Been thinking about other parts of my life

[Our abuse recovery guide]

Hello all,

I originally came to this site for help with my wife's behaviour. However I've read that sometimes we get ourselves because we are conditioned from childhood to except this type of behaviour. Then I started thinking about red flags from my childhood. First off I was thinking that I spent a lot of my early childhood alone, most of my earliest memories are all from within my bedroom. Mom and dad separated when I was real young and I don't really have any memories of my father. The odd thing is whenever I've mentioned him my mom gets really defensive and pulls him down. Then came a string of boyfriends, some of whom where really abusive. Never towards me but I did witness a lot of physical abuse. Then after these I remember her meeting her partner who she has been with for nearly three decades. She was only with him a couple of years before she started have 'affairs' I only stopped noticing these when I confronted her while I was young, around 11. She has since told me that she only stayed with her partner because I made her. I've always known my mom to be a hitter, always smacking me as 'kids need a good slap.' When I was around 11 I remember her kicking me in the back because I was on my computer and was trying to find a save point on the game. Shortly after this I witnessed her drinking, she started sitting up all night drinking spirits. I started hating this as she would drag me out of bed in the early hours of the morning and belittle me until I was in floods of tears with statements like "Your a waste of space." "You ruined my life." When I was around 14 I walked in on her drunk with pills all over the table. I only went to check on her because she came in and said "there's no more I love you's." " I've got to cut the apron strings." So confused I followed her. The thing is she always where's this angry scowl when she's drunk of pure hatred.

Her way of showing love seemed to be buying me gifts. I used to hate opening presents, I used to get told "Your a selfish, ungrateful brat." I still hate recieving gifts 20 years later, I feel really ashamed when I get them. I don't like being around people who are drunk either. I hate when my wife comes in drunk although she is a happy drunk and will chat to me for ages. The thing is when I started establishing boundaries with my wife she got real frustrated at first but now she will go away and come back and we compromise. When I set a boundary with my mom she ran to her partner and the only way I can explain it was it was exactly like what my 4 year old does when you tell her that she can't have her own way. This freaked me out so I decided to leave. Once me, my wife and kids where out the door she ran down and slammed it behind us. I pointed out to my wife that her behaviour seemed odd. I also asked if I was out of line and she said "You were very fair and I agree with what you said." It was later when my wife said " I didn't want to say anything but your mom is always sarcastic with you and always pulls you down and belittles you."

I always get told I'm lucky because I always got everything I wanted. Does any of this behaviour sound familiar? I've started to think I didn't have the amazing childhood I was convinced I had.

[cartman1]

Hello all,

I originally came to this site for help with my wife's behaviour. However I've read that sometimes we get ourselves because we are conditioned from childhood to except this type of behaviour. Then I started thinking about red flags from my childhood. First off I was thinking that I spent a lot of my early childhood alone, most of my earliest memories are all from within my bedroom. Mom and dad separated when I was real young and I don't really have any memories of my father. The odd thing is whenever I've mentioned him my mom gets really defensive and pulls him down. Then came a string of boyfriends, some of whom where really abusive. Never towards me but I did witness a lot of physical abuse. Then after these I remember her meeting her partner who she has been with for nearly three decades. She was only with him a couple of years before she started have 'affairs' I only stopped noticing these when I confronted her while I was young, around 11. She has since told me that she only stayed with her partner because I made her. I've always known my mom to be a hitter, always smacking me as 'kids need a good slap.' When I was around 11 I remember her kicking me in the back because I was on my computer and was trying to find a save point on the game. Shortly after this I witnessed her drinking, she started sitting up all night drinking spirits. I started hating this as she would drag me out of bed in the early hours of the morning and belittle me until I was in floods of tears with statements like "Your a waste of space." "You ruined my life." When I was around 14 I walked in on her drunk with pills all over the table. I only went to check on her because she came in and said "there's no more I love you's." " I've got to cut the apron strings." So confused I followed her. The thing is she always where's this angry scowl when she's drunk of pure hatred.

