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Author Topic: Her lack of empathy regarding me  (Read 535 times)
Aussie JJ
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« on: September 06, 2014, 06:34:58 PM »

Well,

I'm trying to step back a bit myself and process my own stuff at the moment.  Very empowering and very frustrating picking up my own unhealthy patterns in life.  For me, I have always put others first and been a door mat so to speak, people pleaser etc etc.  One thing I have found is I am way too empathetic to others, now looking at this with my BPD relationship, how many times she had no EMPATHY for me or others is just mind blowing.  Hopefully others can relate to this... .  here goes a short list

She made an effort to 'detach from my emotions' while projecting blame onto me... .  constantly blaming. 

She hasnt allowed our son to spend fathers day with me, he is with the replacement. 

She wants to travel overseas for Christmas and his Birthday to spend time with extended family, spending time with his father is less important. 

She cant see how she is hurting our son with her actions, everything is all MEMEMEMEMEME. 

There are more, I don't want to be too specific, some of them you could pick if I wrote them and she read this board.  Hopefully others can relate here, hopefully some examples you can get out and vent some frustration as well. 

I myself, I can see it clear as day, I don't know how she is unable to see what she is doing. 
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IceQueenSunday

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« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2014, 06:43:53 PM »

I honestly think they are incapable of empathy most of the time  it's very me me me me me me all the time with BPD  x

That being said I can see why you are hurting so bad  that is an awful place to be in  xxx

I don't really know what to advise in ways to help, I just hope that things improve xx
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« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2014, 07:09:46 PM »

Totally understand where your coming from.

My ex wife list.

Wanted me to drive back from hospital after I had a knee operation as she was tired.

Went out for the day when I had pulled my back so badly that I couldn't move from the sofa. (didn't even give me a bucket or leave me anything to drink)

Wanted to have our sons for a third Christmas in a row as it would be the first Christmas with my replacements family.

So many many more but these are the ones that spring to mind as the least empathic.
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« Reply #3 on: September 06, 2014, 07:25:26 PM »

I think a lack of empathy is the main defining characteristic of a BPD. I try to be charitable by thinking that their illness consumes every waking minute of their lives so there isn't much leftover for them to consider other people. They honestly have trouble getting through the day. I've told this story in here before but will repeat it as an example. My ex had attempted suicide just before her parents were going on a vacation. The parents wanted to cancel their vacation but the T told them not to. Whilst on the vacation my ex phoned her mum constantly to the point where her dad told her later that her non stop calling ruined their vacation.
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Hopeless777
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« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2014, 07:49:57 PM »

In 27+ years of marriage to my BPDw I never got an apology for anything. Empathy? Forget it! I really don't believe they are capable.
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« Reply #5 on: September 06, 2014, 09:41:59 PM »

I am very much like you aussie jj, im a very empathic person... .probably to empathetic and been the doormat too many times as well. I never really noticed my ex ex's lack of empathy until after we broke up and were trying to be friends. We work together and while at work we had gotten into to it and she unleashed her vicious wrath on me. Having problems with anxiety and panic attacks i became sick and went outside and started throwing up some blood. I texted what had just happened and asked her to come out (she used to be in nursing school) and she never came out. Later on when i was feeling better i asked why she never came out to see if i was ok... .said she was mad at me and didnt care. As time went on there were more and more occurrences where she show zero empathy for me and when asked how she could go caring for me just weeks prior to feeling nothing like she had flipped a switch she said she has the ability to turn her feelings off and pretend things dont exist. Im still baffled by that statement... .is that even humanly possible? All i know is that it hurts really bad. There had been no contact for over 2 months now.
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freedom33
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« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2014, 02:33:02 AM »

There are more, I don't want to be too specific, some of them you could pick if I wrote them and she read this board.  

I have this fear as well. That she could be here in these forums, stalking me, reading all this. She knows that I know that she has strong traits of BPD (and she knows it herself although she won't admit it) and knows that I have posted a post during one our past break ups somewhere else in the internet. I vented quite a lot - not in disrespectful or malicious way - in an honest heartfelt way. (this is it the post she read if you are interested https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=223894.msg12422019#msg12422019). I used to post here with a different name that she knew I used generally so that is what she used to google me and find me. And she did find this post above at another website. I hope she did not find it here as well but I asked the moderators here to change my username to Guest29 just in case.

