Anyone else super reluctant to share plans with SO?

[misuniadziubek]

Does anyone else experience a really deep reluctance when it comes to sharing plans with S.O?

My mom has been sick recently because she is overworked, so my dad suggested that she take a couple days off and go to a spa and retreat thing with me. I was more than happy to agree to it because I have seen how terrible she has been feeling and I know this trip will make a huge difference to her.

We leave on Sunday though and that's when I usually spend time with my BPDbf.

Honestly, I've been reluctant to tell him at all. I'm scared he's going to feel abandoned, get angry. Anything.

I have anxiety over it because of how things were in the past.

I have trouble being upfront and honest.

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[Samuel S.]

Your mom is an extremely important person in your life. Your BPDbf has extremely important people as well. Considering that your mom has been sick and overworked, you deserve to be with her. You are doing the honorable thing by being with her. If your BPDbf can't realize that, it says a lot about that person. I understand your reluctance and whatever happened in the past, but you love your mom. Also, there's something else to consider. If he has so much disregard of your feelings and of your mom, if you were to make a commitment to this person such as marriage, he would treat you sadly even worse. Indeed, taking a stand against such a person is the best thing you can do for you and for your mom who needs you!

[Moselle]

I do recognise it.

I also remember dreading the thought of telling her something I knew would be upsetting and therefore leaving to the last minute

[formflier]

  I have trouble being upfront and honest.  

       One other way to look at it, is to consider why you feel you have an obligation to tell him.  Sort of like many of the "nons" on here (me included) have a hard time sorting out the difference in privacy and secrecy.  pwBPD have "trained" us to be an open book, an over open book in my opinion.  If it doesn't involved them, it doesn't involve them.  They would have us think that the polite (or right) thing is to ask their permission or give them ever detail, so they could convince us to spend time with them instead.  In truth, the polite thing is to let him know that you have plans this weekend.  Label them family commitments.    I would stay away from giving many more details.  Remember:  Less is more  Enjoy the spa!      

FF

[Chilibean13]

I deal with this quite a bit. I've started letting him know about plan about 2 weeks ahead of time when possible. Enough time for him to freak out about it but also enough time that he can work through it.

Think of it this way, she is probably going to get mad whether you tell her today or tomorrow or Sunday. Why not just get it over with?

[unicorn2014]

How are things going with your boyfriend? If I remember your story correctly there was a problem because you were going to help his roommate on your essay and then he was critical towards you. I apologize if I got your story wrong.

[misuniadziubek]

How are things going with your boyfriend? If I remember your story correctly there was a problem because you were going to help his roommate on your essay and then he was critical towards you. I apologize if I got your story wrong.

Yeah. His roommate hates my guts. He still blames me for scr*wing it up but that doesn't come up unless I ask about her or he  gets super angry at me. He'll say things like, 'We already know you're not dependable.'

It doesn't really phase me any more because I solved the initial problem and have been thriving since, but it still hurts when he says that this is how I failed out of college.

Think of it this way, she is probably going to get mad whether you tell her today or tomorrow or Sunday. Why not just get it over with?

Yep. It's true. But at this point I just wait until he asks me first. Not the best strategy and he'll see through it.

Formflier you got everything down pat. Definitely on the overly open book thing. You must prove your honesty and trust. Except that 90% of the time he never tells me what's going on in his life unless he deems it important enough to tell me or he needs validation.

Last Wednesday he had a college exam. He didn't tell me about it and had I not been coincidentally in an online chat he frequents at the moment he mentioned it. I'd have never figured. He doesn't need to tell me it, so he doesn't, but then it made more sense to me why he passed out after at 9 and missed our scheduled Skype call.

My reluctance comes from our past situations. My parents once went to Vegas and left me with my brother for the week. I told my bf two weeks in advance that I wouldn't be able to spend that weekend with him and he was free to visit if he wanted. He got super angry for the next week, saying that I should have asked him first before agreeing to it.

   

Let's just say that was a horrible two weeks of texts. A lot of anger and tears on my part.

[unicorn2014]

Do you and your boyfriend define your relationship the same way? Does he also call you his girlfriend, or consider you his significant other?

