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Author Topic: Worst reaction to your BPDs behavior?  (Read 11166 times)
Mazda
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« on: October 02, 2013, 08:22:06 AM »

Hi all,

I was wondering what the worst reaction you've had to your BPD SO has been?  At one point after our engagement broke up (actually on what would have been our wedding day) he had called me and "apologized" for the way he spoke to me 3 days before when I reached out to him to convince him to get help.  He was, as usual, unreceptive and I ended up just saying ok, there's no point and hastily leaving the conversation.  After he had apologized, he went on to tell me that he had started dating someone else (I later found out that they were actually just friends) and that he had given her his email password to read the mails that I had sent to him so that she could see that he didn't treat me well (read: manipulate her by playing the victim role).  I was livid at this as he had only known her for 2 weeks at this point! My mails had details of our intimate life as well as information on a pregnancy that I lost and didn't want anyone to know about.  He then went on to tell me that she was going to help him with his issues (bear in mind I had made appointments with therapists for him and tried my utmost to convince him to get help, including finding out his insurance cover - I live on another continent from him) and that he would treat her properly (saying this to the woman he abused while engaged to).  I was so furious that I called his local priest and told him that he drinks (a complete no-no in our community), does drugs, smokes and abused me (all true).  I now however, feel bad as I think that I overreacted.  Have any of you ever reacted to such an extent?  I would never have done anything like this before and I don't know what happened to me to make me lash out like that.

Thanks,

Maz
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Mazda
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« Reply #1 on: October 03, 2013, 03:27:26 PM »

Bump... .anyone? I'm feeling really guilty
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simplyasiam
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« Reply #2 on: October 03, 2013, 03:38:26 PM »

i burt the bible at one point, burt everything in my home that made me think of her and worse thing do worry what you did is nothing
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simplyasiam
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« Reply #3 on: October 03, 2013, 03:39:48 PM »

burnt
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Cmjo
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« Reply #4 on: October 03, 2013, 03:54:42 PM »

I am afraid the gaslighting drove me to distraction and I hit him, lots of times as he would never hit me back, I realize now that he taunted me to provoke me, then afterwards he would smile and say it was me who belonged in an asylum not him! And I became so ashamed I couldnt tell anyone or get help.
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MammaMia
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« Reply #5 on: October 03, 2013, 04:05:43 PM »

Mazda

This relationship is toxic.  Your behavior speaks volumes.  You cannot "fix" him

and trying to do so (especially by long distance) will not work.  

I know this sounds harsh, but perhaps it is good that you did not marry.  Let him work on his own issues.  If he is successful, fine, if not, you need to detach for your own wellbeing.  
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Mazda
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« Reply #6 on: October 04, 2013, 04:04:09 PM »

Thank you all. I guess I just need some reassurance as I genuinely acted out of character and all of my cries of saying I was pushed into it were thrown in my face and made me doubt myself. I feel like he completely took away my own sense of identity.

I can't fix him and I wanted to save him. I guess in a way I thought I would be the one to change him. How stupid I am.
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eyvindr
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« Reply #7 on: October 04, 2013, 04:22:23 PM »

Hi Mazda,

We're all only human. Of course, we've done things at time that we're ashamed of -- and we're ashamed and feel guilt because we have consciences.

In my case, I yelled at my ex. She uses that to claim that I'm abusive, and that I emotionally abused her, because she's read online, and "been told by numerous therapists" that yelling is a form of emotional abuse.

I don't in any way want to defend yelling. I hate it, and I'm ashamed that I allowed myself to be reduced to a screaming maniac. But what my ex always leaves out -- even when it was just the two of US discussing it -- was any and everything she did to provoke the yelling. Which happened over the phone, except for a few instances -- and only after I did my damnedest to get off the phone, begging to move the discussion to another time when we were feeling less emotional, trying to approach whatever issue was causing the conflict from another angle, trying to defuse, trying to use humor -- nothing ever worked, because in every case she would simply DEMAND than I agreed with whatever she was saying and apologized for whatever imaginary slight I'd committed -- which I never did, because I'm just not wired that way.

Oh, those horrible phone calls... .ultimately, we reached the point where I would inform her that, if she didn't accept that we needed to either talk at another time or agree to disagree, I would need to get off the phone -- which she refused to permit me to do, until I would finally just hang up.

Guess what?

Hanging up on her was abusive behavior... .~sigh~ Essentially, any attempt I ever made to enforce personal boundaries was deemed by her to be "abuse." Yet the actual emotional abuse that she dished out to me and her parents -- that was just her expressing her feelings.

It's a real convenient, if twisted, strategy -- BPD's always "win" b/c they simply refuse to "lose."

Read up on projection and projective identification, Mazda -- I think you'll find it helpful.

And don't be so hard on yourself. Might not have been the best idea, but at least you were telling the truth -- not making up heinous falsehoods about your ex, with the intention of manipulating the truth to win sympathy that you didn't deserve.

Hang in there.
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MammaMia
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« Reply #8 on: October 04, 2013, 05:45:05 PM »

Mazda

We torture ourselves over what we have said or done out of sheer frustration, when the reality is that most pwBPD just conveniently forget what they do not want to hear or twist it to their advantage.  It is part of the disorder.

When someone exceeds our personal limits and tries to destroy our sense of self, it is time to say ... .  ENOUGH!   I DESERVE BETTER.  Do not apologize for standing up for yourself.

Some of life's lessons REALLY hurt.  The best we can do is learn from our mistakes and move forward.  There IS happiness out there and you will find it, now that you know what you DO NOT want out of life.


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blurry
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« Reply #9 on: October 09, 2013, 02:16:07 PM »

 I changed the locks on her, put half her stuff in storage, the other half went flying out the second story window, reposted all of her promises to me, suicide threats, marriage proposals to me, to anyone and everyone that might care (her mom, dad, best friend, her kids dads ect), basically anything i thought could incriminate her in their mind.

I've dragged her name through the mud as best I could to anyone who'd listen. Plus I've said some of the most hurtful things I could think of to her, all true of course, but BPD doesn't want to hear how hurtful their behavior is. Their behavior no matter how hurtful and bizaare, is totally acceptable and justifiable in their mind.

I feel like it was all after being pushed to my limits and my only regret is that it all slowed down any recycle attempts I could hope for. This last time was so ugly, even knowing her recycling patterns now, ill be in shock if she tries again.

Last time she recycled me, she had me thrown in jail for a night, 11 days earlier and had a no-tresspass order against me, and I had gone on a week-long mudslinging campaign directly before. Two days later she was professing undying love, a week after that, she despised me and hated my guts again, a month later we were married. 3 weeks later, she was gone again.

Not sure what's more bizaare, her behavior, the hot and cold, push/pull, or my behavior in going back to her repeatedly up to this point. I might be the crazier of the two of us actually. But as I like to point out, whatever my illness is, it doesn't cause me to lie, cheat, be dishonest, take advantage of people, try to ruin someone, or act as an around dispicable untrustworthy liar who repeatedly breaks commitments and gives false promises.
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Blade99d
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« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2013, 02:36:40 PM »

Initially, I let mine yell at me without getting excited and firing back, however after several months, i began to fire back.  At one point I called her a c.nt wh.re, and made a really inappropriate comment about a suicide that took place.  I always apologized for losing my cool, and my T has indicated that this toxic relationship caused my anxiety to skyrocket, hence the namecalling.  My T has told me repeatedly that I am very mild mannered, and remain calm, even when he challenges me on certain topics of discussion. 
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goldylamont
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« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2013, 07:29:34 PM »

Hi all,

I was wondering what the worst reaction you've had to your BPD SO has been?  At one point after our engagement broke up (actually on what would have been our wedding day) he had called me and "apologized" for the way he spoke to me 3 days before when I reached out to him to convince him to get help.  He was, as usual, unreceptive and I ended up just saying ok, there's no point and hastily leaving the conversation.  After he had apologized, he went on to tell me that he had started dating someone else (I later found out that they were actually just friends) and that he had given her his email password to read the mails that I had sent to him so that she could see that he didn't treat me well (read: manipulate her by playing the victim role).  I was livid at this as he had only known her for 2 weeks at this point! My mails had details of our intimate life as well as information on a pregnancy that I lost and didn't want anyone to know about.  He then went on to tell me that she was going to help him with his issues (bear in mind I had made appointments with therapists for him and tried my utmost to convince him to get help, including finding out his insurance cover - I live on another continent from him) and that he would treat her properly (saying this to the woman he abused while engaged to).  I was so furious that I called his local priest and told him that he drinks (a complete no-no in our community), does drugs, smokes and abused me (all true).  I now however, feel bad as I think that I overreacted.  Have any of you ever reacted to such an extent?  I would never have done anything like this before and I don't know what happened to me to make me lash out like that.

