BPDFamily.com

I can't believe I did it.

Avoiding her like the plague.

Her arrested, RO, the works.

I was arrested once because her hysterical behavior was misinterpreted by a security guard as me harming her, when I was only trying to get away.

We both told the cops that, but $1000 bail later for charges were never filed

I was free. We broke up no less than 10 times, and got back together.

We dated for a year and half and lived together for nearly 2 years.

Now, for a year and a half, every time I saw her I went the other way. I painted her black as did she to me. I burned every bridge to her, so I would never ever go back. EVER!

I've seen her with a million different guys,

we've even been at the same events and places, and I

just didn't talk to her.

But she came up to me on NYE, and I said "Hi, happy new years!" the 1st words I'd spoken to her in 1.5 years. I'd tried to imagine what might happen if I ever tried to talk to me, I assumed she hated me.

After all I'd had her arrested for flipping out on me in a mens room,  and slapped her with an RO, and she was kicked out of our house.

The words just flew out her mouth.

"I love you, I've never stopped loving you, all I've ever wanted is you,

do you still care for me?"

I said no, how could you love me? I hate you, and we can never be together. I was lying and she knew it.

But as she moved in closer, I smelled her, her perfume, her scent,

like heroin to a drug addict.

I have missed her, and because of that I know she is not the only one

who has issues. She's a beautiful woman, though being 10 years my senior.

I told he it could never be, we are no good together, we can't no no no no... .  

she wrapped her arms around me and kissed me, I kissed her back, and told her again, this is wrong, we've told every one we hate each other, we'll both lose every friend we've ever had.

She said, I don't care, I want you back.

I said, yes, but you've dated so many guys, wealthy men,

I have nothing, I'm not working, I have no money and

can't afford anything. No, please we can't do this.

She says, I don't care, I love you... .  I want you.

Take me home with you.

I crumbled. My years of trying to be an A-hole facade melted,

I walked out of the room in a daze, as she called a cab.

Someone asked me, whats going on? You have a funny look on your face?

No! OMG! You and (Name)?

I didn't even say a word. It was all over my face, My shame, my failure to be strong.

The rest you have to leave to your imagination.

We've barely been out of the bedroom except to eat as we've consumed each other. I missed her so bad.

I feel like I am Frodo, and she is the ring.

Cast in the fires of Mordor, I try to throw her back, and for 1 and half years we didn't speak ONE WORD to each other, and in the matter of 2 minutes, it was all out the window. It took an RO just for me to escape from her.

She dated 100 men since then, and lives a life of ease on other people's money, just so they can be with her even without sex.

She's so sexy and beautiful.

Her big blue eyes, perfect body and blond hair... .  

She's not in good shape financially, still no job, no money, and living off the generosity of older wealthy men, who let her live in their houses spend time with them, just to look at her.

I can't have her living with me.

I just wrote her a letter, telling her, she has to try to be happy with less than she wants or it won't last.

I could barely get her to leave today.

She's driving around in another guy's car, living in another guy's house who is a friend. If she continues staying here, he might toss her to the curb, and I know she'll expect to move into my measly one bedroom apt.

Aint gonna happen.

I got a DUI and now I'm on probation.

One outburst from her that results in the cops being involved will land me in jail, and I don't have the money for bail.

I'll lose everything, my home, my possessions while I rot in jail waiting for a trial.

She's surrounded by wealthy men, who shower her with expensive dinners and trips, and she still only wants me. The major object right?

So here I am sending her an email, yet again trying to reason with an unreasonable person. Oh... .  god.

My soul burns for her, the last 4 days have been like a dream.

I did miss her, I could never stop thinking about her, but knowing that only makes me as sick as her.

I know this can't have a good ending.

What do I do?

She is like a drug to me. I cannot resist her. But I must. Right?

good luck in jail man... .  i can just picture it perfectly with the wa our justice system works... .  she wrongs you... you lose your cool... she screams wolf... .  seeya bunny rabbit youre goin to jail for nothing at all... .  you rot while she moves on with no worries or thoughts to the next hugh hefner mansion... .  my suggestion? Cut her off! Good chance shes still sleeping with every other guy she "always loved" too... .  although my exBPD wasnt like this... i do know a girl very similar to this that ive known for a decade and although id love to be with this girl... shes so sick and twisted i think she believes her own lies in her ficticious world... .  set your boundaries and remain firm... as soon as she crosses the border send her butt packing!

OMG, yes, you do need to resist her, somehow. I really fear how this is going to end up for you. I think you do too?

I know how it is, being drawn to someone like a moth to a flame. I've done it before, knowing it was my own undoing. I did it with a past gf, who was absolutely crazy and evil, and who would have liked nothing more than to destroy my life (not the ex). I look back on that time now and breathe a huge sigh of relief that I managed to come out of it, without my life being ruined. It could have happened so easily. From where I sit now, I see that it would have not been worth it. I like my life, I like where I am, and I am grateful for what I have. I'm glad I didn't throw it away back then, for her. It's been years.

Try to imagine yourself happy five years from now, in a life you don't have yet, doing things you can only imagine right now, and going about existence in a different way. Imagine how you might look back on this moment in your life now, with her back in the picture, and possibly undoing all possibility for you in the future. It's not worth it. She's not worth it. It's like a drug addiction, and you somehow need to find a way to get out. That is all I can say, having read what you yourself wrote.

"My precious"... .  

:'(

I know I only in for more pain... .  god give me the strength.

She's already saying she wants to live with me.

I had to move heaven and earth to escape her.

I am a very very sick boy and I am ashamed of myself.

I know we are in the Honeymoon phase.

I do have to say it's wonderful. I guess I did say it best.

Heroin to an addict.  She says it means we really love each other.

I know better. I put up with the pain, because when things we good, they

were the best I'd ever known. Until it went to like 80% pain 20% pleasure.

And I didn't know about BPD then, and I do now.

She turns me on like no other woman.

My soul burns for her. Hopefully not in the hell of the county jail.

Can I cut it off before things turn bad?

She's never taken no for an answer, hence the RO.

Tume in next time... .  

Coming up on the 10 oclock news... .  

film at 11.

She's coming back tonight.

No stopping her now that she knows where I live.

She's positively relentless.

I tried so hard to be strong... .  it wasn't enough.

I needed to try harder. But 1.5 years, I thought, enough time had passed to simply say hello for gods sake.

The thing that blows my mind is HOW in the hell could she still want me?

I mean other than like a 'sex for old times sake' kinda thing?

I'll write an update when she leaves next, god knows when that will be.

If you don't hear from me, please,

Send lawyers, guns and money, to get me out of here.

I want to point out one obvious thing. I'm not trying to be mean, I promise. 

Your ex doesn't love you. She doesn't care about you, or your life, or your health. She doesn't. You probably know that? If she loved you, she wouldn't be using you yet again. She's using you. And you're letting her. That's pathetic, yes? Pathetic. And weak. It's all these things and more.

Sorry, but this is all true, and you know it.

I say this with compassion and love, because I'm hoping you find the strength to make the right choice here, which is to go NC again. I don't care if you have to leave the state, or hideout in a tree house, or live on a raft, or take on a new identity, or check yourself into a psych ward, whatever it takes to get away from her.

Here's wishing you strength... .  

Thank you... .  I have tears in my eyes because I know you are right... .  

and this time, I will probably have to find a new planet... .  she's

that relentless. Another state or country won't do it.

Oh god, what hath I wrought?

Hell hath no fury like a BPD scorned.

I tried so hard to be an A Hole, everyone believed I truly was as it relates to her. That's what it took to keep her away. 1.5 years.

Man, 3 words, Happy New Year. Ooo

Noo

I am pathetic.

One more thing, and then I really need to go,  lol

Again, not trying to be mean here. 

You seem to be reveling in this, enjoying it somehow, even though you know it will be your undoing. Why is that?   

Also, what kind of person (I want to say man here, but I'm trying not be sexist,  lol) lets someone else control them in this way? Seriously, what kind of person? That's you right now, just so you know. But you are enjoying this, nevertheless. I wonder why that is?

That's all from me. I hope the best for you. 

I smile sadly, my exBPD and I were "bunny" to each other... .  

I would urge you to read my various posts.  I have been where you are and there are moments where I still am.  I struggle with this still.  I spent $100,000 on my exBPD who cheated on me, destroyed my property, and choked me.  I still love him.  We may not be able to control our feelings, but we can and HAVE to control what we do.  I ended up moving while he was out of town... .  we recycled.  I moved 1,000 away... .  we recycled.  I finally ended it two weeks ago and it's still up and down. 

