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VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?" Parental alienation is when a parent allows a child to participate or hear them degrade the other parent. This is not uncommon in divorces and the children often adjust. In severe cases, however, it can be devastating to the child. This video provides a helpful overview.
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Author Topic: What were Your first warning signs  (Read 950 times)
nolisan
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« on: February 06, 2013, 01:12:15 AM »

I am four months out of a 1 year r/s with a "BPD" ... .  no contact one day at a time. I have reflected on the early days and signs that I ignored.

1a. Unloving mother

1b. Childhood sex abuse by uncle or stepdad

2. Complex PTSD (I didn't think to much about this because I have PTSD - in fact it attracted me to her "birds of a feather". cPTSD and BPD have similar manifestations.

3. These facts were shared very early in our dating.

4. A ten day "time out" when I made a small mistake. Wasted a pair of tickets to her favorite play. This was in the first month. (the time outs would be a recurring theme - all via email btw)

What things did you see early on?
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GreenMango
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« Reply #1 on: February 06, 2013, 01:50:41 AM »

The paranoia/persecution stories and frequent changes in attitude towards other "close" people.  One week love them, the next hate them.  I didn't really get that this was part of a larger problem.

Noli-San... .  needless to say I learned a lot from this experience.  It changed a lot of the way I look at a partnership or relationship. 

Has it changed things for you too?
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daintrovert13
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« Reply #2 on: February 06, 2013, 03:11:15 AM »

acting weird on first date.

carving wrist.

compulsive lying.

faking ailments.

alter ego.

obsession with picking face for hours.

punching walls. acting like a baby.

morbid jealousy.


Never overlook signs PD for the sake of stunning beauty and body or idealization.

She still was a very sweet romantic girl though and I grew to love her... but BPD took over and I got dropped.  :'(
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almost789
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« Reply #3 on: February 06, 2013, 04:30:35 AM »

Mine didnt rage outwardly or any of the obvious stuff. My first sign was the irratic behavior. One day he wants constant contact, all day everyday. Hes cheerful happy upbeat... .  ect. The next hes empty cold, distant robotic for no apparent reason, no arguements or disagreement just a complete switch in personality. Then back again to constant contact, happy, upbeat... .  and repeat, repeat, repeat. Another sign was these ridiculous lies. Lying about the silliest things and making up elaborate lies for no reason.

So... .  1. Polarized behavior

        2. Lying
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asher2
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« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2013, 08:58:42 AM »

Since we broke up and been NC, I've been working on myself considerably, trying to get myself as "best" as I can for not only me, but future relationships. This topic is certianly something I've reflected on so as not to make the same mistakes in the future. Some of the warning signs I encountered were:

1) She'd go "missing" on me for a day or two when we first started seeing each other. I initially thought she was playing "hard to get" but I now know that she had other guys she was keeping in her hopper. Although these "missing" episodes did lesson as we dated, they still occured occasionally thoughout our relationship. Why I put up with that, I'll never know. Never again for sure!

2) On our third date, she started crying out-of-the-blue because she told me she wasn't the same religion as me. I told her it wasn't a big deal, it was only our third date. I found it odd that she was so concerned about figuring out religion and how that plays into our relationship on date number three (to the point of massive, prolonged crying). Looking back, her abandoment fears were probably already kicking in.

3) Telling me about inappropriate relationships she had in the past with other men. Affairs with married men, engaged men, other's boyfriends, etc. I remember when I questioned her about why she had these affairs she said she felt bad but, "They are the ones who were involved with other people... .  they are the ones who should feel the worst." Facepalm. Classic example of not understanding or respecting boundaries. Major red flag.

4) Bascially moving in to my place after about two weeeks of dating and talking about marriage and having kids. I didn't realize it at the time, but our relationship moved at a very unhealthy pace. As was the case for most of us, the pace is initally very intoxicating and feels wonderful. I was put on a pedistal unlike anything I have ever expereinced. I've now learned that relationships need to progress and develop over time naturally. Cutting corners in this regard leads to bad news later down the road.

Daintrover13... .  I had to laugh at the "obsession with picking face for hours" that you had on your list. Mine did that to me ALL THE TIME. Again, for life of me, looking back, I don't know why I allowed her to do this. It annoyed the hell out of me, yet I let her do it. Although I'm not sure this is something that is indicitave of BPD behavior, I had to laugh because I could relate!
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trevjim
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« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2013, 09:34:49 AM »

I was oblivious to it at the start, when I first started dating her, she was trying to get her baby back from social services (the child's dad/her ex was abusive to her and the baby) and that was obviously an incredibly stressfull to anyone, let alone a 19 year old girl. so when she showed anything that I would now relate to BPD I would just put it down to the situation ( I guess the stress of it bought out her BPD more)
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KellyO
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« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2013, 09:35:35 AM »

I overlooked myriad  Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) from the first day, but I overlooked two big. First one was him starting sulking for me because I spoke to him when he watched TV and I was on the computer. We had known eachother maybe two weeks. My apartment was very small, so we were next to each other. I did not understand he was punishing me... .  and there was that first sign of control. He made it very clear I have no business to talk to him if he is watching TV. Period. Second was not much after that, and this one was a test I overlooked. One morning I said to him " Hun, if you eat a banana, it would be really nice if you would put the skins in the bin and not leave them on the table". What happened was hours of rage, yelling, name calling, him shaking and walking around like a madman, he threw my apartment key at my face... .  and that was a beginning of my nightmare. I told him if he was so unhappy with me that he has to behave like that, there is the door, he is free to go. It made things  spin to hell so fast I couldn't believe the situation. I knew I should leave him right away, I'm not THAT stupid. But I did not want to, because I was so much in love, and I believed an adult man can learn to handle himself. Little did I know  Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)
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bpdoe

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« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2013, 09:51:11 AM »

I did not understand he was punishing me... .  and there was that first sign of control. He made it very clear I have no business to talk to him if he is watching TV. Period.

I got the not talking while she was watching TV one. On the opposite side, if I was watching TV and she wanted to talk to me, I'd better listen to her or rage on.

Of course, I allowed it to keep the peace thinking I was doing the right thing... .  







oops.
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coffee shop
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« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2013, 10:15:00 AM »

I didn't notice at first but can see it now, he had nothing good to say about anyone, he had old friends & family we would go see, but first he would tell me all these negative things about them. It was like he had to make sure I didn't want to trust them or get close to them. Soon he was telling me all kinds of things about my friends and family.

Several months after we were dating seriously, my mother became ill and was set up with hospice. During this time he was very distant, when I would ask him about this he would say that he was allowing me to have undistracted time with my Mom. I thought it was strange that he didn't give me any personal support but he convinced me that how he was handling it was the best for me. Now I realize he had no empathy and so he wasn't thinking of my feelings at all. After the memorial service he again put down all of my family that he had not met before and convinced me that they really didn't care for my Mom because they weren't there before she died, even though that is how he was at the same time. But of course the way he behaved was the right way and even though others did the same thing, they were wrong.

