I really really really wanted this to be the one, the "keeper"

[VIDEO: "What is parental alienation?"]

Yes, I did notice the "love-bombing" and "pushing the relationship forward quickly" very early on.  

The other bad behavior that showed itself very early on...

I met my wife (current) online back in oh' seven…

Yeah, I was a clueless little pup back then…

So we met, and started dating… I knew enough to "take it slow", as I was newly divorced the year before, and had a GF in the interim, whom I know understand to be a classic borderline… when that ended, I met "Q" : )

So "Q" and I started to date, it was wonderful, she was perfect, we seemed to "click"… spent a lot of time together, she would come over to the house, and have dinner, as I was a single dad then... her dog even liked me, my dog adored her…

About four weeks in… no sex yet, as I was playing hard to get (smart?)… she was over to the house… supper, hanging out, talk… and she left to go back to her home… we hugged, we kissed, and expressed our mutual "good night"… and away she drove in her mustang ~>

About ten minutes later, I get a text from her… now keep in mind, this is oh' seven, the flip phone age, so you had to "really want to text"… she texts me… " I love you "…

Now, was this a bad thing?… not really (?), four weeks in (?)… she had all night right, but she tells me she loves me, with a text (?)… I tried to call her back, but she didn't pick up?… so I texted her back, "I love you too"… but in the back of my mind, I had "pause"… "a text, not in person"… hmmm

Now, to me, the very first "I love you", should be face to face… yes?

I think this was a first red flag…

It was so perfect the first 2-5 months… as I look back now, the "mask" was firmly in place… I had no clue about what was coming…

She started out small, I remember our very first little disagreement, very minor, and I let it go… but I thought to myself, "well, the innocence is now gone"…

When I asked her to marry me, three years later, I took her down to the beach, where we walked on our first date… I took out a little candle, I lit it as it was near dusk, got down on my knee, pulled out the ring, and asked her for her hand in marriage : )

" I love you "Q", will you take my hand in marriage, and be my wife, will you marry me "Q"?"…

*I rehearsed that too : )

… that was in late oh' ten… we married on New Years Day afterwards…

I really really really wanted this to be the one, the "keeper"… maybe she still is… its a journey right…

"flip phones"

Red5

[Red5]

Yes, I did notice the "love-bombing" and "pushing the relationship forward quickly" very early on.  

The other bad behavior that showed itself very early on...

I met my wife (current) online back in oh' seven…

Yeah, I was a clueless little pup back then…

So we met, and started dating… I knew enough to "take it slow", as I was newly divorced the year before, and had a GF in the interim, whom I know understand to be a classic borderline… when that ended, I met "Q" : )

So "Q" and I started to date, it was wonderful, she was perfect, we seemed to "click"… spent a lot of time together, she would come over to the house, and have dinner, as I was a single dad then... her dog even liked me, my dog adored her…

About four weeks in… no sex yet, as I was playing hard to get (smart?)… she was over to the house… supper, hanging out, talk… and she left to go back to her home… we hugged, we kissed, and expressed our mutual "good night"… and away she drove in her mustang ~>

About ten minutes later, I get a text from her… now keep in mind, this is oh' seven, the flip phone age, so you had to "really want to text"… she texts me… " I love you "…

Now, was this a bad thing?… not really (?), four weeks in (?)… she had all night right, but she tells me she loves me, with a text (?)… I tried to call her back, but she didn't pick up?… so I texted her back, "I love you too"… but in the back of my mind, I had "pause"… "a text, not in person"… hmmm

Now, to me, the very first "I love you", should be face to face… yes?

I think this was a first red flag…

It was so perfect the first 2-5 months… as I look back now, the "mask" was firmly in place… I had no clue about what was coming…

She started out small, I remember our very first little disagreement, very minor, and I let it go… but I thought to myself, "well, the innocence is now gone"…

When I asked her to marry me, three years later, I took her down to the beach, where we walked on our first date… I took out a little candle, I lit it as it was near dusk, got down on my knee, pulled out the ring, and asked her for her hand in marriage : )

" I love you "Q", will you take my hand in marriage, and be my wife, will you marry me "Q"?"…

*I rehearsed that too : )

… that was in late oh' ten… we married on New Years Day afterwards…

I really really really wanted this to be the one, the "keeper"… maybe she still is… its a journey right…

"flip phones"

Red5

[ColdKnight]

Hi Red,

What was the first little disagreement if you don’t mind me asking?