[maxsterling]

Yes.  This is a natural coping mechanism that you developed after getting too many negative or stressful responses.  I reluctantly tell my W plans, because no matter how I tell her it seems to be a stressful exchange for me.  She either wants too many details, complains, or gets upset.  Doesn't really matter what the plan is.  If it is something I want to do and she doesn't, or if it is something I am doing without her, she's upset.  And if she is going to be upset no matter what I do - why not just either not tell her or tell her at the last minute, and deal with it then, rather than tell her long in advance and deal with the guilt trips and crap for a week or two?

[yeeter]

Ya, its unfortunate but many times its just 1) easier 2) more flexible 3) more likely to get what I want if I just dont share.

Its a form of control, in a passive aggressive way. 

Its not that I dont 'want' to share.  Its just that I have learned things go better (for me) if I make some of my own decisions and take some of my own actions, and simply 'inform'.

[maxsterling]

Ya, its unfortunate but many times its just 1) easier 2) more flexible 3) more likely to get what I want if I just dont share.

Its a form of control, in a passive aggressive way. 

Its not that I dont 'want' to share.  Its just that I have learned things go better (for me) if I make some of my own decisions and take some of my own actions, and simply 'inform'.

Exactly,  I can evaluate whether something is really her business or not.  If it is, she needs to know.  If not, telling her will likely only prompt an argument where she baits me to JADE.

If I want to go to an Alanon meeting, I can tell her a week in advance, and I will hear, "ok.  Why do you want to leave me alone?  Do you not like spending time with me? You are always gone and I am so lonely... ."  I will hear this for an entire week. Or, I can tell her half an hour before I leave, she will get mad, I leave, and it blows over in a few hours. 

[misuniadziubek]

Do you and your boyfriend define your relationship the same way? Does he also call you his girlfriend, or consider you his significant other?

Sometimes I'm reluctant to call him my bf. At best my partner, at worst my friend .This was especially true when we went through what I would call a therapeutic separation. I would call myself single.

He always refers to me as his gf or a highly affectionate made up nickname he has for me equivalent of calling me his one and only sweetheart, so definitely considers me his significant other.

We're also technically in an open relationship but this was only significant when we weren't seeing each other as often and as his transference when we were separated with vlc. We've both tried our luck with other people and had very similar negative experiences.

[misuniadziubek]

Ya, its unfortunate but many times its just 1) easier 2) more flexible 3) more likely to get what I want if I just dont share.

Its a form of control, in a passive aggressive way.  

Its not that I dont 'want' to share.  Its just that I have learned things go better (for me) if I make some of my own decisions and take some of my own actions, and simply 'inform'.

It's sad to admit this. I wish things were easier in that way. More balanced.

[yeeter]

Ya, its unfortunate but many times its just 1) easier 2) more flexible 3) more likely to get what I want if I just dont share.

Its a form of control, in a passive aggressive way. 

Its not that I dont 'want' to share.  Its just that I have learned things go better (for me) if I make some of my own decisions and take some of my own actions, and simply 'inform'.

It's sad to admit this. I wish things were easier in that way. More balanced.

Yes, I wish it were different as well.  But part of the process for me was detachment (hopefully with love, grieving of all that was, and will be lost (basically everything having to do with a healthy relationship), and then acceptance of reality as reality.

I sound harsh. Bitter. Sad.  But those aren't completely accurate.  I think 'indifferent' maybe is a good word.  In that I have accepted the reality for what it is.  I continue to work to make things better.  They may, or may not improve. That part is to a large degree out of my control.

Not that things aren't better.  They are a lot better overall. But some things are same old same old and have to be accepted as reality.  So adapt, move on with living life.  This includes sharing less, which has helped. 

[Notwendy]

Enjoy your time with your mother!

Relationships involve shared values. One thing we all know when we are in a relationship with someone else is how we got here! We all got here from a parent- either biologically or by adoption and that parent(s) is significant. It was our first relationship. It existed before our SO and for most of us, it is enduring. Unless there is some kind of issue with an overbearing or intrusive parent, an SO wanting to spend time with his or her parent is a given, it doesn't need to be explained.

