BPDFamily.com

Positive Peer Culture Therapy

we started the session with nali telling us that he wanted to talk about how the home visit went...

i told him we were very impressed with how well BPDd-13 handled being told "no" to some requests.  BPDd-13 said that she pushed the limits a few times but caught herself and backed off.  she is referring to asking again after being told no...in regards to riding on a very very cold day.

nali asked BPDd-13 how she felt about her ability to accept the answer "no"?  BPDd-13 replied "awesome.  i felt it made us come together as a family. then nali asked husband the same ... husband replied "proud that she was able to use reason and delay gratification."

nali asked if other family visiting noticed any difference in BPDd-13...i replied BPDd-13's stepdaughter (21)ter remarked on how happy BPDd-13 is and sees how hard she is trying and working at it.

BPDd-13 then told us that permission was not given for us to visit with her peer and her peer's family off campus...that she had taken peers' word for it that permission had been given. nali asked us how we felt about BPDd-13 being honest about this?  i replied that honesty is highly valued by our family because that is how trust is earned and if there is no trust there is no open communication...no real family.

nali asked BPDd-13 why honesty is important to her...she replied because it helps you and the other person.

nali asked me what I did to help facilitate a good home visit...i replied: I listened for what everyone needed and used validation (https://bpdfamily.com/content/communication-skills-validation) to help keep open communication so that we could stay in the positive and not get stuck in the negative.  nali asked husband the same question...i didn't think it was possible for her to earn my trust so quickly but she did. I see that she has matured a great deal. nali:  awesome stuff!

BPDd-13 told nali that "i feel that my mom is a good mediator between me and my dad when ever we had issues and my dad was quick to pull out of his emotional mind."

nali asked BPDd-13:  "what helped you to be true to your positive peer culture?" BPDd-13:  i don't want to loose it.  if I mess up at home I will loose all that.

me:  i think that BPDd-13 so believes in Positive Peer Culture that it is who she is now rather than just something she practices.  it is a new way of being for her and I can see how important it is to her.  therefore it is important to us as well.  we want to support her in this new way of being by providing boundaries that hold her accountable to herself and our family.

nali:  what do  you think of that BPDd-13?

BPDd-13:  i like it!

dh:  she is confident in the way she conducts herself and I think she realizes the old paths led to destruction and these new paths lead to success.

nali:  BPDd-13 what do you still need to work on?

BPDd-13:  listening to what they are trying to tell me.  when my dad was with me and I was deleting my facebook he got agitated and told me I was going too fast.  he said it in a harsh tone.  i could have listened.

nali:  is his tone about you or him?

BPDd-13:  him.

me:  what could she have done, being in the help seat, to work through this to mutual satisfaction?

BPDd-13:  i could have slowed down and shown him what I was doing.

dh:  she did tell me to take a deep breath at one point.

nali:  she is much more open and not shutting down.  what happened that changed things for you BPDd-13?

BPDd-13:  i decided I wanted to change and I realized that my family will be there for me all the time.  i was afraid that they didn't love me and I realize now that they do.  once I realized that I had to change the way I treated them.  i could no longer justify my behavior.

nali:  so you recognize how our behavior affects others?

BPDd-13:  yeah

nali:  i hand it to you.  you are doing great things.  i believed you would do well on the home visit but I didn't expect you to do great things!  i need you to be a good leader with solid boundaries now.

dh:  i see we are becoming a closer family because we are not afraid to express our feelings and thoughts.

nali:  a lot of the past was based on fear of sharing those thoughts and feelings because of being judged.

me:  my anger in our "past life" was really a secondary emotion to fear.  the fear of things never getting better and having to live like this year after year, the fear that my daughter would never get any better and never know what it is like to be loved or truly give love and have a happy stable life for herself.

nali:  now that love is back at the forefront things will get better and better.  in the Bible the story of saul the persecutor of Christians comes to mind as a good example of how love changes things.  saul was changed because Christ confronted him with love...not beating him down but calling him to do great and mighty works.  BPDd-13 found the courage to change when she knew she was loved and now she is changing her world.  how do you feel dad about open communication?

dh:  it is the only way we really have to solve problems in the family and in the world.

nali:  keep being faithful family to honest and open communication.  keep your faith in each other working as life is not a destination but a journey worth taking.

we said our good byes

BPDd-13 is so very impressing with her "new way of being".

lbjnltx

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BPD d13 in residential treatment center «

Month 1 (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=120563) Month 2 (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=177524) Month 3 (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=125264) Month 4 (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=127415)

Month 5 (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=129653) Month 6 (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=131681) Month 7 (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=133797) Month 8 (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=136413)

Month 9 (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=138842) Month 10 (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=140551)

Thank you for sharing these conversations ... it helps a lot to see how far you've come ... and also to see how you put the principles into action!

it has been quite a journey...i have learned so much about what peace really is.



lbjnltx

lbj - there is indeed so much courage happening for every one of you in this family. I have been thinking all evening about you, husband and d14 and what the key parts are to these successes. I tried to pick out in this quote the parts that really aligned with what I have noticed along the way as you have shared your family story. Courage is the best word to describe this feeling I have. Love alone is not enough with our families. We have to live find the courage to persist, to learn the tools, skills, words for communicating in the same language for the love to get where it needs to go. And you, husband and d14 are really working it. This creates such an environment for your future success when d14 comes home to stay. I am so proud of all of you, if that is not overstepping somehow. Your story brings me such great joy. Thank you so much for sharing your life with us.

qcr  

thank you so much dear qcarol,

about 20 months ago I ran into a woman at the grocery store who knew my d when she was 9 and 10 years old.  when she asked me how my d was doing (at this time she is 12 and had just been dx/emerging BPD) I told her the horrible truth.  her advice to me was:

"just love her through it".  at the time I thought ... wow...she just doesn't get it...what kind of advice is that?  now...after taking this journey thus far...i can see clearly it was the best advice I got!

a while back...months ago...someone started a thread on one of the workshop boards (i think) that asked "What is your greatest fear?"

i posted "that my precious daughter would never know I love her"

i don't have to be afraid of that anymore.  I will continue to do my best to not be afraid to show her I love her.

since I ran out of new books to read...i recently picked up "BPD in Adolescents" by blaise aguirre to re-read.  one of the things that really stuck out to me is the phrase "adolescents with BPD need more than anything to feel understood".  I think my d does feel "understood" now and I can truly say I understand her.

one day qcarol I hope to get to meet you and have  you meet my precious d.



lbjnltx

lbj,

Let me add my thanks again along with all of the other posters.  We all appreciate your sharing the journey of your dd through RTC.  You  are such an inspiration.  I am so happy that you  were able to get your dd this help during her adolescence.

My husband went along with me to my T appt., today.  She explained how my dd is stuck in her teens, emotionally.  It helped that she was able to explain BPD to my dh.  My husband told me that he only did it for me because he knows how much it means to me.  And, that meant a lot to me.  I know how he feels about going to talk to counselor. But, he was willing to do it for me to  learn how to interact with  my dd.  It really helps when the husband gets on board.

Thanks again.  May God bless you. |iiii


peaceplease

 
this is a scary journey sometimes and having someone to hold your hand and travel it with you is immensely helpful...just as we hold each other's "hands" on this site.

i pray that the tools your husband learns he will practice with you and vice versa...it will bring you closer together and may also improve the relationship w/your dd.

lbjnltx

qcarol,


well...if that isn't a case of the donkey calling the pig long ears I don't know what is!

i can think of no one on this site that has shown as much courage as you qcarol...no one.

lbjnltx

got a big surprise last night...an email from the transitions unit at falcon ridge titled ...it's me, your daughter

it read "hi mom and dad I made pre-trans and got shoes privilege it's fun so yeah love ya bye"

we emailed back:  "wow that is great!  we are so very proud of how hard you have worked...the hardest work any of us will ever do is working on ourselves...you are MY HERO!

btw:  what does "shoes privilege" look like?  should I send your UT Flip flops?


look forward to talking to you tomorrow with lorneta!

big hugs and kisses

mom and dad"

her reply:"shoes" privilege is when I get to wear my tennis shoes every day whenever I want. it's like a thing of trust which is so awesome. I went to equine and i'm training a new horse. he's a colt named nugget. well pre-trans is fun. i'll tell you more about it tomorrow. love you.

i learned from her today that she is allowed to email and receive emails wednesday-saturday in the evenings.  she will be allowed to do activities, go to meetings and do service work while in pre trans and also when she is in the transitions unit permanently.