[Red5]

Hi Red,

What was the first little disagreement if you don’t mind me asking?

It was the Marine Corps Ball, 2007... which is in November.

I was a single dad, three teenagers, we lived on the air station here aboard Cherry Point, I was assigned to the Harrier training squadron as the ordnance shop chief.

My daughter was about fifteen at the time, “Q” and I had been dating since June, it was about the middle of October... so “Q” and I had been dating for about four months...I’d asked her to go, as attendance is a mandatory event, but I didn’t tell her that...

My duaghters friends said they were going too, along with there mothers and fathers...

I said sure why not, you might have fun...

When I casually mentioned this to “Q”, she politely blew a gasket... I tried to explain that D15 would be in a different part of the venue than us... but “Q” would not relent... she went on and on, we were on the phone that night...

So I recall asking her why this was such a big deal to her... and I got the “you’ve been with me long enough that you should know”... ie’ mind reading, I was still a clueless pup at this point.

So I told her, “look, if it means that much to you, I’ll tell D15 that we will be attending the Ball sans teenage daughter”... yeah, D15 wasn’t even going to ride with us...

So November rolls around, and we get invited to “Q’s” Foo sisters home for Thanksgiving... my three kids were all invited too... it wa nice, a family get together, you see the divorce was pretty hard on them, as their mum had basically abandoned them (us), so any semblance of normality was a good thing...

So you aren’t going to believe this... after the evening of Thanksgiving dinner, and about two weeks form the Marine Corps Ball, that very evening... “Q’s” father passes away, dropped dead... he was 65, and had mesothelioma... terrible... lots of resulting drama, is an understatement... wow : (

So, here it’s time for the Ball, a few days weeks later... but “Q”, even though she had bought a gown, says that she is “too depressed” to go, even as her Foo offer d encouragement... she said no...

But the USMC Ball was an appointee place of duty, so I went solo, and I got sloshed, I had a great time...

Got a ride back home from the venue, which was at the convention center up in New Bern...

The next day was a Saturday... and “Q” came over that afternoon, we hung out, and then she took me to New Nern to get my truck...

I will always remember the “big fuss” she made about the tickets, and her dress, and my daughter... to the point I as like ______.

It amazed me how she was unable to “let it go”, to “chill”... so ridged... black and white... like she seemed to think she owned me after only four months... then her Dad dies... she switches gears... won’t go, so forth and so on... that first Christmas... she was also acting out... that’s another story... I called it the “cutting board Christmas”... so two red flags inside of six months... should have given me a clue... but I was not aware then, even after the divorce and dating the Red Head realeaste agent...

Those first four months were awesome, not one single aurgument... nothing, just as sweet as she could be, and the love bombing, and the little gifts... I was in heaven... as I’d not had this kind of treatment from a woman in over a decade...

Then she took it as a slight about D15 and the Ball tickets... like flipping a switch, wow.

I’ve read, that the borderline can only hold the mask for about 4-6 months, then they can’t do it anymore.

I tell you the truth, after being marri d to her for eight years... and an eleven year relationship... I must have driven her absolutely NUTS those first four months... yeah, and I’m not talking about happy happy boom boom either, but what kept her around for 3.5 years... we broke up many times over this period, before we married... I chocked it all up to post divorce independent attitude, ie’ hard headiness...

But it was borderline... but... I obviously had no way of knowing, or understanding what or whom she really was...

Yeah... we’ve now been separated for nine plus months... and she is basically NC with me, although, she did come by last Saturday and dropped off S33 (autistics) birthday present...

So, what is that?, why the continued contact there?

Thoughts?

Red5

 

[ColdKnight]

Red,

Thank you for your service btw.

I have read that most people are on their best behavior for the first 4-5 month of a relationship so I would imagine a pwBPD would be the same. They just have more turmoil to suppress and when they finally blow look out.

After the ball incident did it seem like the incidents became more and more regular for minor issues? Looking back would you have done anything different? (besides move on down the road and not look back ) Would you have held firm on allowing your daughter to go?

You said you have been “basically” NC for 9 months. Does that just mean a text here or there about “business”

What caused this final split?

