long sad story

[Hopelessandlost]

Hello all, many years ago I was involved in a chat group that helped me immensly as I was in a 30year absive marriage. I finally left 10 years ago. A counsolor later told me that he suspected my ex had anti social personality disorder. After three years of counsoling from a trauma counsolor I walked away, not totally healed but with a greater understanding of what I had been dealing with.

Fast forward, I have five children from this marriage and out side of the youngest who does have some anxiety issues the other four have brought me more pain then I can take at times. My oldest who is 31 left my life when I left her father, taking his side all the while admitting we lived in domestic violence with him. Her and I never got along from the youngest age... .if I was to label her I would say she is a functioning borderline. She  Was a brat from the youngest age. She was manipulative and very materialistic and demanding she get the best of everything even though we lived in poverty. I have come to grips with her absence easier because we never did get along and she left chasing boys at a young age. You couldn't tell her anything. She is now married and as I look at it as she is someone else's problem now.

My second child is 30 diagnoised with bipolar, anxiety, depression and is a drug addict. I also heard she was prostituting herself to. She cut ties with me last year as her drug use was getting worse. I miss her a lot but the way she used to be.

daughter number 3 is a diagnoised borderline, and social phobia, depression and anxiety. This girl is 28 and has put me through hell and back on many occasions. Her lastest is hacking into my accounts and reading things that I have privately said to my sister and those close to me about my feelings and my issues with my kids ect. It is my only outlet... .she was bragging she was reading my private messages for 9 months now. At this point I am painted totally black... .this daughter is due to move across the country next week to marry some guy she met online. The guy has been funneling her money to supplement her disability. They have only physically been together for about a month when he has been on vacation. I see diasaster, there is no way she has been up front about her life and her relationships.she has admitted to me on several occasssions that she doesn't have feelings, she fakes it to get what she wants and this guy is promising all kinds of things, but she will be far enough away that someone else will have to clean up her mess.

My most pressing issue to hurt me is my oldest son who is 25. Since his teenage years he has been a handful. He appears to be a clone of his father, abusive, physically and emotionally, violent, openly admits he has no feelings or empathy for anyone. He was arrested finally two weeks ago for assault on his girlfriend, this is really no shock. He has assault several people including me in the past and we just always caved in and never reported it. He was put into my custody... .so myself and my youngest were walking on egg shells all the time around him. Last night I got a call he was arrested for being with this girlfriend again who the court told him specieifically to stay away from. He is back in jail now, I assume till his court date at the end of the month. There was no talking any sense into him... .he becomes agitated at even normal conversations. He says he doesn't care about his life or anyone's life. He threatened to kill me a week ago if I ever thought of putting him in jail. He threaten his younger brother to who is 23 who intervened with me.

I am just sickened as I watch my kids fall one by one... .I only have one in my life out of the five that I can truely rely on the youngest. I have a lot of guilt over not leaving my ex sooner... .but then I read a lot about personality disorders are genetic and maybe this would have happened regardless of the timing of my departure from The marriage... .opionions?

I'm feeling very lonely and beaten down right now. I've cried more since he was first arrested then I ever have... .almost daily. I think after all the years of the crap by them all... .I have hit my limit.i love my kids and would do anything humanly possible to help them, maybe that is the problem. I always has issues with the tough love thing. I think talking to people who have lived through this will help me immensely right now. Thank you my friends!

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[heartandwhole]

Hi Hopelessandlost,



I'm so sorry to hear about your situation. You have been through so much, and I can understand how difficult it must be to see your children struggle. It took a lot of strength to leave your husband. I commend you for taking care of yourself and doing what was right for you. 

You've found a great place for support. Members here have been in similar situations and understand. The site also has lots of tools and resources to make things better for you.

The first thing I'd recommend is to think about a Safety Plan.  It's much better to plan what you will do before a situation escalates to physical violence, than to try and scramble to get support when emotions are high. Hopefully, you will never need it, but I encourage you to spend some time on it, just in case.