Thanks,

Maz

Mazda, this phone call had **nothing** to do with his apologizing to you and everything to do with abusing you further. The apology was a manipulative way to get you to open up, so that he could pour salt on your wounds and try and make you feel inadequate and insecure. Your anger and reaction to him is not just understandable, it's to be expected.

Regarding what you actually did--I say, you shouldn't feel any remorse for what you did in regards to its effect on your ex. Whatever, you were just telling the truth. However, I would say be careful how your actions may make other people see you. I think the only important question to ask is if your actions had any negative affect on you? On your life? But honestly don't waste any time feeling bad about someone who acts nice for the sole purpose of ripping you apart--such a cheap (and all too common) shot.
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Ironmanrises
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« Reply #12 on: October 09, 2013, 07:43:43 PM »

In round 1... .

In devaluation/discard... .

After she raged at me... .

Literally yelling at me... .

I called her a "monster"... .

I had never up until... .

That point... .

Been subjected... .

To that kind of treatment... .

By anyone.

Sure... .

Calling her that... .

Was not nice... .

But not unwarranted.

She later used that... .

When she returned to me... .

In round 2... .

And said... .

"It hurt me that you called me a monster... ."

Of course... .

No self reflection... .

Of why I had said that to her... .

Was stipulated by her.

In round 2... .

Of devaluation... .

After a particular lethal... .

Barrage of missiles... .

She launched at me... .

Regarding... .

My "insecurities"... .

I yelled at her.

I literally... .

Screamed at her.

I couldn't hold it in anymore.

Did it have any effect on her... .?

No.

I hate this f¥cking disorder.

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eyvindr
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« Reply #13 on: October 09, 2013, 08:42:57 PM »

Mine calls me a monster now.

How does one go from "soulmate" to "monster"?

Just jump on the BPD express -- you'll get there in a New York minute.

I hate this f¥cking disorder.

Yep.
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"Being deceived in effect takes away your right to make accurate life choices based on truth." -- waverider

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Ironmanrises
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« Reply #14 on: October 09, 2013, 08:47:52 PM »

Mine calls me a monster now.

How does one go from "soulmate" to "monster"?

Just jump on the BPD express -- you'll get there in a New York minute.

I hate this f¥cking disorder.

Yep.

In bold.

I wouldnt be surprised... .

If mine called me that now.
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DragoN
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« Reply #15 on: October 09, 2013, 09:18:37 PM »

Excerpt
Have any of you ever reacted to such an extent?  I would never have done anything like this before and I don't know what happened to me to make me lash out like that.

That is more a premeditated action. So there may be an element of revenge? Only you can know that. Have not reacted like that. In self defense? Yes. But not a premeditated manner which could affect his livelihood. Let his boss and co workers deal with him on their terms.

Excerpt
Not sure what's more bizaare, her behavior, the hot and cold, push/pull, or my behavior in going back to her repeatedly up to this point. I might be the crazier of the two of us actually. But as I like to point out, whatever my illness is, it doesn't cause me to lie, cheat, be dishonest, take advantage of people, try to ruin someone, or act as an around dispicable untrustworthy liar who repeatedly breaks commitments and gives false promises.

The actions are what matter.

Excerpt
Regarding what you actually did--I say, you shouldn't feel any remorse for what you did in regards to its effect on your ex. Whatever, you were just telling the truth. However, I would say be careful how your actions may make other people see you. I think the only important question to ask is if your actions had any negative affect on you? On your life? But honestly don't waste any time feeling bad about someone who acts nice for the sole purpose of ripping you apart--such a cheap (and all too common) shot.

Punching, hitting, throwing things, have been subjected to the lot of it, and only once did I hit first, after a year and a night of his drunken abuse. It was extreme. I had witnesses for that one though. His exwife had heard everything the night before, she knew and knows what he is capable of. She was helping me with losing his beer into the plants on the hotel balcony.

Excerpt
Oh, those horrible phone calls... .ultimately, we reached the point where I would inform her that, if she didn't accept that we needed to either talk at another time or agree to disagree, I would need to get off the phone -- which she refused to permit me to do, until I would finally just hang up.

Guess what?



Hanging up on her was abusive behavior... .~sigh~
Essentially, any attempt I ever made to enforce personal boundaries was deemed by her to be "abuse." Yet the actual emotional abuse that she dished out to me and her parents -- that was just her expressing her feelings.

The Phone. That was a convenient one as there could be no record of what transpired. And to end the abuse and the threats, hanging up was all that was left and then pulling the lines out of the wall. Then the cell phone went wild with calls.

But... .he was smart, NO emails anymore because I kept them. When he went off on denials in the past I had a record.

Excerpt
How does one go from "soulmate" to "monster"?

Monster? I've been called 1000X worse than that. As it doesn't apply, it doesn't bother me all that much. When the name calling starts? I tell him to look in the mirror for the answer to his problems.
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eyvindr
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« Reply #16 on: October 10, 2013, 12:39:48 AM »

Sabratha --



The Phone. That was a convenient one as there could be no record of what transpired. And to end the abuse and the threats, hanging up was all that was left and then pulling the lines out of the wall. Then the cell phone went wild with calls.

Same here -- but oh so easy to just turn off the cell. Always amazed me at how she'd try to debate me about how it was apparently some nearly impossible thing for a human to choose to turn off their cell phone -- as it it were oxygen itself.

But... .he was smart, NO emails anymore because I kept them. When he went off on denials in the past I had a record.

Ha! You'd think mine would at some point realize that she was creating a permanent record of every single abusive statement and threat! I honestly have to think that, in her dysfunctional mindframe, she really thinks she has total control -- as in, whatever she says people will believe, and whatever she chooses to deny won't exist!

Excerpt
How does one go from "soulmate" to "monster"?

Monster? I've been called 1000X worse than that. As it doesn't apply, it doesn't bother me all that much. When the name calling starts? I tell him to look in the mirror for the answer to his problems.

Oh, I've done the same, many times. But, no one should be surprised by that, because, after all -- it's typical abusive behavior and I am, after all, the abuser.     UGH!

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"Being deceived in effect takes away your right to make accurate life choices based on truth." -- waverider

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AliveButBeatup
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« Reply #17 on: October 10, 2013, 01:03:47 AM »

Sabratha --



The Phone. That was a convenient one as there could be no record of what transpired. And to end the abuse and the threats, hanging up was all that was left and then pulling the lines out of the wall. Then the cell phone went wild with calls.

Same here -- but oh so easy to just turn off the cell. Always amazed me at how she'd try to debate me about how it was apparently some nearly impossible thing for a human to choose to turn off their cell phone -- as it it were oxygen itself.

But... .he was smart, NO emails anymore because I kept them. When he went off on denials in the past I had a record.

Ha! You'd think mine would at some point realize that she was creating a permanent record of every single abusive statement and threat! I honestly have to think that, in her dysfunctional mindframe, she really thinks she has total control -- as in, whatever she says people will believe, and whatever she chooses to deny won't exist!

Excerpt
How does one go from "soulmate" to "monster"?

Monster? I've been called 1000X worse than that. As it doesn't apply, it doesn't bother me all that much. When the name calling starts? I tell him to look in the mirror for the answer to his problems.

Oh, I've done the same, many times. But, no one should be surprised by that, because, after all -- it's typical abusive behavior and I am, after all, the abuser.     UGH!

I like your comment about the phone in reference to it being treated like it was oxygen itself. The phone was a source of more arguments than I can remember. A central figure in the mistrust issues.  And getting a few hours of sanity back in my life by turning my phone off was beyond understanding.
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croovis

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« Reply #18 on: October 10, 2013, 01:24:58 AM »

After the first real dumping, I found out that days later she was already on to a new guy/guys. I called her a cluster b vampire, among other things. She never got over the fact that I used her disorder as an insult. On another occasion, I had heard rumors of her seeing multiple people immediately in the wake of our r/s ending. I called her out on it, and said it would be really hard for her to earn my respect again.

I recently attempted my very own recycle in the past few weeks, after 3 months NC. Took her out on a date- the night ended with her pushing me away and even kissing another guy in front of me. She profusely apologized the next day, but my pride was so wounded that I went out of my way to call her a coke whore and a person who trades their body for drugs, a person who gives their body and heart away to everyone to the point where it is meaningless.