I can see a lot of these patterns developed even in the first few months of our relationship. By the end of the 6 year marriage. After we were married he imed. started showing me how pathetic I was and how important everything he did was and how insignificant what I did was. later he would tell me how I would rage every 3 months and that I told him that I had mental problems and a drinking problem, even though I didn't do anything of these things. If I denied this he would start raging at me and this would last for hours. After a while I learned he was telling others that I had all the problems that really he had.
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paul16
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« Reply #9 on: February 06, 2013, 10:43:13 AM »

Ran into what used to be her BFF at a theater. She made up some story about why they weren't speaking (later found out that it was far from the truth) and wouldn't even go up to her and say hi.

Her substance abuse and new found promiscuity were red flags but I didn't attribute that to BPD until later. She also had numerous financial and legal problems. They were all caused by somebody else (ex's mostly).
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Sunshinegirl3275

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« Reply #10 on: February 06, 2013, 10:46:00 AM »

One of my biggest regrets is that I kept recycling and overlooking the red flags. I guess you live and learn.

Here's my list:

1. When we first met he had numerous women in his life that he spoke to often. I felt like he idealized me to my face and painted me black to these women (and later I found out he told one of them intimate details that completely crushed me for a while)

2. He often said every other woman in his life abandoned him and I was his soul mate. This is a HUGE red flag.

3.Not one of my friends liked him and I lost friends because of him.

4. He turned everything around - made me feel like I was the jealous one and often times early in the relationship I felt like I was going crazy. He was soo good at blaming me and making me feel guilty. This is called gaslighting.

5. The relationship moved at warp speed. He couldn't get enough of me and wanted me 24/7.

6. He made bad decisions and blamed everyone else.

7. He would act like a two year old when he didn't get his way.
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coffee shop
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« Reply #11 on: February 06, 2013, 11:00:08 AM »

Sunshine, I just had to laugh when I read the last on your list. My ex even had the toddler pout down, he crossed his arms over his chest and stuck out his lower lip! I had forgot then one. LOL!
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trouble11
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« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2013, 11:09:33 AM »

I never had a chance to see them as we started as long distance while he was supposedly in the divorce process.  We had gone to high school together and dated briefly back then.  The only clue I might have gotten would have been from the amount of time we spent on the phone.  I missed that one because after all ... .  we didn't get to see each other so longer than normal phone calls seemed normal under the circumstances.   His dad left when he was 4 and had just had open heart surgery to repair a whole in his heart.  Now that I think of it ... .  pretty sure that surgery was unsuccessful.     He was also sexually assaulted by an older neighbor as a child.  I got that these things could screw someone up, but had no clue about BPD.  I thought PTSD at worst. HA   By the time the weirdness started ... .  1.5 years later, I had torn my world apart and moved back to my home town.  Which isn't really home anymore.  I think if I had lived here I would have maybe seen more, but long distance they can keep it up forever.
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Dave44
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« Reply #13 on: February 06, 2013, 12:34:01 PM »

How stupid is this post gonna make me look?

- Brought her oldest daughter on our first date.

- 2 kids from 2 different men and an abortion from a 3rd

- 37 years old with not a thing to show for herself. Even after filing for bankruptcy 2 years                  prior for being over $72,000 in debt.

- Having me over at her house with her kids after our 3rd date in as many days.

- Openly admiting on our first date she hadn't had a relationship last longer than 3 months in the past 10 years.

- Her oldest daughter (8) telling her friends at school that she was gonna have a new dad... .  2 weeks into dating her mom.

- All previous bf's were all "losers".

- A month and a half after dating was my birthday and she got me a necklace with a pendant on it and on the back she had her name, her 2 kids and mine engraved on it!

- Never had a stable career of any sort.

And those are just a few... .  did I mention she was really hot?
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trevjim
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« Reply #14 on: February 06, 2013, 12:41:37 PM »

-Before we even dated, she kissed me whilst in a R/S (we worked together) told me she wants a baby but her BF doesnt, a few months later she is pregnant (I found out after we broke up she stopped taking the pill and didnt tell him)

-Had child at the time in foster care (has him back now) due to the dad beating her through out theyr R/S and put the child in hospital. (unsure how much was made up/exagerrated by her)

-Hadnt spoken to her real dad and step mum in many years, all i heard was bad things about them (when i finaly met them, they are lovely and have done alot for her even though she is ungrateful)

-Told me on our first date we would be having sex in no time (that hooked me in!)

- After a couple of dates told me she felt like she was in a dream and didnt think she would find love again until dating me

-Used to have tantrums

-Bad mouthed her friends and family to me, even though they did and had done so much for her.

-Threatened suicide a few times because of the social services/court situation.

At first I put this down to her horrible situation with her child, now im not so sure

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trouble11
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« Reply #15 on: February 06, 2013, 12:59:48 PM »

Hey Dave ... .  Isn't there a song about marrying an ugly girl? 

Chorus: If you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, Never make a pretty woman your wife. So from my personal point of view, Get an ugly girl to marry you.

A pretty woman makes her husband look small, And very often causes his downfall. As soon as he marries her, then she starts, To do the things that will break his heart.

But if you make an ugly woman your wife, You'll be happy for the rest of your life. An ugly woman cooks meals all the time, She'll always give you peace of mind.

HARRY BELAFONTE - GET AN UGLY GIRL TO MARRY YOU

PS  You're not stupid ... .  well ... .  no stupider than me.  Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)
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trevjim
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« Reply #16 on: February 06, 2013, 01:03:43 PM »

Hey Dave ... .  Isn't there a song about marrying an ugly girl? 

Chorus: If you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, Never make a pretty woman your wife. So from my personal point of view, Get an ugly girl to marry you.

A pretty woman makes her husband look small, And very often causes his downfall. As soon as he marries her, then she starts, To do the things that will break his heart.

But if you make an ugly woman your wife, You'll be happy for the rest of your life. An ugly woman cooks meals all the time, She'll always give you peace of mind.

HARRY BELAFONTE - GET AN UGLY GIRL TO MARRY YOU

PS  You're not stupid ... .  well ... .  no stupider than me.  Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)

Without being sexist, their is probably some truth in that, the thought that my ex could of got anyone at the click of her fingers, and she did on some occasions, really put alot of stress on me
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trouble11
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« Reply #17 on: February 06, 2013, 01:23:50 PM »

I get that trev ... .  the funny thing is my exBPDfb isn't particularly good looking.  We had dating in high school and that added to the connection.  He does great at finding somewhat attractive replacements because he is a cop.  Guess the uniform covers up a WHOLE LOT of ugly.   
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stevenq

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« Reply #18 on: February 06, 2013, 02:43:04 PM »

extreme jealousy/possesiveness

talked about moving in after 2months

tried to get me to change my hairstyle, the way i dress, what to eat

being very clingy

told me she liked "the attention" i gave her

always paranoid that i would leave her
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daintrovert13
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« Reply #19 on: February 06, 2013, 05:31:33 PM »

extreme jealousy/possesiveness

talked about moving in after 2months

tried to get me to change my hairstyle, the way i dress, what to eat

being very clingy

told me she liked "the attention" i gave her

always paranoid that i would leave her

Try moving in WITHOUT talking about it.