How long had it been since you had seen her prior to her dropping off the gift for your son?

[Red5]

I have read that most people are on their best behavior for the first 4-5 month of a relationship so I would imagine a pwBPD would be the same. They just have more turmoil to suppress and when they finally blow look out.

This pattern seems to hold true, across the board, 4-5 months, then the mask slips.

After the ball incident did it seem like the incidents became more and more regular for minor issues?

Yes… increasing from minor, to semi middle of the road, escalating to "don't call me ever again"… then recycle… I lost count after the second year of dating.

Looking back would you have done anything different? (besides move on down the road and not look back ) Would you have held firm on allowing your daughter to go?

If I'd known the tools, and what I was involved in… perhaps (retrospect)… and yes, I would have been firm about my D15… you don't "own" anyone after four months of dating… but that was my mindset, due to not being aware at that time (lost in the sauce pup)… I was the "people pleaser" due to the love bombing campaign at that time.

You said you have been “basically” NC for 9 months. Does that just mean a text here or there about “business”

In the first two months, it was NC, then we started talking, and a few texts, mind you it was all blame-shame-projection (BSP)… me being the target… then we had "lunch"… more BSP, gave me indigestion… then we started meeting for lunch regularly, about three times, and she took me to dinner for fathers day… each time, its was BSP… ouch… but I took it all… then she went grey rock again… a few texts… I tried to keep contact with her… even going to her new house to "help" with things... haul things for her, currently she has split me pretty black… its been almost ten months…

What caused this final split?

She hit my son… and that was it… SET, and validation are thrown aside when the borderline step mom hits your autistic kid (S33) .. for taking too long in the bathroom… long story man : (

How long had it been since you had seen her prior to her dropping off the gift for your son?

Since Aug 3rd… when I repaired a piece of furniture for her, and took it to her house, had a pretty good visit .. then she went high * right on me about an hour later first text, then phone call, she "blew it up"…

mstnghu… as far as lying I don't think she ever does outright, its more the "magical thinking, and "emotional reasoning"… rewriting history to suit her mood, and her feelings equal facts persona…

Red5

[Red5]

It's been about 11 years but I clearly remember the first time I ever saw my wife dysregulate over absolutely nothing.

...…I was completely blind-sided by this… I still chose to continue the relationship and these sorts of flip-outs have happened many times since.

#Me2…

… after the aforementioned Thanksgiving, a few weeks later, and after her father's funeral... was Christmas, together now (oh' seven) 6'ish months, so things were 'serious'… she said, that "Christmas is a big deal for me"… so I took a clue, I remember her putting up her tree, and then helping me at my house (single dad pad with three teenagers)… she asked what I wanted for Christmas… I said something like… "I just want to be happy"… I got a funny look, so I did the JADE thing… "well "Q", this time year before last, I was in Iwakuni Japan, W#1 was making her exit back home, and I was 3k miles away, across the Pacific… it was a long WESTPAC (six months) when you know your S2B exW is stepping out on you, and is neglecting the kids… it was a rough time"… "so I just want to be happy"… more looks, now a frown (?)… no empathy maybe (?)…

So I asked her, but never got a real answer, (mind reading was expected by now) but I was listening to her... I got *slippers *a nice bamboo cutting board * gloves, *scarf *____ (a few other needs-wants)... so Red5 delivers, right down the checklists... exactly what she said she was looking for... yeah 

So we spent Christmas eve together, and then she went back home, as we were to have Christmas day diner at Foo sisters again (same place as Thanksgiving)... she took her presents home with her .. not opened yet.

There was no call that next morning, figured she was talking to her grown and gone two adult children... by noon time, still no call... so I called her... "hey, what do I need to bring again... love you!, see you soon"... she was cold and distant (?)... oh boy : (

So I showed up, with S(autistic) only, as my other two teens had "other plans"...

I remember coming in the back door, there she was, standing next to her mum, in her sisters kitchen... and I got the weirdest look from both of them... my heart sank... I had no idea what was up... I figured it was still the passing of dad...

Still cold, not even a hug... lunch was cold, distant, weird... couldn't wait to leave, get out of there... on the way out, I tried to kiss her, she gave me a cheek (wtf)... I gave her a card, she snatched it from my hand... and away me and the boy went... I was like wtf over... and "F" this $hit : (

She calls me later on, and lites into me for being SO INCONSIDERATE (?)... yeah... blindsided : (

This is what happened, the presents I got her, form the gourmet kitchen store, and the ladies "boutique"... after six months of a relationship, were NOT good enough, what, no "bling" she said... she devalued them all, and she said she took everything to the good will!