I think these are my worst transgressions. I feel like I would lose my cool and get verbally explosive, but even most of it was by text.

I tried to patch things up with her, but she claims that I've hurt her too much. It really drives me crazy. On the one hand i feel really guilty for being a dick, but on the other I feel like the betrayals I endured in our relationship were far worse than any words I had to say. I dont go out of my way to start things, I just react when I get betrayed and my pride gets stomped on. But she pulls this victim card, me and my cruel oppressive words. Its crazy- am I expected to be a bloody saint? Just sit there and empathetically hold her hand when she stomps on my heart?

Is it really all that bad to say those things or do I have a right to vent?
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« Reply #19 on: October 10, 2013, 01:51:47 AM »

I called mine a psychopath, and got a shocked look from her which told me I wasn't the first to tell her that.  Hmmm.  I didn't even know what a psychopath was then, but it sounded good, and her look made me find out, which led me to BPD, which led me here.
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« Reply #20 on: October 10, 2013, 02:33:57 AM »

I've reacted in ways that are inexcusable and have violated every core ethical tenet that I believe in. For example, after one particular sexual transgression, I had her get naked, put a collar and a leash on her, and had her lap Guinness out of a bowl, knowing that she's an alcoholic w/ BPD. It really doesn't matter that it was consensual and that was her "thing," it was just so wrong. Such bad karma to give into those demons... .   
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« Reply #21 on: October 10, 2013, 04:06:10 AM »

Excerpt
Such bad karma to give into those demons... .   



Yep, as the Karma bus eventually trucks along and smacks into and then backs up over the karma wisher of ill intent and then drives forward. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink and you can lead a PD to a shrink but you can't make' em think.
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« Reply #22 on: October 10, 2013, 04:49:25 AM »

my worst reaction;   after a particularly long fight that dragged on for days, the frustration built for both of us.   We had been reading the high conflict couple together and one of the (rare) things we agreed on was that we needed to call a halt when emotions escalated.   Anyhow we were on day two of the fight, and I was using the tools here and the things I learned from the book and I was pretty calm.   I was sitting on the sofa, and she turned and looked at me and said the coldest cruelest thing anyone has ever said to me in my life.  If I told you what it was out of context it wouldn't even make any sense but put in the framework of what we had been through together it just broke me like Dresden china.

It was typical BPD, it was all on me,  it was all my fault,  I was a failure of a human being.   

My defenses were down and that one cold comment ripped through me in ways I still can't adequately describe today months later.  I was up and moving towards the door as fast as I could go with the idea of getting away from her.   

And in a violent echo of a badly broken heart I threw a punch at the wall,  the concrete wall, and fractured my hand.  It took a surgeon and four screws and a plate to put my hand back together.

I don't know how she recounts the story to the people who knew us.  I am sure I was the lunatic who was out of control and crazy, and she was the victim of events out of her control.

Which is very sad.  Because she is a smart talented creative person who deserves to be happy.   And I kind of doubt she will every find happiness if she doesn't change some of her thinking.

I know that breaking my hand and my heart was a clarion call for me to change the way I think and the way I looked at things.
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« Reply #23 on: October 10, 2013, 04:56:32 AM »

I carried on responding with "I love you - I understand you won't want to be in a relationship with me and I will work hard to become friends instead" until the point where it emerged that he was now fully "in a relationship" with my Replacement, despite months gaslighting me that he wasn't, and this emerged the day after he'd sent me the most loving declaration yet that there was no-one else, never would be anyone else, that only I truly knew and understood him, disparaging "other people", and promising always to be there for me if ever I needed him.

then I got angry and gave him some real truths, such as that he needs to see a therapist about Cluster-B disorders, and that he doesn't love me, he only loves himself and his fake FB-persona and revels in his arrogance.

I regret that last part, that he doesn't love me, because I know it isn't true - he does love me as best he is able to love, and he doens't love himself in the slightest, but is so wildly dysfunctional that he cannot make any real decisions about anything, and simply reacts to others, including reacting to encourage women who believe in his ultra-cool and witty FB-persona.

It is sad.

But it is no longer part of my life, and I am working hard to make it all be in the past for me. I have the capacity, in time, to move on from it, but he, poor lost soul, will always have the memory of the woman he loves turning on him in fury because of his behaviour. Yet another level of guilt and shame for him, poor thing... .

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« Reply #24 on: October 10, 2013, 05:16:58 AM »

Mine calls me a monster now.

How does one go from "soulmate" to "monster"

Yep.

That has nothing to do with BPD specifically. This can happen in any relationship. Things change in life, what you consider now as valuable can be different tomorrow.
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allweareisallweare
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« Reply #25 on: October 10, 2013, 05:29:00 AM »

I'm telling you, what happened with me was I had to 'restrain her'  after I was assaulted - I had a TV remote thrown in my face - and in anger I grabbed her and just literally 'restrained her' and she struggled and got some bruising. I'm telling you, some guys would have done a lot lot worse, simple. I'm not some guys, I felt I responded with reasonable force to a person having a mental episode - she was here on vacation for Christmas and had previously spoiled Christmas day with her childish behaviour, plus was mensching when friends of hers came up from the capital - just to try ad drive some gaslighting point home, I bet.

Anyway, she  my baggage got up and left, went to a hotel. I thought it could have been over then - it should have been to be honest, I'd given the woman more-than-enough - but she got me to help me with a task a few days later - then scurried into the hotel after it was done. I was ready there and then to forget her. But no, she called a few times and I went out with her, we went to karaoke, I went back to the hotel, we kissed and made up - but, you see, BPD don't know they're in the wrong. I don't count this as recycling at all, more like a quarrel - but she was citing this event later and later into April, May ... and recently. I wish she could get into her thick head that she was in the wrong, maybe then ... .   

So when we split, I count it for things like that. I could get over it, but her - the diagnosed BPD - could never.

I went to see her one last time in April in her country. After that I didn't see her and we split in very late July and rebounded ten days later 

It actually doesn't matter - I am realizing as I conclude this post - how patient the non is, how much they love the person - the more they are the more they hurt when the BPD has to go/decides to go. I can only switch to hate for the person now - people say NC is essential - but hate helps to maintain that NC 









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« Reply #26 on: October 10, 2013, 05:42:20 AM »

Sabratha --



The Phone. That was a convenient one as there could be no record of what transpired. And to end the abuse and the threats, hanging up was all that was left and then pulling the lines out of the wall. Then the cell phone went wild with calls.

Same here -- but oh so easy to just turn off the cell. Always amazed me at how she'd try to debate me about how it was apparently some nearly impossible thing for a human to choose to turn off their cell phone -- as it it were oxygen itself.

I like your comment about the phone in reference to it being treated like it was oxygen itself. The phone was a source of more arguments than I can remember. A central figure in the mistrust issues.  And getting a few hours of sanity back in my life by turning my phone off was beyond understanding.
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« Reply #27 on: October 10, 2013, 05:52:30 AM »

i don't like admitting this but full disclosure here is good for the soul, since we're all sharing, right? i think in the four years of the r/s i never said anything too bad, and i never called her foul names, other than maybe "stupid", or one time i called her a "dumb blonde", even though she isn't dumb or stupid (well... .?). And of course I heard about this one slip up for *years*.

But anyways, the worse things I said were during the last few months of the r/s... .all I can say is that she changed, or got worse, and I started to become aware of things and suspecting that her issues were from her childhood instead of from previous bad r/s (which I thought were the reasons, but no longer). During one argument she just kept railing on me, wouldn't stop and the things she was saying about me just made no sense at all--I just got the feeling that she hated men in general in that moment and was taking it out on me. And, I don't know exactly what I said, but basically it was, me: "Why don't you go tell all that isht to your daddy?", her: "What are you even talking about?", me: "I don't know, your daddy, your uncle or whoever the hell broke you as a child and made you the way you are. You don't hate me you hate someone who broke you in the past. Why don't you leave me the hell alone and go deal with it, because you're crazy as a bat." I didn't know about BPD then, if I had I doubt I would have gone there. I think that's probably the meanest thing I said. I don't really feel bad about it though.
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« Reply #28 on: October 10, 2013, 10:12:24 AM »

Goldylamont,

Thats not mean, thats just some righteous truth! I personally like the idea of dropping righteous truth on people, although, really, a PD cant handle it.

