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« Reply #30 on: January 26, 2017, 11:17:49 AM »

I can try it that way, its just upsetting bc we canceled bc of how she feels in the moment... .not bc something forced us too.

how she feels in the moment is significant - to her its probably every bit as significant as anything else that would force a cancellation.

youre trying to affect a change in her behavior that wont change over night, if ever. but small steps on your end over time will make it much easier for her to transition and follow your lead.
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« Reply #31 on: January 26, 2017, 03:37:35 PM »

How do I manage the fantasy then?
 

You cannot manage her fantasy. It's part of her BPD. She has unrealistic needs to merge with someone while simultaneously fearing engulfment. That is who she is. Being long-distance is probably how she deals with this, so she can have both at the same time. Closeness and distance.

I said we just need to spend more time together so that she can see what we have is real, and that its not just online.  

Maybe stop saying this for a while and see what happens. "Real" may be what is triggering her. Intimacy, closeness, in person.

What happened last time you met in person?
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« Reply #32 on: January 26, 2017, 05:01:33 PM »

 

You cannot manage her fantasy. It's part of her BPD. She has unrealistic needs to merge with someone while simultaneously fearing engulfment. That is who she is. Being long-distance is probably how she deals with this, so she can have both at the same time. Closeness and distance.

Maybe stop saying this for a while and see what happens. "Real" may be what is triggering her. Intimacy, closeness, in person.

That actually makes a lot of sense, she has always distanced herself when things start to get real.  We have a very intimate relationship... .I know she knows me better than anyone, and I the same with her. We have everything you could want in a relationship except the physical closeness.

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What happened last time you met in person?

We met under less than favorable circumstances, we were fighting at the time and I showed up uninvited. I felt good about it but she felt I was a little detached... .
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« Reply #33 on: January 29, 2017, 03:02:12 PM »

I am going to be near her for work soon, she isnt excited about the possibility of seening me... .should I make it a point to see her or just act like I am not even there.
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« Reply #34 on: January 29, 2017, 03:08:24 PM »

what does near her entail? same room?
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« Reply #35 on: January 29, 2017, 03:25:06 PM »

same town... .we are in a LDR... .and she wants to keep everything we have online so to speak... .but isn't excited about spending time together in real life bc the last time we were together it didnt live up to her fantasy I guess... .she felt I was absent... .I dont think it was akward I was just tired and had been sick so I don't think I showed the enthusiasm she had hoped for.
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« Reply #36 on: January 29, 2017, 03:34:24 PM »

she isnt excited about the possibility of seening me

id say in that case, respect her wishes. dont smother.
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« Reply #37 on: January 29, 2017, 03:37:46 PM »

and then 2 or 3 days after that I will hear about how she misses me and wishes I was there, how much she hates that we dont live closer, etc.  she does this all the time
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« Reply #38 on: January 29, 2017, 03:41:09 PM »

let her. right now, it remains her choice. trying to force the issue (despite her expressing missing you or wishing you were there) isnt going to change her mind, but reinforce it.

if you pull away in that sense, just a bit, shes more inclined to change her mind.
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« Reply #39 on: January 29, 2017, 03:46:01 PM »

just seems like a wasted opportunity... .all she does is complain about me not being with her in person, then when an opportunity arrives she doesnt want it.  I feel like I am being led on... .like she really doesnt intend on us moving forward.  She keeps telling me how she is tired of spinning her wheels with me... .thing is she is the reason we are stuck in neutral... .I was prepared to move there... .she wouldn'tallow it... .I am always ready to go see her, no dont drive all that way... .its just maddening to have a person tell you how much they want you in their life every day then tell you dont come see me
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« Reply #40 on: January 29, 2017, 04:09:30 PM »

its not that I cant accept her feelings... .but why must it always be hers... .mine never count.  And I hate that I will be right there and not see her.  Especially when I know what will happen.  She complains about our situation all the time but the moment I  try and address it ,she stops me.  Its a constant no win situation, the last time I didn't mention seeing her for an extended period of time she asked why I hadnt said anything.  I said "bc you asked me not too", she got sad and said that never stopped you before.
I really don't know what to do about that... .its not fair that she tells me everyday how she wants me yhere and when I find ways to make it happen she tells me no.
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« Reply #41 on: January 29, 2017, 04:15:03 PM »

its not that I cant accept her feelings... .but why must it always be hers... .mine never count. 

does this matter more to you than your goal? no right or wrong answer.

I feel like I am being led on... .

she has been consistently inconsistent. i get that. stop being led on. let her complain about not being with her in person. it means little if shes not willing to act on it (dont tell her that). shes matter of fact when she tells you she wants to keep the relationship online. that is where she is.

can it change? if shes still expressing missing you and wishing you were there, that would suggest it could.

you are going to have to affect that change. you are going to have to give her reason to act on it. right now you are not doing that, you are doing the opposite. amping it up will push her away. youre gonna have to get grounded (use the tools) and get above this dynamic to get anywhere.

are you willing to do that? no right or wrong answer. its not going to be fun, but it is possible; whats your limit?
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« Reply #42 on: January 29, 2017, 04:38:06 PM »

I accept that her feelings will always have to be considered before mine... .I accept that generally with women... .


I guess I just want some kind of guide... .she asks me all the time for timelines... .I guess I'd like an idea of when she will be ready to see me again.  In a month, 6, a year?  Just so I can act accordingly, so I can adjust my emotions so to speak... .or lower my expectations maybe... .
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« Reply #43 on: January 29, 2017, 05:39:24 PM »

I guess I just want some kind of guide

whats stopping you from being your own guide? are you going to leave this entirely to her indefinitely?
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« Reply #44 on: January 30, 2017, 02:23:37 PM »

how do I go at her pace so she is comfortable, and be my own guide?   Her range of emotions is so wide... .one minute I am thanked repeatedly for not giving up... .the next she has every reason why I should quit and walk away... .always me that should walk away... .save myself
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« Reply #45 on: January 30, 2017, 02:46:50 PM »

how do I go at her pace so she is comfortable, and be my own guide?