At any rate, coming back to the topic of empathy, when I allowed myself to go back the last time it was all fine for a week and then she brought up the fact that she has read my post and she was insisting I take it all back. To take all these feelings of hurt that I expressed in that post above - tell her it's not true. She didn't even ask me how I felt about it. She just told me to take it back. Talk about lack of empathy - Her starting point I suppose is that 'you shouldn't feel hurt, because it makes me feel bad, makes me feel that I am a person that can hurt others but I am not that person, I never hurt anyone, I am perfect.' Talk about lack of empathy. No she didn't apologised, no she didn't empathise with my pain, she didn't show compassion, she only cared about herself.  

Anyway. I said no. I said that this is how I feel. I am sorry if this upsets you but I will not apologise for my feelings. It felt good to stand up for my truth and respect my feelings and inner world. She kept bringing it up and insisting every once in a while to take it back and I kept saying no. She eventually stopped. Empathy and compassion are just words in a BPD world they do not really exist. And the tragic irony is that she was really into buddhism, and compassion and all that stuff. Just words... .That's my vent. Thanks for reading (incl. my ex if she's stalking)
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« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2014, 03:24:18 AM »

I used to ask my xwife to put herself my shoes, or in anyone elses. To see things from someone else's perspective. She said it outright; she didn't think that was "her job".

When we were in counseling she was (naturally) asked the question how this or that made someone feel. She broke down crying. Said it wasn't fair to ask questions like that.

Lucky she is not a of a violent nature, or it is easy to see how someone like her would end up in jail. These people lack some basic functions for sure.
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IceQueenSunday

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« Reply #8 on: September 07, 2014, 04:41:13 AM »

In 27+ years of marriage to my BPDw I never got an apology for anything. Empathy? Forget it! I really don't believe they are capable.

See my ex would apologise after arguments because he knew I wouldn't speak to him unless he said sorry I guess but it was just a word, I don't believe he meant it at all. It was just a means to an end?
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freedom33
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« Reply #9 on: September 07, 2014, 04:48:16 AM »

See my ex would apologise after arguments because he knew I wouldn't speak to him unless he said sorry

To be honest this doesn't sound healthy for either of you.   

From my experience BPDs never apologise and if they do it comes with a BUT i.e. excusing themselves. I am sorry so and so but (and you usually but means it was your fault). Inability to assume responsibility for their actions is a hallmark feature of pwBPD. They just lack insight.
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« Reply #10 on: September 07, 2014, 05:05:15 AM »

No it's not healthy, I fully understand that but at the time my mind wasn't in a very healthy state. I guess my reasoning was that when he apologised he understood that being aggressive in my face was wrong, hurting me was wrong etc. I wasn't willing to speak to someone who would do that without remorse but I know now even the sorry's weren't real? And tbh yes they did always have a 'but' included. 'Im sorry but you' etc 
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« Reply #11 on: September 07, 2014, 05:27:10 AM »

And sorry I should have explained here that I meant after extreme rages not just every day discussions or disagreements. X
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« Reply #12 on: September 07, 2014, 05:45:53 AM »

The first time i noticed her lack of empathy it came as a shock. She had a week full of plans, so i couldn't see her. I told her, i would miss her. Her response: "So what?". So cold. 2nd time i noticed it was when i mentioned our anniversary, she responded by telling me i sounded like a woman. No regard of my feelings whatsoever. After our breakup her lack of empathy became more and more noticeable.(especially when i found out she might have BPD). I told her she hurt me a great deal, she couldn't care less. She felt guilty for breaking up, she really did, even cried when she broke up, but probably because she was mad at herself for failing once again.(its all about her!).

