Its not her fault, but she is responsible...right? So what now...

[Chansen]

In the most loving and genuine way I told my BPD wife how she feels and experiences emotions is because of how terribly treated she was as a child emotionally and she never had a chance to develop her emotions. I told her it is not her fault she is like this and it is very sad. She took it fairly well, but didn't show much emotion (contrary to if I leave a few dishes in the sink the night before makes me the worst husband in the world). A few weeks or so later, as I patiently request she seeks DBT to help her learn how to interpret and react to her emotions, I said something to her in the kitchen that she did hear and she began to rage! (for some reason this is an INSTANT trigger for her even in very calm moments... .) This terrified our daughter and I pointed that out to my wife as I comforted our child. She insisted it was my fault she reacted this way. I told her that I see she is very frustrated when she can't hear me and I will try to avoid that, but naturally there will be times I might not speak loud enough for her to hear and it is your responsibility to regulate your emotions about it and not hurt anyone around you. This flipped her out and pulled back my very heart felt conversation with her about her condition not being her fault. She claimed I was being two sided by saying its not her fault she is this way and saying she is responsible for her actions. I told her that as an adult even if we have had terrible past it is our responsibility to get help even if it was not our fault we were treated a certain way. Now she says she doesn't want T because she says it removes my responsibility from her condition (she blames me entirely for how she is).

I know DBT will really help her as she knows she is suffering from BPD, but she is growing more allergic to it the more I bring it up. However, I know our family condition will plummet if she doesn't get help. If it was only rages that I concerned me I would consider fighting through it, but over the last months I have almost received daily death threats from her and suicide threats in attempts to get my attention that she needs "help" and someone to "just love her". I have been her "little puppy" the last months silencing myself to these extremely damaging rages and threats ad controlling my temper and responses entirely. I don't know how to deal with this in a healthy way as I feel like I am constantly beaten up by her. These huge rages are terrible, but the little ones in between seem to add a lot of emotion damage as well... .for example, everything, i mean EVERYTHING reminds her how terrible of a husband I am, how screwed up I made her life, and how much better her life would be without me... .tv commercials about diapers reminders her how much she has missed from our daughters childhood, snow falling outside reminds her how she wishes she could play with our daughter but can't because how I made her so depressed and hurt, quotes in romance movies reminds her how she wishes she married someone else who REALLY loves her, dishes in the sink reminds her how screw our life is and simple things even can't be done... .endless constant reminders she gives to me that makes daily life miserable. I don't know what do to... .it is sometimes at the point that when we sleep in different rooms after her rages and threats, I set "traps" by the door to alarm me in case she wanted to come in and hurt me in my sleep (she has never done this, but has claimed she thought about killing me in my sleep... .So I won't take my chances). I feel completely unsafe in my own home and bed and I hate how much trauma our child experiences... .the only "peace" comes when she gives me the silent treatment or when someone comes and visits (which she puts on her happy face and life sees normal again).

I really want to stay with her, as I know she will benefit greatly from DBT as I know how receptive she can be. However, in the meantime, I am dying slowly, loosing strength naturally from the complete chaos she brings... .and doing even those dishes she will rage over the next day seems daunting to complete simply because of the stress I go through... .so I leave them and go to sleep without saying good night to her... .furthering her bitterness, but I simply don't have strength to test to see if her emotional volcano will erupt tonight or not.

So, should I move out with our child temporarily until she seeks treatment? I know this is an ultimatum, but I want to get her attention and send the message that she simply can not treat me this way and she can't control and manipulate people. She has conditioned me to comply to almost everything she requests and I know this has to stop... .I just don't know what to do as the situation is very terrifying.

I have no one to talk to about this, so any help is so appreciated. Thank you.

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[formflier]

 

First, understand that it is not your fault.  That she has it or that she snapped that day. 

She is trying to offload a feeling by placing blame.  Don't accept it or spend much time listening.


It is likely that she was walking around "full" of this bad feeling and your "trigger" to her "burst" that feeling and it all came spewing out.

So, its likely not that she was completely normal and you pushed her to full on.  She was 99% of the way there, it just took a small nudge to get her over the edge.

Yeah, stop bringing up DBT.   It seems to be smothering or pushing he away.