What would my future have been?  He would have drained me dry, I would have turned to my family for money, I would have drained THEM, and once the cash was gone he would have been gone too. 

We have grown addicted to the highs, but the lows are too great a price to pay.  Please get away and stop judging yourself so harshly.  We do the best we can where we are.  But get away from this, it cannot end well.

Broiled bunny: I echo what others have said. You sound like you are reveling. This is not real, never was real and it will not end well. It will end like it always does, when you least expect it. I just hope you don't lose it all this time.

What price your life man? Do you want love or do you want a drug? What will you allow her to take from you this time?

Somehow, they recycle us and always end up better. And we pay the price.

In my case, my ex had me convinced that if i broke up with her, she'd end up homeless (so everytime I'd bring up sexual problems it'd devolve into a drama that because I want sex I'm going to make her homeless).

Long story short, we broke up and she's living the high life (she spent the summer in europe, has a new rich gf, a new car, a new job on and on) while I'm over here trying to recuperate financially, physically, emotionally and spiritually from all the damage she did.


Next time she comes up to you (there's always a next time with a BPD), all you have to do is say- excuse me- and walk away. It's simple, just not easy.

  It is really brave u have come on boards for support, that is a positive and well done.

I think once we are educated about BPD it is harder to surrender to the highs because it is all to clear what happens when things turn and unless your exBPD has had or is in T things may very well be the same between u... .  because what has changed since things ended... .  besides time... .  

You have changed your educated now, you know what could be in store... .  

Let me ask u a question for you to think about... .  What does your future look like, can your dreams, hopes, aspirations include this person and there behaviors?

I hope you can continue to be strong, keep in touch with boards for support

I appreciate the board, it's about the only place I can spill my feelings, and not be judged... .  well not too much.

Really, I didn't speak to her for 1.5 years. Not a hello.

I told her no, no, no, at the party, but i should have gotten up and walked off. I really am a good man, with good intentions, and I really wanted her to move on, and meet someone with lots of money who would take care of her since she's a bit of a princess. Funny thing is, she has met a lot of rich men, she's working all of them, and all she wants from me is intimacy and sex. (Well not all, she wants a life together. I just mean, I'm in bad shape financially and she knows it but still is coming straight on for me)

I mean I've read a lot of BPD stories on this board, but never one exactly like mine.

She caught me off guard on NYE.

The LAST, the VERY LAST thing I expected was her to profess her 'love'. I was stunned and shocked! And a little bit titillated, true.

I was trying to let her down easy when she slipped passed my defenses,  leaned in and kissed me. I didn't kiss her back at 1st. She kept saying, didn't you miss me? etc etc etc.

It was about 2:30 am NYE, and yes, I'd had a few drinks (and like I said took a cab).  I still said no, but eventually I just went weak, kissing her back and saying no at the same time like some cheap B movie.

I thought maybe she just wanted something for the night... .  silly me.

I mean a year and half later... .  she might still like me, but not still have a torch for me.  

If anything, I thought maybe she wanted revenge for being tossed in the clink, and the RO. I was sometimes the one refusing sex, so that was never an issue either. I used to say how can I make love to a Porcupine? After she'd been raging for a couple hours... .  oddly she'd get horny.

Yeah... .  lame. I'm really sorry.

You're all reading this and thinking what a dick. I'm really sorry.

I'm just telling it the way it happened.

I wanted to say, I'm not sure if I'm reveling in it, but yes, still in the honeymoon phase, as is she. I actually haven't dated much since we split up and sadly the women I met were crazier than her, sex and intimacy have been non-existent in my life, a lot due to just trying to recover from her.

But as it was said, I'm educated now, and pretty good idea whats to come

when the honeymoon ends. Otherwise I'd be oblivious of everything, thinking of a future together... .  not.

That being said, she's fairly high functioning BPD, and a real charmer, really sweet when the monster of BPD is at bay.

I did really try to say no, but yes, in the back of my mind, I did miss her.

A year and half wore down my defenses, I figured she'd moved on.  

I probably am reveling just a bit since it's been so long and so little affection to me, but I do tend to have a bit of a black sense of humor. If the world was ending tomorrow and everyone knew it, I'd probably be very pragmatic and have a few one liners despite it being the end. So what you interpret as reveling may just be my black humor. We'll all be dead soon enough, some sooner, some later. It's always the same in the end.

So,  please don't think I enjoy being tortured, I don't.

But the last several days have been the exact opposite of torture.

I know it will end soon, and I'll have to be the one to do it.

I suppose I could lie and say I've been seeing someone else... .  which I haven't.

Thankfully this time, my name is the only one on the lease.

I like the idea of imagining my future, with and without her.

Yes, without her sounds much better.

Thank you for the support of those of you here who've been there.

It does and WILL make a huge difference on how I deal with my 'mistake'.

God, you nailed it.

It does sound like you're enjoying being recycled. That's alright, a lot of us have been there. You've admitted it, might as well be honest about it too. If you were really worried about how this will all turn out, you would have stayed NC because that's your best answer right there. You already saw that it was working. Although in your initial post you did state: "I was lying and she knew it." That's where she got you. She didn't need to sneak in, the door was wide open. What are you going to do now? Move again? Quick, how much time before she gets back? Or: Better luck next time? How's that going to work? You let her in by not being your real self, her false self is now reattaching back to you as best it can (but as you know the set-up's rather faulty), and those two partial-selves do not make make a coherent whole. A few more times around the bedroom sounds kind of fun, actually, but at what cost to the progress you've been making living life without her? Especially when you say she's going to move in/ hurt you/ leave again. Covering up lies with other lies, as you proposed, may get you out of this, but which one's heavier, to You, to carry with you as you move on from this, the truth or lies? Wishing you well with this. Sounds... .  Familiar.

Some times it's two    forward and one   back.

myself: wow, that was awesome. I know I've read in other places on this board about the triangle (see writings on karpman triangle, and I love "2010"'s writings).  Many have talked about how the only way off the "merry go round" is as the victim.  As much as I've resisted that truth, it has been my story. What I've read here is that as long as we continue to be willing to "play",  we will be recycled. I believe what others have written about the only way to win is to refuse to play.

My last time around the "merry go round" almost cost me my life, so I'm not up for another  "flirtation with the disease", as they say in 12-step rooms.  I sure wish you a soft landing broiledbunny.

I just want to say, BB, that I honestly wasn't trying to be mean, or judgmental, though I know I sounded that way. I need to work on that,  lol  It is actually something I'm working on, for what it's worth. I get upset when I see someone doing something that isn't good for them, and I get on my high horse and preach. Not a good thing.

I've been exactly where you are, and much worse. I had a gf a ways back who I knew was going to destroy my life, if she had her way. Yet I still couldn't break away. Around and around and around I went. It was insane. I look back now and wonder wth I was thinking, and I'm just so grateful that she didn't suck me into the abyss and ruin my life. It could have worked out that way so easily. I hope things go well for you, honestly. 

Hey Dude,

Don't beat yourself up. Seriously. Your ex sounds seductive. Mine was too. It was never ending seduction. She sounds hot too. So, you hooked up with her for a few days. That's OK. You made a mistake. And it sucks. We all make mistakes. So don't beat yourself up. You aren't pathetic. You are a human being and this woman seduced you. It happens.

So drop those feelings of guilt and shame right now. They aren't going to help you right now. Drop that. Drop that now. What you need right now is take a step back. Take a few days away. And just really think about how much you value yourself. If you don't value yourself, ask yourself why. And commit to learning how to do it. You know this is going down a bad path. You don't need to feel guilty or ashamed. Right now, that won't help you. You need every ounce of energy right now to listen to the tiny voice in your mind that loves you. It is the same voice that is getting you onto these boards to tell your story. Listen to that voice. That voice is your best friend right now. And listen to what that voice is saying. That voice is telling you to STAY THE      AWAY FROM THIS CRAZY B*TCH!. So, do that. Who cares if you spent the last few days banging her. You made a mistake. Pick yourself up, dust yourself off, and run. Sprint. You know what you need to do. Do it.

I don't know how you could possibly give in to her. I don't know anyone else on these boards that would, if there pwBPD came back like that... .  well not anyone but me and every other one of us in a weak moment.

