3 weeks of silence

[FaithfulInLove]

Hello everyone,

I wanted to ask for some opinions on my current situation.

To remind you:
My ex-fiancée and me are broken up for more than a year.
We live far away from each other and he has been dating other women during the past year.
While at least in the beginning he kept my hopes up a lot for a chance of working this out.
We have officially been nothing but friends for half a year. I didn't keep my feelings for him a secret but something stops him from being with me while he is wishing for a longterm girlfriend badly, expressing this on social media.

As soon as he was with someone else I had to work hard for this friendship, as soon as they broke up things got more stable again between us and I heard from him everyday - until he met someone new... .

After his most recent break up 2 months ago he was dysregulating badly.
We were on and off contact because he "needed no friends!", I was "disrespectful"... .
it was a hard time for me because he acted like a good friend, then threw me out of his life "for good" several times.
I avoided JADEing and validated as much as I could. He always came back after a few days of silence.

We have seen each other 3 weeks ago and we hooked up - which I thought was a good sign that I was still more for him than a friend.
The next day he acted as if nothing ever happened between us.
He refused talking about his feelings for me which hurt me a lot and got me really upset.
He told me that he can not be with anyone at the woment which I see as an excuse because he is obviously looking for a new girlfriend already (this is not just in my head, I'm just leaving out the details here).

After the weekend we spent together it was me asking him for space, so we can get our heads clear.
He just nicely agreed and went silent then. I have still been blocked on most social media since our last fight, that day he also unfollowed me on Twitter, then started posting things about having to crop people out of his life and that his weekend has been ruined... .Those things scared me a lot because it felt like this was about me.

I reached out a week later and wished him a happy birthday. He got back to me, was really thankful. Then I asked him how he was feeling. He left me on read, hasn't been online on that app since then.

This is two weeks ago. Apart from this little birthday interaction we are no contact for three weeks straight after seeing each other.
I really still want to rekindle things and got the advice of letting HIM be the one of doing the next step/missing me and reaching out to me.

What worries me is that I was the one asking for space - but he was the one not getting back to my last question.
On Twitter - where he knows I can see what he is posting - he has been really depressed the first weeks, is now getting back to being more positive. I am scared that he thinks I don't care at all because I did not react on any of his tweets, asking for help... .but I must add, the people who were reacting on them got pushed away harshly... .

So I have been strong and didn't reach out all this time, but it scares me that nothing comes from him either.
I miss him, I am used to texting with him everyday.

From your own experience and from what I told you about my situation, is waiting this out a good approach? Do you think he might reach out to me at some point?
I was told I have been behaving like a punching bag the past year and that he won't ever value or respect me when I keep running after him and that this is ruining my chances of getting him back.

Thank you,

FaithfulInLove

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[itsmeSnap]

hello again FaithfulInLove

So I've replied to a few of your posts before, sorry if I forgot any details you've posted previously, but lets see...

He refused talking about his feelings for me which hurt me a lot and got me really upset.

Did he say he didn't want to talk about it or did you ask him? also, what made you upset about it?

He told me that he can not be with anyone at the woment which I see as an excuse because he is obviously looking for a new girlfriend already (this is not just in my head, I'm just leaving out the details here).

Try not to leave out details, they seem important to the situation here.

Then I asked him how he was feeling. He left me on read, hasn't been online on that app since then.

Again, it seems you asking about his feelings is a trigger for him. If nothing else, try to hold yourself from doing it, instead wait for him to come through when he's ready.

Contacting him doesn't seem to be the main issue, but maybe he feels like you're pressuring him for an answer that he doesn't have, and you mentioned that you got upset last time he didn't want to talk about it.

I reached out a week later and wished him a happy birthday. He got back to me, was really thankful.

Maybe he just doesn't want to make YOU upset.

but I must add, the people who were reacting on them got pushed away harshly... .

Just because he's showing himself as the victim doesn't mean he actually needs, or even wants sympathy. Playing the victim quite likely helps him rationalize him blaming others for his feelings, and "helping him" is felt like a threat: if he cannot be the victim how is he going to blame others for his misfortune? and so he pushes them away.

Makes sense? or did I just assume too much between the lines?

So I have been strong and didn't reach out all this time, but it scares me that nothing comes from him either.
I miss him, I am used to texting with him everyday.

From your own experience and from what I told you about my situation, is waiting this out a good approach? Do you think he might reach out to me at some point?

In my experience, 2 years with a girl wBPD, going no contact for 3 and up to 6 months at a time, there's a chance he might reach out. A few times I did the reaching out even after a "catastrophic breakup" and we got back together again. No hard and fast rules, everyone is different.

If you feel like it maybe reach out, but keep it light like the birthday message, he responded positively to that right? Keep the "feelings talk" for a later time, now that we've identified that as a trigger its best to stay clear of it until you can figure out a good way to handle it.

I was told I have been behaving like a punching bag the past year and that he won't ever value or respect me when I keep running after him and that this is ruining my chances of getting him back.

I think we've established it might not be the "running after him" that's the problem. Also, value and respect yourself first and foremost. Nothing wrong with wanting to make things better. like they say somewhere and everywhere around here: to start making things better we first need to stop making them worse, and you seem like you're trying to do just that.

Hope that helped!

[FaithfulInLove]

Hello ItsMeSnap!

"Did he say he didn't want to talk about it or did you ask him? also, what made you upset about it?"

I was upset because he slept with me, knowing that I still have all these feelings for him.
Then acted as if nothing happened.
Being back together with this man is my biggest wish and it is the one thing I am fighting for in my life, I can barely think about anything else since he left.
When he kissed me it meant everything to me, and when he snuggled up to me at night I thought he finally was ready to give us another chance. He knows how this break up destroyed me and how much I cried. I didn't expect him to "play with me" like that.
Not without giving any answers... .It would have been okay for me if he told me he felt like doing this now but that he still doesn't feel like working things out anytime soon. If he would have been open with me, but just acting as if nothing happened...

I lived my dream that night with having him so close.
The next day the whole dream was gone. As if nothing ever happened. That was what upset me. That I had everything back for a minute, just to be back again to this nightmare of him being just some distant friend to me who I can barely talk to.
And I tried to stay calm cause I thought he'd come and talk to me about it when he is ready... .but he didn't.

And then, cause I really couldn't hold back my tears anymore, I sat down with him and asked him if there was another chance for us. And what he explained there sounded to me like a nice "maybe someday but better don't wait for me".
And when I asked him if he didn't love me anymore he threatened to just leave although I came from another country to see him... .
So... .I care about how he feels a lot but this was just too much for me... .

"Try not to leave out details, they seem important to the situation here."

I'm trying to keep my post short as possible. He is texting other girls on Twitter, fighting for their attention and he has a dating app on his phone, some tweets hinting on him USING it as well.

"Again, it seems you asking about his feelings is a trigger for him."

The question was not about his feelings for me but about how things are going...
From Twitter I know he has been pretty depressed that week, I wanted to offer him to talkhere.
I usually get an "Okay" or "Fine" or "Not too bad" when he doesn't wanna talk about it, and then I never press him to tell anything more, so... .I don't understand how this could be a trigger... .
I made it light by calling him "old man" because it was his birthday (he is in his early twenties).
My message really has not been a pressuring one... .

"Contacting him doesn't seem to be the main issue, but maybe he feels like you're pressuring him for an answer that he doesn't have, and you mentioned that you got upset last time he didn't want to talk about it."

