I attended a virtual coda meeting

[thepixies21]

Well my husband decided that the partial program isn't for him. It is what it is. I'm uncertain about what happens next. But I logged into a virtual coda meeting on Friday, and I liked it a lot! I thought I was going to vomit out of fear that they were going to make me talk but they didn't, and it was a relief to just listen, and not feel like I'm back in first grade waiting for a teacher to call on me. I'll work up the courage to speak in the future though. I’m really working hard at accepting this codependent part of myself, and trying to make it a priority to not let it be in control anymore. I’ve decided to focus less on what my husband's symptoms are, because that's his journey. I really hope he continues to work on things, it does seem like his heart is in the right place lately. But we’ll see what happens. For now I’m going to focus more on myself and how I’m feeling.

I pushed myself out of my comfort zone this weekend. I told him several days in advance that I was going to have therapy in the morning, get a haircut, and then that evening go out to dinner with an old friend that he previously did not want me to spend time with. It didn't go down easy but I held my ground. And I had an amazing day. But it was a very hard thing to do. It’s not easy at all. I knew he wasn’t happy about it, but I’m noticing that there really does seem to be some understanding from his side, that I'm trying to take care of myself so I don't have a breakdown. I knew the therapy and hair appointment would be totally fine, but being able to spend the evening with my friend was fabulous. I had some nerves beforehand, like generally just feeling uncomfortable, and wondering if something bad would happen, wondering if my husband would get mad, but I pushed through it and it was great. It has been a glimmer of the old me, the one that can joke and relax and have fun. I don't want to live in fear anymore, I want to live a life.

The other piece of the puzzle I'm working on with my therapist is my childhood and my own past. I grew up with narcissistic parents, followed by a string of manipulative friendships and relationships. I think I have this very deep fear of becoming narcissistic myself. And I think part of the reason that I will concede most of the time is this paralyzing fear of ever being like them. I never want to use people, I never want to feel like I keep people in my life as objects that I use to get what I want, or to use them to make me look good, or anything like that. But I think I have overshot, and here we are. So I’m working with my therapist to try to find this balance in the middle. Not selfish, but not a doormat. It’s really really hard, but it’s work worth doing.

I know I'm still in the beginning, I still mess up all the time. I still get caught in the arguments and the caretaker role, but it is getting easier. So for everyone here who has posted their own stories, and especially for those who took time out of their lives to write to me and give me advice, it has been so appreciated. I'm going to enjoy this good weekend, and I'm going to try to hold on to it.

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Couscous]

Congratulations! That’s really great to hear!

I think I have this very deep fear of becoming narcissistic myself.

I think you’ve hit the nail on the head here. I also think that those of us who grew up with narcissistic parents were punished in some manner as children for “being narcissistic” (aka being a normal kid), so I think that a lot of our fear and anxiety around “being selfish” is connected to those past experiences. Don’t be too surprised if in the coming days your H tries to punish you, either overtly or passive aggressively (perhaps by giving you the silent-treatment or becoming cold) for this “crime” you have committed, but if you can stand strong and stay the course he will have to adjust to the new you.

Keep up the good work!

[thepixies21]

I also think that those of us who grew up with narcissistic parents were punished in some manner as children for “being narcissistic” (aka being a normal kid), so I think that a lot of our fear and anxiety around “being selfish” is connected to those past experiences.

Couscous I totally agree. I think it was just instilled in me that I'm innately selfish so I need to work hard not to be. Everyone who isn't my family thinks the idea that I'm selfish is ridiculous, so that makes me feel better. I'm glad I'm not alone in having that experience.

That's good advice, with that in mind I'm trying really hard to validate my husband, and tell him how much I appreciate that he was understanding about the time I needed this past weekend and why it was important to me. I do sense a little resentment, and making some comments like "I thought we'd have time to (insert thing he wants to do) this weekend, but there's no time now I guess..." But I'm trying not to bite. So far no anger outbursts so I'll take it.

[SaltyDawg]

Well my husband decided that the partial program isn't for him. It is what it is. I'm uncertain about what happens next.
That is very disappointing, a major setback for sure - be sure that there is something 'next' - talk to your T, and his T [if he allows you to].  Encourage him to try it again, you don't want to enable him to fall back to where he was.  If he absolutely refuses to go to PHP, perhaps go to CODA with you?  You want to set a firm boundary and enforce that boundary, otherwise the cycle of destruction may resume.

I’ve decided to focus less on what my husband's symptoms are, because that's his journey. I really hope he continues to work on things, it does seem like his heart is in the right place lately. But we’ll see what happens. For now I’m going to focus more on myself and how I’m feeling.

That is awesome, do self-care, do what is best for you.

I pushed myself out of my comfort zone this weekend. I told him several days in advance that I was going to have therapy in the morning, get a haircut, and then that evening go out to dinner with an old friend that he previously did not want me to spend time with. It didn't go down easy but I held my ground. And I had an amazing day. But it was a very hard thing to do. It’s not easy at all.

That is awesome self-care.  You also used the 'seed planting tool' [in bold], so when it did happen, he did not panic about it as he had time to pre-process what is going to happen, and he knew you weren't going to abandon him, even though he was anxious about it. 

I don't want to live in fear anymore, I want to live a life.
Do it again, and do it more often.  The more you do it, the easier it will be to do it.  Just like before to let your DH know beforehand so he can pre-process what you are going to do with the 'seed planting tool' and reassure him that you will return. 

The other piece of the puzzle I'm working on with my therapist is my childhood and my own past.

Me too.  I had a different set of childhood issues; however, for me it has led me to being a caretaker and a codependent.  It sucks, but I am starting to deal with it with my individual T, as I learn, I will be sharing more on this aspect.