My exBPDgf had been out of my life over 20 yrs... and contacted me on FB, and I thought I was strong... had moved on, been married over 20 yrs, had a kid, and my head on straight. Two months later I filed for divorce. That was about 3 yrs ago... and my life has been a new hell only matched by the r/s with her 20+ yrs ago... when I was abruptly dumped... we had been planning to get married, I had a 3 location medical clinic chain... and I left the town I grew up in, my family, my business... my life really, to get away from her, as she showed up dating a neighbor and kissing hugging him on his porch. It was either move or kill someone.

So now I am 50, paying child and spousal support, and a big mortgage and second on the house my family used to be in, that I am in alone (upside down on a bit... so stuck)... starting over... .  from my pwBPD's coming back in to my life, and my less than sterling way of handling it.

What they heck, go for it dude... give us updates... I think inmates get to use computers once in a while if they are good... .  if I keep going back I may end up same place. It truly is an addiction of some type.

Uh... Seriously... 100 since you? Are you using any sort of protection? Shame on you if you are having unprotected sex with her!

Broiled Bunny

Thank you for sharing your story.  It is a nightmare come true.  I have told my ex BPD that I want no contact.  I am fearful of what would happen if I found myself in your shoes, the allure is so strong.

I do agree with the other posters that you are getting something out of this.  Maybe this is a huge ego stroke.  Look I have nothing yet this beautiful woman is picking me over these wealthy guys who can offer her the world.

Hopefully you will find the strength to shut this down before things move from worse to worst.

God give me the strength to say pound salt if my ex ever suggests any kind of rekindling of the relationship.

The posts you are receiving may sound harsh, I don't think they are meant to be, we are all here to support one another.  If I ever find myself in your shoes, I pray that out of kindness the posters on this site will give me the same advice they are giving you.

My prayers are with you!

Broiled bunny... .  you definitely gave us the scenario where NC is not detachment... .  so many folks here think it is the same thing... .  it clearly is not.


Well, you are not a victim... .  this is your life and as far as we know... the only life we get.  If you continue, there is a good chance of chaos and perhaps even jail time.  If you end it now, you get a bit of self respect... .  how do you want your life to look?  It is up to you.

I was lying to her when I said I didn't care. But then, that's the rub isn't it.

Letting go of your BPD, something I"ve been working on since August of 2011, because whatever she was and wasn't I loved her with all my being.

And through that came my destruction and ultimate very bad ending, but the ending being her being arrested (not me) as I said before, and me with an RO against her, the only escape. No charges were filed, and I let the RO go after a few months.

And it was working by just avoiding her.

I recognize my role in the whole mess for being attracted to her, the excitement and we did always share all the same interests, had so much fun, though that might just been a BPD adapting to her surroundings.

Changing, adapting as they do to the needs of their major object, though never had a T to exactly see what my role is. I Know I have a role now, from reading here and other places... .  I know I helped and participated in the process that caused me so much pain, and waited far too long to separate until she had a vice grip on me, and both on a shared lease, big mistake and no where to run, no where to hide, all my friends wanting nothing to do with her or me. Not wanting her parked in front of their house the way she did at my work, and previous residences. But she comes off like a poor little ... .  you know, I hear people say the term waif, and I didn't think it applied to her, but perhaps it does. Always problems, and she seemingly incapable of solving them on her own. And while you help her with her problems, she loves you, or what feels like love at 1st.

My true self is a nice guy, and it is difficult to be an ass to her on purpose for the purpose of keeping her away.

But NEVER imagined in 1.5 years she'd have feelings for me. I was pretty sure I only hated her, but my emotions have been mixed for sure.

I've missed her, cried at night, knowing it could never be and to be strong.

Finally I was doing pretty well after about a year, finding this and other sites, and reading about BPD and having an epiphany about what had happened and why she is the way she is.

But all the passion and love in my heart came rushing back with a kiss. We had a strong connection.

She's not a devious person, she just is. Damaged as we all are in some way, sweet and nice, but eventually so possessive and controlling that she kill the love she craves. Maybe I've never really seen her true side?

Truth and reason don't work with her.

I can't just say, I don't see this working, it's been nice reconnecting, and burying all the pain of the past. Lets stay friends, and let the past be the past, and move on.

With a sane person, they might say, ok, and not be happy but let go.

She'll just be like she never heard the words.

I wish I had the financial means to see a T and see things the way you do.

I'm just scratching by.

Can someone explain to me, why a woman who can have any guy she wants, wants me? Ok, I"m not chopped liver, but as I've said, I'm not in a good place financially, but finally recovering from the previous damage and feeling strong enough to face the world head on and achieve things.

I do have a hard time in relationships though, I get so attached, and usually they are the ones who are more ambivalent.

Might as well face you're addicted to love as Robert Palmer said, hence I"ve been avoiding attachments for all this time.

But why the hell does she always want to come back to me?

No, I completely appreciate your honest input. I need it now more than ever.

You have a lot of good things to say.

It's especially hard because I've been so completely alone.

At least I know what I'm getting into, and I will make strong boundaries.

Perhaps when she sees she can never have what she wants completely she'll leave in search of the elusive perfect person for her?

It's so wierd how she never sees that her role in the disasters she creates and the drama. It's always someone elses fault.

"If a man is alone in a forest with no woman around to hear him, is he still wrong?" he he

Great advise.

Thank you. It's amazing how now after she's finally away (after 4 days of non stop boinking, cuddling, laughing and reconnecting), I feel the FOG lifting, and when she's here, I'm like a love zombie lost in the FOG.

At least I recognize whats happening.

I mean, she really really turns me on... .  I'm trying keep within the boundaries of describing a  "love" situation without it turning into 50 shades (ha, don't worry I haven't read that crap) but you hear what I'm saying.

Last few days are just a blur and honestly it has been wonderful, fantastic, beyond words, and all a mirage right?

Unfortunately I agreed to see her tomorrow, and being an ass will only escalate things in a bad way quickly. Better to just go along for another couple days... .  famous last words of a heroin addict. I'll quit tomorrow... .  

but the commitment is made, and I'm quite sure hell and high water won't keep her away. It won't be all bad, we're still in the honeymoon.

For sure if I keep my cool, she will to, She's been very in control of herself and her emotions and no bad vibes or feelings at all, though we all know that won't last.

I PROMISE I WILL CUT IT OFF! PROMISE!

Any advise on the best way to do that?

Honestly if you pursue this "thing" with her, you'll have to re-register as RoastedToastedAndEatenAlive... .  Bunny.  You're fooling yourself if you think everything's ok for just a few more days.  You already stated that you know it is bad for you, so there's a decent start.  I dealt with a potential recycle attempt about 3 months out of a 5-1/2 year relationship with mine, so I'll tell you what helped me.

I knew in my rational mind she was terrible for me, even though my heart still needed to catch up by a long ways, I was still hurting like hell.  She attempted to contact me several times for 3 months before I finally gave in and took one of her calls.  She was crying and begging me to see her, said she only needed space, and a bunch of other lies, but she was BEGGING to see me.  Before taking that call, I made a commitment to myself that this thing with her was dead and gone no matter what, and I wasn't going to allow myself to reason with her or try and explain myself.  I knew I needed to stand my ground, and I didn't need any excuse to do that.  It is what it is whether she likes it or not, my way IS the highway.  You already know the potential to get sucked back in when feelings get stirred up, how relentlessly seductive she can be, but if you are mentally prepared beforehand, you'll stand a much better chance at sticking to your guns.

I probably could have recycled with her very easily, and I imagine it would have been a major ego boost, at least until the whole thing exploded in my face again.  Either way, I was still hurting, and it would have felt good to revel in her idealization again, nothing quite like feeling worshiped by a BPDex... .  except for the respect I earned from myself when I stood my ground and told her no.  And I have felt better and better ever since, and I know it won't explode in my face like the alternative was guaranteed to do.

You're in a bad spot, but it's not one you have to be stuck in.  Won't it to be over?  Commit to it now, stay committed to it, and be ready to end it, that's it.  Just end it.  You don't have to explain yourself, and you really don't even have to see her.  You're torn between heart and mind, in a way you're at war with yourself.  Time to dig up some strength and put on your game face, suit up and stand your ground.  Good luck man.

Glenn,

She claims, she only had one actual boyfriend, and only slept with the one guy, and the rest were just guys she went out with and didn't F^& that she's got a reputation for being a big tease and letting guys take her out and getting nothing.

