Sister and Mom with BPD

[Our abuse recovery guide]

I am a newbie. I'm so glad I found this group. I've been reading some of the educational material for the past two days.

My sister was diagnosed with BPD when she was in college. She is 8 years younger than me. She is in her 40s now and I'm in my fifties. She has been living in my basement for the past 2 years. This is the second time she has lived with me as an adult. The other time she lived with me for about a year. The first time she lived in the main part of the home as a family member and ate meals with us etc. This time she is in an apartment downstairs with its own separate entrance. I thought that this more separate living arrangement would make the living together much easier than the first time. I was wrong.

I have been stressed out ever since my sister moved in. The feeling that my sister has a big hole that she expects me to fill has grown bigger and bigger since she moved in. I have fibromyalgia and chronic migraine and have been working on learning how to pace, stay within my true energy limits and take better care of myself. At first my sister encouraged the taking care of myself, but when I realized that I can't give my sister the amount of time and attention she demands and began saying no, her behavior escalated. She is angry. She is suspicious that I am "punishing her." She is intensifying guilt producing statements (such as pointing out every time I see her, "how very long" it has been since she last saw me. The last time I reserved time for her was two weeks ago. I had a bad migraine but I was afraid to cancel due to the escalation in her responses. I played half of a long card game with her and then excused myself to go lie down, while my husband finished the game with her and then played a second game with her.

What I am finding most frustrating of all is my own behavior. I am regressing back to unhealthy behaviors that I have worked hard to grow past:
-I am saying yes, when I really want to say no.
-I am hiding inside of my house, to avoid the discomfort of my sister tracking me down to give her attention every single time I try to use my patio or spend time in my yard.
-I am saying no or canceling get-together for legitimate physical needs but I say it without actually using the word no (to avoid trouble) or I hear myself making promises to make up the time in the near future (to placate and please her--but at the price of me putting myself in position of giving more energy than what I really have to give, thus hurting myself).
-I am closing my garage door as quickly as possible after I get home from doctor appointment or grocery appointment because she has scared me multiple times by approaching without my awareness and standing so close to my car door that I am in danger of hitting her with the door. I have PTSD from childhood and first marriage abuse and this behavior is quite stressful for me.
-I have been stuffing anger, over all the times since she moved in that she has talked about topics that we agreed years ago not to talk about anymore. (One of those is her discussing with me her self-harming behaviors. When we were younger, she confided in graphic details all the self-injury behaviors she was engaging in. She refuses help from professionals for that behavior though.)

When I finally got in touch with all these changes in my behavior about a month ago and all of the stress I was feeling, my first response was thinking that I would have to ask her to move out soon and feeling lots of stress about how she would react. She has attempted suicide 5 times in our adult years and that adds to my anxiety. After thinking about it more, I decided that I want to try to correct my own behavior and try better boundary keeping and see how that goes. I also decided that I need to educate myself more on DBT and get some support--which is how I found this group. I am aware that I still may end up needing to ask her to leave in the future. I need to reduce my stress for the sake of my chronic illness state and if better boundaries don't bring down the stress sufficiently then I will have to put my health first (far easier said than done). My preference is to find a way to meet my needs and to be compassionate and respectful of her needs at the same time.

Both my sister and I lived through lots of abuse from both parents in childhood. Both of our parents are active alcoholics who disowned us about a decade ago. I am convinced my mother is also BPD. The first time I read about BPD when my sister was diagnosed I had the thought that the description also fit our mother. My first husband was diagnosed BPD and psychotic level narcissist during our marriage. I feel really tired right now from having spend my whole life around people with BPD. Reading the educational materials on this site and reading a few of the posts is helping. I am not alone. My life experience matches the realities of how it feels to live with people with BPD.

A week before my sister moved in, she announced in a voice that I recognized as a warning, "I am going to live with you the rest of my life, unless you kick me out." I felt physically ill. I was depressed at the time and told my husband what she said and that I thought letting her move in was a mistake. He reassured me it didn't need to be forever but that it was financially advantageous for both parties. It hasn't been emotionally advantageous for me--and watching my sister's clingyness and negative comments grow bigger makes me doubt that it is for her best good either.

I hope better boundary keeping will help. And if it doesn't help, I will know that I tried my best and will, hopefully,  feel more peace about asking her to leave if that is what I need to do.

Thanks for being here.

 

[peacebthejourney]

I am a newbie. I'm so glad I found this group. I've been reading some of the educational material for the past two days.