Family T session #26 1-6-11

BPDd-13 tells us more about Nuggett...a yearling she is getting to work with and that she was very surprised to make it into pre trans...the only thing holding her back is being behind in school/attitude about school and slight inconsistency in all areas of the program.  she said that her peers didn't think she would earn "shoes" privilege as it is the highest privilege one can earn...it signifies complete trust. she also added that some of the staff didn't believe she was going to be awarded "shoes" privilege either.

we discussed thinking errors and husband and I listed the ones that we struggle with.  BPDd-13 told us one of her main thinking errors is "emotional misreasoning" defined as:  the  individual draws an irrational and incorrect conclusion based on the way he feels at that moment. she said that this is what she did during the home visit when the issue of giving her iphone to her sister came up and she got emotional asking me "does daddy love sissy more than me?"  BPDd-13 went on to say "that was incorrect reasoning."

dh:  did you feel I loved sissy more?

BPDd-13:  yes at that time I  did.  i know that isn't true though.  i do see that dad treats me differently.  he is more serious with me and gets upset with me.

t:  why do you think he treats you differently than your sister?  could it be the age difference between you? (her sister is 22)

BPDd-13:  i know she is an adult but that doesn't mean he can't joke around with me like he does with her.

me:  daddy uses humor and joking around to interact with people and keep life fun.  he used to tell sissy that he found her at the circus feeding the elephants peanuts and decided to take her home with him.  when he told you that you cried.

t:  so your sensitivity would not allow you to interact with dad like your sister does.  are you less sensitive now so that you can be more playful in your interaction with dad?

BPDd-13:  yes

dh:  i love all my kids.  each of them is an individual and I treat them as such.  i tell each of them that they are my favorite.  BPDd-13, do you believe that.

BPDd-13:  yeah

t:  so if dad were to tell you "your eyes don't match" how would you react to that?

BPDd-13:  i would tell him he is going bald.

t:  what if he says something that upsets you?  what could you say to let him know that?  could you say something like "that's a little personal"?

BPDd-13:  yeah I can do that.

t:  so how will changing thinking errors help your family?

BPDd-13:  it will keep us open to each other and communicating.

t:  your parents have worked hard to make a better family.  they have been involved in the program with you.  the fact that they recognize they have thinking errors too and are working on them just like you are will help you all as a family move up the ladder of needs.  how do you feel about yourself?  how many thinking errors have you recognized and worked on correcting since you have been here?

BPDd-13:  about 20 million!

t:  one area that still needs work for you to make it into trans is your thinking errors in regards to school.  

BPDd-13:  i have always disliked school.  well there are some things I like about it.  i like to write poetry and do other creative assignments.  i just don't like math I guess because I am not good at it.

t:  if you change the way you think about math from "i hate math" to "math is a challenge to be conquered through practice" then you can change what "math" means to you.  you like challenges.  you have taken the first step towards this by being aware of your thoughts about math.  avoiding things we think of as unpleasant will only add to our stress.  these things rarely go away..each time you avoid your stress level will climb and this will keep you from climbing the ladder of the hierarchy of needs.  

me:  mixing something you enjoy in with an unpleasant task can sometimes help us get through it.  i don't enjoy ironing...it is so boring...so I will listen to the world news or some music I like and that helps me not focus on how bored I am and I can complete my task and feel better about myself.  

t:  yes, there is satisfaction in conquering a thinking error.  being creative in solutions is a plus.

me:  i have realized that before BPDd-13 went to falcon our family was stuck at the "safety needs" level of the pyramid.  because I did not believe I could protect BPDd-13 from herself, because I didn't feel secure in my own home, because our home was out of "order", and because BPDd-13 didn't respect the limits that we set we were all very unstable.  once she started to work on herself and I had security at home knowing I was safe and she was safe at falcon I very quickly moved up that ladder of needs to the top.

t:  it is amazing how quickly we can move to the top of the hierarchy once we have our safety needs met.  most families that we see here at falcon ridge are stuck on that safety needs level as well.

end of session.

thanks for reading and all the support you continue to give to me.

lbjnltx

Pass the kleenex.     Tears of joy!   |iiii

Thank you, lbj.


peaceplease

qcarol,

I second what lbj says about you having the most courage.   |iiii




peaceplease

qcarol,

May I third that please?  I don't know anyone who has more courage  |iiii

lbj,

It is wonderful to be on this journey with you, see the progress and in a way, share the reward.  Thank you so much for continuing to share with us and care with us.

pennifree

lbj - this is the nugget for me from this session. Bringing this level of needs into our conscious awareness - and how we get stuck here - explains so much about feeling no sanitiy in my home for so long. And also how not having my DD24 living in my home helped me begin the long painful journey toward safety for myself, husband and GD5. Now that I am less stuck we are able to include DD in making a fun visit AT OUR HOUSE! We did this two weeks ago, and are planning to try again this coming Sunday. It also helps to have her bf come as he is so good at giving her 'a look' that somehow reminds her to be nice to us.

Thank you again for sharing.

qcr |iiii    :)

for anyone interested in maslow's heirarchy of needs:




                                    SELF ACTUALIZATION

                                personal growth and fulfillment

                                     

                                      ESTEEM NEEDS

                       achievement, status, responsibility, reputation

                             

                            BELONGINGNESS AND LOVE NEEDS

                         family, affection, relationships, work group, etc


                                      SAFETY NEEDS

                   protection, security, order, law, limits, stability, etc


               BIOLOGICAL AND PHYSIOLOGICAL NEEDS

       basic life needs-air, food, drink, shelter, warmth, sex, sleep, etc.

Each of us is motivated by needs. Our most basic needs are inborn, having evolved over tens of thousands of years.  Abraham Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs helps to explain how these needs motivate us all.

Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs states that we must satisfy each need in turn, starting with the first, which deals with the most obvious needs for survival itself.

Only when the lower order needs of physical and emotional well-being are satisfied are we concerned with the higher order needs of influence and personal development.

Conversely, if the things that satisfy our lower order needs are swept away, we are no longer concerned about the maintenance of our higher order needs.

1. BIOLOGICAL AND PHYSIOLOGICAL NEEDS- air, food, drink, shelter,

    warmth, sex, sleep, et.

2.  SAFETY NEEDS- protection from elements, security, order, law,

    stability, etc

3.  BELONGINGNESS AND LOVE NEEDS- work group, family, affection,

    relationships, etc.

4.  ESTEEM NEEDS-self-esteem, achievement, mastery, independence,

    status, dominance, prestige, managerial responsibility, etc.

5. SELF ACTUALIZATION NEEDS-realizing personal potential, self-

    fulfillment, seeking personal growth and peak experiences.

qcarol,

looking at your d's situation...and considering where her lower level needs are not being met...is it any wonder that she has not been able to move up the ladder?  this applies to all of us and our BPD children.

what's the solution?  meeting the lower level needs as much as possible..."how" becomes the question.

lbjnltx

"how" without backrupting mom and dad. "how" with becoming an enmeshed, enabling parent.

"how" without compromising myself and my boudnaries. YIKES - this is hard work. Guess I'll just keep working it day by day.

Thanks, qcr |iiii

dear qcarol,

your d's needs being met...whatever the level...is not solely your responsibility...

it occurred to me, when you were posting about your d's living situation, that her behavior changed a little bit for the better.  coincidence?  I don't know...it was just a thought that came to me as I read through the pyramid...my point is...when the basic safety needs are met then perhaps progress will begin to become more consistent.

i hope!

lbjnltx

we have enjoyed being able to get nightly emails from BPDd-13 and respond to them.  she was able to go to the nursing home and interact with the residence singing and dancing.  she got to go to a family fun center and ride go carts.  her time in "pre trans" is over and back to the regular unit now until she earns her place in the transitional unit.

i received her 5th progress report in the mail yesterday.  she continues to improve in some areas and hold her own in others.  she did lose ground in 2 areas related to the residential unit (interaction with the other girls). 

we are in the home stretch now...it is time to solidify and be consistent.  we will have family therapy on thursday.

lbjnltx

Family Therapy Session #27  1-13-11

the session began with BPDd-13 telling me that she is working really hard to get caught up in math...the obstacle that is keeping her from going into the transitional unit.  she only has 3 more assignments to make up to be current...she said she is managing to get caught up without losing ground in other subjects...that she rode little doc yesterday and is doing well. 

t:  do you want to  tell mom what we talked about yesterday?