Her way of showing love seemed to be buying me gifts. I used to hate opening presents, I used to get told "Your a selfish, ungrateful brat." I still hate recieving gifts 20 years later, I feel really ashamed when I get them. I don't like being around people who are drunk either. I hate when my wife comes in drunk although she is a happy drunk and will chat to me for ages. The thing is when I started establishing boundaries with my wife she got real frustrated at first but now she will go away and come back and we compromise. When I set a boundary with my mom she ran to her partner and the only way I can explain it was it was exactly like what my 4 year old does when you tell her that she can't have her own way. This freaked me out so I decided to leave. Once me, my wife and kids where out the door she ran down and slammed it behind us. I pointed out to my wife that her behaviour seemed odd. I also asked if I was out of line and she said "You were very fair and I agree with what you said." It was later when my wife said " I didn't want to say anything but your mom is always sarcastic with you and always pulls you down and belittles you."

I always get told I'm lucky because I always got everything I wanted. Does any of this behaviour sound familiar? I've started to think I didn't have the amazing childhood I was convinced I had.

[cartman1]

Just wanted to say. I don't think she has BPD but I've never considered her to have maladaptive behaviours before and this all is. Plus the getting at tattoo on a whim. A piercing out of the blue. There's loads of impulsive behaviour.

[GeekyGirl]

Hi cartman1 (and I've been meaning to tell you, I love that name--reminds me of South Park and good times ),

Your mother's behavior does sound like it's consistent with BPD traits. It sounds like her comments (especially after drinking) were incredibly hurtful.

Your feelings towards gifts sound familiar too. There have been a number of members here with BPD mothers, me included, that also have felt that their mothers equated love and gifts. My mother is a compulsive shopper and the quality/quantity of her gifts is a direct reflection of her feelings about the recipient at the time. I can understand how it makes gift giving and receiving not so much fun for you.

What, if any, similarities do you see between your mother and your wife?

[cartman1]

There isn't any obvious things that jump out. But neither of them like going anywhere on there own. They always need someone with them. Both think its important to buy gifts for people. (I like giving, just not recieving.) I'd rather give someone my undivided attention as that more important. When you give either of them an opinion on something they both easily take an opinion as a criticism and get very offended but at the same time they demand an opinion, it makes my head spin.

With my wife though I've seen disassociation, something I've never heard from my mum although she always tells me about ghosts she's seen. I don't know what that's about. Oh and they both like to hide an insult in a joke?

[cartman1]

Oh and both are very invalidating both verbally and emotionally.

[cartman1]

When I say invalidating both verbally and emotionally I mean they will talk but when you reply they do something like just walk out the room half way through your sentence or something like that and then just continue the conversation as if they just never heard what I was saying. I always laugh to myself now and think 'Am I supposed to be in this conversation  '

With the emotional thing, when my Grandfather passed away my wife just didn't know what to do. She just seemed to leave me alone and then had a go at me for having a cry one night. Where as my Mom said something like "I don't know why your so upset, I've lost my Dad!" The thing is I don't even think I took it too bad really. I didn't sit around or anything, I took one day off work while he was in the hospital dying and one for the funeral and had a couple of times I had a cry.

Whenever I have something up with me Like a family member die or I'm ill. My wife just can't stand me, I find that strange. Being mad at someone for being ill.

Compared to my wife though I've had an extremely bland childhood. When my wife opens up, it churns me up inside. Some of the stuff she says is terrifying. I think she's so brave just getting up in the morning. I wonder though, If I'd met a normal and well balanced girl. I wonder if she would see my childhood as terrifying because to me it's normal. I don't know any different, it's all I know and there's no changing the past. But I can change today and the future. Nothings going to hold me back.

[ScarletOlive]

Hey cartman1,

I agree with GeekyGirl, your mother's behavior does seem to jive with BPD. I'm sorry she said such hurtful things, ignored your opinions, invalidated you and smacked you. You didn't deserve any of those things, and I can totally see why you would have a hard time being around drunk people after that.

Also, having everything you wanted doesn't equal amazing childhood. My parents usually gave me what I wanted, and they could be very loving too. This doesn't negate the fact that my parents were abusive, nor does it excuse the abuse.

I understand what you mean about comparing your childhood to your wife's. Still, I think that abuse is bad, period. We can always find people with worse stories than our own, but it does not make what happened to us any "less" bad.

Sending you lots of caring as you go through these thoughts, cartman.

[GeekyGirl]

Whenever I have something up with me Like a family member die or I'm ill. My wife just can't stand me, I find that strange. Being mad at someone for being ill.

That sounds very frustrating and invalidating. Have you told your wife how that makes you feel?

We tend to look for partners that remind us (on some level) of our parents, because that's what we're most comfortable and familiar with, so it's no surprise that your mother and wife have some very similar traits.