Have you been in touch with local Domestic Violence hotlines? You could call just for informational purposes. They often have access to resources that you may not even have been aware existed in your city/state.

Keep writing, Hopelessandlost. It helps to share. We are here for you. 

heartandwhole

[Hopelessandlost]

i was reading the description from your site on Narcissistic individuals. Both my son and daughter fit this profile to a tee. I had an argument with my daughter just recently. She stated that she was perfect, and her relationship with this guy she basically only knows online is perfect. I simply said none of us are perfect and she lite up like a Christmas tree called me a bunch of names and went the silent treatment for awhile. My son also thinks he is totally perfect... .Im sure he still thinks that as he sits in jail. Everything is ALWAYS someone else s fault... .in a lot of cases I am an easy scape goat to place blame.

they have both told me at various times that they can't feel things like normal people. They don't care about anyone but themselves. My son told me "nothing against me but if i died right there in front of him he wouldn't care". that hurt... .my daughter is the same way. She talks about killing me... .I hope in jest but there is a piece of me that isn't so sure... .

Neither of them understand me... .I am an emotional mush. they have me wondering if I am normal. with all this going on lately I have done more then my share of crying... .my daughter simply says stop being a baby... .

it all just hurts right now... .

[Kwamina]

Hi Hopelessandlost

I am verry sorry you are feeling this way and find yourself dealing with multiple disordered family-members. You are really dealing with a lot right now.

Considering everything that's going on, I can understand how your youngest could have some anxiety issues. How would you describe the relationship your youngest child has with your other four children?

Neither of them understand me... .I am an emotional mush. they have me wondering if I am normal.

Disordered individuals often live almost like in an alternate reality as a result of their distorted thinking and perception which can be very confusing when you are consistenly faced with this. When it comes to the issue of what is normal and what not, several things stand out to me in your posts, most in particular:

My son told me "nothing against me but if i died right there in front of him he wouldn't care". that hurt... .my daughter is the same way. She talks about killing me... .I hope in jest but there is a piece of me that isn't so sure... .

He threatened to kill me a week ago if I ever thought of putting him in jail. He threaten his younger brother to who is 23 who intervened with me.

Your son and daughter saying these things and threatening to kill you isn't normal, no matter how much spin they or anyone else would put on it. Whether in jest or not, saying these things and making these kinds of threats to you isn't normal at all, very disturbing and hurtful indeed and totally disrespectful. I concur with heartandwhole that working on your saftey planning is crucial.

Take care

The Board Parrot

[7babies]

I just wanted to say I understand some of your pain. Please be safe and seek help for yourself also. You are in my thoughts.

[Hopelessandlost]

That's so much for the feed back. I need to hear I'm not crazy more then you can ever no. when you hear it so often from my kids I begin to believe it. my youngest isn't close to any of his siblings. Which is probuley for the best. His brother used to beat him up from a very young age and I don't mean play fighting. He has watched me stumble with his sisters throughout the years. He says he hates his brother at this point for all the pain he has caused us.

I just made an appointment with a abuse agency that I went to years ago after my ex husband. Wait list brings it to May though... .although she stuck me on a cancellation list.

I have lived in a bubble surrounded by disordered people... .I don't think I know what the outside world is like. It was common for my ex husband to threaten the kids and I. It seems normal for them to do it to me, although it doesn't feel right. I think I am to desensized to it all, although my nerves aren't. I shake uncontrollably when I am dealing with their crap. I used to say my ex has taken years off my life, I think my kids are taking the rest.

I was at court today for my son, it got pushed till tomarrow to see if he gets out. It is when he comes home that I need to be able to set those heavy duty boundaries and make them stick or else have the courage to call the police. Has anyone else had dealings with calling the police on their child? The whole idea hurts me to the core... .I am such a non confrontational person... .I feel like I am living in a revolving nightmare that never ends. He is my ex all over again... .and somehow I need to get rid of the guilt I feel that this is somehow my fault for not leaving the marriage sooner and getting the kids out... .