I also noticed the lack of empathy towards others. We work together, and in the past few weeks i noticed she doesn't care about the opinion of coworkers anymore. A coworker of mine has a chair for her back problems that shouldn't be adjusted. My ex accidentally sat on her chair and adjusted the chair. Something that can happen to anyone, however when the coworker came in she wanted the chair back, and my ex gave her the chair back while moping, and asked the coworker if she wanted to have the whole desk and the computer as well. Man, such resentment. Later on she told me, the coworker could cry in a corner, because she was being a pussy.  

Yeah they don't really care about anyone, but themselves. On the surface they all seem to be caring so much, but i think they only do that, so they will be perceived by others as a kind and warm person, so they will not feel left out.
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freedom33
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« Reply #13 on: September 07, 2014, 06:07:24 AM »

Yeah they don't really care about anyone, but themselves. On the surface they all seem to be caring so much, but i think they only do that, so they will be perceived by others as a kind and warm person, so they will not feel left out.

Beware of BPDs bearing gifts, be them in kind or in material form. These gifts are conditional and there will be payback when you are painted black. Nothing is given from free. The price you are forced to pay is at least a 'pound of flesh'. I have stopped accepting favours or gifts from her towards the end. She was trying to force her caring and her favours that I didn't need on me and I was like 'no thanks'.

Man I feel like sh1t today... .I feel like a total loser... .I can't focus on my work and I don't feel like going out. What a torture... .Another challenging day to go through.
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« Reply #14 on: September 07, 2014, 07:57:46 AM »

Yeah they don't really care about anyone, but themselves. On the surface they all seem to be caring so much, but i think they only do that, so they will be perceived by others as a kind and warm person, so they will not feel left out.

Beware of BPDs bearing gifts, be them in kind or in material form. These gifts are conditional and there will be payback when you are painted black. Nothing is given from free. The price you are forced to pay is at least a 'pound of flesh'. I have stopped accepting favours or gifts from her towards the end. She was trying to force her caring and her favours that I didn't need on me and I was like 'no thanks'.

Man I feel like sh1t today... .I feel like a total loser... .I can't focus on my work and I don't feel like going out. What a torture... .Another challenging day to go through.

We all have those days.  Try to go easy on yourself, as if you have the flu really.  I had to do this for months, I had just enough to go to work, take care of my kids and home, and then I went to bed early.  Bedtime was my favorite time of the day, I took sleep aids and my brain could finally rest... .

It's hard.  It seems so unfair.  I know I recently spoke to my Ex from a year ago.  Haven't spoken for 6 months.  His life is great.  He is in great shape, dating someone else, the job I helped him get is going awesome... .all in all life is grand.  Meanwhile, back at the ranch, I have been ever so slowly, getting back to the business of life.  Stupidly; I asked why, because like most of us, I got no closure.  His response?  I was an awesome girlfriend and partner.  He could not have asked for a better person.  And he was sorry he hurt me but he isn't ready to settle down with one person.  He doesn't DO deep feeling relationships.  This from the guy that rushed me into a DEEP relationship when I was the one wanting to go slow.  He's dating someone else now, and I know for a fact, like with me, he is still on the dating sites AND trolling online and through all tech related sites that offer the chance to text and IM people. 

Once, after the end came, he said something to me that was keen insight on who he is.  He said he NEEDED the attention of MANY women.  It made him feel good about himself when the "winked" at him or emailed him to say he was cute on the dating sites."  This from a 43 year old man.  Sad, really.

Luckily for me, he is a "hit it once and done" guy.  He has never gone back to recycle anyone.  We did briefly, but I believe he did it cause I pushed so hard for it and he felt guilty.  In the end, he just couldn't do it, juggling me and multiple encounters proved too hard.