She went on, to compare me to my predecessor... how he was this and that, and the "most considered man"... yuck !... she said... "did you see those earrings I was wearing, well he (tommy boy) gave them to me"... "he knew how to treat a lady"... "YOU DONT"... and she hung up on me...

Well... merry /F_ing/ Christmas huh : (

She said to never call her again... that was our first Christmas together... there is a lot more to tell, but... maybe later... talk about a red flag !  ugh : (

Yeah, blindsided... but I recycled with her in about a weeks time... and then onto the next torpedo attack...

sheeesh : (

Red5

Prologue... her ex asked her for a divorce on Thanksgivig day... so obviously T-giving is a "trigger"...

[ColdKnight]

Hmmmmmmm that very would could be.
The twice mine did it were always early July each time at about the four month mark. So I don’t know if it’s the season or the time.

[Red5]

Hmmmmmmm that very would could be.

So I don’t know if it’s the season or the time.

So as her father passed away in November (month) as well.

As did her ex husband... again in the month of November.

But wait there’s more... she had a beloved yorkie pup, who would have been fifteen years old this year, also... passed away last November... NOVEMBER... she had her altercation with my autistic S33 the very next morning after her pup passed...

Obviously she was “disassociated” in her “executive functions”... so she went after him that next morning... and we seperated two weeks later resultant... DV is a deal breaker...

But I’m still holding on to that damn rope...

Yeah, November is a major trigger month for her... also December... but perhaps December is just collateral splatter shrapnel from November... our anniversary is New Year’s Day, it’s always been hard to get her back to “baseline” by _one_ January... the stories I can tell, about her tearing down the Christmas tree on Christmas Eve...yeah, wow ; (

How a-bought you CK, ever experienced anything like that?

Red5

[Red5]

I think July just happened to be a coincidence. A friend asked if I thought it was a July trigger.

I think the trigger was whenever we started to get close she would start to feel jealousy creep in.

I think when those feelings began to crop up again she pulled away.

What I’ve read, is that borderlines fear closeness, intimacy... due to the ever present fear of abandonment, fueled by jealousy perhaps as you are describing CK... and they have to always be in control due to this inner turmoil, being the fear of abandonment... internal constant “what if” emotional reasoning, quickly turns into “feelings equal facts”... so their overwhelming desire to control leads them to sabotage the relationship...just when things are getting stabilized from the last derailment...  

It’s a viscous “catch-22”... so as their control urges overpower their sense of _____ for the non, you and me... they will destroy the relationship... a preimtive bridge demolition scenario...I’ll leave you first,

And the non never see’s it coming, and doesn’t understand why... “I thought we were good, what the h3ll are you doing, why are you doing this to me”...

It could be sparked by something inconsequential... a missed phone call or text... seemingly out of proportional anger, rage, and scorched earth type stuff...

The borderline is hypersensitive... and the non doesn’t realize this phenomenon... so there you have it.

... wash rinse repeat.

My own ubpdw has left before, the first time was only four months into the marriage... and I helped her do it, I rented the truck, as she said... “I’m done”... she was going after my two other teenagers whom were still living at home with me then...and I’ve lost count of the “I’m DONE I want a divorce” line, the extinction burst type behaviors... although she will accuse me of doing it too... and I have, at the point of exasperation... to make it, her... just stop, after she had utterly destroyed me emotionally...devalued the marriage... blew it all up...

It’s been a wild ride, eight years married, eleven plus years relationship... she is a very volatile person inside, and I didn’t see it, or else I’m subconsciously ignore it... for years.

When they (she) is in “full bloom”... and about to be overwhelmed by her inner demons, for lack of a better word, everyone, including her most closest become targets for her rage... her own daughter, son, their fiancée’s, now wife (her son), and third husband in the case of her daughter... also in laws... her sisters, her mother... my children, and “me”... all attacked at some point along the way...

