, so I figured *I* must have done SOMETHING to cause it.  After a little while I just kept going that if a, b, or c happened (she got to know me better, or she quit her job or she started to trust me more, etc) she'd finally calm down and the old person would come back.

it can't at all be compared to someone who's physically handicapped. A person that has lost the use of limbs or mobility will usually work very hard at rehabilitation because they genuinely have the desire to improve their physical function. A BPD does NOT understand the depth of their mental disability and will not seek any professional help. Even the small number of those who will agree to therapy will never recover because they will manipulate even the most highly trained Psychologist.

Very valid point, but one disagreement: I've seen evidence that SOME BPDs seek treatment and SOME of them actualy do improve their situation.  The severity of the disorder varies from individual to individual.  but I agree, unlike physical problems, many if not most PDs either do not think they have a problem, or minimize it or simply do not seek help

[hijodeganas]

I believe, since you are new to this mental illness, that you would benefit greatly from reading every article here that you can. Knowledge truly is freedom when it comes to this illness. It goes far deeper than you realize right now, you've only scratched the surface.

Totally agree.  I'll admit, I'm still naive to many aspects of BPD; like I said, my encounter was considerably brief, and I got out of it fast.  In many ways, I'm thankful I'm more ignorant than most people here; I think my quick recovery can be attributed to the fact that I "only scratched the surface" as you said.

My advice would be to let it be, leave it as it is for your own welfare. Re-engagement can be from days to even years, but it happens eventually. By preparing yourself with the tools and the knowledge gained here through the personal experiences of those who've been through Hell and back with a BPD, you will be able to survive this without too many deep wounds that would last a lifetime.

This highlights one aspect of my ignorance: I assumed that if she went NC for a few weeks, then it was permanent.  However, I'm reading cases of exBPDs contacting again after several months, or even years.  Yikes.  Honestly, I'm looking forward to it; it'll be a good test of my resolve.

Thanks very much for the information and the warnings.  Much appreciated.

[hijodeganas]

Thank you for your response, and no offense, but your reaction to my reaction is also very knee jerk.   

I have posted repeatedly: I have NO desire to save her, and I am not codependent.  My only desire is to inform her of what I've learned and encourage her to get help.  If I can't do that, so be it.  I'm fine with that.

I know this may be hard to understand, but I'm the happiest and most at peace with myself I've ever been in my life now.  I'm not seeking validation.

What you seem to fail to understand is that, as the previous poster was insightful enough to notice, I know very little about BPD.  It's still new to me, and I haven't fully experienced the depth of the disorder personally.  I have no idea what to expect should we meet again, and most of the information I've received on here has been VERY useful.  To be honest, the more I read, the less I am inclined to re-engage with her again.  I never said I definitely want to - the title of this topic is "Considering."

So please, don't misinterpret when you read my posts.  I understand your intentions are for the best, but don't project your personal experiences on to mine.  Thanks.  [/quote]
   Yes you did post on the wrong board, if you are searching for validation, on reengaging with BPD. I suggest you do some more research, as your knee jerk reaction, upon putting a name to her illness, is also typical. Most especially, if your intentions are not, to be with this person.

Your concern is most noble, just as many others on this site. We and most likely you, suffer with codependency. This would be much better time spent. Your current girlfriend can say what she wants, and you can believe, what you want to believe. Making a choice to add chaos to your life, is not going to benefit, anyone involved. If you belive so, please explain. The notion that your going to save the day, for her, is a pipe dream, and you know it, or hopefully, soon will. Your support will be misenterpeted. (its a 3-7 yr old mentality) You dont think like BPD. So your motives, and BPDs, is NEVER going to be the same. Even with extensive therapy, her warp thinking will only be curved, not healed, and by a trained individual, not you.  If you would like to answer a question that would benefit you and your current r/s, try this one, " What is it about me, that had me so attracted to, such a damaged person ? , It seems, as I read through all of these posts, you are getting, pretty much the same response, and also show, how this person, has/had you on an emotional roller coaster.  It also seems very apparent, that you are hell bent on FIXING IT... .PEACE  [/quote]

[2010]

As soon as they know they have you, they withdraw. They begin to devalue you. They don't want to be abandoned so they do things that will be effective in making you leave them first. Sounds so bizarre, but that's how it goes. THEY take control of the departure by leaving first emotionally.