BPDd-13:  ok. well we talked about whether or not I really love you and dad.  lorneta told me this is something I struggle with because of my disorder.

t:  BPDd-13 struggles with identifying her emotions.  we worked through this by BPDd-13 giving her definition of what love is.  tell mom how you define love.

BPDd-13:  well...like...do I enjoy spending time with them, do I like being in their presence, do I like to talk to them, do I worry about them, do I want to do things for them, am I happy when I am with them?

t:  and were all of your requirements met?

BPDd-13:  yes.

me:  answering the question "what is love?" is a difficult thing...many people don't know the answer to that.  is it a feeling or an action?

BPDd-13:  I think it is both.

me:  the Bible tells us there are 3 kinds of love.  eros love which is romantic love like between a man and a woman, philadelphia love which is brotherly love like what we have for our friends and neighbors, and agape love which is how God loves us..unconditionally, and how we love you.

t:  moms and dads love their children unconditionally.  even when you were not behaving appropriately they still loved you.  you realize that now right?

BPDd-13:  yeah

t:  BPDd-13 identified what it was that caused her not to love you.

BPDd-13:  it was me not wanting to listen to  you.  my odd kicking in.

t:  it was your actions pushing mom and dad away, now she realizes that you were just doing your job as parents trying to protect her.  we have reviewed some of the corrected thinking errors.  BPDd-13 is more aware and willing to listen and work on things.  many times she comes into therapy sessions telling me what she needs to work on for that day.  when you have a problem or concern here who do you go to first?

BPDd-13:  peers

t:  after peers who do you talk to?

BPDd-13:  you or another staff member

t:  when you go home who will you go to first?

BPDd-13:  mom and dad

t:  if you go to peers do you think they will be able to help you?

BPDd-13:  probably not.  they won't have had Positive Peer Culture.

t:  they won't be able to give you good advice will they?

BPDd-13:  no.

t:  there may be times when mom and dad won't know how to help you.  that is when you will need to tell your therapist at home what you need help with and mom and dad can do the same.  ok?

BPDd-13:  ok.

t:  BPDd-13 still struggles with identifying emotions.  when she first came here she could only identify 2.  what were they?

BPDd-13:  happy and sad.. lol

t:  I gave her a facial expression chart that lists the emotions under each picture and asked her to list 3 descriptive words to describe each.

BPDd-13:  i'm working on how to better identify my emotions and other peoples.

t:  last week we discussed thinking errors.  has that been helpful to  you and your dh?

me: let me preface what I am about to say with a statement.  I have been working on myself for 3 years now and non of this comes naturally to me.  it has all been learned so I am not bragging when I say that I don't have many thinking errors any more.  that is not to say that I don't still engage in them occassionally.  having a list of them and being able to label them has helped me recognize when I am engaging in them and be able to correct myself.  I believe that being an active listener, especially in a relationship where the other person works through their thought processes out loud, has helped me to engage in less thinking errors because I am listening for the need that I can validate. being patient through this process and waiting for the "conclusion" can be difficult but not impossible.  my husband is more emotional than I am.  I am more cerebral...i know that is a stereo typical reversal but it is the truth.  I struggle more with being Wise Minded and not so much logic and reason. 

t:  so you need to be more in touch with your emotions.

me:  yes.  that is what I work on daily.  for every feeling there is a need...if I want to get my needs met I have to be in touch with my emotions.  once I do identify a need then I am pretty good at getting my needs met.

t:  when people have very different personalities it can be difficult to communicate effectively.  there is a good book you can read about personality types and how to best interact with that person.  it is called "the people code" by taylor hartman.

me:  I may give that a read.

t:  for next week lets go over chapter one of "i don't have to make everything all better". 

me:  sounds good.  I sent the lundbergs an email a few days ago about the impact that book has had on me and my life and how it is helping many people on my online support group.

t:  that's great.  I spoke with them a few months ago and they were so gracious and humble about the feedback I gave them on the book.  I am hoping they will come to falcon ridge soon.  we are still working on that. 

me:  the book has become a fixture on my support group site.  they have it on the recommended reading list, the blog page, and they have a biography of the lundbergs on the book review page.  I believe that from the information I got from reading their book and the biography that this is a ministry to them.

t:  you are right.  they told me in similar terms that it definitely is.

is there anything else for today?

me:  I have not heard back from anyone on whether or not to send the "nightmare before Christmas" blanket.

t:  that decision has been left up to me.  I would rather not have the skull and crossbones images on campus.  for me it carries a negative connotation. is that ok BPDd-13?

BPDd-13:  yeah.  can I have my UT blanket?

t:  that would be fine.  that would be a more positive image.

me:  yes, unless  you think about their football record this past season.

everyone:  lol

me:  don't bring that up to carol.

everyone:   lol

t:  we won't!  besides, BPDd-13, you don't have that much longer to be here.

BPDd-13:  I DON'T?

t:  I don't mean you are going home in 2 weeks.  I mean that we are moving towards transitions unit and looking towards graduation possibly in march.

BPDd-13: REALLY?  can I tell my peers that I may graduate in march?

t:  no.  that is not what I said.  you may tell them that a march graduation is your goal.  it is not absolute.  I have had some incidences lately where students have misquoted me and it has caused some problems.  let's be clear and in agreement, ok?

BPDd-13:  ok.  so I can say that I have a goal date for march graduation.

t: yes.

me:  BPDd-13 said that it is possible that she gets another home visit soon. is that so?

BPDd-13:  yeah. in february.

t:  yes. that is a possibility.

me:  well, as much as we would like to have you come home for a visit next month I don't know if it will be .

BPDd-13:  I know I know dad already told me that finances are a problem.

me: right.  we don't want to jeopardize your time at falcon ridge by using the funds for a home visit.  at the same time if a home visit is important to your therapy program we may need to figure something out.

t:  we can talk about that together more tomorrow if you will call me.  I will also present this to the treatment team and get some feedback from them.

me:  ok.  I will call you tomorrow and wait to hear the results of the meeting.

t:  anything else?

me:  I miss you so much.  I got really sad when I could not get daily emails from you anymore.  I look at the electronic photo frame and think about all your good qualities each time a new picture comes up.  how pretty you are, how intelligent, how creative you are, how compassionate you can be, how talented you are in so many ways.

BPDd-13:  aww.

me:  I love you baby.  you have done really well.  I am so proud of you.  I don't know anyone that has worked as hard on themselves as you have.  you really are my hero.

BPDd-13:  thanks mommy.

t:  well we need to end the session for today. 

BPDd-13:  bye mom, love you.

me: love you too sweety.  take care of yourself.

end of session

WOW - so much insight in this meeting. Have to think about it and return to comment on a couple of parts that really stuck with me (after supper and gd to bed)

qcr

lbj - this so pervasivie with my DD24, and was an issue with her starting at a very young age - 30 months on. Even with the therapy I started when she was age 3, I never seemed to find a way to deal with this effectively. From where I am now, I believe it was ME with the 'odd kicking in' - my own resistance and willfulness.

gd calling me. will be back again later

qcr

Thinking on this some more - I stuggle to be a good listener with my little girl, now a big girl - to sit quiet with her and hear the need being expressed by the pushing away behaviors. I often pushed back - getting loud or demanding myself, not physical but in an emotional way. Or I turned away, not being able to 'stand it' - the pain of not knowing how to 'fix it', not knowing what she needed or wanted, or doing what I believed to be the best thing and having DD's behaviors get worse, or others not seem to understand what I was trying to express that she needed (as in school even with IEP spelled out). This child was so foreign to all my experiences with children around me growing up and as a young adult. And she was my only child so I had no comparison, only my experiences growing up in a big family as the oldest girl (7 kids), and lots of babysitting, lots of nieces and nephews. Wish I had then what I know now. But you know, this is the life I have and the path that I am on, so all I can do now is make the most of each day and the best of my relationship with DD going forward.

