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Author Topic: Why do I feel a deep shame, guilt and emptiness?  (Read 340 times)
mumuli

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Posts: 9


« on: November 26, 2013, 05:42:04 AM »

Hi everyone, I would like to share my story.

I am 27 (Chinese), and my exBPDgf is 23 (Caucasian). When we met, she was 19 and lived in poverty with her mother in a small town (BPD mother, abusive father, both passed as of 2013). We met at a local Celtic festival, where we fell in "love" in matter of weeks. I invited her to move into the city with me, and go to college. My family was happy to support her through college, since they liked her at the time.

The first two years were great. There was no stress in life, and we simply played video games all day. She enjoyed EVERYTHING I did, and we went EVERYWHERE together- we in inseparable. It never occurred to me that this girl has very little personality and hobbies (reading and some art), and that most things she tells me were things that I told her. Out convocations were mainly about trivial things (games, TV shows etc).

Trouble began once I started grad school. I became VERY busy, and I expected her to be busy as well with community college and her part time job at Starbucks, but she has significantly more free time. During of my time off, I have her attention, but would also relax by gaming. She then developed a habit of locking herself in the bed room continuously. And every night we have this conversation.    

ME: Hey babe, you dont look happy, wassap

HER: Nothing, I am fine

ME: You sure?

HER: I am ok, go play games with your friends.

ME: No, I want to spend some time with you.

HER: No, I am ok, go play games. I am not happy but I want you to be happy.

ME: I want you to be happy too, what can I do?

HER: Silence

ME: Ok, well if you need anything, let me know, I love you.

There was a time I became frustrated at her for not having her own life, and is almost like she is dependent on me to have a life FOR her (which is impossible). I was frustrated because the sex was bad (it was always bad, but I didn't mind), and masturbation felt better. I was frustrated that she cant understand the stress I was under, and keep requesting that I take her to places after 12 hours of classes. And I was frustrated that she cannot advocate for herself, and merely complain about everything, and then gets mad at me when I  something to help her- "People always doing things for me, like they think I am helpless". All she did was sit in bed.

Around June of this year, she met a female co-worker who is 19. They hit if off hard, and began to spend ALOT of time together- they called themselves "sisters". I was getting concerned because I notice that my ex was getting secretive with her phone, and would text late at night. I confronted her about her behavior and she replied "don't be silly". I did not feel validated at all, but she offered nothing more. At lease I can take solace to know that my ex is not gay (don't fight me on this one, I did ALOT of investigation to reach this conclusion.)  

A week later, I found note she wrote, saying "X may not be the one I marry". That send me into panic mode, and I confronted her with it. She told me that it was just something she wrote when she was feeling depressed, and that she has depression.

Since that day, I began walking on eggshells. Her affection slowly withdrew, and she blamed it on the "depression". She needed to spend the night with her friend's family in order to "take care of her depression". I did not like it, but I was unable to get mad at her because I believed that it was her depression doing this. She texted me "I love you, and I appreciate your understanding, your are a wonderful Husband" every day. whenever I openly communicate to her that my needs are no being met, she would either dissociate, snap saying "it is only temporary!", or "don't be silly". Still, I became more desperate, and began putting my feelings aside for the needs of her "depression".

Last week, I sat down with her and told her that I am willing to be loving, patient, emotionally, and finical supportive. She said "I don't even know if I love you" and I replied "it is ok, you loved me for all these years, it is the depression. If you don't want to be affectionate, it is ok, I will be patient and wait until you get better". She then left for her friend's place. Later that night, one of our mutual friend called me, saying that my ex was saying weird things like "I don't have depression, I am just not happy with him". I was crushed.    

My ex and I met up the next day, and she broke up with me. She said "I am doing this because it is unfair for you to deal with my depression. When you become more successful with your school, you will be leave me for someone else. I am too depressed to go to school. I need to take some time off to take care of this this depression and find myself. There is a possibility that we may be together again, once I fix myself, I will come find you." And then she was EXTREMELY affectionate towards me. She INSISTED to hold my hand as I was dropping her off. Once I dropped her off, I was in tears. But she walked off like nothing happened.

