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Author Topic: How do you stop your inner critic when it goes on a rampage?  (Read 556 times)
Riv3rW0lf
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« on: January 20, 2022, 04:05:22 AM »

Exactly as the title suggests!

I had a nice dinner with friends yesterday. Nothing happened, it was a great and we were all happy to see each other.

Then I came back home and BOOM, started replaying the evening in my head.
Did I talk too much
Did I not talk enough
Was I out of place

I couldn't find anything wrong with me, but still it kept on searching.

Tried to give my compassion, acknowledge it. Still it kept on searching, keeping me from sleeping.

Do you have any trick to shut it down?
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Goldcrest
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« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2022, 05:59:16 AM »

I get like this Riv3rW0lf It has been so bad that I am quite socially avoidant. I fear the shame of being exposed as stupid, sensitive or arrogant (my parents favourite labels for me).

I think the more often you can learn to just tolerate the negative talk and see it for what it is the less volume it has. My husband is a psychologist and gave me a strategy where you imagine all the negative voices are people behind you on a bus. You are driving the bus and they are all trying to distract you or put down your driving. You have to say "thank you everyone but I know what I am doing, where I am going, and I am going to get on with my driving". Shut the voices down and see them as just unruly passengers. I have found that when this happens to me I think - oh well, so what if I was stupid/sensitive/arrogant...what is the worst that can happen?

Something my dad used to say - probably the only wise thing he taught me LOL - All the time we are worrying about what people think of us, they are busy worrying about what we think of them".
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Couscous
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« Reply #2 on: January 21, 2022, 11:51:29 AM »

Try telling it thank you for trying to protect you but that it’s really not being very helpful right now.
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« Reply #3 on: January 21, 2022, 08:26:53 PM »

Hi Riv3RW0lf,

Yes, and after years of doing this to myself (ruminating) and not sleeping... I asked my dr. for something to help me sleep and for anxiety.  She gave me a Rxn for traZOdone.  I take a quarter a pill a night as needed, and I sleep like a baby.

You know that after years of this abuse your body will fight back by producing cortisol right?  I have high cortisol (I'm 50), that scared me enough to do something about this stress.  I don't want to die of a stroke or heartattack.

 Virtual hug (click to insert in post)
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Methuen
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« Reply #4 on: January 22, 2022, 02:10:52 AM »

“How do you stop your inner critic when it goes on a rampage?”

Does your inner critic say any of the same things your mother  used to say to Little RiverWolf? …

1) Awareness. Recognize when your inner critic is making noise, and note it.
2) Remind. This was tricky for me.  When those lousy feelings would come up, I would remind myself that there was probably another explanation, or that I was being unfair to me, or that my imagination was
3) patience with self.  Practice self care.  Your inner critic will quiet down if you don’t give it a voice u Way to go! (click to insert in post)
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Riv3rW0lf
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« Reply #5 on: January 23, 2022, 07:31:57 AM »

This was all very helpful, thank you everyone.

From thinking back on it, I think I tend to do that when I have a feeling that "I did well" compared to someone else.

I remember feeling this way when I had run a 10km in 46min. One of my friend back then had trained a lot. She didn't know I was also a runner and I ended up into the race because someone else offered their spot. She did it in 56min. I didn't do it to spite her, I was just running. But then I overheard say something along the lines of "I am not competitive". And I remember being deeply hurt by that, because I really didn't feel in competition with her. I just loved running and ran a lot... Like.. a lot. We are not friend anymore because in truth, I felt a lot of competition coming from her and it made me feel uneasy most nights after hanging with her, now I know I was probably just way too sensitive because of what my mother told me.

My mom often accused me of being like my father, of thinking I was better than anyone else, so anytime I perform well, and someone notices it or questions themselves, I get really scared and I feel bad.

During this dinner, my friend noticed my daughter speaking a lot, and that she could understand her very well. And her own daughter is so very sweet, but she still doesn't talk very much, but then, she is 8 months younger! I went into how it changes so much over the course of a few months (true), that all children are very different (true). I felt bad that my daughter was potty trained and talked well, because I could feel my friend was comparing our children. Not in a mean way, she was just worried for her own daughter. And then I think I couldn't sleep because I thought maybe it had come across as patronizing or like I was better than her, when I truly don't feel that way.  She asked for advices on potty training and so I told her how I did. And I felt bad, because my friend was doubting herself because of me and my daughter, when she is a wonderful mother.

Anyone else feel this way about their own achievements? Like.. just an overall incapacity of enjoying them, of being proud of them. And an undeniable urge to justify themselves or make excuses when someone start "comparing" and asking for advices?
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« Reply #6 on: January 23, 2022, 08:06:17 AM »

Oh my goodness Riv3rW0lf completely relate to all this. I used to habitually make myself smaller in the competitive sense because I was afraid I would be rejected or perceived as showing off. I remember beating a friend (I hadn't intended to beat her just rode the race) in a mountain bike race and becoming very anxious afterwards that she would hate me for it. I was so socially inept that I phoned her up to apologise for beating her, thus making it 10 times worse.