She just brought more and more items in each time she came to visit me. *shakin' my head*
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SarahinMA
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« Reply #20 on: February 06, 2013, 05:40:23 PM »

-Extreme jealousy

-Extreme road rage

-Self-deprication

-Would talk crap about EVERYONE (and meanly)- why did I ignore this?

-Mama's Boy- his mother called every day, sometimes multiple times a day

-Would mention painful memories from his past and when I would probe him about these, he would close up (after a year of dating)

-Refused to go to the doctor, yet complained often about ailments

-Held major grudges

-Extreme stoicism- loved that people couldn't read him even when he was EXTREMELY angry

-Would never comfort me when I was upset- he would just close up and withdraw- silent treatment, yet would also cry with me. 

-He would get drunk and pick fights with me and then withdraw

-Wanted to spend 24-7 with me, yet if I ever expressed wanting to go out with girlfriends, he would mope and get very passive aggressive

I think I could go on... .  
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refuge
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« Reply #21 on: February 06, 2013, 05:49:10 PM »

me:

thinking to myself : "hey... wait a minute... .  somethings not right here, she's way to hot for it to be this easy"

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Peterpan
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« Reply #22 on: February 06, 2013, 07:02:35 PM »

same as above,pursued me for months, constant obsessive texting all through the day for two or three days,then nothing,completely vanishing for two days... .  then back again obsessively.

Started out with "would really like to get to know you even more" yet on the first meeting " hell I could leave her for you, you are absolutely stunning, perfect" (he stood back while I paid for the coffee on the first time we met out )

one of the things which I personally found odd was that he was 'unhappy' with his nagging wife, would refer to her as 'she or her'... .  then I would get texts explaining all about -------- (wifes name),been out with  ----------

sat eating right now with -----------     which hurt, just didn't feel right.

Was to the minute with texting times, same times every day for months, then it changed abruptly, very obviously and clearly around a different working pattern than mine.

Then the projection,"would love to see more of you, but YOU are always so busy",,nope, not me, I was neglecting other things to see him.

There were so many that I almost immediately knew he had something wrong with him, but every time I brought his behaviour up, I would be told it was because he was really insecure (due to being hurt so badly in the past)

I never thought he was a self harmer at all, but he had scars, which, when I asked where from,his explanation just didn't  add up, I knew he was lying about it, but dropped it thinking he was embarassed.

When I read these now, I wonder how I didn't act on my hunches.



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nycman

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« Reply #23 on: February 06, 2013, 07:04:21 PM »

I met my ex girlfriend with BPD on an adult hookup site. I answered her ad for NSA oral sex and she replied almost immediately.  She was much younger than me and physically beautiful.  She kissed me on the first date, we had sex on the next and every one thereafter.  Her few friends were all guys, and none of the relationships seemed deep or long in duration. She told me immediately that she was engaged twice, but that she was always the one to end her relationships because of personal flaws in her boyfriends.  She wanted to move fast with me... move in, talk about marriage and kids.  Also, she had terrible fits - uncontrollable rage if I was a few minutes late, forgot to pick something up at the store, help her with her coat after a meal in a restaurant, and was always having snits with cab drivers, restaurant workers, hotel staff.  To her, I was selfish, cheap, had no empathy, etc.  And six months when I tried to detach, I was reduced to lowest form of human on earth, and then a few minutes later she was hugging me and begging me to give it another chance.  I never had anyone in my life talk to me/email me the way she did. We would have total knock down brawls, and then it would be all lovey dovey a few minutes later. She was at time my worst enemy, and at other the love of my life.  Once I caught her trying to sleep with an ex boyfriend.  I also found her having gone back on the adult hookup site, and saw that she had feedback on in person meetings from 19 other guys!  She denied all of this, changing her story several times, saying she went on the site to see if I was on there, that she was just curious for some inexpiable reason, etc.  I asked her to let me log in to her account and she sent me another account that she clearly threw together in the prior few minutes.  And when I called bull ___, she said the original account was broken and not accessible.  After a week of argument on it, she gave me the credentials, I went on to her account, and saw that all the messages were deleted, that she tweaked the selection criteria and even included on it a picture that I took of her - my favorite no less!  She was very secretive with her iPhone, often getting texts and acting suspicious.  She dressed in over the top provocative dresses and heels, and lingerie in the bedroom, often not wearing panties. She wanted sex in unisex bathrooms in NYC restaurants and my office.  In the end, when I did a hard clean break, she went to my NYC apartment (when I was away) wrote several suicide notes, wrote on my walls with a sharpie, cut her wrists, lost half her blood but survived.  I had to have a crime scene clean up firm get rid of all the blood that was all over the apartment - my tub, my bed, etc.  She wanted me to find her dead in my apartment.  And then, after she got out of the hospital she wrote a six page letter to my boss making all kinds of claims about unethical behavior on my part, including affairs with subordinates.  Fortunately, there was nothing true and the lawyers and HR dismissed it after a week long investigation.  This was a month ago.

All of this is classic.  But she showed other signs that are not typical. She was strangely independent and self confident, but maybe this was a facade.  She was very smart and analytical, but not a personal failure.  Yes she had money problems, but did not drink or use drugs, only smoked cigarettes.  She had trouble verbalizing affection for me, but was physically very sexual and satisfying.  I liken her to the perfect physical bed mate, but this faded over time.  She talked a big game, but over time did not seem as interested in bed and the frequency of sex subsided.

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DRodman

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« Reply #24 on: February 06, 2013, 07:07:52 PM »

- Saying she had been a cutter in the past, but hadn't done it in a while.

- Saying she used to be bulimic, but still saw her throwing up all the time

- All her ex's had treated her so poorly and she was the victim (never a mutual break up)

- Wouldn't eat breakfast, but would drink excessive coffees, energy drinks, and also take diet pills.

- Would flat out say "I'm not damaged goods" while laying around.

- Wanted to have sex w/o condoms, which I never gave into (she wasn't on the pill, either, even though she said she was going to)

- Wanting a timeline on when we were to get married (complete with a countdown calendar on her computer) within the first two months of dating

- Her buying rings with our initials on it and wearing it around (wasn't aware she did this until I randomly saw the rings being worn)

- Still being Facebook friends with ex's who had abused her and still texting them (wonder if the abuse even happened)

- Couldn't sleep during normal hours, or at all, and would get mad if I was asleep at 3 AM on a Wednesday when she called/texted and didn't answer.

- Showing me a wedding site that she still used from her ex bf's plans to get married

All in all, blinders were on during my time with her... .  my bad, and luckily I woke up and broke it off.  Biggest bullet I ever dodged!

