Triangulation/Reengaement and Out in less than 8 hours.

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

So, last night I was driving home after having dinner with my brother and actually feeling good about myself.



I get less than a mile from home and my phone starts to ring. "Ex" popped up in big red letters. I hit the "silence" button so it just rang on her end.



Then I get a text. "If you want your ___ I can put it outside otherwise I will just throw it out... ."



I didn't respond instantly as my heart had started to pound from the phone call. I didn't actually respond at all. I spoke with my roommate and we drove over there, he walked up to the door and got my stuff. It took a few trips and I reminded him to ask about certain things. I got them.



I went home. I start to unload my stuff and I see that one bag is blatantly her stuff.



I took the bait hook line and sinker.



"Thanks. One of these bags is full of your stuff. Perfume, body wash, candles, childhood photos etc. I can bring it back or throw it away."



A few minutes later I get, "Oh ___ sorry, you can just throw it away but hey I forgot to give you your wooden toolbox and the stuff in it."



A few more minutes pass by, "Let me know if you're coming otherwise I will just put it in the trash compactor."



Then finally, "Alright I didn't hear anything so I'm going to bed."



I was already on my way over there at that point. I didn't plan to talk to her and I didn't plan anything. I just went. I walked up to the door and I knocked. She answered I went to hand her the bag and she said, "It's over here."



I walked inside and grabbed it. I made my way to the door and the dog ran outside she asked me to help her get the dog. I called it and the dog came to me instantly. I went to leave and she was looking at me and smiling. I recognized the smile and told myself to go but I opened my mouth and said, ":)o you want to talk?"



Her eyes lit up and said yes. I went inside and at first I just sat down I wasn't thinking straight but I wasn't incredibly emotional.



I forget exactly how it all played out but the major gist of the conversation at first was the BS. Me asking why are you returning my stuff now. Her responding that she thought she was still blocked. I told her, "I unblocked you so I'd stop checking for an apology that would never come."



Then there was crying and half-truths. There was her telling me they're not together. That he wants to be but she wants to be single. Her telling me she's sorry that she handled everything poorly but she wasn't happy. Her swearing it never got physical until after I left and it still hadn't gone all the way (the punch line for this comes later).



I started crying and bashing her hard. No holds bar. She took it and started crying back and saying things like, ":)on't you think I just want to hold you and kiss you."



Her saying things like, "You don't want me back. We can't come back from this. What do you want me to do beg for you back?"



This went on and on and eventually the conversation was more emotional BS than relevant issue.



Eventually I hugged her. I even almost kissed her. She started being playful and coy. She gave me cookies and we ended up laying down together. I held her. I was in extreme denial and then I broke down again and started to go but then I didn't want to.



We started watching a stupid show on TV. She asked me about my dates I told her no many times and then gave sparse details. She got jealous of some efforts I had made but I just told her, "I was trying when you got back you didn't care."



I held her and we laid in bed together until about 3-4AM and I started posting here. I was given a wake up call as I was stating my observations and the things she said.



Very clearly I was told that it is obvious she is triangulating and that I need to remember the realizations I had made. I hadn't slept at all and yet she was sleeping incredibly sound. She looked different.



I grabbed her phone and went to the bathroom. I read everything. I was right about everything. I even found out that things with her replacement are not only going poorly but she's got incredible drama stemming from it. The guy is still married, he and she are in a stupid breakup cycle. She had him begging not to leave every day for a week or two on end.



I go back to the bed and put my jeans on. I sit back down for a moment and look at her. She wakes up and says, "Joe, go back to sleep."



I told her, "I haven't slept at all. Old habits die hard."



"I went through your phone. I had no right to but I did it anyways. I saw all of the texts dating back to that last week."



We then went through a few rows at 5AM of texts I saw and the dates etc.



The back and forth isn't important. It was now that she asked me to leave but wasn't being forceful. I was calm now and merciless.



"Your Grandparents know you conned them out of money. I told your Mother not because I wanted to speak to them but out of concern for you. I had doubts tonight but judging by some of this fantastical lies you have been telling I now know you clearly are a very disordered person. I believe you may suffer from a multitude of Cluster B personality disorder traits."



Without screaming she said, "Go. I want you out of my life forever."



I then started in, ":)id you ever love me? Do you even know what love is? You thought you could tell me half-truths and cry to get me to say I'd give you a chance? You still have a boyfriend begging for you."



She said, "I told you I will always love you, part of me will always love you. Not as much as **** though!"