FF

[babyducks]

Hi Chansen,

I know DBT will really help her as she knows she is suffering from BPD, but she is growing more allergic to it the more I bring it up. However, I know our family condition will plummet if she doesn't get help. If it was only rages that I concerned me I would consider fighting through it, but over the last months I have almost received daily death threats from her and suicide threats in attempts to get my attention that she needs "help" and someone to "just love her".

I suspect the more you try and discuss it the more she will be  allergic.    That doesn't have anything to do with how compassionately you are approaching the topic.    It's part of the cognitive distortions of a mental illness.   It is very difficult to approach this as an ally, to build trust and understanding.   I am concerned that by continuing to discuss the topic she will become more resistant.   Not something you want right now.

So, should I move out with our child temporarily until she seeks treatment? I know this is an ultimatum, but I want to get her attention and send the message that she simply can not treat me this way and she can't control and manipulate people. She has conditioned me to comply to almost everything she requests and I know this has to stop... .I just don't know what to do as the situation is very terrifying.

I have no one to talk to about this, so any help is so appreciated. Thank you.

Safety first.   Your and your child's safety is the number one priority.   If there is ever a question of things flashing over into actions , then take your go bag and exit for the day or the night what ever works best for you.

As much as it would be nice if there were quick solutions or immediate ways to fix things typically it takes some time to reduce the level of conflict and for new behavior to take hold.   The first thing to do is stop making it worse.  The link is right over there on the right hand side of your screen.  

and the second thing I am going to strongly suggest, is that you consider getting the ball rolling and finding a therapist of your own to talk to.   Not because I think you are fault or to blame.  Specifically because I think there are lot of complex and difficult issues that you are going to need some help with.   that's okay.   many of us need a trained advocate in our corner to help us unravel things when we are first here.

I am going to suggest you put yourself first.   some one has to take the lead in getting to a healthier place.   you are more likely to have success with that.  

does that make sense to you?

'ducks

[Daniell85]

"I do have hope though... .I have insisted that she take DBT therapy and she has agreed as she most likely has BPD."


You have diagnosed to her than she has BPD? Was this verified by a medical professional?

You have followed up by insisting she take DBT therapy.

Your wife very likely sees you as persecuting and harrassing her at this point. I agree with babyducks, the more you speak with your wife about your assumption she is mentally ill, and you insist she needs treatment, the more you will push her away from anything like that.

I read your back story a bit. I am having a little bit of difficulty following so my apologies if I ask questions you already answered.

If I understand correctly, you never saw this behavior prior to marriage. Was it before she had your child that she began to show so much upset, or after she was pregnant and had the baby?

[iluminati]

I agree with the others about bringing it up.  There's nothing like forcing someone to confront the fact that their wonderful family ain't worth a good gosh darn to make someone mount the defenses.

In terms of the death threats and suicide threats, there's a simple solution: call 911.  Don't discuss it, don't debate it.  Take it completely out of your hands.  There's nothing like the police and EMS show up to show that you're taking her situation seriously.  She ultimately wants to be heard as going through something serious.  Let the boys in blue educate her.

[Daniell85]

Think he said he is in eastern Europe? Not sure how the authorities would handle these kinds of threats.

[Chansen]

Good call, I have stopped bring up BPD and DBT all together... .so now should I simply wait till she wants to do it? Or just give it some time before I bring it up again?

To answer a few things questions some of you had:

I read your back story a bit. I am having a little bit of difficulty following so my apologies if I ask questions you already answered.

If I understand correctly, you never saw this behavior prior to marriage. Was it before she had your child that she began to show so much upset, or after she was pregnant and had the baby?

I only noticed it once before we got married when she exploded on me on valentines day for drinking in a "noisy impolite" way from a coffee cup as I walked her home that night... .just after I surprised her with a romantic dinner. She ranted about everything for the half hour we walked home in a kind of fury that I have never seen before in someone. She went inside her flat and came out 10mn later and apologized though (I dream about times as good as these now... .). When we got married it came out progressively, our honeymoon for example was a disaster over a few dumb things. A few days after we got married she threatened to rip up our marriage certificate in the airport during a layover... .But since we have a baby things have gone from terrible to hell. She is EXTREMELY sensitive to "time passing away" and seeing our daughter grow up and not being apart of her life as she sits in bed all day (and blames me) kills her. As well as the natural added pressure of being parents and trying to keep stay on top of finances while I attempt to take care of our daughter and emotional tornado wife. So I think it would have got bad despite having our daughter, it just got worse quicker... .