Hope it is OK to high-jack you post somewhat in my responses here, but this last session with your D14 has really opened up a lot for me tonight.

qcr  

PS. raising gd5 has also given me some insight and practice with new skills - such a gift. It has helped me to realize that I did the best I could with what was available when DD24 was younger - I read, got involved in her school, in ADHD advocacy (her initial dx) with NAMI with bipolar dx (my dx and her second dx), did lots of different therapies for both of us and meds.  - I really have been an active participant in my life and trying to understand how best to help DD make her way in her life with limited financial resources. GD5 is truly a gift for me - and I think there was a sense of this from the day DD told me she was going to keep this baby. I knew I would be very involved in this family situation - though did not anticipate being the primary parent long-term.

I am so thankful for you, lbj, and the other parents here that give me perspective and hope to keep going.

lbj - this is such a wonderful statement about the work you have done for yourself - your unending drive to create and fully utilize the resources you have needed to find the best possible path for your life, - and the best possible care for your D14 and the best possible support for your marriage. And you have such a strong faith. It is indeed so hard to "be patient throghout this process and wait for the "conclusion" --- by actively listening for the need that you can validate. The Lundberg's book, "I Don't Have to Make Everything All Better" really points out that to be able to 'listen, listen, listen and understand ' with someone else, you first have to be able to do this with yourself, "to have a stong belief in yourself and your own value system". You are a shining example of this principle. We all so appreciate your sharing this with us through your story on this journey with your d14 and dh. To me, this is the heart of the reason to 'take care of myself' - then I will be able to really listen to my family and be there to validate them, and set boudaries, and be able to love them without reservation.

qcr  |iiii    

dear qcarol,

thank you for reading and responding with affirmation that our family's experience is in some way helpful to  you and in turn your family.   :)

i spoke with BPDd-13's therapist on friday to get a better understanding of what is to come in the future.

the therapist anticipates my d graduating during the march family weekend that is scheduled.  even if the treatment team does not recommend she graduate in march she will still come home with us at the end of the family weekend.  during her time at home, if she does really well, she will be invited back to the june family weekend and will graduate then. the dilemma...dh says "no way"  we aren't going to spend all that money to fly back up there in june.  she needs to graduate in march and come home and that will be the end of it.   ;p  

it is very very important for BPDd-13 to have the graduation experience and all that it denotes.  when I tried to explain to husband that WE HAVE NO CONTROL OVER THIS it didn't sit well with him.  I told him that I believe she will be ready to graduate in march and we won't have to worry about it.  that just leaves the "what if"... I will add this to my  prayer requests and leave it alone...it will all work out the way it is supposed to...that I am sure of.

also I asked the therapist about my BPDd-13's psychotic features...is she still experiencing them...t said "no.  not in a good while"... since the increase in the abilify.  I am hoping that my d will be able to get off of some, all, or decrease meds in the future with the help of neurofeedback therapy...

the therapist asked the neurofeedback therapist if he would be willing to do a diagnostic test on BPDd-13...he said yes...t told me she would have him call me...we will see how that turns out as I am really having to work with my husband to get him to ok spending some extra $...

the clinical director has offered to decrees fees for BPDd-13 until she leaves the program...very thankful for that

we have Positive Peer Culture tomorrow and family therapist on thursday.

take good care all of you!

lbjnltx

lbj - your faith is your sanity  |iiii  Sounds like things are moving in a good direction. There is time before March for husband to find his own way to what is best for D14.

I'm on computer at work - my laptop died and is in the hands of our IT guy for now. Hope to check back tomorrow before I leave work.

qcr 

Dear lbj,

Your faith never ceases to amaze me and as I have said before- the progress you all have made- is astounding- your dd, you, and your dh.  I do believe strongly as you say- that it will work out "the way it is supposed to". Not to mention that you are so very wise and have learned so much about communication- that if it ever got to the point of "what if" I can see you being able to "reach" your husband- with the communication tools that you have acquired and thus have helped others with so frequently on this board- not to suggest it will come to that - the "what if".  Just that taking everything into account and what you have been able to get past- I have confidence in you and your skills and your thought processes and your faith that yes- it will all work out as it is supposed to. 

      

wtsp

dear wtsp,

thank  you so much for the vote of confidence...i will do my best to stay in my Wise Mind, be validating towards my husband as he "works through" these decisions ... most likely out loud  ;p  and at the same time I have told him "if I have to go and get a job to pay for it (flights, neurofeedback therapy, individual therapy) then I have no problem with that.  with that choice will come consequence, intended and no doubt unintended that will have an affect on our business and our relationship."

i told my husband 2 years ago that as a mom "i would sell everything I have to help our daughter".  this really disturbed him...his reply "i wouldn't". he still has a difficult time with there being no guarantees from the residential treatment center that our d will come home "cured".  I understand his position...he is nearing retirement age and has worked hard all of his life for what he has...i am younger by 15 years but I have worked hard all my life too...i could live in a 2 bedroom apt. and be content if my d was well better than living on this big ranch managing our investment properties if she was not well...it is a state of mind I suppose.  once more I say I must be able to look at myself in the mirror and know I did everything I could...else I wouldn't be able to live with myself in peace.

with all the hardship you have endured and are still dealing with concerning your d I know you understand fully what I am saying here.

lbjnltx

1-18-11

Positive Peer Culture Therapy

dh not available for this session due to work

1.  rather than demand obedience, Positive Peer Culture demands_____

BPDd-13:  greatness

nale:  what is greatness?

BPDd-13:  our values of care and concern for self and others

nale:  right.  greatness is driven by our values.  give me an example of

       how your values are used here at falcon ridge.

BPDd-13: today when a peer gave me attitude I asked her not to be that

       way because it only hurts her.

nale:  ok so how will this work at home?

BPDd-13:  if we are caring and concerned for each other we will be

        honest and open in our communication.

nale:  mom how does that sound?

me:  it sounds like the basis of care and concern.  being honest and

      open will allow us all to be the best we can be and keep us in the

      positive and moving forward.

nale:  in the past, at home, how was communication?

me:  there really wasn't any.  when we were angry we were closed off

      to listening for information, feelings and needs.  we get wrapped

      up in our own thoughts and feelings and it becomes all about us

      and not the care and concern for the other person.  when we are

      practicing good listening by being patient and looking for the other

      persons' needs and validating we are keeping our focus and our

      concern on them and not ourselves.

nale:  wonderful

2. what is self government?

me:  in the general population, concerning youth, it is usually a sham.

      adults do not truly give up their power and give only innocuous

      decision making power to young people.  in Positive Peer Culture adults assign to

      young people responsibility and teach them how to fulfill that

      responsibility.

BPDd-13:  self government is making good decisions without being told.

nale:  when young people are empowered to make decisions they have

      to understand that they have the ability to handle the responsibility

3. youth must come to reject all behavior that in any way hurts self or

others.  what must they replace this hurting behavior with?

BPDd-13:  helping behaviors

me:  behavior that shows care and concern

nale: what helpful behaviors did you use at home BPDd-13?

BPDd-13:  honest communication of my feelings and I trusted my parents

       to do what was right for me.

nale: mom what helpful behaviors did you use during the home visit?

me:  I used good listening skills and was patient.  I validated and was

      honest without judgement to provide a safe place for BPDd-13 to be

      open and honest.

nale:  safety is a key component.  BPDd-13, what does safety provide for

      you?

BPDd-13:  well, it lowers my anxiety and helps me stay in the here and

       now so that my emotions don't get out of control.

4. what type of climate can Positive Peer Culture only exist in?

me:  a climate of mutual concern for self and others.  I think it must be

    a climate of non judgement.  feelings are not right or wrong good or

    bad they just are and each of us have a right to them without being

    labeled.

nale:  BPDd-13 what do you think of what mom said?

BPDd-13:  I think that is what we all strive towards.  none of us are able

    to use care and concern all the time but we strive to.  I like what my

    mom said.

nale:  what causes us to not have care and concern?mom

me:  having a victim mentality and focusing on our own feelings.

BPDd-13:  I try to remember and recognize that they are having their own

    problems and focus on myself so that I don't personalize.

nale:  it can be hard to not personalize.  what causes you to do that?

