Painting the ex black - healthy?

[Beware of Junk Psychology...]

Split

Although it is good to work through the hurt from our pwBPD, I think it diverts us from the original topic of codependency.  When we constantly shift the blame on the pwBPD, isn't that the same as us painting the disordered person black?

yes, you should paint people that abuse you "black" and even take severe legal action. It's not the victims fault. Disordered or not they do understand their actions.

[hurting300]

Split

Although it is good to work through the hurt from our pwBPD, I think it diverts us from the original topic of codependency.  When we constantly shift the blame on the pwBPD, isn't that the same as us painting the disordered person black?

yes, you should paint people that abuse you "black" and even take severe legal action. It's not the victims fault. Disordered or not they do understand their actions.

[Skip]

Although it is good to work through the hurt from our pwBPD, I think it diverts us from the original topic of codependency.  When we constantly shift the blame on the pwBPD, isn't that the same as us painting the disordered person black?

yes, you should paint people that abuse you "black" and even take severe legal action. It's not the victims fault. Disordered or not they do understand their actions.

Only if emotional immaturity is your game.  

Stay centered.  You'll heal faster.

[hurting300]

Although it is good to work through the hurt from our pwBPD, I think it diverts us from the original topic of codependency.  When we constantly shift the blame on the pwBPD, isn't that the same as us painting the disordered person black?

yes, you should paint people that abuse you "black" and even take severe legal action. It's not the victims fault. Disordered or not they do understand their actions.

Only if emotional immaturity is your game.  

Stay centered.  You'll heal faster.

oh sorry, I didn't know punishment for abusers was immature. We should not blame EVERYTHING on them right. But nothing is wrong with swift even handed punishment.

[hurting300]

 

[NonAverageJoe]

Analyze and accept reality. Don't interpret. That is healthy.

[Skip]

oh sorry, I didn't know punishment for abusers was immature. We should not blame EVERYTHING on them right. But nothing is wrong with swift even handed punishment.

Before giving this advise to anyone, it mighty help to examine it in your own life.

Your ex is the mother of your child.  Isn't your goal to have access to your child at some point and co-parent?

How is painting her black going to work?  What swift even handed punishment are you contemplating?

[TheDude]

yes, you should paint people that abuse you "black" and even take severe legal action. It's not the victims fault. Disordered or not they do understand their actions.

This begs the question - do you think that directing any of that their way will then make them understand their actions? Or isn't it more likely to just perpetuate the cycle?

[hurting300]

oh sorry, I didn't know punishment for abusers was immature. We should not blame EVERYTHING on them right. But nothing is wrong with swift even handed punishment.

Before giving this advise to anyone, it mighty help to examine it in your own life.

Your ex is the mother of your child.  Isn't your goal to have access to your child at some point and co-parent?

How is painting her black going to work?  What swift even handed punishment are you contemplating?

you have a good point skip. Did you know she never once said "I love you" to our baby. Her grandmother is raising the baby? Unfortunately we have to serve the mother. See that's why when you get attacked or murdered at the end of the trail you get to have a victim impact statement. I'll always believe abusers need to punished. Its going to be hard for me to Co parent with an abusive sociopath. Be centered is dead on though it's just hard at times.

[hurting300]

yes, you should paint people that abuse you "black" and even take severe legal action. It's not the victims fault. Disordered or not they do understand their actions.

This begs the question - do you think that directing any of that their way will then make them understand their actions? Or isn't it more likely to just perpetuate the cycle?

no it wouldn't. Even the dumbest criminal in the world would realize it's not worth it. She thinks she is untouchable. She's running because she knows what's going to happen in a court of law. I've never had these problems before in my life. I wished I had never said hello to her in the grocery store.

[guy4caligirl]

I feel with you Hurting ... .it's the anger that you have towards her that makes you think that way , they can easily press your wrong bottom  , Justice is coming to them God is watching , they will get their punishment , sooner or later , being borderline is already a constant suffering , they are not happy and they will never be , be happy, love your child , I hate injustice you probably do to. It's ok to paint us black and treat us like nothing but god forbid if we wish them bad .

Is that justice ?

[hurting300]

I feel with you Hurting ... .it's the anger that you have towards her that makes you think that way , they can easily press your wrong bottom  , Justice is coming to them God is watching , they will get their punishment , sooner or later , being borderline is already a constant suffering , they are not happy and they will never be , be happy, love your child , I hate injustice you probably do to. It's ok to paint us black and treat us like nothing but god forbid if we wish them bad .