Alas, hijodeganas left first. In the mind of a Borderline, the quote above applies to the process that hijodeganas has taken. The break-up was 30 days ago and he has already moved on to a new partner, blocked and deleted the former partner from social contacts, asked his friends to do the same (which they complied) yet after those harsh sanctions and human shielding, is now considering re-engaging the former partner (while currently involved with a new partner) based upon "helping" her.

I'm wondering, it's been about 2-3 weeks since she called me to harass me about asking my friends not talk to her.

This doesn't sound like harassment, it sounds like hurt. Wouldn't you be hurt if your former partner asked all of their friends not to talk to you?

It's very believable that they would re-engage when it suits them and their needs, no surprise there.

This applies to your actions too.  After asking all of your friends to turn their backs upon her- You're now going to act as though you have a friendship? Your needs to reestablish contact are for what reason? Perhaps to suit you and your needs?

(new girlfriend) She's an extremely understanding person; she also has a exbfPD, so she somewhat understands where I'm coming from.

Unhealed break-ups are not a plus to have in common. Now there's two triangles; you, ex and new girl and new girl, her ex and you. This gives you allot of room to play on the drama triangles and it's very unhealthy to even consider it a benefit to have in a relationship.

to me, accepting a BPD unconditionally is the same as enabling it.

Transference and counter transference are valid roadblocks to acceptance. You'll want to get to acceptance of the disorder. It is a disorder and you are not enabling it if you accept it.

I'm reading cases of exBPDs contacting again after several months, or even years.  Yikes.  Honestly, I'm looking forward to it; it'll be a good test of my resolve.

In light of the fact that you have a new girlfriend, who is struggling with her own break-up woes, this doesn't bode well for anyone's mental health.  It sounds like you are trauma bonded instead.

I'm a psychology major and studies have shown that people who have a passion about something, whether it's music or sports or whatever, can be just as happy single as people in highly functioning relationships.  It's highly unusual but people can achieve happiness without having a SO.

Yes, people can be happy and whole without their lost objects. They shouldn't have to go out and immediately replace them either.  There should be time to heal from loss as well as to "consider" the opportunities for personal growth and introspection. Continuing to engage in a powerful one-up position to someone who is perceived as being BPD just causes more hurt. The outcome of anyone else's personal happiness (other than your own) is not in your hands.  Sometimes it's better to turn the attention to yourself for a change. 

[hijodeganas]

Interesting evaluation. Although, being virtually all on the negative slant, is also naturally partially invalid.

[hijodeganas]

Also, 2010, you've made a lot of assumptions about me, one being that you are implying *I* am the one with BPD, which is highly laughable.

Rather than trying to read into what I'm saying and commenting as though I wasn't present, try asking me directly? Would be appreciated.

[LightAtTheEndOfTheTunnel]

Don't

Do

It... .!

Look after you 

[hijodeganas]

Don't

Do

It... .!

Look after you 

Haha. Simple enough. Thanks.

Yeah, more and more I'm getting the impression I should just stay away... .

[LightAtTheEndOfTheTunnel]

Don't

Do

It... .!

Look after you 

Haha. Simple enough. Thanks.

Yeah, more and more I'm getting the impression I should just stay away... .

Look at what you have... .you have a new girlfriend and you have your life together (your words).

Concentrate on that... your one of the lucky ones who have been lucky to find love again after such a soul destroying experience with a BPD.

Concentrate on your girlfriend and yourself and your future together. Leave the past be.

Don't triangulate and become as bad as them.

   

[Suzn]

   I think everyone here is looking out for your best interests. Also most of the members that have been here a while understand BPD fairly well (we arent pros but... ) So we also look out for a pwBPD. I didnt see anything in 2010 comment that suggested you have BPD. Frankly I am very glad you are here because of the fact that you are a student of psychology. You will have a gift of knowledge from this sight you dont get from a classroom if you spend enough time here.

Have you had a chance to look this over...

Workshop - BPD: Understanding the borderline mind/what's in the head of someone with BPD?

How about this one...

Workshop - BPD: How can I get someone to see a therapist or to get into treatment?

There are tons of lessons and workshops here just for your understanding and growth.

This is all at your fingertips... .do with it what you will.

Take care of you  

[FindingMe2011]

I have posted repeatedly: I have NO desire to save her, and I am not codependent.  My only desire is to inform her of what I've learned and encourage her to get help.

