Ranting in an adjacent room..how best to respond

[formflier]

So... as you can imagine... with a bajillion kids around... something things get said "room to room"... vice face to face.

So... sometimes I'll hear something in an adjacent room and ask for clarification or speak up if I don't hear it well.

So... sometimes she really wants to communicate... sometimes she is ranting... its usually hard to tell the difference.

Tonight it was clear it was a rant... I had turned on a bath fan and turn off running hot water in the shower.  (we sometimes run out... again... lots of people)

So... .I exit the bathroom and she says "please turn my water back on... "

So... I turned it back on... she asked why I turned it off and I responded it was hot and didn't want you to run out.

She walks into the bathroom shuts the door and is ranting about "I wasn't trying to help me... ."

I've not addressed it... .and at the moment can't figure out anything helpful to say.

When I hear an alone rant in another room I should... .?

FF

[once removed]

big pet peeve of mine: im preheating the oven, running a bath, that sort of thing, someone comes along and turns it off. i see a lot of couples fight over this.

thats how i read it. is there more to it?

[BetterLanes]

Hi Formflier. My H often does this. Complaining or just talking out loud in another room on his own. Sometimes apparently not prompted by anything, and sometimes following on from something that just happened. If it does relate to something I did, the phrasing he uses isn't what you'd use in a face to face discussion, often it's third person wording like "People shouldn't do [whatever it was]". Do you remember exactly what your wife said? You quoted "I wasn't trying to help me", which is strange grammar, did she say "you" or "he" and you changed it to "I" for the post?

I tend to label this in my head as "passive aggressive" if the content is negative or "just thinking out loud" if it is neutral, and ignore it. Sometimes if I think there may be a real problem I ask ":)o you need my help?" I have no idea if those are the correct labels or responses.

HTH, BetterLanes 

[Notwendy]

What if this is a way of self regulation? We put children in time out for this- to learn to self regulate and let them rant in their rooms. As they develop better skills, the "talking" becomes internal. I think we have all done some ranting in our minds and then talked it out. If a pw BPD has emotional regulation difficulty, they may not have that skill.

What do we tell a ranting 4 year old? You may yell if you like, but in your own room. The room is the boundary. We can't control their feelings or how they manage them, but they have to stay in their room until they calm down.

My take on this is that your wife knows you are in the house and has the ability to come and speak to you if she wants you to know how she is feeling. If she's ranting in a room by herself, she's put herself in time out. There is no reason to interrupt this or try to get her to talk to you when she is upset.  Let her calm herself down in the way she knows how. Going in there to "help" could interrupt her own skills.

[toomanydogs]

Hi FF,
  I really like what notwendy wrote. Initially, I was going to suggest you ignore the rant (difficult, I know); however, what notwendy points out is that emotional regulation is a skill.
  I've always thought I was a good mom to little kids (under 8 or so), and I rarely got triggered by them. I always had the ability to pull back and tell myself, "Ahh, they're learning how to do such and such."
  An example: Both my daughter and son, when they were about 18 months old, tried to stack blocks. They could stack three and then they'd get to four and the blocks would topple. Both of them responded in the same way: by screaming and then hitting the rest of the blocks, so they'd scatter across the floor. Then they'd retrieve the blocks and try again, with the same results and the same response.
  I think notwendy's right. As long as your wife isn't in the bathroom breaking things, which my STBX did constantly, I'd let her be, let her try to get herself regulated again.
  I forget: how many kids do you have? I miss having kids underfoot.
TMD

[formflier]

On the strange grammar

My memory is that she actually did say "I" as if she was "re-quoting" me... .but there was a mocking tone to it.  She had asked and in my response I said "I was trying to help save hot water for you... " (you can imagine the disappointment of running out of hot water just a few min in.)

Yes... lots of couples fight over things like this.  Once it was made obvious to me she intended to have the water on... .and asked me (quite pleasantly actually) to turn it back on... I turned it back on and provided an explanation as requested.

I would have thought it over... .at that point and would have figured that getting in a hot shower would be pleasing and "regulating"... yet there was a rant for a while.

I tend to agree... .let her self regulate.

I suppose I could keep some ear muffs around or something for when I really don't want to leave and go to another room.

FF

[Notwendy]

It's probably better to leave the room. I think it helps for her to be alone to self regulate. If she's upset, your presence could be a trigger. In addition, it could be embarrassing for her to feel out of control emotionally in your presence.

She is who she is. It's tempting to make meaning out of someone's behavior according to our own context. All spouse, siblings, room mates probably do things that are annoying to each other at times. People can have some quirky behaviors. Yes, she may have been annoyed when you turned off her bath water, but that's in the realm of day to day life in a house with other people. It may have no further meaning than that.