But it’s all my fault...smh,

She is fifty two now, and she has cancer... she will never admit to herself, “introspection” that there is any “problem”, too prideful, too hardheaded... whatever... it’s all about the “inner wounded child”, the “false self” that was created when she was a kid,borderline is caused by childhood trauma... in most cases...from what I’ve read.

If we stay,we have to enter into radical acceptance... and you have to also release your expectations of what you wanted the relationship to ever be, because the borderline cannot ever give that to you... because it was never given to them when they were children... that’s the BLUF.

Its sad, and their are battalions and regiments, whole divisions of folks who will never understand this... and they will conintue to suffer, and be abused, and never understand why, and they will think that they themselves must be at fault...this is part of the control and punish aspect of a borderline relationship.

But once the non becomes aware, wakes up, smells the coffee brewing, then things change... trust me, when this happens... the borderline will pick up on it immediately... like the radio station changing on its own... and it will que up their dysregulative behaviors... because they understand that their control over the non, is about to end, and their fear of abandonment goes hyperspace...

Wow ; (

I used to think, “she just likes to fight”...”that’s how she was raised, her whole family is Iike this”... “I’ve married another one”... oh boy, damn.

But there is way more to it than that... that “fight” in her was, and still is... borderline-narcissistic rage, and it’s always right there... one misstep, and you will ignite it... its their defensive mechanism... and there is little to zero chance of them ever “overcoming” this hard wired defensive mechanism within them.

The borderline will destroy everything... to keep that inner balance of control... the inner child stands watch over the false self, they are arrested here, they never emotionally developed beyond this point.

Tough stuff,

Red5

[ColdKnight]

“It’s a viscous “catch-22”... so as their control urges overpower their sense of _____ for the non, you and me... they will destroy the relationship... a preimtive bridge demolition scenario...I’ll leave you first, ... “

I agree. Control is very important to them. When we had our very first hiccup last year she said “when I’m not in control I feel like I am drowning” I took that as in control of herself but now I believe it was in control of the relationship. Actually probably both.

[once removed]

the two of you are still in contact, right? how is it going?

[Red5]

the two of you are still in contact, right? how is it going?

... ColdKnight, or Red5?

[once removed]

i was asking you, Red.

[Red5]

... last year she said “when I’m not in control I feel like I am drowning” I took that as in control of herself but now I believe it was in control of the relationship. Actually probably both.

The average non is like, “go along to get along”... comfrey in their own skin, there is introspection... accountability, and mutual respect of others, most of us (nons) are empathic, we are caregivers, not caretakers... there may be a healthy degree of humility in us, would never even think of hurting anyone else, either physically or emotionally... we feel genuine sadness when others are hurting, and we want to help them... we have the need to “talk things through”... we may be “gullible”... assuming that everyone else is like us, that the random psychopath is a rareity...

We may have gone many years not understanding the complexity of the human social emotional constructs... and how this related to our ongoing relationships...

I remember the night my first wife told me that she was sexually abused as a child... I was twenty two, she was twenty... we’d been married for four years, and had our first son, whom is autistic...I had no clue at all how to process that, or even the extreme ramifications of what this was going to mean to our marriage.

That was thirty one years ago...

Yes, these souls are either drowning, or clinging to someone else to try to keep from drowning... metaphorically.

And you know what happens when the drowning person panics while you are trying to rescue them.

“I felt like I am drowning” is a very accurate way to describe what they may be feeling.

When the anger pool overflows, like rushing flood waters, nothing is safe in its path... the borderline will attack anything, anyone when they are trying to keep from drowning... their feelings overwhelm them, there is no empathy... to a child, and adult, and in my case, a special needs autistic... and that’s just damn awful... who would, in any frame of mind do this?

I’ve tried to wrap my mind around this... as to why... and it’s so very damn complicated...

I think what your partner said, was “both” CK, she meant herself, and the relationship.

My current ubpd wife used to tell me quite often... “I love you Red5...but you have the capability to make me very angry”...

“And why is this” I used to ask...she also told me many times... “I have a temper, do you think you can handle it”... well, that was a red flag ...