Really, I would have to differ, with your opinion. WE are ALL codependent, in some way or fashion. Just some more than others, and some is healthy, some is not. You being in psychology field, I think, has some what clouded your own judgement. You yourself, in previous post, have mentioned, that only the person with the issues, has the ability to make the changes. You have went from asking everyone you know to unfriend her, to MAYBE IM THE ONE, THAT CAN MAKE THE DIFFERENCE. Because, you have gained a little knowledge. How long did you 2 date or what ever? YOu still havent answered, why you think you were attracted to someone, with such a severe mental illness, and was not able to see this, before you had invested so much. Do you not find it odd, that you are on here posting about your former r/s, while being in the next ? Do you not agree that you have brought some baggage, into your new r/s? You obviously, have moved on, by jumping into the next r/s. Not right or wrong, just IS. Nobody is perfect, and we are all human, psychology major or not. She knows she has issues. It will be alot less painful for her, to continue her ways. She will enjoy the attention, until you turn the mirror her way. I think you should go to her, and tell her of your new found knowledge (that she already knows, and may even know the name). You have also started a triangulation (read definition) game. Its of the healthy variety, for now. Continue the useless game and you will LOSE, and most likely, come away, with a worse feeling, than when you started. It may not be one to you, but rest assure, for now, and most likely for a long time, it will be to her. As long as you play by her rules. Time better served, with your new love. Its not fair to her. Look at just the amount of time you have invested today?. I wish you well.  PEACE  

[BlushAndBashful]

Haha. Simple enough. Thanks.

Yeah, more and more I'm getting the impression I should just stay away... .

Honestly, I would just say to stay away. My crystal ball says you really don't want to go near this can of worms, no matter how good your intentions are.

[2010]

Also, 2010, you've made a lot of assumptions about me, one being that you are implying *I* am the one with BPD, which is highly laughable.

Rather than trying to read into what I'm saying and commenting as though I wasn't present, try asking me directly? Would be appreciated.

I made no such assumption. But I was "asking you directly" these questions:

I'm wondering, it's been about 2-3 weeks since she called me to harass me about asking my friends not talk to her.

This doesn't sound like harassment, it sounds like hurt. Wouldn't you be hurt if your former partner asked all of their friends not to talk to you?

It's very believable that they would re-engage when it suits them and their needs, no surprise there.

This applies to your actions too.  After asking all of your friends to turn their backs upon her- You're now going to act as though you have a friendship?

Your needs to reestablish contact are for what reason? Perhaps to suit you and your needs?

[hijodeganas]

Hmm. Perhaps I don't fully understand the definition of codependency then. I really don't care if I see her again. Ultimately that's up to her. Also, if certain conditions are not met I am not interested in any contact with her whatsoever.

However, I'll admit that I still think about her every day. If that constitutes co-depency then I am still codependent.

That's a fair point, about me thinking *I* am the one who can make a difference. I'm starting to think that's highly unrealistic and that really its up to her. I wonder though: if you are ignorant of your own disorder, wouldn't that make it harder? Wouldn't it be helpful to know what's wrong with you?

I was attracted to her because she was an awesome person. Pretty simple. I stayed because I mistakenly attributed her behavior to her being young or to my past history as a "player." I ended it after two and a half months because it was just exhausting.

I find it odd but not unusual that I am another relationship. I expected to be lambasted for it, that's alright.

The more I'm reading and receiving these responses the more I feel I should just get out, and that I would probably offer the most benefit to everyone involved if I just stuck with my very first plan: moving on with my life.

Thanks for your insights and opinion. Much appreciated.

I have posted repeatedly: I have NO desire to save her, and I am not codependent.  My only desire is to inform her of what I've learned and encourage her to get help.

Really, I would have to differ, with your opinion. WE are ALL codependent, in some way or fashion. Just some more than others, and some is healthy, some is not. You being in psychology field, I think, has some what clouded your own judgement. You yourself, in previous post, have mentioned, that only the person with the issues, has the ability to make the changes. You have went from asking everyone you know to unfriend her, to MAYBE IM THE ONE, THAT CAN MAKE THE DIFFERENCE. Because, you have gained a little knowledge. How long did you 2 date or what ever? YOu still havent answered, why you think you were attracted to someone, with such a severe mental illness, and was not able to see this, before you had invested so much. Do you not find it odd, that you are on here posting about your former r/s, while being in the next ? Do you not agree that you have brought some baggage, into your new r/s? You obviously, have moved on, by jumping into the next r/s. Not right or wrong, just IS. Nobody is perfect, and we are all human, psychology major or not. She knows she has issues. It will be alot less painful for her, to continue her ways. She will enjoy the attention, until you turn the mirror her way. I think you should go to her, and tell her of your new found knowledge (that she already knows, and may even know the name). You have also started a triangulation (read definition) game. Its of the healthy variety, for now. Continue the useless game and you will LOSE, and most likely, come away, with a worse feeling, than when you started. It may not be one to you, but rest assure, for now, and most likely for a long time, it will be to her. As long as you play by her rules. Time better served, with your new love. Its not fair to her. Look at just the amount of time you have invested today?. I wish you well... .PEACE   

Haha. Simple enough. Thanks.

