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Author Topic: Update - dx change  (Read 542 times)
Lollypop
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« on: May 15, 2017, 02:43:05 AM »

Hi

So my adult son 26 has had a re-diagnosis GAD, depression with BPD traits - this was done privately... He's been recommended somatic experiencing therapy - again, will need to be private. The NHS refuse to treat him (CBT) until he's drug free.

I've been on the path of trying to help him. He's had three months of a steady downward spiral. The re-assessment and support provided by the psychiatrist has buoyed my son up and he's had a very good week. I understand that this will only be temporary as he's in a two week cycle of pattern with the GF and I predict by next weekend it'll kick off again.

My son hasn't contacted the psychologist to find out about the somatic therapy. I think it may be because it was suggested that it would be useful to write some notes about himself - this is an obstruction to him taking action. I'm being kind and generous here as I actually feel incredibly frustrated that he's not contacted her yet.

I sat in the dark last night watching tv. My son came in with the GF quietly, went to the kitchen and helped themselves to food, went upstairs without even saying hello. I was miffed and went into the hall and was hit with the overpowering smell of weed through the kitchen, hall upstairs to the landing. It hit me (again!), it always comes back to the weed. Why should I be helping him when he's just not willing to help himself?  why does my house smell of weed?  I shouldn't have to put up with this and I totally understand this is within my control.

I'm validating the invalid.  Always.  I need help with this.

Here's an example, son has a really bad pain in his neck and can barely move. This was on the morning of his psychiatric assessment and he was very stressed plus he cricked his neck in the night, I give him some paracetamol and say "this will help with the pain".  I'm doubting whether or not he'll go ahead with the assessment.  My son is extremely reluctant to take the two tablets but says "I'm taking it because I don't want to have to cancel him". 

Assessment took a long time and I could see him wincing later that morning as he was trying to move his neck so I knew the paracetamol was wearing off. After the assessment I suggest taking a couple more and son said "no, I'm not taking any more as I can still feel the other tablets inside me body".

I've learnt that if he FEELS then it must be true to him. I wouldn't say "no, that's not true" as that would be invalidating,

I spoke with the psychiatrist about the contradictions in my son. Son is taking purported Valium off the Internet (he has no idea if it is real Valium or the contents of the pill), he smokes weed every day. Yet he won't take a paracetamol despite being in pain. The psychiatrist says that's just nonsense and he needs to be told "you cannot feel the tablets, not taking a pain killer when you're in pain is wrong".  I can see the psychiatrists point, he's challenging my sons thought process. By challenging I wouldn't be validating the invalid. By not challenging, I'm perpetuating his thoughts.

The psychiatrist also said "you know, a little knowledge can be very harmful". He's referring to my sons ego and his own perceived indepth knowledge of pharamaceutivsls and drugs.

To be honest, I'm feeling so confused right now.

I've decided to not say one word about the about the psychologist. I'm wondering why I should even consider paying if, as I'm feeling, my son won't be prepared to do the homework that comes with it. If he won't work towards reducing the weed then that says everything.  By me, introducing a deal, a requirement into this situation in muddying the waters and he'll get confused.  It's a lot of money that we'll struggle but can find. I'm sorry I'm all over the place as you can read.

Let's stick to my problem. When to challenge.  How can I stop validating the invalid?

LP
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« Reply #1 on: May 15, 2017, 07:30:49 AM »

I am by no means an expert, but I have a schizo son who uses a fair amount of weed. I believe that his usage of it precipitated his schizo ( some research backs this up, as certain vulnerable people will develop schizo from weed usage). I am from Canada, where legalization of it is in the works. My son still uses a fair bit of it, and theories purport that this usage is a means of self medicating. He also smokes tobacco, which is very common in people with mental health problems, and some research supports it's usage as self-medicating as well. He says smoking of either weed or tobacco calms him down and helps him function better. I suppose an addiction in a way, but that's his reasoning. One of the problems with weed today is that it is not the same weed most of us used 50 years or so ago. It's much stronger, and has much more of the bad-type ( there is good vs bad type of THC in all weed) of THC.  Back in the day, not much fiddling was done with the respective levels of the THC compounds and the bad THC was buffered by the good THC. These days, weed contains more of the bad THC, and that is where the problems arise. So, my feeling about weed is that I don't like it, especially it's usage in the teen years. But if my son is using it to mitigate some the negative effects of his mental illness, then I will have to acknowledge that it may be helping him function. His usage has tapered off over the 6-7 years, as I've seen his overall improvement in his life get better. He doesn't need it as much to deal with day to day matters. I don't know if this helps with the weed dilemma.
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« Reply #2 on: May 15, 2017, 11:11:30 PM »