Is that justice ?

no it's not justice. My justice will come when my attorney's melt her down on the stand. They have no right treating us the way they do. I wish NO harm to her. I still pray for her, but justice is justice. In my state you can not use a personality disorder as an insanity defense. You clearly know what you are doing. And she'll know soon.

[guy4caligirl]

I wish you the best you have always inspired me thank you and god bless !

[hurting300]

I wish you the best you have always inspired me thank you and god bless !

don't hate your ex man, don't wish nothing bad on her... .Just let her go and forgive yourself for allowing her to abuse you. She honestly can't help it. But, you have a constitutional right to defend yourself against harm.

[guy4caligirl]

NO don't get me wrong Hurting I still love her and I find it hard to play games all i want is to get her in treatment and I will take care of everything even she did what she did , she needs help , she is not that bad that's why I still have hope , I went NC cause I have no other choice but I know she still do think of me .And it's my pleasure that she does .

Again every case is unique !

[hurting300]

NO don't get me wrong Hurting I still love her and I find it hard to play games all i want is to get her in treatment and I will take care of everything even she did what she did , she needs help , she is not that bad that's why I still have hope , I went NC cause I have no other choice but I know she still do think of me .And it's my pleasure that she does .

Again every case is unique !

yes every case is not cut and dry. My ex is a human and I get that. She's never had anyone come down on her, all her exes said yes ma'am to everything. Not me . She won't get away with it. She can't, it's my responsibility now to stop her.

[Ripped Heart]

hurting, I know exactly how frustrating this can be and how it makes you feel. Why should the victims of abuse suffer while the abusers walk around to continue their abuse? It can be very frustrating but as always, we have no control over the actions of others, only they do.

There is nothing I like to see more than an abuser being brought to task for their actions and part of our anger stems from the fact that in a lot of cases, that doesn't happen. Especially if we are the abused. I went through it with my exBPD/NPDw where I was physically, emotionally and mentally abused for 2 years before I finally managed to get out, with the help of a tremendous therapist.

However, there is always a difference of opinion as to what constitutes as punishment. An eye for an eye? If there are children involved, what kind of impact does that have on them overall? Mirroring their abuse back at them plays right into their hands and makes it easy for them to launch a smear campaign against you and there is nothing you are able to say or do to defend that.

The best way of punishing an abuser is by showing them they have no control and being centred within yourself. Why? Because you don't have to punish them, they do it all by themselves. It tears them up to know they have no more control over you. It doesn't take away the scars or mean you have to be "best friends", you kill them with kindness.

I have an issue with my exgf in that she stopped me having access to my children as soon as she found herself a new guy. It's her pattern because she did the same thing with me to the father of her other children the moment I came on the scene. A few friends that have known her for years suspect she has a PD, I was with her for 10 years and she doesn't meet the criteria but she is definitely emotionally unstable.

In the beginning, I was devastated at being cut out of my children's lives and the more I fought, the more difficult she made it and the more I think she enjoyed it because she was "punishing" me for leaving. To be honest, I put up with the drinking and gambling, the not working, not contributing to anything it was like raising another child. In the end, I moved out just around the corner to give us some space and work through our issues. It was a year of trying but it constantly felt only one of us was making the effort. She pretended to be off the drink and gambling but all she was doing was hiding it and that's when I called time on the r/s. Her punishment of me through our entire r/s was because of what her ex did to her when he ran off with another woman.

This was a woman, who even after our r/s ended kept on wanting to torture me and used the children as weapons to do that. It almost caused a breakdown in the end and I suffered emotionally and financially as a result. Eventually, when I learned that was what she wanted and expected, I changed tact. If there was an issue, especially around the kids, I would offer to help. What I showed her and what I felt towards her for her actions were very different things. Eventually she started to open up more but still used the kids as weapons. I picked and chose my battles, always supported my children financially despite being stopped from seeing them. Helped out when they have had schools trips or if they have ever needed anything and generally became the nice guy. This has driven her insane and the nastier she is towards me, the nicer I am towards her.

Roll on to next month, access to my children is going to court and she is in for a hiding from the judge. I didn't go straight to court, first tried to work things out between us, she didn't want to do that. Next came mediation (twice) she messed that around too by cancelling appointments and not turning up. Then came the decision from lawyers and mediator to take it to court, she didn't like that. Instead, she is backtracking and I've been able to see my children several times this past month. Her lies have unraveled because she has youngest d4 calling new guy daddy and telling her that's her dad and she is pleading for me to stop this going to court.