Yeah, more and more I'm getting the impression I should just stay away... .

Honestly, I would just say to stay away. My crystal ball says you really don't want to go near this can of worms, no matter how good your intentions are.

Hmm... .I'm hearing this more and more... .In all honesty, I think I am deceiving myself into thinking I can "help" her even though, realistically, there's probably nothing I can do and that re-engaging is probably a bad idea.

It does make me sad to think she has to suffer like that, maybe for many years, if not the rest of her life.

[hijodeganas]

I agree. Everyone has their own unique ways of communicating it. Lol

I was never interested in abnormal psychology until recently. I'm more into developmental and educational. I'm taking a keen interest in people's reactions to my situation here.

  I think everyone here is looking out for your best interests. Also most of the members that have been here a while understand BPD fairly well (we arent pros but... ) So we also look out for a pwBPD. I didnt see anything in 2010 comment that suggested you have BPD. Frankly I am very glad you are here because of the fact that you are a student of psychology. You will have a gift of knowledge from this sight you dont get from a classroom if you spend enough time here.

Have you had a chance to look this over...

Workshop - BPD: Understanding the borderline mind/what's in the head of someone with BPD?

How about this one...

Workshop - BPD: How can I get someone to see a therapist or to get into treatment?

There are tons of lessons and workshops here just for your understanding and growth.

This is all at your fingertips... .do with it what you will.

Take care of you  

[pallavirajsinghani]

Hello h:

I present my comments as observations and not as criticisms.  I would appreciate it if you would reflect upon them (not react immediately, but really reflect) and then post (if you'd like to, of course).

It appears to me that you requested advice and opinion.

When the opinion and advice has been in general NOT to reengage, you have bristled at it.

So the questions to ask yourself are these--I am restating some of the questions that 2010 has asked you.

1)  Are you actually looking for approval from the board members to reengage?

2)  Are you eager to use her as a test subject of your "new found" knowledge and understanding of this disorder?

3)  Is your desire to "help" her genuine?  Or is it hubris?  Or perhaps you are using her as an "academic" study.

 Just being a psychology major will not help you to help her for a variety of reasons, some of which I will briefly mention:

        a)  You are not a clinician--and she is not your client.

        b)  You are not a DBT expert.

        c)  You are not fully cognizant of the effects of this disorder on non-BPD people.

4)  You have not defined what that "help" means.  How much time, emotional energy, physical energy, money are you willing to spend on giving her this "help".

5)  How will you prevent yourself from FOG (Fear/Obligation/Guilt).  Think that if you are so weak that you cannot even resist her for more than 30 days, how can you resist her now?  What exactly has happened to you in these 30 days that has given you strength, wisdom, knowledge, greater experience?

6)  Are you wishing to reengage because you miss the thrill and the adrenaline rush of "high drama"?  If you believe that Peace and Boredom are the same and Excitement and Anxiety are synonymous, then perhaps further life experience and maturity must occur before you even consider reengaging.

As 2010 recommends, indepth and honest reflection and selt-retrospection must be conducted before you take any action regarding reengaging.

God bless.

       

[hijodeganas]

Initially I was considering re-engaging. I thought it would be best. Now I'm highly doubtful that it would be beneficial.

It is partially to learn, rather experience. But it's pointless if it's not going to be beneficial to anyone.

That's why I'm grateful for this place: people here have more experience than I do. Everyone's input is valuable.

Hello h:

I present my comments as observations and not as criticisms.  I would appreciate it if you would reflect upon them (not react immediately, but really reflect) and then post (if you'd like to, of course).

It appears to me that you requested advice and opinion.

When the opinion and advice has been in general NOT to reengage, you have bristled at it.

So the questions to ask yourself are these--I am restating some of the questions that 2010 has asked you.

1)  Are you actually looking for approval from the board members to reengage?

2)  Are you eager to use her as a test subject of your "new found" knowledge and understanding of this disorder?

3)  Is your desire to "help" her genuine?  Or is it hubris?  Or perhaps you are using her as an "academic" study.

