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Author Topic: Big step for me  (Read 918 times)
Finallyawake
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« on: April 21, 2017, 05:21:42 AM »

I am sure this will sound like no big deal to most other people, but I took two big steps today. Since last year, I have been working on myself so that I can someday establish healthy boundaries with my BPD mother. I am the non-BPD in her life.

Today, I reserved a po box for myself (she opens and reads a lot of my mail) and I emailed a psychologist to ask questions and eventually make an appointment for myself.

I am in my 40's and these are things I have never done before without my mother knowing. She basically depends on me completely and forces me to be dependent on her, so these are big steps for me. I am finally doing things for myself. She would be furious at me if she knew. My stomach is very upset right now, but I am doing this!
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Kwamina
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« Reply #1 on: April 21, 2017, 06:41:48 AM »

Hi Finallyawake

I also saw your other thread and I too remember you  Thanks for your updates.

Taking one step at a time is very wise after living with your disordered mother for so long. I can understand why your stomach might feel this way. That feeling too will pass though and what will also help is to keep in mind that your mother's behavior stems from her distorted thinking and perception. Even if she would be furious, that does not mean that you've done anything wrong, it's her disorder speaking. You have the right to assert yourself and set boundaries Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

It's wonderful that you are taking these steps forward and I hope you will continue to grow and heal  
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Finallyawake
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« Reply #2 on: April 21, 2017, 10:03:28 AM »

Thank you for that response. You are so right, but I appreciate it being said. Yes, it has taken me a long time to realize her thinking is distorted.

Just this morning, she dropped something. I didn't care and simply helped her pick it up. Then she said I was angry at her for dropping the thing and that I'm mad at her all the time. Same thing happened yesterday. She spilled some milk in the kitchen. I offered to help clean it up. She got furious. She said she spilled it on herself, not the floor. Then she mocked what I said by sarcasticlly asking if I was offering to clean her legs and thighs (which sounded REALLY disgusting to hear her say). Then she said I was making fun of her for spilling the milk and she can't take how I am angry at her all the time.

I was not the least bit angry at my mother for dropping or spilling these things and I certainly did not make fun of her for spilling milk. Both times, she was completely 100% wrong about me.

I know she is projecting her own opinions of herself on me. I am guessing she was probably angry at herself or it reminded her of a time in her past where maybe her father or someone else got angry at her for dropping something. The projecting/ gaslighting has hurt me for years. It is only within the past year or so that I truly understand what is going on with her. I used to blame myself for everything she accused me of.

Relating her distorted thinking to me getting the p.o. box and contacting a psychologist - I do realize I am not doing anything wrong. My fears are that she will find out. However, I know that is extremely unlikely. It also still takes some getting used to that I am keeping things from her. I used to feel compelled to tell her everything. That is no longer the case, but I do feel guilt that I have to keep things from her. I temper that guilt by telling myself that I am an adult and don't need to tell my mother everything. Also, I would not need the p.o. Box and the psychologist if it was not for her.
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Kwamina
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« Reply #3 on: April 28, 2017, 04:18:19 PM »

Hi again Finallyawake

Then she mocked what I said by sarcasticlly asking if I was offering to clean her legs and thighs (which sounded REALLY disgusting to hear her say).

I can understand why you found this quite unpleasant to hear. Was this the first time your mother has said something like this to you?

Relating her distorted thinking to me getting the p.o. box and contacting a psychologist - I do realize I am not doing anything wrong. My fears are that she will find out. However, I know that is extremely unlikely. It also still takes some getting used to that I am keeping things from her. I used to feel compelled to tell her everything. That is no longer the case, but I do feel guilt that I have to keep things from her. I temper that guilt by telling myself that I am an adult and don't need to tell my mother everything. Also, I would not need the p.o. Box and the psychologist if it was not for her.

Fear and guilt can really keep us trapped in unhealthy dynamics. I am glad you are taking steps to break these dynamics Doing the right thing (click to insert in post) Pete Walker has said some very relevant and powerful things about fear and guilt that you might find helpful:

"Feel the fear in your body without reacting to it. Fear is just an energy in your body that cannot hurt you if you do not run from it or react self-destructively to it."[/quote]

"Feeling guilty does not mean I am guilty. I refuse to make my decisions and choices from guilt; sometimes I need to feel the guilt and do it anyway. In the inevitable instance when I inadvertently hurt someone, I will apologize, make amends, and let go of my guilt. I will not apologize over and over. I am no longer a victim. I will not accept unfair blame. Guilt is sometimes camouflaged fear. – “I am afraid, but I am not guilty or in danger”."