I don't know how I can be more of a friend to him. For months I didn't bring that topic up until he started dating someone new and I had to explain why I seemed sad/not happy for him.

"if he cannot be the victim how is he going to blame others for his misfortune? and so he pushes them away."

Makes sense to me... .but also I see he got invalidated by the ones he was blocking out there... .they were telling him "to not feel that way because it's just not true". So I can understand how this could make him upset.

"If you feel like it maybe reach out, but keep it light like the birthday message"

I am extremely anxious that he is angry at me for not being there for him... .I wonder if he needs his time to realise he misses me, too... .And when I come running back after asking for space... .I am just not sure how I would handle it if he lashed out at me... .I have been crying through the past three weeks, he is missing.

I sneaked a little present under his Christmas tree. I was thinking about waiting till then to see if it makes him wanna talk to me... .I did not get the present yet that he had promised me when we have seen each other... .
Also his Family has invited me over in four months. It would be hard not seeing him when Iam there but this would be an Occasion to talk again... .

He seems not ready, I am going for winning him back in the long run and I don't wanna make things worse. I just don't have a real plan. My anxiety is making things really hard.

Thank you for taking the time to really read about my situation and discussing things with me.

[itsmeSnap]

I didn't expect him to "play with me" like that.
Not without giving any answers... .It would have been okay for me if he told me he felt like doing this now but that he still doesn't feel like working things out anytime soon.

And then, cause I really couldn't hold back my tears anymore, I sat down with him and asked him if there was another chance for us. And what he explained there sounded to me like a nice "maybe someday but better don't wait for me".

Emphasis added.

So you see, he did tell you there's a chance but not right now. Though keep in mind I'm considering with "sounded to me" = fact. I know it sounds like I don't believe you, keep in mind I'm trying to look at it from his side, like the "talk to the puppet" thing to make it safer to talk about a difficult situation soo bear with me.

It seems like you either want the perfect relationship or the perfect closure (him telling you there's not a chance ever for a relationship anymore), no middle ground of seeing him (and possibly sex like last time you were together) when you're visiting his family and maybe taking time to talk things through and maybe just date/hang out.

And I understand you were to be married, you keep mentioning he is your ex-fiancee so I see why expectations are high.

So, its been a year, he told you there's a chance but not right now, expectations need to match reality or you're going to keep getting hurt by thinking any contact from him (up to sex) means he wants a full committed relationship again, only for him to bail last minute.

Try to see a middle ground, no relationship doesn't mean you can't see him, talk to him, or flirt with him, just a casual thing for now, maybe later he'll take you "off the market" like he promised, but also you need to work on the idea that that might not happen and you can still keep seeing him in those terms or decide not to, it's your choice.

He is texting other girls on Twitter, fighting for their attention and he has a dating app on his phone, some tweets hinting on him USING it as well

So that's a fact then, factor it into your expectations of him. He will be dating other women, right now he doesn't feel he's in a committed relationship with you, are you still ok chasing him if this is so?

My gf also does that when she's feeling lonely, heck I do it when we've broken up, we would later laugh about how much those dating apps suck when we start talking again.

Point is, your perspective on the matter could be what's hurting you, radical acceptance is one of the tools that come to mind in this situation. You don't have to be ok with it of course, if that's the case you need to set the proper boundary, including for yourself: how much is too far? what consequences are you prepared to enforce if he goes there?

I usually get an "Okay" or "Fine" or "Not too bad" when he doesn't wanna talk about it, and then I never press him to tell anything more, so... .I don't understand how this could be a trigger... .
I made it light by calling him "old man" because it was his birthday (he is in his early twenties).
My message really has not been a pressuring one... .

Facts are not reality with pwBPD, feelings are: if he felt pressured, his reality is that he was pressured, the nature of the text is of little importance. Those short responses might have been a way to not blow things over, my gf would start being dismissive like that when she started being dysregulated and would later tell me I'd been annoying and wouldn't stop pestering her and she had nothing to say; The messages leading up to it would be good morning messages, how's work, what are you up to for the weekend, seemingly innocuous right? she took offense to them anyway

So just keep that in mind.

I just don't have a real plan. My anxiety is making things really hard.

My advice is that the plan should be to work on your anxiety so you can better handle his reactions. The co-author of the book "stop walking on eggshells" recommended me (she's THE EXPERT, wrote THE BOOK haha she had a thread recently here and I got an answer for one of my questions in exchange for a personal story, good deal if you ask me) to look into dbt for handling my gf's shenanigans, specifically dbtselfhelp.com, seems a bit cluttered but the lessons are there, I'm looking into them, so try it yourself maybe?

you got four months 'till you visit his family, should be plenty of time to work on your strength and learn to at least manage your anxiety for next time you see him.

Sounds good? is there a plan or path you'll want to look into but haven't decided yet? you mentioned you're in for him for the long run so that's settled, how about mid term? short term?

Stay strong

[FaithfulInLove]

"It seems like you either want the perfect relationship or the perfect closure"

To be honest, I would not even be able to accept the perfect closure anymore after all this back and forth
HE is looking for a perfect relationship and that's what we once had. That he is looking for that with someone else now and doesn't really seem to consider me anymore, that's what drives me crazy and makes me feel not good enough.
I have no problem with causual sex, but the coldness before and after, that's what I have a problem with after getting him to know as the warmest most loving person ever.
I wasn't even allowed to grab his arm while running through the city - which I really think good friends can do - when at the same time he was okay with sleeping with me before and after. Can you see how this can be confusing?

"And I understand you were to be married, you keep mentioning he is your ex-fiancee so I see why expectations are high."

Exactly... I really have been the "distant one" all the time, pulling him back to the ground, telling him things are going really fast.
He got hurt over this back then. Now it's the other way around ,  
I don't need to get married next year, I just wanna start dating again, exclusively. He always gave me the feeling of being everything he ever wanted. Now I am the last thing he considers and I'm sitting here, reading tweets like "Being single sucks" while he knows I LOVE HIM TO DEATH.

"Try to see a middle ground, no relationship doesn't mean you can't see him, talk to him, or flirt with him, just a casual thing for now, maybe later he'll take you "off the market" like he promised, but also you need to work on the idea that that might not happen and you can still keep seeing him in those terms or decide not to, it's your choice."

This would be easier for me if at least our friendship would be a safe Thing. But as I told you, he keeps going in and out of contact. It always seems to be the last time I hear from him. That's stressful when someone means so much!
When he is seeing someone else he loses interest in our friendship. When they break up he dysregulates. It is a horrible place for me to be at... .
I think I understand where you're coming from. If I took things more easy, if I was more confident, it would be easier for him, right?

"He will be dating other women, right now he doesn't feel he's in a committed relationship with you, are you still ok chasing him if this is so?"

OF COURSE I WANT MY BABY BACK AT ANY COST  :')

"if he felt pressured, his reality is that he was pressured, the nature of the text is of little importance."

That's true... .maybe it confused him that I reached out after a week after asking for space... ?

"The messages leading up to it would be good morning messages, how's work, what are you up to for the weekend, seemingly innocuous right? she took offense to them anyway"

When we were in touch those kinds of questions kept coming from HIM. So, then it is the best thing to keep things on that level, right?

"My advice is that the plan should be to work on your anxiety so you can better handle his reactions."