Hi LP

You've understandably a lot on your mind and I can see you sorting through, things are changing, it's confusing as you say and it's good to write it down and throw it out there.  Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

Not sure if useful at this point to stand back a wee step and reflect and also look ahead, while this maybe all clear in your mind I don't see it in your post - the famous LP plan  Smiling (click to insert in post)

Here's a few Q's
- Has the Simple Plan you've been working towards so far changed due to recent events?
- What does LP's 'keep it Simple Plan' look like today, Q's like what are the key priorities, what is achievable, and yes what are the deal breakers, what are the challenges, your limits, what is the timeline, miles stones, the steps etc.  For me plan in place - then use the tools and lessons to deliver.

I can imagine it maybe difficult for your DS to write about himself if he's not able to think clearly, do you think he is struggling with this task taking into account his limitations? Would you use Dearman here? One can only wait as see if he puts the work in. 

I know you desperately want your son to be drug free and there are contradictions flying from all directions as you say, getting him into treatment working with a psychologist and psychiatrist is hopefully the route to get him on that road to drug counselling that he has refused from the NHS - following previous unsatisfactory experiences. If CBT had been offered alongside drugs counselling - ie parallel treatment would he have accepted?

It looks like this to me:
Privately financed: therapy-meds with parallel drugs counselling or drugs counselling following on
Free: drugs counselling followed by CBT- meds

If you accept he is turning down free NHS drugs counselling, you need to be comfortable with his choice you've accepted. If your decision is you pay the cost of private care with the expectation they move him to drugs counselling that is your choice, one to feel comfortable with, to accept. You know I know zilch about weed, internet pills, drugs ... .Beady makes good points about weed - it may help day to day functioning, then again it may precipitate mental health issues ... .

Interesting validating / validating the invalid - re the neck crick and paracetamol, I'm not sure I'm following. DS decided not to take further paracetamol. When he says he can feel it inside, is he communicating it's not yet time to take more?  I can feel the effect of tablets working and wearing off and I can also feel my pain and decide if my pain warrants more meds, it's a personal choice, or am I wrong? "The psychiatrist says that's just nonsense and he needs to be told "you cannot feel the tablets, not taking a pain killer when you're in pain is wrong". Is the psychiatrist invalidating your son? Confusing eh   

Once treatment commences are you expecting patient confidentiality, as you are paying will you ask your son for access to the medics? As you know I have not paid for treatment so far though will be in the future.  It's been bliss not knowing anything at all (apart from what she shares from time to time) letting DD get on with it - it's all hers and I'm cheering her with love.

Treatment is a journey as we know and my experience is we  Bullet: completed (click to insert in post) as we go along  Bullet: completed (click to insert in post) and some successes come first and others come later and there are bumps, easy does it.

So, what are your thoughts LP

WDx




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« Reply #3 on: May 16, 2017, 01:03:39 AM »

Hi Lollypop,

You have a lot going on right now, and I can understand your frustration. In your shoes, I know I'd feel confused about what the professionals have told me, and irritated about my son not making a move toward the treatment that I'm going to be paying for. This is a lot to be hit with at once. I like  Bullet: contents of text or email (click to insert in post) wendydarling's suggestion of breaking the situation down into manageable steps. I know that's easier said than done.  

The weed question is a very interesting one. From what I've heard,  Bullet: contents of text or email (click to insert in post) beady makes a good point: today's weed is different and stronger than what my peers were smoking years ago. It does seem to be a way to self-medicate/soothe. I thought that your son was not smoking in the house—that was a rule he respected—so the smell was emanating from their clothes, maybe?