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Finallyawake
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« Reply #4 on: April 29, 2017, 08:54:28 AM »

Hi Kwamina,

Yes, that was the first time she said something like that. Her intention was to make me feel stupid for offering to help her, probably because she felt stupid for spilling the milk.

She often assumes I am making fun of her when she does something wrong, which of course I would never do.

It blows my mind that she actually thinks I would make fun of her. I have many serious concerns about her, but honestly I cannot remember ever making fun of her. It is just not something I would do. When she does something she views as wrong, I think she beats herself up inside and then blames me for how she feels about herself, projecting her own feelings onto me as if I said them.

In fact, yesterday she was furious at me because I suggested that she should not wear her winter jacket (with a fake fur trimmed hood). Yes, her hands were very cold, but I was only making a suggestion. It was 60 degrees outside and it was supposed to be in the low 80's later in the day. She reacted to me by being angry, making all kinds of gaslighting comments, and acting like I was wrong about the temperature. Then, about 12 hours later, she brought it up again and said my comments about the weather upset her all day. I was stunned that she took issue with something that to me was not much more than small talk.

Of course, today she is acting like nothing ever happened. She's back to acting perfectly nice and normal. I know this will be short-lived.

Thank you for the insights about fear and guilt. I am not letting those emotions stop me anymore, but it is stressful. Since my last post in this thread, I actually went to the post office with my boyfriend and picked up my key (I paid for the p.o. box online). I also spoke to the psychologist's receptionist and got on the waiting list so I can be seen as of July. I did confirm this psychologist can assist a non-BPD, so I am optimistic about this.
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Panda39
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« Reply #5 on: April 29, 2017, 11:01:22 AM »

I am sure this will sound like no big deal to most other people, but I took two big steps today. Since last year, I have been working on myself so that I can someday establish healthy boundaries with my BPD mother. I am the non-BPD in her life.

Today, I reserved a po box for myself (she opens and reads a lot of my mail) and I emailed a psychologist to ask questions and eventually make an appointment for myself.

These are not small things, these are BIG! and awesome things! You are taking care of you! You are living my little mantra... .

"Have you ever looked fear in the face, and said I just don't care"... .(Glitter in the Air by:Pink).  

I was stuck in a dysfunctional marriage for years due to fear so though not the same situation you are in I can really relate to some of what you are dealing with.  You are pushing through the fear and it isn't easy, it can be hard, it can be scary, but I'm here to tell you it is soo worth it!  I came to discover the more things I was scared to do, that I overcame, the more confidence I developed and the braver I became and the more my self esteem grew.

I discovered that I was the one that kept myself trapped in my unhappy marriage.  I was the key to my own freedom and my own happiness.

You have just taken the first steps and as they said back in the day... ."Keep on Truckin"

I am in my 40's and these are things I have never done before without my mother knowing. She basically depends on me completely and forces me to be dependent on her, so these are big steps for me. I am finally doing things for myself. She would be furious at me if she knew. My stomach is very upset right now, but I am doing this!

You are stepping out of the dysfunctional dynamic you have known your whole life that isn't easy, it's scary and it's brave and it's exciting of course your stomach has butterflies with army boots... .but keep pushing through that and do what you need to do for you.  You deserve to live your life as you choose, even though you have been told/taught otherwise.  It is okay to love yourself, to take care of yourself, and put your needs before the needs of your mother or anyone else... .this is not selfish, this is self love, self care.

I'm cheering you on!  

Panda39

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"Have you ever looked fear in the face and just said, I just don't care" -Pink
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« Reply #6 on: May 09, 2017, 04:26:02 PM »

Panda39 reading your story reminds me of the ridiculous levels of control these people have. 

Molding and shaping everything around them.  Don't worry about the PO box, she'll never know if you don't tell.  She'll probably notice you not receiving mail, but you'll shrug your shoulders and be as bewildered as she is.  Always a big push these days for online billing, so that can be one excuse, other stuff like magazines and subscriptions can be 'cancelled', so that excuses anything like that, e-greetings cards, if I think of more I'll pop back.

