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Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits. Practicing lawyer, Senior Family Mediator, and former Licensed Clinical Social Worker with twelve years’ experience and an expert on navigating the Family Court process.
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Author Topic: Kinder camp  (Read 516 times)
formflier
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« on: June 17, 2015, 06:01:14 AM »

 

My wife just came downstairs and is getting our d4 up an hour earlier than we had discussed and agreed on before sending her to kinder camp (she will be in kindergarten this fall)... .kinda like a trial period of going to school.

I asked her what was going on... .if there was a schedule adjustment... . 

She stated that the girl went to bed at 930 last night (which... is same time she has been going to bed)

I said I didn't understand what that response meant... .that my understanding was that we were trying to maximize her sleep time to help her behavior at school.

"If I want to get her up early... .then that is what is going to happen... ." is what she said next.

Thinking about it now... .I should have ignored the entire event... .but I said I don't understand the position you are taking about the kids and schedules

"You don't matter... . You don't listen to me so I will not listen to you... that's the way its' going to be... "

I walked away... . Still working on my coffee... .trying to stay calm.

:'( :'( :'( :'(

It's one thing to keep me awake at night... .I'm an adult... .


FF

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« Reply #1 on: June 17, 2015, 09:25:51 AM »

I walked away... . Still working on my coffee... .trying to stay calm.

   
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takingandsending
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« Reply #2 on: June 17, 2015, 11:04:11 AM »

I said I didn't understand what that response meant... .that my understanding was that we were trying to maximize her sleep time to help her behavior at school.

FF - Admittedly, I have not been following the dynamics between you and your wife, but they seem to be cycling into conflict lately. I think, if this you stated you didn't understand what her response meant, she likely felt invalidated, prompting the hostile response she gave you. Is there another way you could have asked her? You often suggest "Help me to understand how you are feeling ... ." Would that have been appropriate?

A more pressing question. What were you feeling when you saw your D4 up an hour early? Were you upset? I would have been, if I were in your shoes. I find it very, very difficult to navigate agreements on parenting with my wife. We had this discussion last night. She feels that I do not respect her views on things like screen time, food, sleep. I do respect her views, and I also disagree with them, at least to the extent that she wants them implemented. I believe she has every right to her views. I do not believe that she has the right to mandate her views be adopted without exception ... .nor do I. It keeps us, many times, reaching meaningful agreements on parenting. I am interested in how you approach this. It is tough even between  parents in a non-BPD environment. In the BPD environment, I find it extremely difficult.
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formflier
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« Reply #3 on: June 17, 2015, 11:08:06 AM »

   I do not believe that she has the right to mandate her views be adopted without exception ... .nor do I. 

This is my position... .word for word... I couldn't have said it better.

I was feeling... confused... .scared... .What the heck?  Disappointed... .as in ... really... .this again.

"Help me understand sort of stopped working well... .at least for now... .I have been attempting variations on that... ."

But... it was how I honestly felt... .I didn't understand... .

FF
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« Reply #4 on: June 17, 2015, 11:30:03 AM »

I was trying to think of which Lesson might have some helpful stuff. There is this one about Not Engaging: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=106107.0;all

It really seems like she is trying to push your buttons to get a response. She is making unilateral decisions and expecting you to step up and argue with her or question her behavior.

Is it possible that her getting the little one up early was done to bait you? If so, what would you tell me or somebody else to do? If I said, my husband is using the kids to bait me and get a response out of me, what would you tell me to do? What lesson would you send me to?
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formflier
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« Reply #5 on: June 17, 2015, 11:34:48 AM »

 

OK... .here is my response... without reading the lesson... .it is along the lines of what I did.

Don't assume... .

So... test the waters and see ... .ask for clarification... .don't accuse... .

The hope is that there are a couple back and forths before a "blowup" to give you a chance to figure it out and disengage... .or SET and validate.

here is the thing... .my wife normally oversleeps... .or is last minute... .she showed up almost exactly an hour early... .so... .often... .not routinely... .she will go places early... because of a mis-set alarm or other booboo.

After taxes... I'll read the lessons.

FF
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« Reply #6 on: June 17, 2015, 11:53:02 AM »

I agree with talkingandsending here.