I used to put myself down all the time because my mother would hate it if I appeared to be better than her. She would either credit my achievement to herself or make me feel guilty because she never had that opportunity/moment to shine herself. She used to measure my arms and legs to compare them to hers in order to prove she was skinnier than me.

Excerpt
My mom often accused me of being like my father, of thinking I was better than anyone else, so anytime I perform well, and someone notices it or questions themselves, I get really scared and I feel bad.
Yes, I relate to this.  Virtual hug (click to insert in post)

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Methuen
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« Reply #7 on: January 23, 2022, 02:13:21 PM »

She asked for advices on potty training and so I told her how I did. And I felt bad, because my friend was doubting herself because of me and my daughter, when she is a wonderful mother.
Could an antidote to this be to assure her you see her as a wonderful mother, and then give a couple of examples?  Followed by reassurance that all kids develop different different skills along different time lines and different ages and stages, and that is normal and ok. Smiling (click to insert in post)

As an aside, you can tell your friend you know someone who had a child who wasn't potty trained until he was over 4 years old.  Definitely outside the normal. And boy did we try everything. Applied every principle and strategy in child development.  He was actually developmentally delayed in many respects including language development.    Today he is a successful accountant and manager at age 26 in an accounting firm.  He has no social, emotional, physical or cognitive deficits.  He is a well adjusted adult with lots of friends, and no potty problems.  Kids just develop on different schedules in their early life, which are sometimes outside of the norm.  This makes the parents uncomfortable.  The kid is actually ok.  The parents' own discomfort is on the parent to deal with.  It doesn't mean there is anything wrong with the child.  Just kind of a funny story to share.  If not interested, you can stop reading here. Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)  I was pretty frustrated when our son was 4 years old and not confidently trained on using the potty.  There's a famous story of a time he pooped himself at a playground on a warm summer day.  H and I took him home, and as a kind of natural consequence, H pulled his poopy pants down outside on the grass, turned on the garden hose (cold water), and started hosing him down.  OMG, he started running around squeeling and just loving it.  He thought it was all hilarously funny. To this day, he has a really good sense of humour.  We the parents, were frustrated and worried about his multiple delays.  Sought all kinds of quality professional help.  In the end, there was nothing wrong with him.  The problem was more with our discomfort of his "delays" according to all the charts.  

Back to your concern, I think if you genuinely share a couple of examples of how you see your friend of being a wonderful mother, and remind her that kids just develop at different ages and stages, it could be an antidote to your inner child fears which were put on you by your mother.  A healthy mother would not have said those things to you.  I think it's ok to share your successes with your friends, just as I'm sure you think it's ok to recognize and congratulate them on their successes.  Those are healthy interactions.  

My sensitive spot tends to be feeling blamed, because my mother has always blamed me for everything (even for things I wasn't present for when they happened).  I was a handy scapegoat.  This sensitive spot is something I need to work on, especially with my dear H.  It's one of my pieces of baggage that I carry around.
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Riv3rW0lf
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« Reply #8 on: January 23, 2022, 03:34:36 PM »

Methuen,

Yes, I did that. I told her to give herself a break, she had just moved  between provinces, and that's it's normal and healthy for a child to "regress" (because she told me she was fine before the move), while she adapts to her new setting. That she was sweet and so very gentle with the baby... She genuinely wanted to care for the baby in such a gentle manner, made my heart triple in size. It was very cute... I did say all children are different.

Like I said, the funny thing is : I couldn't find what I did wrong, I just kept searching and feeling off. Woke up at midnight and my mind was still scanning for a fault! Took me a whole hour to calm down. It does that a lot when I see more than one friend at a time... Like some sort of social anxiety I guess... 

I don't know, maybe I was set off by something else too. I think maybe I picked up on something else unconsciously that I cannot see... Maybe it's just because I told her about my mother being BPD? Is that possible? That I would be scared somehow because I opened up? Maybe something to discuss with a T.

Also, I loved your story. Made me laugh ! Thank you
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Riv3rW0lf
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« Reply #9 on: January 23, 2022, 03:57:45 PM »


I used to put myself down all the time because my mother would hate it if I appeared to be better than her. She would either credit my achievement to herself or make me feel guilty because she never had that opportunity/moment to shine herself. She used to measure my arms and legs to compare them to hers in order to prove she was skinnier than me.



Yes, my mother is like that as well. She needs to be the best in the house. It affected me in various ways, I cannot decide what to write here. I just see distortions. Distortions in the way I feel about myself, distortions in my actions, distortions in how I see reality, how I connect.

