I want him out I need tips

[salamandra]

Hi there, we have been living together now for six months and in this time I have realized that I have made a mistake. This new perspective has made my eyes open and think he is the typical BPD, I see triangulation, silent treatment, lies, gaslighting, mood changes, sex as hoocking... .I dont want to go to much into detail, I am so tired and beginning to feel sick. I have no evidence of cheating, but I have my feelings and intuition, and I am pretty sure our relationship has been a triangule from the beggining, one year and a half now, and I can see it now. I have tried to confront it with him several times but I have no answers, I have lost the hope and I just want to feel healthy again.

Well, if it was just me I would probably pack and go, but I have a little girl, we like the house and I think the less stressful thing for us would be to stay here and make him leave. But I know it is not going to be easy, I have already tried and he just changed again to charming for a while. I might sound heartless, and of course I care and this part is going to be difficult, but I need an strategy, practical tips please!

[FigureIt]

I am there and completely understand what you are going through.  My uBPDbf and I own a house together.  I too have a D(10) not his and want to stay in the house with her and my dogs.  He has told me that he will fight for the house, dogs, and me to pay him money. 

What I have done so far is

1. briefly consulted with an attorney. 

2. Gotten my finances together

3. Begun to reconcile with myself I may not keep the house but will find one.

4. Spoken with my parents about financial assistance with plan to pay them back

Those things I have done for the past 6 months.  My daughter will be going into Middle School next year so I am able to move within district this May which gives me a larger area.  I have a call into my attorney to meet with him.  He told me previously it could take 4 months to get my name off the house and my downpayment back.

As soon as I meet with my attorney I can message you directly what I learn.

[love4meNOTu]

Hi there, we have been living together now for six months and in this time I have realized that I have made a mistake. This new perspective has made my eyes open and think he is the typical BPD, I see triangulation, silent treatment, lies, gaslighting, mood changes, sex as hoocking... .I dont want to go to much into detail, I am so tired and beginning to feel sick. I have no evidence of cheating, but I have my feelings and intuition, and I am pretty sure our relationship has been a triangule from the beggining, one year and a half now, and I can see it now. I have tried to confront it with him several times but I have no answers, I have lost the hope and I just want to feel healthy again.

Well, if it was just me I would probably pack and go, but I have a little girl, we like the house and I think the less stressful thing for us would be to stay here and make him leave. But I know it is not going to be easy, I have already tried and he just changed again to charming for a while. I might sound heartless, and of course I care and this part is going to be difficult, but I need an strategy, practical tips please!

Hi Salamandra -

I think FigureIt's post is as practical as it can get.

You say you want him out, have you considered asking him to leave? Unless your bf is abusive, of course.

From my experience, I did tell my xhwBPD that I wanted a divorce. The extinction burst from that conversation lasted weeks, until he finally left. It was more than a month of really horrible stress... with me leaving a room as he was entering it. I was just too afraid of more anger directed at me, and I had had enough. So I stayed out of his way. I did what I could to get him to go quickly, including giving him my wedding rings to sell.

He escalated the more I withdrew, and some of the lessons here were helpful in that regard, basically the lessons tell you to become "boring". If he asks you what is going on you say "I just don't know, I'm just depressed/ confused". After this goes on for a while I can tell you they lose interest and are off to more exciting pastures.

Give it a try if you are truly done with this relationship. I think it is under "how to breakup with a BPD".

L

[love4meNOTu]

Leaving A Partner with Borderline Personality


Written by Joe Carver, PhD.

Separating from "The Borderline" often involves three stages: The Detachment, Ending the Relationship, and the Follow-up Protection.

The Detachment

During this part of separating from "The Borderline", you recognize what you must do and create an Exit Plan. Many individuals fail in attempts to detach from "The Borderline" because they leave suddenly and impulsively, without proper planning, and without resources. In many cases, "The Borderline" has isolated their partner from others, has control of finances, or has control of major exit needs such as an automobile. During the detachment phase you should... .

- Observe the way you are treated. Watch for the methods listed above and see how "The Borderline" works.

- Gradually become more boring, talk less, share less feelings and opinions. The goal is almost to bore "The Borderline" to lessen the emotional attachment, at the same time not creating a situation which would make you a target.

