How to deal with a serious break up and earn back her trust?

[Rev]

but right now, trying to contact her, or get her to accept your love, or to see the light, would not be respecting her, it will do the opposite of making her feel heard, and it will run counter to your goals.

Please listen to the wisdom of this one sentence.....

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[ForeverDad]

So you are telling me to give up with her for my own safety? Because you believe that anyway it will be a nightmare for me even in the future, even if I can fix this situation, or because you think her statement is irreversible?

No, her statement is not irreversible.  Many people with BPD are known to cycle between yes and no, push away then pull you back.  No one can say what she may do in the future.  But right now she has blocked you and thrown in the police/legal risk too.

It also sounds that you're trying to please her.  That's normal of course.  But when dealing with a person with BPD, that's a slippery slope, as in, where does it end?  This is at least your second break-up, right?  You're so desperate to woo her back, but isn't there a risk that even if you do restart the relationship that it could fail again?  And again?  There are no guarantees in life, but loving a person with mental health issues is a huge challenge.

[ilpablo]

Thank you for being so clear and compassionate in explaining better to me the point.

I really appreciate it.

I will write the letter, but I probably never send it to her.

I'm doing my best to be the man she always wanted on her side.

I hope she will come back

[ilpablo]

Btw, FYI:

Yesterday she watched my stories on Instagram with another profile she is using.

She didn't use that profile for a long time till now, so she is might be doing that on purpose, because if she really wanted to cut me 100% off she could just block me from that profile as well.

I opened our chat on that profile (didn't write anything) and the last messages were full of love.

What do you think? A bit more hope for me?

[ilpablo]

Also I understood what happened with her friend.

That girl is really childish and anxious. In fact, she is older than my ex gf but never had a real bf.

I remembered that and I think she is influencing my ex in a bad way against me.

This is so sad because I wrote that girl only because I know she care about her, and I was just seeking help to fix the situation and tell her to take care of my ex gf now that she is on her own.

[ilpablo]

Sorry guys, my previous messages were referring to the Once Removed's and Rev's post

It also sounds that you're trying to please her.  That's normal of course.  But when dealing with a person with BPD, that's a slippery slope, as in, where does it end?  This is at least your second break-up, right?  You're so desperate to woo her back, but isn't there a risk that even if you do restart the relationship that it could fail again?  And again?  There are no guarantees in life, but loving a person with mental health issues is a huge challenge.

I think our relationship broke apart because we both did something wrong. I'm just trying to take my part, since I know she is right on many points but till now I was mostly JADEing (aka defending myself from what I once perceived as a personal attack).

Now I'm studying this forum every single day and I believe I was never even close to the knowledge and the awareness that I feel right now about this situation.

That's why I think she should know, and I should prove myself this way. If we get back together I will also try to set boundaries and involve her in having a better communication/behavior towards each other (and I'm pretty sure I can better manage to communicate this myself now).

This is our second brake up.

First brake up was last December, then we got back together in February and things were going super good until we broke up at the end of June. Since then we were talking from time to time, we dated different girls/guys, till I decided to try once again and restarted our communication around the 10th of October. We were doing well with a bit of flirting by both sides, till we ended again into another argument.

The argument started when she sent me a paint and I told her "how much I was missing your paints? <3"
From that point she switched her mood and became rude to me, saying that I don't understand we are not together anymore, I was trying to force her into a relationship she don't want (??), I'm bad for 100 reasons (already told me a million times), she never loved me (first time she told me this and really hurt me), etc... then everything escalated on my side too, till I offended a bit her due to my frustration.

After that the following day I sent her a stupid video on Instagram to de-escalate, but she got pissed insntead and she called me saying to leave her alone. I then asked what was the real problem, she said okay I will tell you but don't say anything it's because of your health problems.

Since I believe that my health condition (brain fog, long covid, etc...) was the major issue between us, I replied that "ofc in your dictatorship I can't even defend myself, right?" I then tried to reach her by saying I'm hurt, I'm sorry, etc... but since then she blocked me and we never talked anymore.

Now I truly believe the major issue in our relationship is the lack of mutual understanding and communication and I'm doing my best to do my part. Now after reading this forum (I'm doing this every single day since then, taking notes, etc...), I really understand how she feel and how I can better communicate with her and be a good man by her side.

Since I finally had this epiphany I truly hope I can use these new skills to make things better between us and contribute to the happiness in her life. This is really what she always wanted from me. Now that I'm fully aware, empowered with these new tools, and willing to commit myself 100% into our relationship, it would be really sad if it will never happen

[once removed]

What do you think? A bit more hope for me?

there could be. it is hard to know exactly what might go into her choice to look; its possible that it may not be for a good reason. but it tells you that youre on your radar, she has thought of you. its something.

i definitely want to encourage you not to take it as a sign to reach out. i cant tell you how many times i have seen that not only here, but in my life, where someone sees social media peeking and decides its a good idea to reach out, and finds out otherwise.

what not chasing her or contacting her does, is give the opportunity for the ice to thaw. she may even feel bad about how things ended. she might reach out when that happens, though she might not. but its the only real card you can play, and its the best one.