  Just being a psychology major will not help you to help her for a variety of reasons, some of which I will briefly mention:

         a)  You are not a clinician--and she is not your client.

         b)  You are not a DBT expert.

         c)  You are not fully cognizant of the effects of this disorder on non-BPD people.

4)  You have not defined what that "help" means.  How much time, emotional energy, physical energy, money are you willing to spend on giving her this "help".

5)  How will you prevent yourself from FOG (Fear/Obligation/Guilt).  Think that if you are so weak that you cannot even resist her for more than 30 days, how can you resist her now?  What exactly has happened to you in these 30 days that has given you strength, wisdom, knowledge, greater experience?

6)  Are you wishing to reengage because you miss the thrill and the adrenaline rush of "high drama"?  If you believe that Peace and Boredom are the same and Excitement and Anxiety are synonymous, then perhaps further life experience and maturity must occur before you even consider reengaging.

As 2010 recommends, indepth and honest reflection and selt-retrospection must be conducted before you take any action regarding reengaging.

God bless.

         

There are assumptions imbedded in those questions but I'll answer them.

No, I wouldn't be hurt. Surprised, maybe, but they are HER friends, not mine. It would be understandable.

Yes, I'm not totally altruistic. I want to see if I can handle her better now that I'm aware. It also bothers me to think someone might be suffering without knowing why.

Also, 2010, you've made a lot of assumptions about me, one being that you are implying *I* am the one with BPD, which is highly laughable.

Rather than trying to read into what I'm saying and commenting as though I wasn't present, try asking me directly? Would be appreciated.

I made no such assumption. But I was "asking you directly" these questions:

I'm wondering, it's been about 2-3 weeks since she called me to harass me about asking my friends not talk to her.

This doesn't sound like harassment, it sounds like hurt. Wouldn't you be hurt if your former partner asked all of their friends not to talk to you?

It's very believable that they would re-engage when it suits them and their needs, no surprise there.

This applies to your actions too.  After asking all of your friends to turn their backs upon her- You're now going to act as though you have a friendship?

Your needs to reestablish contact are for what reason? Perhaps to suit you and your needs?

[FindingMe2011]

I agree. Everyone has their own unique ways of communicating it. Lol

I was never interested in abnormal psychology until recently. I'm more into developmental and educational. I'm taking a keen interest in people's reactions to my situation here.

  I think everyone here is looking out for your best interests. Also most of the members that have been here a while understand BPD fairly well (we arent pros but... ) So we also look out for a pwBPD. I didnt see anything in 2010 comment that suggested you have BPD. Frankly I am very glad you are here because of the fact that you are a student of psychology. You will have a gift of knowledge from this sight you dont get from a classroom if you spend enough time here.

Have you had a chance to look this over...

Workshop - BPD: Understanding the borderline mind/what's in the head of someone with BPD?

How about this one...

Workshop - BPD: How can I get someone to see a therapist or to get into treatment?

There are tons of lessons and workshops here just for your understanding and growth.

This is all at your fingertips.  do with it what you will.

Take care of you  

The kicker to all of this. Is if you truly do, discover your truth. All of this sticks out like a sore thumb. Chances are pretty good, there were many red flags, all through out your r/s. People can act, for only a certain amount of time, and even then they will tell, and show, whom they really are, including you, me and everybody else. Maybe you will take a keen intrest, in finding your truth. One does not have to meet you, to see what you are telling them. They are your words. Words that you have carefully typed. Look through, just this post, it tells plenty, whether you realize it or not. You have talked about her, and it is really about you.  PEACE

[hijodeganas]

1)  Are you actually looking for approval from the board members to reengage?

No, not at all.

2)  Are you eager to use her as a test subject of your "new found" knowledge and understanding of this disorder?

No, I don't think so. But I am curious about it.

3)  Is your desire to "help" her genuine?  Or is it hubris?  Or perhaps you are using her as an "academic" study.

A bit of both.

I'm on my phone and it's about to die so I'll continue later, sorry.

 Just being a psychology major will not help you to help her for a variety of reasons, some of which I will briefly mention:

        a)  You are not a clinician--and she is not your client.

        b)  You are not a DBT expert.

        c)  You are not fully cognizant of the effects of this disorder on non-BPD people.

4)  You have not defined what that "help" means.  How much time, emotional energy, physical energy, money are you willing to spend on giving her this "help".

