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Think About It... Whenever we refuse to take responsibility for ourselves, we are unconsciously choosing to react as victim. This inevitably creates feelings of anger, fear, guilt or inadequacy and leaves us feeling betrayed, or taken advantage of by others.~ Lynne Forrest
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Author Topic: How did your relationship evolve?  (Read 20972 times)
Awesome Jim
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Posts: 502

« Reply #10 on: December 23, 2008, 03:45:18 PM »

Thanks for the great post Kinetix - your story is so similar to mine and I'm sure to many others and it is also a great time of year to have a post like this to remind us of the danger of BPD as I am sure many of us feel weak in terms of our ability to ward off re-engages during the holidays.

I think people have said some really interesting things here.  I think what C2 said was a brilliant observation about all of us and our situations in terms of the insidiousness of their behaviour that only we are allowed to see.  It reminds me of that old cartoon where the guy discovers this singing and dancing frog and every time he tries to show someone else the frog's talents all he gets is a "ribbet" and people start to think he's crazy - lol.

Also in terms of what C2 said about how we get sucked in and are then reluctant to give up, I had a friend make a very astute observation about human love in general the other day.  He suggested that when humans engage in love it is completely irrational - that love itself is a form of insanity.  We often stay with abusive, harmful people for long periods of time which makes no sense whatsoever in terms of improving our lives or chances for survival and yet, both women and men stay in such horrible relationships because we claim we "love them".  It's not rational.  Even healthy love is not really very rational - I mean ultimately we stay because love makes us feel good - well so does heroin but doing it cuz it feels good, even if it wasn't physically bad for us, still doesn't make any sense.  I personally tend to agree with this to a degree and I have kind of rationalized it in my brain (being the closet evolutionary biologist that I am) as being a very unique trick our genes or biology plays on us by generating such powerful and addictive feelings that cause us to both want to procreate (on a purely selfish level - as in sexual drive) and to then stick around and raise our offspring (this is where love comes in, making what appears to be empathetic behaviour appear) and yet it makes absolutely no logical sense.  So we are genetically programmed, like all other animals, to engage our sexual instincts and also specifically in humans the instinct of "love" has been hardwired in our brains for the simple reason that we stick around and raise our children and support our families.  In other words it is necessary for our own brains or biology to trick us into falling in love so that we continue to reproduce as well as raise our offspring and thus pass on and evolve our genetic material.

People with BPD have poor emotional regulation (I mean this is really what the disease is) so I think this is why the normal ups and downs of any relationship are immensely exaggerated with them, simply because their emotions drive their thinking far more than logic or fact or rational discourse.  When I read people in other posts claiming that their BPD never loved them it really bothers me because I believe they do love and are completely capable of loving.  The problem though is that the normal emotions involved with love cause them to do crazy things and express insane emotional outbursts centred around jealousy and abandonment fears.  If they didn't love you they wouldn't hate you when they are upset - they would simply be indifferent.  We only really feel deep hatred towards those we love most and whom we feel betrayed us or abandoned us.

I personally have accepted my uBPDexgf for whom she is adn how she is.  I also have had her out to my place recently to spend some time with her and her son and to give her son a gift for Christmas.  Do I wish everything was normal and we were back together? - of course I do.  Is it going to happen or am I going to be foolish enough to believe it could be? - no - of course not.  I cannot hate forever someone I have been friends with for many years and whom is overall a good person.  She knows she can't help herself and proved it to me this past Saturday.  She had grabbed her son's arm and told him to behave when we were at the mall (he did actually need to be told to settle down a bit) this Saturday and he started to cry a bit but clung to my leg when he did.  I patted him on the head a bit and comforted him and he calmed down right away.  At dinner she apologized to him for snapping and admitted to thim that she should have taken her meds before she came out.  To me this says that she knows how she is but does not know how to control it and that meds do help her a bit.  IF that's the best she can do, and accordingly to pretty much all of the research I have read it is, then I can at least accept that she has done her best to control her disorder and taken some level of responsibility for it.  As I often say, I can't hate an alligator because it eats people and I can't hate my ex gf simply because she has BPD.
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« Reply #11 on: November 08, 2010, 07:32:34 PM »

We don't walk away because the BPD isn't obvious at the time, only in retrospect.  The push/pull dance, the splitting, the abusive behaviors, the gaslighting are all insidious.