It's very difficult to see a loved one in pain, and your wanting him to take the paracetamol is very natural and offering it to him a helpful thing to do. Unfortunately, if your son would rather be in pain than take another dose, that is his choice. It does sound strange that he feels the pills inside of him, but perhaps he feels their effects. Maybe he is very sensitive to them. Anyway, you might validate that he feels that way: "It's tough to be in pain, I'm sorry that your neck is hurting again. I hear that you feel the pills inside of you and that you don't want to take anymore. The painkillers are here for you if you change your mind." Or something that feel right to you.

I can see the psychiatrist's point about "telling it like it is," and think in some cases that kind of response could be helpful. He is not living with your dear son, however, and doesn't know him like you do. So, for now I'd trust what has worked for you.

The progress and then setbacks can be draining, LP. Please be gentle with yourself and remember to breathe and fill yourself up with self-compassion. Write it out here, take time out do do some art, and/or anything that makes you feel good and centered again. We're here with you, cheering you on.  

heartandwhole
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« Reply #4 on: May 16, 2017, 01:37:56 AM »

Hi WD & Beady

My big girly boots are back on.  Smiling (click to insert in post)

Weed: 33 years ago I used to type dissertations for extra money. My first was MJ & Schizophrenia and I will never forget that brilliantly written work. There's no doubt in my mind heavy long term MJ use causes serious mental health issues. Particularly when started in the formative years. The psychiatrist confirms this and used an analogy of DS being brainwashed; MJ is good, it can save the world and he needs to have help to see it is harming him. This is why I find my situation incredibly hard as a MJ is legal in a lot of places, it's accepted and it's normal. Beady is right, it's not the same product from 60s and 70s - particularly in the UK where it is really strong (to me the smell is unnaturally strong as an indication).

Plan: my original plan stays. Regardless if he's in treatment or not - he will live independently. He needs to improve his financial management and priorities his responsibilities (rent, register as self employed).
1. Improve relationship
2. Financial mgt
3. Move towards independent living

He is responsible for deciding upon his treatment. He refuses drug counselling. I believe he should have therapy & drug counselling together. He would have refused CBT & Drug counselling free in the NHS. If he pursues this latest idea of somatic experiencing combined with life skills mentoring by the psychiatrist (on a flexible basis) there will have to be a limit - it can't be open ended and there has to be a review to see any improvements.

I promised myself it would be a gradual ramping up, realistic and in keeping with his abilities. He got unwell for 3 months and we got stuck. He was still working (not as much), paying for weed but struggling with keeping to his weekly contribution to his living expenses which is currently only £25 percent - that's unacceptable.

I'm going to insist on more rent and he registers as self employed. Pay tax and NI.

DS is super sensitive about his physical self. I've seen him literally feel his skin was crawling when his hands were dirty. Exposure to land through his work has improved his ideas and he sometimes doesn't wear gloves. It's his hands that are his issue. He says he cal "feel" the paracetamol in his body, like his blood (my words).

I've got complacent. It's a combination of enjoying easier living and hope that he'd problem solve the big issues. He's unable to see the big issues unless he's smacked in the face with them. We have been keeping him in too a comfortable state.

I believe he will always take drugs. I need to get him out of my house and let him find a way that he can live a life independently. I hope this will be by the end of the year.

I forgot to say it's GCSE time and my own final two module assessments. It's been a bit fraught all round.

All calm, boat steady as she goes. Big girly boots at the ready for all weathers.

WD: patient confidentiality. I agree that they are adults and we don't need to know. This helps them understand the line of responsibility. The psychiatrist has wanted me around to help me get him understand the issues but if we enter into a regular arrangement with him then I pass on the involvement. I guess we just pay the bills and I can see this amounting to thousands - this doesn't feel comfortable given that I believe he'll never give up drugs. He's just not ready. He won't until he's too uncomfortable. There has to be a motivation to change.

DS is currently skipping around happy as Larry - still on the wave of motivation following the psychiatrist. Enjoying the words of action, the potential and hope yet does nothing to push it forward.