BPDd-13:  being close to a person.  really caring a lot about them.

nale:  can you be hurt without your permission?

BPDd-13: no

nale:  what do you think about what BPDd-13 said.

me: I agree with her.  it is very difficult to not react emotionally to an

     emotionally charged person especially when you love them dearly.

     for me, staying in touch with my compassion really helps me to put

     the focus on them without owning their feelings or behaviors.

nale:  so setting some personal boundaries for what we will own is

     a way to not become enmeshed.

5. what do young males consider positive, helping behavior as?

BPDd-13:  what makes them happy.

nale:  mom, what did you put for your answer?

me:  I wrote "feminine", it is something that girls do.

nale:  some men consider it to be weak to be concerned, caring, and

      helpful. ok lets move onto values or rules.

6. do you have set rules in Positive Peer Culture?  is so, wjhy? if not, why?

BPDd-13:  I didn't know how to answer this question really.

nale: mom, did you have an answer?

me:  I wrote down; no.  young people need to develop wisdom and

      the ability to make independent judgements based on their values.

      they can make better judgements if they ask themselves 'is this

      helping or hurting".

nale:  the rules that are there fluctuate depending on the individual

      circumstance.

BPDd-13: oh, so they are more like guidelines.

nale: yes.  if our values are strong they are based on helping not on

      hurting.

7.  does Positive Peer Culture teach you to make sound decisions even in the absence of

specific guidelines? why or why not?

BPDd-13: yes. we are given choices and those choices will have natural

      consequences.

me:  I wrote yes too.  sometimes there are no guidelines to use when

      a decision must be made.  in the absence of guidelines our values

      of being helpful and not hurtful will guide us to the right decision.

      sometimes there is no clear right or wrong...sometimes it is a

      judgement call.  like the story of robin hood...it is ambiguous.

      stealing from the rich is wrong...giving to the poor is good.  how

      do you reach a decision based on the information you have?

nale:  how would you reach a decision BPDd-13?

BPDd-13:  I would ask myself how I could give to the poor without taking

       from the rich.

nale: awesome.  mom what do you think about her answer?

me:  it meets all the criteria for helping and not hurting.  she would

       rather give a little honestly than give a great deal dishonestly.

nale: ok, biblical application here.  do you know the story of the

       widow's might?

BPDd-13:  i'm not sure.  if you start to tell it I will remember.

nale:  ok. so the rich people in the temple were all bragging about how

       much they gave to the temple and comparing themselves to each-

       other.  then in comes the very poor widow who had only a few

       coins. she gave all that she had.  her gift was much more valuable

       than all the donations from the rich because she truly understood

       what it was all about.

8. what does "caring" mean?

me:  I want what is best for you.

BPDd-13: I have your best interest at heart.

nale:  BPDd-13, do you understand why you are here at falcon ridge?

BPDd-13:  yes. because of the poor decisions I was making and I had no

      boundaries.

nale: that is a behavior you used to have.  why did  your parents bring

      you here?  was it because they have a great deal of love for you?

BPDd-13: yeah

nale: do you understand how much your family loves you and how do

      you see your family differently than before.

BPDd-13:  yeah.

nale: what does that look like?

BPDd-13:  well we talked about this in family therapy...when I was

       wondering if I loved my family as much as I should. lorneta told

      me that my feelings and beliefs about my family met all the

      requirements of how I define love.

nale:  how do you feel hearing that from BPDd-13?

me:  it feels really awesome.  that she can contemplate and work

       through such a philosophical question that many mature adults

      never even try to shows her deep thinking and honest reflection.

      her level of maturity is amazing.

nale:  how does that feel for you BPDd-13 to hear mom's answer?

BPDd-13:  it feels good to be validated.  I know I won't always get that

      every time from everyone so I am getting good at validating   

      myself.

nale:  so are  you getting pretty good at self validation?

BPDd-13: i'm working on it.

read each quote and write whether it is helping or hurting.  if the quote

is hurting, rewrite the comment to be helping.

9.  "you're really smart; I bet you could finish all your work today."

BPDd-13:  that is helping

me:  I agree.  I wrote that it is encouraging and positive/

10. "why do you act so dumb?"

BPDd-13: that is hurting.  I wrote "i think you can do better"

nale: what did you write mom?

me: I rewrote the question "why are you reluctant to show how

      intelligent you are?"

nale:  in our haste to respond sometimes our statements come out

      how BPDd-13?

BPDd-13: jumbled up and mean.

nale:  why is that you think mom?

me:  because we don't listen for the need or feeling and we don't stop

      and think first.

BPDd-13:  yeah. we get caught up in our own ideas and emotions.

me: that is when it becomes about us and not them.  no good

      communication can take place at that point.

BPDd-13:  I used to work off of my emotions.  when I was angry I would

      be rude and even threaten my mom.  when I was happy I would be

      nice.

nale:  what have you learned to control your emotions?

BPDd-13:  sometimes it is ok ... well, really all the time it is ok to be

      angry if that is your true emotion.  how you handle it is what is

      important.  it cannot be hurtful to others.  it is important to be

      honest about your emotions.

me: when someone is expressing their emotions honestly and not

      being hurtful it is much easier to validate and be compassionate.

      then we can be patient and give them their space if they ask for it.

      if they are not being honest and they are being hurtful and will not

      listen to validation it is important to take care of and protect

      yourself.  taking care of self is paramount to helping someone else.

      if you don't take care of self you can't take care of anyone else.

nale:  you hit the nail right on the head there!  BPDd-13 do you agree

      with what mom said?

BPDd-13: yes.

nale:  good. ok next time we will do chapters 4 and 5. anything else

      today mom?

me: I would like BPDd-13 to know that I have started praying for the Lord

      to send to us the adult leadership we will need to start the Positive Peer Culture

      program here at home.  I would ask you to pray for that as well

      nale and BPDd-13.

BPDd-13:  thank you so much mom. I will pray too.

nale: I will as well and will be able to help you out in some ways as

      well.

end of session.

thanks for reading...i hope it helps you and in turn  your family in some small way.  

lbjnltx

   

 |iiii     Thank you so much for taking the time to type all these sessions in for us - it's so helpful in my situation with dd25.  And I can identify with your situation with husband also - my husband really wants to help and to see our daughter well too, but somehow they seem to be a bit less able to give all don't they?  I suppose it's the way a man looks at the practicalities  ?

Thanks for your example - your commitment is inspiring.

thanks for reading oglobaith!

:)

I wish I knew how to quote.  I think that I did it once.  Anyways, LBJ, thank you so much for all of your posts.  The one part that I saw myself in was feeling sorry for myself and being the victim.  In all of the complaining that I do about my dd, I truly do love her.  Sometimes, I hear myself talk and you would think that I can't stand her.  These days, I really don't like her.  However, I raised and loved her since she was an infant.  I love her.  And, I recognize now that it does come all about us at times.  I am just so furious with all that she does.  I ralize that I need to work on more validations skills.

I am improving with the boundary setting.  However, my T pointed out to me today, that I did not praise my dd when she had a positive behavior that surprised me.  I should have thanked my dd for being understanding.  Oh well, I will do better next time. 

It really helps to learn from others, and you provide so much help with your posts.  I know that I have a long way to go.  But, with the help of this board and my T, I believe that I will achieve my goal. 

I will pray for the success in starting the Positive Peer Culture. God Bless you for doing that.  Your dd sounds like she is progressing so nicely.   

peaceplease

I do fully understand what you are saying, Dearest lbj.           

Your dd has made incredible progress and now has a great shot at being in a way better place and this is not the time to stop or interfere with the process.  I know you won't allow anything to get in way. 

You are a wonderful, caring, loving mother who has learned a great deal and has put it all to good use and you are getting wonderful results.  You have put in great great deal of effort to help your dd- and we all on this board- because of your generosity- the way you have shared it all with us- we are all witnessing the process and progress as it happens.  The gray skies have parted and you are seeing lots of light.  We are all seeing the light too- being a part of your and your dd's process and progress.

So yes- with all that I have endured and who I am as a mother- I do understand fully.

     

wtsp

 

lbjlntx - As always, thank you for sharing the details of this process with us. This is such a concrete way to share these principles for me to evaluate with my own process with Dd24, Gd5 and my dh.