Now that I'm fully aware, empowered with these new tools, and willing to commit myself 100% into our relationship, it would be really sad if it will never happen

i learned them long after my relationship ended, and i know what you mean. the thing is, i use them all the time, with everyone in my life. whatever happens, theyll make you a better man, and a better partner.

[ilpablo]

I'm really grateful I found this place.

It is a great source of knowledge to become a better person.

And I never heard better words from anyone else in my life.

You guys are being very wise and supportive to me.

Thank you so much!

It really helps

[Rev]

I'm really grateful I found this place.

It is a great source of knowledge to become a better person.

And I never heard better words from anyone else in my life.

You guys are being very wise and supportive to me.

Thank you so much!

It really helps

ilpablo,

Thank you for your kind words. We have all been where you find yourself and it helps in our own continuing healing to pay it forward.

So thank you also for your own courage in telling your story and finding your own healing.  One day you will pay this forward to someone is hurting and confused.

Hang in there.

Reach out any time.

Rev

[ilpablo]

Hey guys, a quick update on my story.

My ex gf unblocked me from social media and WA.

Then she probably saved again my number cuz I wasn't seeing her picture before.

Still no contact.

What should I do in your opinion. Still nothing or can I make a move?

Thanks everyone for your support!

P

[SaltyDawg]

My ex gf unblocked me from social media and WA.

Then she probably saved again my number cuz I wasn't seeing her picture before.

Still no contact.

What should I do in your opinion. Still nothing or can I make a move?

Pablo,

   I know this is the bettering board; however, I will take the opportunity to ask you a tough question.  You mentioned that she had broken up with you twice before, so this will be the 3rd 'recycle' if and when she reaches out to you.  Since these relationships are cyclical in nature, are you willing to put yourself through the ordeal of a 3rd involuntary break-up if you wind up being together again?

   Also, if she just unblocked you, she could see what you are up to, and possibly block you again in a day or two (I know some social media limits how fast/often they can block/unblock).  It is not uncommon for an ex to look at their ex (you) as you have been a significant part of their lives before.  I personally would wait for her to reach out to you, at least for the first few days in case this is a temporary situation where she has unblocked you.

Once Removed said,

there could be. it is hard to know exactly what might go into her choice to look; its possible that it may not be for a good reason. but it tells you that youre on your radar, she has thought of you. its something.

i definitely want to encourage you not to take it as a sign to reach out. i cant tell you how many times i have seen that not only here, but in my life, where someone sees social media peeking and decides its a good idea to reach out, and finds out otherwise.

what not chasing her or contacting her does, is give the opportunity for the ice to thaw. she may even feel bad about how things ended. she might reach out when that happens, though she might not. but its the only real card you can play, and its the best one.

I personally would advise in light of Once Removed's advice, which mirrors my own experience.

   If she does reach out to you to reconnect.  You mentioned that you have a therapist, work with your therapist on the dynamic on what you can do to change yourself to be there for her.  If you do think she is BPD, and you want to have a relationship with her, use the tools found in the book Stop Caretaking the Borderline Or Narcissist: How to End the Drama and Get on with Life by Margalis Fjelstad

   Be sure to do self-care, and that includes consulting with your own individual therapist on this topic.  Also do stuff for yourself, that fills your 'cup'. 

   Take care with self-care.

SD

[ilpablo]

Hi everyone!

I want to give you a quick update about my story.

First of all, thank all of you for the support and useful advice you gave me in this difficult moment.

Respecting her need to stay apart and working on myself have definitely helped me to heal, better manage the situation, and ultimately bring my ex back.

Suddenly one day she texted me like nothing has never happened.

We restarted communicating and everything was great. For a while.

Now we are back into mixed feelings, one day she is talking about the future together, saying I'm the only one she ever loved and she want to live with me, etc....

The other day I'm no good for her for many reasons.

For example:

1) She told me she want to stay home instead of working. -> My answer: "It's okay for me as long as it's sustainable and it makes you happy. Maybe you can work a bit online, so you can have your own income and be independent." (I work online as well, so I proposed to help her to build her own thing, or to help me with my work, since I need help anyway and I'm going to pay someone else otherwise) -> Her answer: " No, it will never work. Because I will not able to ask you what I need, and you are not capable to deal with this situation. So we will break up, because I will be unhappy. I should never said anything like this. Now I'm even unsecure about our relationship".

2) She said all her friends "hate me", so this is a problem and ofc it's my fault.

I can share many other situations like these, but it would be pointless.

My message is not to blame her or something, I would just ask you an advice on how to deal with these situations. I'm trying to do my best, but I noticed that now it's probably even harder than before because after the brake up she is constantly questioning me, her feelings, and our relationship. For long time it wasn't like this. She was sure about us, even if all these problems were arising every other day. But the relationship itself wasn't in discussion.

So now I feel every single word counts on how things will develop between us.

Since I think you are more experienced and wise than me, I really need your help!

