BPDFamily.com

Hello everyone,

I wish to open this poll in order to help all the people who are on the brink of breaking NC with their exBPDgf/bf. This poll is addressed in particular to those of you who had already broken NC and who have learned your lessons from it. Your vote based on your experience is valuable and could be an eye-opener to those who are still struggling with their decisions. Thank you all for your participation.

I could really vote either way, but I went with "no". Sometimes breaking NC helped, and sometimes it didn't, in a variety of ways.

Bear in mind the outcome of the whole situation. I guess that when breaking NC in the beginning it might be some kind of relief, but what about afterwards? Was it worth it? Or did it contribute to needing even more time to reconstruct oneself?

Anyway, thanks for your share. :)

I wasn't even referring to the relief from her absence. We didn't ultimately reconcile, but I learned a lot more about how far off her perception of me and our situation was, and what had happened. I didn't experience closure or anything, but I had more information, and we had some good conversations and some good things happened between us. A lot of it was hard too, and furthered the damage that we did to each other - and made it harder to move on - but it wasn't as black-and-white "NC is good/NC is bad" as many stories are.

I actually spent most of the last two months getting closer to my dBPDxgf, and it really helped me out in the long run. I eventually became emotionally numb to her actions, learned a great deal, and ultimately received closure, but it was most definitely not easy. It really took all the patience and compassion I could muster not to get hurt by any of it. My approach worked for me, but it is definitely not for everyone. IMO, NC is the best approach unless you really know what you are doing.

Its hard to answer. Our first period of nc was mid way through 2014, obviously a LOT happened since then and most of it for the negative. With that said I wasn't ready to move on back then so I see what happened as being nessasary. I'm the sort of person who learns the hard way, I needed to exhaust all possibilities to be OK with moving on.

It could be either way for me. I got some answers from her, but it usually just caused more confusion.

Yes it has although breaking no contact happened involuntarily (my ex became very volatile, I became afraid and my T and I decided that we could do gray rock, which didn't completely work, either.) Communication provoked a lot of anxiety and anger in me. I felt very suffocated in the beginning, but it has also helped:

I was able to see how unbalanced my ex is. A lot of things were kind of normalized in our home life but from a distance, I just said Wow, what is this?

Written language helped me to see his cognitive distortions and difficulties very clearly - this was also hidden to a degree behind volatile reactions at home. Behind the rages, there is a person with very strange thought patterns.

I have had a chance to see how exploitative he can be or he can attempt to be.

With the help of this site, I had an idea of how the disorder runs so I was able to see my relationship from that perspective and it has helped me achieve closure in my head. Without this site, I wouldn't experience this as an empowering result.

I learnt a lot about my own triggers and started to feel much stronger when I wasn't affected as much. I can see where I am in my detachment.

Still, I would have preferred NC and feel that maybe LC would have been harder after a longer relationship - we were together for 2.5-3 months and I was already very dissatisfied in this relationship.

For me, not being in NC has been challenging and I've been exposed to hurt and more than I wanted to know about her new relationships/attachments. I really love the concept of release with grace though-- that feels in line with my values and who I want to be.

For me, the challenge of release with grace is how to deal with the push pull-- how to resist the pull and endure the push.

It is a little bit easier for me to resist the pull this time around since she is in relationships with other people. When the push comes, I say to myself "this is her push" and try not to take it personally. That's at my best-- at my worst, I come to these message boards in pain and try to make sense of it all.

NC (or DNR, since he initiated) started last March and was broken briefly by me in Sept--just a quick exchange of emails about some business. "Hope you're well" was the extent of emotion expressed.

Did that hurt or help? I think it was neutral but on the side of hurting for the simple reason that it wasn't the kind of contact I would have wanted. On the other hand, our business was settled, so I guess it brought some good, so I'm answering yes.

The troubles started the previous December (the discard), and that was followed by a freeze-out and then some low contact. I only had one more phone conversation and never again saw him in person. I very much wanted to see him in person.

Was it like that hug Lonely_Astro is contemplating elsewhere? Not sure.

I may be wrong, but I think part of the problem for me is that he seemed to become a RADICALLY different person when he dumped me. He said himself, "I feel like I'm a different person." But I've never seen this person in the flesh! Maybe seeing him, seeing the absence of love in his eyes, would help me put to rest my memory of him as a guy who loved me. I have two Ds in my head: the one I knew in person and the one on the other end of some really nasty remote exchanges. I wish I could merge them so I would stop thinking of the guy I knew as still existing on some other plane.