If you have a routine with your bf and he is expecting you, then it is in fairness to him to tell him that you have plans with your mother, so that he can make plans of his own. Other than this, it needs no explanation as to why, or JADEing. It isn't a competition. It is your mom!

Your bf may make this into some issue of rejection, choosing your mother over time with him, but you don't have to buy into this. You have the right to choose to see your mother. It isn't a competition, although he may see it that way. This is his issue to deal with.

But I do get it. We have gone through this so many times with my mother w BPD. I really get the statement FF made about being trained to be an open book but as we have gotten older, we don't wish to share everything with her, especially because we know she shares everything with her FOO and some things we wish to keep private .We know that she's going to be furious, so yes, we decide when and how to tell her according to how we think we can handle it. It really feels icky and manipulative. It isn't easy to just tell her if it is something that she needs to know. Still - that is what we need to strive to do.

[waverider]

My problem with sharing plans far in advance with my wife is her inconsistency.  She tends to impose her needs, so you adapt and replan, she changes her needs, you have to change again. Then she cancels her needs. At the end of the day your plan is all messed up as it its full of edits and erasers blanks...

Of course experience teaches you what you can hold back on and what is best brought up early.

Too much information= too many chances to make it all harder than it need be.

[teapay]

If it is something that won't really impact my W, I generally don't tell.  But if it will, like spending money, leaving town, impacting schedules I do tell her soon and don't wait to the last minute.  I understand the trepidation because there often are some kind of reaction, but telling sooner than later seems to help things not spiral.  If I do something without her, the W often feels there is some kind of cosmic unfairness about it.  She is being denied something in someway, especially if whatever is the issue might bring me pleasure in someway.  It is hard to validate that without making her look bad.  At the end of the day, if it is something I have to do or really want to do, I'm probably just going to do it whether she likes it or not, but i try not to slam her over it.  I still feel like I'm running her over though.

[Notwendy]

There seems to be some kind of zero sum about things that, doing something we want is some kind of negative or unfair situation for them. The two are not necessarily connected. Sure, if someone took nice trips all the time, or spent all the money- that may be unfair, but in my experience it tends to be the other way- the non rarely doing things for themselves because it upsets the person with BPD.

I agree that telling at the last minute isn't the nicest thing to do. I have done this with my mother, to avoid weeks of questioning and more drama.

[unicorn2014]

Thank you for answering. I assume the open relationship was something mutually chosen.

---

I also can relate to your original subject, for me it is more bigger pictures issues as my pwBPD wants to plan a future with me but he's not available in the way I need him to be so I've learned not to talk about my future with him.

[misuniadziubek]

When I finally told him, it blew up into a big fight where he called me a lazy burnout because of my job situation, implying that because I had not yet gained employment, it's only fair that I dedicate my weekends to him.

He brought up thanksgiving again, pointing out how I -chose- to go to my brothers psych evaluation over being with him on Thanksgiving after telling him unknowingly that I'd be free. This of course led to him being phoneless in a the bad part of town and getting robbed, because -everyone- let him down.

This was after a very lovely morning together before I left. He knew I was leaving early. He didn't know where I was going of course.

And I was too honest. I deflected the question and brought up his reluctance to ever be okay with me spending time on the weekend with my mom.

And yeah. I feel like crap right now. I don't know. It was nice being with him and then boom, nuclear bomb.

[formflier]

  And yeah. I feel like crap right now. I don't know. It was nice being with him and then boom, nuclear bomb.

       Is there anyway to apply a boundary to not listening to his criticism after you informed him?  Not sure how that dynamic worked out, but it's obvious you would be better off having not heard what he had to say.        

FF

[unicorn2014]

Miz, I'm not sure if you got my question. Was this open relationship something you both chose?

[Notwendy]

Miz, you feel bad because you just got puked on.  

I mean it figuratively. I've been the recipient of emotional puke myself.

When someone can not manage their own bad feelings, they have to get it out. So they project them, blow up, and then, they feel better while the person projected on feels like puke, or at least is covered with it.

Where you went wrong is making a statement about him not accepting that you want to see your mom.