The quoted question is the one that really stays with me from this session. This is about that delicate balance between taking care of myself - without guilt - and taking care of others I love - without becoming enmeshed and taking over their lives. It is truly a learned skill to become AWARE of my responses when the other person is just not in a place to hear or accept any validation from me. And it also works the other way - for me to become AWARE of when I am not in a place to listen to the other's feelings and needs. And I am finding with everyone in my family that there is a time to step back, take time out to find my quiet center and allow them to do the same. Then we can come back together with our focus on kindness and respect.


The other aspect of this session that caught my mind was how well it was linked back to the home visit. The focus on keeping the progress made at residential treatment center functioning when d14 comes home is impressive, and this is the key to making this evolve into a way of "being", not just "doing" for your whole family. It takes effort on everyone's part to keep things moving in a positive direction after graduation.

A comment from an earlier post here - be cautious about moving too quickly to reduce d14 meds, even with the addition of neurofeedback therapy. I know it is hard to think of our children needing meds. over the longer term, but she may need this neurochemical support to maintain the high level of functioning you are seeing. I always stop and think - if my DD had diabetes or heart disease and diet/excercise/lifestye choices were just not enough taking meds. to support health would be OK. This same principle applies to our brain chemistry. I have seen my DD make some progress while consistently taking her meds. only to lose it all when she feels better and stops. I have experienced this myself many times over the past 20 years with my own mental and medical health issues. If it is working, stop trying to fix it.


So glad my laptop could be resurrected one more time as I cannot afford a new one! I so missed coming here this week.

qcr  |iiii  

greetings all,

thank you qcarol for  your concern about my BPDd-13 and the possibility of a meds reduction or discontinuation in the future.  it is not a decision that will be made lightly...!  she struggles so much with being tired from the meds...hoping that if we make permanent corrections through neurofeedback therapy we can reduce or eliminate some or all meds and particularly not have to add any...for the add.  

lbjnltx

ps:  so glad your laptop has at least one more life left in it...it has been pretty quiet around here without your  voice and leadership!

1-20-11

Family Therapy Session #28

Discussing Chapter 1 "I Don't Have To Make Everything All Better"

t:  BPDd-13, tell  us how you define validation

BPDd-13: understand what the other person to the best of your ability

     and let them know that you do.

t:  good.  I like that definition.  dad, tell us what  you got out of the

     chapter.

dh: when someone comes to you with a problem if you will listen to

     how they feel their emotions will lessen and they can better work

     out the problem.

t:  BPDd-13, what do you think about what dad said?

BPDd-13:  that's good.  I still am working on self validation, giving myself

     internal validation.

dh: in the past when you wanted to go riding in the back pasture and i

     didn't think it was safe that day I would just say "no.  it's too windy

     or something like that" now I know to ask a validating question and

     try to understand the "why" of where you are coming from.

t:  if dad is validating you and you are validating him right back you

    will be able to work it out.  dad's concern is for your safety, physical

     emotional, and spiritual.

dh:  if I walked in the room and BPDd-13 was on the internet and I asked

      her what site she was on and what she was doing it would be

      because I am unsure that she is safe.  she could show me and we

      could then discuss the safety of it.  if I checked it and found it was

      ok and she was using the info to her benefit then I would tell her

      "thank you for showing me. I feel better about it" and then I would

      leave.

t:   validation in that situation can help reach a solution.  mom, what

      did you get out of chapter 1?

me: I understood how using positive mental attitude statements and

      non validating responses can shut down communication.  when we

      validate we keep the lines of communication open and information

      and feelings continue to flow back and forth.

t:  so if mom has a bad day and seems preoccupied...not noticing that

     you have your hair done really cute, what could you do BPDd-13?

BPDd-13: I could ask her "what's wrong?"

t:  yes. then the lines of communication will open up.  mom will have

     your attention and you will have hers.  then she will notice how

     your hair looks and say "your hair looks so cute today".  open lines

     of communication benefit everyone.

me:  I also learned that listening without labeling or making value

     judgements keeps the focus on the speaker and not the "listener".

     when we make judgements or put labels on that takes our attention

     off the speaker and puts it on ourselves thereby closing the lines of

     communication.

t:  that is right. we must listen to understand and listening for feelings

     and needs.  parents are most worried about safety. they need to be

    heard and understood too.

BPDd-13:  so if I validate them after they validate me then everyone's'

     needs are met.

t:  correct. everything we do all day  every day is to get a need met. a

     family helps each other meet those needs.  if we can hear and

     understand.  it takes time, don't be in a hurry.  really in the end it

     saves time because it is a problem solving skill.  non validation can

     result in huge fights and issues have to be re visited over and over.

     it takes practice.  if discussion get heated it's because someone

     doesn't understand.  that can be frustrating for the speaker.  just

     like yesterday, you were getting frustrated with me because I didn't

     understand the feeling you were trying to express.  what did I say?

BPDd-13:  "keep going".

t:  right, and eventually i  understood and we were able to have open

     communication.  if your parents don't get it, be patient and talk

    about it until they can understand.  sometimes you have trouble

    expressing a feeling so you will need to work until everyone does

    understand.

me:  the part of the book that talks about walking emotionally with

    another person as far down as they need to go will help them be

    able to bring themselves back up is really interesting to me.

t:  this takes a great deal  of patience and time and it works well if you

    are able to do it.  anything else to discuss today?

dh:  I would like to discuss the issue of having boyfriends.  is that

    something we can talk about today or do we need to wait until

    another time?

t:  I think BPDd-13 is ready and open to listening.  she has completed the

    "safe dating" class.

dh:  well, in the past there were some boys that were ok and some that

     were not because we were not comfortable with them.  we tried to

     explain to BPDd-13 why we did not want her to spend time with this

     one boy she would say "but I love him".  can you help us come

     together on this?

t:  well first lets get a definition of what dating is so that we all are

    speaking  the same language.  BPDd-13's talking about hanging out.

    how old do you think you should be to go on a one on one unchap-

    eroned date?

BPDd-13:  16.

t:  ok, if a boy is rude to your parents that is a big warning sign that he

    won't treat you well.  sometimes we look more at who someone is

    and not how someone is.  if you are doing that, what state of mind

    are you in?

BPDd-13:  emotional.

t: if dad says "i'm concerned about your safety" it is because he wants

    you to be treated well.  he might say "i would rather  you didn't date

    him."  what would you do if dad said that?

BPDd-13:  I would give it some thought.

dh:  so now, after learning all that you have, would you date that boy?

BPDd-13:  no, he doesn't have or respect boundaries.

dh:  didn't mom tell you that at the time?

BPDd-13:  yeah but I didn't want to listen then.

t:  so lets get a clear picture of the boundaries we are setting ok.

    BPDd-13, you say you are not old enough for "dating" but you do want

    to be able to hang out with a boy you like and that likes  you back

    as long as it is in a public place or with a group of friends and there

    are adults around. is that right?

BPDd-13:  yeah.

t:  mom, can you agree with this?

me: I can only agree to this is I see that BPDd-13 is having and protecting

     healthy boundaries and is consistently Wise Minded.  if she isn't,

     then activities like that will have to wait until she is.

t:  ok.  boy can be cunning and manipulative sometimes.  are there

     boys you wouldn't see anymore?

BPDd-13:  yeah. "C" because he hurt me.  I hate him.

t:  people give us warning signs about how they will treat us.  if a boy

    is rude to his parents eventually they will be rude to  you as well.

BPDd-13:  mom, would you be ok with me having a few friends over so

    you could get to know them first and then later letting me go hang

    out with them?

me:  if I felt good about your choices of friends, that they were a good

   influence on you then I would be ok with that.  it would need to be

   done on a case by case basis though.

t:  when you are trustworthy your privileges will increase.  if you have

   been making bad decisions it won't matter who you are with or

   where you are wanting to go.  you will not have earned that privilege

   well I think you all worked this out very well.  I remember the last

   time we discussed dating and boys...i think you put your fingers in

   your ears and we had to table it.  just remember to keep talking and

   validate each other and it will work out.  BPDd-13 is in a much better

   place since the last time we tried to discuss this.  it will be harder

   when there is a real person involved in these scenarios.

me:  BPDd-13, what can I do to help your friends feel comfortable in our

   home?  you told me that "none of my friends like you, they think you

   are a b!ch".  I have had what I believe to be healthy boundaries for

   myself, my family and my home and have asked for those to be

   respected.  (i already know the answer to this question. she lied to

   her friends)

BPDd-13:  they didn't like you because I told them how much I didn't like

   you and I made a bunch of stuff up that wasn't true.

t:  thank you for being honest today.

me:  keep up the good work sweety.  work hard!  I want to be able to

    get emails from you again soon!