Don't feel guilty for taking steps to untangle from this.  It's very easy to say, I know, but sometimes it's the only solution.  I've just completed a Masters degree that I never told mine about - I'd get too much grief for my autonomous thinking and decision making, so I didn't open the door to it.

The other day my friend asked if I wanted to go to a concert.  She had been going with someone else but the friend dropped out and said to just pass on the ticket, no charge.  Instead of saying 'oh, that's great, how generous that she offered it to you, are you looking forward to it?  Who is it? (Anastasia btw :D)  Where is it?' etc', all i got was negative snarling.  She spoils everything with jealousy, negativity and bile. As I've said in a previous post, she would come out of an empty room with a black eye.

My attempts with her over the years were fruitless, of course they were only going to be.  I had too much faith in my ability to be the perfect child and draw out the loving mother that I was convinced was in there.  I now think limited contact is best. 

She's a waste of my time and resources.  It's like teaching a tortoise the alphabet, you can devote as much time, effort, motivation, empathy, patience and commitment in the world, but when all is said and done that tortoise is never going to pen a masterpiece.
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« Reply #7 on: May 09, 2017, 04:45:11 PM »

So very proud of you, finallyawake!  These are big steps indeed. 

My most favorite book title (and I do mean title because I never read the book... .despite being eternally inspired by the title) is FEEL THE FEAR AND DO IT ANYWAY! 

That is exactly what you are doing.  Keep up the wonderfully courageous and smart work!

XOXO
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« Reply #8 on: May 09, 2017, 04:47:11 PM »

Hello Finallyawake,

I am so so proud of you. Look at you !

I also of course understand your fears. I have a BPD mum myself.
However... .what is the worst that could happen, when your mum found out ? She'd be angry, for sure. But she's angry already !
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« Reply #9 on: May 09, 2017, 06:32:33 PM »

what is the worst that could happen, when your mum found out ? She'd be angry, for sure. But she's angry already !
BINGO!  That's it exactly!
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Fie
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« Reply #10 on: May 10, 2017, 01:47:02 PM »

Finallyawake,

I was thinking about something that I wanted to tell you.
Right in the beginning when I was starting to understand that the behavior of my mum always has been a little 'off' (you know, the famous 'light bulb moment', my good friend asked me : 'Why are you so afraid of her?'
(she's a psychologist - I now know that she of course understood the dynamics in families like mine, and she *knew* why I was so afraid. She just wanted to throw the question out there.

Hearing that question, I felt like : 'heh, duh, of course I am afraid of her, she's always making sure that I am'.
I somehow understood my FOO's game by than, so I knew that this fear was because she was unpredictable, always angry, never happy upon seeing me feeling good about myself, etc.

But really, my friend's question was rhetorical. Because yes, I could give her a bunch of reasons why I was so afraid, all coming down to the fact that I had learned to be, as a child.
But what I did not really fully understand yet by then, is that *as an adult*, there is *no reason anymore* to be afraid. She triggered me by asking me that question, and slowly slowly I started to see things for what they really were : I was an adult, and my mum was an insecure child. There was no reason to be afraid. If my mum chooses to be angry, I will survive. I don't depend on her anymore for my survival. I can look after myself now.
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Finallyawake
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« Reply #11 on: May 10, 2017, 08:30:35 PM »

Hi everyone. Thank you for all of your responses. Today I switched health insurance plans so the psychologist I want to see this summer will be in-network.

I am so excited and terrified to take these steps. I have the p.o. box key on my keyring. My mom doesn't even notice. I get a little thrill every time I look at it, knowing I am doing something to straighten out my life. I haven't got any mail there yet, but everything is in place. Right now, I will only have my health insurance statements go there. The rest of my mail will go to my house.

My mom recently threatened to not let me practice driving until I do some stuff for her first. Little does she know I finished the driver's manual and I am saving up for a car. I own the car my mom drives (it's old), but the 2nd one will be all mine. That goal will take a few years to save up for, but I will drive and have my own car someday.

It's kind of eye-opening for me to realize just how dysfunctional my life has always been. The more that I talk to my friend, my boyfriend, and post on here, the more I start realizing.