- Quietly contact your family and supportive others. Determine what help they might be - a place to stay, protection, financial help, etc.

- If you fear violence or abuse, check local legal or law enforcement options such as a restraining order.

- If "The Borderline" is destructive, slowly move your valuables from the home if together, or try to recover valuables if in their possession. In many cases, you may lose some personal items during your detachment - a small price to pay to get rid of "The Borderline".

- Stop arguing, debating or discussing issues. Stop defending and explaining yourself - responding with comments such as "I've been so confused lately" or "I'm under so much stress I don't know why I do anything anymore".

- Begin dropping hints that you are depressed, burned out, or confused about life in general. Remember - "The Borderline" never takes responsibility for what happens in any relationship. "The Borderline" will feel better about leaving the relationship if they can blame it on you. Many individuals are forced to "play confused" and dull, allowing "The Borderline" to tell others "My girlfriend (or boyfriend) about half nuts!" They may tell others you're crazy or confused but you'll be safer. Allow them to think anything they want about you as long as you're in the process of detaching.

- Don't start another relationship. That will only complicate your situation and increase the anger. Your best bet is to "lay low" for several months. Remember, "The Borderline" will quickly locate another victim and become instantly attached as long as the focus on you is allowed to die down.

- As "The Borderline" starts to question changes in your behavior, admit confusion, depression, emotionally numbness, and a host of other boring reactions. This sets the foundation for the ending of the relationship.

Ending the Relationship

Remembering that "The Borderline" doesn't accept responsibility, responds with anger to criticism, and is prone to panic detachment reactions - ending the relationship continues the same theme as the detachment.

- Explain that you are emotionally numb, confused, and burned out. You can't feel anything for anybody and you want to end the relationship almost for his or her benefit. Remind them that they've probably noticed something is wrong and that you need time to sort out your feelings and fix whatever is wrong with you. As disgusting as it may seem, you may have to use a theme of "I'm not right for anyone at this point in my life." If "The Borderline" can blame the end on you, as they would if they ended the relationship anyway, they will depart faster.

- If "The Borderline" panics, you'll receive a shower of phone calls, letters, notes on your car, etc. React to each in the same manner - a boring thanks. If you overreact or give in, you've lost control again.

- Focus on your need for time away from the situation. Don't agree to the many negotiations that will be offered - dating less frequently, dating only once a week, taking a break for only a week, going to counseling together, etc. As long as "The Borderline" has contact with you they feel there is a chance to manipulate you.

- "The Borderline" will focus on making you feel guilty. In each phone contact you'll hear how much you are loved, how much was done for you, and how much they have sacrificed for you. At the same time, you'll hear about what a bum you are for leading them on, not giving them an opportunity to fix things, and embarrassing them by ending the relationship.

- Don't try to make them understand how you feel - it won't happen. "The Borderline" only is concerned with how they feel - your feelings are irrelevant. You will be wasting your time trying to make them understand and they will see the discussions as an opportunity to make you feel more guilty and manipulate you.

- Don't fall for sudden changes in behavior or promises of marriage, trips, gifts, etc. By this time you have already seen how "The Borderline" is normally and naturally. While anyone can change for a short period of time, they always return to their normal behavior once the crisis is over.

- Seek professional counseling for yourself or the support of others during this time. You will need encouragement and guidance. Keep in mind, if "The Borderline" finds out you are seeking help they will criticize the counseling, the therapist, or the effort.

- Don't use terms like "someday", "maybe", or "in the future". When "The Borderline" hears such possibilities, they think you are weakening and will increase their pressure.

- Imagine a dead slot machine. If we are in Las Vegas at a slot machine and pull the handle ten times and nothing happens - we move on to another machine. However, if on the tenth time the slot machine pays us even a little, we keep pulling the handle - thinking the jackpot is on the way. If we are very stern and stable about the decision to end the relationship over many days, then suddenly offer a possibility or hope for reconciliation - we've given a little pay and the pressure will continue. Never change your position - always say the same thing. "The Borderline" will stop playing a machine that doesn't pay off and quickly move to another.