Yeah, and I got some land in Florida. But seriously, what would be the point in lying, though I guess she doesn't want me to think her a whore.

God only knows what the truth is.

As far as protection non protection... .  there was protection... .  

Yes, I am torn.

Yes, I need to put on my game face and end it.

The wheels are in motion though. She'll be here tomorrow morning expecting a day hike, dinner and lots of sex. I am strong when I am away from her. When I look in her eyes, I melt.

So many men would give their eye teeth to be me, but they know not what they wish for to be the object of her desire.

How can we continue to love people who've caused us so much pain and damage?

The damage with me breaking up again, will not be without consequences either. The good feelings, longings, and desires I've had for her spilled out like a broken dam, washing over her in waves of joy, she was so happy you can't imagine.

I professed my love for her, and desire, and though what I said was true, Oh... .  I'll pay for it later. I feel the FOG lifting but am afraid of an in person confrontation. That would be the most likely scenario of her having a panic attack from her fear of abandonment, and consequent hysterical outburst (loudly) that might result in police arriving from the neighbors calling the cops. She's neve r tried to say I did anything to her, but I know if and when they get there, she'll be bawling her eyes out, and sweet innocent thing she is, (ha) the cops may still haul me away, since they beileive that a woman won't want to tell the truth, even when it is true, (he didn't do anything)

because it already happened once.

I'll need to do it on the phone, chickensheet as that sounds, and then run for the hills, batten down the hatches and disappear for a few days as she flys over on her broom to burn me and mine to the ground.

Whether I let myself be seduced, or not, it will be my fault, and she will again paint me black for recycling and leaving her. My phone will likely ring with vitriolic messages from her friends, But so,

better than letting it go too long.

[quote author=FogLight link=topic=191526.msg12177426#msg12177426 You're torn between heart and mind, in a way you're at war with yourself.  Time to dig up some strength and put on your game face, suit up and stand your ground.  Good luck man.[/quote]

RoastedToastedAndEatenAlive.

Pretty good. I know you won't agree, but telling her not come over, will result in her coming over and fighting the whole day, chasing me down the street, whatever it takes to engage me, good or bad.

Why not just enjoy it? Have a hike, dinner, and send her packing the next day? I still have time to plant lots of doubts, that may make her come to the conclusion on her own, that I'm not all that. She wants a lot, and 1st time around I told her yes on everything. Now, the answer is no no no.

She gets nothing of what she wants. No possible future.

Hard as that will be, too look her in the eye, and say no, I realize I don't love you, or something like that. She reads me like a book.

Like I said, I have no doubt now,  there is something wrong with me, but not sure what it is in relation to my attraction to BPD women.

I'm a man, guilty as charged. Hard to pass when a extremely sexy woman says something like I want you.

But thanks to all you guys, I"m learning a lot over the last 6 months or so.

I'll handle it.

Love your nickname, wish I had thought of it (BroiledBunny). I think all of us that recycle think it won't be THAT bad, this time. And in my personal experience I was wrong every time, it was always 10x as bad as I imagined the worst case could be. Still I did it a few more times. All told we have broken up and got back together 7 times now. She has BPD and major issues, and I have issues of my own... clearly just from going back in and out of an abusive relationship.

I hope it works out well for you, which sadly probably means you are apart from her and avoid jail. While I have recycled a number of times, I live 4 hrs away from my exBPDgf and it makes it easier to keep distance between us. If she was close bye I would be super screwed.

Any one else think it is horrible that what seems like "the love of our lives" and "true love" is a trauma bond between two people with issues? And that the fix is getting well enough to have a normal bond with a more normal person, that is unlikely to have a fraction of the intensity... .  seems like a travesty of cosmic justice somehow.

What's wrong with you is that you never took the time to learn to LOVE YOURSELF during the time you were apart from your ex.  She is playing you and you are playing right into it.  You said it yourself, you were weak and lonely.  That is because you never took the time to work on you while she was away doing whatever she wanted.  You sat and waited for her.  Now you got your wish.  I am not going to apologize for being harsh because it is what you need.  It is our co-dependancy issues that get us and keep us hooked to BPDs.  Our total and utter lack of self-esteem that they boost so well when they do their "wonderful idealization".  Until you build your own self love and self-esteem you WILL continue this dance, probably for life.  MAN-UP and stop making excuses for her and this situation.  You want out, do the work and get out.  If not, then stop posting about how you are "gonna do this or that, after the next round of sex".  All that is is bragging as far as I am concened.

Hopefully you will wake up and see the light, cause you are the only one that can get you out of this.

Advice on how to break it off?

Tell her you can't do this anymore. Do it over email if you have to. H*ll, do it over text. It doesn't matter. Then block her number, block her email, and lock your door or get out of town for a while, stay at a buddies place. See any attempt at her contacting you as abusive/needy/manipulative. She doesn't love you. It sounds like you don't even LIKE her. Sure, you like the sex. But is having sex worth going to jail for? Seriously.

She is going to destroy you. You know it. So do whatever it takes to tell her NO. And that's that. Whatever fury she unleashes on you is just more proof that you made the right decision.

Intensity, yes. For certain.

This is your addictive brain talking.  Treat it like an addiction.

12 step programs are basically free and are wonderful for working on you BB.  Check into coda... .  step 1 - admitting you are powerless over the person and your life is unmanageable

Sound about right?

You are so completely right. I've been out of work, a near wreck, self esteem? Whats that. I've only started feeling like I have any worth in the last couple months and just barely surviving. I was practically suicidal at one point I was so depressed, but finally turned a corner a few months ago.

I met some beautiful and seemingly nice women, and sadly, I just couldn't afford to pursue them.  My finances allow me to just afford rent, utilities, food and little else. But I am fortunate to have that and I thank god I have a roof over my head.

I didn't want to connect with a woman, only to have her find out how

poor I am right now. It's not permanent, I think I'll find a job soon.

But I figured I'd wait till I was in better shape financially before

trying to date, I mean, you gotta go through a lot of crazy women to find a sane one, and that takes time and mucho bucks . Then, they may not want to be with you.

Honestly it wasn't till I found the forum, and began reading about BPD that I began to feel better. You can see my progression by reading my posts... .  

I think I need to review again, exactly what BPD is.

I think I've forgotten a lot of what it is, other than the abandonment thing (her big time), and the 'I hate you don't leave'. (also her)

I woke up this morning feeling sane and in control.

BUT I can't help but to want to help her.

I want to tell her about BPD, see if it's possible to get her to go to a T.

Not that I would want to continue the relationship, but then you know, I remember, that's how it all started, me helping her.

There's no just being friends with her.

Experience has shown me, there's no reasoning with her.

But I keep going back to maybe she's salvageable. That therapy could help her see the light, I want to discuss her past encounters with T's, and find out if she ever had a diagnoses, and did she do anything to work through it.

But I know that won't and can't happen. I can barely take care of me right now, and she'll pull me back into the abyss I've spent so long getting out of.

I do care about her, and that's the really hard part.

She's really an amazing woman at many levels, and then, there's this.

The deal killer. Like I said she's high functioning, so the ugliness doesn't come out right away.

Oh, yes, I have a terrible thing I must do.

I must detach. I've been so alone, and with little joy in my life, and I have to toss her to the curb, the one woman who would waste 2 minutes of her life to be with a broke loser, which sadly until I'm working, I am. The one incredibly beautiful woman who seems to have loved me, ha. Yeah, it's just the fog creeping in.  

I've forgotten why they do the things they do, time to do some reading again.

Where would I find a program like this?

My friend, your self esteem is in the toilet.  I know, I've been there too.  A theme I see running through your posts is that you are broke and therefore not worthy; you are broke, and this girl says she wants you, so that seems to make it worth the danger... .  

You are not:

Your looks.

Your age.

The money in your bank account.

What you do.

Plenty of women out there are doing just fine on their own and can buy their own jewelry for their birthdays quite happily when their guy is loving, supportive, sincerely, strong in himself, and bothers to remember said birthday with a heartfelt card or kitchen cleaning or something that is not monetary.  Someone you have to buy will cost you more than money.  I know, between my ex-husband and my exBPDbf, I'm out $200K in four years--all my savings, my retirement, and all quite literally nothing.  I'm scraping to get buy and am swamped with debt.  THAT is what buying love cost me. 