BPDd-13:  ok, i'm trying to get into trans.  love you dad, love you mom.

   bye.

us:  by sweety love you too!

end of session.

lbj - you have all learned so much. The maturity in this session is so great.  |iiii  you all are working very hard for the success of your family.

Keeping you all in my thoughts and prayers.

qcr

lbj,

Again,  |iiii . I really look forward to reading about the journey of your dd at residential treatment center. Keeping you in my thoughts and prayers.  

peaceplease

lbj,

Hi!

your doing an outstanding job in trying to resolve your family issues.  Stay strong and be persistant and it will pay off.  I, myself, have been working very hard and it seems to be paying off a little at a time.  At any rate, a little step in the right direction is all that I ask.  Each day that passes I put a mental check mark on my mental calandar.  I have many checkmarks thus far and hoping for much more. 

I am relatively new to this but I have found many words of encouragement on this site.  Keep your chin up and keep plugging away.  Better days are ahead of you.

|iiii

EJ

Family Therapy session #29

BPDd-13 started the session by telling me that she was pulled out of dance therapy for our therapist session...she said she was having so much fun with all the other girls doing swing dancing/jitterbug.  she also told me that yesterday she was helping a peer get her horse from the pasture and all the mares made a mad dash for the gate and got out.  she and her peer were able to get them all back in.  one girl was trying to help lure them in with a bucket of feed...(not a good idea!) and had to run for it when the horses made a b line for her...she poured out the feed on the grain but didn't drop the bucket...another peer that was watching from outside the fence laughed so hard she wet her pants.   lol  BPDd-13 also helped unload 1400 lbs of hay and cleaned the stalls.  she was so proud of herself and excited that the equine staff has a special treat planned for her as a reward for all of her hard work.

mind you...this is the same child who pulled a gun on my horse just last year when she couldn't catch him to put back in his pasture!  she has come a long way baby!

the t, lorneta wanted to talk about her amazing accomplishment with little doc last week...getting him to lay down.

t:  what did you learn from getting him to lay down?

BPDd-13:  that I have to have strong relationships to get something out

    them...like trust and respect.

t:  how does that translate to your relationship w/mom and dad?

BPDd-13:  when horses lay down they are at their most vulnerable.  when

    I am at my most vulnerable is when I don't want to talk about some-

    thing they bring up.  that is when I need to trust them the most.

t:  how can your parents now you are vulnerable?

BPDd-13:  I need to tell them how  I feel. 

t:  what feelings might you be having when you are vulnerable?

BPDd-13:  scared or unsure of myself or maybe sad.

t: if you feel scared that can turn to anger.  they may be able to help

   you through it. if you don't express your true feelings, you may get

   angry and then all you are doing as a family is yelling and not deal-

   ing with the fear.  sometimes we don't want people to see inside of

   us.  that is when we are the most vulnerable.  mom, what can you do

   to help her during vulnerable times?

me: we could ask her how she is feeling.  and then ask her if she is

   able to trust us to help her through this.  we can refer to the coping 

   skills list that she made.  first listen without interruption, we can

   validate, ask validating questions and if she needs to we can

   use coping skills like taking deep breathes, take self time, remind her

   the situation is temporary, and if need be, table the issue until self

   time is over. I was wondering if we might add a phrase to the list.     

   I know this phrase has a lot of meaning for BPDd-13.  "is this helping

   or hurting?"

BPDd-13:  yeah. I like that because then I could let you know if you were

   not meeting my need at that time and you could try something else.

t: just keep communicating until everyone is satisfied.

me:  she told me to "give her a hug even if she says she

   doesn't want one.  i'm not sure about that though.  if she is angry i

   don't want to violate her boundaries and force her to let me hug her.

   I think it would only make things worse if I did.

BPDd-13:  yeah.  it would be better if  you asked me if I wanted a hug or

   reminded me that I was the one that suggested the hug as a coping

   skill.

t: great.  I think it is important that kids not be forced to have physical

   contact with another person.  they need to have a voice in that and to

   have their boundaries respected.  something happened in group wed.

   you were belittling yourself saying "no body likes me".  why do you

   think you want to take away the love others have for you?  what do

   you need at that time and why do  you want to punish yourself?

BPDd-13:  I need care and concern.  I know I am not in my Wise Mind

   when I do that. 

t: when you did this at home, saying "you don't love me" what can

   mom or dad do to help you get into your Wise Mind?

BPDd-13:  tell me "i know you need care and concern".  I used to ask my

   mom "why do you hate me?"

me:  I would try to validate by saying "it  must be painful for you to

   feel that way" and I had established some boundaries because I did

   not appreciate her telling me how I feel.  if I tried to reassure her that

   I loved her it would end up in an argument or  debate.  I would end

   up saying "please don't tell me how I feel.  I am capable of expressing

   myself".

t:  so mom needs validating too sometimes.  lets look at chapter 2 of

   "i don't have to make everything all better".  mom, what did you take

    out of chapter 2.

me:  that we need to leave the responsibility of solving problems where

    it belongs...with the person who has the problem.

t:  you have to work through the consequences sometimes BPDd-13. mom

    and dad will work with you and help you all they can but it is up to

    you to make personal choices sometimes and if you don't choose

    wisely then there may be hard consequences.  will you always make

    good choices all your life?

BPDd-13:  no.

t:  mom and dad are not going to rescue you.  they will support you,

    not rescue you.  you need to learn problem solving skills.  dad, how

    about you, anything you would like to add?

dh:  when she has a problem we will give her some ideas, alternatives,

   and possible solutions so she can make a choice and solve her own

   problems.  she can come to us for ideas.  we will listen to her and

   allow her to choose which avenue she wants to take.

t:  if mom and dad don't rescue you who will learn from the conse-

    quences?  melt downs won't work anymore..in an attempt to have

    some peace in the home they may have made some choices for you

    or allowed you to do some things that were against their better

    judgement.  you have done a lot of work on yourself sense then so

   you need to take responsibility.  anything else from chapter 2?

me:  I learned that we need to not offer advice or ideas unless asked.

    when offering ideas we are not to forget that it is their choice to

    use the idea or not.  we are not to use words like "should" and

    "ought" when presenting ideas because then we are telling them

    what to do and not letting them make their own choice.

t:  yes.  never tell a teenager what they already know...like "you should

   have done such and such..."  that only puts shame on them.  it would

   be better to ask them "what did you learn from this?"  do not make

   judgements.

me: I know I already feel bad enough without someone else judging my

   mistake too.

BPDd-13:  I could say "i know I should have..." so that they will know I

   have thought about what I could have done differently.

t:  you have come so far individually and as a family.  I don't think you

   will have those melt downs anymore, you just won't need to.

BPDd-13:  I don't think I will either.

t:  well, she is smiling so we will end this in a happy place.

BPDd-13:  bye mom, bye dad, love you...see you later.

me,dh:  love you too take care.

end of session

Great.  |iiii   Keep letting us know how you're all doing, the info is so helpful.

God bless

lbj - I can put myself and my family into these sessions more and more and wonder how my DD would react to the questions. I know how we each have been in the past, and though change is slow in coming sharing in your journey has helped me to keep my focus so much. Thanks so much for opening yourlife to us all.

qcr     :)

 I've just finished reading though you posts again about your dd's therapy and your conversations with her and the T and I'm just trying to sort out the differences between the way you relate to your dd and the way that I relate to mine.  I know I've had this overpowering urge to try and teach my dd but now I realize that by doing that, I've invalidated her.

I also realize now that I have to learn how to quiet my mind and stop talking and just listen to her and try to understand how she is feeling and not tell her how I am feeling.  This, I can see is going to be a very difficult lesson for me to learn because part of my reaction to my dd in the past has been that I've felt responsible to help her in that way. 