I don't know if this is true or not, but a lot of the time it seems that you are trying to guide your life based on what you think that she may or may not want at some point in the future. It almost looks like you're playing Russian Roulette and she gets to decide where the bullet is.

So much control has been given over to her. So much of your life seems to be dictated based on her response; whether real or imagined.

Take control of your life back from her. Make your own choices and decisions and allow her to make hers.

So, she's asked you not to come and see her right now. That's her choice to move at that pace. Now, you get to make your choice. You can guide your own life.

With all choices come consequences. This applies to both of you. It looks like you are trying to protect her from the consequences of her actions and choices and are guessing at how to proceed. So much time and energy seems to be focused on her at what she says at any particular moment.

If she's happy and talks to you about the future, you dash off in that direction. If she is dysregulated and lashes out or pushes you away, you dash off in that direction. You seem to be allowing her to guide you every step of the way and you're all over the map.

she asks me all the time for timelines... .I guess I'd like an idea of when she will be ready to see me again.  In a month, 6, a year?  Just so I can act accordingly, so I can adjust my emotions so to speak... .or lower my expectations maybe... .

What is stopping you from establishing this timeline for yourself? It doesn't have to be anything that you externalize to her. But, why not just make yourself the priority and commit to moving in a different direction if she hasn't shown signs of changing her position by X date? Guide yourself and don't allow her to dictate.
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« Reply #46 on: January 30, 2017, 03:21:29 PM »

I used to allow her to dictate everything... I have quit doing that.  I told her and continue to tell her its a relationship or nothing.  I refuse just a friendship and she knows that.   perhaps you are right... she behaves the way she does bc there is no penalty.
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« Reply #47 on: January 30, 2017, 03:41:50 PM »

Why tell her anything? When you do that, you are still allowing her to dictate your life. You need to start making those decisions for yourself.

You want a relationship, and you want a certain kind of relationship. Either you can have that with her or you cannot. It's up to you to decide if what you get is what you want to keep.

That being said, it doesn't need be a "at this moment, if I don't get it I'm walking" decision. It can be a "if by X date, if I don't have Y in the relationship, I'm going to re-evaluate" type of thing.

The whole point is that you matter just as much as she does. What you want in life is just as important. But, you have to decide and start believing that is a truism. If you don't believe that it is true, you might want to examine that and figure out why you make her more important to you than you do yourself.

I had to do just that. I put my x before everything else. I made myself subservient to her because I was afraid of losing her. I convinced myself that the pain of the relationship was less than the pain of losing her. It wasn't until I removed the fear of losing her that I was able to start to improve things. I was able to take my life back and that put me in the position to guide not only me, but the relationship.

When I was living in fear, I was reacting emotionally to everything that she said and did. Every choice that I made in my life was based on the fear of losing her. This kept me from facing the scary stuff about myself, but it also kept me from putting an end to conflict. I was at her mercy and she knew it. She used it against me. She manipulated me with it.

Releasing that fear ended the manipulation. It allowed me to define and maintain boundaries. I stopped solving all of her problems. I became proactive rather than reactive.

Please don't take any of that to mean that I stopped listening to her or that I no longer cared about her wants and needs. Those things were still important to me. But, I didn't allow her emotions to guide me like I had in the past.
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« Reply #48 on: January 30, 2017, 06:48:26 PM »

I guess I have been willing to let her call the shots bc of what I did over the summer.  It was wrong and I know that.  I think about all the issues we have and I know that plays a large part in all of it... .she doesn't trust me and has no reason too.  it makes it hard.  I know what I want and I know that I want it with her.   I guess in my mind every problem has a solution and I just have to find the answers for us... .I know she can't.
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« Reply #49 on: January 31, 2017, 01:59:03 AM »

That has left me confused.

You know that she can't find a solution, yet you are letting her call the shots.

Can you explain how that works in your mind?
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« Reply #50 on: January 31, 2017, 03:50:00 AM »

I guess I have been willing to let her call the shots bc of what I did over the summer.  It was wrong and I know that.  I think about all the issues we have and I know that plays a large part in all of it... .she doesn't trust me and has no reason too.  it makes it hard.  I know what I want and I know that I want it with her.   I guess in my mind every problem has a solution and I just have to find the answers for us... .I know she can't.

It sounds like you are letting guilt call the shots, Once. Do you think so? I can understand that, and I'm sure I'd feel similarly in your situation. 

Building up trust again after a betrayal takes effort, time, and lots of patience. Especially if there are other issues at play, like fears of abandonment. I would try not to let FOG be the leader here. I know it's not easy, but since she is not able to be steady here, you are going to have to.

It might be time for you to call the shots for yourself, and just observe her reactions. If you can take a step back, even just a little, and observe the dynamic with open curiosity and non-judgment, you'll learn so much about your relationship and be better able to see what needs the most attention/change.

What do you think?
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« Reply #51 on: January 31, 2017, 08:11:32 AM »

heartandwhole


I agree that guilt plays a big part in what I do.  Then endless fights bc of what I did and I just let her rage at me were bc I felt guilty... .thought that would ease her pain and mine.   I have since let that go and I dont play into it and those fights have gotten less frequent and the rage has decreased dramatically
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« Reply #52 on: January 31, 2017, 10:44:59 AM »

This thread has reached its posting limit, and is therefore locked. Please feel free to continue the discussion in a new thread. Thanks for your participation.
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