Do NOT fall for this stereotype.  And do not settle for less than a good human being as a partner just because you don't yet have a job.

Google CODA or Alanon.  They have meetings in most major cities.

I'm so glad I have you guys to talk some sense into me.

Yes, I waited for her. Despite all the pain she put me through, I dreamed of her, wanted her if for nothing else than the intimacy and sex.  But it took so much to get away from her, I assumed she hated me, and all I had to to do was continue avoiding her and it would just stay a dream. I figured it would and could never happen.

She caught me so completely off guard on NYE, basically threw herself in my arms, professing her love for me, it was shock and awe. I haven't felt the touch of a woman in so long. And yeah, we had a certain connection that to me at least, felt like no other. I've felt so happy, elated these last few days.

I haven't felt like this, ha probably since I met her the 1st go around in the beginning phase.

Realizing what I've done, and what I must do, I won't survive another round with her.  I've done a terrible thing.

It's really starting to hurt, remembering why I left, and knowing what I have to do.

I really want to thank everyone for your honesty. It's what I need.

Good job, man. You can do it! You did it before. You can do it again! Stay strong, buddy. You will totally make it. Focus on doing the work on yourself.

Oh god, it hurts. My heart is breaking all over again. I did so well for so long staying away... .  all gone in 3 words, happy new years. :'(

Another phrase I've heard in many circles: insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results

YOUR responsibility, if you want sanity more than insanity, is to make yourself impermeable and impervious to this cheap thrill. How? By being willing to go to any lengths to look at your side of the street in all of this stuff and to fill your coffers (emotionally, spiritually, psychologically, sexually, financially) so that you are no longer available to this scheisse.

It is possible. You just have to want it more than you want the mirage of her.

And nothing is "gone". You needed this, for reasons that will become more apparent to you the further you get away from this. SLAA is a great place for looking at one's patterns in relationships too.

For me, I find that a big part of my codependency is an addiction to pain. First I have to get out and stay out of dangerous situations. And be willing to go through "withdrawal". It can/will get better, if this is truly what you want.

Dont go backwords in life for somebody who didnt think you were good enough the first time man.

Keep your self respect, even if it means she finds your'e replacement and your left with nobody.

At some point she'll remember you, and thats payback enough.

|iiii

I am wondering whether painting her black may have inhibited your ability to truly move on.

I know that for me refusing to admit that there were both good and bad parts to our relationship would allow me to take on the role of the victim and continue to be helplessly under his control. Same with accepting my own responsibility in the bad things that happened between us. While I didn't choose this, I allowed him to get away with treating me in ways that I know logically I shouldn't have accepted.

I am wondering if painting her black has been allowing you to keep a mindset of victimization that made it easier for you to agree to a recycle.

I think you need to cut this off before it gets any seriouser, and go back to no contact. Then when you are ready, begin taking inventory of what you did that allowed this to continue. I'm not saying it's your fault. But you need to examine how you ended up in this situation.

She's setting you up. Do you think she has forgotten about the arrest and the RO? My BPDexGF remembers everything in her own twisted up way. You are going to go down hard on this one. You can't even afford a lawyer, how well do you think you are going to do in court?

If she isn't working, where do you think she is living and spending her time when she isn't with you? Probably with the guy who loaned her the car, or with the guy who is keeping a roof over her head.

You are going to hurt her if you cut her off, but not nearly as bad as she is going to hurt you if you don't.

GTFO if you want to stay out of jail.

You may have been NC but emotional detachment is different.  Yes, commend yourself for the progress youve made.  Time alone does not heal these wounds.  Sounds like you were not truly "ready" for her alluring temptation.  The unexpected is what we must be prepared for like this.  Various types of reengagement present themselves...

No, im not saying.  Its easier said than done.  But your experience actually scares me, as i know im not ready to resist mine again either.  I am seriously trying to take a turn now with my thinking.  After subjecting myself to hostility for over a yr since we "ended", constantly breaking NC on both sides, i realized detaching is my main problem.  Its the hook i need to escape.

Your reaction and profession of this shows your unhealthy addiction has not been broken.  BPDs are famous for treating us like scat then trying to resume neglecting responsibility as if nothings happened.  Dude, she does not have your best interest in mind and ypu are being a source for her to feed off of.  I doubt you wanna expose yourself to that again.  Youve learned her danger, what shes capable of in the past.  Her words are hollow so quit holding onto them.  Would she let YOU get by with even minor transgressions?  No so why should she be handed your soul on a silver platter? 

Broiled, I'm sorry for what you're going through.  Like me, you have a tendency to be very hard on yourself.  It's in these moments where we are at our weakest.

Might I make a suggestion?  It's time for you to really start focusing on yourself. As an outsider I'd say that you have tried to bury a lot of your pain and shame since initially going NC instead of trying to learn from the experience with your ex.

Truthfully, it seems like you're addicted to her, and you're trying to get a fix. I think you might benefit by trying to figure out why you're an addict in the first place. And honestly, it probably makes some sense to lay off the booze for a long time... .  good decisions cannot be made with alcohol involved.

You want her to be someone she's not. She has a disorder and always will.  Nothing is going to change a person other than themselves. And pwBPD are fundamentally averse to change, and any indications to change themselves are usually fleeting.

You are letting her hold you down.  The lessons of life will keep repeating themselves until you learn them. Learn from this.  Try to avoid blaming yourself, judging yourself, using harsh words against yourself, etc.  If you beat yourself up, you'll only look for reasons to quick ways to bring yourself back up emotionally.  This will drive you back to your ex. 

She doesn't love you.  She's incapable of genuine love. Right now, you're probably making excuses for her so you can keep your drug. All the while, you're letting her manipulate you. You're better than that, and you can be strong. You can get through this and learn this lesson... .  that you're worth a damn, and that you deserve to have a happy relationship with love if you work on yourself.  That you need to learn how to love yourself first.  And that now is the time for you to really focus on being the person that you need to be by treating yourself with love, dignity, and respect.  Saying no to someone who manipulates you is a great start.

I'm wishing you well.  Learn for this... .  don't beat yourself up!

Well said and I agree. Many people posting about hating their exes and encouraging others to do so need to look behind the hatred and the anger. I'm sorry Broiledbunny but you need to start to get to know yourself.

You have no sense of your self and WHY you allow yourself to go back. You can put the boundaries in place. You can DO everything people tell you to do. But if you can't make a start on reconnecting with the child that didn't get his needs met (you) those boundaries will come tumbling down because they have no roots to hold them up.

Breaking an addiction is hard work. I can see you are in pain and she takes the pain away. The pain was there before you even met her though. If you can't get to a CODA meeting yet read a book on codependency and where it comes from. Think about your childhood.

It's hard work. We'll help you if you can get on that path. If you go NC do it differently this time. Try keeping hold of your compassion while you do it. I don't mean that to sound harsh I just mean it's easy to just denigrate the ex and lie to yourself that you don't care as much as you do. And pretend that she didn't have any good qualities.

But the only true way to move on is to connect with yourself.

Broiled Bunny -

I am so proud of you for resisting all that time.  I agree with the poster who says don't beat yourself up.  And I'm a little surprised that there are several responses to your post that are harsh and lacking a certain understanding of what it is like to the be the victim of a BPD.

I was dumped suddenly by my BPD and *he* is the one who refuses to talk to me.  I am having a lot of trouble moving on and am a little jealous that yours came back to you.  Do you see any signs that she has changed?  Are you talking about your relationship or just ignoring it and consuming each other physically? (and I get that - and miss that so much)

I want you to know that I am so sorry you are going through this and you feel like you are back at Square One.  Can you move?  Change your phone number and email address?  Wear a wig?  ha ha  Please keep us posted and hang in there.  At least you are having sex. 

Cookie

you said you have no money and no job, my advice to you is to RUN - get as far away as possible and rebuild your life.  :)o you have any family in another city?  Friends?  Go there, get a job and get your life back.


It is not worth the price you may have to pay.

I just smell a serious false accusation about to happen. Every time I gave my BPD exgf the benefit of the doubt I have ended up regretting it later.

I hope you are not in the slammer as I type this.

I disagree and think Seeking Balance is unnecessarily harsh.  The reason we are here is that we are wounded from a failed relationship with a crazy person.  We loved them.  The difference in a non BPD relationship is that ours will hurt us.  We know this.  They won't change.  :'(

1. NC is necessary but not necessarily perfected / understood the first (or second) times around. Many of us went back for more and more until the light went on.