She can't tell them I'm abusive, because I never have. She can't tell them I'm a threat to the children because she knows I'm not and the other thing is that I have a photo her sister posted on Facebook of her giving our daughter (then 2) a bottle of Vodka Blue. She has been there both times I've seen the children this month and seen their reaction to me, so can't even use that. She has tried to provoke me in emails and I've responded with kindness so she doesn't even have that. It's destroying her that through this web of deceit and destruction, I'm still smiling and rising above it all. It's still going to court because I want fairness for the children and the removal of control from her.

So the best form of punishment against an abuser is to be yourself and show them they no longer have any control over you.

[Rise]

I'll always believe abusers need to punished.

This does raise the question, if our exes deserve to be punished, what is the appropriate punishment?

[guy4caligirl]

My case is similar to yours I am the only one that stood my ground with her she knows it for five years I don't lick ... .

I say what's on my mind and stand with what's right , that's why she never got my back if she was in the wrong, I have faith , and I am still standing strong few bad days but hey it's a process isn't it ?

[hurting300]

I'll always believe abusers need to punished.

This does raise the question, if our exes deserve to be punished, what is the appropriate punishment?

well if they hit you, they should go to jail. If they steal from you, sue them.

[hurting300]

hurting, I know exactly how frustrating this can be and how it makes you feel. Why should the victims of abuse suffer while the abusers walk around to continue their abuse? It can be very frustrating but as always, we have no control over the actions of others, only they do.

There is nothing I like to see more than an abuser being brought to task for their actions and part of our anger stems from the fact that in a lot of cases, that doesn't happen. Especially if we are the abused. I went through it with my exBPD/NPDw where I was physically, emotionally and mentally abused for 2 years before I finally managed to get out, with the help of a tremendous therapist.

However, there is always a difference of opinion as to what constitutes as punishment. An eye for an eye? If there are children involved, what kind of impact does that have on them overall? Mirroring their abuse back at them plays right into their hands and makes it easy for them to launch a smear campaign against you and there is nothing you are able to say or do to defend that.

The best way of punishing an abuser is by showing them they have no control and being centred within yourself. Why? Because you don't have to punish them, they do it all by themselves. It tears them up to know they have no more control over you. It doesn't take away the scars or mean you have to be "best friends", you kill them with kindness.

I have an issue with my exgf in that she stopped me having access to my children as soon as she found herself a new guy. It's her pattern because she did the same thing with me to the father of her other children the moment I came on the scene. A few friends that have known her for years suspect she has a PD, I was with her for 10 years and she doesn't meet the criteria but she is definitely emotionally unstable.

In the beginning, I was devastated at being cut out of my children's lives and the more I fought, the more difficult she made it and the more I think she enjoyed it because she was "punishing" me for leaving. To be honest, I put up with the drinking and gambling, the not working, not contributing to anything it was like raising another child. In the end, I moved out just around the corner to give us some space and work through our issues. It was a year of trying but it constantly felt only one of us was making the effort. She pretended to be off the drink and gambling but all she was doing was hiding it and that's when I called time on the r/s. Her punishment of me through our entire r/s was because of what her ex did to her when he ran off with another woman.

This was a woman, who even after our r/s ended kept on wanting to torture me and used the children as weapons to do that. It almost caused a breakdown in the end and I suffered emotionally and financially as a result. Eventually, when I learned that was what she wanted and expected, I changed tact. If there was an issue, especially around the kids, I would offer to help. What I showed her and what I felt towards her for her actions were very different things. Eventually she started to open up more but still used the kids as weapons. I picked and chose my battles, always supported my children financially despite being stopped from seeing them. Helped out when they have had schools trips or if they have ever needed anything and generally became the nice guy. This has driven her insane and the nastier she is towards me, the nicer I am towards her.

Roll on to next month, access to my children is going to court and she is in for a hiding from the judge. I didn't go straight to court, first tried to work things out between us, she didn't want to do that. Next came mediation (twice) she messed that around too by cancelling appointments and not turning up. Then came the decision from lawyers and mediator to take it to court, she didn't like that. Instead, she is backtracking and I've been able to see my children several times this past month. Her lies have unraveled because she has youngest d4 calling new guy daddy and telling her that's her dad and she is pleading for me to stop this going to court.

She can't tell them I'm abusive, because I never have. She can't tell them I'm a threat to the children because she knows I'm not and the other thing is that I have a photo her sister posted on Facebook of her giving our daughter (then 2) a bottle of Vodka Blue. She has been there both times I've seen the children this month and seen their reaction to me, so can't even use that. She has tried to provoke me in emails and I've responded with kindness so she doesn't even have that. It's destroying her that through this web of deceit and destruction, I'm still smiling and rising above it all. It's still going to court because I want fairness for the children and the removal of control from her.

