Tools to de-escalate

[3birds]

My wife has BPD. I am finally waking up to the idea that this isn’t going to get better by explaining, by trying to convince or show her why her way of thinking is wrong, by ignoring it, or by trying to be perfect so as to not incur her wrath.

I have read about validation and JADE, and although I am very new to all of this I am beginning to understand that it’s going to take a LOT of work from me to make things better. She told me right off the bat that she had BPD but she also told me she was “much better now” which I can only assume was best misleading and at worst an outright lie.

Anyway, here’s the problem. She dysregulates often - probably once per day. My success with dealing with this has been extremely poor. I know that I now need to set clear boundaries as far as how I will allow her to talk to me and treat me. The problem is that she hates when I try to walk away from an argument. She’s told me in no uncertain terms that walking away is the worst thing I could do. Now, I know I have to tell her “tough crap”  and walk away anyway and not worry about her reaction to this. I’m working up to that and next time she dysregulates I am out the door. But how do I do that? What is the best thing to tell her to let her know why I’m not sticking around to argue? To be abused? What should I actually say that will be most effective in letting her know that I won’t be treated like that ever? She is going to claim that I’m “going to meet some slut” which is how she has kept me from leaving up until now. I had to prove to her that there was nobody else so I stayed and argued and got completely destroyed as a result. How do I present it to her so that she knows exactly why I’m not going to be treated like that?

Also, do I have to do this every time she is crappy to me? Because it happens very often and I feel like I’m going to have to get another apartment just so I have somewhere to go every time this happens.

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[babyducks]

Hello 3birds,

My wife has BPD. I am finally waking up to the idea that this isn’t going to get better by explaining, by trying to convince or show her why her way of thinking is wrong, by ignoring it, or by trying to be perfect so as to not incur her wrath.

I hope you are giving yourself credit for the change in your thinking about this.   Its a big step to move from an attitude of "I'll explain it" to an attitude of "I'll understand this".    nice job.    it also takes some time to move an attitude or approach into a different place.   it takes work and effort and some tinkering of finding what works and what doesn't.     everyone is slightly different when it comes to what tools work and how to employ them.

I have read about validation and JADE, and although I am very new to all of this I am beginning to understand that it’s going to take a LOT of work from me to make things better.

Validation and JADE sound simple but in reality they are far from simple or easy.   Lets think about Validation first... everyone, and I do mean everyone does better in a highly validating environment.     What does highly validating environment mean?    that on a constant and regular basis validation is used to create a relaxed and trusting environment.   Validation has to be real, in that it has to be something you would normally say and actually believe.   Validation has to be personal, not a line memorized from a book.    Validation creates an emotional connection.    Validation is not usually going to work in a crisis situation to put out  a fire.   Its more meant to lower the stress and tension before the crisis breaks out.    Its a skill, like playing the piano.    The more you do it, the more you consciously think about it the better you get at it.    Practice here.   Practice with people other than your wife.   and what ever you do; don't be Invalidating.

which brings me to JADE (justify, argue, defend, and explain).    Don't JADE.   It's invalidating.   Instead of JADE - try active listening.    Instead of JADE - try SET.

SET = Support, Empathy, Truth.   a three point statement that acknowledges your wife before you state your truth.    as a quick example something like:

Support = What you are saying is important to me.   
Empathy = It's not good for either of us to argue like this.
Truth =  I don't want to fight anymore so I am going to take break and come back later.

The problem is that she hates when I try to walk away from an argument. She’s told me in no uncertain terms that walking away is the worst thing I could do. Now, I know I have to tell her “tough crap”  and walk away anyway and not worry about her reaction to this.

OOooph.   You aren't really going to tell her "tough crap"   right?   That's horribly invalidating.

Let's start to pull apart what is going on when she tells you that walking away is the worst thing you can do.

What do you think is happening when you walk away?   Dig deep and think about this?   What's going on with your wife when an argument breaks out?

People with BPD have highly harmfully intense emotions, that are often puzzling to us.   Hard to understand.   Difficult to relate to.    We often invalidate those emotions.   "How on earth can you say I'm going off to meet some slut, that's just nuts?"   pwBPD often feel like they aren't heard or understood.

a highly validating environment goes a long way to creating a sense of being heard and understood.

abruptly leaving and argument with tough crap (or something like that) pours gas on the fire of not being heard or understood.

I’m working up to that and next time she dysregulates I am out the door. But how do I do that? What is the best thing to tell her to let her know why I’m not sticking around to argue? To be abused? What should I actually say that will be most effective in letting her know that I won’t be treated like that ever?

Practice here.   try some of your thoughts out here and see how they feel and what feed back you receive.    when you start to walk away,... it matters what you say as you leave the argument.   Do not stand there and absorb verbal abuse.   When you leave do it in a way that does not escalate the fight.    what do you think of these suggestions.

"wife's name,    I don't want to fight with you any more, its not good for us.   I'll be back later to talk when things are calmer."   -->  when things are calmer NOT when you are calmer.

"This doesn't feel like a productive conversation any longer,   lets think about ways to keep this civil and talk later."

"When I get called names I feel upset and angry so I need to leave the room (house) until things feel better."

She is going to claim that I’m “going to meet some slut” which is how she has kept me from leaving up until now. I had to prove to her that there was nobody else so I stayed and argued and got completely destroyed as a result. How do I present it to her so that she knows exactly why I’m not going to be treated like that?

pwBPD have low self esteem and don't believe they deserved to be loved and fear abandonment.   "Going to meet some slut" is more an expression of her fears than an expression of your behavior.    It's a maladaptive coping trait to project her fears onto you.    Can you see how that works?   By accusing you of leaving her, you "had to prove to her that there was nobody else".   but that never really works.   because by proving there is no one else you are "validating the invalid"... another key component of this tricky validation thing.    Don't validate the invalid.

wife:   You are keeping someone on the side... you are seeing other women...
3birds:   It feels really sad that you would say something like that.   

