Long hard day...

[MaroonLiquid]

So I texted her and asked if she wanted to go to get some ice cream and she said she was alone.  I said I have my kids and she said she would love to see them.  I asked if she wanted us to pick her up or bring some to her.  She didn't answer so I called her and she said she didn't want to go.  I asked if she wanted to go or bring her something and she said no, she was just going to watch a movie.  I asked if she was sure and she said yes.  I said ok, I understand, then asked how she was feeling.  She said she has had a bad couple of days.  I told her that I know it's hard for her when she is hurting or not feeling well and that I was here if she needed anything.  She didn't respond, and I asked if she wanted me to let her go and she said yes so she could finish watching the movie.  I said ok, no problem. Have a good night.  She said ok and we hung up.  We have been texting since about other stuff.  Nothing serious.  It's been a very good day communicating with her.  Thank the Lord. 

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[formflier]

 

Part of the "problem" with texting... .is it allows her to keep some "push" or "distance" yet still communicate with you.


If that is why she is doing it.

I won't keep harping on the point about texting being bad... .a lot of that is my personal experience... .but as long as she can get her communication needs met via text... .she will shy away from the rest.

If she can talk on the phone... but not meet in person... she will do that... .

Most likely.

Just a thought...

[sweetheart]

Continuing to sound great, no pressure, upbeat, validating. Moved from text to phone without any hitches.

Slowly does it MaroonLiquid 

It's great to hear your day was better, that talking to your wife was better today.

[MaroonLiquid]

I texted my wife this morning to ask how she was feeling with no response.  So I called her about an hour ago (didn't answer and figured she probably wouldn't) and left a message to see if they wanted to go to a movie with us or watch a game together. She texted back a few minutes later and said they were busy tonight.  I responded with, "Ok, You're welcome".  I think she doesn't want to answer the phone in front of the kids.  Part of the hole she has dug for herself.  Anyway, kind of irritating we communicate all day yesterday and very little today.  I'm trying to see her in person and she is balking at the moment... .oh well.  Won't let it bother me... .Her issue not mine

[formflier]

I texted my wife this morning to ask how she was feeling with no response.  So I called her about an hour ago (didn't answer and figured she probably wouldn't) and left a message to see if they wanted to go to a movie with us or watch a game together. She texted back a few minutes later and said they were busy tonight.  I responded with, "Ok, You're welcome".  I think she doesn't want to answer the phone in front of the kids.  Part of the hole she has dug for herself.  Anyway, kind of irritating we communicate all day yesterday and very little today.  I'm trying to see her in person and she is balking at the moment... .oh well.  Won't let it bother me... .Her issue not mine

Did you go to the movie anyway? 

You don't want to give the impression you are "chasing".  If you tell her you are going to do something... and ask her along... .and you go anyway... .that really isn't chasing.  If you ask her but because she won't go... .you don't go... then things are dependent on her.

[MaroonLiquid]

Of course I went.  It wasn't dependent upon her, just gave her the opportunity. 

[MaroonLiquid]

can someone explain the cycle of contact for a full day with validating and everything, and then she pulls away again.  Tried to invite her along this weekend, once she said no, and the other she had plans with our daughter and friends (which I understand). It doesn't really affect me emotionally anymore, as I can just let her have space, but curious, is that part of the push/pull, her having to deal with emotions or what?  Maybe it doesn't make any sense, I don't know.  Just continue to be the steady boat in her life that doesn't waver. 

[MaroonLiquid]

So I post what a great weekend on I had with my kids on Facebook and my wife posts on hers shortly after about how her kids are fatherless.  She kicked me out of their lives.  She caused all this and them to be fatherless!  Are you kidding me?  That pisses me off!  Venting here!

[MaroonLiquid]

Just had a moment of clarity regarding her Facebook post.  She is feeling horribly guilty that after reading mine, the only father her kids have ever known and they have loved have been cut out of their lives by her.  I texted her and asked her if I could stop by and talk for a few minutes and she responded with, "Please do not come to my house."  I said, ok, can I call later then?"  She said, "No.  Please just leave me alone."  I responded with, "I can see you are upset about something.  I'm here for you when you are ready to talk about it.  Whatever it is, we can work through it together."  Her response was, "I'm not upset about anything, just don't want to be bothered tonight."  I just said, "ok have a good night."  She isn't going to get a response out of me.  I won't respond with anything but kindness and understanding.  God has changed me and won't let it affect me... .

[AnnaK]

What I would say:

Old way (it won't help calm him down, but it will at least take the divorce out of question)

- I want a divorce

- I do not want a divorce, but if you want it - please do all the paperwork :-)

Now I'd rather say something like this:

- I want a divorce

- No, you don't

Chances are I'd hear something like a sigh of relief : "Right, I don't"

If he still insists on wanting a divorce (right now and here, yeah), I'd suggest him to do all the paperwork, because why should I do it, if I don't want a divorce?