Exactly that is my plan. I am in therapy for a year. Reading all the Information I can get. What else can I do?

"is there a plan or path you'll want to look into but haven't decided yet? you mentioned you're in for him for the long run so that's settled, how about mid term? short term?"

I need a plan to come back into contact with him. Cause why should he be free to spend time with me in four months when we are not even talking anymore? I can imagine him going out and leaving me be alone with his family if we stayed out of touch until then. I wanna become a good friend that he can talk to easily so that things will feel good for both of us.
Any advice how to get there?

Thank you for being there,

FaithfulInLove

[itsmeSnap]

To be honest, I would not even be able to accept the perfect closure anymore after all this back and forth

well that could cause some issues down the line, others on the board have mentioned getting restraining orders, false assault charges, that sort of thing. Just be safe is what I'm saying, there are consequences you might not have considered.

I have no problem with causual sex, but the coldness before and after, that's what I have a problem with after getting him to know as the warmest most loving person ever.

ok, so at least we have that out of the way. Its worth having that as a given instead of tiptoe'ing (sp?) around the issue.

I wasn't even allowed to grab his arm while running through the city - which I really think good friends can do - when at the same time he was okay with sleeping with me before and after. Can you see how this can be confusing?

which I really think...

Yeah, but here again, expectations rear their head. Maybe he's not comfortable with public displays of affection, which is not necessarily because of BPD.

My gf would tell me when we first met that when she had sex she would make it so the other person was done as fast as possible just to be over with (even though she did want to have sex), she had issues with being touched and would tell me that she would flinch at the slightest bump, cuddling was out of the question.

As time went by she became more comfortable around me, sex was fine and she even wanted to cuddle after.

Point is, there's a background from him that we don't have, there may be a reason why he's reluctant to do that. In my case my gf hinted at abuse but would never tell me outright what happened, still too painful for her I imagined. So don't assume it's entirely about your interactions or how he feels about you.

Exactly... I really have been the "distant one" all the time, pulling him back to the ground, telling him things are going really fast.
He got hurt over this back then. Now it's the other way around ,   

So you see how this could be confusing for him as well?

This would be easier for me if at least our friendship would be a safe Thing

Now this is something you can work on, if you want a safe friendship you can work to that effect, but that means not being a couple, more like friends with benefits (he seems to also not have a problem with casual sex); breaking up in a relationship and going back to being friends is hard enough, so if you want a safe friendship it might mean that, "just friends".

I know it seems like I'm telling you to detach, I was told by someone here to be just friends with my gf recently and I said no thanks I want the full experience haha so I see your struggle.

Case in point:

OF COURSE I WANT MY BABY BACK AT ANY COST   :')

So yeah

If I took things more easy, if I was more confident, it would be easier for him, right?

Not for him, more for you. Take it as a journey, not a destination. Like a plane ride: the seats are awful, lines long, security invasive, jetlag makes you feel bad for days, but you understand that when you decided to book the trip, because it was worth it.

If he's worth it to you, then you might as well get one of those neck pillow things and read a book or something while you're "trapped" in the plane; you know the destination, make the trip as comfortable for yourself as you can.

When we were in touch those kinds of questions kept coming from HIM. So, then it is the best thing to keep things on that level, right?

Best? who knows. Depends on how he reacts I guess, it drove my gf mad at one point haha so your mileage may vary.

Exactly that is my plan. I am in therapy for a year. Reading all the Information I can get. What else can I do?

Good question! what else can you do? attend a class, meet with friends, start a business, spirituality, whatever, the world is your playground; make the best of it, make it your own.

Cause why should he be free to spend time with me in four months when we are not even talking anymore?

Ok so you want him back but won't tolerate him spending time with you until you talk beforehand, is that right? How long would you need him to talk to you before you consider him "talking again"? any topic you'd want discussed? I've noticed the feelings talk being an issue, would that need to be sorted out? what if it isn't?

Rhetorical questions to get you thinking the issue, I don't have an answer here; it seems serious enough that you are willing to enforce consequences though.

I wanna become a good friend that he can talk to easily so that things will feel good for both of us.
Any advice how to get there?

You know him better that I do, but the general idea is that people don't change too much, so if you've been able to restart contact before you might expect the same circumstances to lead to contact again.

he keeps going in and out of contact. It always seems to be the last time I hear from him

What happens before he's in contact? have you been on/off or just good->engagement->breakup->now?

When he is seeing someone else he loses interest in our friendship. When they break up he dysregulates.

Does he contact you then? how long does contact usually last?

Thank you for being there,

Just practicing the skills while I wait for my maybe-soon-to-be-ex-gfwBPD haha. I'm thankful someone helped me when I was feeling down, so now I give advice myself; I'm no expert so hopefully I don't make things worse for anyone 

[FaithfulInLove]

"that could cause some issues down the line, others on the board have mentioned getting restraining orders, false assault charges, that sort of thing."

I am always really careful in the ways I contact him, he never even threatened to do anything like this to me.
I am giving him his space when he asks for it or lashes out.
This time - it has just been an "Sure we can give each other some space if that's what you think is best". I don't think he would come around with a restraining order. He didn't even block me on the channels I haven't been blocked before, and as I said he reacted positively to the birthday wishes.

My gut feeling is telling me he is just thinking I don't really care about him while I'm taking my space... .and he can't be bothered with someone who doesn't show she cares... .
But I don't want things to go on like this, with me being the only one who ever shows she cares... .Friendships AND relationships shouldn't be a one sided thing... .Still... .I was the one asking for space...
He might be super anxious about being pushed away when he tries to talk... .: (

"Maybe he's not comfortable with public displays of affection, which is not necessarily because of BPD."

When we've been together we have been kissing in public all the time, I didn't see him having a problem with that at all... .

"Point is, there's a background from him that we don't have, there may be a reason why he's reluctant to do that."

Well, maybe he doesn't want to see anyone in his hometown - so that they don't ask questions... .

"So you see how this could be confusing for him as well?"

No, I don't really see how it can be confusing for him that I want to save this relationship...
I am not stressing about him moving in with me tomorrow or propose to me again, I always made it clear that I love him and that I wanna win back his trust and WORK THINGS OUT because what we had was beautiful...
He doesn't encourage me at all in this. He stays silent when it comes to this, so I try to not bring it up anymore if the Situation doesn't require it... .
He only comes around saying "Maybe maybe there is still a chance when I say something like "yeah it's sad but I see I gotta accept there is no chance for us". He is not sure at all

"if you want a safe friendship you can work to that effect, but that means not being a couple, more like friends with benefits (he seems to also not have a problem with casual sex); breaking up in a relationship and going back to being friends is hard enough, so if you want a safe friendship it might mean that, "just friends"."

I am trying to get nothing more but "Just friends".
I'm letting him come to me, I didn't seduce him last month, it was all him.
You say he doesn't seem to have a problem with causual sex, but that's what he kept saying all the time, that he only wants something deep and long lasting.
He has rather been shocked about my old stories... .He didn't have sex before he met me and during the relationship we had issues because he "felt used for it" and I "wanted it too much"... .

"Ok so you want him back but won't tolerate him spending time with you until you talk beforehand, is that right?"

No, I think you got me wrong here.
I mean I can not just decide to come and see him in his country, without a word just because his parents invited me, right?...
5 months without talking and then being like nothing ever happened? That would be awkward.
It's just not okay and I wouldn't want my exes doing this to me, appearing at my home out of no where.
He'd probably just not be at home if he found out I planned that without asking him.