I'd probably be annoyed  too if someone turned off my bath water, but that's all it is. The feeling doesn't have to be right or wrong. Your wife feels what she feels, and if ranting in private is what she needs to calm down, why not let her have that space to do so?

[formflier]

Few clarifications:  Had it been a bath, I wouldn't have touched it.

It was a shower... was at "max hot" and had been running for a while.  All of the water and heat was going down the drain... .whereas in a bath... .you can enjoy what you have ran while out of the room.

She has no way of knowing if I'm still in the adjacent room listening to her rant or not.

FF

[toomanydogs]

I suppose I could keep some ear muffs around or something for when I really don't want to leave and go to another room.

FF

Noise canceling headphones work terrifically. I used them whenever I had to drive any distance with my STBX. 
TMD

[snowglobe]

This happens a lot of times for my uBPDh too. He is talking to himself, especially when under duress or something is bothering him. If he is downstairs and yells at me, I try not to pay attention. Unless it’s said to my face, I will not validate or acknowledge it.

[Red5]

She walks into the bathroom shuts the door and is ranting about "I wasn't trying to help me... ."

I've not addressed it... .and at the moment can't figure out anything helpful to say.

When I hear an alone rant in another room I should... .?

Good afternoon FormFlier !

I ignore these little “freedom of speech” moments from the Mrs.’s.

Not worth it anymore to me… if it’s not one thing; then its going to be something else…

I was conditioned long ago to NOT participate in such acts of insubordination towards my own “punishingly beautiful” wife, nope, Red5 keeps his soup cooler shut (!)… or else it’s “woe betide to me”…  

So these daze, when she does it to me, I just ignore it, as I do have quite the VA disability rating for hearing loss anyways… due to being around the “sound of freedom” for all those years.

Hot Water, “pun intended” is a huge deal around the common area decks of Red5’s domicile.

Never mind that we have a hot water heater that looks like a friggen Saturn Five Rocket sitting in the garage… it’s one of those “smart units “ too, it beeps, has pretty indicator lights, and makes all kinds of cool R2D2 noises…

Yes; hot water, you’d think I was making her take “Navy Showers” or something…

She is always on mine, and my S31(special needs) case about hot water protocol in the evening hours.

*Don’t let S31 stay in his own shower past 10-15 minutes, I (u/BPDw) want hot water too!.

*Make sure S31 doesn’t fill his sink too full with hot water when he is shaving; on starboard side shaving nights.

*Don’t run the dishwasher (hot water) after the evening meal; whilst clearing the galley, and mess deck.

*And a "biggie"... .DON”T wash “whites” in the evening hours, as it uses “too much” hot water.

*Don’t (!) wash up heavy pots/pans in the kitchen sink with… you guessed it, HOT WATER… if I (u/BPDw) am in the shower.

Lordy!… she never stops…

I remember taking a “shower’ with a canteen in the desert, later on a “camel back”…

I remember ALL fresh water being secured (shut-off) onboard ship sometimes…

I remember living in the barracks, and the word “hot water” was a “misnomer” to us.

But if Red5 ever brings that up, then … to channel Captain;  Lt. Commander Philip Francis Queeg, its “woe betide to you!”…

I (we) feel your pain FormFlier… yes I do,

To me, “hot water” is on a spectrum… from left to right, left (zero) being maybe "cool" warm, like maybe taking a shower in someplace like Twenty-nine Palms, or Yuma Arizona… and then onto the right, past “hotishness” of a factor of five to ten… like a steamy HOT shower in the barracks in Ørland Norway… (Norwegian: Ørland hovedflystasjon)… in January, when the snow is piled up eight feet outside… a ten, steamy scalding HOT !

Red5 has had a hard life, so when the Mrs’s Red5 complains about having NO hot water, and I can clearly see “steam” pouring outa her shower stall door, and its June here on the crystal coast, and the humidity is 90%+ outside… I just think to myself, &$%# !… boy, you got no idea sweet pea !

But I keep my remarks to myself, and I sound off… “Yes Dear” !

… And I continue to think to myself… “I’ll go and shutdown the friggen reactor cooling system now so you’ll have your friggen  #&%@  Hot Water”…

Laugh out loud I say, laugh often… you may begin now ! 

Ya’ll have a great day !

Red5

[Fian]

A few thoughts,

1.  If she is doing it because she wants to tell you something without getting blamed for it, then it is manipulative and it would be reasonable to ask her to stop.
2.  If she is doing it, and not aware that you are overhearing, it would be reasonable to ask her to do it a little quieter next time so you don't have to listen.
3.  In either case, you have to weigh the cost of the pushback on #1 and #2.  BPD have no problem saying mean things to your face, so in another room is better.
 It may be better to just ignore it, than to have a fight over it.  Pick your battles and decide if this is one worth going to war over.

