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Highly Recommended Book... Surviving a Borderline Parent. Discover specific coping strategies for dealing with issues common to children of a "Borderline parents": low self-esteem, lack of trust, guilt, and hypersensitivity. This is a step by step guide for adult children of parents with Borderline Personality Disorder -- it teaches you how to overcome the devastating effects of growing up with a parent who suffers from BPD.
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Author Topic: BP parents ability to break up family  (Read 3740 times)
eve7
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« Reply #20 on: November 28, 2006, 08:36:55 AM »

I have experienced this both with my mother and my MIL. My mother will bad-mouth me to my my brothers. I think my mother has issues with other females as it seems to be a common thread in her relationships. However, my brothers, because of their own experiences with my mother, don't believe her. We sometimes compare notes about our mother's behavior. As my youngest borther stated to me, "Sometimes Mom lives in her own little world."

My MIL has been more successful with divide and conquer. She would badmouth X to Y and then do the same to Y to Z. She would often isolate me from other family members with gossip so it was like one big clique when I entered the room. Now she wants to complain and wonder why the family isn't so close anymore. DUH! :smiley

The bottom line to me is manipulation and control. That has been what I've observed when these behaviors are in action. It's like a dance and well, I've just stoppped the music.  wink
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Piglet
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« Reply #21 on: November 28, 2006, 01:39:55 PM »

I've skimmed thru this thread, and went back and read the previous thread referenced, and I just had to say that all of this applies to me, even though I was my mother's only child.  Mother uses other family members (cousins, etc.) to play the role of the missing siblings.

Scary stuff.

P.
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skiqjack


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« Reply #22 on: November 29, 2006, 11:12:03 AM »

Jung, packdogs and history aside (maybe), my BPD father always enjoyed pitting people against each other.  Sometimes, when he did it in his favorite bars, it was funny to watch.  He'd pit a loud-mouth bar maid against a worn-out almost homeless drunk.  Or the bar owner against a beer salesman.  Or two shoe shine kids against each other. He'd wisper in the ear of each, then watch the fireworks.
  If either warring faction ever turned their attention toward my father as the source of the fight, he'd plead ignorance, demand to be left out of the fight and reiterate something one of the warring factions had just said, which resumed and re-escalated the fight.
  What I didn't realize before going no contact was that he was doing the same thing in our family.  He'd pit one sibling against another, a sibling against our mother, or any combination thereof.
  As pack leader, he'd eventually step in and quell the turmoil, then re-start it later whenever he wanted by reminding one of the siblings of what the other had said/done in the past.
  This was all part of the misery loves company mentality that BPDs have, and it likely made him feel better about not being able to get along with people. 
  "OK," he might think, "I can't get along w/ people, but neither can those around me.  But I'm so smart I can see this and even provoke it, so again, I"m better than they are."
  It's all sick.  Our family history of fueds and spats over the years has left most of us so bitter that we'd just rather not see each other for fear of being reminded of the ugly turmoil and wars that made up our family life.
  BPD dad, divorced mom and siblings are still at it, far as I know, but I stepped out of the mess almost 6 years ago.  I should have done it decades ago.   
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StillLeaving
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« Reply #23 on: November 30, 2006, 01:40:05 PM »

FEEDBACK WELCOME
Hello, I'm a Non-mom, and want to share what my adult "unchosen" child said when I emailed two sentences to convey BP traits in her dad's (years of) behavior: GULP :-X 
"I don't want any part of any of these e-mails anymore. PERIOD.  I am not in
agreement with any type of disorder nor am I able to diagnose a disorder of
such, as I am not a doctor, nor are any of us, with the exception of (familyM.D),
and she isn't even the type of Dr. that would diagnose this disorder.  until
he has been "officially" diagnosed, I don't want to have the discussion.
There is NO reason any of your children should be "pulled" into your
diagnosis, and your interpretation of your husband.  so PLEASE do not
include me in any more e-mails pertaining to YOUR interpretation of dad.
these are YOUR issues, and I prefer to not have anything to do with it.
thanks"

StillLeaving,
GLo
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Piglet
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« Reply #24 on: November 30, 2006, 01:46:44 PM »

FEEDBACK WELCOME
Hello, I'm a Non-mom, and want to share what my adult "unchosen" child said when I emailed two sentences to convey BP traits in her dad's (years of) behavior: GULP :-X 
"I don't want any part of any of these e-mails anymore. PERIOD.  I am not in
agreement with any type of disorder nor am I able to diagnose a disorder of
such, as I am not a doctor, nor are any of us, with the exception of (familyM.D),
and she isn't even the type of Dr. that would diagnose this disorder.  until
he has been "officially" diagnosed, I don't want to have the discussion.
There is NO reason any of your children should be "pulled" into your
diagnosis, and your interpretation of your husband.  so PLEASE do not
include me in any more e-mails pertaining to YOUR interpretation of dad.
these are YOUR issues, and I prefer to not have anything to do with it.
thanks"

StillLeaving,
GLo

Oh my... I hope this helps a little.  I received a similar reaction - but much more benign - from family members when I first figured out my BPD mom 3 years ago.  I spoke with some close relatives and gave them SWOE and UTBM.  They gave me limited feedback, and the general attitude is that they didn't want to know/be involved/discuss it.