"What happens before he's in contact? have you been on/off or just good->engagement->breakup->now?"

We had some issues during the relationship which made him sometimes leave for a night. He never stayed away for long back then, he just got angry about something Little, when I had a different opinion.

Now he often is dysregulating, saying he doesn't need friends and he doesn't trust me. Once he called me disrespectful and when I asked him about this when we were back in touch and things calmed down - he didn't even remember!

"Does he contact you then? how long does contact usually last?"

I'll give him space when he feels like leaving, telling him he can come back if he changes his mind and usually it only takes up to 4 days... .
Then I'm getting a nice "Hey " or he will tell me I don't care about him and then I tell him about my point of view, make him realise that actually I do care... .and then he usually calms down after a few hours and texts me normally. (Texting normally means short uninvested messages every few hours, we barely went over this the past year... )

He is distorting realitiy a lot... .doubting that the people around him care about him, even when they just stop showing it because literally nothing comes back... .It's so sad... .!

[itsmeSnap]

My gut feeling is telling me he is just thinking I don't really care about him while I'm taking my space... .and he can't be bothered with someone who doesn't show she cares... .

That last part sounds to me like a bit of a stretch. Could be true, I can't know for sure, I see you might think that because of the social media posts.

He might be super anxious about being pushed away when he tries to talk... .: (

This sounds more like it.

When we've been together we have been kissing in public all the time, I didn't see him having a problem with that at all... .

Well, maybe he doesn't want to see anyone in his hometown - so that they don't ask questions... .

So he only has issues with it in his hometown? you said you went to visit him recently, was he the one visiting when you first met or did you travel to him but away from his hometown?

No, I don't really see how it can be confusing for him that I want to save this relationship...

I meant the part where you said you had to slow things down:

Exactly... I really have been the "distant one" all the time, pulling him back to the ground, telling him things are going really fast.

BPD is notorious for abandonment issues, so this could be why this is happening.

I gotta accept there is no chance for us". He is not sure at all

Phrasing could be improved here a bit, try instead "I gotta accept whatever happens".

Telling him there's no chance means there's a probability he will take it at face value and think that he actually has no chance; his telling you there might be means he cares enough, him going cold could be because he fears you will actually follow through with the "no chance" thing.

To be honest it also sounds like a panic move on his part and part of the push-pull dynamic. There's gotta be something that changes, and since it seems to be your "first breakup" with him I see why there's so much struggle here.

You say he doesn't seem to have a problem with causual sex, but that's what he kept saying all the time, that he only wants something deep and long lasting.

Indeed, it seems like I got it wrong. Details help.

He has rather been shocked about my old stories... .He didn't have sex before he met me

Were the stories about past relationships? Could this be why he's conflicted about sex with you?

No, I think you got me wrong here.

It's just not okay and I wouldn't want my exes doing this to me, appearing at my home out of no where.

Ok so that makes sense, I did get it wrong.

He'd probably just not be at home if he found out I planned that without asking him.

Maybe, maybe not.

I mean I can not just decide to come and see him in his country, without a word just because his parents invited me, right?...

If his parent invited you then you'd be visiting THEM and not necessarily him right?

Just putting it out there, there's no right or wrong answer here. If you don't feel like it its ok to decline the invitation.

he will tell me I don't care about him and then I tell him about my point of view, make him realise that actually I do care... .and then he usually calms down after a few hours

That happened with my gf also, except she said I had given up on her. She calmed down after I told her I didn't want things to get messed up between us, she told me "I did good". that was the first time I'd seen her "come back" after an episode without it causing a breakup so I see how that would play out between you two.

So he usually calms fast, could you think of a reason why he would be taking so long this time around? I remember you mentioned you broke up over a year ago is that right?

I might be over my "helping" capacity in this situation but what caused the breakup in the first place? Sorry if I'm asking too much, again just trying to help 

[FaithfulInLove]

"So he only has issues with it in his hometown? you said you went to visit him recently, was he the one visiting when you first met or did you travel to him but away from his hometown?"

He didn't have issues with this anywhere when we were together, cause I was the girl he wanted to marry and he was proud of having me, but since we are broken up he is hesitant of showing affection. But not just in public.
There barely is any affection - (apart from the sex). Sometimes he hugs me when I gotta cry. That's it.

"No, I don't really see how it can be confusing for him that I want to save this relationship... "
I meant the part where you said you had to slow things down:

That could be confusing, yes... I always tried to explain my point of view and marrying after less than a year in a long distance relationship just didn't feel fully right for me...

Phrasing could be improved here a bit, try instead "I gotta accept whatever happens".
Telling him there's no chance means there's a probability he will take it at face value and think that he actually has no chance; his telling you there might be means he cares enough, him going cold could be because he fears you will actually follow through with the "no chance" thing.
To be honest it also sounds like a panic move on his part and part of the push-pull dynamic. There's gotta be something that changes, and since it seems to be your "first breakup" with him I see why there's so much struggle here.

Let me discuss this with you further... ? I never told him he doesn't have a chance with me.
He keeps treating me as nothing more than a friend while tweeting stuff like "being single sucks" and flirting with other girls while he knows I am interested in him and suffering because we're not together. He usually books TWIN ROOMS for us when we are traveling together and he gets into relationships with other people, doesn't react on any kind of tiny romantic gestures he's getting from me, nothing ever comes back.
Whenever I bring up that I see things are over, I do it in a way of adding that I would still wanna work for it and that I must accept that he does not want it, so there is no reason for him to think that he has no chance with me... .and this is when he is kind of throwing those maybes in - usually he doesn't react at all and those maybes are thrown in a few hours later... .
Once I told him I am going out with other people... .and that actually it is still him I want... .and that I need him to make an effort if he doesn't want me to move on. This situation ended with him wishing me good luck with that new guy, then reaching back out inviting me to talk a few hours later, just to pull away again as soon as things are starting to go well... .
Can you please explain what you mean by "Panic move"?

Were the stories about past relationships? Could this be why he's conflicted about sex with you?

We're quite young, as far as I know he only had long distance things before me who he never met and one girl who never showed affection and didn't even want to kiss him. So, he didn't have the chance for further experiences I'd say.

If his parent invited you then you'd be visiting THEM and not necessarily him right?
If you don't feel like it its ok to decline the invitation.

I love his parents. I feel like going at all cost.
I am just scared about what effect it would have on him... it is kind of clear I am doing this just because I miss him and this would make me feel a bit reconnected... .
It would be hurtful if he wouldn't be around... .When we've seen each other he said he'd take time off from work for me when I come over - but now that we're not talking... .Maybe he doesn't feel like talking again, who knows?

"So he usually calms fast, could you think of a reason why he would be taking so long this time around? I remember you mentioned you broke up over a year ago is that right?"

Yes, it's more than a year ago.
What I can imagine - I have asked him for space once (that was half a year ago, cause he kept my hopes up and I really thought we could work things out and then he told me he had a date just a few weeks before actually meeting up "to talk things through"... ).
When he reached out I didn't reply back then because I have been asking for a few weeks away and he said he was okay with that.
He got really upset because he saw me online and I didn't wanna talk to him, all I said was that I needed more space and he ended up blocking me out for a whole month, really not wanting to talk to me ever again (also because he was in a new relationship).
We only got back to talking because I was ready to do him a big nice favour.
Now I have asked for space again - but in a much more gentle way, by reassuring I will be there for him if he needs me.
Maybe he is still afraid he will be ignored when he reaches out to me... .