Does that make any sense?

I would also have liked a hug, but maybe I couldn't have handled it. Also, I strongly suspect HE couldn't handle it. He didn't want to see me because it would have made me real again.

One thousand times YES! I've had this exact same thought process. I was dumped over the phone a few days after our last date, and never saw her again in person. Then NC for around six weeks, then increasing contact throughout the summer, to the point where it seemed possible that we might get back together. But she refused to see me, even as a friend. (We were long distance, otherwise we might have.) She talked constantly about how she wanted to hug me, and how she did miss me, but she just wouldn't see me. I made it very clear that it didn't have to be a "date", and that it was just important to me to SEE her and experience the interaction in person. But she wasn't having it. So yes, I can relate to the frustration of not having a physically present moment of closure - and also with trying to deal with a "virtual" person who is being awful to you in ways that they couldn't/wouldn't do in person.

Generally, I do not thinking breaking NC is a good thing to do, but it depends on quite a lot of things.

I voted "no" for breaking NC.  The reason for this is because when I broke NC and contacted my exBPD, he ignored me.

You would think this would be devastating for me.  It was not.  It was proof that he is an immature child who cannot engage in a real relationship and he cannot take responsibility for his actions.  Anybody who ignores you or gives you the silent treatment is emotionally abusing you. 

When mature adults break up, they talk it out, they discuss it, they come to a conclusion.  When I broke up with my boyfriend before my exBPD, we had a big conversation.  We decided we should be friends.  We have now been friends for 5 years.  We have an amazing loving friendship. In fact he's coming with me on vacation that my exBPD was supposed to go with me on!  We are just going as friends (he's now dating someone else), but how amazing is it that we have such a great bond that we did not allow to fade just because we were not compatible as partners.

My exBPD has destroyed any type of relationship we could have in the future, by ignoring that text.  He proved to me he is not worthy of my friendship.  Mature healthy adults do not ignore.  They engage, they learn, they resolve, they move forward and face their problems. 

I felt weak breaking NC . . . but it was a blessing in disguise.  It showed me his true colors.

I broke n/c because I was moving and her dog's microchip was still registered to my address. The email exchange was to let her know that she needed to submit a change of address to the microchip company.

It actually became a friendly exchange, which surprised me because the breakup and the aftermath was ugly. She answered my emails almost instantly and was humorous in a few. Once the address change was taken care of, however, she realized I wasn't interested in ongoing contact and her final email was abrupt.

I don't regret contacting her for a few reasons, one being that I loved that dog!  :)  I'm also glad that what will likely be our last contact was pleasant - the most shocking part of the b/u for me was how ugly it got.

Being in contact with her didn't set me back at all, surprisingly. Having to talk her through the change of address reminded me of how often I had to be "the responsible one" in the r/s - which I definitely do not miss. And I was not tempted to stay in touch.

The exchange actually gave me a sort of closure. But it was an exchange I was ready for, a year after the b/u.

A valid point. I know a lot of people advise no contact but there are times when that person needs to make contact just so their ex can stamp out any burning embers of hope that are still smouldering under the surface. And nobody will p*ss on those embers like a disordered ex!

From the movie “Nightwatch”

You should take a look

Nah

No you should. Otherwise you’ll just be haunted here working at night. Nothing cures a fantasy like a quick dose of reality

You think so?

Go on...

I've read so many posts about this subject and it strikes me that there seems to be some misunderstanding about No Contact. I believe people use the term erroneously.

The concept of No Contact means just that ... No Contact (ever again). It is the result of a person resolutely adopting a strategy of fast track healing from a less than savoury experience with another.

I would say ... but I might very well be wrong (because I often am, and would like to invite some discussion here) ... a lot of people confuse the concept of No Contact with Silent Treatment (convenient wouldn't you say? Absolved of the very crime a BPD person commits and disguised under the umbrella of a supposedly healthier banner ... nevertheless, an abusive counter strike).

If you haven't yet reached a point from which you now appreciate that your life will be healthier, happier and better served without this other person (and implement NC) ... you're not adopting NC ... you're playing the same tactic 'ST'.