5)  How will you prevent yourself from FOG (Fear/Obligation/Guilt).  Think that if you are so weak that you cannot even resist her for more than 30 days, how can you resist her now?  What exactly has happened to you in these 30 days that has given you strength, wisdom, knowledge, greater experience?

6)  Are you wishing to reengage because you miss the thrill and the adrenaline rush of "high drama"?  If you believe that Peace and Boredom are the same and Excitement and Anxiety are synonymous, then perhaps further life experience and maturity must occur before you even consider reengaging.

As 2010 recommends, indepth and honest reflection and selt-retrospection must be conducted before you take any action regarding reengaging.

God bless.

        [/quote]

[pallavirajsinghani]

My Friend,  You hit the nail on its head when you said, "I want to see if I can handle her better... ."



This is Taming of the Shrew syndrome.  :)on't google it, the term is my invention of 10 seconds ago.

She is feral indeed.  You wish to domesticate her.  In return you want her eternal gratitude and admiration.  Can you even begin to see the moral implications of this stance?

Yes, I do believe you when you say that it hurts you to see her suffer.  Well, you should explore this board further, more specifically, pay attention to the threads where BPD sufferers have been told by the people who love them of this diagnosis, or even that they may have some mental disorder.

Your altruism is laudable.  It is what makes you human.  One of the criteria of mental disorder in the DSM manual is "absence of altruism".

The general consensus is that even though your impulse may be right, even if your impulse may be only to help her, even then, it is not advisable for you to act upon it.  Your altruism is misplaced.  You should not hesitate to develop your study of psychology further into abnormal psychology area, or to help as a volunteer on a suicide hotline, or volunteer to help in a mental health facility... .your altruism can take many other forms.  Forms, which will teach you a lot while simultaneously protecting from your ego (I use this term now in a clinical sense) from getting damaged.

I am very proud of you because you sought feedback.  

Hell is paved with good intentions... .and Thoreau never said that the cure for love is to love the same person more.  It is not that you did not love her enough.  Love, as you will understand when you read about this disorder more, is not in itself or by itself a cure for mental disorder.

Seek peace, and light and good health my friend... .

[hijodeganas]

1)  Are you actually looking for approval from the board members to reengage?

At a computer now, so I'll try to answer properly: No, I'm not.

2)  Are you eager to use her as a test subject of your "new found" knowledge and understanding of this disorder?

Not exactly.  Though I am curious what it would be like to interact with her now that I'm more aware.

3)  Is your desire to "help" her genuine?  Or is it hubris?  Or perhaps you are using her as an "academic" study.

Like I said, I am curious, but if I cannot offer her any genuine help, there would be no point and I'd rather move on with my life.

 Just being a psychology major will not help you to help her for a variety of reasons, some of which I will briefly mention:

        a)  You are not a clinician--and she is not your client.

        b)  You are not a DBT expert.

        c)  You are not fully cognizant of the effects of this disorder on non-BPD people.

This is totally true.  I have little to no knowledge of PDs in general, much less BPD.


4)  You have not defined what that "help" means.  How much time, emotional energy, physical energy, money are you willing to spend on giving her this "help".

This is an excellent question.  In all honesty, I'm not sure.  Monetarily, none.  Other than that, whatever I can afford, which I've come to realize is probably not going to be enough... .

5)  How will you prevent yourself from FOG (Fear/Obligation/Guilt).  Think that if you are so weak that you cannot even resist her for more than 30 days, how can you resist her now?  What exactly has happened to you in these 30 days that has given you strength, wisdom, knowledge, greater experience?

Another excellent question.  It's hard to explain really.  Awareness has helped.  My friends and family were extremely helpful.  I've gotten back into self-improvement and self-development, something I was really into several years ago, and I feel like I'm getting my perspective back.  Getting active again was also immensely helpful.

But I am not so delusional that I think it's "enough" yet.  My last remaining fear is how to handle seeing/meeting her again.  I haven't seen her since the break up so I really don't know how I would handle dealing with her face to face.  I think I could but I'm really not sure.

However, day to day life has gotten back to normal and my current perspective on the situation is fantastic.  I'm actually grateful for it; I feel sometimes we need a kick in the pants to get our stuff together once in awhile, and this was the "gift" I received from the experience.

6)  Are you wishing to reengage because you miss the thrill and the adrenaline rush of "high drama"?  If you believe that Peace and Boredom are the same and Excitement and Anxiety are synonymous, then perhaps further life experience and maturity must occur before you even consider reengaging.