This list will help keep me somewhat grounded keeping me into the world of reality.  Thank you so much.

[Hopelessandlost]

I just wanted to say I understand some of your pain. Please be safe and seek help for yourself also. You are in my thoughts.

Thank you so much. The support I find here will help build my strength... .it's so good to not be alone

[Hopelessandlost]

Just thought of another conversation I had with my daughter when she told me she never apologies for any thing because she is never wrong. She said she may fake it if the situation warrants it but never means it. She often tells me she hates all people, and that if I get old she will push my wheel chair over a cliff... .again sick humour or... .

[Kwamina]

Hi again Hopelessandlost

How are you feeling now?

She often tells me she hates all people, and that if I get old she will push my wheel chair over a cliff... .again sick humour or... .

This is sick humour indeed. What I also find very disturbing about the comments your daughter and son make, is that even if they don't mean it, just saying these words to you brings a picture of this happening to your mind which by itself is already very unpleasant. My uBPD mom for instance twice told me that people were trying to poison me. The first time she said it was when I was in my teens and the second time when I was in college. It was utter nonsense, yet her saying these things brought images of it actually happening to my mind which was very unsettling.

[Hopelessandlost]

Hello all, I am feeling very alone in my Personal family hell. Only my youngest is sharing it with me as we support each other.

Another thought about my daughter came to mind when she told me recently that I was on her top list of people she wants to kill... .and reminded me she likes the  idea of tourture. She has never apologized for hacking into my fb, she sees no wrong in what she did. She left today with the guy she met online from arazonia, she has given up everything, her disability, her apartment everything because this guy has promised to take care of her. I am torn in my thoughts. I will miss her but on the other hand I don't really know why... .will I miss the continued abuse from her? She also is an alcoholic.  She has been a huge part of my life forever... .and not always in a good way... .so why do I feel any emotion?... .She feels none about leaving me... .not even a good by... .

My oldest son continues to press boundaries... .I am shooting to get him to a psych assessment on the 28. After that I may be less likely to tolerate the crap I've been taking... .I'll be honest I'm afraid of him. But it doesn't take much to scare me and I hate confrontation. I have been keeping notes of many of his actions. He is angry with the world. He keeps threatening to kill my cat and guinea pigs because they bother him... .is he serious or not... .it still upsets me to hear him say this.

Last summer him and I were walking down a street by some parked cars when he told me he could break everyone of the windows in the cars and not give a f~}%. These was one of the first time he verbalized to me his total lack of empathy... .

He talks about beating up a person at the doughnut store because his bagel wasn't cut straight ect. He talks about how stupid everyone one is and how smart he is... .

There is so much more to tell... .i am so torn that I have created this monster... .

[7babies]

Please be safe. I know this is extremely painful but you and your youngest deserve not to be threatened.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Hopelessandlost]

I remember thinking when I was dealing with my ex husband if only I had been stronger and more able to stand up to him things might have been different. I have those same feelings now.

I am pretty isolated from the world, other then for my youngest. My parents disowned me when I left my ex. They didn't believe in divorce for any reason and blamed me for not making it work... .they also disowned my kids, their grandchildren at the same time. Five siblings followed my parents and never spoke with me or my kids again. I have one sister that lives a couple hours from me that is educated and totally believes in me and why things happened the way they did. She cut ties with my parents because of me. My parents have their own mental health issues at one point they had over 50 cats in their small bungalow. The house was a health nightmare. My mother was very controlling and I lived a very isolated childhood, not really allowed to have friends or belong to anything. I was the oldest so I always had child care duties with my siblings. I was never allowed to date... .

So when I met my ex as a pen pal and he told me he loved me I fell like a ton of bricks. My parents never have told me that ever. Love was not an emotion in my childhood home... .

Anyhow that is a bit of the background from where I came and why I feel as alone as I do. I do have a boyfriend but he has his own depressive issues and tends to just listen to me without helping me through things at all. Maybe I need something more... .thanks for listening... .