2. It's apparent in facts but not feelings. You will reread this in time and see why this NYE event unfolded... .  both in her and you.

!

3. She mirrors what you want to see. You have a hole in yourself she fills with her disordered behavior. Like it or not you are in need of work on yourself and this emotional rollercoaster will shine a light for you to examine your inner problems. Might take bailing out of jail or a 6 month stay in the local sheriff's hotel... .  but you're too informed for the seeds not to be planted to start really reflecting.

4. We all have rock bottom to hit. If you stay! you will be shamed. If you try to break up you will be shamed. Like a tick... .  the longer she stays on you the deeper she goes and the more she feeds. Removal will be painful.

5. She doesn't have rich "friends", she has rich suitor in training. You aren't a one and only you're a "one of many" and you probably know it. She doesn't love... .  she survives as her disorder demands and it demands she lure people to complete her.

Good luck broiled bunny... .  I mean that. I did this dance with my wife of 15+ years and I ate it over and over. When all the magical mirrors break and you "see" clearly through your experience, her "heroin" will be like vinegar on your teeth and her pitiful pleas for love will be like smoke in your eyes.

Rabbit Stew anyone?

I really appreciate everyone's input.

So far everything has been pretty much prrrrfect with her.

I'm waiting for the other shoe to fall. And I tell her so.

She's like a kitten all snuggly and cute. Happy happy happy! Smiling, so happy.

And like a tiger, sexy and insatiable.

So far nothing bad. It is nice to have her in my bed, all snuggled up.

I missed her, I really did. The good part, you know. We have such strong chemistry and went through so much together, good and bad.

She's not a bad person, and I don't know about all this that she doesn't feel love. I mean love itself is a form of insanity.

Where's the line?

She'll do almost anything to please me. Really.

I remember when I'd get home from work, the house would be spotless, and she'd be bouncing up and down, I'd call her tigger, she's be so happy to see me. She was never horribly vengeful. But there was the raging.

She still doesn't acknowledge her own role in the disaster of a breakup we had. She still see's it as I had HER arrested.

I say, she had herself arrested. All she had to do was leave the bathroom before the cops go there. She watched me call 911.

I'm on record, on the 911 call, telling her to leave, just go, stay at your GF's and we'll talk in the morning.

Nope. She stayed till the cops came.

Her own fault. Worst case, they woulda talked to her the next day.

Instead I now know, they chained her to a chair for nearly a day.

Her fault, not mine. Lack of control of her emotions.

Which is a BPD characteristic, though she's high functioning.

Never cut herself or anything like that. Mostly the fear of abandonment thing, and the emotional control issue, and of course the "I hate you, don't leave me thing".

She's paid for groceries, helped clean up,

really... .  nothing bad all YET except that it's obvious she's still completely obsessed with me, and doesn't act rationally in the way she is so wanting to be with me, and not focusing on solving any of her problems, outside of just talking about them, yak yak yak yak, no action, so familiar.

But am still befuddled WHY in gods name, after she had 1.5 years to lasso in a guy with some dough, she wants to be with the poorest guy in town.

It hasn't always been this way. I once owned property etc. I lost everything, not necessarily to due with her. I just feel so distracted when she's around, can't focus. I'm in a state of constant arousal when I'm with her.

We both feel the same way. She would stay here if I'd let her, so not a matter of her going around with other guys. She stick to me like glue if I'd let her.

There's tons of guys who would take her out if they could, spend money on her, but she says she's doesn't feel connected to them, the way she does to me. That she never wanted to break up (well I did!) and always has loved and never stopped loving me, and just filled her time with guys who wanted to spend $$ on her, but only slept with one guy that she had a relationship with. The phone rings, she doesn't answer it. I keep telling her, you'd be better off with someone else.

One week, and sheeet, she's already saying she wants me to marry her.

I'm saying, slowwww down, woa nelly. Nice and easy.

She's so gawdamm pushy. Saying no to her, results in 1/2 hour conversation, instead of an OK.

I could barely get her to leave.

Some of you are probably just pulling your hair out in frustration

that I'm doing what I'm doing, being so foolish as to imagine I'll be strong enough to pull away, like the tick analogy.

Now all this said, we've discussed EVERYTHING, the good the bad.

Seems a lot of our mutual friends, were putting BS in her ear, that I had other girlfriends and crap. She says she didn't think I loved her before, and now she's certain I do. And yes, without a doubt, I do.

I have little to offer a woman these days, at least per what women expect,

and with her, she's happy to have a meal at my little apt. Cuddle and watch a movie. That can't be said about other women I meet. My options are somewhat limited with my financial situation.

No offense to the women out there, but women I've met since are just as crazy or MUCH MUCH worse. In my experience when a woman decides you are her man, she'll do anything to keep other women away, and oddly women are most attracted when you have a beautiful woman on your arm.

They don't want guy who walks in alone, they want the guy who's already taken, because now he's proven to be desirable.

The better looking the woman you're with is, the better looking the women that come after you. And then, when you're single and alone, it's an uphill battle to get their attention.

The war of the roses, men are from mars, women from venus.

We'll never see eye to eye, women and men, and love drives people to do the craziest things.

So, what is love?

The guy she dated after me, looked almost like me.

She read me a dating profile she was writing to put online, a draft never finished, and it described me to a tee. Our interests, identical,

is it possible she's not BPD? And perhaps just a mixed up girl who happens to be madly in love with me? I do have a lot of good qualities. I don't really have much trouble meeting women, but I'm not the kind of guys who wants a different women in my bed every night... .  ha, odd huh? So many guys love variety, and as I've said before, I just want one good one to share my life with.

She once was wealthy, had her own money.

And when she had money post divorce, she showered it on me with trips, clothes, anything I wanted. But I just wanted her to buy a house, and have some security but she just blew the money making herself feel better.

She wanted to go to Europe and pay for it (she pay for it)

but I felt that wasn't wise and I didn't be obligated and have her tell everyone how she spent all this money on me.

Still we ended up traveling here and there, local trips nothing extravagant, but it's so easy to spend a lot these days traveling with nice rooms and $200 a night and more. A grand here, and grand there.

But she's just as happy camping. No complaints about the accommodations even when we're in a tent.

But not going to Europe didn't accomplish anything. She's told everyone I'm a jigalo and she supported me, no I had a job, when we lived together we split all the expenses, me from working, her from savings.

She still has delusions of getting some 100K + a year a job, though she hasn't worked for 10-20 years. I mean, she really was very wealthy.

The Ex husband just is huge jerk, took everything. I know this to be true, she was a basket case when I met her, in the midst of the divorce. A very traumatic event. She SEEMS better now. Not going through my phone, acting crazy jealous etc. YET.

Don't think I've forgotten how crazy it got.

Well, the apt. is in my name only.

She isn't moving in, and worst case, I have the right to toss her the curb.

But I'm guessing she'll come crying to me soon enough saying she has no where to live, and lay the obligation and guilt part of the FOG on me, despite doing nothing to make herself employable. Still the same broken record.

Well, just giving you all an update on the Soap Opera of my life.

Finally having a breather, wow it's a been whirlwind week.

And she's actually been super helpful, since I can only drive to work and DUI classes, she's taken me to run all my errands... .  

Can I be wrong?

I've been learning alot in the DUI classes, drinking way down, and her too.

We just have a glass of wine with dinner. I'm sure Alch had a lot to do with the madness before.

I asked her point blank about her previous go arounds with mental health if she'd ever been diagnosed with BPD. She said no... .  of course.

I do know she had therapy about her fear of abandonment.

Oddly her best friend is a retired shrink. I have a feeling perhaps he has helped her, yes, he. He's an old man, and has his own love interests, and knows she's crazy for me, and seemingly approves.

But the whole, picturing my life with her... .  oh... .  no can't see it.

OK, signing off for now, hasenpfeffer.

Just had a night that I shouldn't have with my exBPDgf as well.

"You may have been NC but emotional detachment is different."    Well put.

Been about 6 mos NC, and was in same town as my mom and exBPDgf, and posted a pic of surprise party on FB... and my exBPDgf contacted me, and asked if I would please meet her at a mall where she was shopping to talk... that she only had a short time.

I said no thank you... and she sent back "your loss" and "I wont ask again"... .  so I decided wth.