So the best form of punishment against an abuser is to be yourself and show them they no longer have any control over you.

I don't feel like I'm mirroring abuse back at her. She lied and talked about me behind my back to other people, you have no idea how bad this is. She was never happy with anything. I'm not a mean person, I have a huge heart. I've never felt these feelings before In my life. I volunteer my time and donate money to charity. She wrecked a good man. She wrecked her deceased ex. I can not let her do it again and if that means a brutal court battle and forced therapy so be it. She would be so amazing if she got help.

[Skip]

no it's not justice. My justice will come when my attorney's melt her down on the stand. They have no right treating us the way they do. I wish NO harm to her. I still pray for her, but justice is justice. In my state you can not use a personality disorder as an insanity defense. You clearly know what you are doing. And she'll know soon.

hurting300

You have a choice.  Attend to your child or attend to your wounded ego.

As wise man would stay as Teflon as possible and know that with persistence and patience, you can lay a major role in your child's life.  Sounds like she can't attend to the child now, so you may even end up with primary custody.

You don't have to melt her down on a witness stand to get access.  Family court will give it to you.

However, if you escalate this into high conflict - be ready for year of heartache and lots of $$ or burning out and walking away from the child.

Fair?  No.

You have a choice.  Attend to your child or attend to your wounded ego.

It's your choice.

But please, before telling others to invest heavily and attend to their wounded ego - stop and help them understand their choice... .

Attend to your child or attend to your wounded ego?

Heal or fight?

Bitter or wiser?

If you take one lesson from bpdfamily its this - the choice is not an eye for an eye - it's detachment, picking up the pieces, and going on to live well.

well if they hit you, they should go to jail. If they steal from you, sue them.

Know anyone with a child that has done well with this?  See if you can find one on this site. 

[guy4caligirl]

hurting, I know exactly how frustrating this can be and how it makes you feel. Why should the victims of abuse suffer while the abusers walk around to continue their abuse? It can be very frustrating but as always, we have no control over the actions of others, only they do.

There is nothing I like to see more than an abuser being brought to task for their actions and part of our anger stems from the fact that in a lot of cases, that doesn't happen. Especially if we are the abused. I went through it with my exBPD/NPDw where I was physically, emotionally and mentally abused for 2 years before I finally managed to get out, with the help of a tremendous therapist.

However, there is always a difference of opinion as to what constitutes as punishment. An eye for an eye? If there are children involved, what kind of impact does that have on them overall? Mirroring their abuse back at them plays right into their hands and makes it easy for them to launch a smear campaign against you and there is nothing you are able to say or do to defend that.

The best way of punishing an abuser is by showing them they have no control and being centred within yourself. Why? Because you don't have to punish them, they do it all by themselves. It tears them up to know they have no more control over you. It doesn't take away the scars or mean you have to be "best friends", you kill them with kindness.

I have an issue with my exgf in that she stopped me having access to my children as soon as she found herself a new guy. It's her pattern because she did the same thing with me to the father of her other children the moment I came on the scene. A few friends that have known her for years suspect she has a PD, I was with her for 10 years and she doesn't meet the criteria but she is definitely emotionally unstable.

In the beginning, I was devastated at being cut out of my children's lives and the more I fought, the more difficult she made it and the more I think she enjoyed it because she was "punishing" me for leaving. To be honest, I put up with the drinking and gambling, the not working, not contributing to anything it was like raising another child. In the end, I moved out just around the corner to give us some space and work through our issues. It was a year of trying but it constantly felt only one of us was making the effort. She pretended to be off the drink and gambling but all she was doing was hiding it and that's when I called time on the r/s. Her punishment of me through our entire r/s was because of what her ex did to her when he ran off with another woman.

This was a woman, who even after our r/s ended kept on wanting to torture me and used the children as weapons to do that. It almost caused a breakdown in the end and I suffered emotionally and financially as a result. Eventually, when I learned that was what she wanted and expected, I changed tact. If there was an issue, especially around the kids, I would offer to help. What I showed her and what I felt towards her for her actions were very different things. Eventually she started to open up more but still used the kids as weapons. I picked and chose my battles, always supported my children financially despite being stopped from seeing them. Helped out when they have had schools trips or if they have ever needed anything and generally became the nice guy. This has driven her insane and the nastier she is towards me, the nicer I am towards her.

Roll on to next month, access to my children is going to court and she is in for a hiding from the judge. I didn't go straight to court, first tried to work things out between us, she didn't want to do that. Next came mediation (twice) she messed that around too by cancelling appointments and not turning up. Then came the decision from lawyers and mediator to take it to court, she didn't like that. Instead, she is backtracking and I've been able to see my children several times this past month. Her lies have unraveled because she has youngest d4 calling new guy daddy and telling her that's her dad and she is pleading for me to stop this going to court.