I hope there is room for critical thinking and discussion here ... because my belief is that this survey achieves very little under the auspices of NC ... perhaps, it would be more helpful for those who have just chosen to go quiet for a while but who, deep down, do want contact or to reconnect. We are 'people' ... surely, division and an 'us and them mindset' causes all kinds of friction and unpleasantness ... this is how wars start. People with BPD traits are people too ... yes, they're a frustrating bunch ... and b?#gger me ... they can try the patience of a saint ... but if you look really closely they've got some top shelf qualities too. Just like you.

People who have opted to adopt NC in its entirety are kayaking down a river, mountain climbing a peak somewhere, snowboarding down Ben Nevis or doing something else (a cuddle anyone) either on their own or with someone that they're in a mutually beneficial relationship with (unless they've fallen off their perch again, met someone with similar traits and are back here for a second helping and some chicken soup) ... otherwise, the people who can truly answer this question are simply not here to answer it.

OK ... I've put my flack jacket on ... guns at dawn ... fire away. It just kinda sticks in the throat a bit all this holier than thou stuff. Either love them or leave them ... but for The Supreme Beings sake ... don't waste your life trying to understand them (they really don't like it when you try to do this).

My lady is a peach ... she runs me ragged ... she's a princess one day ... a witch the next ... I wouldn't have her any other way. There's ST, awful behaviour, ups and downs and shades of colours you couldn't dream of ... if you can learn to accept them for everything they are ... and love them anyway ... I'll lend you my take ... they are the most faithful, loyal and loving people on the planet. Get a hobby ... live ... contemplate your own navel and take your finger out of theirs ... !

If you're with a borderline make sure they're borderline ... they're  deeply sensitive and need your love ... NPD's ... and ASP's ... get the 'flock outta there'. Treated properly ... the only crime a person with BPD will commit ... is the crime of 'loving you to death'. So let them ... You'll love it.

I'm definitely going to get banned from this site ... !

Take care. x

Oops ... that was a rant, wasn't it? <Grin>.

Great post. But again, let's not lose sight of the fact that although pwBPD have common traits, each experience may be more or less unique regarding the bond in a relationship. The bottom line is, pwBPD may 'love you to death' but for how long? One week? One month? One year? 10 years? I guess it'll depend on each pwBPD.

I agree with you regarding the difference between NC and ST. However, I don't know (we haven't done any kind of survey) if all those who have initiated NC are necessarily absent. Anyway, they may at least pass by to this board at the beginning of their initiative.

Caley, I have no stones to toss or weapons to fire... .and I don't know much, but I know thw silent treatment. What I'm doing ain't it. I'm just trying to avoid even more soul-shriveling abuse.

Life is hard.

It's hard for me in a different way than it's hard for you.

There was a time when I would have embraced the chance to love him warts and all. He wouldn't let me, in the end. If I could just walk away and pretend he never existed, well, that would be great. Or kayak. Alone or with someone else. Wanting it won't make it so.

Yes Caley, a discussion should incorporate diverse points of view, bringing color where monochrome does not suffice. Though, if we could shut off matters of the heart in-the-blink-of-an eye--therapists would shutter doors, lonely-heart bars would close down, and emo music would thankfully be less predominate (blech, sort of joking).

But the human heart wants what the heart wants--despite reality, and clings to illusion. Consequently, reason wars with feeling, and harmonizing both disparate elements challenges our beings. Until, a livable balance is struck, we suffer. And if suffering is caused by desire then suffering may be alleviated via detaching from said object of desire, ergo no contact. However, that is not tantamount to eliminating desire itself, yet it is a pain management tool/mechanism. Under those circumstances, it is not employed as a silent treatment punishment because it is being utilized as a survival mechanism.

Though, I have never been an enthusiastic proponent of no-contact regarding my own partnership/BPD story--I do accept that it serves a purpose for many. Generally, I shy away from no-contact, because for me, it compartmentalizes segments of my life that I view as a continuum. There are chapters in my story, though it remains a work in progress. Beginning, middle and the ongoing, all have meaning to me--and I do not feel the desire to archive the characters who have mattered. However, some here have experienced what they consider to be traumatic abuse. It is very difficult to reconcile abuse with lingering or past desire, because on its face it appears illogical--though we know that those two oppositional elements may be present in these relationships  Therefore, the tool of no-contact can assist while that painful dualistic tension is being sorted out.