Met her and we went to eat at food court (toned down mood)... and started talking. I said I wasn't comfortable and just wanted to see her but didn't think anything had changed... so she started questioning me on my current relationship with exwife, and why I didn't protect her (pwBPD)... and got me on defensive... .  as usual (buildup to hater typically)... so I asked questions about her inconsistencies and the way she had treated me... .  got answers that sounded like BS... .  and called her on it. Said what truth was (what had happened)... and what her version was... and she was shucking and jiving to try to make it sound like it was something else... .  so I said I didn't appreciate the lies and manipulations... .  and that kicked off her full hater for a second... then... well it became clear that she is BPD, she started nice, turned clingy, tried manipulating, and then went angry.

It was a mistake in so many ways to go. I was hurting seeing her, she was wanting to understand why I had dumped her and went NC... .  and lied about the things she did and tried to make it sound like I had just been mean to her for nothing. She told me things I didn't want to know about her followup relationship... and it ended with me sorry to see her go, but trying to keep her thinking the worst of me.

She made very good points that I was self centered and didn't take her emotions/feelings as valid to her. She had told me that she was paying the price for dating her new guy, both financially and emotionally... .  and I simply said "I am sorry it didn't work out, what do you want to eat."  And interrupted a few attempts to start in telling me about the guy... so now I am trying to understand why I put myself and her through this evening.

She was ready to recycle again... .  and I kept thinking I wanted it... .  but pusher her away, then saw her and ended up arguing and really pushing her away. So if she wasn't disordered it would be the last of it... .  I fear its not even close, and I should have just avoided her, been boring and non-commital if I couldn't stay NC.

Whenever I am around her I swear I start doubting my own sanity, recollection, conclusions... .  but there will be just these tiny little hints that I have her pegged... .  little evasions to questions, that kind of thing.

I feel like if there is going to be Rabbit stew... .  I am one of the chefs... .  so not what I wanted.

Wondering if I am N?

BB, some quotes from you:

"But am still befuddled WHY in gods name, after she had 1.5 years to lasso in a guy with some dough, she wants to be with the poorest guy in town.  It hasn't always been this way. I once owned property etc. I lost everything, not necessarily to due with her."

"There's tons of guys who would take her out if they could, spend money on her, but she says she's doesn't feel connected to them, the way she does to me. That she never wanted to break up (well I did!) and always has loved and never stopped loving me, and just filled her time with guys who wanted to spend $$ on her, but only slept with one guy that she had a relationship with."

"I have little to offer a woman these days, at least per what women expect,

and with her, she's happy to have a meal at my little apt. Cuddle and watch a movie. That can't be said about other women I meet. My options are somewhat limited with my financial situation.

Dude.  Wow.

Sounds like both you and her are obsessed with how much money women require for "maintenance", and how if a woman doesn't care about how much a man spends on her, she's a saint, and if a man doesn't have money, he's a loser.  This is a recurring theme and it makes you susceptible to being dazzled by what is or should be not a big deal at all. 

My favorite type of date has ALWAYS been curled up on the couch with someone I love eating a meal made at home.   I'm awesome and unique, (LOL self-validation!) but surely, there are other women like me out there.  You can get someone who's OK with limited funds without the heavy price of someone who's BPD.

Now... .  all I need to do is convince myself I can find someone with the qualities I like in a guy without him being BPD... .  

Broiled

Well it looks like the tone has changed a bit, it seems you've decided to pursue this thing with her.  Hey man, you do you, nobody has the right to criticize you for that, nor should you let it bother you when it does happen.  All I can say is stand FIRM on your boundaries, I'm sure you know firsthand how pushy and testing she can be, it's like the normal girl stuff but jacked up on deca, test, and tren.  At least you're being a tad more realistic about the situation this time, the part about expecting the other shoe to drop as you know it will.  Good luck dude, good luck good luck good luck GOOD LUCK!  I think you're gonna need ALL of that  :)  haha be safe!

Hi Broiled,

Good luck on your new adventure. I hope things work out the way you want them.  Remember the old saying hope for the best, plan for the worst.  I think that holds true.

Again good luck, whatever happens people here will support you.

The thing that has helped me the most in detaching from my ex is understanding that most of it has absolutely nothing to do with me as a person and that him saying stuff that I might like to hear or like to be true "there's never been anyone like you" "Im not interested in sleeping with other women" "all these amazing attractive women want me but I don't want them" "I wish I could marry you" etc etc had no relevance to whether it actually was (true).

We are not NC but I have also established a new boundary by ending the friends w benefits arrangement we had. I feel so much better for it even though I miss so much the feeling of being loved by him.

Good luck bb. My advice (fwiw) is to at least agree one boundary with yourself as an "objective test" of whether this connection is going where you want it too. That's how I justified putting myself part way back to crazy town & it only took a very short time for that "test" to be failed Ie (question answered).

Well, I managed to detach for a little while.

She left yesterday for 3-4 hours, and on Mon. as well.

She had to go home to attend to her pets.

She wants to come back tonight, but I am,

a. concerned the landlord will notice how much time she's been spending here and say something.

b. I am getting just plain worn out. She refuses to accept anything other than what she wants. Me. 24/7.

c, resentful for not accomplishing my goals, and kicking off the New Year with a

very successful push to get FT employment. Instead, I've been wiling away the hours with her.

d.  Tired!

She's only been gone 1 night in the last um... .  let's see 8

God, she's gonna burn me out.

I just can't be charming, happy and friendly, entertaining all the time.

I need down time, ME time, time to recombobulate, consider my goals, do home projects, laundry etc. Though she's actually been helping with a lot of that.

She so badly wants me back, in the capacity we were before, and

I want something... .  different.

Something we can both live with, something more like dating, but I'm OK to be exclusive. We just see eye to eye on so many things.

She still can't seem to admit what she feels she did wrong in the relationship. For me, I know I lied about stupid ~ that didn't matter, but due to her spying she already knew the answers, and then didn't trust me.

So this time, I've talked to women friends right in front of her, so she'll know they are friends, not lovers.

Well. just got off the phone with her... .  

she grinds me to dust... .  just like the old days.

She doesn't stop till she gets what she wants.

I want a night or 2 alone, she wants to be with me.

It gets too exhausting to fight her.

Hanging up on her will result on her being on my door in no time, tears in her eyes, hurt.

I caved... .  I'm resenting her now.

At least she's going to wait till I tell her it's ok to come over, have a client for some piece work stopping by for a few minutes.

I did say she's gotta go in the morning, and she agreed.

Regarding the money theme. I live in a wealthy area. It costs a lot to live here. The ratio of women to men sucks. Guys put up with amazing BS just to be with someone. I'm fighting to not be with someone... .  hmmm.

I hear the pain and anguish in her voice, wanting to be with me... .  

BPD right? Am I right? She says it's just that she loves me and missed me terribly for the whole year and half we were apart.

I'm gonna lose it pretty soon and wind up telling her off, and the cycle repeats. Tried to explain she'd be better off just waiting a day, that I'll wind up resenting her, too much too soon, but it went no where.

Now there's a tell tell sign somebody needs some "me" time. Where did your boundaries go my friend? This is looking frighteningly like enmeshment growing roots. Fear, obligation, guilt. I see all three in this last post. It is not "mean" to be interdependent, it's one sign of a healthy relationship. BPD or not. Hope to hear you are getting some much needed sleep/rest/you time. Take good care of you too, your needs matter.    

Seducing, clinging, hating. Where are you on the merry go round? And around we go... .  

And like others have written, I was just another object to her. "Nothing special" except perhaps in brief moments, often coinciding with great need. My question to my exBPD gf, if she ever shows up in my sphere again: what is/was your part?

As I wrote on another board, that will tell me everything.

a. Someone who cannot take responsibility for their side of the street is not someone who can play with integrity

b. someone who only blames me-same as a

c. someone who is owning their part-means she's really changing

I feel like I've let you guys down... .  well, now it's the clinging stage.

She's gonna leave me no option other than to leave her in the lurch.

Got her to leave at a more reasonable hour today, but now she's trying to work out what's going to happen going forward and wants to talk about it endlessly. I'm saying 'for god's sake woman, it's only been a week!'!

But she's saying, 'you're the love of my life! I want to be with you! '

In my favor is that she doesn't have a car, got in an accident months ago and doesn't have the money to fix it.

She's using the vehicle that belongs to the owner of the house she's staying at, and he's out of town for a little while.