Looking at it from the glass-half-full point of view, at least you already have some tools and knowledge of BPD, so you can apply them to your mother. Even if she doesn't have BPD (and just shows BPD traits), some of them, like SET, are useful with people without BPD.

[cartman1]

Hi,

I'm guessing they are just traits, I bet these traits would link through a lot personality disorders and 'issues' alike. The main thing for me isn't the 'they have XPD' it's accepting that these people are in my life, they have been very invalidating for different reasons. But if I had been a truly confident and strong person in the past I presume I wouldn't need the validation in the first place, well in my adult life at least. Here's a quote from member 2010:-

1) Attempts to be heard by a deaf and disordered person are repetitious and compulsive and it’s all about your identity and voice (that’s been disallowed) from childhood.

2) Perhaps you keep giving these people another chance to prove you’re wrong. Yes, maybe they just need a little more time to understand their disorder. Is this your attempt to be fair and balanced while getting your voice i.e., “needs” heard? (This facilitates your attraction.) Is it possible that you keep returning to this person to get your needs met because you are conditioned from childhood to return to a person who cannot and will not hear you? (a person that disallows your voice based upon their pattern of maladaptive behavior?) If so, you need to stop.

I accept this. I accept I need to stop this, especially number 2 with my Wife. Trying to get your voice heard by invalidating people will leave you feeling invalidated.PERIOD. For the first time in my life I'm looking for my own validation, I'm pinning my hope on me. It's quite empowering to sit down and decide what you want to do with your life and give your life your own meaning and not have to think of the fog, kick eggshells out the way. I refuse to feel anxious. I accept that there was good parts to my childhood and bad parts. The main thing is though I refuse to feel ashamed about it anymore. I'll feel like there's a load off my mind now I've wrote this.

The Journey continues, thanks Peeps! 

[doubleAries]

cartman (oh, and geekyGirl, I actually DID grow up in South Park--yes, it's a real place)

My mom was the witch of all witches. Yet somehow, I believed that once I got out of there, everything would be fine. It didn't even occur to me that any of the abuse would have some kind of lasting effect on me. And my mind could not grasp the connection between growing up in serious dysfunction, and then later me marrying a man diagnosed bipolar with psychotic features, ASPD and NPD. How could there possibly be any connection? 

[cartman1]

cartman (oh, and geekyGirl, I actually DID grow up in South Park--yes, it's a real place)

My mom was the witch of all witches. Yet somehow, I believed that once I got out of there, everything would be fine. It didn't even occur to me that any of the abuse would have some kind of lasting effect on me. And my mind could not grasp the connection between growing up in serious dysfunction, and then later me marrying a man diagnosed bipolar with psychotic features, ASPD and NPD. How could there possibly be any connection? 

Hey doubleAries, think my new catchphrase should be "screw you guys, I'm going home."?

On a serious note I was thinking along these lines myself. 3 adult relationships, first with adopted girl I was getting bad vibes from, real clingy. (southparks actually just started ) second sexually abused in teen years, Dad run off early on and Mom was a binge drinker, had real obsessive compulsive behavior. Then my Wife, I walked straight from girl 2 into her. She had just been dumped in a flat by her parents sexual abuse and alcoholic Mom and the dance started. Obviously my Mother hated all 3! Now I've got a T' with a sore ear.

and remember ":)rugs are bad um'kay!"

[doubleAries]

MKay! (I actually met Trey Parker a couple years ago at a political convention and we talked about the elementary school we both went to--a few years apart--for quite a while)

All my realtionships have been dysfunctional. Even my friendships earlier on. Started cleaning up that act (actually have friends now who are well adjusted, independent, "regular" people who don't need anything from me--just like me   ) and hope the same thing starts happening in my intimate relationship life! Well, it's not just "hope". It's finally understanding at least the beginning of how to make that happen. Maybe someone could actually just like me, and I don't have to rescue them, fix them, save them so they owe me some affection   Hell, maybe i can even put down Mr. Hat and just be myself! 

[GeekyGirl]

Even though this is a pretty serious thread, I'm loving the SP references!

I think we've all been conditioned to shelve our needs, which does make having healthy relationships difficult. We grew up with behavior that set the tone for dysfunctional relationships down the road, and it takes a lot of work, courage, and growing pains to move towards healthy relationships. I could write a book about the unhealthy relationships I chose to enter before meeting DH, and when I look back, I made some unhealthy choices because I was trying to find love and affection from anywhere I could find it... .  because I wasn't getting it from my parents. Have any of you seen that in yourselves?