She is living with her friend's family now, I don't know how she is supporting herself- I am still paying her phone bill. Her friend's family is going to another country for a month in December. We had a NC rule set up, but she broke it one week by texting me "I hope you are alright", I did not reply.

That is my story as of right now, and I have a few questions.

1) I am SO CONFUSED by the "You are such a good guy and such a good provider, and unconditionally love me, so I need to leave you". In two years I will be a doctor, and I can support us to move to anywhere you want, buy our house, and support her in doing ANYTHING you want with her life. I thought that is what women want, where did I go wrong?

2) Why do I feel a deep shame, guilt and emptiness? I feel like I did so much wrong in the relationship, in not being able to predict what she wanted. And that I deserved to have my heart smashed into pieces. I should have never played video games, or spend time with friends. I would of properly not take so much classes on grad school. I should have never said "no" to any of her demands. I should have never felt frustrated by her. I should have been a better boyfriend.

3) People I talked to (psychologist friends, my therapist, friends with BPD exes who also know her) said that my ex will very likely return to me and show love and affection. But they warn me to not take her back. I know that it is hard for my ex to meet people, but I still don't see why she would/ could come back after breaking my heart. And why should I not take her back.  
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Learning_curve74
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Posts: 1333



« Reply #1 on: November 26, 2013, 09:05:36 PM »

Hi mumuli, I remember story from the intro board. It sounds like you are separated from your exgf and trying to figure things out. It's not easy. 

I do not know if you read this article, but it will help you understand BPD and BPD behaviors and might help depersonalize the experience: The Symptoms and Diagnosis of Borderline Personality Disorder. The most important part I'll quote below here:

Excerpt
To the sufferer, BPD is about deep feelings, feelings often too difficult to express, feelings that are something along the lines of this:

If others really get to know me, they will find me rejectable and will not be able to love me; and they will leave me;

I need to have complete control of my feelings otherwise things go completely wrong;

I have to adapt my needs to other people's wishes, otherwise they will leave me or attack me;

I am an evil person and I need to be punished for it;

Other people are evil and abuse you;

If someone fails to keep a promise, that person can no longer be trusted;

If I trust someone, I run a great risk of getting hurt or disappointed;

If you comply with someone's request, you run the risk of losing yourself;

If you refuse someone's request, you run the risk of losing that person;

I will always be alone;

I can't manage by myself, I need someone I can fall back on;

There is no one who really cares about me, who will be available to help me, and whom I can fall back on;

I don't really know what I want;

I will never get what I want;

I'm powerless and vulnerable and I can't protect myself;.

I have no control of myself;

I can't discipline myself;

My feelings and opinions are unfounded;

Other people are not willing or helpful.

To the family members, BPD behavior is often very frustrating can feel unfair and punitive - something like this:

You have been viewed as overly good and then overly bad;

You have been the focus of unprovoked anger or hurtful actions, alternating with periods when the family member acts perfectly normal and very loving;

Things that you have said or done have been twisted and used against you;

You are accused of things you never did or said?

You often find yourself defending and justifying your intentions;

You find yourself concealing what you think or feel because you are not heard;

You feel manipulated, controlled, and sometimes lied to.

As such, the most obvious "symptom" of Borderline Personality Disorder is a lifelong pattern of instability in interpersonal relationships, self-image and emotions.

Take a look at how some of the thoughts are very contradictory, e.g. If you comply with someone's request, you run the risk of losing yourself VS.

If you refuse someone's request, you run the risk of losing that person; and I don't really know what I want VS. I will never get what I want. There is a reason a pwBPD's thought processes are considered disordered. For example, if she doesn't really know what she wants, then what difference does it make if she never gets what she wants -- what's so disappointing about not getting what you don't know you want? HUH? It's crazy to have anxiety about these two exact things!