Conundrum,

I once helped my ex cut herself. Even though that scenario you described is different, it feels familiar- delving into the messed up-ness of it all.
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« Reply #29 on: October 10, 2013, 12:16:42 PM »

My worst reaction by far came after she told me she had a "date" that night.  Even though we weren't in a 100% committed relationship, I was upset and told her that I wanted her all to myself.  She told me she wanted me all to herself.  If what she was saying was true, that should have ended the discussion right there, but she told me she planned to go on the date anyway, and was excited about all the wild and crazy sex she was going to have.  I left her apartment feeling powerless, frustrated and distraught.

Instead of going to work like I should have, I drove my car as fast as I could on the freeway and tried to get the nerve to kill myself by smashing into a concrete barrier.  I changed my mind and got off the freeway where I continued to drive like a maniac.  I ended up getting into a minor car accident in a parking lot (no one was hurt thank God), but did nearly $1800 worth of damage to my car.

She didn't believe me when I told her about the accident and said I was making it all up just to ruin her date.  The next day I told her about my suicidal intentions before the accident.  She freaked out and called my psychiatrist even though I told her not to.  I knew the crisis had past and I wasn't going to harm myself.  She misunderstood some of the facts of the accident (I didn't help by not clarifying them) and when the wires in her brain got crossed, she went from being lovingly concerned to telling me to F off!

I sent her pictures of the damage to my car and asked if I could come over to clarify things.  I also wanted to apologize to her and her date, who to my dismay was still there, for any disruption I had caused.  When I got to her apartment, she raged at me the whole time and demanded I admit that I made the whole thing up.  She demanded I admit I was trying to make her look like a fool and was intentionally trying to sabotage her date.  I would not admit to any of those things so she threw me out!

I spent the next hour on the phone with Suicide Hotline trying to calm down from her verbal assault against me.  After that I was walking down her street when I crossed paths with a random stranger who wanted to have sex with me.  I said okay and we went back to my apartment and did it.  That was totally out of character for me and I had been celibate for MANY years before that.  I wanted to have "revenge" sex because I was so sick and tired of her having sex with anyone and everyone... .except for me... .and then rubbing it in my face.  She's a sex addict so that came with the package, but her denial of me sexually... .even though we slept in the same bed together on a regular basis... .had frustrated me beyond belief!

So yeah, that was my worst reaction by far!  If I could go back in time, not only would I have went to work instead of driving like a maniac, but I never would have told her about the accident until after her date was over and she had called me again.  Unfortunately this whole incident DESTROYED our relationship!  She turned against me and started making frightening threats of revenge against me.  She became physically abusive towards me and started throwing drinks in my face, beating me and even shoving me to the floor!  My back still hurts to this day from when she shoved me to the floor as hard as she could. 

I am devastated that this incident killed her love for me.  There's nothing I can say or do to make her change her mind about what happened.  There's no apology I can give that's good enough.  No rational conversation I can have with her to clarify the facts of what happened.  No way to clear up the misunderstandings.  It's a no win situation. 

I paid a high price for this accident.  Not only did I pay a high price to have my car fixed, but I paid a high price in losing her love for me.  I can't undo what happened.  The pain it's caused me is severe.

All I can do is try to learn from it as I attempt to move on. 
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« Reply #30 on: October 10, 2013, 01:01:44 PM »

Badly Abused I think anyone would be distraught with the situation you were dealing with with your ex. It sounds like you are also working through some of your own personal issues also separate from your ex and r/s? I am concerned since most of the responses here involve us doing or saying something that may have been mean to our ex's, however in your situation your reaction was to do something mean to yourself. Are you still currently working with a professional to work through these issues? Best of luck and thanks for sharing 
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« Reply #31 on: October 10, 2013, 01:13:46 PM »

Left mine abandoned at a restaurant.  And said and text much worse.   That's when I know I am getting unhealthy.  When I stoop to their level. 

Of course all he remembers is that I left him to walk.  (which he probably didn't)  And that I am a hate person.  Right now I am trying to get him his taxes that I got done for him and I am hateful because I am having them couriered instead of meeting face to face.   Nothing we do good is good and whatever we do wrong is blown up so big.  And they are just perfect.   

The best thing I am learning from this is I let people make me sick. And frankly I am tired of it.  So, you did it, you feel bad.   That's good.  They do it they don't   In fact they do stuff and say its our fault they did.   Its just a horrible cycle.     I am glad you posted this.   Sometimes they make us feel so bad that we almost have this ideal of ourselves that we have to be perfect.  Its creepy. 

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« Reply #32 on: October 10, 2013, 01:28:20 PM »

Left mine abandoned at a restaurant.  And said and text much worse.   That's when I know I am getting unhealthy.  When I stoop to their level. 

Of course all he remembers is that I left him to walk.  (which he probably didn't)  And that I am a hate person.  Right now I am trying to get him his taxes that I got done for him and I am hateful because I am having them couriered instead of meeting face to face.   Nothing we do good is good and whatever we do wrong is blown up so big.  And they are just perfect.   

The best thing I am learning from this is I let people make me sick. And frankly I am tired of it.  So, you did it, you feel bad.   That's good.  They do it they don't   In fact they do stuff and say its our fault they did.   Its just a horrible cycle.     I am glad you posted this.   Sometimes they make us feel so bad that we almost have this ideal of ourselves that we have to be perfect.  Its creepy. 

You may have left him at a restaurant but I am sure he did things worse, and all the time, and did not feel remorse.
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« Reply #33 on: October 10, 2013, 01:46:10 PM »

Excerpt
How does one go from "soulmate" to "monster"?

Just jump on the BPD express -- you'll get there in a New York minute.

LOL  Well, i've actually begun to appreciate the validity in the theory, our BPDs cycle between 1. the vulnerable seducer, 2. the clinger, 3. the hater. During the later stages of r/s they can cycle between the phases rapidily, whereas previously they it may have taken months to years to go from one phase to the next.  We're divorcing and have been exchanging nasty emails, as our sole means of contact while attempting to "negotiate".  I had a nasty "last farewell email" ready to respond with... .but instead after cooling down a bit, I simply responded with "so do you want to talk about it"... .and then she asked if " will sweet (name) show up", to which i responded " yes, will the sweet (name) show up".  So i was prepared to negotiate and be protective, instead we hugged for 3 minutes after i walked in the door.  Had an intimate conversation about her "growth", during the middle of which she asked "are you hard?".  which i wasn't, but became LOL.  We wound upmaking passionate love after not seeing one another for about 3 months.  For whatever reasons, i was essentially depressed for the next 4 days, and could barely get out of bed.

Excerpt
 Such bad karma to give into those demons... . 

Yep, as the Karma bus eventually trucks along and smacks into and then backs up over the karma wisher of ill intent and then drives forward.  

So my worst acting out was about 6 weeks ago.  I sent her 3 successive nasty emails - short and full of vitriol - calling her every name in the book and outing her BPD and making a decision (after i got triggered and successfully solicited) to say fuk the "high road" i will go down to the depths of hell and look her in the eye... .and dish back.  Well as mean, explicative ridden name-calling as it was I didn't call her "fat' which i think in my screwed up way of thinking was one way of sending her in code i would not hit her in that spot (she's overweight, i called her fat azz once in 8 years during a particularly frustrating time coaching her for a triatholon, so she could put it on her resume, don't think she's been on a bike, swam, or jogged since the event... .but recall within the last year of her hater phase, her lashing out at me for calling her "fat", which i didn't but made a comment about the amount of money she was spending on groceries)... .but i digress; ADD kicking my butt today.

So, i've been pretty confrontative in email as of late (counterproductive) about outing her BPD and citing example after example of BS i have endured CALLING IT OUT-FULL STOP; essentially demanding she get in treatment specific to BPD and narcissistic abuse... .and kinda pulling a page from her own book and throwing it back in her face... .which quite frankly diminishes my humanity, my compassion, the very things i am looking for from her... .while basically stating to her she is not a true friend.  I feel very hurt and angry that we failed to go the route of amicable mediation, but it is in keeping  par with anything i want, rarely happens as it winds up being her way or the highway with super uber control... .or when my jerk button gets released she responds with administrative detachment.