That said, by being here and actively working on our issues, we're making a conscious choice to have healthier relationships down the road. 

[cartman1]

Even though this is a pretty serious thread, I'm loving the SP references!

I think we've all been conditioned to shelve our needs, which does make having healthy relationships difficult. We grew up with behavior that set the tone for dysfunctional relationships down the road, and it takes a lot of work, courage, and growing pains to move towards healthy relationships. I could write a book about the unhealthy relationships I chose to enter before meeting DH, and when I look back, I made some unhealthy choices because I was trying to find love and affection from anywhere I could find it... .  because I wasn't getting it from my parents. Have any of you seen that in yourselves?

That said, by being here and actively working on our issues, we're making a conscious choice to have healthier relationships down the road. 

Yes, I see it all the way along my life. I got into relationships and things go down hill. My first was a girl who I had no real physical attraction to. I just knew she needed me and I needed someone but soon after I felt bad on her so I split up with her. Then I met a Girl about 6 months later. We went quite deep, quite fast and then I got sent away on tour and I was on a ship and everyday for three months she was all I could think of and I ended up self harming. I got discharged from military service for this. I spent the last 3 months as an out patient in a psychiatric hospital then got my papers and went home to the love of my life, we moved in together and then the arguments started and it went downhill fast, to the point where we couldn't stand each other so I walked, but I went back and we started recycling for a few hours, we slept together then I got dressed and left. Within a month I met my Wife and the dance started again. 

[cartman1]

Oh when I wrote the love of my life, I was being ironic. I meant at that point in time, I wish I'd known. I wish I'd met my wife when I met the first girl. I know things would have been different. Me and my wife have fell out in the past but my second relationship was more toxic. It was on a different level.

[doubleAries]

geeky girl, dang it, that's so obvious I didn't even think of it! I've been puzzling for a long time about why I jump to others needs, and they don't reciprocate! I knew I needed to learn to meet my own needs, but couldn't figure out why I couldn't/wouldn't! I also knew growing up in serious dysfunction that very few of my needs were met and that I had to put them aside or "get in trouble". But somehow didn't connect it into the same thread.

But yes, I did connect the concept that I have been desperate for love/affection and trying to get it from people who not only couldn't serve as surrogates, but weren't very capable of giving any at all. Pick up brick. hit self in head. drop brick (on foot). Repeat.

[cartman1]

GeekyGirl, doubleAries,

Thanks for all your input. Your input has given me an idea, I think I should go and see my therapist and tell him about a deep seated fear I've always had that keeps resurfacing in cycles.

I think I should say that my Wifes diagnosis of P.T.S.D. Was probably right, has it give her traits? Obviously. Something else I've learned is maladaptive people gravitate towards others But if I take the blame and shame away and I start hearing what she's told me all along " you've got bad insecurity issues." And google searches like "why does my H say he loves me but acts like he hates me." Then I start seeing a picture building.

Something is telling me that I'm going to have a very productive therapy session if I take my gaze away from her and focus my attention on me and my problem.

What do you guys think?

[GeekyGirl]

Something is telling me that I'm going to have a very productive therapy session if I take my gaze away from her and focus my attention on me and my problem.

I think that would be time well spent. As someone told me once, "The only thing I can control is myself." By talking to your T, you'll work towards healing from the shame and guilt that you've been carrying around.    (and I'm right there with you ) Don't get frustrated if it takes more than a few sessions once you open that door.

[cartman1]

Something is telling me that I'm going to have a very productive therapy session if I take my gaze away from her and focus my attention on me and my problem.

I think that would be time well spent. As someone told me once, "The only thing I can control is myself." By talking to your T, you'll work towards healing from the shame and guilt that you've been carrying around.    (and I'm right there with you ) Don't get frustrated if it takes more than a few sessions once you open that door.

I hear you. See my last session was now 4 weeks ago and I started working through the shame. I was due back last Tuesday but I got a call the night before saying my T's daughter was ill and he would call me soon. I started feeling a bit let down by this. I just wish he would of called or someone to give me a date to go back as I've been doing quite a lot of 'soul searching' and I feel I need to get it off my chest. The problem is if his daughters not well then he can't predict when she will get better. I'm guessing Therapy starts with a journey inwards and then one back out, rebuilding our issues. I'm really looking forward to getting back there and working on me. See I think I've found the point in time that has kept coming back to me as an emotion and I want to discuss it with him.