In my situation, insidious is a really good word to describe how subtle the process was. But I can't discount the "all in" aspect of what kinetix called the "sunk cost."  It is like the gambling analogy- you dont really know when to walk away. You've invested so much- and there were times when things seemed to break even, but for the most part I was deluded in thinking that the bad was nowhere near as noteworthy as the good. I believe, as "soodone" says, that "average people walk away from the nuttiness but those that have old unresolved ''stuff'' are glued to it and try to wrap their heads around it."

That's me- trying to wrap my head around it- and worse, sticking my head up someone's ass, failing every time.

What did Chris Farley say in the movie "Tommy Boy?"

Tommy: [Trying to copy his father's quote] "Hey, I'll tell you what. You can get a good look at a butcher's ass by sticking your head up there. But, wouldn't you rather to take his word for it?"

Customer: [confused] What? I'm failing to make the connection here. lol

Tommy: "No, I mean is, you can get a good look at a T-bone by sticking your head up a butcher's ass... No, wait... It's gotta be your bull...?"

David Spade: [embarrassed] Wow.
[It takes Tommy until the end of the movie to say the phrase correctly]

"I can get a good look at a T-bone by sticking my head up a bull's ass, but I'd rather take a butcher's word for it."

BPD is BPD... You could stick your head up there and look around and get nothing out of it but exasperation and a waste of precious time.  So many of us returned to the BPD looking for answers- in effect, giving them more control of our lives. Now I know, there's nothing left to do but turn my back, walk away and take the butcher's word for it...
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« Reply #12 on: November 08, 2010, 08:06:50 PM »

I have saved this and will faithfully read it first thing every morning. Thank you all that posted Doing the right thing
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« Reply #13 on: November 09, 2010, 06:31:02 AM »

God, I read this twice. Good stuff. It makes me want to give a quick chronicle of my own situation. Maybe I will.

She was a statue of a Greek Goddess
One day she crumbled
All that was left was a broken, hurt, angry little girl hissing at me and giving me the finger
GENERAL ANNOUNCEMENT: Are you on the right board?
This board is for members with failed or failing relationships that want to detach from their relationship and relationship wounds. If you are still analyzing the decision to stay, please post on Undecided: Staying or Leaving
All members living with a pwBPD should learn to use the Stop the Bleeding tools - boundaries, timeouts and other basic tools - to better manage the day to day interactions with your partner. If you have questions on any of the tools, feel free to go over to Staying: Improving a Relationship with a Borderline Partner and ask for help. :-)
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« Reply #14 on: November 09, 2010, 07:27:44 AM »

I read this and it hits me like a 2*4 between the eyes. I was doing folly and I should be glad I am out.
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« Reply #15 on: November 09, 2010, 09:52:09 AM »

Kinetix, thank you so much for posting that.  I am sitting here dumbfounded.  It's almost 100% exactly my story.  That's EXACTLY how my xBPDbf's and my relationship evolved.  The MINUTE I pointed out that I needed a slight bit more love or appreciation from him, he got "monster mean" for the first time, and it completely freaked me out.  It was all downhill from there...

He just broke up with me 2 weeks ago.  

Wow.  I'm printing that out and putting it up near my desk at home.

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« Reply #16 on: April 03, 2011, 05:17:12 PM »

This is it - I finally got it.
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« Reply #17 on: April 03, 2011, 06:16:29 PM »

Very, very good old thread. Nice find!  Doing the right thing  The similarities are still amazing me, but yeah... that's really it. I bookmarked it.

You know what keeps in my head all the time? Why I didn't know about BPD and info like this before I knew her... damn!  grin
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It's not too late to make better choices

« Reply #18 on: April 03, 2011, 08:05:16 PM »

 Doing the right thing

Mary Oliver:  Someone I loved gave me a box full of darkness. It took me years to understand that this too, was a gift

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Two years out and getting better all the time!

« Reply #19 on: April 03, 2011, 08:32:37 PM »

good post. Thanks for posting that to remind us.

"If your're going through hell, keep going..." Winston Churchill
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