Again, ways that i am hurting my self and regressing rather than being committed to growth and resilency no matter what, but instead feeling a sense of inner rage and wanting her to feel hurt and with a motive of revenge (feelings, i have always regulated and controlled thru my adult life in taking the higher road)... .so i geuss its back to biting off my own nose, getting disgusted with myself, because there is no win in these tactics and enough dysfunction is ENOUGH.  It does nothing to help my depression, integrity, and honor, rather it feeds the angry bitter resentful wolf, i've allowed her to let myself turn into.  I think i have a trauma bond, like an abused child to an abusive parent, whom still attaches to the abusive parent as child protective services comes to take the child out of harm's way.   what are peptides anyways... .but addictive little creatures deep down nestled in there demanding screaming for more, more, more like a nest full of baby robins with their mouths wide open waiting to be fed when momma bird returns with  a worm.  too much.  exhausting for me too.  my life is passing me by and i am pissed and unable to sustain my focus or concentration, except for ruminative clusterfuk associations i've just vented. ugg

Excerpt
Yep, as the Karma bus eventually trucks along and smacks into and then backs up over the karma wisher of ill intent and then drives forward.  

 Agreed.  Well said.
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« Reply #34 on: October 10, 2013, 02:33:07 PM »

Badly Abused I think anyone would be distraught with the situation you were dealing with with your ex. It sounds like you are also working through some of your own personal issues also separate from your ex and r/s? I am concerned since most of the responses here involve us doing or saying something that may have been mean to our ex's, however in your situation your reaction was to do something mean to yourself. Are you still currently working with a professional to work through these issues? Best of luck and thanks for sharing 

Yes, I brought huge personal issues into the relationship.  Just like I had to deal with her BPD, she had to deal with my rock bottom low self esteem amongst other issues.  I think it exhausted both of us.  I've been getting professional help for 4 years, but things only seem to be getting worse for me instead of better.

Thanks for the cyber hug! 
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« Reply #35 on: October 10, 2013, 02:44:40 PM »

After being verbally abused in a restaurant, she called her mom in front of me and handed me the phone.  Her mom begged me to hug her/hold her on the couch while we watch tv after because her daughter was "really sorry"  and couldn't I just get over it.  I couldn't. 

I said to her later that night, " (Name), You must think I'm Jesus Christ.  Because only Jesus Christ could take your sh== and hold you all night long.
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« Reply #36 on: October 10, 2013, 02:47:44 PM »

After being verbally abused in a restaurant, she called her mom in front of me and handed me the phone.  Her mom begged me to hug her/hold her on the couch while we watch tv after because her daughter was "really sorry"  and couldn't I just get over it.  I couldn't. 

I said to her later that night, " (Name), You must think I'm Jesus Christ.  Because only Jesus Christ could take your sh== and hold you all night long.

May I borrow that
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« Reply #37 on: October 10, 2013, 02:57:11 PM »

After being verbally abused in a restaurant, she called her mom in front of me and handed me the phone.  Her mom begged me to hug her/hold her on the couch while we watch tv after because her daughter was "really sorry"  and couldn't I just get over it.  I couldn't. 

I said to her later that night, " (Name), You must think I'm Jesus Christ.  Because only Jesus Christ could take your sh== and hold you all night long.

May I borrow that

DRV3006... .Absolutely!  Although I hope you or I never have to use it again!   Smiling (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #38 on: October 10, 2013, 04:06:54 PM »

All --

I wanna say "wow," but honestly -- the wow factor has faded to "as predicted," with respect to the ever-growing catalogue of similarities and shared experiences b/t r-ships with these poor souls.

croovis --

It really drives me crazy. On the one hand i feel really guilty for being a dick, but on the other I feel like the betrayals I endured in our relationship were far worse than any words I had to say. I dont go out of my way to start things, I just react when I get betrayed and my pride gets stomped on. But she pulls this victim card, me and my cruel oppressive words. Its crazy- am I expected to be a bloody saint? Just sit there and empathetically hold her hand when she stomps on my heart?

Is it really all that bad to say those things or do I have a right to vent?

Yeah, pretty much -- you're expected to sit patiently and agree with every hurtful unwarranted accusation without getting remotely upset, let alone angry with her. (And yes -- you have every right to vent. Get it out.)

heeltoheal --

I called mine a psychopath, and got a shocked look from her which told me I wasn't the first to tell her that. Hmmm. I didn't even know what a psychopath was then, but it sounded good, and her look made me find out, which led me to BPD, which led me here.

Makes you wonder sometimes if our unconscious minds were looking out for us, huh? I know, in my case, when I would finally reach the point of reacting to the abuse, it truly was like I couldn't stop myself from verbally defending myself. My ex always contended that I was the only one in her life who ever told her the things I said. Quite possible -- I did often feel, when I'd attempt to talk to her about some concern, and she'd react so absolutely inappropriately -- anger, insults, criticisms, instead of just responding to my concern -- that, judging by her reactions, I must have been the first person in her life to ever point out that she was less than perfect, or to ever tell her "no." I usually called her a "spoiled little brat," in the heat of the moment -- that's how damned abusive I am. And I wish I'd've left it at that, but in our last stupid telephone altercation, I did tell her she was acting like a "crazy bhit." I'm sure she'll never forget it. (Ever notice how the only people who get upset if you call them crazy are crazy people?)

babyducks -- 

And in a violent echo of a badly broken heart I threw a punch at the wall,  the concrete wall, and fractured my hand.  It took a surgeon and four screws and a plate to put my hand back together.

I punched a wall once -- in the midst of being harangued for spending too much time. Having dinner. With my family. On Christmas EVE! I had told her to leave, and she refused, and just kept haranguing me about how low a priority she must be to me for me to treat her with such dismissiveness on Christmas Eve... .blah, blah, blah... .I punched the wall, at some point out of sheer frustration -- with the side of my fist, to make a noise. No damage to the wall or my hand. Or her, mind you. Just a loud *thump*. To this day, she cites it as an example of my "abusive behavior" and evidence of my "violent nature."

I don't even kill *spiders* in my house -- I take them outside. But I punched a wall. Like, "sorry, wall."

Escaped --

then I got angry and gave him some real truths, such as that he needs to see a therapist about Cluster-B disorders, and that he doesn't love me, he only loves himself and his fake FB-persona and revels in his arrogance.

I regret that last part, that he doesn't love me, because I know it isn't true - he does love me as best he is able to love, and he doesn't love himself in the slightest, but is so wildly dysfunctional that he cannot make any real decisions about anything, and simply reacts to others, including reacting to encourage women who believe in his ultra-cool and witty FB-persona.

That sounds almost verbatim exactly like things my ex said to me! So weird.

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« Reply #39 on: October 10, 2013, 05:44:45 PM »

eyvindr:

"when I'd attempt to talk to her about some concern, and she'd react so absolutely inappropriately -- anger, insults, criticisms, instead of just responding to my concern."

That to me is the core of it, and I just let it go, time and time again.  I LET IT GO!  What the hell was I thinking?  And that is the most important question to me now.  Is that my wiring from childhood still running around my psyche?  Probably.  :)igging deep requires courage and vulnerability, and the gift that was my BPD experience is the need and desire to look.  Water seeks it's own level, and I was in that relationship because it was the right one then, and if I want healthier, I need to get healthier.
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« Reply #40 on: October 10, 2013, 07:37:20 PM »

Let's see... .

1.)She made fun of my most intimate issues behind my back with a bunch of junkies and completely abandoned me to go do a bunch of drugs so I went home (abandoned her) in her mind... .so she blacked me out to her friends and family.

2.) I wrote her an email expressing how I'd felt abandoned many times... .so she hited another guy (afraid of abandoment claim)

3.) She kicked me out of where we were staying 3000 miles from home, so I yelled at her on the way out.  Called her a b**ch, F her drug addict friends, and I told her i was going to stop hiding the truth of what she'd been doing the whole time... .blacked me out again, silent treatment, cheated on me.

I don't know... .this happened a few more times.

Then, I went logical on her.  I'd just ask her questions to point out her errors in logic, when facts didn't add up.  Boy did this enrage her.  Then, she started the physical violence.

Eventually, i really reached a point where I just stopped reacting.  I dissociated and just started taking it, fearing the next round of abuse, and praying for a breadcrumb of love.

It sickens me to read that.  I'm a former college athlete with great prospects, women have approached me many times to tell me I deserve better, how attractive I am, yet all I can somehow see right now in the mirror is the pathetic wimp who couldn't walk away from an angry toddler.

I'm ashamed.
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« Reply #41 on: October 10, 2013, 08:02:22 PM »

Questioningfaith, try not to beat yourself up. BPD plug into our soft spots, Idealize, then devalue. It's an addiction. It's very little terrible about you, but the good and loving aspect of a person that they are able to emotionally capitalize on to my/ your detriment.

Excerpt
Then, I went logical on her.  I'd just ask her questions to point out her errors in logic, when facts didn't add up.  Boy did this enrage her.  Then, she started the physical violence.