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Dave44
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« Reply #25 on: February 06, 2013, 09:36:22 PM »

me:

thinking to myself : "hey... wait a minute... .  somethings not right here, she's way to hot for it to be this easy"

Omg... .  this is it summed up in one simple phrase! Couldn't have said it any better myself!
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nardila

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« Reply #26 on: February 06, 2013, 10:07:14 PM »

1. moved too fast, was talking about moving in early early in the relationship

2. overly jealous, the CIA wished she worked for them, told me she was jealous with her ex husband

3. Change her mind often

4. Kept making her ex husband like he was a monster even though it didnt seem to be like that

5. Early on talked about knowing how to play games of being interested and not being interested (this was big)

6. Her children were out of control

7. was needy from the very beginning, needy of time, attention, love

I guess i was needing to feel close to someone like that too, and she knew how to be close because of her needy actions, but then the manipulation, and criticism, which were tolerable after the sex.

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« Reply #27 on: February 07, 2013, 12:19:55 AM »

No real friends - didn't talk about anyone longer than a few months ago. Seemed to have no real history

Proudly talked about being wild in his youth to the point that his parents took him to see a specialist

Regrets / whimsy about his ex. Something happened there, but would never go into detail. But wanted them back.

Insensitive... .  always talking about someone else who is amazing. Who he has a crush on. Never complimented me.

No accountability. Just couldn't own the slightest bit of a problem or blame. All on me or someone else

Moody. Different person one day to the next

Addicted to TV... .  had to be the first to watch a whole season of 30 Rock... .  everything. Not a single show he wasn't across

Couldn't be told. Knew everything about everything. Any contribution by me met with eye rolls and 'I know'

Promiscuous

Tight... .  wouldn't pay for anything.

Took other people's successes as a personal slight. He should have got this / that and not them

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Alvino
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« Reply #28 on: February 07, 2013, 10:47:12 AM »

1. Everything happening too fast, emotional rollercoaster (I thought this was an indication of "true love" at the time... .   

2. No real friends, one friend that was alternately the best person in the world or devil incarnate.

3. Temper tantrums that would make a 5-year-old blush.

4. Guilt-tripping me for real or perceived offenses. First I thought "cute". Totally underestimated how much that constant barrage shifted my compass in the long run.

5. Making me responsible for her happiness.

6. Picking fights for no good reason.

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HardTruth
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« Reply #29 on: February 07, 2013, 06:02:48 PM »

-Suicide attempt 11 months before we met on his bday because his exwife had blown him off on the bday before.

-Talking about how his exwife was in AA, and how he wished she could have just been honest about her drinking... .  as I noticed he drank almost every day that we hung out.

-Making up stories - "I just love the taste of scotch, I don't drink it for the alcohol content."  Uh huh... .  

-Started dating right after his divorce, which he didn't want.  A couple months after the divorce, met a woman, invited her to move in a month after dating.  When she moved in a month later, he already realized they weren't a match... .  and kicked her back out a couple months later.

-Triangulation (read definition) - telling me how his exwife didn't like him having porn (he called it "art" on his computer and going to strip clubs.  How his previous exwife and he used to joke about how he had a crush on her best friend, who was a pretty blond... .  Telling me he had a "date" with a woman in his divorce group (we were monogamous), but that it wasn't really a date... .  

-Turning off and on emotionally in the mornings when we woke up together - sometimes wanting to be close, other times can't wait to jump out of bed... .  
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« Reply #30 on: February 07, 2013, 09:07:36 PM »

me:

thinking to myself : "hey... wait a minute... .  somethings not right here, she's way to hot for it to be this easy"

Yessssss!
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« Reply #31 on: February 09, 2013, 11:05:09 PM »

-He emailed me after our first blind date and I said I wasn't interested and he emailed me back "breaking up" with me and then I emailed wishing him well, and then he emailed me back saying he wants to meet me again

-He moved very fast, said "i love you" after 1 month of dating.  He discussed marriage and house buying after that and moved in after 2 months, and proposed after 2 months of dating

-Went into tantrums when we couldn't make appointments together like driving to make an appointment at the airport and we missed it and he went absoulutely raging blaming me in the car

-Raged at me when I made comments I was having doubts about our marriage

-He made insults about other people

-He would say I love you every 10 mins.

-He would hug me like a mother and say I was ok and I love you baby

-was an absolute momma's boy.  I went to visit his parents and he had a weird almost incestuous relationship with his mother.  His mother talked to him like he was still a baby and doted after him.  His only friends were his parents

-His only relationship was with a woman in his mid 20s and then with me.  He was 40 when he dated me.  He didn't date for 15 years.  He was a virgin at 40 when he met me

-Said he was a gaming addict before he met me and he still games

-Every time I wanted to hang with other friends, he made a comment for me to stay with him

-We went on a group hike and he followed me a step behind me, like an attached baby

-Said he was too good to date other women before me.  Other women weren't good enough for him

-Random road rage blaming the other drivers

-He would coddle me comb my hair and give me foot rubs

-was with me 24/7, very needy

-I called the police on him when he was raging and blaming me in the car and we were heading home

-When he proposed to me he rented an expensive hotel room to surprise me and then when he wanted to surprise me by asking me out that night, I said I didn't want to go out that evening, and he had a rage blowup saying "you ALWAYS mess things up... .  !"

This was only in the first 6 months I was with him.  The next 2.5 years later, it got worse, believe me.
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sadderbutwiser

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« Reply #32 on: February 10, 2013, 05:07:19 AM »

Here were my warning signs:

Told me of his 2 failed marriages, and failed long term relationship in great detail on our first date - demonising them with himself as victim.

Despite being an accountant - was in debt, lived in a rental that was frankly a filthy hovel, spent recklessly, had cashed in his pension, spent £130K of his £150K divorce settlement in one year with nothing material to show for it.

Drank heavily and daily - and lied about it to me.

Expected to move in with me - with his 2 youngest sons (4 and 6 yrs) for whom he had care for one night a week and 3 weekends - with no suggestion of what he would contribute.

Had only 2 "friends" - who were not what I would term friends

Older sons in their 20's - one hadn t talked to him for years - one only saw him when he wanted money.

Jealous- said he knew "every man at work "was waiting to go out with me - and jealous of my good relationship with my ex husband - when we were together with our kids on their birthdays etc.

Lies - boasting.

Couldn't be alone  - constantly phoning and texting me while I was at work, and in the evenings when I did not see him.

Extravagant gifts

Rages - getting worse in intensity over imagined neglect or slights

Had an over religious, critical and neglecting mother

Sulked, guilted,  criticised

Wated to be included on my nights out with my women friends - jealous of them
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« Reply #33 on: February 10, 2013, 05:16:24 AM »

(contd)

He declared his "feelings" on our 3 rd dats and bought me "I   you" charms for my silver bracelet - which made me uneasy

Told me also on 3rd date that his sister "was glad I had a good job and my own home".