This didn't even affect me at this point and I'm now getting fully dressed and I say, "I never cheated on you and every fault I have in the relationship pales in comparison to what you did. Most people get dumped before they realize the problems. I was working on things for a future. I could have taken a break up, those are easy. Betrayal stings and taints every good memory. I hope you get help because you are not living in reality."



I left and there was some texting about leaving her family and her alone. Delete my number. I texted back about seeing through her façade and telling her it would all come crumbling down etc.



The End



I could have swallowed my pride. I could have had her back and all it would have taken was my self-esteem, my self-respect and my sanity.



I set myself back by going there but I got my head right in spite of things and I got out. I could have had sex with her and I didn't. Despite the mistakes I made I could have made a lot more.

[NonAverageJoe]

So, last night I was driving home after having dinner with my brother and actually feeling good about myself.



I get less than a mile from home and my phone starts to ring. "Ex" popped up in big red letters. I hit the "silence" button so it just rang on her end.



Then I get a text. "If you want your ___ I can put it outside otherwise I will just throw it out... ."



I didn't respond instantly as my heart had started to pound from the phone call. I didn't actually respond at all. I spoke with my roommate and we drove over there, he walked up to the door and got my stuff. It took a few trips and I reminded him to ask about certain things. I got them.



I went home. I start to unload my stuff and I see that one bag is blatantly her stuff.



I took the bait hook line and sinker.



"Thanks. One of these bags is full of your stuff. Perfume, body wash, candles, childhood photos etc. I can bring it back or throw it away."



A few minutes later I get, "Oh ___ sorry, you can just throw it away but hey I forgot to give you your wooden toolbox and the stuff in it."



A few more minutes pass by, "Let me know if you're coming otherwise I will just put it in the trash compactor."



Then finally, "Alright I didn't hear anything so I'm going to bed."



I was already on my way over there at that point. I didn't plan to talk to her and I didn't plan anything. I just went. I walked up to the door and I knocked. She answered I went to hand her the bag and she said, "It's over here."



I walked inside and grabbed it. I made my way to the door and the dog ran outside she asked me to help her get the dog. I called it and the dog came to me instantly. I went to leave and she was looking at me and smiling. I recognized the smile and told myself to go but I opened my mouth and said, ":)o you want to talk?"



Her eyes lit up and said yes. I went inside and at first I just sat down I wasn't thinking straight but I wasn't incredibly emotional.



I forget exactly how it all played out but the major gist of the conversation at first was the BS. Me asking why are you returning my stuff now. Her responding that she thought she was still blocked. I told her, "I unblocked you so I'd stop checking for an apology that would never come."



Then there was crying and half-truths. There was her telling me they're not together. That he wants to be but she wants to be single. Her telling me she's sorry that she handled everything poorly but she wasn't happy. Her swearing it never got physical until after I left and it still hadn't gone all the way (the punch line for this comes later).



I started crying and bashing her hard. No holds bar. She took it and started crying back and saying things like, ":)on't you think I just want to hold you and kiss you."



Her saying things like, "You don't want me back. We can't come back from this. What do you want me to do beg for you back?"



This went on and on and eventually the conversation was more emotional BS than relevant issue.



Eventually I hugged her. I even almost kissed her. She started being playful and coy. She gave me cookies and we ended up laying down together. I held her. I was in extreme denial and then I broke down again and started to go but then I didn't want to.



We started watching a stupid show on TV. She asked me about my dates I told her no many times and then gave sparse details. She got jealous of some efforts I had made but I just told her, "I was trying when you got back you didn't care."



I held her and we laid in bed together until about 3-4AM and I started posting here. I was given a wake up call as I was stating my observations and the things she said.



Very clearly I was told that it is obvious she is triangulating and that I need to remember the realizations I had made. I hadn't slept at all and yet she was sleeping incredibly sound. She looked different.



I grabbed her phone and went to the bathroom. I read everything. I was right about everything. I even found out that things with her replacement are not only going poorly but she's got incredible drama stemming from it. The guy is still married, he and she are in a stupid breakup cycle. She had him begging not to leave every day for a week or two on end.



I go back to the bed and put my jeans on. I sit back down for a moment and look at her. She wakes up and says, "Joe, go back to sleep."



I told her, "I haven't slept at all. Old habits die hard."



"I went through your phone. I had no right to but I did it anyways. I saw all of the texts dating back to that last week."



We then went through a few rows at 5AM of texts I saw and the dates etc.



The back and forth isn't important. It was now that she asked me to leave but wasn't being forceful. I was calm now and merciless.