Follow-up Protection

"The Borderline" never sees their responsibility or involvement in the difficulties in the relationship. From a psychological standpoint, "The Borderline" has lived and behaved in this manner most of their life, clearly all of their adult life. As they really don't see themselves at fault or as an individual with a problem, "The Borderline" tends to think that the girlfriend or boyfriend is simply going through a phase - their partner (victim) might be temporarily mixed up or confused, they might be listening to the wrong people, or they might be angry about something and will get over it soon. "The Borderline" rarely detaches completely and will often try to continue contact with the partner even after the relationship is terminated. During the Follow-up Protection period, some guidelines are:

- Never change your original position. It's over permanently! Don't talk about possible changes in your position in the future. You might think that will calm "The Borderline" but it only tells them that the possibilities still exist and only a little more pressure is needed to return to the relationship.

- Don't agree to meetings or reunions to discuss old times. For "The Borderline", discussing old times is actually a way to upset you, put you off guard, and use the guilt to hook you again.

- Don't offer details about your new life or relationships. Assure him that both his life and your life are now private and that you hope they are happy.

- If you start feeling guilty during a phone call, get off the phone fast. More people return to bad marriages and relationships due to guilt than anything else. If you listen to those phone calls, as though taping them, you'll find "The Borderline" spends most of the call trying to make you feel guilty.

- In any contact with the ex "Borderline", provide only a status report, much like you'd provide to your Aunt Gladys. For example: "I'm still working hard and not getting any better at tennis. That's about it."

- When "The Borderline" tells you how difficult the break-up has been, share with him some general thoughts about breaking-up and how finding the right person is difficult. While "The Borderline" wants to focus on your relationship, talk in terms of Ann Landers - "Well, breaking up is hard on anyone. Dating is tough in these times. I'm sure we'll eventually find someone that's right for both of us." Remember - nothing personal!

- Keep all contact short and sweet - the shorter the better. As far as "The Borderline" is concerned, you're always on your way somewhere, there's something in the microwave, or your mother is walking up the steps to your home. Wish "The Borderline" well but always with the same tone of voice that you might offer to someone you have just talked to at the grocery store. For phone conversations, electronic companies make a handy gadget that produces about twenty sounds - a doorbell, an oven or microwave alarm, a knock on the door, etc. That little device is handy to use on the phone - the microwave dinner just came out or someone is at the door. Do whatever you have to do to keep the conversation short - and not personal.

The key to health is the early identification and treatment of problems

In all of our relationships throughout life, we will meet a variety of individuals with many different personalities. Some are a joy to have in our life and some provide us with life-long love and security. Others we meet pose some risk to us and our future due to their personality and attitudes. Both in medicine and mental health - the key to health is the early identification and treatment of problems - before they reach the point that they are beyond treatment. In years of psychotherapy and counseling practice, treating the victims of "The Borderline", patterns of attitude and behavior emerge in "The Borderline" that can now be listed and identified in the hopes of providing early identification and warning. When those signs and indicators surface and the pattern is identified, we must move quickly to get away from the situation. Continuing a relationship with "The Borderline" will result in a relationship that involves intimidation, fear, angry outbursts, paranoid control, and a total loss of your self-esteem and self-confidence.

If you have been involved in a long-term relationship with "The Borderline", after you successfully escape you may notice that you have sustained some psychological damage that will require professional repair. In many cases, the stress has been so severe that you may have a stress-produced depression. You may have severe damage to your self-confidence/self-esteem or to your feelings about the opposite sex or relationships. Psychologists, psychiatrists, social workers, and counselors are available in your community to assist and guide you as you recover from your damaging relationship with "The Borderline".


After graduating from Ohio University with a Bachelor's Degree in 1971, Carver joined the Psychology Department at a local state-operated inpatient psychiatric facility, Portsmouth Receiving Hospital. Carver immediately began graduate course work, initially at Xavier University in Cincinnati OH, then Marshall University in Huntington, WV and finally returning to Ohio University in Athens, OH. After graduating with a Master's Degree, Carver co-founded a private practice corporation, Southern Ohio Psychological Services, Inc. Returning to Ohio University, Carver began doctoral studies and was granted my Ph.D. in 1989. Carver then obtained a license to practice in 1990 and has remained in private practice. In July 1996 Carver parted from his original corporation and formed another private practice as a solo practitioner; Joseph M. Carver, Ph.D., Inc. That practice is located in Portsmouth, OH (740-353-1548).