1) I am SO CONFUSED by the "You are such a good guy and such a good provider, and unconditionally love me, so I need to leave you". In two years I will be a doctor, and I can support us to move to anywhere you want, buy our house, and support her in doing ANYTHING you want with her life. I thought that is what women want, where did I go wrong?

If your exgf has BPD, it's not a simple matter of what she "wants"... .as you saw above, it is hard to tell for sure what she wants, and in fact how do you know what anybody wants except for maybe yourself? If you want to understand why a person does what they do, then you must think like they do. If you cannot twist your mind into her crazy disordered patterns of thinking, then it is impossible for you to understand her. And in reality, how important is it to understand her? I understand why a robber wants to steal from me, but it doesn't change the fact that I have no desire to be robbed.


2) Why do I feel a deep shame, guilt and emptiness? I feel like I did so much wrong in the relationship, in not being able to predict what she wanted. And that I deserved to have my heart smashed into pieces. I should have never played video games, or spend time with friends. I would of properly not take so much classes on grad school. I should have never said "no" to any of her demands. I should have never felt frustrated by her. I should have been a better boyfriend.

Can you explain exactly what you did wrong? Don't regular people play video games and spend time with their friends? Isn't grad school very time consuming? Are you really saying that you should never have gone to grad school, never play video games, and never spend time with friends? Didn't SHE tell you to go play video games and spend time with your friends?

Didn't you move her into your house and support her totally as far as living and school expenses go? How does it get any better than that?


3) People I talked to (psychologist friends, my therapist, friends with BPD exes who also know her) said that my ex will very likely return to me and show love and affection. But they warn me to not take her back. I know that it is hard for my ex to meet people, but I still don't see why she would/ could come back after breaking my heart. And why should I not take her back. 

She tells your friend she's not depressed just unhappy with you, but then she tells you she's depressed and that you'll leave her anyhow. A non-disordered person would think, "mumuli is so good to me, he takes care of me, and must love me deeply, he would never leave me!" Unfortunately, a BPD doesn't think that way; she probably thinks more like, "I'm worthless, everybody leaves me, look my parents both left me by dying, it's only a matter of time before mumuli leaves me." The future is a huge black wall of anxiety for her that you have no control over changing. So instead of being able to face her fears, she soothes them by running away and/or finding another friend to hang onto for dear life and dump on instead since you are now the main source and trigger of her ultimate fears. And the only thing you did to become that trigger is to get way too close, too intimate, too in love with her.

Here is the thing, mumuli, nobody can predict exactly what another person will do, as the future is open ended. Maybe you or she will get hit by a truck while crossing the road tonight, therefore it will never come to pass that she returns to you. But maybe she will try to recycle you. The question is what do you want? Do you want to go through this cycle again? BPD are very adept at playing the push-pull "game".

Hang in there, it is not easy. 
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Learning_curve74
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Who in your life has "personality" issues: Ex-romantic partner
Posts: 1333



« Reply #2 on: November 26, 2013, 09:09:59 PM »

Please read this article too: Surviving a Break-up with Someone Suffering with Borderline Personality Disorder

It describes ten beliefs that you may have that can keep you stuck:

1      Belief that this person holds the key to your happiness

2      Belief that your BPD partner feels the same way that you feel

3      Belief that the relationship problems are caused by you or some circumstance

4      Belief that love can prevail

5      Belief that things will return to "the way they used to be"

6      Clinging to the words that were said

7      Belief that if you say it louder you will be heard

8      Belief that absence makes the heart grow fonder

9      Belief that you need to stay to help them

10      Belief that they have seen the light

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Learning_curve74
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Posts: 1333



« Reply #3 on: November 26, 2013, 09:11:07 PM »

mumuli, I also have the feeling this post from user 2010 may also describe the relationship dynamic between you and your exgf. Do you identify with it?