For years, my mother viewed me as all good. If she didn't start splitting and raging at me, I might have never admitted to myself that I am a grown woman who is in a virtual prision that I let my mother keep me in.

I know that I can be free any time I choose, but I need help from a psychologist to be able to take that step.
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« Reply #12 on: May 13, 2017, 07:50:16 AM »

Good for you! Most/All of us have used techniques like that to help us cope. I might have missed this, but do you live with her? I was guessing by her reading your mail that you do. You must find a way to not live together. It is essential to finding peace. Yes, it will be very difficult, but trust me, in the long run you will be much happier and more peaceful. In the chaotic lives created by this (and other things) peace is essential.
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Finallyawake
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« Reply #13 on: May 15, 2017, 01:43:50 PM »

Yes, my mother and I do live together. I own my home and my mother lives in it. I don't see a way to get her out. She won't go. I asked her to move out three times during arguments, in fact twice in the last year! However, I realize that she needs me, and I am not about to evict her.

My goal for my relationship with my mother is to still be close to her and care for her. I am okay with her continuing to live with me. However, I want to drive, make decisions for myself, and be able to openly go out with friends and a boyfriend without a rage response from my mother. She is getting what she wants. Now it is time for me to get what I want.

I don't know if it's somewhat from a lifetime of enmeshment or just love alone, but I don't want to go no contact with my mother. I really hope this is possible. She's the one with BPD, not me. I don't see that my relationship with her has to be fully enmeshed or no contact - black & white thinking. I would like to think that a third way (as I described in the previous paragraph) is possible.

I do understand that no contact or limited contact would be the easy way to reclaim my life. However, I view that as a last resort for me. I am hoping that with enough therapy and educating myself that I will be able to achieve this.
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« Reply #14 on: May 15, 2017, 02:36:19 PM »

Hello Dear Finallyawake 

Excerpt
I realize that she needs me

Where does she need you for ?
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Finallyawake
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« Reply #15 on: May 15, 2017, 03:52:39 PM »

My mother needs me for a variety of reasons:

1. She does not earn enough in retirement to get by on her own. She does pay her own way, but she could not afford anything nearly as good as my home on her own, even though I am not rich. 
2. She is afraid to be alone.
3. I am her parent, friend, cook, doctor, tech support, comic relief, (emotional) punching bag, repair person, etc. She depends on me for just about everything.

She often says she wants to learn how to do all the things I do, but comes up with every excuse imaginable to not learn. Then she projects and blames me for not teaching her how to do things.

Most recently, she threatened to not let me learn how to drive again until I teach her how to do all the things she depends on me for.
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« Reply #16 on: May 16, 2017, 02:27:28 PM »

To me personally only the first reason you mentioned might be a 'need' in the real sense of the word.

Would her pension allow her to live by herself, albeit in a smaller home then she is living in now (yours) ? If no, is there other family that could help out financially ? Maybe, since your mother has a pension, only a small contribution could even be enough ?

Number 2, being afraid to be alone, I know all too well. As a lot of children of BPD I have abandonment issues. I have dealt with most of them, but there was a time I was really afraid to be alone. Luckily one can grow.
I have a daughter, I am terrified of the day she will once leave home. But not a single hair on my head would think about expecting her to stay. This is her life and she has only one. I have my own and should respect that she also has one. Why should I get double, and leave her with nothing ? Because I am afraid to be alone ? These are my demons. She has nothing to do with them and will have her own things to deal with.

The things you mentioned under 3 are all things that children should not be for their parent. No one should be *everything* for someone else (unless babies, who are dependent on their parents for everything).
People can hire others to be their doctor, cook, tech support, repair person etc. And punching bag well ... .

Seriously sweetheart... .

If you do not like me saying all of this, please tell me and I will only reply to concrete questions you will be asking in your posts. I do not want to disturb you with my opinion if you are not ready.
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Finallyawake
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« Reply #17 on: May 16, 2017, 04:13:51 PM »

Hi Fie,

You are absolutely right. My mother expects way too much of me. Unfortunately, the answers to all of your questions are "no". She could not even afford the very cheapest rent on her own. There is no one who could help her out financially, not even a small amount. There are no other relatives she could live with.