Same here. And I will stick with logic and reason from here until eternity. "Emotional Reasoning" is not going to be my guiding light in existence.

eyvinder

Excerpt
Makes you wonder sometimes if our unconscious minds were looking out for us, huh? I know, in my case, when I would finally reach the point of reacting to the abuse, it truly was like I couldn't stop myself from verbally defending myself.

Many of your posts I can really relate to. Defending myself in the wake of the bogus attacks of twisted logic and false accusations is probably the only reason I am not crushed into oblivion.

People react differently to these situations, FOO stuff mixed in there. I was/ am the rebel child. So, that did not work well in the BPD / Non dynamic with my SO.
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« Reply #42 on: October 10, 2013, 08:22:40 PM »

My worst reactions were not the overt name-calling, losing-your-cool kind, although I did that too toward the end when the r/s was on its last legs.

My reactions were engineered to get directly at his abandonment and control weaknesses.

We had an LDR and I would visit him on weekends. So I usually made sure to spend every hour with him. During devaluation, when nothing positive that I did seemed to change his bad attitude toward me, on a weekend visit I stayed out late one night with one of my good girlfriends in his city (I used to live there) who I had not seen in a while. We went to a bar, had a fun night just catching up with each other. I returned to BPD boyfriend's place just as he was getting up for work. I knew I was in the doghouse.  

He acted like it didn't bother him, but he brought it up the next weekend when he was drunk and mad at me. He verbally attacked me about being out late and who knows what I was up to. I turned my head away from him and smirked with satisfaction, letting him imagine the worst.

I pulled this trick again, but it ended the r/s for good. I walked out of his place mid-argument in the evening (he was drunk; I was done with his blaming me for our failing r/s) and stayed overnight with my friend. I collected my things the next morning and that was the end.  

It's funny, but me being natural me was "reaction" enough for my uBPDexbf. Just me being smarter than him, outgoing, cute, professionally successful, popular -- that was enough to keep my ex-man in a perpetual state of anxiety about me. I didn't have to do anything to hurt him. Just being there for him to feel and love me was hurt enough.
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« Reply #43 on: October 10, 2013, 08:40:45 PM »

My worst was scrambling to be better, by her definition, in her eyes.

My best is BEING BETTER, in mine.

Idea        Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #44 on: October 10, 2013, 08:52:19 PM »

myself --

My worst was scrambling to be better, by her definition, in her eyes.

My best is BEING BETTER, in mine.

Idea        Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

Poster material.
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« Reply #45 on: October 13, 2013, 09:03:02 PM »

"How does one go from "soulmate" to "monster"?

Just jump on the BPD express -- you'll get there in a New York minute."

Thank you for that.  It is both true, and it made me laugh.  There is nothing funny about what we are going through, yet if we can mock it a bit, I think it helps a lot.

I saved that one.

Annie
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« Reply #46 on: October 14, 2013, 07:28:28 PM »

Questioning Faith:

Right there with you.  Not so much with her drug abuse and cheating per se; mine's on the suppossed high functioning spectrum... .

but end result; very similar.  Not that I feel ashamed about not being able to walk away... .but at a loss, very confused, as to how far down, numbed out, and oblivious to my prior strengths.  Confidence nearly destroyed. So much of myself I gave away, or let her take... .under the assumption we'd experience mutuality rather than a long downward spiral of passive aggressiveness, denial, and projection.  Tired of the victim role.  Yet currently imprisoned to these negative binds.

And while divorce proceedings are underway, I'm in the midst of a recycle.  Aside from the loving intimacy, after incredibly destructive negative emailing back and forth (mutuality)... .i feel like a dissociative ghost sleep walking thru what's become a surreal existence. 5-8 years, 5-8 months, 5-8 days... .

Fighting for breadcrumbs... .What the heck  "like a moth to a flame"
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Emelie Emelie
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« Reply #47 on: October 14, 2013, 08:27:24 PM »

Ive embarrassed myself beyond belief. Sending sobbing messages when I had too much to drink. Acting like a pathetic loser. Most recently showing up where I was clearly not wanted. (he was busy wooing another girl). Validating all of his feelings and pretending mine didn't matter.  AllOwing him to treat me like comPlete crap the last two months of the relationship when he was sending clear signals he wasn't sure be didn't want me anymore. If I could have one do over... .it would be that I ended all contact with him when I finally walked out. Left with some dignity and grace. Now here I am mOnths later trying to let go with some dignity and grace. I hate that I acted the way I did. Mortally Ashamed and humiliated.
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« Reply #48 on: October 14, 2013, 08:43:08 PM »

Emelie... .



I know that feeling... .

You described... .

Of not being wanted... .

That was how it was like for me... .

On my birthday... .

Which was the tail end of the devaluation... .

In round 2... .

Where i spent a few days in her house.

I know that feeling... .

Exactly... .

Of not being wanted.

I saw it on her face... .

As she dysregulated... .

I never felt... .

More alone... .

In my life... .

Then those horrific... .

Few days... .

Including my birthday.

Humiliated... .

Beyond words.

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« Reply #49 on: October 14, 2013, 11:07:11 PM »






It appears i may have spoken too fast regarding feeling "ashamed" or embarrassed... .when i said earlier

Excerpt
Not that I feel ashamed about not being able to walk away... .but at a loss, very confused, as to how far down, numbed out, and oblivious to my prior strengths.  Confidence nearly destroyed. So much of myself I gave away, or let her take... .under the assumption we'd experience mutuality rather than a long downward spiral of passive aggressiveness, denial, and projection.  Tired of the victim role.  Yet currently imprisoned to these negative binds.

Hmmm... .maybe remorse and regret for not being able to walk away... .but then again, the words of BPDspell appear to articulate what I'm not yet able to describe in feelings of shame that i have avoided in my last post , quoted above.  Hence, i'd like to revisit where being ashamed or having a sense of shame does indeed reside inside of me:

Excerpt
   So how did shame manifest itself inside of me? Hating myself, blaming myself for my ex's actions, living in delusion and denial, accepting abuse, accepting my ex's lies as truth, using my ex as a cover up for my own feelings of worthlessness, treating my ex better than I treated myself, protecting my ex by not revealing his abuse... .

This is my shame and I now OWN IT.

I had a tough time being in touch with my own personal shame and deep sense of unworthiness because staring into my own mirror was something that I did not want to do. Just like my ex.

So what did I do? I stared into my ex's mirror hoping that he could validate me and make me feel worthy of the love that didn't exist inside of me.

Just like my ex.

When there's no love for yourself; shame is it's replacement.

It's hard to admit that we don't love ourselves and avoiding this truth comes with consequences like picking damaged people to love us.

I compare engagement with a BPD like investing in a car with a busted tail light, cracked rear view mirrors, a rusty engine, a dirty window shield. How the hell can a damaged car take you far?

Same thing with our exs. They can't take us far because their capacity to navigate love is extremely compromised.

Feeling weak and discouraged.  Hmmm... .still part of the negative crippling self sabotaging bind of which shame may indeed have a hold... .
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eyvindr
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« Reply #50 on: October 14, 2013, 11:11:49 PM »

Emelie,

You're human. Forgive yourself. You were only reacting genuinely to what you were feeling. Sure, we all have moments we'd love to re-do, scenes we'd like to re-shoot -- forgive yourself. These r-ships are hard, they are intense, they push us to extremes. Please don't beat yourself up over this. At least your feelings were real, huh?

*hugs*

e.
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« Reply #51 on: October 14, 2013, 11:25:41 PM »

Seeker,

Does my description put her on the low end?

I (ashamedly) hope so.  My worst fear (which in writing I realize I need to detach from - her life is her own) is that she will go on to be this amazing hollywood star/artist that she wants to be.  That I will have somehow lost out, because I didn't learn validation skills and just stick with her.

I want to see her bottom out, face her addictions, make amends.

I guess I have this high and mighty view of who she "is".

My view:

Gorgeous

Cultured

Well Put together

Intelligent

Talented

Motivated

Passionate

Reality:

maybe a 6.5 or 7 out of 10

Acts like a belligerent uneducated child, but fakes intellectual conversation well

cant keep a friend or promise for the life of her, terrible r/s w family (lies to everyone one of them and rages) and doesn't even keep her appearance or room clean - total mega skank/bhit look

Talks about big things - hasn't followed through on a single one

Sits around ALLLLLLLLLLL day smoking pot and then does harder drugs at night

Fakes every emotion, literally, I watched it with her friends.

That was actually the real eye opener for me, when I realized, wait a second, she lies to her mom, her best friends, every other person in her life, why the heck wouldn't she lie to me?