"Your Grandparents know you conned them out of money. I told your Mother not because I wanted to speak to them but out of concern for you. I had doubts tonight but judging by some of this fantastical lies you have been telling I now know you clearly are a very disordered person. I believe you may suffer from a multitude of Cluster B personality disorder traits."



Without screaming she said, "Go. I want you out of my life forever."



I then started in, ":)id you ever love me? Do you even know what love is? You thought you could tell me half-truths and cry to get me to say I'd give you a chance? You still have a boyfriend begging for you."



She said, "I told you I will always love you, part of me will always love you. Not as much as **** though!"



This didn't even affect me at this point and I'm now getting fully dressed and I say, "I never cheated on you and every fault I have in the relationship pales in comparison to what you did. Most people get dumped before they realize the problems. I was working on things for a future. I could have taken a break up, those are easy. Betrayal stings and taints every good memory. I hope you get help because you are not living in reality."



I left and there was some texting about leaving her family and her alone. Delete my number. I texted back about seeing through her façade and telling her it would all come crumbling down etc.



The End



I could have swallowed my pride. I could have had her back and all it would have taken was my self-esteem, my self-respect and my sanity.



I set myself back by going there but I got my head right in spite of things and I got out. I could have had sex with her and I didn't. Despite the mistakes I made I could have made a lot more.

[downwhim]

Joe, I think you got what you needed and you did not have sex with her. You did what you needed to. Don't beat yourself up about it... .

[Infern0]

You did good man. Now move on and forget about her and her drama.

Cluster B's hate "losing" and make no mistake you came out of this with the "win"

Do not re-engage, end it now with you on top.

[NonAverageJoe]

Haha, please tell me how I won that depraved game Infern0? She wanted me to cave and say I'd give her a chance. She wanted me to be "friendly" in public etc. I shot all of that down but still held her in bed... .

[NonAverageJoe]

If anyone has any insight into what the hell was going on in her end I could use it. My objectivity stops at lies.

[HappyNihilist]

If anyone has any insight into what the hell was going on in her end I could use it. My objectivity stops at lies.

She was trying to keep you emotionally attached to her, on her terms.

She was feeling you out... .asking about your dates, testing your boundaries, gauging how you feel about her.

She wants to know if you're a source of supply that she can keep around -- sometimes on the back burner, sometimes not. Every drama triangle needs a third party, after all.

[NonAverageJoe]

Well she got her answer. I couldn't believe a single thing she said and the blow out after.

I think it was good for me, Inferno is right I won that exchange. I walked into that scenario unprepared for that though.

[NonAverageJoe]

Coworker just reported a drive by. While a main road she has no reason to come down this way. She can take the freeway to bypass this whole section of town.

[downwhim]

Nonaveragejoe,

She misses you. She wants you. She lost you. She is trying to re-engage. Trying to see if you will take the hook.

You have worked hard. Be strong. Practice N/C and move on. She is on the hunt for a taker. You don't need to go there again... .Driving by is one of her impulsive behaviors showing it's nasty face.

[NonAverageJoe]

I hope its unrelated she did say she wants me out of her life forever. I think I'm going to just not let it bother me. I don't think she'll escalate anymore because her attempts were half measures and passive aggressive before.

[Mutt]

Hi NonAverageJoe,

A pwBPD have difficulties seeing the grey areas in life and in people. Things are either all good or all bad and all or nothing thinking.

I hope its unrelated she did say she wants me out of her life forever.

"out of her life forever" quantifies as all or nothing thinking. She said this based on how she felt at that moment and she's treating you as all good now.

She was feeling you out... .asking about your dates, testing your boundaries, gauging how you feel about her.

She misses you. She wants you. She lost you. She is trying to re-engage. Trying to see if you will take the hook.

I have to agree. She's putting her feelers out.

Then there was crying and half-truths. There was her telling me they're not together. That he wants to be but she wants to be single. Her telling me she's sorry that she handled everything poorly but she wasn't happy. Her swearing it never got physical until after I left and it still hadn't gone all the way (the punch line for this comes later).

There's truth here NonAverageJoe. It sounds like things are on the rocks.

Most people get dumped before they realize the problems. I was working on things for a future. I could have taken a break up, those are easy. Betrayal stings and taints every good memory. I hope you get help because you are not living in reality."

I think this is where she hurt you. You have your values. You had plans, dreams. You give the impression your the type of guy that puts his head down through the good and bad up to a point.

She crossed a line. Trust is broken due to her betrayal.

NonAverageJoe, I think you handled it well under the circumstances.

I'm not sure that I would tell her she's mentally ill or a cluster B personality disorder. I'm guilty of this, I did mention it to my ex simply because I wanted her to get help.