I think he feels sorrow for how he treats people.  Only because he wants everyone to think highly of him.  But he himself told me he is incapable of FEELING deeply... .
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« Reply #15 on: September 07, 2014, 08:20:15 AM »

When I was sick was when the lack of empathy was most apparent to me. I wrote on another thread that I had taken him on a VERY lavish vacation for Easter. After a night out including dinner and casino, I was doubled over in pain. I was up all night sick in the bathroom. He got up and got dressed in the middle of the night in a huff and saying he was going back downstairs to the casino because I wasn't being affectionate in bed. I was passing a kidney stone! About a month later, I had another terrible problem: a miscarriage when I'm way past my prime for childbearing, so it was painful and dangerous. For some reason, he was angry that I was sick and wouldn't speak to me for days; I suffered alone. Finally, I got out of bed and went to a movie with him and his sons. My only request was that I sit next to the exit in case I got sick and needed to leave quickly. He was furious because it wasn't the best view for him. He got up with his sons and left me alone. I have many more examples which are mind blowing--but what about my illness or impairment seemed to be such a trigger for him?
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« Reply #16 on: September 07, 2014, 08:20:28 AM »

Mine would go on and on and on and on and on about his own ailments.  He pretty much ignored me and changed the conversation back to him the one time I mentioned my own ONE ailment.  When he made reference to it he said "I hope your 'thing' is okay."  My thing, what the heck?  He basically couldn't be bothered to remember the name of the ONE ailment I mentioned about myself, yet expected me to know about every medication he was taking for his plethora of issues, both mental & physical.  
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« Reply #17 on: September 07, 2014, 08:28:21 AM »

And yes LOLSTER! I had to listen to him ad nauseum every time he had a sniffle. He is a frequent flyer at a local hospital emergency room for the most innocuous things. So maybe, I just answered my own question. ONLY THEY ARE ENTITLED TO SPECIAL TREATMENT when they are ill; our illnesses are a distraction and inconvenience for them--it distracts us from our primary job;  catering to their every whim and NEED!
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« Reply #18 on: September 07, 2014, 08:34:41 AM »

Opening my heart and telling about things that trouble me was never an option for me. My wife would get all jittery and anxious, telling that I have serious problems (which I had not) and I need to seek help (i e instead of bothering her).

This was her standard response to anyone who admitted some type of weakness; why don't they seek help?

Towards the end I got so fed up with this so I explained to her like it was: normal people have problems, and they help themselves and they help eachother. Only special people like you ___ up their lives royally on a regular basis with no regard for the consequences and then go see a professional and ask them how to sort it out.

(I phrased the last sentence a little friendlier actually).
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« Reply #19 on: September 07, 2014, 09:47:40 AM »

Mine was deeply concerned whenever i had to see a doctor or when i was sick, she was scared i would die. I found that odd.

And she was afraid i would kill myself when she broke up with me.  Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #20 on: September 07, 2014, 10:10:30 AM »

See my ex would apologise after arguments because he knew I wouldn't speak to him unless he said sorry

To be honest this doesn't sound healthy for either of you.   

From my experience BPDs never apologise and if they do it comes with a BUT i.e. excusing themselves. I am sorry so and so but (and you usually but means it was your fault). Inability to assume responsibility for their actions is a hallmark feature of pwBPD. They just lack insight.

My expBPD said "Im sorry" as a defense mechanism, much like a child would say upon getting scolded by a parent.  I'm sorry would be said to me without really listening to what I was saying or how I was feeling as a result of his hurtful actions. Like a mantra with no meaning. Just words.

When we say we are sorry and are genuine about that, we change the behavior that was hurtful.

This is impossible to a pBPD bc the disorder is too complicated and great.

I felt he said I'm sorry to avoid abandonment only.  Not for any other reason.

They lack empathy, indeed.

Every interaction with my expBPD held the words "I". 

"I"... .am feeling sick, have a horrible headache, have a bad stomachache, didn't sleep well at all, don't feel right, feel sad and alone, am scared, am hungry, wish you were here, don't want to see you anymore, know you will leave me, know you are cheating on me, can't trust you, can't live without you, have never felt so loved by anyone, have no one who understands me as you do, need you, can't see you anymore, have to figure myself out, don't know what I want in life, can't see you anymore.

This was my r/s with this person.

Never once, about "me" and in looking back, my needs were always discounted. Idealization was the only time that I felt an equal sense of mutual caring.  Thereafter, it was always about him.  Clearly, the recycles are about them. Not about us.