I might be over my "helping" capacity in this situation but what caused the breakup in the first place? Sorry if I'm asking too much, again just trying to help

He felt put second in my life. And he did have a good reason for that.
I would be completely ready to change that if he just gave me the chance to...

[itsmeSnap]

Ok so quick recap just to check if I got everything right:

You broke up

He kept your hopes up by telling you maybe but not following through. Did you guys still talk/text regularly during this time?

You asked for space, he reached out again but you still needed time, he got mad. I'm guessing this caused the first longer period of no contact?

You reached out yourself, things were good for a while. Then you needed space, he was reluctantly ok. This was three weeks ago correct?

You visited him, he invited you over, had sex, he went cold again. This was about a week ago right?

Can you please explain what you mean by "Panic move"?

He's conflicted about being with you, when you "threaten" to end it or see other people he gets afraid of losing you and throws in a " maybe" to try and get you to stay. The issue is not resolved, but at least you're not out of his life entirely though he keeps you at a distance to avoid having to deal with the root cause.

So, he didn't have the chance for further experiences I'd say.

So how about you? Did you have "more experience" than him? Did he know about your past relationships?

This is what I meant by if the stories were about other relationships: if you let him know about your own past he might have twisted the experience of physical intimacy with you according to his own insecurities, that's maybe why he says "you used him for it" and "you wanted it too much".

He felt put second in my life. And he did have a good reason for that.

Maybe you've posted this before in a previous thread, care to elaborate on the " good reason" he felt put second before you guys broke up?

[FaithfulInLove]

Thank you, itsmeSnap for being there and really trying to understand.

Respect for being able to sum that confusing story up so well!

Let me get this all clear:
Yeah, he broke up.
He got hurt in our relationship because I was obsessing over a band (we both like) and decided to see them on our anniversary instead of him. That special day was our break up reason.
Yes, he kept my hopes up by telling me maybe but not following through. We talked regulary but it went from us both wanting to work things out to me begging and crying and getting more and more depressed everyday and him getting more and more silent and starting to ignore that topic which drove me crazy... .and then suddenly being in a new relationship.
Yes, I asked for space, he reached out as soon as he saw me on Twitter, he got mad because I didn't text him although I told him I needed a few weeks away, not just one night... .Yes, this caused the first longer period of no contact.
I reached out, was really patient and things got better and better - especially after his girlfriend broke up, we talked everyday a bit, our friendship was good enough again to plan a meet up, we were quite close again.
But then he got into a new relationship. We still saw each other on the planned date, but as soon as that day was over, he got really silent... .Until she broke up... .Then these horrible phases of him texting me, then saying he didn't need me started... .
I got him to meet up three weeks ago, that was when we hooked up. Then I said I needed space and he was reluctantly ok. Apart from the birthday wishes we are in no contact since then. For 3 weeks, not just for one.

He's conflicted about being with you, when you "threaten" to end it or see other people he gets afraid of losing you and throws in a " maybe" to try and get you to stay. The issue is not resolved, but at least you're not out of his life entirely though he keeps you at a distance to avoid having to deal with the root cause.

I don't get this... .I always wanted his friendship, never threatened to leave his life. It's him making things so complicated and making me so anxious by leaving and coming back again.

"So how about you? Did you have "more experience" than him? Did he know about your past relationships?"

Yes, and I've been open about that.

I miss him tremendously much. I am scared he won't reach out. And I am scared to do this myself and get to hear that he doesn't want me in his life anymore.
This scares me so much because this is the first time we are having so much space without him being involved with someone new. I am scared he decides he is better off without me, cause this friendship truly meant a lot to me. I love that person and want him in my life.
I don't wanna be the one running after him again... .
I don't wanna seem stubborn, but I am the only one showing that he means something... .That is painful.
I want a chance of these dynamics to change.

[itsmeSnap]

Just added a reply on my own thread and I was feeling quite frustrated myself talking about my situation.

I see your post, give me some time to cool off before I try to help you, something might come off the wrong way. I will look into it, didn't want you to feel like I stopped replying.

Hopefully someone can post some encouraging words for you right now, hang in there.

Thank you, itsmeSnap for being there and really trying to understand.

Respect for being able to sum that confusing story up so well!

 

[FaithfulInLove]

Hey itsmeSnap,

thank you millions for that short message.

I'm never expecting anyone to always read and reply to my threads and I haven't been expecting this from you either, but it is lovely reading that you wanna get back to me later.

My anxiety is sky high and I am happy to have someone to talk to.

I am close to just reaching out myself again, but I think it would be better to give it time... wait for Christmas maybe... .(There's a tiny hidden present under his Christmas tree for him... maybe that helps him getting back in touch)

Thanks for being there

[itsmeSnap]

Hi faithfulinlove, thanks for understanding.

I feel a bit better now, let's give this a shot 

I don't get this... .I always wanted his friendship, never threatened to leave his life. It's him making things so complicated and making me so anxious by leaving and coming back again

.

Again its not about if you did, its about if he felt like it was so. This is very counterintuitive so don't be hard on yourself.

See, particularly after you both started distancing, he seems to be keeping you at arms length: just within reach but not letting you get close. Others have mentioned their partners doing this, I saw a post recently where the person said they had a breakup, were in talking terms again and made plans to go out but their partner would flake out at the last moment.

I see an issue here that is worth exploring: you are very focused on this relationship and are attributing everything that happens to be relating to him.

When you say "he's making me anxious" and "he's making things complicated", or even "if I did X would make it easier for him" you are giving away your agency, your ability to take control and be the change that's needed, and also your part of dynamic and how to change it.

I know you desperately want him back, but if this is to work you need to make sure you can keep it like that when when you do, and that takes some introspection.

I miss him tremendously much. I am scared he won't reach out. And I am scared to do this myself and get to hear that he doesn't want me in his life anymore.
This scares me so much because this is the first time we are having so much space without him being involved with someone new. I am scared he decides he is better off without me, cause this friendship truly meant a lot to me. I love that person and want him in my life.
I don't wanna be the one running after him again... .
I don't wanna seem stubborn, but I am the only one showing that he means something... .That is painful

One thing I'll say that might help you with your anxiety is this.

Feel the moment, be here right now and wait for the future to come to you.

I used to have anxiety attacks myself, I thought I was going to die every time. I would worry I was worried that I'd be worried about something (it made sense to me at the time, but now I see how farfetched that sounds)

So I just let myself feel the anxiety, started noticing every symptom not as a sign of impending doom but just something that was happening to me at the moment. I would focus on breathing and just feeling it.

It was awful, but it eventually went away. Each time it would get less intense because I started learning what to expect and it made me less worried over time.

Now after I read some on dbt and crisis management (don't remembered the exact name of the skill but its something to that effect) I see that being in the moment, and once calm to distract oneself is the first part of it.

I learned that skill the hard way, but its worth sharing if you want to look into it.

Now as far as the relationship is concerned, try to make it come from a place of happiness instead of fear.

You mentioned tou want the relationship to be what it once was, approach it like so. If he's not ready then respect that, if you want to test the waters again then its your choice, just don't hold yourself hostage to the "what ifs".

So, the now is a bit of a waiting game it seems. What happened before you decided to go see the band for yourself?