My sister was diagnosed with BPD when she was in college. She is 8 years younger than me. She is in her 40s now and I'm in my fifties. She has been living in my basement for the past 2 years. This is the second time she has lived with me as an adult. The other time she lived with me for about a year. The first time she lived in the main part of the home as a family member and ate meals with us etc. This time she is in an apartment downstairs with its own separate entrance. I thought that this more separate living arrangement would make the living together much easier than the first time. I was wrong.

I have been stressed out ever since my sister moved in. The feeling that my sister has a big hole that she expects me to fill has grown bigger and bigger since she moved in. I have fibromyalgia and chronic migraine and have been working on learning how to pace, stay within my true energy limits and take better care of myself. At first my sister encouraged the taking care of myself, but when I realized that I can't give my sister the amount of time and attention she demands and began saying no, her behavior escalated. She is angry. She is suspicious that I am "punishing her." She is intensifying guilt producing statements (such as pointing out every time I see her, "how very long" it has been since she last saw me. The last time I reserved time for her was two weeks ago. I had a bad migraine but I was afraid to cancel due to the escalation in her responses. I played half of a long card game with her and then excused myself to go lie down, while my husband finished the game with her and then played a second game with her.

What I am finding most frustrating of all is my own behavior. I am regressing back to unhealthy behaviors that I have worked hard to grow past:
-I am saying yes, when I really want to say no.
-I am hiding inside of my house, to avoid the discomfort of my sister tracking me down to give her attention every single time I try to use my patio or spend time in my yard.
-I am saying no or canceling get-together for legitimate physical needs but I say it without actually using the word no (to avoid trouble) or I hear myself making promises to make up the time in the near future (to placate and please her--but at the price of me putting myself in position of giving more energy than what I really have to give, thus hurting myself).
-I am closing my garage door as quickly as possible after I get home from doctor appointment or grocery appointment because she has scared me multiple times by approaching without my awareness and standing so close to my car door that I am in danger of hitting her with the door. I have PTSD from childhood and first marriage abuse and this behavior is quite stressful for me.
-I have been stuffing anger, over all the times since she moved in that she has talked about topics that we agreed years ago not to talk about anymore. (One of those is her discussing with me her self-harming behaviors. When we were younger, she confided in graphic details all the self-injury behaviors she was engaging in. She refuses help from professionals for that behavior though.)

When I finally got in touch with all these changes in my behavior about a month ago and all of the stress I was feeling, my first response was thinking that I would have to ask her to move out soon and feeling lots of stress about how she would react. She has attempted suicide 5 times in our adult years and that adds to my anxiety. After thinking about it more, I decided that I want to try to correct my own behavior and try better boundary keeping and see how that goes. I also decided that I need to educate myself more on DBT and get some support--which is how I found this group. I am aware that I still may end up needing to ask her to leave in the future. I need to reduce my stress for the sake of my chronic illness state and if better boundaries don't bring down the stress sufficiently then I will have to put my health first (far easier said than done). My preference is to find a way to meet my needs and to be compassionate and respectful of her needs at the same time.

Both my sister and I lived through lots of abuse from both parents in childhood. Both of our parents are active alcoholics who disowned us about a decade ago. I am convinced my mother is also BPD. The first time I read about BPD when my sister was diagnosed I had the thought that the description also fit our mother. My first husband was diagnosed BPD and psychotic level narcissist during our marriage. I feel really tired right now from having spend my whole life around people with BPD. Reading the educational materials on this site and reading a few of the posts is helping. I am not alone. My life experience matches the realities of how it feels to live with people with BPD.

A week before my sister moved in, she announced in a voice that I recognized as a warning, "I am going to live with you the rest of my life, unless you kick me out." I felt physically ill. I was depressed at the time and told my husband what she said and that I thought letting her move in was a mistake. He reassured me it didn't need to be forever but that it was financially advantageous for both parties. It hasn't been emotionally advantageous for me--and watching my sister's clingyness and negative comments grow bigger makes me doubt that it is for her best good either.

I hope better boundary keeping will help. And if it doesn't help, I will know that I tried my best and will, hopefully,  feel more peace about asking her to leave if that is what I need to do.

Thanks for being here.

 

[Naughty Nibbler]

Welcome peacebthejourney:  

Sorry to hear about the difficult situation with your sister.  Good to hear that you have been studying some of the lessons and that you want to try your best to work things out.  It's understandable that you need to look after yourself and you own health.  If you end up having to ask her to move out, you will feel better about it, knowing that you tried your best to improve things.