Quickly dropped all his hobbies and arrangements to become totally involved in my life, with my friends, and with my family - took on a different identity.

I was surprised to find what common interests we had (later realised about"mirroring"

Said things - but actions did not match up (e.g. what I admired about him was that he said his time with his kids came first - but later on - he would ditch them if he thought he was missing out on something I was doing with my own family - even trying to take them back early on Fathers Day so he could come to my family celebration.

Finally - met someone on a blind date 4 weeks after we broke up - moved in with her 8 weeks later.
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« Reply #34 on: February 10, 2013, 10:02:23 AM »

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) didn't show up at an event we planned to attend together -- never acknowledged much less apologized

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) alternated between bitter victimhood and self-recrimination

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) history of dubious, abusive, and/or long distance relationships

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) called me several times per day, every day

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) no job, living off of retirement savings unsustainably

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) moved in with me a few months after we began dating, without discussion

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) obsessed about events that had occurred years (>5) before

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) too often, when I started to share something about myself, she immediately changed the subject to her

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) texted an xbf ("We're just friends" when we were in bed together

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) lots of (real) physical ailments requiring time consuming

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) reputation (in various organizations in which she participated) for being unreliable

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) told me several times that she had refused wealthy men who offered to support her

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) sexually flirtatious; a lot of men seemed to have crushes on her

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) at her therapist's request, she and the therapist took art classes together

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) wouldn't acknowledge to certain of her male friends that she and I were dating  ("We don't discuss our romantic activities"

Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) I had brief moments of clarity where I could see that she wasn't capable of a truly reciprocal emotionally committed intimate relationship


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struggli
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« Reply #35 on: February 10, 2013, 12:19:49 PM »

-Gave me her number and after a lot of texting, I asked her out and she told me she had a boyfriend, but said we could be friends.  I said no because I was sexually attracted to her.

-Two weeks later, she calls me up.  I assume she is single now because of our previous conversation.  We go on a date.  She tells me she was raped within about 30 minutes.  It's slightly shocking, but I take it lightly.  

-After date, we go to my place and have sex.  :)on't get me wrong, I wanted to.

-We have sex everyday for about 4 or 5 days after first date.  She tells me then "I just broke up with ex."  Ummm, so she was having sex with me all that time and she was still technically in a relationship.

-She tells me she loves me in about a couple weeks (which isn't a red flag to me because I felt the same way about her), however a couple weeks later tells me "she's not good at love."  Silly me, I don't give that statement as much attention I should've. I just tell her she seems to be doing fine to me.

-I see her putting candy in her boss' mouth

-I meet her male friend (her first boyfriend) and they flirt:  he says "I know you want me", they giggle a lot, he slaps her but when she's walking in front of him, they play with each others hair... .   It's all very childlike, and probably harmless, but still pisses me off.  I tell her afterward that the whole thing was very uncomfortable for me.  She says "If you want me to give up my friends for you I will"  What do I say to this?  Yes, give up your friends?

-After three months together, I am going to be leaving town to see my family.  I had told her about it and invited her well in advance.  She said she would go.  At the last minute, she said she could not go because of having accepted a new job just a few days before.  Seems reasonable to me, so I'm bummed but I understand.  The day before I am to leave, she calls me by her ex's name, and I catch her texting him that she misses him.  Our first fight begins.  She then begs me not to leave and tells me she doesn't know how to be alone.  Things were never the same after I left that following day.  

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« Reply #36 on: February 10, 2013, 12:50:29 PM »

I didn't know anything about BPD at the time but on the first date I thought she was just plain crazy and depressed.

Initially I was not attracted to her because she was so crazy even though she was very hot.

But there was something 'special' about her which caused me to give her another chance. She seemed 'nice.'

On 'date' 3 there was this sudden super mutual attraction like you might see in movies or novels like a lightening bolt. Seemed to come out of nowhere.

Well... .  the warning signs were immediate and continue to this day (2 years on the 19th). There are too many to list... .  many are incredible and unbelievable... .  some downright hilarious... .  but I don't want to relive them.

The bottom line is it did not matter what the warning signs were/are.

The only thing that matters now is whether or not I will be able to resist the next recycle attempt.
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« Reply #37 on: February 10, 2013, 01:02:51 PM »

I feel embarrassed to write mine because I look at them and cringe. Why oh why was I so stupid to get sucked in to this, and not run for the hills? This r/s has really exposed my inherent lack of self-worth. Ok... .  

• Very first time I met her... she came along to a sports day out. I was her mate's cousin. She got drunk, she put her hand down my top and inside my bra in public, and kept trying to kiss me, licking my neck and ear, and was groping me. Later on I was sleeping and she got on top of me and started to kiss me again, pulled down my top and started kissing my breasts until I pushed her off. I'd never met her, and I was 'straight'. Text me an apology for 'bad behaviour' a day later.

• Second time I met her put her hand up my skirt, again in public.

• Was terrified to come out (longest r/s was with ex-boyfriend of 3 years, every other girl has been a hook-up), so at 28 is still deeply closeted. Why did I think she would come out for me?

• Her type is 'straight'... .  short-term, no future. She told me she only liked straight girls, didn't find lesbians attractive.

• Ignored my cousin who told me she was bad news. Told her outright to stay away from me on my ex's birthday. She had no clue we were already "in love" at this point, but said to stay away from me. My ex had made it clear she fancied me, but that was all she knew. My cousin had known her for 8 years... I'd met her twice before we started dating.

• We had sex on our first date, even though I told her I was nervous/wanted to take it slowly because I'd never been with another girl.

• Told me she was "completely in love" with me after 3 weeks, but wanted to tell me sooner (she didn't even know me)

• Told me she was always meant to be unhappy and alone

• Told me she wasn't good at relationships and to get out whilst I still could, and she didn't want that life for me.

• Told me she felt wrong, abnormal and weird, and that she wasn't right for being gay.

• Displayed signs of shame during sex (covering face with pillow)

• Always sick... .  bad stomach/headache. Constantly taking something for them.

• Had no real friends. Always cried about being alone.

• Everyone had treated her badly... .  she was the victim of these r/s's that had hurt her deeply when they'd ended. These girls had broken her heart, used her, made a fool of her.

• Wanted me to move in with her after 5 weeks

• Talked about marriage after 8 weeks, it was a case of when she asked me to marry her.

• Told me she often thought about killing herself, but would never do it because of her mum.

• Told me how you felt when you died was how you felt forever - in relation to suicide, doing it when you felt happy.

• Picked fights with me all the time, especially if we were lying in bed after sex. I would get up to leave and she would have this terrified look on her face, and would be frantic for me not to leave and grab hold of me and pull me back, "Please don't leave! If you leave you'll never come back".

• Drank wine every night and took painkillers to sleep. Had night shakes/terrors. She would always suddenly jerk when she was about to drop off to sleep and wake herself up.

• Had slept with ten times as many people as I had.