[heartandwhole]

Anyhow that is a bit of the background from where I came and why I feel as alone as I do. I do have a boyfriend but he has his own depressive issues and tends to just listen to me without helping me through things at all. Maybe I need something more... .thanks for listening... .

Hopeless, I'm sorry that you didn't get the love and care that you needed in childhood. That is very painful.   And it certainly makes sense to find yourself in situations and relationships that evoke that same theme.

Have you seen a therapist to help you work through these issues?

I found it very helpful after my relationship with pwBPD. Through that relationship, I understood a lot more about my family of origin, and how my coping strategies were limiting me and causing me pain.

Waiting until May for your abuse center appointment is a long time. I agree that those statements by your children are concerning and would make me feel very uncomfortable. Please do keep the hotline/helpline numbers handy. Reaching out to a live person who understands what you are going through is just a phone call away. Sometimes we need immediate, one-on-one help, which we can't give here on the forum.

Keep posting and let us know how you are doing. 

heartandwhole

[Kwamina]

Hi again Hopelessandlost

Hello all, I am feeling very alone in my Personal family hell. Only my youngest is sharing it with me as we support each other.

The situation with your other children is very difficult indeed. I hope that you posting here will help you feel a bit less alone and that the advice you get here will prove helpful

I am torn in my thoughts. I will miss her but on the other hand I don't really know why... .will I miss the continued abuse from her?

Even after all she has said and done, she is still your daughter and I think it is normal you on some level would still miss her then.

I'll be honest I'm afraid of him. But it doesn't take much to scare me and I hate confrontation. I have been keeping notes of many of his actions. He is angry with the world. He keeps threatening to kill my cat and guinea pigs because they bother him... .is he serious or not... .it still upsets me to hear him say this.

Considering the things your son says and does, I think you definitely have reason to be concerned. Did your son always have violent tendencies like this? You mentioned that since his teen years he's been a handful, was he already violent and/or making violent threats back then?

There is so much more to tell... .i am so torn that I have created this monster... .

You may be his mother, but your son is an adult and responsible for his own behavior. He might not be a monster, but he definitely is behaving very poorly and that's 100% on him, he is responsible for his own behavior just like every other adult is only responsile for his or her own behavior.

I remember thinking when I was dealing with my ex husband if only I had been stronger and more able to stand up to him things might have been different. I have those same feelings now.

Once we know better, we can do better. It is possible to do the best you can with what you know in the circumstances and still say that you could have done things better. The two statements 'doing the best you could' and 'could have done things better', can co-exist and both be true at the same time.

Anyhow that is a bit of the background from where I came and why I feel as alone as I do. I do have a boyfriend but he has his own depressive issues and tends to just listen to me without helping me through things at all. Maybe I need something more... .thanks for listening... .

Thanks for sharing some of your background story. That does help to understand where you are coming from and why you feel the way you do. I myself am a member from the Coping and Healing Board and have a uBPD mom, uBPD older sister and also a narcissistic brother. I am verry sorry your parents and a lot of your siblings treated you this way and didn't support you when you divorced from your abusive husband. I am glad though that you at least have one sister who is supportive of you. How does that sister view your children's behavior?

So when I met my ex as a pen pal and he told me he loved me I fell like a ton of bricks. My parents never have told me that ever. Love was not an emotion in my childhood home... .

Many of our members have experienced something similar. When your parents are unwiling and/or unable to consistently show you the love you need, people will often desperately look elsewhere for love and approval. Unfortunately this can make us vulnerable to getting into relationships to fast with people who have issues of their own. As a result we might find ourselves in our adult lives in relationships that basically recreate the drama we experienced with our parents growing up. It is what it is though, you cannot change the past but you can work on getting a hold on things in the present.