I need to see a T. Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #10 on: January 24, 2022, 03:30:06 AM »

I could never figure this out because I have a very high self-esteem. My uNBPD mom brought me up to believe I could do anything I turned my mind to, it may have been her narcissism but the bottom line was that her children were capable of anything. Made me high functioning out there. So it took me me long time to realize that the form my disassociated childhood took was for me to always secondguess myself. Like you, Riv3rwolf, I would review every encounter and action and be hard on myself for what was less than 100% perfection. It is really weird when the world looks up to you in your particular field of excellence while you feel it is not good enough. Productive but weird. Even in mental health I wanted to be the superstar Smiling (click to insert in post)

So high self-esteem can be compatible with a very low level of self-love, ending up in abusive relationships until I could learn I deserved better.

These days, I tell myself "you are enough". It is my favourite mantra. When inner critic is harsh I tell her "thank you for all the times you made me a better person. You are a great inner critic" This flabbergasts her and causes everybody to chill instantly.

Therapy definitely helps. It is magic

 Virtual hug (click to insert in post)
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Riv3rW0lf
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« Reply #11 on: January 24, 2022, 07:40:18 AM »


So high self-esteem can be compatible with a very low level of self-love, ending up in abusive relationships until I could learn I deserved better.

 Virtual hug (click to insert in post)


Yes, that's the piece I was missing. I noticed, recently, how my uBPDm would tell my daughter "you are the best!", but in a very intense manner. And when I got back home, my daughter would say "I am the best", and it made me feel uneasy. Because of the pressure I think.

Maybe that's exactly that. For my uBPDm, everything is a competition. I was always competing with her, if I fell short, she would "take charge" because I wasn't learning fast enough or because I wasn't good enough. Because I don't have lots of memories of my childhood, I do wonder how it got so bad though...  It's like ... I had to be the best everywhere, but at home, I still had to let her shine and win. Which was a huge contradiction. It's almost like it made me an ambitious overachiever that can't stand overshadowing other people.

But that's the piece that I was missing. Like you, I am an overachiever. I am competitive, but this competition is turned "inward". I don't care if I have less than someone else, but I care if I have less than what I aimed for, and I aim very high.  Maybe I do look competitive to others though ..

On the other end, I feel bad when people assume I am competing with them, I am not. I don't want anyone to feel bad about themselves, which explain the reaction I have when someone says I am competitive or get jealous. I am very sensitive to jealousy/envy. Because the truth is, I often feel like a fraud. Like I don't deserve success. Even though, I really like it.

I did become well recognized in my field, I somehow always end up at the top of the ladder,  yet I often feel like a fraud. I basically turn everything I touch to a science, I need to master it. But it is exhausting, because I actually never even really enjoy my own achievements, it is just never enough, and let's be honest : it makes me look arrogant, because there is no way I can master everything. I need to always do "better", and it feels like I never did enough, or that I did too much. If I overshadow someone, it is also unacceptable. And any mistake I make feel like an earthquake in my body, the anxiety can get overwhelming.

Thank you. It was counter intuitive for me... I am actually good at things, but I still have this feeling of emptiness. It feels good to know I am not alone with this.

I will try this mantra. I am enough. And also... You are right... In the end, I should thank my inner critic, because it does make me a better person. But I just feel exhausted now and it needs to stop.

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Woolspinner2000
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« Reply #12 on: January 24, 2022, 07:56:45 AM »

Hi Riv3rW0lf,

Have you heard of Pete Walker's work regarding CPTSD? He has a section on shrinking the Inner Critic that is really helpful. You can Google him to get to his website, and his work is something we frequently recommend as being helpful.

From Pete's book: Complex PTSD, From Surviving to Thriving:
Common Inner Critic Attacks
1. Perfectionism
2. All-or-None & Black-and-White Thinking
3. Self-Hate, Self-Disgust & Toxic Shame
4. Micromanagement/Worrying/Obsessing//Looping/Overfuturizing
5. Unfair/Devaluing Comparisons to others or to your most perfect moments
6. Guilt
7. 'Shoulding'
8. Over-productivity/Workaholism/Busyholism
9. Harsh Judgements of Self & Others/ Name-Calling


There is also a section on Endangerment Attacks of the Inner Critic.

My inner critic has sure been active, some times more than others.
Do you find yours is more active at certain times than others?

 Virtual hug (click to insert in post)
Wools
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Riv3rW0lf
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« Reply #13 on: January 24, 2022, 03:29:50 PM »

Wools,

Thank you so much. I will look into it right now. .

I think I am often "controlling", especially on certain things, like... Food. What my children eat... it just can bring me a lot of distress. I try to contain myself, but there is something about it that make me react when... say my husband give undiluted apple juice to my daughter... and then I feel bad I reacted, because it's really not the end of the world, is it? Or I feel distressed when my husband is eating and I hear him get another portion, and another... I have a very weird relationship with food. I got better at "not saying anything" but I still feel distressed somehow. I am mentioning it because I just went through an episode today about that... Anyway...