In the moment, it isn't about that. It isn't about anyone. It's about him feeling bad because his routine, his expectations, his security, his sense of control over you, ( which is really about feeling out of control with himself). He didn't get what he wanted, and he did just what a little kid does when they don't get what they want.

A tantrum.

Even if the reason for the tantrum is valid ( it usually is, when a parent says no). the kid does not understand why he can't have cookies for dinner. All he knows is he wants cookies and that big bad parent said no.

If someone has a stomach ache, and they throw up, they usually feel better. I bet it is all over for your bf, but not for you. I think keeping this perspective will help you not take it so personally.

As to the tantrum, if the kid has a tantrum and the parent lets him have cookies for dinner- what does the child learn? He learns that tantrums work! He gets cookies! He also knows that the parent does not mean what he/she says. The next time the parent says no, what do you think the kid will do?

So, lets say your bf has a fit, berates you for choosing to see your brother, and you decide to not visit your mom? What do you think will happen the next time you say you wish to spend time with your family?

Of course, we are not parents to our pwBPD and we should not treat them as children. However, this is what happens when, as a child, they learn that tantrums work for them in their homes. If this works, they do not learn other ways to communicate effectively. We can decide to not reinforce this behavior.

It gets better if- you do not take the behavior personally, so you become less sensitive to projections. And, you stand up for your boundaries.

Enjoy your visit with your mom

[yeeter]

In the moment, it isn't about that. It isn't about anyone. It's about him feeling bad because his routine, his expectations, his security, his sense of control over you, ( which is really about feeling out of control with himself). He didn't get what he wanted, and he did just what a little kid does when they don't get what they want.

A tantrum.

Even if the reason for the tantrum is valid ( it usually is, when a parent says no). the kid does not understand why he can't have cookies for dinner. All he knows is he wants cookies and that big bad parent said no.

If someone has a stomach ache, and they throw up, they usually feel better. I bet it is all over for your bf, but not for you. I think keeping this perspective will help you not take it so personally.

As to the tantrum, if the kid has a tantrum and the parent lets him have cookies for dinner- what does the child learn? He learns that tantrums work! He gets cookies! He also knows that the parent does not mean what he/she says. The next time the parent says no, what do you think the kid will do?

Of course, we are not parents to our pwBPD and we should not treat them as children. However, this is what happens when, as a child, they learn that tantrums work for them in their homes. If this works, they do not learn other ways to communicate effectively. We can decide to not reinforce this behavior.

It gets better if- you do not take the behavior personally, so you become less sensitive to projections. And, you stand up for your boundaries.

This is a good analogy.  Once you learn to recognize things as nothing more than another 'tantrum', you can keep your own emotional reflexes in check and apply boundaries. 

In fact, I have coached my kids on this very thing (just because mom is projecting stuff out on you that makes no sense, doesnt mean its true, and doesnt mean you have to own it).  My 11 year old is pretty good at sorting through it.

Another extension I will share came from a T after a few  joint sessions.  Her observation was that by definition, some of the things that one of us needed for a sense of calm, caused the other one stress.  Emotional projection to get stuff 'out' by my wife, was part of this.  She has to get it out before she can recover.

[isilme]

Yes.  I find myself gauging the best times to divulge when friend want to do things, or when we have an event to attend.  I was very surprised he decided to attend a wedding for a long time friend's little sister - he's been avoidant of weddings as much as possible, so much so we're just barely planning ours.

But yes.  I don't just tell him about things when I hear about them, as I know his mood will be dependent on if we go. 

[misuniadziubek]

Miz, I'm not sure if you got my question. Was this open relationship something you both chose?

Sorry I didn't realise you were asking. It was mutual. He was having a bit of a crisis because he said he loved me but didn't know how to handle never being with anyone else, considering I was his longest and most serious relationship but he never wanted to break up.

I was on board because i felt like it was something that would help him figure things out and at the same time freed me to experiment with things I wasn't as comfortable doing. I liked the transparency of the arrangement but at first when he did it. It made me extremely insecure and upset. I dealt with it. Things are fine.  No regrets because he met someone with BPD and it pushed him to get diagnosed.

I got mad when one person treated him badly. That is kind of weird

[unicorn2014]

Ok mis, thank you for answering.