Your view of not depending on your daughter is 1000% more healthy a view than my mother's view. I would be perfectly fine without depending on her. She would be destroyed if she could not depend on me.

I do love her and am okay with her living with me. I just need to stop her from depending on me so incredibly much. The more I examine this, the more I start to wonder if this is the real reason she won't let me drive or have a life separate from her. Maybe controlling me is her way of feeling in control because she depends on me so much.
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« Reply #18 on: May 17, 2017, 12:37:17 PM »

Hi Finallyawake

I am a grown woman who is in a virtual prision that I let my mother keep me in.

I know that I can be free any time I choose, but I need help from a psychologist to be able to take that step.

We all need help in our lives at some point and being able to recognize that is already a very significant step forward Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

What I believe is also crucial is to indeed recognize the roll you yourself play in the dynamics between you and your mother. Regardless of what she has done in the past and is still doing now, you are an adult now and responsible for your own behavior and choices.

Our BPD loved ones can do a lot of things, the reality though is that they cannot control us unless we allow them to. Moving forward I think an important thing for you to examine is why you let yourself be controlled by your mother. After a lifetime of dealing with this, it is understandable and normal that you would be affected in some ways. Little changes such as changing your language to describe events can already have quite a positive effect, such as saying "how we let others control us" instead of "how others control us". This is more empowering because it puts the focus on you and your own role and ultimately the only person you have any real control over is you and not your mother. But by changing your own behavior and responses, changing your way of communicating and setting an enforcing/boundaries, you can definitely change the relationship dynamics between you and your mother.

She would be destroyed if she could not depend on me.

I also encourage you to look at the way you label things? Using strong words such as 'destroyed' likely triggers a lot of emotions also in yourself, but is it realistic that your mother would really be destroyed if she could not depend on you for everything? It might hurt, anger, sadden etc., but would she really be destroyed? Perhaps using different language here can also help you, some tips from dr. David Burns come to mind:

"The Semantic Method: Simply substitute language that is less colorful and emotionally loaded."

It sometimes might seem like a little thing, but the words we ourselves use to describe things can greatly affect how we feel and think about those same things.

Take care

The Board Parrot
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« Reply #19 on: May 18, 2017, 01:37:40 PM »

Hi Finallyawake.  I am so excited to see you taking the steps that will help free you from the prison you have been in for so long.  Planning all the steps out requires a lot of courage and strength and apparently you have those in spades!

I love what Kwamina says here:
Excerpt
Little changes such as changing your language to describe events can already have quite a positive effect, such as saying "how we let others control us" instead of "how others control us". This is more empowering because it puts the focus on you and your own role and ultimately the only person you have any real control over is you and not your mother. But by changing your own behavior and responses, changing your way of communicating and setting an enforcing/boundaries, you can definitely change the relationship dynamics between you and your mother.
He is so right about changing the words we use to describe our situations.  This alone can have a huge impact, I know it did for me.  I still find myself using self-limiting phrases and when I catch them and take back my power (apologies for the cliche) I can feel my mindset change. 

Your mothers potential emotions and reactions do not define reality for you nor do they have to define reality.  A relatively small change like this can have a huge impact and can help prepare you for the future you are planning.

As always, be well.  Still rooting for ya!
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« Reply #20 on: May 19, 2017, 06:02:49 PM »

More progress -

I switched insurance companies and just called to schedule my first appointment with the psychologist for July. Mom will be taking me to the appointments. I told her I am going to the medical building for work and she totally bought that explanation!

I am continuing to save up for a car and I am currently reading Surviving a Borderline Parent, which is really good.

I am also improving at having anger towards my mother. My mother has tried everything imaginable to punish and shame me whenever I felt anger at any point during my whole life.

I learned from the book that it's okay to feel anger. My go-to method of responding to my own anger has always been to suppress and deny it. Now I know that I am not bad for feeling anger. What is more important is what I do with that anger. I am choosing to let it motivate me to bring some positive change in my life.

Yesterday, my mother got angry at me because I seemed angry. (How hypocritical is that?) Of course, she accused me of not loving her (a splitting tactic I am now immune to, which used to make me cry and beg for forgiveness in the past).

She told me anger is not allowed in our home. I corrected her. I said anger is a normal emotion and what is more important is why I am angry and what I am doing about it. I asked her why she would not simply ask me why I was angry. It actually led to a good conversation.