I posted here... and if I can find the thread I'll post a link.  I got some very good advice that basically said you can't MAKE THEM GET IT. 

So I sat back... I did what was best for ME and my small child and my husband (so I thought, although I did let my guard down which is why I am still here at BPDFamily)... and I waited.

Eventually  he will get to everyone.  They eventually turn on EVERYONE.  If you refuse to be the whipping boy (so to speak), eventually the bp will turn it on someone else.  That is what happened here... everybody sees it now. 

I still feel like if they had gotten on board with a PLAN a few years back (basically if everybody would have stopped catering to her crap in an organized fashion), it would have been easier on us, but it's true:  you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink.

P.

Modified to add this link:  http://BPDfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=7577.msg69042;topicseen#msg69042
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LavenderMoon
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« Reply #25 on: November 30, 2006, 02:21:46 PM »

FEEDBACK WELCOME
"as I am not a doctor, nor are any of us, with the exception of (familyM.D),
and she isn't even the type of Dr. that would diagnose this disorder.  until
he has been "officially" diagnosed, I don't want to have the discussion."

this is her choice to not be involved, this is part of the dynamic of the how bp's get so much support, to keep blaming the target.  you can only respect her choice.

as far as this official diagnosis, that people are so stuck on, this is a mystery to me.  people assume that the "psych industry" has some "secret bag of voodoo", that they are the only ones who could "actually know".
most of the them to this day, have no idea what it is, or they have some vacant knowledge, & can't wait to pin it on someone, whether they are bp or not.  they have a list to go by, so what.
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Theireyeswerewatching
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« Reply #26 on: November 30, 2006, 05:52:20 PM »

As an aside: does anyone know anything about the history of the pack structure in dysfunctional human families? Has it been around since cave days? Or is it more recent?



Warm Greetings,

If you've reached a certain age and allow family members and outsiders to interfere with your marital unit, there are gaps and loop holes in your maturity level. But, some people like for their personal life to be in everyone's mouth, in front of everyone's eyes, and in everyone's ear. It shows great disrespect to self, your spouse, and your spousal unit when you breach the privacy of your personal affairs and allow outside mouth's to run loose and tongue wag freely in your private affairs. The older you become the more gross this childish misconduct becomes.

Sometimes parental relationships to include sibling relationships must be terminated if not severely limited due too disrespect and intrusive misconduct concerning the private life of your marital affairs. Absolutely no one! to include extended family members should be allowed to interfere with your spousal unit. Dysfunctional enmeshed family systems do this and create great harm and unnecessary stress in marital affairs. Those of us that have become aware of the devastating affects of not having clear boundaries and visible lines protecting our marital unit will suffer intrusions of all sorts possibly leading to break ups.

I do not like or tolerate outsiders meddling/having an opinion/role about or in the interworkings of my private life. If a man needs his parents permission and/or the opinion of anyone besides himself to choose me to become apart of his life, then I don't want him.

Best Wishes For The Future. smiley

http://www.joy2meu.com/DysfunctionalFamilies.htm

http://www.joy2meu.com/Codependence1.html

http://www.silcom.com/~joy2meu/joy_21.htm

http://www.silcom.com/~joy2meu/mothersfathers.html

http://www.joy2meu.com/codependent2.htm

http://www.pasadenaisd.org/ParentUniversity/parent45.htm

http://www.coping.org/relations/boundar/intro.htm

http://www.soulwork.net/sw_articles_eng/emotional_incest.htm

http://www.zondervan.com/cultures/en-us/Product/ProductDetail.htm?QueryStringSite=Zondervan&ISBN=0310243149
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salveregina
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« Reply #27 on: November 30, 2006, 06:28:08 PM »

BPD_sucks,

WOW shocked shocked...for a 19 year old...you are certainly wise beyond your years...yes, they break up the family!  They leave devastation in their wake.

I always thought me and ensis would have a normal relationship after my mother died...man oh man was that ever wrong!

My mother planted seeds of division when we were just young children and she nurtured that for a lifetime by splitting us - black and white, up and down...endlessly...and now my mother is dead and my sister and I are No Contact...exactly what BPDm wanted...it was too threatening to her for us to have any relationship.