LP
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Lollypop
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« Reply #5 on: May 16, 2017, 01:45:46 AM »

Hi heart

The smell is from the clothes.  I have to move all items of clothing into the pit of his room and keep the door closed at all times. He doesn't smoke in my house or garden (I guess he does when we go away).

I did open a bag he'd left in the downstairs hall. There's a sealed jar with quite a lot of weed in it. Presumably he doesn't feel safe to leave it in his car. I need to talk to him about this - I said no drugs in the house. But I know he's got the Valium under his bed. He used to take nurofen. This gets very complicated - to him they're all the same thing. To me they're not but I can see a valid argument : what's the difference between any of them? Ah, Ones illegal, one is incredibly dangerous (unknown Valium), the other over the counter. All are damaging.

Thanks everybody for your support.

LP
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« Reply #6 on: May 16, 2017, 01:51:23 AM »

Sorry me again!

Basically this is where I'm at.

I push him forward, I whinge and whine because he's not ready for it all at once (treatment and drugs counselling).

In this order:
DS needs to decide and take action - that's his responsibility.
We need to decide if we pay and take the risk.

Regardless I stick to MY plan.

Hugs to you all.

LP
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« Reply #7 on: May 16, 2017, 07:28:41 AM »

Your sons claim that he can 'feel' the paracetamol in his body sounds very much like my daughters' claims. She, thankfully, does not take illegal drugs, but also resists drugs of any kind, as she claims she can feel them in her body. It's like she is overly sensitive to them.
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« Reply #8 on: May 16, 2017, 07:38:23 AM »

Hi Lollypop,
I really admire how much thought and reflection that you put into how to approach your son, plan for the future, etc.  I can only hope that someday I will be able to react to my daughter, 20, in the same way.  I feel at this point I am so wishy-washy and my own thoughts are all over the map.  One moment I can be calm and determined to let her make her own bad choices, that she is an "adult" and that I will back off and not contact her (particularly when she is ignoring us, or has done something terribly hurtful). And then in the next moment, my anxiety from worrying about her safety is overwhelming.  My thoughts race and I am overcome with heartache, feeling so alone and hopeless.

I can only hope someday that I can come to radical acceptance as you have, and interact with my daughter in a more consistently productive manner.  I have read many of your posts and am inspired by your insights.  Your son is lucky to have such a thoughtful, accepting mother.  I hope today is a good day.   

   
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« Reply #9 on: May 16, 2017, 08:20:49 AM »

Hi mommae

Thanks for your kind words and support. My simple plan has really helped me not to sweat the small stuff. I get distracted, I constantly doubt what I'm doing.

If it's any help to you, I felt exactly the same as you do now. I started to look outwards instead of inwards.

I got myself out of my house and started a part time art course. Suddenly my world opened up, I was talking to other people (not my friends and family who'd just go so tired hearing me harp on about all my problems). I had a new space that I could just be myself, not a parent.  I had no idea how this small but very courageous step would impact my whole life; new friends, new interests and I'm demonstrating to my kids what it means to look after yourself. Yes, I'm here for them but I have my own life now; I've dragged my H along as he didn't want me to change but he sees now that I'm right.

Anxiety and worry are just wasted energy.  I remember the day I announced I was going to college: their mouths dropped to the floor and I silently but nervously giggled to myself. I haven't looked back.

You'll get there, you'll find your own way.  You are not alone, nor helpless. You're here with all of us who totally understand. The heartache, goodness, it's a tough one to bear but it does get better. You're journey starts with you. Take care of yourself, even if is just a deep hot bath, happiness is found in small things.

Hugs

LP
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« Reply #10 on: May 16, 2017, 09:12:59 AM »

Thank you for your thoughtful response the me, Lollypop.  The logical me agrees with everything you've said and I do know that I need to get my own life back.  I have become someone I don't even recognize and barely like anymore.  I find myself boring and hate that I don't want to do the things I once enjoyed, but instead stay cooped up in my house, hiding out.  When I do get out, it comes as a surprise to find I am enjoying myself without the ever there anxiety. 