After thinking about it more, I decided that I want to try to correct my own behavior and try better boundary keeping and see how that goes. I also decided that I need to educate myself more on DBT and get some support--which is how I found this group. I am aware that I still may end up needing to ask her to leave in the future. I need to reduce my stress for the sake of my chronic illness state and if better boundaries don't bring down the stress sufficiently then I will have to put my health first (far easier said than done). My preference is to find a way to meet my needs and to be compassionate and respectful of her needs at the same time.

Your sister probably won't like BOUNDARIES , but they can help improve things for you. It will be up to you to enforce them consistently.  You will need to be consistent with the boundaries, or it won't likely work.

You mention DBT.   I'll go ahead and share the links below, in case you can use some more DBT info.The first link below leads to a self-help DBT website.  The 2nd link relates to a DBT book, but makes lessons available to the public.

DBT SELF-HELP WEBSITE
www.dbtselfhelp.com

IMPROVE THE MOMENT WORKSHEET
www.dbtselfhelp.com/html/improve_the_moment_worksheet.html

PANIC LIST
www.dbtselfhelp.com/html/panic_list.html

FINDING ALTERNATE THOUGHTS
www.dbtselfhelp.com/FindingAlternativeThoughts.pdf

DBT SKILLS TRAINING
https://dbtskillstraining.wordpress.com/

Have you thought about some therapy sessions with you and your sister?  Is your sister getting any treatment for her BPD?  Is she employed?

[peacebthejourney]

Thank you for the  welcome, naughty nibbler. I really appreciate the links for more resources.
.You're right. My sister does not like me having boundaries. The past three months I've consistently done a boundary--and she has gotten angry every time.

Yesterday, I began working on a second boundary:
Her behavior I don't want to keep rewarding=Her pounding on my door when one of my daughter's visits and when I answer she then comes in, ignoring me and then in a demanding and guilt-producing way gets my gentle daughter to agree to have coffee or a hike with her within the week.
My new strategy:
I will answer the door but not invite her in. I will tell her I have company and I will get in touch with her after my company has left.
I did this successfully yesterday.
However, I realized I have to figure out the rest of the situation: After I delivered my message, she went downstairs but then slammed her door very loudly. After my daughter left, I went downstairs and visited with my sister for an hour. She seemed happy to see me. She gave a guilt producing statement near the beginning about how "very long it had been since I last visited with her" that I didn't know how to respond to, so I didn't say anything about it. Then we talked about books and authors for an hour. She seemed so cheerful I began to doubt my perception earlier that the slammed door was on purpose and anger filled. When I said it was now time for me to go and eat dinner and exercise, my sister's whole demeanor changed and she said in an angry way, "It's a good thing you came down when you did. I was about to leave the house. You made me wait a whole hour!" I felt shock at the rapid shift. I felt numb. I had no idea how to respond. I heard myself say in a polite voice, "It was a nice visit. I hope you enjoy your dinner." And then I quickly exited. So frustrating. I think it might be better next time to be more prepared for the zingers (which have been happening fairly frequently since she moved in). I think I have to go straight into another boundary. I don't want to reward zingers with politeness, I want to find a way for her to understand that our time together will end promptly anytime she sounds like that. It's a tone of voice she uses with me, that she never uses when other people are around. As I left, I heard her making another statement about how "long" it had been since I last visited her. I feel a little threatened everytime she sounds like that. It's really uncomfortable. Sometimes it feels like she is working to manipulate me and other times it feels like she is losing control of herself. She has told me before that she has punched holes in walls before in anger, she's never done it in front of me before and I haven't seen evidence of it in her apartment since she moved in---but as a former abuse survivor I think I feel fearful and that's why I shut down/go numb or semi-numb when she does a very rapid shift into anger and unreasonable clingy demands or irrational accusatory conclusions.

You asked about therapy. I did do a very uncomfortable multiple month joint counseling with my sister about seven years ago. My sister barely spoke during the sessions. Her counselor asked me lots of questions about Trish's and my relationship, about our childhood home and my experiences of abuse from our father.

Shortly after that my sister had a couple more suicide attempts (5 attempts so far in her adult life). She stopped going to counseling and dropped out of her dbt therapy group. She is on an anti-psychotic drug that she has a family doctor prescribe. She acknowledges acknowledges that the drug has made a big difference with her depression and with her "daymares" as she calls them (which sound like obsessive ruminating on violence(in some of it she's the victim and some of it she's the perpetrator) and hallucinations of rape and violence. She has told me multiple times since she moved in that the doctor's were mistaken in her diagnosis with dbt, that she fired a family doctor who showed too much concern about her continued self-injury behavior and she has expressed that she has no intention of getting any more counseling. Therefore, I don't see any potential for joint counseling.