• Invited the 'evil' ex she 'hated' to her birthday party and bought said ex a birthday gift and flirted with her all night in front of me and everyone.

• Extreme jealousy if I even looked at anyone else.

• Always reading my text messages.  

• Had a photo of an ex fling and her on her fridge for the duration of our r/s, and one framed stuffed in her wardrobe. Lied and gave another name when I first asked who that was in the photo.

• Put up a very inappropriate birthday card in her flat from the aforementioned ex fling, saying how turned on she was getting at the thought of my ex.

• Was dating a lesbian when we got together - I didn't check they were officially over, should have, I just assumed they were. This was a girl that my ex was set up with the night she first met me (and more or less sexually assaulted me!).

------- all of the above within 2 months of dating.

I've come to realise, that these sorts of feelings, whilst shocking to most, weren't alien to me. Most people would have seen a girl with major emotional issues and run the other way. I, on the other hand, recognised this, and was familiar with this, so jumped straight in. Our r/s only took hold because I was emotionally unhealthy too. Clearly I was to stay in this relationship. These red flags came after two months, and things only got worse... .  the lying, the constant contact with exes, the increasing emotional fragility and hypersensitivity. At one point I thought she was autistic because she couldn't read me, everything was very literal. Then the whole mothering came in, it became clear to me that she wanted me to re-parent her, to show her the unconditional love she never had.

She's got work to do, and so do I. Why did I settle for that? Why didn't I think I deserved more? This is why these r/s show us what our issues are. Maybe without this hellish experience I would never have seen my issues. Thank goodness she did dump me. I can work on me and have the chance at a truly reciprocal and healthy r/s.
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bb12
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« Reply #38 on: February 10, 2013, 04:10:55 PM »

She's got work to do, and so do I. Why did I settle for that? Why didn't I think I deserved more? This is why these r/s show us what our issues are. Maybe without this hellish experience I would never have seen my issues. Thank goodness she did dump me. I can work on me and have the chance at a truly reciprocal and healthy r/s.

Yep - that is the entire point of this experiece. To learn.

It is the slap in the face that wakes us up to feeling for the first time. We go from not knowing ourselves at all, to knowing ourselves backwards. An amazing reward for the intense pain... .  if we do the work and really seek to understand what happened

Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

bb12
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GreenMango
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« Reply #39 on: February 10, 2013, 04:34:30 PM »

It's really easy to talk about the red flags.  Another question to ask ourselves is why you stayed?
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TheDude
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« Reply #40 on: February 10, 2013, 04:36:24 PM »

It's really easy to talk about the red flags.  Another question to ask ourselves is why you stayed?

And another would be... .  why did I keep going back?
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« Reply #41 on: February 10, 2013, 04:42:19 PM »

Also an excellent question... .  Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

When I looked at that I had some really ugly feelings come up... .  that took awhile to work through. Smiling (click to insert in post)
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dharmagems
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« Reply #42 on: February 10, 2013, 06:21:57 PM »



And another would be... .  why did I keep going back?[/quote]
I am still healing from this whole experience in undertanding why I kept coming back... .  I believe all the attention he gave me was because I never experienced the loving treatment before.  I came from a domestically abusive upbringing and he was the first to care for me like a mother.  Give me bear hugs, say I love you, you're ok, give me foot rubs and body rubs, and open the door for me, give me flowers.  I have never gotten that before.  That's why I kept coming back.  BUT---there's the bigger understanding and healing, and ultimately I have to leave, and that is a blessing to me, and I am so proud that I have mustered the strength to get out.

Even it's so very gut wrenching to leave, I have to also forgive myself for wanting to stay.

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Seb
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« Reply #43 on: February 10, 2013, 07:21:56 PM »

She's got work to do, and so do I. Why did I settle for that? Why didn't I think I deserved more? This is why these r/s show us what our issues are. Maybe without this hellish experience I would never have seen my issues. Thank goodness she did dump me. I can work on me and have the chance at a truly reciprocal and healthy r/s.

Yep - that is the entire point of this experiece. To learn.

It is the slap in the face that wakes us up to feeling for the first time. We go from not knowing ourselves at all, to knowing ourselves backwards. An amazing reward for the intense pain... .  if we do the work and really seek to understand what happened

Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

bb12

Exactly! Very well put. I am getting to know myself through all this, and in some bizarre way it feels like my life was leading up to this car crash of a r/s, in order to wake me up from this semi-existence. I am in the process of becoming emotionally healthy and mature, thanks to the nightmare of this r/s.

It's funny (but not!), I still sometimes catch myself wondering if I was the problem, and it wasn't her at all - she has blamed me for the demise of our r/s, and I'm someone that more than happily takes the blame too. So, its been good to remind myself of all the very unhealthy things she did and said. I think she did a great job gaslighting me! Those red flags aren't normal or healthy behaviours. Good to remember why I'm better off where I am now, even if it still hurts sometimes.  Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #44 on: February 10, 2013, 07:34:37 PM »

Five weeks in to our relationship my stbex told me someone had told her that I approached a woman- an aquaintance. I knew she and her husband. My stbex told me that in that approach I told this woman if her husband ever leaves her I would want to be with her. My stbex became very jealous. I had never said anything of the sort. I found myself defending my actions. And there were no actions to defend. It felt odd. Thought I could just say it didn't happen and that would be enough. 5 years later I've had countless affairs-in her mind. In reality I've never spoken out of turn to any woman as long as i have been with her. I have fought many battles that didn't exist. She told me that I would be fighting non existent problems 5 weeks in. I didn't listen.
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« Reply #45 on: February 10, 2013, 08:55:42 PM »

I too fell for the gaslighting. Man she was good at putting the blame on me so i was always feeling guilty. She constantly remined me how she didnt leave me when i didnt have a car and she had to do all the driving. I always felt obligated. She would tell me "i know a ton of guys who would kill to be in your shoes!" who says that? She was beautiful but very insecure. When i would breakup and she would call me back and tell me "im swallowing my pride and reaching out to u!" "im not perfect" that used to always get me to come back. I guess i thoght "she was seeing the light".
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findingmyselfagain
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« Reply #46 on: February 10, 2013, 09:39:43 PM »

In the first yahoo chat... .  *TWO* divorces at the age of 24 y/o with a 1 y/o from the second husband. Practically had sex on the first date. Looking back I recognize she had very few friends. We spent 4-5 days/nights a week together... .  besides me her "friends" were her co-workers who we hung out with very occasionally. Our communication was apparently pretty horrible. Though I was told constantly how wonderful I was, I was also accused of "tuning her out" and "interupting a lot" early on. I was usually pretty clueless to just how extremely insecure she was. I was constantly having to prove myself. This dynamic certainly reflected some my core wounds and issues, but a lot of it was pure healthy relationship ignorance. I would have put on the brakes much sooner with the knowledge I have now.
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faithfull

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« Reply #47 on: February 10, 2013, 10:22:15 PM »

1. Totally detached from mom.

2. love/hate dance with dad.