I do tend to be a workaholic... I am very industrious like my husband would say. Having children and caring for them forced me to stop myself. They were a godsend somehow in being able to enjoy myself and life. But now, I find motherhood to be the most exhausting thing and I get distressed about the mother I am. Did I play enough? Did I talk too loud? I don't have enough patience, now I have too much...  

I think ... A lot. I am always looping and planing and obsessing about things I shouldn't be obsessed about to a point where I stop hearing someone talking to me. It's worst when I am under stress though.  Or bored. If I am bored, then I start thinking and it's down the rabbit hole from there.

In all honesty, my inner critic is almost always active on one form or another based on the list you made, but it gets especially bad when I see many people in a short amount of time. Especially if I say something I know I should have kept secret. I talk too much and too openly about my thoughts and feelings, and when I do, inner critic goes on a rampage.  Even posting here sometimes activate it.

I just never realized it wasn't normal I guess... It's just who I am. I am a critic. I took on the persecutor role in my own abusive family with uBPDm and my brother. that's not who I am in my close family (H, DD and DS), but it definitely is who I am with myself. My husband often calls me out because I overanalyze everything and I find it near impossible to stop it.

And I am exhausted.

« Last Edit: January 24, 2022, 03:36:59 PM by Riv3rW0lf » Logged
Riv3rW0lf
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« Reply #14 on: January 24, 2022, 04:03:27 PM »

I am reading on shrinking the inner critic and I am relieved to have found this ressource. Thank you so very much Wools. It seems my critic did indeed become my superego and I have lots of untangling to do.
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« Reply #15 on: January 25, 2022, 08:13:20 AM »

You are very welcome, Riv3rW0lf. I have to keep working on shrinking my inner critic too. Different things will trigger me worse than others, and I believe it is a process. Learning to be okay with who we are while patiently challenging those learned beliefs and behaviors takes time. I would encourage you to work on one or two things as you become aware of them, and don't criticise yourself for all those areas where you find you fall short of the mark (in our minds). Have your T help you too.

Here's an example of something I worked on that is much better now. When it came to holidays, I drove myself crazy trying to do everything because I felt I had to do so in order to show that I was a "good" mom. Each holiday was so stressful. My T challenged those beliefs and helped me form a plan to drastically change what I did so that I didn't spend all day in the kitchen (the kitchen was a very emotionally triggering place for me where so much of my uBPDm's anger and abuse towards me came out). Having a plan helped me to stick with it even when my feelings wanted to pull me sideways and prompt me to fall back into the 'shoulds.' At first it was excruciating because I thought I'd be disappointing everyone. You know what? They all adjusted, and we really all had a much more pleasant time together (except for my ex which is a whole other story). Now my inner critic is much quieter each holiday season. Took some time, but I have not forgotten how to navigate the holidays.

Sounds like food has a 'special' place in your life too (and yes, I'm being a bit sarcastic). My mom told me when I was 12 years old that I'd be priettier if I was thinner. My baby sister remembers me crying when my uBPDm put me on a diet, and I was so hungry. She'd only allow me a saltine cracker with a teaspoon of jam or an inch of juice in a tiny glass. I still struggle with the whole body image and inner critic thing. Still a work in process!

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Riv3rW0lf
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« Reply #16 on: January 25, 2022, 01:21:12 PM »

Wools,

My stepmom is a psychologist and she is currently working on a lecture about food and its affective meaning and impacts. I had a discussion with her recently on how my uBPDm food is always "lacking" to me. To her friends, to everyone really, she is a really good cook. My brother loves her food. To me, it's just ok. It doesn't feel like it actually nourrishes me. It fills me, but without pleasure.

My father's food, on the other end, I love. He can serve me a canned soup that he modified by adding water and spices and somehow it becomes the best soup in the world. He cooks a lot and doesn't really serve canned soup but you get the idea. His food somehow nourrishes my heart as much as my body.

What is also strange is that food is actually something that makes my uBPDm really proud. She makes her own bread, home bake cookies, dessert and pie. Everything we ate there were home cooked meals and dessert and I still have memories of her showing me the pie she had just baked. It's not like I missed out on food... Unless I don't remember. Which is a real issue I have right now. I don't have enough memories with her. I shut it down a long time ago.

I remember she called me fat when I was young. Said : "no wonder you are fat, you are always eating." But I don't remember her putting me in a diet or anything.

I am not sure why I always feel like I won't have enough. If we share a chocolate bar, it HAS to be 50/50 with my husband. I just get this idea that there won't be enough. That he will eat everything and then when I will want some, there won't be anything left. It's just weird. He always tells me :"I'll go and buy some more, why are you this worried?"
I wonder sometimes if she didn't starve me sometimes without me remembering. Is that even possible? Or was it just the comments? I don't know. Maybe I starved myself because I didn't want to be called fat anymore. I sure remember I stopped eating in front of people as a teenager. And eating on a first date... goodness, hello anxiety!