In some relationships, the idealization phase is the partner being in lonely child stance and the Borderline being in abandoned child stance.*Both need saving* Both need attachment to stave off the pain of being alone.  This is one type of bonding seen in this community.

In this bond, both people bring core trauma to the relationship. Mirroring reenacts the earliest childhood experiences to rise up and emerge into consciousness.

In idealization, there is a dual identification and projection for both people that they have found a perfect love- however, one partner (the “lonely child”) does not yet realize that the other partner (the abandoned child= Borderline) has no whole self- and is utilizing a fantasy of a part-time good in order to fuse with the partner's part time good and become one.

The lonely child has spent much of their life becoming “one.”  When a lonely child finds an abandoned child, both parties feel needed. However, rather than truly loving the individuality of both parties- the sad, fantasy aspect of mirroring magnifies the unhealthy *needs* of both people.

When the lonely child begins to question the reality of mirroring (reality testing) this raises core traumas into activation concerning both the questioning (uncertainty) and the hope (unfulfilled expectations) of the unrealistic attachment. "Lack of inherent trust" is found in both parties at this stage.

Reality testing causes the lonely child to pull away because certain things don't add up- as you say, "the idealization phase slowly erodes."

Pulling away, even while in the lap of comfortable luxury- triggers the abandoned child issues of the Borderline. This causes panic reactions of clinging behaviors by the Borderline to prevent the retreat of their desired love object. These immature demands can look like entitlement to others, especially to a lonely child, who has learned early on to be self sufficient and to self soothe- but the entitlement markers are highly charged and emotional to a Borderline, which isn’t Narcissistic grandiosity- it’s ego deficiency and panic.

The entitlement phase brings a hidden "angry and aggressive child" out from hibernation and into full view and this usually occurs when the lonely child least expects it.  The angry child that emerges is pissed and has delusions of persecution that are ideas of reference from earlier childhood trauma. It’s at this point that the angry child (Borderline) will become enraged and try to cast off shame.  They may attempt to harm himself/herself in order to scapegoat the lonely child- who unwittingly stands-in for the earliest attachment.  This triggers the lonely child's trauma from their earliest attachment as well.

The Borderline wants so badly to be whole that they demand that the lonely child create wholeness for them- which the partner succeeds in doing early on but then relaxes. The Borderline temper tantrum, with its ideas of reference being so very childlike and fantastic, perceives the relaxation of the partner as though the attachment is split up. In order to cope, the Borderline must now find another part time perceived good object to self medicate the emotions of feeling badly from the split.  If this cannot be accomplished, the surge of limbic fear concerning anger and abandonment causes such great pain that self harm is often inflicted for relief.

The lonely child is often very surprised by this. The anger and dysregulation are in contrast to what he/she perceives are necessary for the circumstances. (The lonely child fails to see need disguised as "love."  Therefore, the lonely child seeks to understand the Borderlines ideas of reference concerning "love" in order to cope with the neediness and begins a line of questioning.  The Borderline retreats.

Lonely child is "understanding driven" and gets drawn into the Borderline acting out. The lonely child now has a mystery- the Borderline dilemma of "who am I?" This is very likely the same way that the lonely child came into existence as an “understanding driven” child. Especially when he questioned the motives of his earliest attachments during infancy and adolescence.

The lonely child *understands* the need to be held, loved and understood – because that’s what he longs for in others. The lonely child feels that in order to deal with acting out of the Borderline- the lonely child must project the aura of grace, compassion and understanding upon the Borderline and also guide, teach and show the way- because after all, that’s what the lonely child would want someone to do for him. There was a large reason that the initial mirroring (of this fixer /rescuer ego) worked so well in the idealization stage- the relationship really WAS the projection of lonely child that was mirrored, not the deficient ego of the Borderline.