3. could'nt drive.

4. extreme idealization that made me very much uncomfortable.

5. constant lies.

6. So defensive against certain group/race, and idealize some others.

7. Very low self esteem.

8. Sleep problems.

9. OCD.

10. No friends.

11. Share so much of sexual details about her past ltr in early stages.

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bb12
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« Reply #48 on: February 11, 2013, 04:12:17 PM »

It's funny (but not!), I still sometimes catch myself wondering if I was the problem, and it wasn't her at all - she has blamed me for the demise of our r/s, and I'm someone that more than happily takes the blame too. So, its been good to remind myself of all the very unhealthy things she did and said. I think she did a great job gaslighting me! Those red flags aren't normal or healthy behaviours. Good to remember why I'm better off where I am now, even if it still hurts sometimes.  Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

Yeah - I know what you mean. I am so quick to own my part in any problem. Perhaps too quick. I have learned that I had / have extremely low self-esteem and the inability to really feel much at all. I am always intellectualising things and not doing enough examination of my feelings. And not knowing yourself = poor boundary setting. So when a pwBPD crosses the one or two boundaries we have managed to establish for ourselves, it can bring out some extreme behaviour in us. I look back at some of the things I did at the end... .  the neediness, the begging, the extinction bursts, the shouting... .  and I too feel gaslighted and conflicted about my part in the dance. Whether they brought this out of us in reaction to their craziness... .  or whether they are right in accusing us of the things they said we were. Who knows? But in my gut I feel that my behaviour was mostly normal and in direct unconscious reaction to the tricks they were trying. Either way, I forgive myself for them and am overjoyed at the growth I have experienced because of this whole thing.

BB12
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« Reply #49 on: February 11, 2013, 04:31:40 PM »

This deserves to be quoted at least once more:

thinking to myself : "hey... wait a minute... .  somethings not right here, she's way to hot for it to be this easy"

Yep.
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« Reply #50 on: March 10, 2013, 05:55:43 PM »

Our partners attractiveness seems to come a lot on these boards. Many of you have posted in this thread about the glaring red flags, yet stayed. This has much to do with our self esteem and worth than anything else.

A major hook for me was my partners looks/attractiveness - I felt like cinderella and had this amazing looking partner who idealized me. This says more about me than it does about him.

Banking the r/s on looks and attractiveness or the fact they are "hot" means we have a low opinion of our own looks/attractiveness. We feel special, wanted and loved because this "hot" person is with us.

Work on your self worth... .  if we really looked at those red flags we all posted we would detach in a minute - why is it that you are still hooked on this person?
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« Reply #51 on: March 10, 2013, 06:28:33 PM »

You see... .  this is a strange one for me. I wouldn't say that my ex was that "hot".

She would tell me all the time how lucky she was to be with me, how I was out of her league, that she fancied me so much. She made me feel beautiful... and no one had ever really done that (or so well) before.

I guess I loved being idealised, and it was more about how she made me feel attractive, rather than me basing it on her looks. I think as time went on I did find her more and more attractive - she had a killer body. I was intensely attracted to her in some way, but not so much, initially, based on her looks.

My hooks were emotional - here was someone that was madly in love with me, made me feel like I was the most beautiful person in the world... and had problems that I could fix. Silly me.
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« Reply #52 on: March 10, 2013, 06:29:23 PM »

The first red flag: How into me she was and how immediately she fell in love.  Not that it never happens but its usually a sign of instability not a 'soulmate'.  She didn't even know me yet.  

2nd red flag: How much she needed to process 'us' even when we were just friends.  It could never be a discussion and then dealt with.  We had to go over things for hours.  This is not normal in a friendship, its even excessive in most circumstances in a relationship until you've been together a long time and have accumulated a history together.  

3rd red flag:  the way she took things I said and turned them around.  In my defense I suspected she had dyslexia which later turned out to be correct.  My text messages weren't read correctly... she'd seize on one thing out of five I may have said and run with it out of context.  :)yslexia also includes audio processing so often dyslexics don't hear things correctly either.  But I was new to dyslexia the same way I was new to BPD.

4th red flag: at our age she should have some close friends.  We knew people in common but there were no close friends really.  she seemed to have some social anxiety and was kind of reclusive.  And hadn't been in a relationship in a long while because the last one was abusive.  I now don't know what to believe about that.  I didn't see the things most people see... there was no self harm I could discern, no sexual acting out, no substance abuse.  

Now all of the above should have kept me away from sleeping with her.  But I was stupid.  All of the above was somewhat intermittent because we were just friends during this time.  Once the relationship became sexual the facade dropped.  The processing increased dramatically with attacks on my motives and character.  The fear I was using her, the panic about things I could never totally figure out.  And then once I got spooked away and started to back away slowly then came the claws.  The accusations of being inappropriate sexually with a married guy friend of hers (I'm a lesbian).  

Her inappropriate sexual behaviour around me.  Texting me about dominating me and me begging for forgiveness (okay that is hot if you have that dynamic and have agreed to it... but not in this context once everything had blown the hell up between us) calling me and getting off on the phone/one sided phone sex once I was starting to back away from her.  

It took two months from beginning to end for it to explode out of control with the behaviour off the charts and getting worse.  The relationship going sexual was the trigger for all the BPD characteristics to be fully revealed.  

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Clearmind
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« Reply #53 on: March 10, 2013, 06:37:38 PM »

My hooks were emotional - here was someone that was madly in love with me, made me feel like I was the most beautiful person in the world... and had problems that I could fix. Silly me.

Me too – I got those from my ex because they were things, for many reasons I could not provide myself. A healthy person does not rely on a disordered person to fill a void.

Definitely a great point you made that we all need to explore more.

Thanks Seb for sharing.

The first red flag: How into me she was and how immediately she fell in love.  Not that it never happens but its usually a sign of instability not a 'soulmate'.  She didn't even know me yet. 

Bingo! Syz you are right – I never knew my ex and he never truly knew me.

The start of a healthy r/s we inquire, take our time to get to know one another.

Not that it never happens but its usually a sign of instability not a 'soulmate'.  She didn't even know me yet. 

I don’t believe there is any such thing as a soul mate – we are all independent people with independent thought – the idea of a soul mate = enmeshed/co-depedent r/s to me now.

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« Reply #54 on: March 10, 2013, 07:06:05 PM »

Bingo! Syz you are right – I never knew my ex and he never truly knew me.

The start of a healthy r/s we inquire, take our time to get to know one another.

Absolutely! This is exactly what I was saying to a friend the other day too... .  

My ex and I had met twice before we started dating. We slept together on the first date and within 3 weeks she was "completely in love" with me and had apparently wanted to tell me after 2 weeks.

I should have stepped of the ride to actually ask myself how this was possible, as she didn't know me after 2/3 weeks. I guess I was enjoying the idealisation far too much.
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« Reply #55 on: March 10, 2013, 07:23:48 PM »

It all seemed to be about chemistry, and conditioning that very little was actually about us as a couple.