I think thats when my idolization faded.

So I truly am curious, am I just in denial about how great and high functioning she is because she's in art classes and pulls A's and B's?

Is she actually in the lower end of functioning?

Cuz honestly (and again ashamedly) that'd be a relief.

I thought I lost a priceless piece of gold!
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hopealways
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« Reply #52 on: October 14, 2013, 11:40:38 PM »

Seeker,

Does my description put her on the low end?

I (ashamedly) hope so.  My worst fear (which in writing I realize I need to detach from - her life is her own) is that she will go on to be this amazing hollywood star/artist that she wants to be.  That I will have somehow lost out, because I didn't learn validation skills and just stick with her.

I want to see her bottom out, face her addictions, make amends.

I guess I have this high and mighty view of who she "is".

My view:

Gorgeous

Cultured

Well Put together

Intelligent

Talented

Motivated

Passionate

Reality:

maybe a 6.5 or 7 out of 10

Acts like a belligerent uneducated child, but fakes intellectual conversation well

cant keep a friend or promise for the life of her, terrible r/s w family (lies to everyone one of them and rages) and doesn't even keep her appearance or room clean - total mega skank/bhit look

Talks about big things - hasn't followed through on a single one

Sits around ALLLLLLLLLLL day smoking pot and then does harder drugs at night

Fakes every emotion, literally, I watched it with her friends.

That was actually the real eye opener for me, when I realized, wait a second, she lies to her mom, her best friends, every other person in her life, why the heck wouldn't she lie to me?

I think thats when my idolization faded.

So I truly am curious, am I just in denial about how great and high functioning she is because she's in art classes and pulls A's and B's?

Is she actually in the lower end of functioning?

Cuz honestly (and again ashamedly) that'd be a relief.

I thought I lost a priceless piece of gold!

Just like my BPDex - it's good that you write these out because once you read it hopefully it reinforces why you should get the heck out of dodge and not look back.  The seduction phase is key to how the BPD traps us.  They idolize us in the beginning to the point where anyone would think they have found true love and then boom they switch to monsters once they know they have us.  They are emotional terrorists.  The only reason you continued to stay instead of running sooner is because you felt unloved growing up.  This is the only reason.  Had you felt loved you would never tolerate this treatment - but it felt familiar to you, so  you stayed. Do not feel ashamed my friend.  Just focus on healing the wounds from childhood - that is the key to healing.
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peas
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« Reply #53 on: October 14, 2013, 11:52:52 PM »

Excerpt
Ive embarrassed myself beyond belief. Sending sobbing messages when I had too much to drink. Acting like a pathetic loser ... .Validating all of his feelings and pretending mine didn't matter.  AllOwing him to treat me like comPlete crap the last two months of the relationship when he was sending clear signals he wasn't sure be didn't want me anymore.

Emelie, I have the same instincts and I too put aside my feelings and allowed my ex to treat me like crap in the last part of the r/s when he was trying to shoo me away. I lost dignity when I didn't challenge him on his detaching and I tried even harder to make things work.

I think my pent-up anger toward my ex saved me from the embarrassment of any sobbing messages and drunk dialing post-b/u. It sounds terrible, but I don't want him "to win" and that is what keeps me NC. I'm not a competitive person but I have to assume that attitude because I hurt so much.

Excerpt
If I could have one do over... .it would be that I ended all contact with him when I finally walked out. Left with some dignity and grace. Now here I am mOnths later trying to let go with some dignity and grace. I hate that I acted the way I did. Mortally Ashamed and humiliated.

We can't change the past. And the grass is always greener. I often wonder if I would be in a better emotional state if I or he had broken contact since our last contact three months ago. I try to heal while managing a state of suspension waiting to hear from him. Interpreting the silence can be excruciating: Does he think of me? Is he with someone else? Did he ever love me? Is he happy? Why isn't he recycling me this time? If I broke NC, how would he react? If he broke NC, how would I deal with it?

NC is probably just as difficult as contact.
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« Reply #54 on: October 15, 2013, 07:19:09 AM »

That was actually the real eye opener for me, when I realized, wait a second, she lies to her mom, her best friends, every other person in her life, why the heck wouldn't she lie to me?

I think thats when my idolization faded.

yes! i had pretty much the exact same realization--i caught her lying to her mom over the phone. it wasn't even a significant lie or anything... .but i was just shocked how easily she lied, to her own mom! it was then that I started to look at her actions more closely and begin my own investigations, and I'm so glad I did.


from @peas:

Excerpt
NC is probably just as difficult as contact.

again i say---yes!  Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)

sorry for the over enthusiasm, i'm on a low-sleep high right now (nothing bad i just like to work all night earlier in the week).
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« Reply #55 on: October 15, 2013, 10:00:34 AM »

Excerpt
I think my pent-up anger toward my ex saved me from the embarrassment of any sobbing messages and drunk dialing post-b/u. It sounds terrible, but I don't want him "to win" and that is what keeps me NC. I'm not a competitive person but I have to assume that attitude because I hurt so much.

That's my own comment above. I should clarify. I did swallow my dignity, mildly, and reached out to ex in the weeks after our breakup. I tried to engage him in a friendly way. I left him some nice voicemails saying I loved him and I just wanted to make sense of the breakup and not leave with our last contact being our last argument when I walked out of his house. He responded to my voicemail messages in text (of course, refusing to talk to me). He thanked me, but the text exchange quickly fell to ___. They led to text fight where he threatened to call the cops on me. So while I did not call him sobbing, I re-engaged post-b/u wanting answers and some peace. Since then it's been three months mutual NC. 
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« Reply #56 on: October 15, 2013, 01:16:03 PM »

peas --

Been there. 

That's my own comment above. I should clarify. I did swallow my dignity, mildly, and reached out to ex in the weeks after our breakup. I tried to engage him in a friendly way. I left him some nice voicemails saying I loved him and I just wanted to make sense of the breakup and not leave with our last contact being our last argument when I walked out of his house. He responded to my voicemail messages in text (of course, refusing to talk to me). He thanked me, but the text exchange quickly fell to ___. They led to text fight where he threatened to call the cops on me. So while I did not call him sobbing, I re-engaged post-b/u wanting answers and some peace. Since then it's been three months mutual NC. 

 Why do they do this sh!t?

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« Reply #57 on: October 15, 2013, 01:54:44 PM »

QuestioningFaith --

Oh, so familiar! Here's mine... .

My view:



  • Beautiful


  • Sweet


  • Creative


  • Kind


  • Intelligent


  • Shy


  • Healthy




Reality:



  • She's still beautiful to me


  • Pretends to be a sweet lil thing in front of people who don't know her, but can be downright mean behind closed doors with those closest to her


  • Talks a lot about being creative, but never does anything


  • She can be kind, most often to people she doesn't know, which is interesting. (Ex.: Each Christmas, she pays for some random person's layaway gifts. But she won't spend more than $20 on gifts for her parents, who watch her primary-school aged daughter ALL year.)


  • Never hesitates to cite her private undergrad degree or her MS degree... .yet has worked in a clerical entry position for over 10 years.


  • Claims to be an exhibitionist, but mostly is very superficially polite with strangers. Have watched her spin the truth with people many times.


  • Over-medicated hypochondriac.




In my case, an early eye-opener was seeing how strained her r-ships w/ her mother and father were -- very little interaction, no eye contact, tense. Should have walked the first time I heard her go off on her father over the phone for not following her commands about something when he was watching her daughter for her

Oh, I stayed. But it did register... .I thought, wow, if she treats her own parents that poorly, how's she going to treat me?... .

Seeker,

Does my description put her on the low end?

I (ashamedly) hope so.  My worst fear (which in writing I realize I need to detach from - her life is her own) is that she will go on to be this amazing hollywood star/artist that she wants to be.  That I will have somehow lost out, because I didn't learn validation skills and just stick with her.

I want to see her bottom out, face her addictions, make amends.

I guess I have this high and mighty view of who she "is".

My view:

Gorgeous

Cultured

Well Put together

Intelligent

Talented

Motivated

Passionate

Reality:

maybe a 6.5 or 7 out of 10

Acts like a belligerent uneducated child, but fakes intellectual conversation well

cant keep a friend or promise for the life of her, terrible r/s w family (lies to everyone one of them and rages) and doesn't even keep her appearance or room clean - total mega skank/bhit look

Talks about big things - hasn't followed through on a single one

Sits around ALLLLLLLLLLL day smoking pot and then does harder drugs at night

Fakes every emotion, literally, I watched it with her friends.