In the "upside down" world of the Borderline, the lonely child is the perfect attachment to fuse to and the hypersensitive Borderline is the perfect mystery for the lonely child to try to understand.  This is the reactivation of a childhood dynamic- that forms a needy bond.

The Borderline is a perfect template with which to Header and identify with as a good object and also one to invest in to feel better about the “self.”

The understanding driven lonely child "imagines" (projects) onto the Borderline what he/she feels the Borderline identifies with. The lonely child often fills in the blanks with projective identification and the Borderline attempts to absorbs this- but it's impossible to appear as a self-directed person while taking cues and mirroring another self directed partner.

The Borderline scrambles to keep up with what is projected in a chameleon like manner.  All of this pressure to adapt and conform to the projection smothers and defeats the Borderline’s yearning for a perfect bond and triggers engulfment failure.  

Engulfment also means loss of control, annihilation fantasies and shame.  Shame activates the punitive parent that resides in their inner world, their psyche. The attachment failure has now become shame based for the Borderline.  It will soon become guilt driven for the lonely child partner.

Engulfment makes Borderlines very frustrated and angry- but Borderlines fear abandonment and choose to stuff away their fear and compulsively attempt to manage their pain. The impulsive gestures are a form of self harm that fixes the bond in a permanent chaos of action/reaction.  

Borderlines can be avoidant and passive aggressive and will do everything in their power to hide their strong emotions until they implode.  They swing wildly from abandoned child to angry child until they deflate into detached protector- who is basically a mute that doesn’t speak- or worse, speaks in word salad when confronted.

The swinging dysregulation pattern is unable to be separated and individuated and self directed. Because it cannot be self directed, it cannot be self soothed. There is no ability to defer these emotions to logic and reasoning with introspection *without* another person to blame.  This is where Borderlines are showing you the maturity stage at which they are developmentally arrested and remain stuck and frightened.

Excerpt
Devaluing is the BPD going into the punitive parent role to switch up the control ~ control was relinquished in the idealisation phase so we will attach. The further along we get in the rs ~ the BPD then feels like we are the persecutor for their failing part time self ~ devalue. Devaluing is more about projection ~ because there failing self makes them feel woeful, scared, fearful.

We all have punitive parents that exist in our heads. This is our Superego.  The criticism felt by both parties exists as guilt and shame inside our heads. This tape plays over and over and is a re-working of former traumas. It is also a huge part of what makes complementary traumas so attractive as binding agents to each other.  The lonely child has the “tyrannical shoulds” while the abandoned child has defectiveness schema- together they interact and drive each other crazy.

The understanding driven child cannot fathom how another human being does not have a “self.”  The understanding driven child has had much childhood experience with strong selves and has created a self to understand the motives of others. Lonely children have a need to have some sort of control over their destiny because so much was out of control in their childhood.

The Borderline’s idea of destiny is being attached to others for protection. The Borderline cannot fathom what it means to have a stand alone “self.”

Both parties are human “doing” for others rather than being- but there is more impulsivity in Borderline in the “offering” of themselves as objects.  (The lonely child is very particular concerning who he gives his heart to and makes decisions based upon careful consideration.)

The failure to find a healthy mature love activates the punitive parent in both people’s psyche- one for persecution and the other for failure to understand others (cloaked in rescuing behaviors)- this is the “flea” of each others psychiatric trauma that really is a very strong obsessive bond, and one of endless victimization for both parties unless one or the other becomes understanding driven toward self direction.  Guess who has the best chance?  Unfortunately, the mirrored good that the Borderline provided was a very strong drug- and the obsession is outwardly projected (as it always has been) by the lonely child in order to understand and consequently, control it.

It’s at this point that spying, engaging in testing and push/pull behaviors occur as both parties fight for control. Each pours salt in the others core wound.

The understanding driven child tries to understand the Borderline and the Borderline feels misunderstood and persecuted. The understanding driven child retreats to repair their ego and the Borderline lashes out and tries to shame him. The pendulum swings back and forth in clinging and hating and disordered thought and chaos.  