[OutOfEgypt]

What's the situation like with the property?  Do you own it?  Rent it?  Who is on the lease or the mortgage?  I'm assuming you are not married to each other? 

[OutOfEgypt]

In my experience, most BPD people want to be seen ultimately as a good and giving person.  In fact, even with all of the lying and deceiving, they can be pretty desperate for it, and they generally want to be given the opportunity to look like a good guy.  So, once their temper tantrums, charms, and extinction bursts wear out, usually somewhere along the way they want to be able to show you and everyone else how fair and kind they are.  The problem comes when they receive the rejection/abandonment.

So, in general you'll probably want to end the relationship in as non-accusatory a manner as possible.  "We're just not right for each other, at least not right now.  I really need time to work on myself, and maybe in the future we can see where things are.  I have to be careful about protecting my daughter and not progressing with a relationship if I'm not in the best place for it, so it is important that I take this time for myself.  Please understand."

If you fear he will become violent, well that's a whole other matter.

In my situation, my final bout with my ex-wife was when we tried to get together one more time after the divorce, after she promised to do therapy.  It only took a few months for things to go right back to how they were, including how I felt in the relationship.  After getting sick of being lied to and cheated on, I found more evidence of cheating again and ended it.  However, it took FOUR months to get her out of the house (which I own).  I even had to get a 30 day notice to evict her, since she claimed she had "established residency" and couldn't legally be forced to leave, just like that.  Being a man, I stayed away from the house as much as possible when the kids were at school so that she couldn't claim I was trying to beat her up or something.  It was a very, very long four months.

[salamandra]

Thanks for all these answers they are helping already to deal with anxiety

My situation is not as complicated as Figureit we are just renting, both in the contract but just renting.

And yes I have already asked him to leave, i did about a month ago, after what has been the worst summer of my life so far. I did it in the way you are pointing, focusing on myself, my feelings and my responsabilities with my daughter. It seemed to be working at the beginning but then he turned back asking for another try and showing his intentions of making things better. At the time I was feeling so weak and depressed, and I was mild I guess and things have gradually gone back as if I had said nothing.

I am going to read a thousand times love4meNOT post about leaving, i think there are some very interesting points there and maybe it stops me fron making A few mistakes. My first impulse of packing and go for example, it might not be a good idea and I would lose the chance of staying at the house. But I have to admit I have my own fear of abandoment and I am sure he is going to play with it in this crisis. I can predict late nights and crazy making comments to come shortly and I dont know how I should or just could react. Is ignoring the best bet?

Finding a lover and playing his game has crossed my mind too just to get out of the phisycal attraction and feel stronger but it sounds now like a terrible idea.

Anyway, some of the advices I am following already naturally, i am sharing less because I am losing the point, i feel a lot less physical attraction and yes I am not as cheerful and I have crying crisis from time to time. The other day in the middle of sex so I guess it might be pulling him away already.

One thing I know I am going to need support from friends and therapy because this is not going to be sweet  

[salamandra]

Also I have thought of finding undoubtable evidences of cheating so I could tell him to leave in anger. But this sounds very painful, would it be a good idea do you think?

[OutOfEgypt]

He'd probably still deny it.  There's a reason many of us doubt our own sanity when being with people like this.

It sounds like you know you need to break away and are making the steps toward it but still feel pulled back toward him.  That's tough.

I know that you like the house, but would you really want to stay in that house with some of the memories you have with him in it?  Sometimes the best thing is to hit the road.  It certainly makes some things much easier, especially if you can work it out with the landlord.

Whatever you do to end the relationship, you can rest assured that he'll do nearly anything to prevent that, drag it on, or keep you hanging around, even as a "friend".  He'll pull on every lever he can find, including your own fears and insecurities.  He'll be sweet.  He'll be forlorn and desperate, so that you feel badly for him.  He'll be angry.  He'll threaten.  He'll try to stain your character to others.  He'll try to make you jealous.  He'll confess to his many hidden sins and promise to get help.  He'll ask for "more time".  He'll be charming.  He'll call you up in the middle of the night explaining how he will always love you.  Be prepared for a battle.  But, even though it may sound terrible, sometimes it's not bad to let them think you're ending it on "friends" terms with loose-ends still attached just to make the transition quicker and less volatile and get yourself to a safer place.