I'm curious because I at first saw the breakups with my gf as a defining event, now I realize there was a process behind it that I couldn't/wouldn't see while it was happening, posting here helped me realized that.

If you still feel like talking then go for it, I seem to more easily see issues in others rather than my own situation haha so hopefully you find it useful.

And if I'm being harsh or too blunt you let me know! I'm more of a business type so I am not as empathic as I should sometimes.

[FaithfulInLove]

Hi itsmeSnap

I'm happy you're feeling better.
Much respect for you cause you are strong enough to put up with other people's problems while having the same!
Sounds more productive than how I handle things, I feel I can't concentrate and give helpful advice to others.

"See, particularly after you both started distancing, he seems to be keeping you at arms length: just within reach but not letting you get close."

Is there a way to change things here? To get through to him? If he can't be in a relationship I at least wanna be sure I can reach him as my friend, not being treated with silence or being told he doesn't need me... .

"I see an issue here that is worth exploring: you are very focused on this relationship and are attributing everything that happens to be relating to him."

That's why I am in a BPD Forum, to get insight of what he is going through and how I can handle things the best way to make things better. I can deal with myself alone.

"You mentioned you want the relationship to be what it once was, approach it like so. If he's not ready then respect that, if you want to test the waters again then its your choice, just don't hold yourself hostage to the "what ifs"."

Well... .at the Moment it seems like he is interested in someone else again...   (round 4, my heart is in pieces!)
So reaching out now doesn't make sense, does it? Isn't that possibility a good reason to go for a "what if"?
After a month of not talking this will probably make him say he doesn't need me anymore... .

"What happened before you decided to go see the band for yourself?"

There were many fights in our relationship becuase he always had to get my Attention over the band.
The band was my everything before he came and he got to know me like this. As soon as a livestream, a tv show or a reply session started he suddenly wanted to give me a call and talk to me, he suddenly felt depressed and needed me... .When we were at their events together he stopped me from seeing them after the show and pulled me back to the hotel... .
This is what made me stay stubborn and do what I want recklessly this one time... .and this is when things got too much for him.
I just was mad because he pulled me away from something I loved, I didn't see this was about his illness and him being really hurt about being put second, I thought it was some kind of weird control game and I thought we could get through everything together... .
Never thought he'd just leave! Although he made me choose between that concert date and him before he really called it quits... .
I didn't understand he was serious after all the fights we had about this before. I thought our love was strong enough for him to learn and accept that I don't wanna stop being a fulltime fan just because we are in a relationship. That is what I told him on day one of being together, that I don't want this if he wants me to step away from the band... .

[itsmeSnap]

Hello again faithfulinlove

Is there a way to change things here? To get through to him? If he can't be in a relationship I at least wanna be sure I can reach him as my friend, not being treated with silence or being told he doesn't need me... .

I'm still waiting on my gf to contact me again after she stopped talking to me and blocked me everywhere, when I figure that one out you'll be the first one to know 

That's why I am in a BPD Forum, to get insight of what he is going through and how I can handle things the best way to make things better. I can deal with myself alone.

Yes, my point is that I read in your posts that it is you who accommodates him and his reactions, or him causing you to react a certain way. It seems to be all about him, what's best for him, what's easier for him to take you back, how to get him back.

Again, I can see where you're coming from. In my post I did get frustrated because someone told me to "just go with her flow" and I get that is good advice: I can't change her so take it as she deals it right? but then I asked what about MY needs? why can't it be her that goes with MY flow?

I haven't figured this one out yet, but posting is letting me see, among other things, that there's no right or wrong here. We have to both focus on them and on ourselves, and in their reactions in the relationship as well as our own.

It all sounds abstract when everyone keeps repeating it. But the fact is that we are also part of the dysfunction, and we should seek to get to know how WE are also part of the issue. Not pointing any fingers here, I notice you are making a great effort yourself, keep on growing! not only for his sake, but for your own as well.

So reaching out now doesn't make sense, does it? Isn't that possibility a good reason to go for a "what if"?
After a month of not talking this will probably make him say he doesn't need me anymore... .

You don't know that, and you cannot be sure unless you ask him. A possibility is just that, a chance, a maybe, a "what if". Would you regret if after a long time of not speaking and you somehow reconnected, if you found out he was hoping for you to contact? and just the same, would knowing that he actually doesn't care for you anymore not give you some relief and obviously after grieving your lost relationship, would you be open to experiencing that love with a new person, just as you experienced that with him after you've had relationships with others in the past?

There is also the possibility, just like in my case, that he would never reach out again. I know that uncertainty is the worst of the worst. I have set a deadline from which I will begin the process of detaching and moving on. I'm hoping she comes around before that. I'm ready if she doesn't.

If you decide not to take the same path as I did, just be sure this is what you want, that longing will indeed be for a long long time, possibly your whole life. Make sure you understand that.

I just was mad because he pulled me away from something I loved, I didn't see this was about his illness and him being really hurt about being put second, I thought it was some kind of weird control game and I thought we could get through everything together... .

Its part both of those things really so you're not wrong. This seems like a miscommunication and boundaries issue.

There were many fights in our relationship becuase he always had to get my Attention over the band.

How did the fights play out? I'm asking because it seems the fight didn't get the message across that this is something important for you.

When we were at their events together he stopped me from seeing them after the show and pulled me back to the hotel... .

Did you give in to going back to the hotel? or did he physically grabbed you and stuffed you in the room? This is one of those "intermittent reinforcement" things: if he managed to get you to give up on them, he will try again, more often, harder, for longer, to get his way. It worked before, it will work again if I just keep trying.

Sort of like you are trying to get him back: "I got him to contact me again, things were good, and then they weren't, but if I just work a bit harder I'll get him to come back to me". Makes sense?

I'm not saying you should stop trying, I'm trying to get you to see just why you/me/everyone keeps trying even against "unfavorable" odds.

Never thought he'd just leave!

A famous person which I don't really know who it was once said: "expect the unexpected".

At least now you know where that path leads you, next time you can use that information to choose your next move.

Although he made me choose between that concert date and him before he really called it quits... .

This is called, depending on your perspective, an ultimatum or a boundary. He could have handled it better, but it was something he thought important enough to say "this is the limit".

You also stated your own boundary here: "I will not let you dictate what I can and cannot do".

Of course there are consequences to everything we do, sometimes we can't have our cake and eat it too, the cake won't allow it .

I didn't understand he was serious after all the fights we had about this before.

Fights are as serious as it gets, next time you'll know better.

I thought our love was strong enough for him to learn and accept that I don't wanna stop being a fulltime fan just because we are in a relationship

Imagine him writing this same situation from his perspective: "I thought our love was strong enough for her to learn and accept that we are in a relationship and it's hard for me that she's a fulltime fan"

There's always the other side, this was just my artistic interpretation of the issue but I hope you can see how this could have played out in his mind.

That is what I told him on day one of being together, that I don't want this if he wants me to step away from the band... .

And still you haven't followed through with that promise. Soft, blurry and unenforced boundaries are no boundaries at all, he likely kept trying to take you away because he saw you wouldn't actually break it off because of this, even after many fights. That is, until the ultimatum.

He tried to finalize the issue with that, you both chose your own way. You both are feeling the pain from it (its a harsh I know, but you keep mentioning how bad you feel and how bad you see him feeling over social media). Can you think of a way you could have compromised? a middle ground, more time for him before and after the concert maybe?