Once he returns on Sun. it'll be a lot harder for her to find her way over here, and me with a restricted license, only for work till April.

But yeah, I'm starting to think it's time to go stay at a friends house, or something, or just wait another couple days till she's without a vehicle.

I hate to be so cruel as to just tell her yes, I want her to come over when I don't but never would've gotten her to leave if I'd tried to stand my ground.

Endless going in circles. She's ready to move in!

Guess, I need to start being everything she doesn't want.

Sadly, the honeymoon is over, and I'm getting sick of it already.

I wanted to show her how in the lease I can't have someone staying here every night, but that turned out to be a mistake, as I couldn't find any clause like that with her standing there.

Now she's saying, 'well see! There's no reason I can't be here.'

Well, great sex last night and this morning, but I know it's just the hook.

Not a reason to be in a relationship, but damn it was great.

It's so sad she can't control herself enough to not drive people crazy with her clinging. In so many ways, she's just an incredible woman.

Before I saw just how bad it could get, I used to feel so

happy (before the madness #1) to have such a beautiful, athletic, smart woman by my side, and we are a good looking couple.

BroiledBunny it's a tough situation you find yourself in right now... .  a true crossroads.  Many of us have been there, you haven't let anyone down here... .  this is your support network  |iiii

It sounds like you are really conflicted in wanting her in your life up to a certain point thats ok with you, enjoying the idealization and mirroring again (don't we all!)... .  not wanting to hurt her feelings, fearing things going very wrong very abruptly as they have done in the past, but also losing out on the benefits of a hot sexy partner... .  

Have you seen this article?... .  

https://bpdfamily.com/tools/articles14.htm

So as you said, she doesn't have the ability to control how she is behaving by clinging to you. Do have the ability to resist another ride on the merry-go-round?

Perhaps looking at some posts on the "staying" board and working on the communication tools and boundaries there will help you.  It's a lot of effort to be in a relationship with someone with BPD... .  both your and her "looks" are transitionary and will change with time... .  does she have enough else going for her to commit yourself to what she obviously wants? 

She's fairly high functioning.

Just got off the phone with a guy who's got his stalker... .  

very different in that she really does not care about or for him, whereas with mine she's very caring and loving, but it's a 50 50 kind of thing, like a switch that goes.

Really hard to see where the line between love and illness is.

I tried to talk to her about BPD, but it went no where.

She's certain she does not have a problem.

And despite how horrible it got before I had to involve the PD to

end it, she still says she never wanted to break up.

Thank god we did. It saved us both. Now, how to finess

her moving on, with the minimum amount of pain.

But she's convinced I'm the love of her life.

I really do believe she does love me, but there's BPD there too.

Some of both. And she's a wreck, no job, no money.

I'm in the same boat but working to do something about it.

She's not doing anything except creating a vacuum in my brain and around me.

Are you still "undecided"?... .  

Acting caring & loving is not the same as being caring & loving (and it doesn't sound like she's even capable of acting it very convincingly!).  Do you honestly think that any of these other male "friends" *cough* would be at all disappointed to see her go? Do you honestly believe that she didn't spin the same or similar crap with them when she thought they were the answer to her problems? Stop kidding yourself & trying to appease her. That isn't a "kitten" you have curled up in your bed, it's a serpent.

Wooddragon - well said!

Thats' the problem.  I hate that when that happens.  And it happens to me just like that.   But the above are on you Bunny.

NC/LC is giving me some time and space to clear up the mess in my head from her/us... .  while recognizing the ruminative obession and the vulnerabilty to my addiction of my dream fantasy hope for her and us when we get together next... .  while the mess i had just with me, before I really get too deep into hell with her... .  is still there needing to be addressed.  Kinda sorta thinking that the mess inside my head about her/us and the ongoing obession inside my brain trying to make sense of that chaos and attempt to correct for that in the future... .  might be functioning to avert me from the real mess of my stuff, completely independent or prior to the massive mindfuk with her/us.  Heck, my side of the street still needs to be swept.  Are you procrastinating and avoiding addressing important objectives pertaining to your stuff, like I am?

Just trying to help here, this might be immature, manipulative, and deceptive... .  but possibly effective in terms of brainstorming.  Many many years ago in my younger 20's, over winter break... .  I got hooked up with a real sexy hottie who was cheating on her SO and was wanting me so badly, stalking, and way too crazy over me way too soon... .  even at that age, i knew that was not the type of relationship I was looking for.  That was my first, in terms of participating with someone who was cheating, just for the sexual adventure.  Oh God, confessing on the boards.  For me it was a fling, a 2-3 week winter break fling while i was full of piss and vinegar... .  and likely still in recover mode from the devastion, loss, and betrayal stemming from my first BPD college sweetheart break-up with whom i had shacked up after moving out of my parents home.  The one who told me "I was the best she ever had", which i believed hence thinking that relationship was secure.

Anyways, back to ending the relationship with the winter fling gal... .    I finally thought at the time in the most resourceful terms how can I end it most effectively and let her move on while releasing me from any further obligation.  My strategy was simply to lie to her.  Telling her straight up  "I'm no good for you.  I'm bad news.  I'm a cocaine addict.  That's all I care about... .  I can't be in a relationship" "I'm a gangster". blah blah blah.  Hey, i painted myself black!  Just to clarify i never was a cocaine addict, nor a gangster.

Have been reading your thread with great interest and excitement as it somehow awakens the addictive, masochistic, get off on the pain, overriding stimulation thing inside of me juxtaposed with some inner challanging self-talk to myself along the lines of "dude, are you really that wrapped around her finger" and romantizing that sh_t while if you don't focus and buckle down soon, the hurts gonna constitute as the worse ever.  By the way, some of the feedback in this thread regarding the addictive, pain, and having our low self-esteem lifted by the rush hit a nerve.  How many wake up calls are we entitled to?  The universe gives us signs, and if we ain't listening, those sounds get louder and louder and LOUDER.  I know you know this.  Best wishes in navigating thru this and coming out of it a better more emotionally healthy and responsible person acting in line with your best goals and best interests.  And improving your risk management skills. OK?  Good luck, man. Hope this might be useful.

NOw here's a paradoxical song of seduction for you BunnyB.

Get Off On The Pain - Gary Allan - ( 3:58)

www.youtube.com/watch?v=3smpJw2mrjg

Broiled, it may be helpful to you start start codependent's anonymous meetings ASAP. Even if a meeting isn't located near you, they have phone meetings that you can dial into. 

One of the things that you would learn at meetings is that you are powerless over your ex insofar as she's mentally ill and you can't guide her to be someone she's not, but you ARE in power of what choices you make in your own life. Your ex isn't making you do anything ... .  you're with her now by your own choice. You have power to decide which relationships you're in, who you spend time with, what you say yes and no to without guilt, etc.  So you may want to consider framing your thoughts in a way that conveys the reality that you have power to decide your choices.

Don't worry about what others think.  Worry about what's best for you. From what I read, it seems that you knew you were in a relationship with someone who is mentally ill, you went no contact, then you became involved again by your own choice on NYE, she acknowledges that she is “messed up" sometimes but ironically won't realize her own contributions to the original failed relationship, and you say that you want to get out of the current predicament but your actions are clearly conveying that you want this time with her. No matter what you ultimately decide, you have the power to decide whether you're in this relationship or whether you decide to leave. Realize that you're responsible for the outcome of your actions... .  if this relationship succeeds or fails, you're responsible for half of it.  But if you stay in it or leave, you're responsible for 100% of that choice.

Wishing you all the best in whatever decision you make.  |iiii

"For love that was, is love that is, we're determined to re-live the pain... .  but then all lovers are deranged" David Gilmour

Working hard to set some boundaries, she fought me tooth and nail.

Funny though, she immediately was able to line up all kinds of fun things to do without me.

None of which have anything to do with work or income.

Meanwhile, I've been at home paying bills, cleaning and sending some resumes.

We're supposed to see each other tomorrow eve.

Sadly, or... .  happily depending on how you look at it, I realize I never stopped loving her, but am and was afraid of her,

with all that went on between us.

I know in my heart it can never work.

I realize it will probably cause me more pain, but I have missed her and I have no one else in my life, not exactly a line out the door. She's so hard to resist.

*mod*

Hi,

This is an interesting and useful topic but the thread is now at 4 pages and has been locked from any further posts.

Feel free to start a new thread on the same topic!