She told, me her younger brother had a “chemical imbalance”... I’ve been reading about this a lot lately... he was very abusive to his three older sisters... and he went on to marry, and have three daughters of his own, after he died at 40 from a heart attack the oldest daughter was down here for a visit a few years back... she recounted how “dad” was pretty much a tyrant... pretty bad stuff... but the Foo does not ever talk about it anymore, it’s been white washed... I could relate a few stories that would cause some here to gasp... yeah...a “chemical imbalance”... sure (yeah right)... I think there was abuse in the home, I’ve heard enough now to connect those dots... both of my fellow BIL’s have rcounted to me some pretty crazy stories (confirmation)... the other two marriages Foo sisters have lasted 30&31 years each... and both are very dysfunctional,

I’d better stop... for now, but to me, it tells the story of this Foo.

And it explains to me why ubpdw left home at sixteen, to marry a man seven years her senior... and keep in mind they dated for over a year beforehand...circa 1983-84... and it also explains to me her current and ongoing unstable mental-emotional homeostasis...

... wow, sometimes I wish I’d taken the “blue pill” instead.

Red5

 

[Red5]

i was asking you, Red.

We talk sporadically... it will be ten months seperated on the 30th.

Things seemed to be getting a bit better the end of August, but she blew it up...

We had an hour and forty five minute phone call about five days ago.  

And it was all “pbs”... projection, blame, shame.

She is still...very very angry...because I “kicked her out”... I said to her, the morning of the vent, “either me and “J” (S33@utistic) leave, or you need to”... so she called her sister, said “I’m done, help me get out of here”... and two weeks later she moved out.

We both went to speak with our Pastor, seperately... but that went nowhere, I’ve been talking to a “T” August was a year in duration... she is fighting cancer... so that overshadows everything...

She actually said, I’m not changing, and neither are you, we have very different parenting styles... and we will never agree...more “pbs”.

If my relationship with her, and subsequent marriage was a college course, I would receive a solid “F” for all subjects, all semesters... from her, but she tells me, “your a good man Red” & “your a good father Red”  ?

She seems unrelenting... I’m wrong, she is right, always, and perpetually...

She also said, “I don’t regret hitting him, I’d do it again, he deserved it”... wow,

She went on, “he is autistic, he isn’t stupid, he can learn”...

Ugh ; (

... no remorse, no empathy... black and white, all or nothing thinking.

But why... an autistic person, who is about a six year old in a grown mans body, he turned 33 the other weekend...and get this, she even gave him a birthday present?

This was all over how long he spends in the bathroom... I think she bullied him, she has hit him before... she has thrown his things into the floor... she tried to control/punish him...it was ongoing for quite a while... and when I dared to intervene... boom!

Why...is she jealous of his relationship with me, as I’m his caregiver...for life?
 
Could it be that simple...

She seems to want to stay connected, but my neutral texts about the weather, seem to infuriate her, so that stopped... much less a weekly phone call, quickly degrades into a rage attack...

I dunno, any ideas OR’.

Red5

[once removed]

She actually said, I’m not changing, and neither are you, we have very different parenting styles... and we will never agree ...more “pbs”.

red ive followed your story for a long time, and if i can speak frankly, i dont think you listen to her.

i think you are far too quick to dismiss what she says as BPD, or PBS, or something else.

the two of you have been fighting about parenting styles for a very long time, and it finally came to a head. members tried to tell you this at the time.

blending families is an enormous challenge. your style has been pretty rigid in that it has never allowed her to have much of a say. this would be immensely challenging and frustrating for anyone.

Why...is she jealous of his relationship with me, as I’m his caregiver ...for life?
 
Could it be that simple ...

it could. it could also be that she feels that time after time, shes been put second.

do you see that as a possibility?

I’m wrong, she is right, ..

i dont see or hear this in her words. i hear "we disagree. we cant get it together and meet in the middle." do you see that as a possibility?

i think there was a window of time in which this could have been resolved. there is obviously still love there on both sides. maybe it still can be. it seems like youre both giving up hope that it can?