For my children though, it's another kind of issue. My daughter had digestive problems when she hit two.she became anemic and had many prolapses because of inflammation. I went into science mode and figured out cutting gluten seemed to help. She outgrew it, but I do get worried. So when I stepped into my in-laws house to find they had giving her a huge plate of chocolate... And then the next day, my father in law gave her juice after I clearly asked to water it down to prevent diarrhea, I got very angry. I didn't say anything, I wished I had. She doesn't eat much, she is very difficult, and she is very sensitive to certain foods. So I try to balance it out with lots of fruits, vegetables and nutrient rich food. I just don't want her to become anemic again.

And if I am perfectly honest... This whole anemia thing and prolapses really hit my inner critic hard. I wasn't a good mother anymore and I know I went too much the other way, I became too controlling out of fear and because I didn't want to fail again. I am trying to take a huge step back now that she is better. But I still get activated easily...
« Last Edit: January 25, 2022, 01:29:30 PM by Riv3rW0lf » Logged
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« Reply #17 on: January 26, 2022, 05:04:19 AM »

Riv3rW0lf I've written about this before but food was a big player in my family and how my mother controlled us. My mother has been eating disordered her whole life. She is anorexic and my father morbidly obese (to a level that the hospital struggled to have equipment for when he was dying). You can imagine how they looked side by side, the absolute other extreme.

Because we were an extension of my mother we were fed when she was hungry and if she wasn't hungry our asking for food was met with irritation. My mother saw feeding us as a massive hassle. She would withhold or dangle food as well. My dad ate to comfort himself and when he retired he got very fat, very fast.

Both my brother and I suffer from a legacy of food control and like you say I get very anxious that I won't get enough. My T talks about it also being something to do with when we were babies and how our mother might have responded to our calls for food as tiny babies. My mother would talk about the nightmare of me, because I wouldn't feed from her.

As an adult I will worry about getting my share of food. If I think someone has more than me (even though I know this is a very sad way to think) I feel anxious. My brother is overweight because he too gets anxious around food so his house is in abundance. Food goes off in his house because he buys more than enough, to avoid ever experiencing the pain of hunger.
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« Reply #18 on: January 26, 2022, 02:48:19 PM »


Because we were an extension of my mother we were fed when she was hungry and if she wasn't hungry our asking for food was met with irritation. My mother saw feeding us as a massive hassle. She would withhold or dangle food as well. My dad ate to comfort himself and when he retired he got very fat, very fast.

Both my brother and I suffer from a legacy of food control and like you say I get very anxious that I won't get enough. My T talks about it also being something to do with when we were babies and how our mother might have responded to our calls for food as tiny babies. My mother would talk about the nightmare of me, because I wouldn't feed from her.

As an adult I will worry about getting my share of food. If I think someone has more than me (even though I know this is a very sad way to think) I feel anxious. My brother is overweight because he too gets anxious around food so his house is in abundance. Food goes off in his house because he buys more than enough, to avoid ever experiencing the pain of hunger.

I stock food as well.  It is kinda nice to talk with other food deranged people ! Smiling (click to insert in post) 

The extension thing rang a bell. It would make a lot of sense that she would only feed us when she was hungry and not the other times. And she was very tiny when she was drinking. Drinking does decrease the appetite so maybe we missed out.

Maybe one day I will be able to unlock a memory that will help me understand.
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lm1109
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« Reply #19 on: January 28, 2022, 05:00:55 PM »

This is interesting! Food has always been a very love/hate relationship with me. My mother absolutely had an eating disorder and as a result I developed one as a teen. I was terrified of weight because of my mothers absolute disdain for overweight people(scary fact she worked in a weight loss clinic solely to shame people and talk about them..at least  in my opinion) At one point when I was about 16 I had a friend sleep over and this friend happened to be overweight. Apparently my friend took a hot dog out of the fridge and ate it(I ate at her house all of the time) My mother picked a ridiculous fight with me and kicked my friend out of the house. This fight turned physical and she later admitted that the fight stemmed from "how sick she was over watching a fat person eat a hot dog" she literally admitted this as if it were completely reasonable!

At 17, I told a friend about my eating disorder. My friend's mom called my mom to get me help, I was raged at for "telling" because of how it made HER look! I moved in with my friend for a few weeks and when I returned she told me that my cat was gone(she got rid of it) and told me it was my fault for f***ing leaving! I was offered NO help and NO support. She would've rather I died of an eating disorder then to "tell" our sick family secrets! I got into therapy after my brother passed away at 20 and I had gotten so dangerously thin that my husband intervened with my doctor. Even though I went through YEARS of therapy and consider myself "recovered" I still have a lot of dysfunction surrounding food.