So, we possess both commonalities and differential experiential notions regarding these matters of the heart, as all things change.         

     

Right, yeah--each of our stories is unique. I apologize for repeating myself but, briefly:

--was unexpectedly told I'd been replaced. It was a period when we'd been friendly but not romantic. Still, it hit hard. He raged, then blocked and froze me out for a month.

--spent a few weeks thinking about everything and wrote him a letter apologizing for my considerable role in what happened. Asked for another chance.

--he called. He said he'd never worked so hard to get over anyone, I'd been his great love, but he'd moved on, implied it wasn't necessarily permanent ("i don't want to do anything with you while i'm with her"--which was insulting, the assumption that i would settle for being side action, but whatever). We spoke for a while and agreed to be friends. I let him know I wanted more but would respect his boundaries. Delusional, but deep in love and shock.

--he played cat and mouse for months, then raged and blocked and froze me out.

Technically I think you'd say I'm DNR (was hoping to resuscitate but no longer). Anyhow, not dogging him after he ghosted isn't "silent treatment."

As for getting on with my life: trying! Honest! Been in T 2x weekly for a year.

Also, I was recently diagnosed with complex ptsd, on top of severe recurrent depression, which makes "getting over it" a complicated matter

So that's one story. There are as many others as there are other members.   

Exactly! It's not the silent treatment when they - in words, or actions - tell you not to contact them. It's respecting their wishes, first of all. Second of all, it's self-protection against getting the same old push-away.

My ex *wanted* the silent treatment, and that's probably what's best for both of us until (if) something changes. She knows.

Umm... .unless they happen to be sex addicted waifs. The only thing my dBPDxgf was "faithful" about was faithfully hating herself after each and every time she cheated on me!  :)

It’s interesting how people are mentioning the difference between silent treatment and no contact. I have never pondered this before.

I would say that silent treatment is a passive aggressive form of communication to the perceived “wrong doer” where although that person has decided not to communicate with the other person, it is short lived and will only last until the anger has subsided or both parties have decided to talk. In short I would say silent treatment is a form of punishment.

No contact is when a person has decided that they want to detach themselves with the emotions that the other person brings.

Then you have low contact which is obviously for tying up loose ends, stuff at house needs to be collected, children, divorce, finances etc.

When a person with BPD leaves they rarely do it in a mature way that communicates to the other person they want to move on for the right reasons, and this is where it all becomes rather abusive. Before the BPD goes they will accuse their partner for the collapse of the relationship and rarely take any responsibility. Cruelly cutting them off without giving them the opportunity to counter their claims the partner is left with guilt, shame, anger and a whole mixture of emotions that cannot be expressed.

So from a BPD’s point of view I feel their lack of contact is a mixture of silent treatment (punishment) and no contact (detaching from the emotions you bring).

Consider another alternative here.  When one person is so hurt, angry and upset by something their partner did they have nothing to say to them that is constructive.  This isn't punitive silent treatment or NC, it is something entirely different.  Sometimes it is better to say nothing rather than letting the emotions do the speaking.

Can you give an example?

C.Stein,

You make a very good point.

To me ... when one has reached this point though, it is an indication that one has recognised one's own emotional dysregulation, where fair reasoning is overshadowed by emotion. So, one goes quiet and says nothing ... because saying anything, at that juncture, does more harm than good. That, to me, is healthy. However, depending on how long it takes to come back to baseline, whatever it was that was upsetting, in the first place, still remains to be addressed. Stuffing, suppressing and sweeping these things under the carpet is not healthy. I don't see this as silent treatment or NC ... I see this as someone who is in touch with themselves, mindful, self aware and fundamentally emotionally responsible, not only for themselves but for their SO's state of being too.

In essence ... one didn't 'lose' control and add fuel to an already raging fire.

Cluster B traited people struggle with this self driven/soothing emotional regulation and get carried off on the intense wave of emotion and can become abusive. Which is what is meant by 'don't take it personally'. Because it isn't ... but it is often hard to accept.

I still maintain that unless a person has decided to completely let go of another, and eradicate them from their lives, for a healthier option ... it isn't NC ... !

So I think this is a semantic matter. There's a taxonomy on the site here somewhere that calls what you describe as the "release with grace" phase. Many need to go through a NC phase to get there--which is where many here are at. This isn't the same as silent treatment, though--for all the reasons already stated.