Oh I tried for so long and I just can't anymore...won't waste any more of MY precious time on somebody who is never gonna get it...so I've walked away...sad, yet freeing!

It's really an amazing thing when you think of it because I'm sure to my mother's conscious mind, she would never have wanted this for us...yet subconsciously, she did want it.

I know you want a relationship with your brother, I remember your posts trying to talk to him.  I know you have tried.  Maybe someday...

Are you going away to school in January?

Very sad,
Salveregina
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StillLeaving
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« Reply #28 on: December 02, 2006, 03:04:58 PM »

Hello, and so interesting reading - thanks;

I'm a Non-m, caught off-guard and pained now about adult children's unwillingness to "talk about BP-d" traits. However, they do at least tolerate me, but not yet forgiven (possibly) for not removing them from (what I know now as) our parental toxicity as children and  allowing the re-engagement back in, but... anyway... yes, by definition:

 "The term, borderline, was created for individules who were at the "borderline" between neurotic and psychotic, which ...disrupts family and work life, long-term planning*, and the individual's sense of self."  (and no one even knows unless they lived it)  embarrassed

ALSO of interest... 'BP behavior ("It") is often compared with toddler behavior. "It" is unable to take
responsibility for what "it" said and did. So "it" will deny "it" said/did whatever, and if "it" does admit to whatever, "it" will claim that you made "it" do so. Either way, you are always wrong.'

KEEP ON POSTING - GET VALIDATED - YOU ARE LOVED
From personal experience, I remember (being stupefied) by certain incidents when my "adult" spouse  behaved with a competitive attitude with or even against our children, and in turn, it "stirred" them against each other. Oh that used to just make me fume! (oh now, didn't I look like the crazy one?) BINGO!
Now after research of this, I see that it is common and a part of the narcissistic trait of the BPD, (Narc tendencies) often struggleS with children in general:
 Because it's natural for children to have levels of selfish tendencies, wanting to compete for attention, etc., and the primary problem for the BPD is competition. THEORY: There's room for only one Narc.
Stay in the Circle of Healing  wink

...way too long... sorry,
StillLeaving
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bpd_sucks
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« Reply #29 on: December 02, 2006, 03:59:45 PM »

BPD_sucks,

WOW shocked shocked...for a 19 year old...you are certainly wise beyond your years...yes, they break up the family!  They leave devastation in their wake.

I always thought me and ensis would have a normal relationship after my mother died...man oh man was that ever wrong!

My mother planted seeds of division when we were just young children and she nurtured that for a lifetime by splitting us - black and white, up and down...endlessly...and now my mother is dead and my sister and I are No Contact...exactly what BPDm wanted...it was too threatening to her for us to have any relationship.

Oh I tried for so long and I just can't anymore...won't waste any more of MY precious time on somebody who is never gonna get it...so I've walked away...sad, yet freeing!

It's really an amazing thing when you think of it because I'm sure to my mother's conscious mind, she would never have wanted this for us...yet subconsciously, she did want it.

I know you want a relationship with your brother, I remember your posts trying to talk to him.  I know you have tried.  Maybe someday...

Are you going away to school in January?

Very sad,
Salveregina

thanks for replying. It's so nice to hear from someone who has been through the same trauma, that is older and wiser. Because it's so hard, and it feels as if there are no solution to these problems and It's so extremly painful to see the years pass by, and see that nothing changes for the better, rather for the worse.

As far as my brother is concearned I think that we are never going to have a normal relationship no matter what. Because everything is so destoryed between us. And as long as I am in contact with my mother I don't feel like I could take some action in explaining to him what are mother is suffering from and that I pray for him to seek therapy and treatment for his depression, but I can't do that now.. because then all hell would brake lose. I feel as if I'm getting nowhere with the relationship to my mother, everything is just a big lie, and she shows no tendency to change. If I go No Contact, I atleast won't have to be afraid for attempting to get my brother to help himself out of the misery he is in.

That's another reason to why I want to go No Contact, because it feels as if the painful memories are just piling up and that It would be easier if I didn't have to see all the misery she has caused within the family. Because it feels my with dispair and sorrow. Because I don't feel as if I'm going to miss out on much but misery any way if I go No Contact.

I so understand that what I would want would be having a normal childhood and a mother that is mentally well. But that is never going to happen, so I have no choice but to look forward.
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Fall Fund Drive
Yes, I'm sniffing you. Glad you finally noticed. Got a question.
Has this place helped you? If so and if you're not already a sponsor, would you please consider becoming one. You can do it! Heck - just sell your cat. Someone sponsored my participation. It's a wonderful thing to pay forward.
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