Wondering?

[Depression = 72% of members]

Just got finished with another relationship ( huge difference in age, 25 years) it makes me think about all the other relationships I've had that have failed. Two marriages, countless girlfriends.  I'm not sure anymore it's the other person but me whom is the problem. As I read about BPD, I see myself, not her. I really liked her, could've loved her, wanted to love her but found fault in everything she did. What to do?

[Golfdude]

Just got finished with another relationship ( huge difference in age, 25 years) it makes me think about all the other relationships I've had that have failed. Two marriages, countless girlfriends.  I'm not sure anymore it's the other person but me whom is the problem. As I read about BPD, I see myself, not her. I really liked her, could've loved her, wanted to love her but found fault in everything she did. What to do?

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[pursuingJoy]

Welcome to bpdfamily, golfdude! We're glad you're here!

I'm sorry to hear about your recent break up. What made you start reading about BPD, and can you give us a few more specifics about how you see yourself in reading about it?

Again, welcome!

pj

[Golfdude]

Went back to counseling after this breakup. Mentioned to her that the ex was on Lithium. Her reply was 'she's bipolar'. I then began reading up on BP, which brought here.

[Golfdude]

I don't have all of the symptoms listed below.  I know that I have helped chase people away from me, wife ( infidelity), stepkids, my own son, grandkids by my antisocial behavior. I know that I chased away this last gf by constantly telling her to leave then wanting to get back with her.

Behavioral: some antisocial behavior, compulsive behavior, hostility, impulsivity, irritability, lack of restraint, risk taking behaviors, self-destructive behavior,  or social isolation
Mood: anger, anxiety, general discontent, guilt, loneliness, mood swings, or sadness
Psychological: depression, distorted self-image, grandiosity, or narcissism

[Golfdude]

Mostly, I feel bad about the way I treated her. If I had known that she was BP or BPD, I would have handled our arguments differently. A little more listening instead of hearing, acting instead of reacting. Maybe should have let my guard down and let her in.  Inside, I knew she would end up leaving. My justification was the age difference.
I'm my defense, she did all the classic stuff, tried to isolate me from my friends, was clinging, needing, made herself out to be the victim, tried to dominate all my time.

[pursuingJoy]

I think it's pretty normal, and might even take some maturity, to see ourselves as we read about BPD. It's really about coping mechanisms and unhealthy relating habits that are largely learned, things we all struggle with and need to learn more about.

I'm glad to hear you're in counseling again and they're qualified to assess you if indeed you have BPD. In the meantime, you'll find support and understanding here.

Hindsight's always 20/20. Don't be too hard on yourself. We all make mistakes in relationships. You both probably played a role. We can all learn and do better next time.

This is a rough season for you. As they say, lean into it, continue counseling, keep processing and read the tools on this site, and of course, share here.

pj

[Golfdude]

It was the alcohol that helped kill us. We rarely argued or fought when we were not drinking. We were toxic with each other when drunk. Another learned behavior from my mother.

 What I didn't understand was, after confronting her with the pattern we were falling into,  she couldn't or didn't want to change, the other question in my head was, is it me that didn't change or a combination of both. The counselor told me that the booze counteracts the medication she is on. Which accounted for her nasty disposition before the honeymoon phase was over. Also accounts for the huge weight gain.  She's been obese since her teens reflecting her mother ( first born) Reading all of this ( after we broke up) I lay here with all this remorse and guilt. I did like her, and could've loved her. My friends tell me it's for the better, my distance friends tell me the same. She moved on 4 weeks of break up after a year and a half. I work in the national physics program and she's now with a line cook.  Im feeling stupid.
 

[Golfdude]

Another reason why I went back to counseling.

[Golfdude]

i have to find peace within myself, and put to rest those demons that I grew up with. I need to not be like my Mother. Thought  I was fixed after the 2nd divorce. I need to move forward with my life and somehow learn to love me and the people I surround myself. I need to learn how to love the people  that love me. I can do all the material and successful things to make my/ our lives happy and not need anything. I just keep destroying it.

[I Am Redeemed]

Many of us here who have chosen partners with BPD traits have found that the choices we make regarding relationships come from experiences with our Family of Origin (FOO). Whether our parents had personality disorders, depression, alcoholism, addictions, or were just emotionally immature or high conflict people, our childhood experiences can greatly contribute to our adult relationship dynamics.

Some of us also have symptoms of complex post traumatic stress disorder. Incidentally, the symptoms of trauma disorders can closely resemble some BPD traits.

Are you still seeing a counselor?

[Golfdude]

Oh, yeah! She agrees that I'm depressed. Also agrees on seeking other professional help for diagnosis.

[AbuNassif]

May I suggest that you ask your friends, one by one, what they like or admire about you so that they call you friend? Make a list, and see for yourself who you are. Look at your friends, consider what you like so much about them, and see for yourself who you are. You know a man by his friends. It's true. Stop and think about what makes you special, how you contribute to your world and how you live out what you value, and commit to making that important.

Don't try to see yourself in the mirror of a troubled and failed relationship.

I've made the mistake in thinking that my intimate relationships would be different than my friendships, and so it was ok to unload the darker stuff on my lovers ... or that I would take their dark stuff, because that's what a lover does, heroically carries what the other can't. It's rubbish. Love is not about trading the hidden hurts, that's part of it, as love can heal, but it's dangerous.

What makes a love relationship more special than friendship is that there is more interest and investment in what makes the lovers special, more than what friends have time or capacity for, plus attraction and satisfying sex. Then there's the real efficiencies of sharing expenses and housing, and forming a team to face family obligations, contribute to society, etc.

Don't beat yourself up. Everybody gets confused and lost. The lucky ones have the chance to find themselves. That's what break-ups are, the chance to look again at who you are, and what you want for your best self.