In the immediate time post abandonment, I experienced a great number of major life issues well known to him, one of which was a major illness that put my mother in the ICU.  He never once reached out in anyway. Not one. To extend an inch of empathy or support. Never inquired with mutual friends on my wellbeing.  Still has not.

What does that say about (lack of) empathy?

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myself
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« Reply #21 on: September 07, 2014, 12:45:01 PM »

Tornadoes don't feel bad about their paths of destruction, either.

They also don't turn back to help clean up, or use the time for introspection.

Why? Because they're just not wired that way.

Yes, humans and tornadoes are usually pretty different from each other.

BPD is like a force of nature, though, intense and out of control.

Best thing to do is stay out of the way. Batten down the hatches.

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« Reply #22 on: September 07, 2014, 12:50:36 PM »

Myself: very good metaphor. When I was younger (ages 6-18) I had almost nightly dreams about tornadoes. I lived in a part of the country where tornado warnings were common, but few, if any, actually hit. So, why my fear and constant subconscious processing of tornadoes? Hazard a guess. I was raised by BPD/ NPD father. I never understood why all those tornado dreams prior to leaving home at 18. Thank you; great insight.
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« Reply #23 on: September 07, 2014, 02:29:32 PM »

I haven't mention my BF and BPD and too exhausted to talk of it today.  I got this text from him Friday "I'm not sure what I did sorry".  I have gotten a few "non-apologies" over the years.  We broke up again today... .
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« Reply #24 on: September 07, 2014, 03:09:34 PM »

Mine was deeply concerned whenever i had to see a doctor or when i was sick, she was scared i would die. I found that odd.

And she was afraid i would kill myself when she broke up with me.  Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)

The day that she admitted to, and had supposedly ended the emotional affair, she left town for the weekend to visit family. She wouldn't answer my phone calls. There had never been a single day in our relationship that we hadn't spoken, and we went two days in a row. She sent a text telling me her phone was almost dead, and when I asked her to just call quickly to say goodnight, she told me she couldn't because she was out drinking with friends. Even for a minute? No, she said. She was too drunk. I finally got a text in the middle of the next day explaining that she had gotten separated from her friend, and had to have her mom make the half hour drive to get her before charging her phone.

I was so angry at the way she had blown me off after admitting to the emotional affair that I considered breaking up with her. But I couldn't do it. I hadn't seen her four four days, and in a panic I called her and told her we needed to talk. She was supposedly in training for her job until ten pm (?) which seemed unlikely. I told her that I was ill and just needed to know if I could trust her. She asked me if I was going to do "something stupid" and if she needed to call an ambulance. Apparently she thought I was suicidal, but couldn't be bothered to drive me there herself. I told her that I just needed to talk to her face-to-face. She refused, and then ask me again if she needed to call ambulance. I was so outraged and hurt that I simply hung up. She sent a text telling me that if I was suicidal I needed to go to the hospital. That was the last I heard from her that night, and I ended up texting her not to contact me again, and I blocked her completely on my phone.

She managed to use an email that I hadn't blocked, and told me how much she missed me, adding that she wanted to know if I was okay. That was the start of recycle number two. I asked her during this time if she would have even come to see me had I ended up in the hospital. She said probably not. At least not for the first night. She said it was all too much for her.

Ironically, after two additional recycles before finally being dumped once and for all for my replacement, I felt suicidal for the first time in my entire life.
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« Reply #25 on: September 08, 2014, 03:57:24 PM »

Beware of BPDs bearing gifts, be them in kind or in material form. These gifts are conditional and there will be payback when you are painted black. Nothing is given from free. The price you are forced to pay is at least a 'pound of flesh'. I have stopped accepting favours or gifts from her towards the end. She was trying to force her caring and her favours that I didn't need on me and I was like 'no thanks'.