[Cat Familiar]

My husband often will suddenly swear out loud, apropos of nothing, and it used to startle me. I typically would inquire as to what it was about and usually he'd stonewall, saying "Nothing" or sometimes he'd be candid and say, "I was beating myself up."

It made my peaceful environment really unpleasant and when I told my T about it, she said, "Why not just let him do it and ignore it?"

I realized that it wasn't a boundary I could enforce--to get him to stop, but that I could choose to not be in his presence when he was doing it.

It occurred to me that I felt obliged to respond to it, when I really needn't. Still, it wasn't pleasant to be around.

The other day I was emptying the toaster drawer where all the crumbs accumulate after I smelled a burned odor emanating from the toaster. He eats toast; I don't. I asked him if he had done this recently, knowing that he NEVER does, and showed him charred crumbs and said it was possible that it could catch on fire if enough crumbs accumulate. (My dad, the electrician, instilled a great respect for electrical appliances in me at a young age.)

So my husband loudly grumbles and sighs--and I was kinda fed up with him for a number of other reasons, so I was less tolerant of this behavior at the moment. "Look," I said, "I'm just telling you the facts of the matter--I'm not criticizing you."

Then, he responded to my response by saying, "Well, it's not always about you." I took that to mean that his loud grumbles weren't about me telling him about the toaster.

"So who exactly are you responding to if it's not me, since I'm the only one in the room talking to you?" I asked, further stirring the pot.

Then he accused me of being angry with him, yet I really wasn't. I just wanted to hold him accountable for his response and I think he understood, but was not exactly happy to be confronted.

Thinking about that later, I realize that it gives me tacit permission to ignore his random vocalizations. And if he wants my attention, he'll have to ask for it directly.  

[formflier]

Cat,

I'll hijack my own thread.

I would insist he give you an answer, since he brought it up.  He obviously didn't want to say and honestly... .that tells me it was about you and he likely couldn't think fast enough on his feet to think up something to say.

I get "accused" sometimes of coming into a room to listen to her "work things out"... .or if I hear her talking and ask if she is asking for me.

Yet... .if she is talking and actually wants me... she will do some grumping about that as well.

She has made a big deal about "promising" to always say my name first... .if she wants my attention.  Then she won't use my name, I won't respond... .she will grump because I didn't respond... .I'll say I'm befuddled because she didn't use my name... .and then I usually get called a name or some sort of other harang...

This has died down over time... .but with the change in schedules and she's around a lot... .lots of "stuff" is coming back... that I haven't had to "deal with" in a long time.

FF

[PeteWitsend]

I have two somewhat conflicting thoughts on this:

1) Leave well enough alone - She's just venting, and you might as well ignore it, and let her vent.  not everything pwBPD do is abnormal; let them blow off steam just like anyone else might if they were annoyed they lost their hot water mid-shower.

2) Engage - Is her outburst/rant a sign of impending dysregulation?  If so, maybe it makes sense to try to politely reassure them of your intent (or clarify why their basis for their rant is not appropriate), before moving on.

doing 1) risks allowing something to simmer; 2) obviously risks provoking a response that might go away on its own.

[Cat Familiar]

Cat,

I'll hijack my own thread.

I would insist he give you an answer, since he brought it up.  He obviously didn't want to say and honestly... .that tells me it was about you and he likely couldn't think fast enough on his feet to think up something to say.

This behavior was a departure from the norm for me because usually, I'd just let it slide when he would grumble.

It's hard for us nons at times because one can shut up and not respond (i.e. choosing one's battles wisely), but then it takes its toll on those of us who tend to be candid and outspoken. So, I try to ignore what I can and deal with what I can't continue to ignore. And yes, it's bullsh!t that he would try to  pretend that his grousing wasn't in response to me pointing out a safety hazard. Then trying to make it my problem, by accusing me of "making it all about me" (i.e.--telling me I'm a self-absorbed narcissist) is right out of his BPD playbook. And in the past, it used to hook my codependent self, "Oh, good grief no, I'm not thinking about myself, I'm just pointing out a potential safety issue--I'm not really a narcissist, please don't think that." And off to the races we'd go, with me JADEing and him feeling unjustly attacked.

But now I don't care if he thinks that, and I am going to call him out when I think it's important. But there's freedom in not falling into old patterns.

I think for you, FF, what your wife was doing was attacking you in private, yet hoping you'd hear. That way she could paint herself as blameless and if you overheard, then you were violating the privacy of her ranting alone in the bathroom.

Best to ignore these things, I think, unless it becomes a frequent pattern.

[swan716]

Yes, my H does this quite frequently. It's usually a lot of cursing, slamming things and sarcasm (to himself) but audible to myself and the kids. I've learned to ignore it and try to let it go. It's my kids who see it as "another fight" between their parents however I have done nothing.

My suggestion is to ignore it as it may be part of self regulating. When it causes emotional distress to the kids? I am still working on a solution.