Now as far as advice goes, I'll ask you first how would you change if given the chance?

Having your thoughts on what needs to be addressed first helps us figure out your priorities and we can look at them from the top (things that need to be addressed ASAP) and work our way down the list (minor annoyances like "drinks from the carton", "won't pull down toilet seat"). Sounds good?

I sound like I'm giving you homework haha

DISCLAIMER: I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT I'M DOING haha this seems like a good way to go about it, to me anyway  . Feel free to take the reins of your own destiny and suggest another way to go about it.

Much respect for you cause you are strong enough to put up with other people's problems while having the same!

I don't "put up" with anyone: helping you, my family or whoever needs me is not a burden to me, I'll help if I can. sometimes I can't, and there's also strength in knowing your limits I think.

Ps. I might be less available because of family stuff over the holidays  , so keep that in mind if I take longer to answer.

[FaithfulInLove]

Hello itsmeSnap
and a big sorry for taking very long myself

I was really down yesterday, just kept myself distracted and talked to a friend.
i appreciate your posts a lot.

"but then I asked what about MY needs? why can't it be her that goes with MY flow?"

I think in a relationship it should be a bit about both people's flows... .

"Would you regret if after a long time of not speaking and you somehow reconnected, if you found out he was hoping for you to contact?"

No, I wouldn't regret it... sure it would be lost time but him seeing that I can go some time without smothering him would be beneficial for the whole dynamic between us after how much I cried around him, right?

"and just the same, would knowing that he actually doesn't care for you anymore not give you some relief and obviously after grieving your lost relationship, would you be open to experiencing that love with a new person, just as you experienced that with him after you've had relationships with others in the past?"

That is not a possibility for me, . I'd give it a few months or a year more and check in with him then and if he still doesn't want anything to do with me, maybe his feelings change within another year... ? There is always hope and I truly am not interested in "finding the love of my life" - I haven't been interested in getting married before I met him, he is the special one for me... and it would take someone TRULY special to replace him. I'm rather on my own than dragging someone along who is second choice for me.

"How did the fights play out? I'm asking because it seems the fight didn't get the message across that this is something important for you."

Ohh, I am sure the message came across that this is something important for me! But his opinion was that the relationship should always be first! BUt he had that opinion from day one of the relationship and the band has been my life YEARS before I met him, so putting the relationship first and stop following the band around just because he was not okay with that was something I wasn't ready to do so fast.
Someone becoming really important is a think that has to develop over time, right... ? He pushed me too much, just like I have pushing him too much then to get back together when he was not ready...

"Did you give in to going back to the hotel? or did he physically grabbed you and stuffed you in the room?"

He made me beg on my knees that I could at least stay and see them on my own if he didn't wanna... but he threatened to break up cause I care about them more anyway and got me coming with him by this if I remember the situation right... this is long ago...  

"Although he made me choose between that concert date and him before he really called it quits... ."

This is called, depending on your perspective, an ultimatum or a boundary. He could have handled it better, but it was something he thought important enough to say "this is the limit".

He had done this so many times before, if I knew he was serious this time maybe I would have made another decision... .I suggested so many ways to compromise but he wasn't okay with that anymore... .

"He tried to finalize the issue with that, you both chose your own way."

But now I'm here being ready to put him first and make him feel as important as he Needs! Sometimes you gotta lose someone to realise you really want him! I told you I never wanted to marry, he took Things soo fast I didn't even have the time to think about what's best for ME.

"Ps. I might be less available because of family stuff over the holidays"

Thank you for telling me! That will help me waiting!
Same here, I'll barely have a chance to get on my computer over the holidays. Maybe I'll also just enjoy being distracted - still I am excited to read from you again!

[itsmeSnap]

No, I wouldn't regret it... sure it would be lost time but him seeing that I can go some time without smothering him would be beneficial for the whole dynamic between us after how much I cried around him, right?

I'm sensing its more about you feeling you could go some time without seeing him that's better for the relationship; which also doesn't mean you've given up either. Overall I rate   

I'm rather on my own than dragging someone along who is second choice for me.

hear hear 

putting the relationship first and stop following the band around just because he was not okay with that was something I wasn't ready to do so fast.

He pushed me too much, just like I have pushing him too much then to get back together when he was not ready...

Sounds great, you know your values and where you stand on them. Particularly with putting a "relationship first", there's a balance to be had here. Instead of an either/or, look for ways to make the band thing "part of the relationship".

I realize you mentioned multiple times that he goes along to the events and then he doesn't want any of it so this could take some trial and error on your part, and now that you've mentioned you're in for the long haul you could get a lot of the latter so take care of yourself first and foremost, its a wild ride.

He had done this so many times before, if I knew he was serious this time maybe I would have made another decision

If there is a next time, you'll know he's serious about this. how you handle it is still important, don't just give in: he could take it to mean he can demand more from you, up to the unrealistic.

I suggested so many ways to compromise but he wasn't okay with that anymore.

did he go through with a compromise plan for a while and give up on it after?

But now I'm here being ready to put him first and make him feel as important as he Needs

he took Things soo fast I didn't even have the time to think about what's best for ME.

Do whats best for both then, win win right?

just kept myself distracted and talked to a friend.

Maybe I'll also just enjoy being distracted

Its good to hear you have someone to rely on.

Happy holidays. 

[FaithfulInLove]

Wow that was quick, thank you itsmeSnap!

"I'm sensing its more about you feeling you could go some time without seeing him that's better for the relationship; which also doesn't mean you've given up either."

Of course I haven't given up! I wouldn't be on here if I had ;)
Just I need to get calmer around him, I want this to feel good for both of us!

"Particularly with putting a "relationship first", there's a balance to be had here. Instead of an either/or, look for ways to make the band thing "part of the relationship"."

He is a fan, I am a fan - I think this should be doable! But he gets soo jealous! I think he is scared I'd leave him for them although they are famous and that's a bit unrealistic, right? But thinking that I WOULD might be enough for him!

"I realize you mentioned multiple times that he goes along to the events and then he doesn't want any of it so this could take some trial and error on your part,"

I think he enjoys those Events a lot himself, but it doesn't seem to feel good for him that I like them so much. Makes him feel put second - that's what he has mentioned often enough throughout the relationship. I haven't listened good enough. I've been annoyed by him trying to take such an important thing away from me. I didn't see his side, only saw mine cause, yeah, the band WAS that important.

"I suggested so many ways to compromise but he wasn't okay with that anymore."

did he go through with a compromise plan for a while and give up on it after?

No, it was a clear ultimatum, he didn't wanna compromise here... .but still... .
he said he loves me and that maybe we can make things work again... .just he also said he doesn't trust me anymore and so - it never happened, his new girlfriends came inbetween.

Happy Holidays to you too! Thanks for the Exchange of thoughts on all this!

[FaithfulInLove]

Update: after three and a half weeks he checked in with me in a light text message, asking if l was okay

I hope this means we will slowly be getting back into touch again

Thank you for listening throughout this hard time!

[FaithfulInLove]

So the story is... We had a nice friendly chat and even talked a bit the next morning.
Then he stopped responding... last thing l said was thank you for something his family send over. I feel like he needs more space... ?

Two days of silence again

[itsmeSnap]

Hi faithful

So the story is... We had a nice friendly chat and even talked a bit the next morning

 

I feel like he needs more space... ?