[pursuingJoy]

Great response, AbuNassif!

[Golfdude]

It is a great response! I need to digest it because a lot of what you wrote has been ringing in my head for years. I don't have and never had a lot of close friends, always kept them at arms length. Have had plenty of opportunity, professionally and personally, to make friends but I always walk away, not letting anybody get to know me. Inside, I know what my fear is, abandonment, betrayal. I bring those feelings to my relationships hoping someone can understand them. Then comes the testing phase, push and pull until they ( or me ) have had enough.

[Golfdude]

Sort of a self fulfilling prophecy.

[once removed]

Just got finished with another relationship ( huge difference in age, 25 years)

what happened?

who broke up with whom? do you want to reconcile?

[Golfdude]

We were drinking and got into an argument at the bar and left together. When we got home, I pulled one of her triggers ( unknowingly at the time) and she snapped again. She began to get in my face, yelling and screaming. I immediately shut down, having seen this before. When I walked away, she began to chase me around the house and trapped me in the bathroom. This is where she began throwing things at me. She wanted me to get physical with her but still walked away. Snatched the phone out my hand and snapped it in half. Btw that's the second time she broken my phone. Was able to get out of the bathroom without any more violence. Walked into the kitchen with her behind me, her still screaming. I told her we can't solve anything while we've been drinking. That's when she grabbed me by the belt from behind and took me to the floor. Crashed into the kitchen roll around, broke a bottle of wine and cut my arm. Told her to leave ( she did).
That wasn't the only time. She's destroyed drywall, pictures, vases, thrown things, etc. I vowed then it was going to be the last time.
We've broken up many times only to get back together. And have tried to talk to her about the fighting and what goes on from my perspective. We really never argued unless drinking was involved and I pointed it out to her.
She doesn't remember saying the things she said or take any responsibility for her actions.
In fairness to her, I've been no angel either. Over the years, I've taken the attitude that I don't need this crap. She's complained that I've disrespected her in public but the people around us haven't really seen what she's talking about. Well,  those friends ended up being polarized. To much of our personal business ended up being 'out there'. It wasn't me telling them.
what I didn't know was evertime we separated, she was cultivating other friendships. That's how she was able to move on so fast.
As far as getting back together, I don't know. She's blocked and unblocked me twice. This last time was with a pic of her and new beau, the line cook.  Btw, He was a friend of mine.  She's still partying and drinking. I need my life to head into a direction that's not toxic. Will continue with the counseling, it's helping.

[Golfdude]

Had her charged and arrested.  She initiated NC, rightfully so. I tried to contact her,  only a couple times, over a period of 5 weeks, because my feelings were hurt also. I sought her out at a pub I heard she was going to. She told me it was over and she had a boyfriend.  I left but came back to see who it was and there he is, sitting next her, grinning at me, a friend of mine. WOW, I was so embarrassed. Left without saying or doing anything. Ended up dropping the charges out of remorse, probably shouldn't have. She's still drinking and partying, as far as I know.
I don't understand why she blocked and now unblocked me twice. To hurt me?
Reconcile? I don't know, the sex was the best ever but she really didn't contribute to the house as much as I thought she should've. She is/ was living at her grandmothers house but her father told her she had to move out due to the family selling it. She's not working full time and hasn't for 5 + years.
Honestly, my feelings are hurt that I allowed this to go on as long as I did. All the red flags were out there. The drinking, fighting, PLEASE READing, isolation, jealousy, my fear abandonment, loneliness, low self esteem.
I need to fix it!

[Golfdude]

It does help to vent here!

[pursuingJoy]

Vent away, Golfdude, we're here.

Honestly, my feelings are hurt that I allowed this to go on as long as I did. All the red flags were out there. The drinking, fighting, PLEASE READing, isolation, jealousy, my fear abandonment, loneliness, low self esteem.

I'm glad you're continuing with counseling, and that you've identified the things above! It is important to work through your pieces, that will help you identify 'green flags' in future relationships and maybe even avoid 'red flags.'

What you described was domestic violence. Do you believe that's a fair assessment, and do you talk about her behavior in these terms with your counselor?

[Golfdude]

not sure as to the domestic violence because I've firsthand been in 2 of those r/s. Both were violent. The first one was when I was young ~ 23. The second one was with baby mama.  I was older than her by 6 years.  That one was extremely toxic and violent and went on for years. Then there was my 1st marriage ( in between the 2).  That marriage lasted only 8 months and she kicked me to the curb for my toxic behavior.  Extensive marriage counseling then just counseling , started to see a pattern developing.
The push pull behavior that existed in this last r/s was me 'seeing' things that didn't make sense. The morbid jealousy in social settings, trying to isolate me from my friends, name calling, shaming ( particularly when alcohol was involved) the crying, the fits she would throw, her behavior in public when she didn't get her way, etc.  I chalked it up to immaturity. Every time she would exhibit one of those behaviors, I would make her leave, thinking that would jolt her into reality.  Little did I know that I was also creating a problem.  BUT, we always came back to each after a couple of days. One day I figured it out and attempted to talk to her about it.  These events didn't happen unless we were drinking. I told her we need to figure out a way to stay together for more than 15 days at a time.  This went on for almost 1 1/2 years. I now know I stayed because of low self esteem, fear of loneliness,  low self worth, pattern of self destruction.
And yes, I talk to my counselor just like this.  
I don't think I'm a Narcissist, I don't know.  I just know that my FOO was the basis of my behavior, Dad was an alcoholic and I'm acting just like Mom after my father died.
Thought I was over it.
My second marriage lasted 19.5 years.  I blamed her for the failure but in reality, I fell back to old habits. There is one common denominator to this, the drinking.