That was actually the real eye opener for me, when I realized, wait a second, she lies to her mom, her best friends, every other person in her life, why the heck wouldn't she lie to me?

I think thats when my idolization faded.

So I truly am curious, am I just in denial about how great and high functioning she is because she's in art classes and pulls A's and B's?

Is she actually in the lower end of functioning?

Cuz honestly (and again ashamedly) that'd be a relief.

I thought I lost a priceless piece of gold!

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"Being deceived in effect takes away your right to make accurate life choices based on truth." -- waverider

"Don't try the impossible, as you're sure to become well and truly stuck and require recovery." -- Vintage Land Rover 4X4 driving instructional video
AliveButBeatup
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« Reply #58 on: October 15, 2013, 03:03:29 PM »

I am enjoying this thread in relation to My View and Reality.

I have been separated from my wife for a couple of weeks now. I look at her photos. I still think she is very pretty. However, I also now have first hand knowledge of all of the ugliness inside of her.  I look at her photo and wonder if her friends and family truly understand the depths of the turmoil inside this woman.  I wonder how many of them she was truly honest with when she shared the reasons for our many separations. She told me she told them, but I doubt it.

She was kind to her mother.  They have a good relationship.  Her adopted minor children were often confused by her behavior. I think she loves them, but sometimes I think they are just a paycheck (State of California pays you monthly for adopted foster children). She would very probably be out on the streets if it wasn't for those checks. She cannot find a job for the life of her. Her financial affairs are a disaster. It is all her ex-husband's fault.  She told me on multiple occasions she would pay me back for whatever it was that I was providing money for.  I knew she never would, but I am thinking why even say it if you know you will never be able to.  I found it very distasteful that she would use her 13 year old son's money promising him she would pay it back. He did work for me and we were supposed to invest his savings in the stock market.  There is something I find very fundamentally wrong about taking your child's money to take care of personal obligations that as an adult you should be responsible for.  Am I missing something here?  It is things such as these that I see and realize separation and divorce is what needs to happen.

ABB
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eyvindr
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« Reply #59 on: October 15, 2013, 03:35:04 PM »

I hear ya, Alive.

You start feeling like you thought you were getting a partner, but instead you have an adult child on your hands. 


I knew she never would, but I am thinking why even say it if you know you will never be able to.  I found it very distasteful that she would use her 13 year old son's money promising him she would pay it back. He did work for me and we were supposed to invest his savings in the stock market.  There is something I find very fundamentally wrong about taking your child's money to take care of personal obligations that as an adult you should be responsible for.  Am I missing something here?  It is things such as these that I see and realize separation and divorce is what needs to happen.

ABB

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« Reply #60 on: October 15, 2013, 05:08:11 PM »

Here's the inner yin and yang of it... .

Excerpt
seduction phase is key to how the BPD traps us.  They idolize us in the beginning to the point where anyone would think they have found true love and then boom they switch to monsters once they know they have us.  They are emotional terrorists.  The only reason you continued to stay instead of running sooner is because you felt unloved growing up.  This is the only reason.  Had you felt loved you would never tolerate this treatment - but it felt familiar to you, so  you stayed 

BottomLine:  Truth.  NEVER thought i would wind up marrying my abusive father.   What sucked here, is because she was female, NEVER saw it coming.  By the time i saw it, the denial and negative bond were so strong that my internal discounting got reactivated.

Faith:

Excerpt
  Sits around ALLLLLLLLLLL day smoking pot and then does harder drugs at night

That would be dysfunctional.

Mine draws a 6 figure salary, very strong work ethic.  But she's a spender, since our separation; dissipating any of her assests: brand new car suv, ANOTHER dog, brand new fence, more cloths, buys enough food to fill the fridge to feed an army winds up throwing 1/2 of it out, when she doesn't go out to eat (the full appetizer, meal, dessert, drink)  more new clothes.  Very self-centered.  Not really able to think in terms of team concept, has hyper-uber control, passive-aggressive to the max, core invalidator, all in contrast to

the flexible, wanting to please, do anything for ya person i was dating.  I didn't see the emotional manipulation for what it was.  She still can be sweet, but if it comes to dialog and give and take exchange... .where i once had influence and respect... .it's as if i've given the adversary inside information as any vulnerability, want, or need that gets expressed on my part either gets used against me, or becomes the next carpet to be pulled from underneath me.  So in an odd way, it kinda sorta mimics the walking on eggshells in a surreal way, compared to the 2 faced father i grew up with (oh your dad's soo cool yada yada, strong work ethic; yet inside the home he'd rage, disparage, and give you THAT look of disgust for no reason while disrespecting boundaries... .functional ptsd).

So yeah, the inner work... .urgh.  Have to find that inner authentic befriending impulse.  My last therapist in mentioning my codependency (God do i ever hate that part of myself which got unearthed) said something about not needing to look outside of myself for someone to take care of me.  Unbelievable... .used to be self-reliant, determined, strong-willed.  So maybe i've become the adult child and am at a loss (mired in depression) for being strong enough to pick myself out of the abyss and wreckage... .while my SO saunters on guilt free with me as her roadkill.  I hate the victim role cus it's disabling... .like inside of a trauma bond.

Q of faith:

I do believe, if in your internal self-talk you are seeing and verbalizing the downside of her character... .it makes it easier to detach.  I seem to pick up on that theme on these boards as a whole.  So if that's devaluing the priceless piece of gold we overestimated as having in our life, but instead it turns out to be some kind of trap that sucks the energy out of our marrow... .then let wake up call help find that authentic piece of internal pride we were once able to estalishe in our lives rather than co-miserating a life of emotional wreckage.
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« Reply #61 on: October 15, 2013, 06:02:51 PM »

I stayed pretty calm (as calm as I could) during the relationship when he was abusive and playing games, even though I wanted to let it rip. 

After it ended, I did let it rip.  I said all of the things I hadn't said during the relationship.  I bombarded him with emails and texts, letting it all spill out.  And I mirrored back much of what he said to me.  He had criticized me for being intelligent.  I criticized him for not being as intelligent as I was. I just slammed back with below the belt analysis, calling him on every lie, every behavior that was abusive. 

Is that something I normally do?  No.  Did it make me feel better?  I felt guilty about it initially.  And a bit disappointed in myself that I'd stooped that low.  I wanted him to know, that I knew who/what he really was and that the relationship was a 'joke'.  But later, I cut myself a break.  Would I react that way again if I could do it all over?  Probably not.  It likely just fed his need for attention. And it was a waste of my time. 
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« Reply #62 on: October 15, 2013, 07:07:01 PM »

I stayed pretty calm (as calm as I could) during the relationship when he was abusive and playing games, even though I wanted to let it rip. 

After it ended, I did let it rip.  I said all of the things I hadn't said during the relationship.  I bombarded him with emails and texts, letting it all spill out.  And I mirrored back much of what he said to me.  He had criticized me for being intelligent.  I criticized him for not being as intelligent as I was. I just slammed back with below the belt analysis, calling him on every lie, every behavior that was abusive. 

Is that something I normally do?  No.  Did it make me feel better?  I felt guilty about it initially.  And a bit disappointed in myself that I'd stooped that low.  I wanted him to know, that I knew who/what he really was and that the relationship was a 'joke'.  But later, I cut myself a break.  Would I react that way again if I could do it all over?  Probably not.  It likely just fed his need for attention. And it was a waste of my time. 

I too did something similar. Was it outside of character for me?  Yes. Am I glad I did it?  Yes.  I think it actually helped the situation.  Crazy people are a funny sort. If they think you are crazier than them, they will run away.

I mirrored her treatment of me. I told her I hated her. I told I cursed the day I met her. I told she is a human sack of s##t.  I mocked her.  I berated her.  A 3 day campaign of texting and e-mails. I kept asking her why she was wearing her wedding band. I kept asking her if she was ready for a divorce now (she kept fighting getting a divorce).  I told her using my family's name as her last name was an insult. She was not good enough to use the name.  I called the police on her when she was screaming and yelling outside my home I had moved to when I left.  I asked her if she had found another guy yet as that was my hope.  That would be excellent.  When you have BPD it is no fun when your victim is not docile. It makes the manipulation more difficult.

I have peace and quiet now. She leaves me alone. No contact. No BS from her any longer.  My tirade allowed her to succumb to her victim mentality and now I am the bad guy.  I don't hang around her family or friends, so nothing lost there. She can say whatever she wants to them. My family and friends know who I am. They told me to get rid of her a long time ago.

ABB
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once removed
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