Also, do I have to do this every time she is crappy to me? Because it happens very often and I feel like I’m going to have to get another apartment just so I have somewhere to go every time this happens.

One size does not fit all.    It depends on the amount/level of crappy.    Hanging in there for a 3 hour knock down drag out argument?   I'd say no, absolutely not.   Trying to weather a 5 to 10 minute outburst - maybe depending how its playing out.

and FWIW,  when I was with my Ex I did keep a condo in the city for times when I had to leave our home in the country.    It was a comfortable place to go when the arguments got out of control.

well that's a lot.   what do you think?

'ducks

[3birds]

That’s what I was looking for, thank you. I didn’t realize how often I was validating the invalid. Just about everything she says when we argue is invalid, which is what makes me want to pull my hair out in frustration. I know I can’t be a part of that any more. I wish I never had in the first place but I can only change that which has not happened yet.

Her controlling nature has been ruining my life. I am an independent person who would never normally stand for any of this, but I have been a frog in a frying pan, slowly letting through little injustices that have accumulated into what it is now.

I am going to dive in and give this 100%. A big part of me thinks that I should just leave and not bother. But I have done that in the past with such challenges and I want to be able to look back at my past self and say “I didn’t just run away out of fear that it would be difficult.” Still, I don’t know how much confidence I have that I can really change anything.

Just recently she told me that I don’t need to be taking advice from “random people on the internet.” She is obviously quite afraid of what I will learn. She is scared that the power dynamic will change (which is going to have to happen if we are going to stay together). She wants me to read from one specific book and she says that all her behavior that I call abusive has nothing to do with her BPD, that it is all because I don’t show her enough affection. This will be a major hurdle I imagine.

She has done about 6-7 years of therapy but it didn’t include any DBT because, she claims, “it doesn’t work.” I have a feeling that she’s missing the most important piece because she’s afraid of it, but my understanding of DBT is limited so I don’t really know.

I know I need to get professional help for sure. Whether she joins me or not, and whether I can find her someone who can treat her is a different story.

Thanks for the practical advice. There is evidence that what I’ve learned here so far has been helping where nothing at all I was doing on my own has. So thank you and while I have a long way to go it’s really good to know that I’m not alone

[babyducks]

I didn’t realize how often I was validating the invalid. Just about everything she says when we argue is invalid, which is what makes me want to pull my hair out in frustration. I know I can’t be a part of that any more.

hello again 3birds,

I am going to borrow a quote from a moderator here.   Its an older quote but she said it better than I can so:

A person who is highly sensitive, extremely emotional, very reactive, and with severe shame issues  will most likely NOT express their primary emotions clearly. They will go straight to secondary emotions, since they feel easier to express. Over time, the pwBPD has gotten better responses from displaying their secondary emotions, so the primary ones of fear, worry, sadness will get buried under the anger.

The invalid parts of the argument could be a way your wife off loads her intense negative emotions.    If its terrifying that the person you depend on for your emotional stability might leave you and you have maladaptive coping traits, one of the things that happens is that you express that fear as an attack.  "It's your fault I can't trust you... you are never really there for me."   Or I don't feel loved because you never show me enough affection.    For my Ex it was I didn't send her enough cards in the mail.     For her, getting a random romantic card in the mail was very important, intensely important.    It was not really my thing but because I knew it mattered to her I would send an occasional card.   Thing was, and I bet you can guess this,... there were never enough cards for her.   My displays of affection always had to be 'bigger and better' to make a difference to her.    We did have conversations about how I chose to display affection and how it had to be genuine and meaningful to me but that wasn't an idea that my Ex could grasp.

Just recently she told me that I don’t need to be taking advice from “random people on the internet.” She is obviously quite afraid of what I will learn.

hmmmmm.    that's an odd remark.    why would she say that?   I would recommend, strongly recommend that you do not tell her you visit this website.    I would also recommend you not discuss with her what you are learning here and through your reading.   It can be vastly triggering for a pwBPD to learn they are being discussed.    Additionally what you are learning/reading should be private,.. something for you.    There should be boundaries about what you share.

She has done about 6-7 years of therapy but it didn’t include any DBT because, she claims, “it doesn’t work.” I have a feeling that she’s missing the most important piece because she’s afraid of it, but my understanding of DBT is limited so I don’t really know.

I know I need to get professional help for sure. Whether she joins me or not, and whether I can find her someone who can treat her is a different story.

My Ex had done 7 years of therapy, when we met.   She was committed to regular therapy, compliant with medication and had assembled a very good mental health team.    She was, truly,... very much better and fairly self aware.     My Ex recommended I get a therapist very early on and I did, to help with the stress and strain in the relationship.      It was very helpful to me.

My Ex is Bipolar I comorbid with BPD and during a stressful period in her life she dysregulated so badly she became psychotic.    Our relationship did not survive that psychotic break.    It was just too hard on both of us to try and remain together.   Still I don't regret trying.     and the one comfort I have is that I did everything I possible could to make the relationship work.

I would still recommend you practice here what you want to say to your wife during an argument.   during the heightened emotions of an argument its hard to express yourself.    and small simple tweaks can make a difference in how the message is received.     these are advanced communication skills, they don't come easily.

'ducks