BPD is a part of her personality, it's ingrained. Changing one's personality is very difficult. The way she interprets reality is what she knows. It's very real to her, just as your reality is real to you. She may not know she's mentally ill and there may be denial.

If you flip this around. What would your reaction be if a loved one told you they suspect your mentally ill? It is what it is.

That said.

I don't think it's the triangulation that's the elephant in the room.

It's not working out with the other man. She's split you good for now. As previous members said. She has her feelers out.

[NonAverageJoe]

The out of her life forever comment came after I confronted her as I was leaving. If I was split good I imagine I'm split bad now right?

[Mutt]

The out of her life forever comment came after I confronted her as I was leaving. If I was split good I imagine I'm split bad now right?

It's not splitting. It's a black and white statement.

If it's on the rocks with the other man and it sounds like there's a strong possibility.  She lacks a stable sense of self, fears being abandoned.

She telegraphed she had something on her mind when you got there and you picked up on it.

How was she treating you when you wanted your things back a couple of weeks ago, maybe three?

Now you were watching TV, in her bad etc. From one extreme to another?

[NonAverageJoe]

The other guy was consistently begging for her back and she was dealing with his (Ex) Wife drama.

I just hope she stays away now there are plenty of dumb tools who will fall for her stuff.

The drive bys scare me though. She even told me a ton of times, "I won't stalk you."

When I refused to tell her where I lived.

Yes while she fed me cookies and feigned empathy. You're right. But I nipped that on the butt right?

[fromheeltoheal]

I communicated with my ex a few months after I left her, and by then I'd detached a little and learned about the disorder, and all of the things she'd do or say that worked so well on me when I was in it were transparent and a little nauseating in that new light;  the exchange actually helped with my detachment.

Seems like maybe you can relate to that a little Joe?

[Mutt]

Yes while she fed me cookies and feigned empathy. You're right. But I nipped that on the butt right?

I'm not sure I'd worry about that specifically, overall you have your boundaries. Simply put, boundaries are to keep the good things in and the bad things out.

What are your personal values?

You articulated the events of what transpired well. That said what did you feel? Did you feel tension, conflict, uncomfortable, angry, repulsed etc... .

[Splitblack4good]

The other guy was consistently begging for her back and she was dealing with his (Ex) Wife drama.

I just hope she stays away now there are plenty of dumb tools who will fall for her stuff.

The drive bys scare me though. She even told me a ton of times, "I won't stalk you."

When I refused to tell her where I lived.

Yes while she fed me cookies and feigned empathy. You're right. But I nipped that on the butt right?

I think you did well tbh . I'm 7 weeks out and becoming more detached but I think deep down and being honest here if that was me in your situation I think I would of caved ! I'm hoping more and more each day now my ex doesn't try to re engage at any point but if she does il be strong enough like you were to walk out and called her out on her b/s .

I don't think il ever hear from mine again anyway she rang me Xmas eve abit upset almost like she was saying her final good byes looking back on it now then day after Boxing Day she acted like she really has detached from me and cut all ties not heard a thing since I've gone strictly NC now for 4 days and am continuing to do so .

[NonAverageJoe]

I was genuinely confused and conflicted.

[Mutt]

I was genuinely confused and conflicted.

She may test again.

[Splitblack4good]

I was genuinely confused and conflicted.

Yer but you still stayed strong in the areas you needed to be good on you .

Like I said I'm not sure I could do what you did not at this point anyway your ex knows your weak points but you still didn't fully cave you got out of there dude thats strong minded stuff trust me !

[NonAverageJoe]

She wanted me to go for real when I exposed her for the liar and the fraud that she is.

I'm on the best first date of my life with an accomplished architect and neither of us wants the night to end.

[NonAverageJoe]

This normal woman is really into me... .

Mutt: I see where you're coming from and I think that the impression I left may be enough for her to go for other replacements or make it work with the loser she cheated on me with. You're right as well, I know love is conditional and I love myself. I was not perfect but my journey has ever been fraught with introspection and accountability. I realize now that I let her victim thinking poison me. I am to blame for that as a result of losing my objectivity and enjoying her obsessive love for me.

FromHeel2heal: I agree. I did not cry. I was calm and I spoke my mind. I think I caused rapid dysregulation when I exposed her at five am. I'm now super excited about this new girl.

Splitblack4good: Thanks, it was not wise to go there but I kept my self dialogue going and posted here while laying in bed with her. I owe a lot to those who were posting in my thread about handling contact that night.

Overall I can handle indirect contact and I think I might be ready to just block her for good completely.