Hi steelwork   :) :)

What about the use of the term "breaking no contact".

I dont like it personally because it sub-communicates that you have failed and need to start all over agin.

If you have given up smoking for a year but had one or two cigarettes within that year then for me you have given up smoking for a year regardless.

If you have been NC for a year and happened to send a couple of text here and there then you have been NC for a year.

 

That means exactly that . That's why I asked if you regret it or not.

Not a specific one, but generally speaking it usually involved a boundary being crossed.  I know for myself there were several instances where I was so hurt by something my ex said or did I simply did not have anything to say.  I wasn't punishing her I was simply too emotional to really say anything constructive.  

That said, as our relationship progressed instead of talking about things once the rational mind was back in control I just let it go with little to no discussion, particularly when I had already discussed similar or identical issues with her before and got nowhere.   This was the wrong thing to do on many different levels.


Sweeping things under the carpet is certainly not healthy.  My ex was literally a pro at doing this and I let her do it more times than not.  I unfortunately allowed this to happen for several reasons.  

First I don't like confrontation, never have.  That is not to say I won't discuss things that bother me and I did with her at one point in our relationship.  However after repeated seeing her sink into a self-pitying depression time and time again with no constructive bidirectional dialogue occurring and nothing really being resolved I stopped trying to talk things out and let her sweep things under the carpet.  

I also did this because I was afraid of negatively impacting what she needed to focus on at the time and by doing so I sacrificed my own emotional well being and the health of the relationship.   I also didn't want to be put in the position where she could point her blame finger at me and say it's your fault I failed.  

This was a full on FOG response by me.  This was obviously not the right thing to do ... .not for me or her or our relationship.  

Sad thing is she is almost certainly pointing her blame finger at me anyway (post discard) because it is what she needs to do in order to justify all her hurtful, wrong and destructive behavior.  She needs to feel that she is a good person and the only way she can do that is blame me for everything.

This is true but it takes time to get to that point. If I want to be honest with my self I should say I have initiated no contact (and told him so because i felt like it and so that he wouldn't perceive it as ghosting or silent treatment) but a part of me isn't ready to let go completely. I blocked him on all social media but not on my phone. I just have his texts going to a spam folder so that I read them when ever I feel stronger to do so. I still get some texts from him. I even broke no contact (only by responding) a couple of times but I have learned from it. I am definetely in a much better place than I was a month ago. It takes times to get to the point of letting go of hope. It can't happen instantly. But at least by doing this couple of things gave me some distance and lifted the FOG in a big way. The thought of not having him in my life isn't so unbearable any more. It hurts but doesn't cause me despair as it used to.

I don't know if my title-question is clearly understood or not.

When I asked if anyone regretted breaking NC, this underlines this case of scenario:

You are in a relationship with your BPDgf/bf, but at some point the r/s becomes so unbearable (suicide threats, suicide attempts, you get depressed, you feel like a zombie and have become a shadow of yourself, etc.) that you express the wish to break up as you feel there is nothing that can save your r/s any more. So, you break up. Now, as soon as you broke up your exBPDgf/bf hammers you, bombards you with telephone calls, with messages, harasses you, stalks you and it becomes so unbearable that you have no other choice but to initiate NC in order to make all this pressure that you can't take any more stop.

Now, among of you who have lived such a scenario (or similar), after managing to hold on to your NC and after awhile when you felt weak and thought that maybe your exBPDgf/bf changed or came to her/his senses during the NC time, have you broken that NC and if yes, have you regretted it afterwards?

This is the real subject of this thread.

In my experience I broke nc 3 months out. It was a moment Of weakness and I had been drinking. I texted and she responded . She didn't want to talk about us or relationship . Told me the door is shut. Couldn't have been colder. This was a woman I left my wife for. Anyway she said we could be friends lol. It set me back big time. I regretted it and haven't contacted since beginning of oct. I still have bad days here and there and think sometimes about texting. But I don't because nothing good will come of it. If she wanted to talk she can reach out to me. Nc is the way to go if you want to move on . It's not easy. But it is possible.

Penelope,

I liked and related to your post.

In cases where physical abuse has taken place ... adoption of NC, in its purest form ... just seems logical and easy in decision. Emotional abuse, however, is insidious ... and all strategy on the way to full blown NC seems to be a process. A prelude, I guess, to the final, committed decision to adopt NC proper.