Divorce is a long story, most probably he'd change his mind much before he can finish the preparations... .

[formflier]

How often does she initiate a text to you... .versus how often do you reach out to her?

What kind of a "reaction" did she get from you about posting about kids being fatherless... .?

[MaroonLiquid]

How often does she initiate a text to you... .versus how often do you reach out to her?

Last week and a half, she would initiate conversation with a phone call to my office (which I thought was strange, but whatever).  Then we would text throughout the day (started by her).  Thursday we were supposed to meet with the laptop, but didn't happen.  Friday, I texted her first about her appointment, and we ended up texting all day.  At the end of the day, I invited her to get some ice cream with my kids (said she would love to see them) and she turned me down.  I said ok, have a good night.  Saturday, I asked how she was feeling with no response, and then called later in the day (no answer and left a message) and invited them to the movie with us, and she texted and said they already had plans.  Just said ok, no problem. 

What was your "reaction" to her facebook post?

It pissed me off internally at first, cried a little and then let it go.  I then called later (no answer and left a message) and tried to include her again, and she said no.  And then the "do not come by my house, leave me alone, and don't want to be bothered" texts.  Again, said ok, have a good night.  Honestly, after that, I am kind of done inviting her or putting myself out there anymore with her.  I'm the one that is trying to make things better.  I have changed my responses to her crap and being rejected as I realize these are her issues.   Her kids are "fatherless" because of her.  I'm back in the place mentally now (where I was two weeks ago) that she needs to start making an effort.  I realize her push/pull crap started.  She wants contact, then pulls away.  I'm tired of it.

[MaroonLiquid]

One more thing, we haven't seen each other in 4 1/2 weeks this time... .:'(

[MaroonLiquid]

So she contacts me first thing this morning and asked if I could keep them on my insurance as hers is too expensive (gave me a breakdown) and she would pay me for half of the cost.  I said sure, no problem.  I think she is scared of breaking every tie to me (which is not what I want either).  I can't decide if I'm ok with it since it costs me the same with or without them, or if she is playing me... .

[formflier]

So she contacts me first thing this morning and asked if I could keep them on my insurance as hers is too expensive (gave me a breakdown) and she would pay me for half of the cost.  I said sure, no problem.  I think she is scared of breaking every tie to me (which is not what I want either).  I can't decide if I'm ok with it since it costs me the same with or without them, or if she is playing me... .

this was your chance to say... .let's meet and discuss this.

You are choosing to allow her to get what she wants without a personal interaction. 

The only way to understand if playing is to see in person... .

But... .she gets what she wants without that... .so... she gets what she wants... .

What happened with the car note payment thing?  Has she asked?  Have you paid it?

[waverider]

or if she is playing me... .

She is playing you, (though she might not know it) and deluding herself to the reality of what she is asking for when he says she wants a divorce. In effect she is playing at wanting a divorce, staying in a kind of "victim limbo" zone

[MaroonLiquid]

She is paying her own car note.

or if she is playing me... .

She is playing you, (though she might not know it) and deluding herself to the reality of what she is asking for when he says she wants a divorce. In effect she is playing at wanting a divorce, staying in a kind of "victim limbo" zone

What do you mean?

[formflier]

How did the paying her car note thing go down?  Did she ask... or did you step up and tell her.

I'll let waverider speak for his point.

My point is that the interaction that you just had... .the dealmaking about who is paying what... .sounds and "feels" (to me) like something divorced people do.

People that are still in a r/s get together and talk over things... .sure they talk dollars and cents but there is more.

If you want a r/s with her... .then you have to "play the cards" that you have.  One of those cards is that she gets nothing out of you that she wants/needs unless she has a r/s with you.  Meeting for coffee... .laughing... talking... .having pleasant conversation.  Going for a walk afterward.  etc etc.  That can happen even while living apart... .you just want to set momentum up towards more of a r/s.

Right now... .you have a digital/phone r/s.  Nothing in person.  She placed a call and got her issues solved... .

My gut says she is in a "happy place"... .or "content place... " in doing this and is making other excuses to keep you away... .

So... .I see this as choice time for you.  If you are ok with limbo going on for another long period of time... .a "digital only" r/s... .then keep going the way you are.

If you want a r/s... .make sure all your choices force her hand to spend time with you.

Note:  She may decide to go ahead and file for divorce... .or she may decide she wants you back... .or... .she may decide to just go NC... .I'm sure there are other alternatives.  Anyway... .my gut says that "something" will happen.

Right now... .you seem to have a pattern established... .and she shows no signs of wanting to end that pattern.

Do you want to end the pattern?