It seems you have entered a phase with your W where she has you painted black and views you as an obstacle or an enemy.  Let me remind you that this is likely part of an overall pattern, and has little or nothing to do with the overall issue of the moment.  I know it stinks to be stuck in this phase, but I don't think there is really anything you can fix about it.  My feeling is this is a situation where it's most important to avoid being Invalidating, rather than to try and actively fix or validate.  It sounds like your W has her mind made up that she has a negative attitude about you.  you don't have to validate that negative attitude, but it's important not to invalidate it.   

A wild guess here, but from your recent postings, it sounds like your wife feels like she is not an equal in your r/s, and feels a lack of control.  I'm sure from your perspective (and probably most people's), that is clearly not the case, but for your wife, that is what she feels.
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« Reply #7 on: June 17, 2015, 11:59:02 AM »

A wild guess here, but from your recent postings, it sounds like your wife feels like she is not an equal in your r/s, and feels a lack of control.  I'm sure from your perspective (and probably most people's), that is clearly not the case, but for your wife, that is what she feels.

Right... .I can see this... .

I need to think carefully about what boundaries I may... .or may not try to add. 

So far... the summer has been about her plans... .and her ability to undo "my plans" with kids.  Compromise is what you fake to get your stuff first... .and then move along.

Is there anything I can do it about... .without resorting to her tactics... .just taking kids and informing her... or not... .

That doesn't seem helpful... .

However... at some point... .I will matter again... .one way or another. 

FF

T

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« Reply #8 on: June 17, 2015, 12:27:54 PM »

The "You don't matter" was a petulant child of 3 or 4, probably where she is stuck. My MC recently asked my wife at what age she wasn't being heard, because she routinely is hurt by me not hearing her, which makes her feel like she doesn't matter.

One of the things that I do now, which I don't think is having much of an impact but maybe helps a little, is to reiterate to my wife that she matters to me whenever we have a disagreement. Even if she is using insulting language, I will enforce my boundary to take some time off, let her know I will be back and that her feelings do matter, that she matters to me. Sometimes, I have to force down the bile rising in my throat to do this, because frankly, I really don't feel like reassuring her after she has attacked me, but I know that there is a hurt person in there who is freaking out about stuff that has little to do with me. So I do it.

I don't know why I am suggesting this when I don't like doing it myself, but I get that my wife validly has feelings of being unimportant, not being heard, not being important. Sounds like your wife is struggling with similar feelings. Taking it out on the kids though is my hot button. I put very direct boundaries on that. My MC advised me that I am the responsible adult parent and have to protect my kids. It removed much of the FOG that I was in, like a light shining from above that said, you aren't wrong to feel angry about an adult manipulating a child to the child's detriment because the adult can't soothe themselves and take care of their own needs.
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formflier
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« Reply #9 on: June 17, 2015, 12:39:22 PM »

  I put very direct boundaries on that. 

Such as...
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« Reply #10 on: June 17, 2015, 12:40:55 PM »

 

Over time... .I have tried the "you matter" thing... with varying success.

Currently... .says says the only way she will know that she matters... .is that do what she says.

If she mattered to me... .I would not be pursuing other women.

If I don't do what she says... that means I am not listening.

FF
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takingandsending
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« Reply #11 on: June 17, 2015, 01:04:38 PM »

You have to hand it to her, she has invented the perfect mouse trap. 

Still, is there any possibility that you can talk to your MC about the age thing of when this view developed? We learned in my last session that my wife's 4 year old is communicating with my 13 year old. Makes for a heck of a marriage! Seriously, it seemed to help us both understand that we are revisiting old, long standing patterns that have little to do with each other and what is present between us in the moment. For my BPDw, the usefulness of that knowledge generally ends about 1 minute after we walk out of the MC session, but it does help me. It reminds me not to take it personally when she uses the "go to" language of hurt/resentment, and I feel a little bit freer knowing that it really doesn't have much to do with me.

I don't have any great ideas. I tend to actually act on my own when I see that my wife and I cannot or will not reach agreement on the kids. I respect the caring, attention and time that she puts in with our sons. I think she has good ideas and rejoice in any closeness and good feelings she experiences with them. But the small things that become big things, like screen time, eating/food, precise sleep time, out-of-the-normal-routine requests from the boys - I tend to do what seems right to me because those are issues that we cannot agree upon. And, stepping out of the FOG for a moment, my wife who has the kids 80% of the time, does exactly what seems right to her without consulting me. I am okay with this. I don't expect her to conform to my parenting approach when I am out of the house, nor do I require it of myself when I am on duty with the boys. She doesn't like that and reads in my actions what she will. I cannot help that. It's her story to unravel.
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