A pretty simple thought...

[Octoberfest]

I had this random thought today in the shower ( It's my dedicated time each day to think about this stuff, what? ) and thought I might share.  It isn't anything too profound, more of a technicality in how we think about this stuff, but it may cause one of you to think a little differently, and that is what this board is for!

Many times in talking to people about my BPDex and all the things that happened and the aftermath and everything else, I make a point of saying "she has Borderline Personality Disorder" and then explaining what it is.  I have been making an effort to drive home the point that, "she didn't ask to have this, she just does, it isn't her fault... . but that doesn't excuse the things she does".

So my thought:

She does not do what she does and she is not the way she is because she is diagnosed with BPD.  On the contrary, she is diagnosed with BPD BECAUSE she does what she does and because she is the way she is. 

That may have been "well duh!" for most of you, but that is an important distinction that I need to bear in mind.  Our SO's were not healthy, perfect people at one point that came down with an illness that made them into what they are.  BPD is quite literally, WHO THEY ARE.  There is no "cure" to make them go back and be "normal" again, as if BPD were some kind of flu or something.  I have often defended my ex to others saying "I see the sweet scared girl underneath the BPD, THAT'S who I love.

The truth is, that person doesn't really exist.  If they do, only in our heads.


I just hashed that out in the span of 10 minutes or so and have a commitment I need to tend to in about 10 minutes so I may expand on this later, but it is a different way of looking at things I think.

[Blade99d]

October,

While they may not have asked for BPD or NPD or any other issue, the fundamental question I have is, do they do anything about it or just continue to wreak havoc on other peoples lives?  In my case, I saw that I had hit rock bottom with my ex BPDgf.  When I told her I hated who I had beome these last few months with the drinking, the fighting, and that i made an appt with  a T, she hit the eject button and I have not heard from her since.  In a healthy relationship we would be working together on OUR problems, but like every other BPD/NPD, she is perfect and has never done anything wrong... . easier to find the next victim, than to take a hard look at ourselves.  Just my .02 cents worth.

[Octoberfest]

October,

While they may not have asked for BPD or NPD or any other issue, the fundamental question I have is, do they do anything about it or just continue to wreak havoc on other peoples lives?  In my case, I saw that I had hit rock bottom with my ex BPDgf.  When I told her I hated who I had beome these last few months with the drinking, the fighting, and that i made an appt with  a T, she hit the eject button and I have not heard from her since.  In a healthy relationship we would be working together on OUR problems, but like every other BPD/NPD, she is perfect and has never done anything wrong... . easier to find the next victim, than to take a hard look at ourselves.  Just my .02 cents worth.

Of course it is easier to find the next victim. I was thinking about this just a bit ago today actually, how my BPDex is off possibly engaged right now, most likely cheating on him too.  About what i would say if she ever managed to contact me again to try and recycle or something.  My BPDex is diagnosed, and in DBT. I think she said she graduated group a month or two ago.  Do I think she is actually better? No, not at all. You can take a CPR course, that doesn't mean when it comes down to it you can perform.  And DBT is A LOT more pervasive than a CPR course  . I thought about what if it were me, if I had all the demons that my BPDex has that I had to live with for the rest of my life.  I decided pretty quickly that I would probably turn to alcohol, drugs, and sex too just like my BPDex did.  When we remember that it is a shame based disorder, that they do what they do because they are running from themselves and the havoc they wreak in the their own lives as well as unfortunate things that have happened to them, it is no wonder that they just keep finding more "victims".  The alternative would be facing and battling all of their demons head on... . I don't know that even many normal, healthy people are capable of doing that.  Certainly there are people that do it, and they are incredibly strong minded individuals for being able to do it... . But our BPDex's, those broken shells of people? I think they will keep running for their entire lives.

[seeking balance]

This might be a good time for you to pick up the book... . The Buddha and the Borderline... . very real story of a recovered borderline.

[Blade99d]

Hi seeking,

I am actually about 3/4 of the way through that book right now . I guess what i meant to say was BPD/NPD's who choose to not seek treatment.  No doubt, kudos to those who recognize they are part of the problem in a relationship and deal with it head on. 

[seeking balance]

Hi seeking,

I am actually about 3/4 of the way through that book right now . I guess what i meant to say was BPD/NPD's who choose to not seek treatment.  No doubt, kudos to those who recognize they are part of the problem in a relationship and deal with it head on. 

What I found enlightening was even recovered technically, patterns of behavior are pretty hard wired and require tons of hard therapy, but people are who they are.

[Octoberfest]

Hi seeking,

I am actually about 3/4 of the way through that book right now . I guess what i meant to say was BPD/NPD's who choose to not seek treatment.  No doubt, kudos to those who recognize they are part of the problem in a relationship and deal with it head on. 

What I found enlightening was even recovered technically, patterns of behavior are pretty hard wired and require tons of hard therapy, but people are who they are.

Amazing... . in a single sentence you much more clearly stated what I was trying to say in the OP 

Yes, I absolutely agree. When I made the CPR comparison I was trying to comment on the fact that the things about a person or the things that person does that leads them to be diagnosed with BPD are who they are... . It is HARD to change the way you are.  It's hard to stop being a cynic, or stop being a pessimist, or a multitude of other things.  And yes, you are right on about being "technically" recovered. My BPDex may have "graduated" group therapy, but I know for a fact she skipped several meetings.  She would fill out her behavior cards 10 minutes before her therapy sessions, lie or often make up how much she drank during the past week, and overall just not complete the exercise as it was meant to be.  It was just like another homework assignment to be done at the last minute for her.

In my second post my core idea is that for pwBPD to really face those demons and solve their problems it takes A LOT of effort and A LOT of dedication.  It is a hell of a battle. 

[seeking balance]

I got what you were saying octoberfest and it is a very real "aha".

Reading that book is that "aha" in practice and since we are not emotionally invested, easier to see the bigger picture of all this.