[Red5]

... I dont think you listen to her.
I agree with you OR, I can be very hardheaded and stubborn... I need to understand this, and own this, she says the same thing.
I think you are far too quick to dismiss what she says as BPD, or PBS, or something else.
... again, I agree... sometimes, I wonder if she is bpd at all... and I’m barking up the wrong tree, am I just that hard too get along with, that said, her own two adult children, and her two BIL’s warned me about her “personality”... more and more though, I’m second guessing myslef,

the two of you have been fighting about parenting styles for a very long time, and it finally came to a head. members tried to tell you this at the time.
... yes you did, but I was too fixated on my own hurt to catch your drift... but whose right, could she be, or is it me... then I get her own children’s accounts... and as well her accounts of their upbringing... the BLUF is she hit him, should I take the responsibility for enabling this event... did I’m actually set it up... due to my letting it come to a head?

blending families is an enormous challenge. your style has been pretty rigid in that it has never allowed her to have much of a say. this would be immensely challenging and frustrating for anyone.
... maybe I was too protective, after what happened in my own divorce... but I do agree with your statement above, blended families are a challenge... she moved into our home, she was the outsider, trying to parent... trying to parent kids whom had been abandoned by their own mother three and a half years previous...I know I’m too ridged... and protective... all true.

it could. it could also be that she feels that time after time, shes been put second... do you see that as a possibility?

I do, I put her second, after my special needs Son...matter of fact, her words exactly...

i dont see or hear this in her words. i hear "we disagree. we cant get it together and meet in the middle." do you see that as a possibility?

Yup, again, her exact words, then she let me have it... she vented a lot of her anger at me...she has been doing this for a long time...

i think there was a window of time in which this could have been resolved. there is obviously still love there on both sides. maybe it still can be. it seems like youre both giving up hope that it can?

yes, there was a window, but I was at the time far too defensive and dismissive of her...she tells me she loves me, and misses me, she is still very angry however... perhaps time... which time is running out, she is stage iv RCC ; (

... thanks you for you frankness OR, I know I need to hear this... and as I said... sometimes I wonder if she is borderline at all...yeah, I’m that mixed up right now, maybe I am for goodness sakes...

Red5

[Cat Familiar]

I’m wondering if you two could agree to set aside past history and enjoy a date night with each other?

[once removed]

I do, ... I put her second, after my special needs Son...matter of fact, her words exactly...

you love your son, Red. all of us can see that. and as a person with special needs, i think we can all understand why you are protective.

putting yourself in her shoes, imagine if you entered into a family with someone elses special needs child and all of the challenges involved, but had no say in how the child was parented, you fought about it often, and you felt put second.

you would have huge resentment. you would feel trapped. you wouldnt feel sufficiently part of the family.

but whose right, could she be, or is it me

the question is not who is right; this is a very complex set of circumstances and history. the question is can the conflict be resolved. right now, she seems to have concluded it cant be. it hasnt been, thus far.

if you think that you have put her second and not allowed her a say, i think it would go a very long way to own that. however, that alone would not resolve the conflict. i think if the two of you want to save this, professional help would go a very long way. id each speak to your pastor about it. id see someone who is a specialist in terms of working with blended families and blending parenting styles. it will require open minds, and open hearts.

what do you think?

[AskingWhy]

Red, whenever I check into BPD Family, I wonder how you are doing.

Entering a marriage with children from a partner who is divorced as always troubling, and even more so with BPD partner.  It's a balancing act of loving one's children, but also giving the spouse the allegiance and place they deserve as one's partner.

You W's comment that she would hit your son again speaks volumes.

Have you read Bancroft's, "Should I Stay or Should I Go?"  It's a workbook about abusive R/Ss.

You know my uBPD H was unable to do this due to the guilt he felt from his divorce from his uNPD X W.  I was the afterthought and came after his children.  This carries into their adulthood and they are all almost 30. 

Your S33 needs you as his caretaker.  He cannot live my himself and your W was totally out of line for what she did to him.  BPD or not, you should not give her a pass for what she did.  Ever.

One of the things about BPD is when they have the NPD lack of empathy.   This means empathy for children and one's pets.  Lack of empathy for innocent family members is not negotiable.  As your S is not going to "grow up," this will be a point to ponder. 

We as partners need to decide what is negotiable and what is not. 

Take care, Red5, as you weigh the development of this separation.   

[empath]

Red5...   

As I read your posts, I get the sense that you feel guilty or like you are the "bad guy" for standing up for your son on that morning. What would happen if you just agreed with Q that you and she have different parenting styles? The events of that morning go beyond "parenting styles" - and honestly, I'm not sure that an altercation could have been prevented. Even in my house, there was a situation between my h and my youngest d that crossed over into abuse. I think several of us around here have had those situations.

It's hard to have firm boundaries and own them for yourself. I still want to soften my boundaries so that I don't sound so mean.