How to change some patterns of responsibility?

[sadeyes]

Hi Everyone,

I need some ideas on changing some dynamics of responsibility.

We have worked into a dynamic where I am doing most of his care almost like he is handicapped. I think this really took hold a couple of years ago when he suffered a back injury,, and really needed my help for a recovery period.

He does almost NOThING for hinself, and any attempt to shift responsibility back to him meets severe dysregulation and raging. I think this is compounded by the fact that he lost his dad 2 yrs old and mom at 4 yrs old, and never again had a 'mothering' figure. He finds someone doing mothering things for him as a show of love & someone not as a lack of love.

He asks me to lay out clothes, I have been asked to physically dress him. Physically bathe him, in addition to things that would be the more mainstream 'stay at home mom' type things. He has shown jealousy when I have 'mothered' the dog even though the dog obviousally can fix his own meals or take a bath by himself.

At times, he also seems to be triggered by my going places like work (almost like some little kids are upset by mommy 'leaving them'

Suggestions on how to get back to a more normal balance?

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[allibaba]

Sadeyes,

Its so good to hear from you!  You were one of the first people that I talked to at the beginning of my journey!

I had this exact same scenario with my husband (though his was because he had ankle surgery and a 18 month recovery) followed by a whole bunch of health problems.

Best advice I can give is to start small and slowly but surely push him towards doing things for himself.  My husband also occasionally gets triggered by me leaving.  I validate the feelings but do not change my behavior (i.e. don't come home early). 

Now I have my husband doing laundry, cleaning floors, sometimes doing grocery shopping, making his own breakfasts and lunch.  Start slow though... .(for example) if you want him to make his own breakfast tell him that you have to leave early one day and that he'll need to fend for himself.  Then leave the cereal out, the bowl out and the spoon out.  He'll start to get self esteem from doing things for himself.

[sadeyes]

It is good to hear from you too! I know we had a lot in common in the h behavior department! I have read you are doing really well! I read here all the time, but don't post too much. I only use my phone to access the site, and it is a hassle to post with the phone. Things have been a bit better in the duration of the dysregs, but not the frequency. The good news is I drop everything and go away at those times.

Biggest problems of the month are him wanting me to do 'mommy' )things, and the fact that I am in a way bullied into never being able to verbalize any complaints I have with out rage and complete shutdown.

[allibaba]

Waverider says:

ABUSE---> BOUNDARIES

DEMANDS--->:)ISENGAGING

I have found success not spending too much time talking about what I want.  I just decide what I want and then GO FOR IT.

If you want him to do more for himself... .start small and make it happen.  I got my husband to start helping around the house by saying 'man, I really can't do all of this.  Could you come and help me fold some laundry.'  If he says no, then I say ok.  I just wanted to be proactive so that our housework doesn't get out of control.  If you are ok letting it sit around then I am too.

I think that its less invalidating asking them to help out than assigning a chore

[dawnjd]

Waverider says:

ABUSE---> BOUNDARIES

DEMANDS--->:)ISENGAGING

I have found success not spending too much time talking about what I want.  I just decide what I want and then GO FOR IT.

If you want him to do more for himself... .start small and make it happen.  I got my husband to start helping around the house by saying 'man, I really can't do all of this.  Could you come and help me fold some laundry.'  If he says no, then I say ok.  I just wanted to be proactive so that our housework doesn't get out of control.  If you are ok letting it sit around then I am too.

I think that its less invalidating asking them to help out than assigning a chore

Bingo. I have been doing the same. 1) Accepted the fact that the house being clean is important to me 2) started doing it and keeping up with it myself. 3) have decided that it is important enough that if I have to do it all myself, then SO will miss out of spending extra time with me. 4) work very hard to not be resentful that he doesn't help or or feel it is important (Zen mind, zen mind)

As for needing to be mommied... .I just won't put up with that. SO gets very mommy-needy when he gets "sick" (because everything is a HUGE ILLNESS with him), I give him the stuff to take and it is up to him to take it and take care of himself. If he refuses to take action to feel better, it is his owe choice.

[waverider]

It is a big task and achieving complete balance and fairness is unlikely, but you have to start somewhere and have a sense of focus and direction. At the moment you feel like the problem is probably just about everything, and totally overwhelming.

The starting point is to prioritize what is important to you, not just a wish list, and what is also not that important (whilst your at it complaints). Trying to badger, nag and negotiate changes wont happen. Start off by doing things that impact your life, cleaning up mess that effects you etc, regardless of whose 'responsibility" it should be. This is because having to live in consequences that effect you will increase your stress and resentment.

This will leave you to just deal with those issues where the outcome does not physically affect you, aside from sulks, dramas and issues from your partner for not doing them. To these you can address the principles of disengaging and boundaries, let the rest slide for now. Stay consistent, it will take a while to break this entrenched pattern.