Absolutely not.  I had more than enough of that while we're together.  You asked previously something else that helped me.  Martin Seligman, a psychologist who created Positive Psychology, was a great help.  I realize the the "drug" like feeling of being with a BPD is not happiness.  It doesn't; it CAN'T last.  I want lasting happiness, and I have that from every other aspect of my life right now.  Like I said, my current GF brings me peace, and I'm crazy about her for it.

As 2010 recommends, indepth and honest reflection and selt-retrospection must be conducted before you take any action regarding reengaging.

God bless.

       

Thanks a ton for the great questions.  Very eye opening.

[hijodeganas]

My Friend,  You hit the nail on its head when you said, "I want to see if I can handle her better... ."



This is Taming of the Shrew syndrome.  :)on't google it, the term is my invention of 10 seconds ago.

She is feral indeed.  You wish to domesticate her.  In return you want her eternal gratitude and admiration.  Can you even begin to see the moral implications of this stance?

Yes, I do believe you when you say that it hurts you to see her suffer.  Well, you should explore this board further, more specifically, pay attention to the threads where BPD sufferers have been told by the people who love them of this diagnosis, or even that they may have some mental disorder.

Your altruism is laudable.  It is what makes you human.  One of the criteria of mental disorder in the DSM manual is "absence of altruism".

The general consensus is that even though your impulse may be right, even if your impulse may be only to help her, even then, it is not advisable for you to act upon it.  Your altruism is misplaced.  You should not hesitate to develop your study of psychology further into abnormal psychology area, or to help as a volunteer on a suicide hotline, or volunteer to help in a mental health facility... .your altruism can take many other forms.  Forms, which will teach you a lot while simultaneously protecting from your ego (I use this term now in a clinical sense) from getting damaged.

I am very proud of you because you sought feedback.  

Hell is paved with good intentions... .and Thoreau never said that the cure for love is to love the same person more.  It is not that you did not love her enough.  Love, as you will understand when you read about this disorder more, is not in itself or by itself a cure for mental disorder.

Seek peace, and light and good health my friend... .

yes and no.  As has been typical so far, you seem to be projecting your experiences or stories on to me.

No, I don't expect any gratitude from her.  I know well enough I'll never get it.

But yes, I do feel like I want to "conquer" this, and that might be a pipe dream.  I want to do it for myself, not for her.  I know my moral stance on this.

Thank you for the thread suggestions.  I'll definitely check them out; I'm sure they'll be of help.

Your idea about redirecting my altruism is fantastic.  Thanks a lot.  In the very least, I want to take my insight and energy and point it at something useful.  If this specific girl is beyond reach, so be it.  I'm fine with that.  But it would be comforting to know I can get SOMETHING out of the experience.  Thank you so much.

Very nice insight on my Thoreau quote... .excellent point there... .

Still got lots of learning to do.

[hijodeganas]

We'll agree to disagree. 

I agree. Everyone has their own unique ways of communicating it. Lol

I was never interested in abnormal psychology until recently. I'm more into developmental and educational. I'm taking a keen interest in people's reactions to my situation here.

  I think everyone here is looking out for your best interests. Also most of the members that have been here a while understand BPD fairly well (we arent pros but... ) So we also look out for a pwBPD. I didnt see anything in 2010 comment that suggested you have BPD. Frankly I am very glad you are here because of the fact that you are a student of psychology. You will have a gift of knowledge from this sight you dont get from a classroom if you spend enough time here.

Have you had a chance to look this over...

Workshop - BPD: Understanding the borderline mind/what's in the head of someone with BPD?

How about this one...

Workshop - BPD: How can I get someone to see a therapist or to get into treatment?

There are tons of lessons and workshops here just for your understanding and growth.

This is all at your fingertips... .do with it what you will.

Take care of you  

The kicker to all of this. Is if you truly do, discover your truth. All of this sticks out like a sore thumb. Chances are pretty good, there were many red flags, all through out your r/s. People can act, for only a certain amount of time, and even then they will tell, and show, whom they really are, including you, me and everybody else. Maybe you will take a keen intrest, in finding your truth. One does not have to meet you, to see what you are telling them. They are your words. Words that you have carefully typed. Look through, just this post, it tells plenty, whether you realize it or not. You have talked about her, and it is really about you... .PEACE

[loveisblind]

I broke up with a borderline about a month ago and only recently found out that she has BPD.  I've moved on (got a new GF, got my life together), but with my new found awareness I feel that I could be of more help to her, as a friend.