I would like to know if you did that before too with your dd and if you did, how did you learn to really hear her and not listen to your own responses? I can see the difference it makes to have a T because for those of us going it alone even without diagnoses, the responsibility feels like an unending, thankless burden to be all things to my dd.  I just want to love her like a normal mother of a 40year old and leave the rest for someone(professionals) else.  I wonder what a person like me could do  whose adult child is not in therapy and if there's a difference in the way we need to relate that will better help them like pick up the slack/work that a T would be otherwise doing or if it would even do any good trying.

Even though I have the best intentions, I admit, she will go right out and do the opposite to prove me wrong or assert her own power. I feel really awful because I think now her last marriage was to prove everyone wrong because all the family had issues with her fiance, even her children and now she had to go through all that just because we weren't able to listen to and understand her. Maybe it will be easier for me to stop 'helping' now that I realize the damage my own behavior is doing to my dd, I sure hope so.

Your journey with your dd is inspiring and I thank you for sharing it with us. Your therapy session with your dd and husband is much needed therapy for us too.

justhere

thank you for reading justhere.

and yes ... I made all the same mistakes as you have..i would try to use reason and logic to communicate w/her during a crisis...that eventually would end w/BPD making threats against me or herself and back to the sheriff's department we would go...a vicious cycle...while the boundaries were empowering...the invalidation was damaging.


when I read the book "i don't have to make everything all better" by gary and joy lundberg. 

i realized I had all the pieces to the puzzle...i just didn't know how to put it together and this book showed me how, and more importantly it showed me WHY I needed to and who it would benefit...EVERYONE!


the book will teach you when and how to offer your help...it can show you the subtle distinction between validating questions that will lead them to problem solve versus giving advice.


i have heard from other moms on this board that the book has helped w/communication w/everyone in their lives...even the pwBPD. 

when I understood, accepted, practiced and consistently applied the techniques in the book it gave me freedom from the fog...fear (masquerading as anger), obligation (to fix it for her), and guilt (that I wasn't being a good parent if I didn't fix it for her).

justhere, you are an intelligent thought provoking woman with a kind and compassionate soul...i pray that you will own this and live like the person you really are.  free.



lbjnltx

After reading what you posted about how in the past, when you and your dd talked it ended up at the sheriff's dept, I realized that it wasn't good for me and my dd's either but it's been over 3 years now since the last time my dd screamed/raged at me and years since I've felt physically threatened so I have been learning how to keep it calm.

I'm on my second read through of "I don't have to make everything all better" and it's all starting to make sense. What a power house of valuable and important information for anyone and any relationship!

Validation is working for me when I talk to my mother and I'm trying it also with my dd's but it still feels uncomfortable even a little fake at times because I'm just aching to tell them how I really feel.

I've been changing my way of thinking though to instead of looking at it like I'm lying to them by not telling them the truth about how I feel, I'm trying to look at it more like yes, maybe I would of done things differently or have the skills to solve this problem or I think a certain way but it's not a lie to keep that to myself.  It's a 'courtesy' or an 'opportunity' that I'm offering to them so that they can learn and find their own way, 'just like I did.' Knowing that I'm finding my own way out is very empowering to me and I want my dd's to know this kind of strength of person too.

I really like what you said in session 29..."is this helping or hurting?" because do we really know how they are feeling and all the unseen or hidden memories that they are dealing with that are contributing to their distress? I hope I can remember to ask this question when I talk to my dd's and hear and accept their answer.

We think we are helping them saving them a step and energy if we give them advice or the knowledge of what we have learned but in reality we are making them work even harder, first to explain and defend their own truth to us and then to sort through all the confusion of someone else's truth and experiences.

An easy way for me to understand this is to look at how my own BPDmother behaves and how it affects me because her behavior is so exaggerated. She has to 'fix' everything, 'order' me to do things, 'keep tabs' on my every move, 'expect' me to do what she wants not what I want or need. I may not be behave in the same intensity as my mother but she has modeled and taught me her form of parenting and I still relate to others with some form of my mothers teaching.  All her interference makes me feel terrible, smothered and like a inadequate child so I don't want to be the source of any more pain and heartache to my dd by following in my mothers footsteps.  I know we are on the right path because at no time in my 62 years of life have I sensed this kind of harmony and wholeness. Thank you for being here.

justhere

had a long talk with BPDd-13's individual therapist at the residential treatment center last nite.

she said my d is doing amazingly well in school right now, having turned in 6 past assignments last week.  they have lost their math teacher as of monday so the special ed teacher is filling in.  she said my d responds well to this special ed teacher so perhaps that will help  my d continue to work hard and get caught up.  BPDd-13 still has to finish reading "anatomy of peace" as it is a requirement to get into the transitional unit.  BPDd-13 told me she has trouble reading this book because it is "so boring" she can't get motivated to stick with it.

we discussed the statement the therapist made in an email about my d being "easily mislead".  she was referring to the incident at Christmas where her friend told her the staff had ok'd the off campus visit between our families.  i told the therapist that I had some responsibility in that situation because I didn't have the knowledge that it wasn't ok and didn't think to ask.  t told me that it was ok because no one had told me like they should have.  the chaos of the evacuation only added to the lack of communication...the problem is that BPD's peer was told "no, we don't want you to spend time w/peers off campus.  we want you to spend time with your family alone."  t then told me that my d has confronted her peer and expressed her disappointment that she lied to her and that in Positive Peer Culture this week when this same peer was talking about herself that my d asked the group "does anyone believe what she is saying right now?".  the therapist asked my d if they were still friends after this and my d told her "yes.  they are."  t said "this is a good lesson for my d because it shows her it is ok to have boundaries and they will only strengthen a relationship...my d has been taught this same lesson through her equine therapy but still struggles with applying it to her human relationships.

we then began a discussion about transitioning home and what to do about her educational options.  t once more voiced that it would be best to home school her for the remainder of the school year here so that we can focus on neurofeedback therapy appointments and the whole transition home.  i expressed my concern over putting her back into a public school situation and setting her up for difficulties due to her add symptoms.  i would like to try to avoid the iep and meds for add through neurofeedback...it is worth trying.

t also said that d is already having mixed feelings about leaving the residential treatment center.  she said BPDd-13 told her "i really love my family and want to be with them but i'm going to be so sad and miss everyone here." therapist told me that my d was being very genuine and heartfelt with this statement and for the first time the therapist was convinced that my d truly believes that she loves us.

i asked her to get into contact with my d's therapist here at home soon so that

he could have time to brush up on his dbt skills and get acquainted w/the Positive Peer Culture process if necessary.  she encouraged me to continue to find ways to get the Positive Peer Culture group started here to help my d with the transition home.  she believes that it will have a great deal of influence on my d's future progress if we can get the Positive Peer Culture group started.

we discussed the option of having my d return to falcon ridge should it be needed and also the option of having her come back from time to time for a brief visit (1 week-1 month) to reinforce all that she has learned.  the therapist said she would see about putting this in the after care plan for my d.

thanks for reading

lbjnltx

dear justhere,



yes!  it is a gift...giving them the opportunity to feel that "my feelings matter" and "someone really cares about me".   how will they ever learn problem solving skills if they don't get the opportunity to practice. validating environments can give them a safe place to do this...a place w/care and concern, a place where they won't be judged for their feelings or thoughts...i once read in the Total Transformation that the anger and frustration adolescents and even adults feel, often comes from a lack of problem solving skills.  ;p


AWESOME!  SO HAPPY FOR YOU!  (wish we still had the cheerleader icon!  guess this will have to do for now.)  |iiii  :)

lbjnltx

lbj - sounds like a really fruitful phone consult with the t. The after care plan is such a key piece. I keep praying for the Positive Peer Culture part to evolve for you at home - would be great if this could even somehow transition into a supportive part of returning to school next fall.

How do you feel about the home schooling option? This is a big commitment on your part too. What kinds of supports will be there for you in transistion from the home school to another schooling option?

So happy for you all that d14 continues to make such good progress - to be able to express her emotions about wanting to come home and missing those at the residential treatment center - this sounds like an important part of the transistion home process as well.

I will keep on praying for you all.

qcr