It's easy to think these people have such a problem with cheating because they are selfish and only think of their own needs.  They appear to always want to have their cake and eat it, too.  But there's probably more to it.  Having someone on the side is a way to get the narcissistic supply they need (attention galore) while never being "fully in" with anybody.  They can't handle being fully in.  They have to destroy it.  And they desperately need a scapegoat, an object to project all of their shame and blame onto.  We fit the bill nicely, don't we?

[love4meNOTu]

Also I have thought of finding undoubtable evidences of cheating so I could tell him to leave in anger. But this sounds very painful, would it be a good idea do you think?

I think Out of Egypt is right on here... in my personal experience it is much better to take the high road and not play games. You'll feel better about how you acted in retrospect.

If he truly has BPD, it's better to keep your feelings to yourself and just repeat... ."I am just not happy/ I am confused/ I'm sorry but this relationship is not going anywhere at this time".

But you know him best salamandra. What do you think you should do?

L

[OutOfEgypt]

to second love4meNOTu, the high-road for sure.  remember that your goal is disentanglement while the pwBPD's goal is to continue the entanglement by sucking you in, even if just into an argument.  so, anything you do like accuse of cheating or what-not is just going to promote more arguing, more drama, and more entanglement. 

[salamandra]

Yeah I think your mantea sounds much better. Just focus on myself and my feelings. Thats all I can truly talk about and defend. Not well trained to do so but getting better

Thanks again to you all

And yes maybe there is another cute apartment outthere waitnig fir e and my little daughter. Its just the stress of all the moving... .Buff i need to take big deep breath and get a bit stronger i feel exausted. My head seems like working but I have feelings for him and I dont think I am ready to resist all outofEgypt describes.

I will start tonight with ten minutes of mantra.

Thnks

[joel6242]

I am with you. I think that we have to look at things differently. I have decided today to end my quest to get rid of my BPD guy and to remove myself from the situation. I have done it all to get him out of my life but nothing works. He is able to keep from jail even though most people could not. He should be in jail right now and please understand that I have tried to get him out of here. He scares me to death. BPD behavior always wins, always.

I am now looking at taking care of myself and not getting rid of him. I need to be safe and happy. I have lived the last 90 days in complete fear. Something has to give, I am working on shutting my life down and going into hiding. As of today, I have two jobs in two cities not where I live. I have been non effective in getting him out but I can get me out.

[Grey Kitty]

And yes maybe there is another cute apartment outthere waitnig fir e and my little daughter. Its just the stress of all the moving... .

It is your choice. Let me paint the choice clearly:

It is easier for you if he moves out quickly and cleanly, and you and your daughter stay put in a stable apartment. However you have no control over when or if that action occurs. It is his choice, and he's not showing a prior history of clear direct choices to do things that make your life easier in the past.

It is more work to find a new place to live with your daughter and move. But you are 100% in control over whether this happens and when.

It won't be good for you to spend (more) weeks waiting for him to 'do the right thing'

[FigureIt]

So when they do "the nice things" how do you handle it?  I know that it is short term that it will end if I said I've decided to stay, which I'm not considering, but he keeps being nice.  He took me to brunch Sunday, he was a bit helpful Monday and yesterday he bought me candy.

I meet with my attorney tomorrow, so I won't officially say we're done until after I speak with him. Plus I know this is all wreaking havoc on me... .I wake up each morning exhausted because I'm processing all this while I sleep.

[OutOfEgypt]

What Grey Kitty wrote paints it very clearly.  Both approaches will take effort and be exhausting, but one of them involves things you can control and the other doesn't.  You know you can't really count on him to follow through without dragging it out.  It's a pretty difficult position to be in.  