When relating together on regular terms, without the dazzle of chemistry and magical thinking, I actually realized I didn't like him. Yet I persevered - against my better judgement.

Self trust is an important tool - for many reasons I chose to ignore my gut.
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« Reply #56 on: March 10, 2013, 07:32:50 PM »

It all seemed to be about chemistry, and conditioning that very little was actually about us as a couple.

When relating together on regular terms, without the dazzle of chemistry and magical thinking, I actually realized I didn't like him. Yet I persevered - against my better judgement.

Self trust is an important tool - for many reasons I chose to ignore my gut.

Yep, very true. I was 'straight' and here was this girl that was intensely attracted to me, and me to her. I didn't understand the why's or the how's but our chemistry was unlike anything I'd experienced before. I too ignored my better judgement and persevered. I think it all boiled down to me not ever thinking I'd find anyone that loved me like she did. I'd waited 29 years after all and I didn't want to lose that.

I was certainly guilty of projecting 'good' on to my exgf. I gave her qualities I desperately wanted her to have, but ones she simply didn't possess. I knew she didn't have the moral backbone and strength of character that I did, but I did a great job of ignoring my inner voice and forging ahead, moulding her in to the perfect girlfriend. I told myself how kind and beautiful she was, without much evidence looking back. I made her in to the person I wanted her to be.
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« Reply #57 on: March 10, 2013, 08:08:00 PM »

I was so inexperienced, but also should have never overlooked and accepted the excuses for her first 2 marriages.

I also should have known that it was doomed when she told me that she told her mom and aunt " I was her knight in shining armor"

who the f&*^ could possibly live up to that Ideal... .  Little did I know
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« Reply #58 on: March 10, 2013, 08:45:35 PM »

First  Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) - but I ignored it because I enjoyed it - my uBPD husband put me on a pedestal unlike anything I had ever experienced.  He even told his family that I was perfect.

- wanted to advance the relationship quickly.

- extremely strong sex drive for a man in his 40s.

- seemed to have loose boundaries with ex-wife, who he has two kids with.  Seemed to alternate between high conflict and too friendly.

- family of origin issues - domestic violence between his parents, physical abuse by his dad.  Both parents have passed away but from what he's said about his mom she might have had narcissistic traits.

- drank too much at times, but not all the time.  Drinking too much all the time started after we married.

The major red flags began after we married - and we married too quickly after less than one year of seeing each other.

- shared intimate details about our r/s with others.

- started push/pull, silent treatment, and rages after we married.

- after we separated and I began therapy even though we were still in a "committed" r/s, he tried to contact women on FB and had some type of r/s with a woman at work though he swears it wasn't physical. (yes, I snooped through his phone)

- mood swings.

After we married, I learned more about him, including he slept with a LOT of women, cheated in many r/s, was cheated on in many r/s, was sexually abused as a very young child by a female babysitter.

Sometimes I feel like I married to a guy from a bad country song.
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« Reply #59 on: March 10, 2013, 08:49:15 PM »

I think a good rule of thumb for next time is not to ignore what my gut tells me even if you do not have a sufficient explanation for what is nagging me at the moment.  Its okay to put what I've noticed on the back burner until I  have further information but don't ignore it or let it slide.  

There are ways to bring these things up later without sounding like you are finding fault with their story.  think about it... try to understand what is bothering you and then when out again ask, "hey you know you said something that was interesting to me the other day... you were describing such and such and that it made you feel such and such... can you tell me a little more about that?"  

You sound interested, which you are, and not judgmental which you want to avoid.  

Another good tactic I think is getting people to discuss their ex's and subsequent breakups.  Is the ex to blame for everything?  because if they are you've got a problem.  Or is the ex 90% responsible for everything... still a problem.  I mean I know sometimes people unilaterally destroy relationships.  I had an ex that cheated, we had little strife between us up until that point, which may have been its own warning because she wasn't speaking up.  We had a good sex life.  When I talk about it now I think I understand there was something missing from the relationship... namely her.  That she has views of love that dictate it is supposed to fill us up and fix everything so we feel whole and not alone.  but that is the best I can give someone about that specific relationship since much of it is speculation.  She unilaterally destroyed us.  And I never got any meaningful answers.   But I certainly can't say that about every relationship.  I have made some errors and I have paid for them though I'm not bitter about it.  I had things to learn even if it hurt.  And that is something that comes through when I discuss certain exs you can tell I still care about them, respect them. etc.  

This is something I think worth exploring before we sleep with people.  Sure its more fun to talk about other things our favorite movies, music, our likes in general or things we think are funny.  But it is important to learn how they think about life, their values, what they actually really believe deep down.  Because that is the stuff that is going to sabotage the relationship not the fact that they like music that makes your hair stand on end... though I stipulate in my case as a music fiend it could also be deal breaker    
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« Reply #60 on: March 10, 2013, 09:47:06 PM »

I think a good rule of thumb for next time is not to ignore what my gut tells me even if you do not have a sufficient explanation for what is nagging me at the moment.  Its okay to put what I've noticed on the back burner until I  have further information but don't ignore it or let it slide. 

Syz, awesome! This is what is meant by inquiring.

Inquiring means to ask questions, look at the response, feeling into your own bodily responses to the answers, letting yourself ask questions even if they feel risky. Think ‘curiosity’…

Many of us did not inquire - instead we were dazzled with promises, happy every after, attempts to save and rescue and lots of sex - none of which are a good pre-cursor to inquiry.

If it feels off then it probably is. Ask yourself how many  Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) are one too many - know your limits. Know what you want in a r/s.
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« Reply #61 on: March 10, 2013, 11:21:58 PM »

there were too many  Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post) that i ignored for over a year. i thought they are her traumatic stress from childhood sexual abuse and having emotionally abusive parents. the first time i finally researched her symptoms and came across BPD was when i started searching about "alternate reality". it felt like me and her lived in two different universes... .  she twisted or forgot what i said or did... .  and did the same with her own words and behavior.

but looking back the first warning sign i should have caught was sleeping together on the 2nd time we saw each other after a 4.5 year break up (i dont think that first break up had to do with BPD... .  but her coming back has BPD written all over it). that 5 weeks of honeymoon period seemed too good to be true... .  should have been a warning sign... .  the rage came 5 weeks of being together. i had known this girl for 10 years prior to that and had never seen rage like that. in hindsight... .  i know now that BPD mostly comes in early 20s (the time she went away) therefore when she was back i saw her BPD... .  never in high school or undergrad.
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« Reply #62 on: March 11, 2013, 01:10:09 AM »

Telling me about her violent ex after a few days and I thought I was saving her.

1 day her family were great and the next the did not do anything for he, it was all about her sister apparently.Also hated some of her neighbours and complaining about other family members and people who were meant to be friends,although I think she only has 1 close friend.

Think this was a warning too, a few times when I asked her to do something or we done something together, she kept saying "it must be getting serious"
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