I am going to try to follow your lead, take the advice I know is right... .heavens I give it to myself everyday and then disregard it.  Time to get me back, for my sake, as well as those around me.  Baby steps - today I am going to head out into the garden for a while.  I used to be able to spend my whole day there, whiling away the hours, taking pleasure in the simplest things.  Now it has been close to a year since I have done virtually anything out there.  My garden needs me and I need it! 

Thank you for validating my feelings, Lollypop.  That you took the time to respond means so much to me! 
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« Reply #11 on: May 16, 2017, 10:15:58 AM »

Hi mommae

Call it what you will but "stitch yourself back together" piece by little piece, stitch by stitch. I'm trying to make sure I use book binding thread because I keep coming undone!

I love that you're going in the garden, sounds perfect and by the sounds of a bit of a project. Somewhere you can sit and breathe - wish I could join you for a cup of tea.

Hugs

LP
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« Reply #12 on: May 16, 2017, 11:41:21 AM »

Hi LP,

I notice with my S15, who I suspect had BPD traits, and at the very least is a Highly Sensitive Person, that he seems to take a strange kind of comfort in feeling physical pain, if that makes sense. He doesn't like the pain (complains) and he also doesn't necessarily try to solve it.

I have wondered if S15's choice to not take medication while simultaneously complaining about pain has to do with his struggles with intimacy, as strange as that sounds. S15 comes to me with a complaint, I offer some suggestions, and he chooses to do nothing. I don't know, it feels like a symbolic interaction that represents all of our other dances around intimacy. A very tiny push pull. Almost like a way to hold me at arms' distance for not responding the correct way. "You cannot give me what I need."

If I am unattached to what S15 does, then he will take a step toward me, asking for some input. He might even take my advice  

My sense is that this is tangled up with the separation stress he feels -- wanting reassurance equal to wanting competence.

They want us to reassure them and make things all better while also wanting to figure things out on their own? And maybe show that they are strong enough to tolerate pain?

I figure these interactions that make no sense are emotional expressions of something, rarely about the thing they seem to be on the surface about.
 
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« Reply #13 on: May 16, 2017, 11:47:42 AM »

That is a great analogy, Lollypop! I'm going go write it on my blackboard in the kitchen... .The one I use for inspirational quotes for myself... .

I did get out to the garden and I DO feel much better.  Eating a bit of lunch and heading back out... .baby steps   Smiling (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #14 on: May 16, 2017, 12:42:44 PM »

Hi LNL

Thank you for your insightful post. That's really interesting to me and I'm going to be very aware and watch the next time it happens.

I gave my DS 6 weeks notice tonight about a rent increase, He was very agitated and I used SET, he accepted that this was more than fair but it was something that "he was really struggling with right now".  He's got a phone bill this week, car insurance on Monday and he needs to pay me two weeks rent (he's late). I know he was hoping I'd say "oh leave it and pay me more next time" but I kept firm. I want the rent money tomorrow. He's has enough money to pay his bills, I know he's got a large jar of pot - he just needs to problem solve and find more work. He disappeared for a while, popped back and then left all smiley.

Steady goes.  I didn't do my merry dance around him, neither did he. This feels different and I'm confident in myself. It's enlightening.

I've come a very long way - assertive but loving.

LP
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« Reply #15 on: May 16, 2017, 01:33:01 PM »

LP,

I think as long as you stick to YOUR plan, you can continue moving your DS along to the ultimate goal... .living independently Smiling (click to insert in post)  I think we can all relate / share in that goal. Hopefully one day for all!

I agree, with what other are saying, small attainable goals are best. It would be too much for anybody to stop cold turkey from any addiction: eating, drug, shopping, drinking. Coupled with mental health disorder and it is all that much more difficult. 

Recently my D and I had an interesting conversation.  She raised the question "do you know how I feel"?  I listened as she's right, I don't! then we sat and I got to share a small bit how I feel as the mom watching her teen suffer and struggle and fight each and every single day.  You know my story, we are fighting a tough fight, but we will continue until we get it right!

Keep up the good work, you are doing great!
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