And yes, I will start being more careful with the words I use to describe things. I agree, words are very powerful.

That's all I've got for now, but I wanted to share this info.
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« Reply #21 on: June 10, 2017, 12:47:05 PM »

From your posts, I am so happy to see you gaining strength! Each step toward independence helps build strength. I might have missed if you mentioned this, but if you don't attend counseling, I strongly urge you to do so. Seek a professional who is familiar with BPD; he/she can give you tools to cope. I know you say you don't mind if she lives with you, but I think you are so close to the situation you can't see the big picture. I should know; I've been there. You certainly do not have to go no contact with your mom, but with me there have been (and are) temporary periods where I don't have contact and I have adjusted. My greatest wish is for you to contact family members and even friends (or ask a counselor) to come up with ideas for how she could live elsewhere. Where there is a will, there is a way. I cannot express to you how much peace you gain by not having the tension, conflict, jealousy, control, and dependency in front of your face at all times. Their disorder has a strong hold on us when we aren't living with them. When you are, you can't come up for air. While it has taken years, the single greatest thing I have done for myself, husband, and son is to limit contact and for me to decide when it happens. It's not easy, but nothing is or ever will be with our moms. BPDs are never able to fill the void. Those of us who try to fill it are only causing pain for ourselves. Not a large amount nor small amount of ____ (whatever they think they need) can ever be enough. You exhaust yourself trying when that energy could be used in a productive, positive focus on finding your inner strength, independence, and peace. I don't mean to be redundant when I talk about peace; when I finally found it, I realized I had been searching for it for most of my life.
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Finallyawake
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« Reply #22 on: June 16, 2017, 12:15:23 PM »

Thank you for your post. I am going to see a psychologist that specializes in BPD. I have now told three people about my Mom's STRONGLY suspected BPD. One person has stopped being in contact with me (forever too busy) since I told her, but the other two have been supportive.

Yes, I would love to have my mother move out of my home. However, you have to understand, she is in her 70's and we have always lived together. We have no family she could live with. Shockingly (I'm being sarcastic here), she is the black sheep of the family. I am disowned because I was loyal to her. There is no making any sort of peace with my family. Besides, most of them are quite dysfunctional themselves, so I would be doing myself no favors getting back into their lives. Additionally, any of the less messed up relatives live thousands of miles away. Those relatives would not take my mother or help her out. I also could not trust them to keep anything I say confidential. Mom could not afford to live on her own and she's not sick enough to be in a nursing home or assisted living, even if she could afford it (which she can't).

I have decided that the best thing I can do in my situation is continue to let my mother live in my home but learn to establish and abide by boundaries that will give me more freedom. My mother is opposed to doctor's, tests, preventative care, routine screenings, and medicines. She has physical symptoms and a questionable diagnosis that required follow-up to rule out a major physical illness. In two years, she has refused to follow up. For someone in their 70's, that is a dangerous stance to take. She can continue to make bad decisions in her own life, but I am quietly taking control of my own and getting stronger daily.

I believe that she tries to control my life because she thinks she knows what is best for me. I do think her intentions are good, but she is such a high functioning somewhat narcissistic hermit witch borderline that she doesn't realize I no longer subscribe to her way of thinking. I don't let her know.

A friend of mine said I am now reverse-gaslighting my mother. For example, my mother told me I never want to move out of state to retire someday. She said she has been to those other places I am interested in (like 50 years ago!) and she knows that are bad. Realizing there is no point in discussing this with her, I told her I agreed with her. In reality, I totally disagree with her!

My dream is to move away from where I live right now when I retire. I'm allowing myself to dream, have goals, and privately disagree with my mother. For the first time in my life, I have decided to stop being the girl my mother has told me I am and instead discover/be the woman who I truly am.
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Panda39
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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner’s ex
Relationship status: SO and I have been together 9 years and have just moved in together this summer.
Posts: 3462



« Reply #23 on: June 16, 2017, 02:22:03 PM »



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"Have you ever looked fear in the face and just said, I just don't care" -Pink
Finallyawake
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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Parent
Posts: 67


« Reply #24 on: June 16, 2017, 04:46:48 PM »

Thank you!
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