 A memory I recently had is of my Dad taking food from my cousin(who we barely knew...we had no relationships with outside family...this was a very RARE occurrence) He took his ice cream cone and just took a big bite out of it and then handed it back, my cousin was probably about 12 and looked absolutely mortified and wouldn't eat it. My parents then acted as if something was wrong with HIM because of HIS reaction! I understand now that this cousin reacted very normally to a boundary violation. My parents, who have NO boundaries, couldn't understand that! This memory helped me understand why I can't stand to share food with someone! For me, I think it's less about a fear of not enough and more about a need for a clear boundary, mine and yours!
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« Reply #20 on: January 28, 2022, 06:47:21 PM »

lm1109,

I hadn't thought about it that way, but the boundary "mine" VS "yours" makes a lot of sens, it really struck a chord
 

I think you are right. Maybe the mere fact of having been raised by BPD mother who never really respected our boundaries provoked us to feel this way about food. It's a easy thing to project a need for clear boundary on to be sure. It's also very primal and all about survival.

It makes a lot of sens suddenly !
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« Reply #21 on: January 31, 2022, 06:21:08 PM »

I was also thinking about the ruminating you discussed earlier in the post. I definitely do this too. Its that deep deep wound of "if my own parents couldn't like me, how could anyone else?" Even though I KNOW the truth is that my parents don't have the capacity to like anyone .. because they don't like themselves..it's still there. A neighbor asked me over for a glass of wine recently. I also actually had a really good time but afterwards I searched for what I did wrong...and if I search enough...I can always find something! I suppose the awareness that we are doing that is half the battle. I've been pretty big on surrender as my means of getting through most things these days. I meditate(and do some yoga) in the mornings (I could never try to meditate while ruminating) but it helps calm me in the morning and seems to steer my day in the right direction. When I "catch" myself judging myself harshly or recognize that the way I'm thinking is not serving me in any way I try to say a prayer of surrender and do some deep breathing and try to visualize myself releasing the emotions/thoughts. I usually do this in the bathroom since that's the only place I can lock my kids out  Laugh out loud (click to insert in post) But, like you, it hits me at night too sometimes and prevents me from sleep...which is the worst...and quite honestly that's when I struggle most with "shutting it off." and I do have a prescription for a sleep med for those nights that I can't naturally calm myself.  I think I'm realizing that when I use my "tools" (meditation, yoga, prayer, journaling, etc) each day, even when I don't think I "need it," it happens less frequently or is at least less severe. So...I've been trying to celebrate that progress!  Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #22 on: January 31, 2022, 07:07:46 PM »

Hi Riv3rW0lf,

We've had lots of discussion over the years about food and how it affects those of us who had a pwBPD. It's helpful to revisit it, especially so that you know you're not alone. You can see from all the responses to your post how so many of us also struggle with issues related to food, whether they're remembered or not.

Excerpt
What is also strange is that food is actually something that makes my uBPDm really proud. She makes her own bread, home bake cookies, dessert and pie.


I find it interesting that your uBPDm made these lovely presentations of food, and while you recall how they looked, you also remember that they were not 'soul' feeding like the food your father made. Take a look at this, and I see once again how important appearances are/were for our pwBPD, but as always, there were strings attached, even if they were only emotional strings (we know how important those were!). My uBPDm was also a good cook, but I mostly remember the really special meals she made when company came. The rest blurs into a place that I don't remember or the details my siblings and I compare that show she really wasn't a good cook for everyday. She was outstanding for presentations and special events, keeping her image up to others.

When it comes to what you don't remember about food, it's okay. You don't have to push to find what drives you to feel as if you will not have enough. It's important that you make note that you are having those feelings, and perhaps with time a memory will come. Our bodies remember so much more than our conscious mind recalls. The book The Body Keeps the Score reminds me that it's okay that my body feels the way it does because it's for a reason. I'm working on being more body mindful these days because I am running into body memories that have no connection to my conscious memory. A few months ago a phrase popped into my head (I have no idea what triggered it), and my brother confirmed that our mom often said this: "You don't deserve to eat," and we'd be sent to our rooms. Neither of us remember if we actually went without food.

So keep hanging in there, and be kind to little W0lf who just wants you to hold her and tell her you will make sure she has enough to eat, no matter what.

 Virtual hug (click to insert in post)
Wools
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« Reply #23 on: February 01, 2022, 07:48:49 PM »

Lm1109,

Yes, doing yoga and meditating in the mornings also seem to help me very much. Or keeping very busy also help, which can both be a good and a bad thing I guess.

I don't know about that wound ... I can't quite bring myself to accept my uBPDm doesn't love me, or didn't love me. I am still unsure where I sit with that. I understand that her way of acting toward me was traumatising, but to say she didn't love me, I don't know... But I understand what you mean... Whether it was love or not, it still came out as rejection, and now it is like we are basically looking for everything we do wrong, maybe in an effort to see the rejection coming, be able to excuse ourselves prior to it maybe, or at least decrease the suffering when it happens... But then it doesn't happen anymore...