My sister had a long history of non-employment and fired from jobs before she moved in with me the first time. It is something I worked with her on while she lived with me, talking with her about the need for her to support herself if she was going to move forward with divorcing her husband and talking with her about getting a job that matched her interests and her skills. Up til that point, every job she applied for was a horrible match for her. Since those talks and helping with her resume etc. She got fired from one more job and then has been steadily employed. She doesn't work full time hours by her own choice. She doesn't think she's capable of working a 40 hour week. She supports herself now--with the exception that we have given her big discounts on car repair through my husband's automotive shop. She has gotten herself into debts she cannot repay multiple times and gone bankrupt once (the bankruptsy was done right before she moved into our home), she still owes lots of money on a student loan and I believe that a small amount is garnished from her wages for that--she says that debt is big enough it will probably never get all the way paid for.

Thanks for asking questions and sharing information. Writing these things is helping me to move forward with acceptance and with processing what's been going on and grappling with figuring out how I want to proceed.

I read an article on this site about listening to difficult expressions of emotions with DBT loved one. I know I've done this many times, but right now I'm overstressed and tired and dealing with my own physical issues and it's becoming a big challenge. I will keep on reading and digesting.

[Naughty Nibbler]

Hey peacebthejourney:  

My sister does not like me having boundaries. The past three months I've consistently done a boundary--and she has gotten angry every time.      

The important thing is to be consistent.  If you are consistent, then she can eventually get used to the boundary and hopefully have less of a reaction.  If you aren't consistent, then you probably won't get a beneficial outcome.

After I delivered my message, she went downstairs but then slammed her door very loudly. After my daughter left, I went downstairs and visited with my sister for an hour. She seemed happy to see me. She gave a guilt producing statement near the beginning about how "very long it had been since I last visited with her" that I didn't know how to respond to, so I didn't say anything about it. Then we talked about books and authors for an hour. She seemed so cheerful I began to doubt my perception earlier that the slammed door was on purpose and anger filled.    
When I said it was now time for me to go and eat dinner and exercise, my sister's whole demeanor changed and she said in an angry way, "It's a good thing you came down when you did. I was about to leave the house. You made me wait a whole hour!" I felt shock at the rapid shift. I felt numb. I had no idea how to respond. I heard myself say in a polite voice, "It was a nice visit. I hope you enjoy your dinner." And then I quickly exited.

 

People with BPD can experience a fast cycling of their emotions, so I'm thinking her emotions change between the time she slammed the door and you came down to see her.  

I think you did well.  Sometimes, you just need to go with not invalidating.  You left with a couple of pleasant comment and didn't give her an opportunity to argue.  She won't likely ever interact the way you might hope.

If you wanted to try and validate her, you could have said something like, "I'm sorry you had to wait, I can see that is was frustrating for you".  I was thinking about perhaps you mentioning,  "I would have understood if you had to leave before I got here", but that comment might invite further comment on her part and perhaps arguing.

Your idea of having some comments prepared in advance, is probably a good one. When you can tell that you sister is showing signs of becoming abusive, you might want to say something like:

          "I can see you are having a bad day, I need to leave now.  We can see each other on another day."

          "I want us to have a mutually respectful conversation.  I can see that it isn't possible now.  We can see each other/talk another time"

The thing you will need to accept is that you sister won't likely be polite and act the way you would hope.   So, having exit strategies and comments ready will likely make you feel better.  Also, since you describe that she can be violent, it would be good for you to have a Safety Plan and think through a plan in advance, should she become violent in your presence.  The article at the link below should be helpful.  
SAFETY FIRST

The link below leads to a video on "I" Statements.  You might want to watch/listen to it.  It is a skill that could be helpful for you.

"I" STATEMENTS

[peacebthejourney]

Hi Naughty Nibbler,

Thanks for your help and encouragement. I just read the article and listened to the utube on I statements. They are helpful.

It is sobering to read your words: "She won't likely ever interact the way you might hope." It helps me realize that I have had the hope that if I handle everything just right then she will behave in a more normal and considerate/kind way. Reminds me of my codependent thinking that I held as a child with two alcoholic parents and as an abused wife in my first marriage.

I think this insight means that I need to work more on accepting that my sister has BPD and that she isn't currently interested in any treatment. So our relationship will be about her acting as BPDs do act and me figuring out how to manage my own thoughts, feelings and words in response to her behaviors.

I also see that I am in a process to determine if my self-management will reduce my stress enough that living together remains a viable option or whether I continue to be too stressed which has a negative effect on my own chronic physical illnesses.