It's the holidays, things get chaotic at home regardless. He reached out, you responded, he now knows you'll respond to him if he does reach out again.

I say give it time.

How are you holding up yourself?

[FaithfulInLove]

Hey itsmeSnap!

Sorry for taking long to reply myself! The holidays kept me busy!
Hope you spent happy days with your family!

Has been a bit chaotic here!.

He reached out to me on Christmas day to say thank you for the little present I left him there and to tell me that my present will be late, he's sorry.

His parents and me set a time for a video call and I thought THEY wanted to talk, but after talking for a few minutes they just walked into his room and gave him the phone to talk to me! That felt really awkward because he was polite to me but I felt like was disturbing him!
We haven't been chatting for weeks, why would he wanna video chat with me?

Since then he didn't get back to my last message again and I feel sorry because even if this was not my fault/not my plan, it might feel like it for him and I hope it didn't get him too overwhelmed, seeing me without a warning... .

His parents have invited me for a visit in 4 months.
They know that my ex and me are friends but as he doesn't talk a lot to them (at least not about me as far as I know) so they don't know about how little we are talking at the moment and I am scared of talking about these issues with them as I know they are straighforward and they might pass on every word I say and if he feels like I am talking behind his back it might make things worse... .

Last time we saw each other my ex told me he wanted to take time off from work when I come over for that visit, so we can spend time. I don't know hiw he feels about that now... .
It feels like right now he is unsure about how much he wants me in his life but he is staying as polite to me as he can (without really making an effort/going out of his way to show me I matter). I feel like right now I must be really careful to not overwhelm him and it makes it really difficult planning the trip.

Any idea what to do from here? I'd love to find a way to make things better between us... .I'd love to get back to the lovely daily chats we had before we met and came close and before I have asked for space... .

I am really scared he will find someone new soon. Nothing hurts me more.

[itsmeSnap]

His parents and me set a time for a video call and I thought THEY wanted to talk, but after talking for a few minutes they just walked into his room and gave him the phone to talk to me!

Parents will be parents, they have the best intentions but sometimes they do make things very awkward.

How did you handle the call? I know that's in the past but poking a bit of fun at them parents could relax the situation.

Since then he didn't get back to my last message again and I feel sorry because even if this was not my fault/not my plan, it might feel like it for him and I hope it didn't get him too overwhelmed, seeing me without a warning

I see you're looking at it from his perspective, good progress 

Be fair to yourself, that was out of your control. Unless you expected them to give him the phone and had hidden motives yourself   there was not much you could have done.

Hanging up on him could be taken as a very rejecting and rude thing, and not talking during a call is its ugly cousin.

So things happen, wait and see what happens.

I am scared of talking about these issues with them as I know they are straighforward and they might pass on every word I say and if he feels like I am talking behind his back it might make things worse... .

If his parents have loose boundaries with him that might be an issue, its good that you're cautious particularly after having this situation (the unannounced call) just shoved in your face.

I am really scared he will find someone new soon

Maybe you, maybe someone else; you said you were ok with that right?

His parents have invited me for a visit in 4 months.

I feel like right now I must be really careful to not overwhelm him and it makes it really difficult planning the trip.

At least you now know that they are likely to "bump you into each other" during your visit. If you decide to go and if you can, let him know in no uncertain terms: "I am going to visit your parents" is as straightforward as it gets.

Any idea what to do from here? I'd love to find a way to make things better between us

You can maybe ask to meet him during the trip, try not to "wishy washy" it: a "wanna meet?" is much better than a "I don't know if you would want to go somewhere maybe?"

Of course he might not want to, but like they say, the ball would be on his court now.

Hope you spent happy days with your family!

As happy as I could have hoped for 

Good luck!

[FaithfulInLove]

Hello itsmeSnap!

Maybe you've already seen I've messaged you some details I didn't want to share with the whole world

a "wanna meet?" is much better than a "I don't know if you would want to go somewhere maybe?"

Don't you think that's pressuring for a polite young man because he might be afraid to say no although he is not so sure if this is what he wants?
Maybe an "l definitely wanna come and see your parents. Would love to spend time with you too! Let me know if you want to" approch would be good?

I would wanna leave this until we are talking more again, problem is: do I know if this will happen soon? No... .: (
Tricky situation!

[itsmeSnap]

Don't you think that's pressuring for a polite young man

Pressuring would have been along the lines of "I will visit your parents, I WILL see you there, you are not hiding from me, I will find you" or something like that haha

Maybe an "l definitely wanna come and see your parents. Would love to spend time with you too! Let me know if you want to" approch would be good?

Same thing as what I said, much more energetic though haha   but yeah that's the general idea; make it your own voice and not a script someone on the internet gave you  .

I would wanna leave this until we are talking more again, problem is: do I know if this will happen soon? No... .: (
Tricky situation!

Indeed it is, but you know you are willing to wait. Only time will tell.

[FaithfulInLove]

I WILL see you there, you are not hiding from me, I will find you" or something like that haha

I'm close to sending such a text :D Only joking of course... !

When I read those messages I keep thinking that approach must look completely naive, like... .he is sliding in and out of giving me the silent treatment, from being all nice, even apologising... .to "I gotta cut you off because you're disrespectful!"... .to coming back and talking with me again like a good friend... .

I think deep down inside he sees what he is doing there and that I am hurting.

I keep those cheerful sweet approaches and it helped us staying in touch so far, but at the same time I think a cheerful "I wanna spend time with you!" must sound really weird to him after all he did and I think he knows what he did... ?
He must be thinking he can do whatever he wants and I'll be just hurting silently and keep my fake smile on?

[itsmeSnap]

He must be thinking he can do whatever he wants and I'll be just hurting silently and keep my fake smile on?

Is it a fake smile though? I know you're hurting but were you not happy to be in contact with him?

There might be a time when you will have to decide if waiting it out is still worth it. You've mentioned you're willing to wait.

Just like climbing mount Everest, you'll be tired, grasping for breath, cold and miserable, you might get a broken limb or a frostbitten finger or toe. There are consequences to what we do, if you feel it is worth it you are more likely to push through it, you will see the summit (the relationship you want with him) and wonder at all you accomplished and you go out to the world to tell your story of bravery and achievement.

Or maybe you decide that you have more important thins in your life than a very tall piece of rock to step on.

Its about perspective and choice.

after all he did and I think he knows what he did... ?

Could be why he's conflicted. Maybe he knows exactly what he's doing and what its causing. Thats in his conscience.

You have to decide what to do with that information.

It is what it is, all the doubts you have about him I sense are more about your own wants and needs and how they conflict with the reality of your relationship.

You want to make it work, but also not like this. Makes sense?

Posting here has made me realize I might have done things in my own relationship to mess it up even though I was desperately trying to make it work myself.

Not saying you're doing it, just that there are reservations, thats where all the doubt might be coming from.

You would have been married right now if everything was right.

Not trying to bring guilt or doubt, I'm saying it because I know this was your own decision. Again, there are consequences and these are complex issues.

I think deep down inside he sees what he is doing there and that I am hurting.

You're the only one that can decide if this is worth it for you. There could be change, there might not be, be aware of that.

Sorry I got no real solutions for you, I keep stumbling upon hard walls myself looking for answers to my own issues.

I'll keep working on it, hopefully your situation gets better aswell.

 

[Bnonymous]

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