Here's the rub though ... what makes a broken nose, or a punch in the mouth more significant than someone repeatedly and knowingly hurting your feelings, breaking your basic human rights or lying, cheating and wilfully distorting your reality, knowingly to hide some pretty shabby and unsociable behaviour? Just because it can't be seen ... doesn't excuse the crime, does it? And, the sooner the adoption of NC the better ... !

Driver,

I believe your survey does answer some questions ... to date, there's a pretty substantive statistical significance; regardless of how NC is understood or quantified. The answer so far is NO ... but what amount of data do you need to collect ... and how will you statistically analyse it given that there is no control group? Superficially it gives an answer but there are too many confounding variables. It isn't going to make it into the annuls of 'Scientific America' and what are you trying to show?

Emotional bonds are tough to break and it seems to me ... that unless you're resolute in the early stages to adopt NC, without the need for understanding and answers as to why ... it is more like a war of attrition of communication and silent separation, which erodes the bond by the very nature of the dynamic, until finally one just doesn't care anymore, has had enough, and the need for closure has no value anymore.

The idea arises whether the concept of NC exists at all when it comes to emotional or psychological abuse.

A good thread.

Caley, I'd be curious to hear more of your experience if you feel okay about sharing. If not, I totally get that.

(Apologies if this isn't relevant to the topic, but I'd like to understand where you're coming from.)

NC from the "non's" perspective might be considered necessary, however when the coin is flipped and the ex is the one doing the NC (eg. ghosting, deleting, trashing, etc... .) it can be incredibly hurtful to the "non".  Seems to me there is a double standard here.

I don't think there's a double standard. I believe there are respectful ways to handle it. If he had said, "I wish no further contact because x."-- i.e. been transparent and acknowledge me as a person -- well, it still would have been a bummer. But it would not be ghosting, which is abusive.

Steelwork,

I've read a lot of your posts and found some gravitas in them. Curious is good ... isn't it?

I'd be happy to share ...

You can private message me if you'd prefer ... that way we wouldn't be disrupting this thread.

C.Stein,

No-one gets to hurt you unless you give them permission to.

Not following you here.  I never gave my ex permission to hurt me.  The very nature of relationships means people will be hurt at times.  The only way to not "give permission" would be to not get emotionally involved with another person.

Yes ... I can see this might seem vague.

Can I ask you some questions?

Can you cast your mind back and remember the first time, in your relationship, when you recognised that you felt hurt by your SO's words, actions, attitude or behaviour?

What did you do about it?

Think about it ... you don't have to answer publicly unless you are comfortable with that.

All that is needed is to recognise the first time your boundaries were breached. Did you, at that point, defend your values or did you ... which I suspect you did, give the benefit of doubt?

If you opted to give benefit of doubt (because overly kind people do that) without voicing concern, then you've neglected to defend your values. And, when you neglect to defend your values you give permission to someone to breach your boundaries. Result = hurt.

If you don't stand up for yourself, for what is important to you, your beliefs ... who else is there to do that job? No-one ... you have abandoned yourself in favour of another who might not have your best interests at heart.

You are not here ... experiencing consciousness ... by some mysterious, wave wanding, cosmic mistake. You have at your disposal everything you need to create anything you want.

When you let someone hurt you once ... you can forgive yourself. When you let someone hurt you again and again ... it is because you've given them permission to ... by not defending your rights to be treated with compassion.

I brought up my concerns, both in an extensive email and followed by a discussion.  This happened on every occasion when I felt she stepped across the line ... .until I stopped doing it (the emails), mostly because I grew tired of spending so much time essentially talking to myself and I had withdrawn/distanced myself to the point where some of the boundary busting (ex. suicide threats, breakup threats) just didn't affect me anymore (or at least not consciously).  This is my fault and my responsibility and now I believe these did still affect me even though at the time I am certain I just blew it off (oh this again).   Kinda like crying wolf.

Trust me you, when she seriously crossed the line it was made very clear she had.  She could (and did on several occasions) shove me over the edge and I allowed myself to be someone I am not (eg. an emotionally driven response).

One doesn't (shouldn't) condemn another without giving them the benefit of the doubt at least once or twice.  My problem, and probably the problem of most everyone on this board, is continuing to give the benefit of the doubt when it probably shouldn't have been given.