Double hugs from The Board Parrot  

[Hopelessandlost]

My daughter who I had spoke about here has left with the guy from the states (we are in Canada). She will be living in arazonia with him I believe. Apart from all her dysfunctional background I have stated already this is a woman who is very intolerant of living with other people, very OCD about everything. She has never lived with anyone over a couple weeks and then her and that friend were at each other's throats by the end.
I havent spoken with her since she hacked into a personal conversation on my fb account that my sister and I had a couple weeks back.  My sister is the only family member that I can talk openly to about a lot of this stuff with my kids. Anyhow there was never an apolize of any kind that she had done anything wrong. It was all about the conversation that I had had about her with my sister and what a bad mother I am. I had one message sent last week of a photo of her giving me the finger and the quote "hey stupid ___". She then tried to call me... .I did not engage. Im tired of playing her games.

In the past when she pulled these stunts I always felt responsible to go back to communicating with her because I needed to get her to doctors appointments, dentists , she needed prescriptions filled or counsoling appointments ect. This time she has this new guy to use and I have been quickly disguarded... .without a second glance... .
Will I ever see her again... .at this point the freedom of her leaving is to much of a plus to think about that. One down... .

[Studebaker]

I am so sorry you are going through this. It sounds like a very tough situation. Keep reading and posting. Take care of yourself and your younger son. You and he are priority now. One more thing... .it's not your fault!

[Hopelessandlost]

Thank you ... .I have to keep being reminded that it isn't my fault... .I seem to take on blame so easily. Part of my personality I guess... .

[Hopelessandlost]

hi all, still no contact from my daughter. I guess when you have limited feelings and empathy for people (doesn't matter for who you can walk away and not look back and not feel anything). I have done so much for her and have been hurt so much at the same time... .

I head with my oldest son tomorrow for a psych assessment that we have waited months for... .not sure what would be the best to hear at this point... .

[heartandwhole]

I head with my oldest son tomorrow for a psych assessment that we have waited months for... .not sure what would be the best to hear at this point... .

Hopeless, let us know how that appointment goes. 

[Hopelessandlost]

hi all i just got a minute but does anyone know about adult ADHD? The doctor my son seen kept mentioning this as a possibility. I wont get to see all the paper work till next week though. hugs to everyone!

[Kwamina]

hi all i just got a minute but does anyone know about adult ADHD? The doctor my son seen kept mentioning this as a possibility. I wont get to see all the paper work till next week though. hugs to everyone!

Here is a link to information you might find helpful:

DSM Definition: Attention-Deficit/Hyperactivity Disorder

Got some hugs for you too

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Hopelessandlost]

Would ADHD explain the lack of empathy and huge sense of eneititlement? I researched that adult ADHD can involve anger and rage but just not sure... .my son does have racing thoughts and finds it hard to concertarte and has no patience and he is his employers best worker because he works almost machine like, he doesn't stop that sounds like ADHD.

I'm pretty sure there is some overlap of disorders here... .

[Kwamina]

I'm pretty sure there is some overlap of disorders here... .

You could very well be right, this is from our article ':)SM Definition: Borderline Personality Disorder':

Common co-occurring disorders include depressive and bipolar disorders, substance use disorders, eating disorders (notably bulimia nervosa), posttraumatic stress disorder, and attention-deficit/hyperactivity disorder. Borderline personahty disorder also frequently co-occurs with the other personality disorders.

DSM Definition: Borderline Personality Disorder

Getting the right diagnosis can definitely be helpful as it can make it easier to get the proper help. Regardless of te exact diagnosis though, what can also help is identifying and focusing on the problematic traits your son has. What was your general feeling after your oldest son's psych assessment? How do you feel about the doctor?

[Hopelessandlost]

My ex husband who my sons behaviours minic exactly was never diagnoised with anything but depression but he was also never honest with his psychriast. And the couple times I tried to be honest I got verbally attacked by my ex before we even got to the car to head home. I had learned it was not safe to tell the doctor the truth... .ever... .