Thank you for the encouragement: "I think you did well.  Sometimes, you just need to go with not invalidating.  You left with a couple of pleasant comment and didn't give her an opportunity to argue." I often have the feeling with her that I'm not sure what to say/ how to respond. It is good to have reassurance that I am doing well different times--even if it doesn't feel great in the moment.

I have tried validating my sister in the past. It actually is my normal response if I am doing well.

A problem though is that I was suffering my first deep depression when she moved in. I have lots of medical issues going on and the doctor determined that all the imbalances of hormones in my body caused the depression. Anti-depressants did not work with my body. I am much less depressed now (almost 2 years later), but still struggling physically with a heavy load of fatigue from Epstein Barr, fibromyalgia and adrenal problems and chronic migraine. Now with the added medical care, my chronic migraine is half the days of every week and month (instead of every day), with flares that become daily for a week at a time. My sister seems unable to accept my energy issue--she is sympathetic about the pain levels but the energy level issue is seen as a threat to her getting what she thinks she needs from me--lots of time together to lighten her fears of abandonment. While my reality is that being around my sister drains at an alarming rate what little energy I have. Thus, I need to see if I can feel less stress in response to how she interacts with me or make the decision that the living together arrangement is just not a good option for my well-being.

So I'll be practicing I statements and boundary keeping and see what happens.

Thank you so much for helping with how to word things. I love this:

"Your idea of having some comments prepared in advance, is probably a good one. When you can tell that you sister is showing signs of becoming abusive, you might want to say something like:

          "I can see you are having a bad day, I need to leave now.  We can see each other on another day."

          "I want us to have a mutually respectful conversation.  I can see that it isn't possible now.  We can see each other/talk another time".

Your words capture what I've been trying to figure out how to say as the next boundary keeping step.

Thanks again!

[Naughty Nibbler]

peacebthejourney   

I hope your physical ailments become more manageable for you.  It has to be difficult to lack energy and deal with pain/discomfort.

One thought about a possible strategy.  Perhaps you might want to try setting up appointments to get together with your sister.  If she can expect to spend some time with you on a given day, and has something to look forward to, perhaps it might help her settle down.  Just a thought to consider.  If you make an appt. with her, and have a bad day with pain/discomfort, you may need to cancel occasionally. 

[peacebthejourney]

Hi Naughty Nibbler,

I was seeing her regularly at set time every week. I got so burned out by the acting out every time I needed to re-schedule due to health that I've backed away from that.
I have been reading lots of info. I think I need to keep processing it all before I'll know how to proceed. I really appreciate you sharing your ideas. It has been helpful.

Do you currently live with a borderline relative?

[Naughty Nibbler]

Hi Naughty Nibbler,

Do you currently live with a borderline relative? 

I have a sister who appears to be high-functioning BPD. We have separate homes.  I've been painted black and I'm currently not in contact with her. 

[peacebthejourney]

Sounds like a tough place to be with your sister. It hurts when a relative labels us as evil/bad. I'm sure you've tried to be kind to your sister. You seem like a thoughtful and supportive person. There are no simple answers with BPD family members.

If I end up deciding I need to ask my sister to leave my home in order to honor my health needs, I anticipate being labeled all bad, or painted black as you put it. When I wrote a letter to my sister about ten years ago saying that I didn't know what was wrong but I was having lots of physical problems and very low energy so I would not be answering her phone calls promptly every time she called---she didn't speak to me for a year or so. This was before my doctor figured out what was going on with my health.

I also have heard my sister tell others that her last roommate "kicked her out"--in reality, the nice woman tried to work things out, then she said she was ready for a change and gave my sister 4 whole months to find a new place. From my perspective, her roommate is a normal person--she is kind and sympathetic--and she struggles with codependency but is working to learn to live a healthier life, she's had counseling and she attends Al-Anon (Ironically, this former roommate also has fibromyalgia and other health issues). From my sister's perspective, she's an evil/bad person who did her wrong.

As I write, I am reminded again--her behavior is normal for someone who is diagnosed as BPD. I guess I'm still accepting the full reality of her mindset. She's in a miserable place. And so am I right now as I try to sort all of this out.

Last night, I read on this website that it is important with BPD relative to "express your awareness of their emotions even as you set boundaries."
I think this is the challenge before me. I need to process my own emotions well enough that I can calmly express awareness/ validation of her feelings as I practice keeping firm boundaries with my sister. Whether we live under the same roof or in different neighborhoods, I need to have the boundaries and I want to respond kindly to her emotions as well. Boundary setting and keeping has always been a challenge for me but I have succeeded in other relationships. It feels twice as hard with my sister--because I was raised by my parents to be her caretaker and because I haven't known enough about BPD.