Hang tough... .! 

[MaroonLiquid]

So should I say I've rethought this and she will need to meet me in person to talk about this as I feel I'm being used... .

[formflier]

I would leave off your feelings... .the part about being used.

Propose to meet to discuss insurance issues.  Make sure you have some forms or something to bring along.

Also... I'd wait until tomorrow to let other senior members post to this thread... .to make sure you get some good variety of opinion and advice on best way forward... .

[MaroonLiquid]

So after no communication, I sent my wife this... .

Wife, after thinking more about your request regarding insurance, I have decided that there are issues that need to be resolved between us before I can agree to keep you guys on my insurance.  We will need to meet to discuss this.  I will call you this evening and we can discuss a day this week to meet. 

She then started to ask me what the issues are.  I didn't answer and she started to dysregulate and said, "Nevermind husband, I am thankful that my company offers insurance and I'll just get it through them."  I had to LOL as she told me earlier she couldn't afford it.  I said, "Help me to understand why you won't meet me in person?"  After a few minutes of no response, I said, "Ok wife, have a good night".  She then started to go nuts on text and dysregulated and even used the Bible verse, "A double minded man is unstable in all his ways." against me.  And then she started to use earlier texts against me. I never responded.  But I see what formflier is talking about now!

[Grey Kitty]

or if she is playing me... .

She is playing you, (though she might not know it) and deluding herself to the reality of what she is asking for when he says she wants a divorce. In effect she is playing at wanting a divorce, staying in a kind of "victim limbo" zone

What do you mean?

I'd say that this is just using the divorce as this phase of the 'normal' push-pull game. Trying to control how far away you are from her, wanting to reel you in one time and push you away the next.

(of course, wavewrider can speak for himself, and will if I didn't get what he was thinking.)

[MaroonLiquid]

I totally agree.  Called her bluff on the divorce.  That was last week.  But today, she asked me to keep her and the kids on my insurance (as hers was too expensive) and then I sent the text in my previous post this evening.

[formflier]

  But I see what formflier is talking about now!

Is this about "using earlier texts against you?" 

Hey... .listen... .overall I think you are doing a great job.  So... .just wanted to clarify that any suggestions or "criticism" of your tactics are trying to "refine" things.

I still think that you are a bit to "wordy"... .

"Let's meet to discuss insurance status... "  short a sweet... .the rest of the stuff is a bit "jadey"

Thoughts?

[MaroonLiquid]

  But I see what formflier is talking about now!

Is this about "using earlier texts against you?"  

Hey... .listen... .overall I think you are doing a great job.  So... .just wanted to clarify that any suggestions or "criticism" of your tactics are trying to "refine" things.

I still think that you are a bit to "wordy"... .

"Let's meet to discuss insurance status... "  short a sweet... .the rest of the stuff is a bit "jadey"

Thoughts?

yes, the previous texts were used against me.  When I told her that we needed to meet, she threw up the "I love being able take care of my family" text earlier in the day, and the the "issued that need to be resolved" text from late in the evening saying I was double-minded!    No, I'm just not going to be used.  Right now, she is ok with having all the benefits of marriage without any of the responsibility.  That is crossing a value line with me and I won't bend on it.  You are either married and working on reconciliation or we're separated.  I would ask her, which is it?  I would say she has been the one that is double minded... .Total projection.  She doesn't want a divorce, just doesn't want to deal with all the crap she has created... .I can see how the rest is "jade'y" though... .I can't fix that though, just have to let her come back to me at this point.  She knows I want to keep them on my insurance, just won't let her take advantage anymore.  Still hasn't given me the laptop for God's sake and the issue hasn't come up since last week.  I'm trying to make things better and she is still trying to have the advantage... .

[MaroonLiquid]

I just remembered that the "family cruise" that I was cut out of is leaving next week.  I think this is where a lot of her drama is coming from right now.  She is looking for an outlet it seems.  Maybe that is why the insurance thing came up... .She is looking for assurance that I will be here when she gets back?

[formflier]

   I would ask her, which is it?  

I would avoid asking her a question like that... .unless you are ready for a take it or leave it moment.  pwBPD usually don't react well when put in corner like that... .

[MaroonLiquid]

  I would ask her, which is it?  

I would avoid asking her a question like that... .unless you are ready for a take it or leave it moment.  pwBPD usually don't react well when put in corner like that... .

I wasn't, that was a joke/vent.  What about all the drama lately surrounding the vacation?  Seems there is a lot of anxiety about leaving in our current situation.  Is that something I should try and confront (obviously SET wise) or wait till she contacts me?  

[Rapt Reader]

This thread has been locked due to reaching its post limit. This is a worthwhile topic, and you are encouraged to start a new thread to continue the conversation if you would like to... .