As I mentioned before, in my situation I had to wait for the pwBPD to move out (I own the house) and I had to employ legal means and bribes, and it still took four months.  Those were loong months.  I actually work from home, so in order to keep my distance I had to take my laptop to various coffee shops and fast-food places all day long, bumming off their wi-fi, for *four* months, just so I wouldn't be home with her alone.  She would call, she would complain that I was being mean, she would complain that I wasn't helping her with her college homework, she would blame me for dropping out, she would call me explaining how she always wanted us to grow old together, etc.  I had to learn to end emotional conversations very quickly and stop answering the phone when she called.

How do you handle them doing nice things?  Well, you can say "thank you" , but can you simply be less available?  If you aren't ready to tell him, can you at least spend a lot of your time away from him?  Tell him you are taking your daughter to visit family for a few days?  The more face-time you have with him, the more he's going to lay it on thick.  He obviously senses your distance.  So, you need to buy yourself some time as you come up with an exit plan that you are going to stick to.

The quicker you get out, and the more complete you make the break, the better off you and your daughter will be.  I have known my ex for 16 years.  I cannot fully get away because we share children.  As much as things are soo much better (I'm remarried), my ex still calls randomly to cry to my wife about various things going on in her life.  She just called last night about something going on with her adult son (my step-son).  It's like she's still trying to use me as an emotional shoulder by proxy, through my wife.  So, while I'm not trying to put your b/f down, people with BPD can be very difficult to get away from.  Not trying to freak you out... .just trying to give you some perspective to encourage you.

[FigureIt]

I am going to try more distance. My concern about being gone is my dogs.  I have 2 which I do 95% of the care for and he has threatened about him getting them. I understand that I may have to give up one but I don't want that to happen and I don't want to give him any leverage.

[OutOfEgypt]

Once you're ready to make a move, or tell him, can you prepare just beforehand by moving your dogs to an undisclosed friend's house?  If they aren't there, he can't take one.  And is he seriously going to sue you for one?

[FigureIt]

Once you're ready to make a move, or tell him, can you prepare just beforehand by moving your dogs to an undisclosed friend's house?  If they aren't there, he can't take one.  And is he seriously going to sue you for one?

My parents and my daycare have said they would take my dogs. His S(17) has also said if he got one he would get it for me and tell him she ran away. My concern is the time it is gonna take to get out. 4 months through the courts to get my money back so I can buy my OWN home. I just feel I will need to be on my toes ALL the time.

[OutOfEgypt]

I know the feeling, but you will get through it.  Unfortunately, you can expect a certain amount of "collateral damage", but hopefully that doesn't mean he steals one of your dogs.  Just don't tell him where they are .  My therapist used to say, "If you camp next to a nuclear reactor leaking radiation, you can expect to get cancer."  When you have a relationship with someone like this, you're going to get hurt, especially when you leave.  You can expect it.  Hopefully it will be minimal, but the cost is still worth it.

[salamandra]

So when they do "the nice things" how do you handle it?  I know that it is short term that it will end if I said I've decided to stay, which I'm not considering, but he keeps being nice. He took me to brunch Sunday, he was a bit helpful Monday and yesterday he bought me candy.

I would say thank you but I wouldn't let these things to turn into guilt later, I have seen now, when I asked him to leave how he used the nice things he did to try making me feel guilty, but I don't buy it, no no no, it just waved another !

Enjoy dinner, it has been his choice to take you out! He knows better than anyone how things are at the moment between you, don't you think? That's why he is taking you out. Ouch it is all so sick and twisted  Let's get out of here!

[salamandra]

And yes maybe there is another cute apartment outthere waitnig fir e and my little daughter. Its just the stress of all the moving... .

It is your choice. Let me paint the choice clearly:

It is easier for you if he moves out quickly and cleanly, and you and your daughter stay put in a stable apartment. However you have no control over when or if that action occurs. It is his choice, and he's not showing a prior history of clear direct choices to do things that make your life easier in the past.

It is more work to find a new place to live with your daughter and move. But you are 100% in control over whether this happens and when.

Thanks Grey Kitty I see it this way too, I have already starting having a look to the market, also is good to have plan A and B.

[Grey Kitty]

One option would be to allow him a fixed period of time to get out, perhaps 'till the end of the month. If he isn't going, do it yourself.