When I brought up to my exwBPD that she owes still owes me $600 i loaned her to help pay for her college tuition she fired back that maybe i should pay her back the money for a 4 day trip to Florida that was a Christmas present. There's a difference between loaning someone money and a gift. I would have rather her not got that expensive gift and pay use the money to pay off some of her bills so she could help with paying the rent and food. Never got a dimiut of her for it and almost went completely broke

Man I feel like sh1t today... .I feel like a total loser... .I can't focus on my work and I don't feel like going out. What a torture... .Another challenging day to go through.

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« Reply #26 on: September 08, 2014, 03:59:45 PM »

I jacked up the last post really bad... .damn phone.  Its a mix on others quotes and stuff... .sorry about that. Just was telling about my ex's gift to Florida she wanted me to pay her back for
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« Reply #27 on: September 08, 2014, 04:09:07 PM »

:-). That is typical BlackandBlue. Here's another one. We had plans to go on holidays next week and we booked our airplane tickets for the trip separately. When I broke up with her 3 weeks ago and went NC she sent me an email saying that if I am serious about going ahead with the break up I should refund her $340 for her flights next week. She said she doesn't want to go alone, she was doing the trip to be with me and she doesn't have money to pay for solo accomodation. Speechless. Didn't even bother to respond.
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Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Relationship status: apart 18 months, 12 months push pull 6 months seperated properly, 4 months k own about BPD
Posts: 865


« Reply #28 on: September 08, 2014, 07:55:42 PM »

AHAHAHAH at airfares. 

I would just go on the holiday solo and forget her.  Do what's best for yourself. 

Mine borrows 4K from my father and when I mentioned I was paying him back and it really wasn't my job, her response, "That's not my concern, he is your father."  What the heck, you borrowed the money woman ?
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michel71
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Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 535


« Reply #29 on: September 08, 2014, 10:26:09 PM »

There are more, I don't want to be too specific, some of them you could pick if I wrote them and she read this board.  

I have this fear as well. That she could be here in these forums, stalking me, reading all this. She knows that I know that she has strong traits of BPD (and she knows it herself although she won't admit it) and knows that I have posted a post during one our past break ups somewhere else in the internet. I vented quite a lot - not in disrespectful or malicious way - in an honest heartfelt way. (this is it the post she read if you are interested https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=223894.msg12422019#msg12422019). I used to post here with a different name that she knew I used generally so that is what she used to google me and find me. And she did find this post above at another website. I hope she did not find it here as well but I asked the moderators here to change my username to Guest29 just in case.

At any rate, coming back to the topic of empathy, when I allowed myself to go back the last time it was all fine for a week and then she brought up the fact that she has read my post and she was insisting I take it all back. To take all these feelings of hurt that I expressed in that post above - tell her it's not true. She didn't even ask me how I felt about it. She just told me to take it back. Talk about lack of empathy - Her starting point I suppose is that 'you shouldn't feel hurt, because it makes me feel bad, makes me feel that I am a person that can hurt others but I am not that person, I never hurt anyone, I am perfect.' Talk about lack of empathy. No she didn't apologised, no she didn't empathise with my pain, she didn't show compassion, she only cared about herself.  

Anyway. I said no. I said that this is how I feel. I am sorry if this upsets you but I will not apologise for my feelings. It felt good to stand up for my truth and respect my feelings and inner world. She kept bringing it up and insisting every once in a while to take it back and I kept saying no. She eventually stopped. Empathy and compassion are just words in a BPD world they do not really exist. And the tragic irony is that she was really into buddhism, and compassion and all that stuff. Just words... .That's my vent. Thanks for reading (incl. my ex if she's stalking)

Funny I could have posted this one tonight! The other day my uBPDw hacked into my iphone. Found two emails I had sent to close friends detailing the drama of the relationship that, in my opinion, was at a close. She printed out the emails and gave them to me after repeatedly asking me if I had talked to anybody else about our relationship, like any friends. I of course said NO. So she showed me the emails and began to cry hysterically. These emails concerned me pouring out MY soul. She saw them as trashing her. I did apologize for lying to her and felt so awful. She told me that to make it right I would have to email them a "retraction". Initially I said "yes", then came to my senses.

She has been acting very strange lately. I think she is putting together some sort of plan to discredit me or make me look unstable. I am watching my back.
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