Safety first.   Your and your child's safety is the number one priority.   If there is ever a question of things flashing over into actions , then take your go bag and exit for the day or the night what ever works best for you.

Maybe obvious, but this gives me a lot of confidence. Since we live abroad in Poland, I have never even thought to go anywhere since I don't know where exactly I would go (we have friends, but I wouldn't want the situation to embarrasses her), but I have read in a few places of people simply going to a hotel and I think I will for sure keep that in mind.

and the second thing I am going to strongly suggest, is that you consider getting the ball rolling and finding a therapist of your own to talk to.   Not because I think you are fault or to blame.  Specifically because I think there are lot of complex and difficult issues that you are going to need some help with.   that's okay.   many of us need a trained advocate in our corner to help us unravel things when we are first here.

I am going to suggest you put yourself first.   some one has to take the lead in getting to a healthier place.   you are more likely to have success with that.   

does that make sense to you?

That does. I have looked into therapy for myself, specifically a Christian therapist who specializes in codependent personality types (which I am sure I exhibit and fuels how how bad our relationship can get). However, the program they offer costs $2000, which we simply can't handle right now... .again I work at home and putting in normal hours is impossible with our situation as much as I am trying (which is working late in the nights and being exhausted all the time). Do you have any other suggestions? They did tell me which workbooks/books they use as a guide and have a lot of good material on their website that I was thinking I could go through myself (another situation is finding time for myself at all as most of it is sucked in simple tasks to keep the house running, trying to work, and withstand the emotional mess my wife throws at me in the midst of it all.) Is talking to someone what is most necessary? If so, do you have any suggestions for me? I have never even thought about therapy in my life, so this is all new for me.

You have diagnosed to her than she has BPD? Was this verified by a medical professional?

You have followed up by insisting she take DBT therapy.

About 2 years ago her youth leader sent me a link about BPD and I brought it up with her and we both did our research on it. For a a week or so it was never a tender subject and we never had an issue about it. We did the quick online tests about it and she agreed it is something she likely suffers from... .but soon she turned the whole thing on me, because I think she saw it as a way I could used to excuse how I "destroyed everything", not her condition. I never said that, but as I look at it now I can see how it went that way in her mind. Back then I was much weaker and followed her emotional needs like a little puppy. I put aside BPD completely thinking I was not being loyal to her and just finding a way to push the blame away. Since then I have tried to step out and find out what is really happening as things get worse and worse. I stumbled upon BPD again when I googled "My wife is crazy" one night in desperation after one of her explosions. Coincidently I found out about BPD again and I was SHOCKED by how similar our situation is with others who have been diagnosed. She has not been professionally diagnosed however, and I know this is essential. But even getting her out of the house is difficult, at that have her get tested for a mental illness. I brought up DBT as a non-threatening solution for her to learn to control her emotions (which she agrees she wants and needs help with.) I don't know how to approach this now. I know things would improve so much if she knew that it is possible for her to help herself without her environment changing first (I have changed a lot in how I react to her and how I am improving myself, but she still clams how our life is the same i.e. dirty dishes, floors and laundry.)

In terms of the death threats and suicide threats, there's a simple solution: call 911.  Don't discuss it, don't debate it.  Take it completely out of your hands.  There's nothing like the police and EMS show up to show that you're taking her situation seriously.  She ultimately wants to be heard as going through something serious.  Let the boys in blue educate her. smiley

I am VERY worried about this. I think in the States I would consider it, but here the Police don't care much about anything, especially domestic violence (Poland has a very high rate of pathological families). Although they don't care much about helping fix the issue here, they do have a very hight tendency to take children away from their parents for even having a messy flat in some cases... .so you can imagine it terrifies me the call the police. I do think, which I mentioned above, going to a hotel in town for the night is a good solution. It puts me back in control without fighting back and staying safe.