Sometimes I think I am the one that keeps rejecting myself when I do that, because I can't bring myself to accept I am imperfect maybe, but also because this is all I've ever known. I will need to change that somehow. Accept that I am enough. Accept that I get tired too and that I don't always have perfect control of my own emotions either. And that it is okay. Because nobody does. And it's okay. And allow myself to feel accepted by others, and that it is safe to be accepted...

The other thing I was just thinking is... The ruminating for me... I think it is just what I always did. Everytime something bad happened, everytime I got rejected, everytime I was left alone while she went out drinking... I would flee in my mind. Sometimes I am ruminating, sometimes I am thinking about basic things... My three years old made me realize this is just a thing I do recently... She said : why are you sad mommy? (I was deep in thoughts about where I would put my pictures) I said : I am not sad, I was just thinking. And she said : you think often and you look sad.

It's weird the feeling I got... I didn't feel sad at that moment, and yet I was... Maybe I'll always be a bit sad... But maybe there can be happiness within my sadness too.

 I think a lot... Thinking became an exit to my hurt and my pain when I was young. It's how I got out of my life... By thinking about that day when I would finally be happy. When I would finally be beautiful and have myself a nice husband.  Making those alternate lives for myself.

Now today, happily married with two children... I am still deep in thoughts. The most basic things become intense thinking sessions. Because somewhere along the way, this is who I became. I forgot to be in the present, because I just got too used in fleeing from it, and I tend to leave the present to hide in my head.  Which is probably why yoga helps: it forces me in the present and back into my body.
« Last Edit: February 01, 2022, 07:55:45 PM by Riv3rW0lf » Logged
lm1109
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« Reply #24 on: February 02, 2022, 09:26:00 PM »

Riv3rW0lf- I just wanted to first clarify that I definitely don't mean that we all have that wound with our bpd mother's, only that I personally have this wound and I know it still really affects me. I suppose my mother loves or did love me at some level, but I'm sure she doesn't like me, she has made that very clear to me. But I am in good company with LITERALLY everyone else on the planet ..Laugh out loud (click to insert in post). I'm just now coming to the realization that this is true. There was nothing I could have ever done differently to make her like me, she doesn't like anyone(she is an extremely bitter and resentful woman) And the rejection is a lot to handle sometimes but I guess I'm getting better with it by admitting that I was in fact rejected by her! Although I'm definitely feeling anger that it's still affecting me!

I really resonate with this:

It's weird the feeling I got... I didn't feel sad at that moment, and yet I was... Maybe I'll always be a bit sad... But maybe there can be happiness within my sadness too.

I feel that too! I absolutely believe we can have both sadness and joy in our lives at the same time. I have moments where I watch my kids in that pure state of joy that kids feel and I am SO happy to see them experiencing childhood differently than I did. They get to be goofy, funny, creative and themselves and it's the most beautiful thing in the world to me but there is also a tinge of sadness in there for little me and also for my brother who took his own life, that we didn't get that opportunity to be carefree kids. But honestly that sadness is my fuel for creating the change for adult me now and for my kids(and hopefully even grandkids someday) So I guess I can finally recognize the usefulness of feeling the pain.

Im also a thinker, always have been, and always will be. I really dissociated a ton as a kid because that was my survival, and then ultimately I also disconnected from my own body with an eating disorder. The yoga and especially the breath work has helped me stay more present and reconnect with those parts of myself that I abandoned along the way. It's also helped a ton with healing my nervous system.

Something that also helps me to not be in my own mind so much during my day is to give myself an hour in the evening to actually sort of dissociate and be in my mind. I love biking so I close my door and use my exercise bike, listen to music and just be in my head for a little bit. It's almost like I need that time each day to NOT be present too..if that makes any sense. But I definitely still struggle with it too, especially when triggered!

Wools- I also wanted to say that the book The Body Keeps the Score is amazing. This was a nice reminder... I think I'm gonna re-read this one too
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« Reply #25 on: February 03, 2022, 12:26:44 PM »

Im1109 (I just realized the first letter is actually an "i"),

Yes, I understood you didn't meant it broadly. It's just a thought I've been struggling with : does she love me or not? I do think, like you, that uBPDm doesn't like me. Actually, she doesn't know me, because I'm just completely unable to be myself with her. I am guarded, I barely laugh (or not genuinely), I am just always on my toes. She is taking all the space anyway, so it's hard to be anyone, really. Her presence is just ... Too much?

It stroke me what you said about your brother... I am so very sorry for your loss. I also have a brother who struggles a lot. He was recently diagnosed with a bipolar disorder that they said came from trauma. He still thinks this trauma is due to my oldest brother, and hasn't put two and two together concerning uBPDm yet. Last summer, he got into his car, into his garage and was about to start the car and let himself fall asleep. I felt something was wrong and I texted him that day. He didn't want to talk over the phone and we texted for about two hours about his life, what he wanted, how lonely he felt. He admitted later he was going to end it, sent me the song from Billy Eilish - I had everything I wanted. He said my texting him is what got him through. But I know he will never quite be through with it... It's a recurrent thought he has. I am slowly learning to distance myself from the possibility that he might someday end his life... Not because I don't care, but because as much as I want to help him, I cannot do more, and in the end, it would be his decision. But damn, how angry I would be at him and at her for that matter. And so... I am so very sorry.