Take care, and I am very happy about your progress.  I am not happy about your DH's setback.  I will encourage you to maintain that boundary and encourage him to get back on to some kind of relevant therapy for himself.

Take care of yourself first, and if you have enough energy left over take care of him too.

[thepixies21]

Well my husband decided that the partial program isn't for him. It is what it is. I'm uncertain about what happens next.
That is very disappointing, a major setback for sure - be sure that there is something 'next' - talk to your T, and his T [if he allows you to].  Encourage him to try it again, you don't want to enable him to fall back to where he was.  If he absolutely refuses to go to PHP, perhaps go to CODA with you?  You want to set a firm boundary and enforce that boundary, otherwise the cycle of destruction may resume.

Thank you so much for the encouragement and advice! Some good news on his part is that he is committed to meeting with his outpatient therapist twice a week, and today they talked about an online DBT program he found, and he even bought a DBT skills workbook unprompted which really surprised me. He knows he messed up by quitting the program, apparently he even called and left a passive aggressive message on their voicemail...ugh. But I have noticed that he seems to be actually taking care of himself a little more, getting up earlier, eating breakfast. He's even talking about trying to get over his fear of driving, which I never thought I'd hear come out of his mouth. I've heard some empty promises in the past, so I'm trying to look for the actions and not the words. But I will encourage the crap out of that behavior if he actually follows through. In the mean time I'm gonna try to keep doing me! Thanks again!

[SaltyDawg]

Thank you so much for the encouragement and advice! Some good news on his part is that he is committed to meeting with his outpatient therapist twice a week, and today they talked about an online DBT program he found, and he even bought a DBT skills workbook unprompted which really surprised me. He knows he messed up by quitting the program, apparently he even called and left a passive aggressive message on their voicemail...ugh. But I have noticed that he seems to be actually taking care of himself a little more, getting up earlier, eating breakfast. He's even talking about trying to get over his fear of driving, which I never thought I'd hear come out of his mouth. I've heard some empty promises in the past, so I'm trying to look for the actions and not the words. But I will encourage the crap out of that behavior if he actually follows through. In the mean time I'm gonna try to keep doing me! Thanks again!

I am so glad that you shared that.  That is totally awesome! 

Do encourage the crap of that!  Definitely 'do you' with Self-Care first, then help him with his journey too.

You are welcome, and thank you for sharing.

Take care.

[Notwendy]

But I logged into a virtual coda meeting on Friday, and I liked it a lot! I thought I was going to vomit out of fear that they were going to make me talk but they didn't, and it was a relief to just listen, and not feel like I'm back in first grade waiting for a teacher to call on me. I'll work up the courage to speak in the future though.


For now I’m going to focus more on myself and how I’m feeling.


The other piece of the puzzle I'm working on with my therapist is my childhood and my own past. I grew up with narcissistic parents. I think I have this very deep fear of becoming narcissistic myself. And I think part of the reason that I will concede most of the time is this paralyzing fear of ever being like them. I never want to use people, I never want to feel like I keep people in my life as objects that I use to get what I want, or to use them to make me look good, or anything like that. But I think I have overshot, and here we are. So I’m working with my therapist to try to find this balance in the middle. Not selfish, but not a doormat. It’s really really hard, but it’s work worth doing.

I have pulled out these statements because they are so relatable. My BPD mother also has NPD traits and at some point in my childhood, I decided I didn't want to be like that. However, our idea of "normal" is based on what we know growing up. Trying to be "not like" our parents doesn't tell us that. It was a counselor who pointed out to me that doing the opposite of one end of disfunction could still be disfunction and so I also went to the co-dependency side.

It was that counselor who sent me to 12 step co-dependency groups to work on this. I recall being so scared to go to one of them. This was before Covid and so they were in person. I am glad you liked the experience. For me, I am grateful for the push to participate in them. I think it has been very helpful.

A couple of tips:

You may not see progress quickly- change takes time but it does happen if you work at it.

Attending groups helps but IMHO, the one- on-one work with a sponsor is where the personal work happens best. This sponsor listens to you and points out aspects of yourself that others won't. They are honest. It's not always easy to hear these things but if you are willing to let someone turn the mirror on you, and do the work, to me it's worth it,

You should spend some time in the groups, seeing who is there, who you seem to admire in terms of "this person has good insight and has done the work" and get a feel for who you would like to have a sponsor and plan to ask them. Some will indicate if they are willing to sponsor and have time available. This becomes more apparent once you have acclimated to the group. People come to the group with all kinds of experiences and capacities. Some, you may not feel you want to be a sponsor to you. You will become familiar with the group if you attend regularly.

Sharing is scary but here's a reason for it. It's not to learn to get up in front of people and talk. It's talking about yourself and your feelings that help you focus on them. Many people with co-dependent tendencies focus on other people's feelings and seem to be less connected to their own. When you share your feelings, you tune into you. You deal with all these feelings like "I don't want to bother these people". "they won't understand".

 

[Pook075]

Hey Pixies.  I just wanted to say that it's great to hear that you're taking care of yourself and taking steps to finding the old you.  It's an incredible feeling and very liberating, so I hope you enjoy that part of the journey as much as you can.  You DESERVE to be happy and don't ever let anyone tell you any different.

One other thing- about the narcissism.  If you recognize those traits and are actively trying to avoid them in your life, then I'm pretty sure that you're not a narcissist.  We all have "me moments" from time to time where we're a little selfish, and sometimes that's actually a good thing putting ourselves first.  Don't be ashamed of that!

Just keep doing you and updating us on your progress!