The lonely child tries to uncover what they think the Borderline is hiding from them (triggering bouts of paranoia) or missing (creating dependency issues.)  The angry child threatens to destroy the relationship (as well as themselves = self harm) which triggers immense anger and outrage for both parties. Their love object is broken.

Both parties are in pain- and their egos are easy to "pinch" because they both fear abandonment.   At this point, both core traumas are exposed and the partners are no longer interacting with each other except to arouse each other’s trauma wounds from childhood.

The false self of the lonely child, that the Borderline mirrored, has more ego- as it is directly tied to a “self” which involves coping mechanisms from childhood that mirrored back good.  It was a self that was capable and seeming to have all the answers in the beginning.  When the Borderline tries to destroy it as a failed attachment, it begins to crumble and the lonely child retreats and tries to repair it- essentially wounded to the core. This is also part and parcel of the injury of the smear campaign- and the lonely child may try to return to defend the "self" from being attacked.

Trauma for the lonely child occurs mainly because of perceived failure they cannot “understand” enough (essentially an obsession at this point) and trauma for the Borderline occurs because of anger and abandonment and shame that existed since infancy- and persecution by their inner parent superego for not becoming whole.  

At this point, both parties feel like failures.

Unfortunately, the repair for the lonely child’s self consists of trying again to fix the Borderline "mirror" to reflect the good.  Many attempts will be made by the lonely child (once again) to effect an outcome other than the failed attachment.  The lonely child will try to re-build the self and get the love object (Borderline) to return and resume their compliant mirroring.

Eventually, the fantasy begins to unravel for the lonely child, that they are alone- and the person that the lonely child fell in love with, (the person in the mirror,) was actually YOU.

Who really is the Borderline? Someone who needed you for awhile because they were scared to be alone.

They’re still scared. Forgive them if you can- they are modern day recreations of their own childhood fears.

Now- after reading all of this- You can’t keep going back for more trauma.  Idea The trauma bond must be broken.

After we've let fantasy go- we can turn the focus to healing.  It's good to wonder what our attraction must have been to this person. Whatever clues you have are generally good enough to give you reason that you’ve had experience with this type of personality before- perhaps within your family of origin.

Stop yourself from thinking that you’ve never been treated so poorly before this relationship. When you catch yourself saying you can't believe it. Stop and think. Chances are- you’ve just chosen to repress a few circumstances from childhood that were traumatic. Now the feelings are back on the surface and you’re going to have to address them.

Introspection involves a great pain. Let those feelings come up. Journal your thoughts when you feel anxious. Learn about yourself. We must address the pain from our childhood that has been left unresolved for too long. We cannot escape from pain if we are to have personal growth- and you've got to get this relationship out of the way in order to get at the real hurt.

Radical acceptance comes when you realize that what was mirrored really wasn’t you- it was what *you wanted others to give to you*   It was <<Understanding.>>

Try to give that to yourself.

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Phoenix.Rising
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« Reply #4 on: November 26, 2013, 10:59:33 PM »

She said "I don't even know if I love you" and I replied "it is ok, you loved me for all these years, it is the depression. If you don't want to be affectionate, it is ok, I will be patient and wait until you get better".

 mumuli,  Have you read anything on here about using validation?  When a pwBPD tells you they feel a certain way, usually their feeling IS their reality.  When I read this part of your post, I thought about validation and how a different response from you might help the situation.

Her: I don't even know if I love you.

You: Wow, that must feel painful and confusing to not know if you love me!

(Blaming her feelings on her 'depression' is probably not validating to her.  In a sense, you are telling her she really doesn't feel that way.)

You did show her support by telling her you will be patient while she figures it out.  Good for you!

You might consider posting on the Undecided or Staying Board.  If you want to work things out with her, you're not going to get a lot of support on Leaving.  Best to you.
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