I also find it very healing to be a non-BPD mother to my own children.  Although I struggle a lot when I don't feel like playing, or when I feel impatient. It is like I have a really hard time assuming my own boundaries toward my children, even if I know it is healthy to show them I also have boundaries, I still feel guilty about it. Working on it though.

And yes, I can definitely see how getting this one hour in your head would help. I can't wait to have some time to myself again. Husband helps a lot but our kids are mainly "my weight to carry," and when he is helping, it's because I am cooking or cleaning. I don't get much me time anymore. There is light at the end of the tunnel though, they are getting older every day.

I think I should get that book.
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lm1109
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« Reply #26 on: February 04, 2022, 07:54:03 PM »

Riv3rW0lf- I'm sorry to hear about the struggles with your brother. Its so hard, and I struggled with this with my mom as well. She was suicidal and I felt very responsible, especially after losing my brother to suicide. I have FINALLY come to the understanding that it was never my job to save my family of origin, only myself. Mine is the only path I have ANY control over. It doesn't make it any easier to accept that people we love choose to not get help for their illnesses. And I don't mean to make the assumption that your brother isn't getting help, but that was my experience anyway. I am not qualified to treat my mom and no matter what I do, I can't save her.

 I was angry with my brother for a lot of years after, because we were extremely close since our parents emotionally abandoned us when we were little. I've forgiven him, but I'm 100% struggling with forgiveness of my mom right now. I have recognized I will only get there through distance from both her and my Dad. I suppressed a lot of my anger I had with them because I felt so responsible for them... I'm angry that I was made to believe I was responsible for them too! I'm trying really really hard to focus on myself, for the first time ever. I totally relate to what you said about not having free time. When my kids were really little, I never had it either, and I was honestly in survival mode for a lot of years. My youngest is now 8 and they are finally old enough to understand that it's healthy for me to take some time each day and I want them to see me taking care of myself so that they grow up and take care of themselves too. I know what it's like to feel like you can't get a break though...its rough! I do find a lot of healing in listening to podcasts or audiobooks while I'm cooking and cleaning too...some of my best breakthroughs are during those times..Laugh out loud (click to insert in post). Sending you lots of support Virtual hug (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #27 on: February 05, 2022, 05:38:15 PM »

I’ve been looking into the subject of toxic shame and I am beginning to realize just how much shame I have internalized, and how shame-based my entire family is. Children are perfect targets for parents to offload their own shame onto, hence our mothers’ abusive behavior. The Inner Critic is really just a manifestation of this.

The article below really resonated with me, and rumination (compulsive processing) is yet another symptom.

Adults shamed as children often involve themselves in compulsive processing of past interactions and events, and intellectualization as a defense against pain.

https://bpdfamily.com/content/shame-powerful-painful-and-potentially-dangerous-emotion

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« Reply #28 on: February 05, 2022, 07:25:40 PM »

Yes, toxic shame is the moto of our family too.

My older brother laughed at me last time because I am protective of my children. It sounded like something I should feel ashamed of, the way he was saying it... Thinking about it now, I thought he was shaming me, but the truth is: I am very defensive and basically any sort of observations on my behaviors, whatever the behavior, feel shameful, and so I justify myself. I worked a lot on my capacity for self-mockery, but somehow, while I seem to be able to do it with my husband and children; I cannot do it for the life of me in my family of origin. It is completely impossible.

My tastes, my way of being, of parenting... I am somehow always justifying myself of being, because I just am ashamed. I feel wrong. Thankfully, I don't think I am shaming my children, it really is turned inward, as opposed to outward like uBPDm.

Working on it though.

Thank Couscous, for sharing your article. Since you researched it a lot, did you find good tricks to get rid of the shame? I find cognitive behavioral therapy useless on me... I am looking for a therapist and am really starting to wonder what approach would work... It has to be some sort of emotional release, anything mind based approach seems bound to fail somehow... My mind understand the process, I understand I have to stop those thoughts, but my whole body feels it, and no matter what my mind says, the body stress overrides it... I'm not sure how to express it differently.

I really have to get that book The body keeps the score I guess !
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« Reply #29 on: February 06, 2022, 01:03:44 AM »

I have just begun delving into this a few days ago, and I just started reading the book, Conquering Shame and Codependency yesterday. It’s really hitting home. The author actually posted here on the book review board that Somatic Experiencing is helpful. I am doing Schema therapy (which works for BPD, btw) and my T would like to soon begin “chair work” with me, which is an experiential technique. I am also in a Transactional Analysis therapy group which I have been finding very helpful.
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