She can't tell them I'm abusive, because I never have. She can't tell them I'm a threat to the children because she knows I'm not and the other thing is that I have a photo her sister posted on Facebook of her giving our daughter (then 2) a bottle of Vodka Blue. She has been there both times I've seen the children this month and seen their reaction to me, so can't even use that. She has tried to provoke me in emails and I've responded with kindness so she doesn't even have that. It's destroying her that through this web of deceit and destruction, I'm still smiling and rising above it all. It's still going to court because I want fairness for the children and the removal of control from her.

So the best form of punishment against an abuser is to be yourself and show them they no longer have any control over you.

"They have no control over you "

I do understand Where you're coming from , I Do not think this control thing is really the case , we Are hurting and miserable they are not period .

[hurting300]

no it's not justice. My justice will come when my attorney's melt her down on the stand. They have no right treating us the way they do. I wish NO harm to her. I still pray for her, but justice is justice. In my state you can not use a personality disorder as an insanity defense. You clearly know what you are doing. And she'll know soon.

hurting300

You have a choice.  Attend to your child or attend to your wounded ego.

As wise man would stay as Teflon as possible and know that with persistence and patience, you can lay a major role in your child's life.  Sounds like she can't attend to the child now, so you may even end up with primary custody.

You don't have to melt her down on a witness stand to get access.  Family court will give it to you.

However, if you escalate this into high conflict - be ready for year of heartache and lots of $$ or burning out and walking away from the child.

Fair?  No.

You have a choice.  Attend to your child or attend to your wounded ego.

It's your choice.

But please, before telling others to invest heavily and attend to their wounded ego - stop and help them understand their choice... .

Attend to your child or attend to your wounded ego?

Heal or fight?

Bitter or wiser?

If you take one lesson from bpdfamily its this - the choice is not an eye for an eye - it's detachment, picking up the pieces, and going on to live well.

well if they hit you, they should go to jail. If they steal from you, sue them.

Know anyone with a child that has done well with this?

yes you are completely right with this. I just get so angry. But my ego? My feelings are just hurt is all. Because I could never do someone that way. I just want her to be better. I know she can do it.

[Rise]

I'll always believe abusers need to punished.

This does raise the question, if our exes deserve to be punished, what is the appropriate punishment?

well if they hit you, they should go to jail. If they steal from you, sue them.

For the record, I have no problem with people having a desire for justice to be served. I get it, and I think it's a rather natural response to being wronged. But what about those of us that have simply suffered emotionally? I've just never been able to grasp what form that justice is supposed to take. How do you get justice for someone breaking your heart? How do you punish someone for treating you badly? What are the consequences supposed to be? Is there even a reasonable punishment for it all?

[hurting300]

I'll always believe abusers need to punished.

This does raise the question, if our exes deserve to be punished, what is the appropriate punishment?

well if they hit you, they should go to jail. If they steal from you, sue them.

For the record, I have no problem with people having a desire for justice to be served. I get it, and I think it's a rather natural response to being wronged. But what about those of us that have simply suffered emotionally? I've just never been able to grasp what form that justice is supposed to take. How do you get justice for someone breaking your heart? How do you punish someone for treating you badly? What are the consequences supposed to be? Is there even a reasonable punishment for it all?

you just have to live well. If they did that type of punishment to you all you can do is beat them up. And come on that's immature.

[TheDude]

How do you get justice for someone breaking your heart? How do you punish someone for treating you badly? What are the consequences supposed to be? Is there even a reasonable punishment for it all?

I tend to think just being who they are in the first place is more than punishment enough... .

[hurting300]

It's been nine months since I've laid eyes on my child. Guys this is tough business. I hurt everyday of my life now. All the money and success i have now, I would give it all up for my baby. My ex has no idea I hit it big in business... She probably still thinks I work in a mill making ends meet. But I would give it all up for the child. It's going to take one hell Of a fight to win this war. And really at the end the family is still broken. I carry a lot of guilt sometimes about things.

[Skip]

I believe in justice. I also know the street rules. In the eye for an eye game, he who cares least wins.

I for one am never entering into the ring with someone who is impulsive and doesn't think of the downstream consequences.

[hurting300]

I believe in justice. I also know the street rules. In the eye for an eye game, he who cares least wins.

I for one am never entering into the ring with someone who is impulsive and doesn't think of the downstream consequences.

well said.