Once I see the actual written report in the next week I will have a better gage at how the psychriast actually seen him. I had this same issue with my daughter, no one wants to listen to those closet to the ill person and it took forever to get a diagnosis. My daughter can present pretty good if she has to, manipulation is one of her better skills. Its only those in an intimate family relationship with her like myself know the truth. I believe we see things that the ill person doesn't see or want to see in themselves and I believe a diagnosis can be clearer if family members are listened to. But They are over 18 you have no say... .it's sad

[wendydarling]

Hi Hopelessandlost

I want to say hi to you and send you my support and a very big loving hug  . It sounds like your son is working with you in helping himself gain a diagnosis, am I reading that correctly? My 28DD was diagnosed BPD 2 years ago, she needed to know her dx and that I was walking with her, validating her journey with love and care. I've never been party to her diagnosis, apart from my DD sharing her diagnosis with me, she shares her progress with treatment from time to time when it's right for her, that's fine as it is her responsibility she is an adult. I hope all goes well for your son and you next week, it's ok to stand back and let him walk forward to work it out for himself and release you.

Thinking of you 

Hope.
WDx

[Hopelessandlost]

Again just a quick message that has me a bit upset. My sister found my daughters blog online and sent me the link. I didn't have to read it all, it is the same crap over and over again. All about poor her and how I am the ___ from hell... .how she hopes moving and this new guy will make her life all new again. How I am causing her to move.  Part of the write up was on her abusive father and how she feels for him and connected with him because of their mental illness. As far as I know they haven't spoken in years, but she always has a picture of him and me in our dating days on her bedside table. She tore apart every member of the family in some way, but as usual was particularly distructive to me... .I'm am so tired of this... .

Going to talk to the family doctor tonight about my sons status from out assessment last week. It is never ending... .

[Hopelessandlost]

My son has been diagnoised with social anxiety disorder, obsessive compulsive  and narcissistic personality  disorder. They are recommending starting and upping to 200 mg Zoloft

Any one Have experience with this drug?

[Kwamina]

Hi again Hopelessandlost 

Considering what you've shared about your son so far, it does not surprise me that he's been diagnosed NPD. This is a very difficult disorder though, but now that he's been diagnosed he can hopefully get more specific treatment for his issues.
Do you know if he'll asides from the medication wil be getting targeted (talking) therapy now?

Through these links you will find some information about Zoloft and other medications:

Psychotherapy and Therapeutic Drugs

Understanding and Treating Borderline Personality Disorder

Depression: Stop Being Tortured by Your Own Thoughts

[Hopelessandlost]

The diagnosis didn't surprize me either... .I talked to a lady from the region  here who offer mental health services. We are going to get him a caseworker and start him in an anxiety group in the fall. Waiting lists here for services are awful. We are hoping his new drug will have lots of  time to kick in by then.

When the doctor mentioned the NPD diagnosis it was like a cloud was lifted from over me. As much as I realize it is a nasty diagnosis andi feel for my son. It answered so many questions about my ex husband and my other children that fit this diagnosis. I understand it can have a heavy genetic linkage. No one would listen to me In the past when I would describe my ex husbands behaviours and children's behaviour, but it was all right there... .and of cours they always denied everything... .

[Hopelessandlost]

Been studying up further in narcissism and between my research and my son s behaviour I see little hope in this situation. In fact I'm scared as to where it is all going to lead.

He had music on this morning and I was humming to it and he told me to stop he doesn't like humming. I am not about to start a rage over my humming so I stopped. You can see who has control here. This is the exact behaviour that my ex husband and daughter display. I am thankful when he goes to work... .my youngest and I are back to walking on egg shells. This son smokes his pot, drinks his beer and plays video games when he is home. He doesn't help out and has only paid me 100$ in the couple months he has been back here toward expenses. He paid me nothing all the time he was here before he moved out in december. He doesn't help with even the simplistic chores, taking garbage out or dishes... .he eats basically take out pizzzia and doughnuts and coffee.

We head to court Tuesday, we'll see how this goes. Of course he appears not at all worried and says it's simple he will kill himself if he goes to jail... .

Between dealing with him and my daughter I think I've hit a depressive state. I feel close to crying a lot lately, and have little motivation to do anything with him around... .