I still don't see this as giving them permission, especially when rights were defended and progress was made (to some extent).  I see this more as allowing myself to be continually hurt by remaining in a situation where that potential existed (i.e. any relationship).  In some relationships that potential is just greater than others, like a relationship with someone who suffers from a PD.  The important question to answer in this situation is, does the good outweigh the bad.  In my case it did for the most part, but the bad cut deep and the wounds never really healed before the next cut came.  Also consider the alternative, walking away, was the more painful option at the time.

I don't feel it is wrong to believe in the good in someone, particularly when that good represents a majority not a minority.

I hear what you say C.Stein ... and I experienced something similar. I relate to your point of feeling like you're 'talking to yourself'. It did occur to me that extolling the significance of empathy was fruitless ... and, even trying to do so ... was a red flag.

Is there much difference between allowing and permission?

Caley, the objective of this thread is not a scientific one. It's a simple discussion with people who have experienced similar things and who have learned their lessons from the difficult relationships they had. Furthermore, I hoped that by sharing their experience, their stories might help people who are feeling desperate in their relationship.

As far as the survey is concerned, it was pure curiosity from my part, not a tool to measure anything nor to draw any kind of scientific conclusions.

To me, NC is not always a choice, but the only escape from hellish threats, stalking and harassment. And I simply wondered how many of us were in similar situation and if soem of us have already experienced what is like to break the NC after awhile i.e. was it helpful or pointless.

It could be just semantics, but in many cases I think there is a difference.  We allow ourselves to be in a relationship that could potentially lead to emotional pain.  This is not giving the other person permission to hurt us but rather choosing to believe more in the potential good rather than the potential bad.  Now when the bad becomes more than the good one might argue the concept of allowing vs. permission are one and the same.

I don't agree. PwBPD have a serious mental sickness, although you don't see it at first glance. One of the characteristics of that sickness of theirs is that they may experience what is called "splitting". They split you and paint you  black and it is as though you never existed. They simply ignore you or impose ST with no apparent reason other than because of their sickness.

It is unfair to compare it with a situation in which a nonBPD tries everything what's in his/her power to improve the relationship and when he/she sees that nothing helps. When the final option is to leave and the exBPDgf/bf desperately clings on you to the point where you get yourself depressed and mentally and even physically sick, and you know that because of their sickness it is up to us to set the limits, there seems to be no other options left than NC, for their sake and for our sake in order to overcome and to heal when it gets overly toxic.

This is simply inaccurate. When you love someone and when that someone betrays you, cheats on you, cuts their wrists, threatens you to commit suicide, ends up in a psychiatric hospital, and what not, what do you do not to get hurt by all these things? Unless you never felt anything for your partner, indeed you don't get hurt. But what kind of relationship would that be then? A platonic one?

Can we all agree that breakups are traumatic, relationships end and that freaking sucks no matter what, and that NC is often applied for different reasons in different situations?

No Contact is what was ultimately required with my uBPDex, for both of us. If she truly is BPD (and I think that she is, or certainly displays traits of it), she was acting out of her disease (there's no other explanation), and all efforts to make things better on both of our parts ultimately failed. We still love each other, and there's a lot of grief on both sides, but there's nothing to be done, and being in contact was making things worse. That's my No Contact in this situation, and it might be different for other people in other situations.

In my case, before going NC, I had warned my exBPDgf. I said that I was going to go NC if she one too many times attempted to commit suicide. Especially because she wanted me to be her accomplice! She wanted me to provide her pills from pharmacy. She threatened me to ruin my lifeand my family's members' lives if ever I warned anyone around her of her intention to commit suicide.

So I said to her that I refused to be her accomplice, that I felt unable to help her and that from now I was going to go NC. She tried to commit suicide anyway. She missed. But then she bombarded me with rage for not being there for her and for not answering her any more.

I broke up contact and tried to reason her anyway. But when I broke NC she insulted me with awful words and told me not to contact her or else she'd file a complain to the police. I tried to calm her down, it didn't work. So I went NC. But when I went NC again, she was the one who harassed me, wo stalked me, who insulted me, who threatened me with worse threats.

In any case I felt whatever I did was not good. No help possible whatsoever, and no discussion possible whatsoever.

So, I think once again, it is unfair to compare it with ST. I sometimes wonder if some people do realize what is like to break up with a BPDgf/bf who clings on you in an unhealthy and toxic way?