It is not particular issues you are really tackling, but rather an entrenched mindset. This is like trying to shift a boulder, setting the process in motion is the hardest bit, so keep it simple. Once their mindset has shifted so they are forced to do something for themselves, they start feeling more capable and find reward in their achievements. The rest will become "easier'.

Though it is still like pushing a boulder, left to its own devices it will stop. There will be a limit to how much of your time and effort you wish to expend pushing, so you will have to be clear in your own mind what is not acceptable and what you can just learn to accept. 50/50 responsibility is rarely achievable, nor necessary, just so long as they are making some effort and you dont feel like a complete door mat, then you can get on with your own stuff.

It is too easy to enable someone to become disabled out of kindness and guilt.

I have this as an underlying problem. At the moment it has been set back a bit due to cancer and chemotherapy giving a legitimate need for extra care.

The core problem is not getting them to do stuff, it is about preventing your resentment about the situation. The solution lies somewhere in the middle, address it from both ends.

I trade off pandering to some neediness issues by taking off some untouchable quality "me" times, where there used to be non. eg tomorrow I will putting the kayak on the car and head off to the bay fishing before dawn and I will be back when I am done, most likely early evening. That would never have been possible once, but that is my price for allowing some of the needs, it is understood now and there are no complaints. By not being there my partner is also forced to do stuff for herself as a side benefit.

Needs often only exist because there is a means of fulfillment available.

[Chosen]

A short answer: stop doing things for him.

Basically, unless it's something that he wants you to do, and you are happy to do for him without resentment, and that you think it's ok, just stop doing it.

It works, because when we first got married I try so hard to do everything for him.  And he took full advantage of it.  E.g. he would literally throw his clothes on the floor when he gets back, to have me pick them up.  He would ask me where is x and where is y, and when I say I don't know he would dysregulate and call me a bad wife.  The only thing I got in return was him dysregulating and thinking I didn't do anything for him, because I can never do it good enough. 

He used to tell me when his credit card statement is due, and if he forgets because I forgot to remind him, it’s solely my fault because HE ALREADY TOLD ME, right?

Later, I have learnt to respect my own value, “Do it willingly or don’t do it at all.” And “Know my emotional and physical limits.”

I stopped doing things for him simply because he “expected” me to.  I still do some things for him, but only when I want to :P  Say, he throws his clothes on the floor, and if I don’t feel like picking them up, I just don’t.  If he wants to lie there, certainly I can too.  Then the surprising thing is that he starts to do things for himself.

For example, in the past, when we get home, he would just leave the groceries by the door.  They could be left here for days.  But recently he actually started putting them away.  Last night he even put away a paper bag which I left on the floor after I bought stuff!  Now that’s a first…   Not always, but he is willing to be responsible for more stuff now.  As for stuff like bills, I don’t ask him about those, I don’t sort out his problems.  If he specifically asks me to help him remember something, I would, but I won’t take on extras.  Not being selfish, but it’s hard enough remembering everything for myself.  And the more we take on, the harder we fall. 

They can do stuff themselves.  It’s just that we usually make it so easy for them to NOT do anything, they have nothing to lose by being lazy.

[sadeyes]

Thanks everyone, and I agree that I have to get myself ready and just stop. I kinda feel like I need to tell him rather than just stopping. For example... .I have always done the laundry, so it would be unfair for me to suddenly stop without telling him, so he gets up for work & has no clean clothes.

Part of the problem is me too, in that I feel that I am always 2 step s behind of what needs to be done.

I am thinking I may try baby steps. 1. For laundry get a extra basket & tell him I am doing laundry on wed and sun or whatever. Whats in the basket will be washed & whats not... .he is on his own. For food, I think I am going to make a big effort to only eat at the table & everyone serves their own plate. If  he wants to eat in front of the tv... .his mess his problem!

[Chosen]

I am thinking I may try baby steps. 1. For laundry get a extra basket & tell him I am doing laundry on wed and sun or whatever. Whats in the basket will be washed & whats not... .he is on his own. For food, I think I am going to make a big effort to only eat at the table & everyone serves their own plate. If  he wants to eat in front of the tv... .his mess his problem!

That sounds like a good plan.  Yeah I don't mean stop out of the blue whatever you have been doing, but say if you only do laundry on wed and sun, and you will not wash the clothes not the in basket, you can let him know.  Then you follow that.  Which means if he didn't put any clothes in the laundry basket and ends up with no clothes to wear... .that's his problem.  It's difficult and of course he won't like having to conform to "your" rules, but the alternative is that you conform to "his" rules (the lack of any rule, which may change anytime depending on his mood), and we all know that in "his" rules you will always lose... .

[waverider]

Telling him is fine, but dont let him drag you into JADE. He will try, so don't start repeating yourself

Part of the problem is me too, in that I feel that I am always 2 step s behind of what needs to be done.

Like chasing the end of a rainbow. Neediness is black hole that can't be filled.