I am shocked at how fast you moved on... .I'm not trying to make assumptions but are you dating this new girl as a rebound? I mean a month doesn't seem very long to just recover. How long were you together? Were you in love? Again I'm not judging I'm just curious. How does your new girlfriend feel about you reconnecting with a girlfriend that you had just an intense relationship with.

Also I have wanted to reconnect as a "friend" but it is impossible. We can't force them to get treatment but more importantly it's up to them to gain self actualization. You can't undo the illness.

I struggle everyday NOT to break NC and so does everyone on this board. Stay strong.

[hijodeganas]

I am too, quite frankly.   

I do feel that I was in love with my exuBPDgf, but my only explanation is that my experience was much shorter than most people's (only two and a half months).  That, plus years of self-improvement.

Quite honestly, I was.  I never really explained my situation with the current r/s.  I've known the girl 5 years.  We've been friends that long.  We started REALLY getting along last year, almost all year, but we both wound up in our separate r/s's.  We also wound up breaking up at the same time, still keeping in touch.  She's also leaving in March, taking a year long internship abroad.  I had no plans to start a r/s so soon, but I can't explain it, it just made sense.  I'm sure I'll receive my criticisms for it, so be it.  I'm very happy in it, and by happy I don't mean "roller coaster ride" happy, I mean "sitting quietly on the beach at night, peacefully" happy.

My current GF was obviously anxious about me considering reconnecting with the ex, but she was also very understanding.  However, I have since changed my mind (I made a new post on L3).  Virtually everyone has said what you said in one way or another: it's not possible and not worth it; it's hard enough to stay away, much less re-engage or be re-engaged.  I've been going over it, and I have to agree.

Thanks for your considerate post and questions.

I broke up with a borderline about a month ago and only recently found out that she has BPD.  I've moved on (got a new GF, got my life together), but with my new found awareness I feel that I could be of more help to her, as a friend.

I am shocked at how fast you moved on... .I'm not trying to make assumptions but are you dating this new girl as a rebound? I mean a month doesn't seem very long to just recover. How long were you together? Were you in love? Again I'm not judging I'm just curious. How does your new girlfriend feel about you reconnecting with a girlfriend that you had just an intense relationship with.

Also I have wanted to reconnect as a "friend" but it is impossible. We can't force them to get treatment but more importantly it's up to them to gain self actualization. You can't undo the illness.

I struggle everyday NOT to break NC and so does everyone on this board. Stay strong.

[hijodeganas]

I wanted to apologize because I misread your post and made a mistake:

Prior to the r/s, there were few red flags, virtually none of which I could have expected myself to notice.  However, during the r/s there were a TON, you're right.  I keep a voice recorder journal where I record my thoughts almost every day, and listening over them, I shook my head and laughed: I lost count of how many red flags I talked about.  In one of my recordings, after our first fight, I said "I don't know why but I have a feeling this r/s isn't going to last long."  Hindsight is 20/20 eh?

So, my bad: Yes, during the r/s there were a TON of red flags.

I agree. Everyone has their own unique ways of communicating it. Lol

I was never interested in abnormal psychology until recently. I'm more into developmental and educational. I'm taking a keen interest in people's reactions to my situation here.

  I think everyone here is looking out for your best interests. Also most of the members that have been here a while understand BPD fairly well (we arent pros but... ) So we also look out for a pwBPD. I didnt see anything in 2010 comment that suggested you have BPD. Frankly I am very glad you are here because of the fact that you are a student of psychology. You will have a gift of knowledge from this sight you dont get from a classroom if you spend enough time here.

Have you had a chance to look this over...

Workshop - BPD: Understanding the borderline mind/what's in the head of someone with BPD?

How about this one...

Workshop - BPD: How can I get someone to see a therapist or to get into treatment?

There are tons of lessons and workshops here just for your understanding and growth.

This is all at your fingertips... .do with it what you will.

Take care of you  

The kicker to all of this. Is if you truly do, discover your truth. All of this sticks out like a sore thumb. Chances are pretty good, there were many red flags, all through out your r/s. People can act, for only a certain amount of time, and even then they will tell, and show, whom they really are, including you, me and everybody else. Maybe you will take a keen intrest, in finding your truth. One does not have to meet you, to see what you are telling them. They are your words. Words that you have carefully typed. Look through, just this post, it tells plenty, whether you realize it or not. You have talked about her, and it is really about you... .PEACE

[blackandwhite]

We've reached our four-page thread limit. Time to lock this one up. 

B&W