Thanks y'all for everything

[once removed]

The other day I'm no good for her for many reasons.

For example:

1) She told me she want to stay home instead of working. -> My answer: "It's okay for me as long as it's sustainable and it makes you happy. Maybe you can work a bit online, so you can have your own income and be independent." (I work online as well, so I proposed to help her to build her own thing, or to help me with my work, since I need help anyway and I'm going to pay someone else otherwise) -> Her answer: " No, it will never work. Because I will not able to ask you what I need, and you are not capable to deal with this situation. So we will break up, because I will be unhappy. I should never said anything like this. Now I'm even unsecure about our relationship".

2) She said all her friends "hate me", so this is a problem and ofc it's my fault.

try not to take these things as put downs.

shes communicating to you, her anxieties about the relationship going forward. they arent small matters; theyre the sort of thing couples break over regularly.

she may be dumping it on you as "your fault" (she has limited coping and conflict skills, thats where youre going to need to compensate for her deficit), but the ability for your relationship to succeed depends on the ability of the two of you to resolve conflict.

1. the work/not work arrangement - couples fight (and break up, or even divorce) over this all the time.

i dont know what the solution is (we can certainly help), but shes telling you in clear and uncertain terms that she wants to stay home instead of working. youre responding with ways she might work. shes telling you no. hear her. accept what she is saying at face value.

is that an arrangement youre prepared to live with, assuming it wouldnt change? there is no right or wrong answer; its something you really need to consider, and think through.

right now, she has a hard time seeing how it can work. can you?

2. well, what happened with the friends?

after the brake up she is constantly questioning me, her feelings, and our relationship.

it sounds like some of this is BPD, and some is natural concerns about getting back into a relationship that ended, is rocky, and concerns about the future.

your relationship ended for important, very real reasons. reasons that she had, no doubt, already been considering.

it has, for now, reconciled. the question now is to what end? to return to the old dysfunctional ways, or to chart a very different course?

it is natural that the reasons that the two of you broke up are weighing heavily on her mind. it is natural that she is testing you, in that regard. it is natural that she may be feeling pressure about it, if you fell out with her friends.

with bpd, those things will tend to be in overdrive. every little thing you do or have done may be under the microscope. "remember the time he didnt lift the lid? hes going to make a terrible father".

i joke, but, people with bpd tend to overstate and exaggerate things that are very real. shes thinking about the incompatibilities between the two of you. shes thinking that shes getting back into a broken relationship with a guy her friends dont like. shes probably wondering if she has made a mistake. and shes also probably expressing it all in an over the top way.

the trick to loving someone with bpd is learning to see through the avalanche, to the underlying thing theyre communicating. shes anxious about the relationship. she needs reassurance. she needs you to be cool. she needs you to lead.

shes also pointing to the very real fact that the two of you have unresolved conflict, and to succeed, youre going to need to learn to solve conflict in a healthier, more constructive way, where everyone feels heard; or, resolve the conflict by deciding they are irreconcilable differences. 

we have a great lesson to start on resolving conflict; its adapted a book called The High Conflict Couple, that i would highly recommend: https://bpdfamily.com/content/ending-conflict

[ilpablo]

Dear friends, BPD Fam,
thank you once again for the help and support you gave me since the time I discovered this forum.

It means a lot to me!

I didn't post anything since last December because we've got back together!

She randomly texted in the beginning of December and we restarted communicating, till we met around the end of the month. With the skills I learned here I was able to understand her needs and manage much better all the conflict situations.

We have spent a few days together before Christmas and for NYE, which our anniversary and her birthday as well.

I did my very best to make that day "perfect" in order to let her feel loved and we had a good time.

Since we restarted dating and my approach has changed, I also noticed she was putting more effort into our relationship.

I hope you can help me to address a couple of recurring issues we are experiencing.

1) The problems are not solved yet, and she tried to brake up again a couple more times.

Reasons are always the same:
- she is stressed for something else (her family, work, school, etc...)
- she get disappointed by something we don't agree on
- she become insure and her doubts raise again
- she restart thinking about all the negative things she see on me (from past situations)
- she restart picturing me as all black and want to split
- I then try to reassure her and address the issues one by one
- Sometimes it works (but it's really hard), sometimes it doesn't and she hang up the phone in the middle of the conversation

I then tell her that if she has any real issue in our relationship or  my behavior we can address this together and solve the problem, or if she is having hard time on her own for other reasons, I can give her the space she needs and we can communicate later.

Am I doing good? Do you have any other advice?

2) Also, when she wants to fight with me she always do these stuff:
- she compare me with her mother (which is the most troublesome relationship for her)
- she brings back old issues we already discussed million times (all the small things I could ever have done in the past)
- she picture our future together as black (fearing that it might be the same as her parents marriage)
- she tells me that we don't share any value (It's true that we have some differences in the way we see the world, like politics for example. But overall it's not true we don't share values, not at all. But every little difference become a gigantic issue in her mind).
- she tells me that she have good time with two of her friends, which she can't have with me
- she tells me all the negative possible things you can say to someone to make him/her feel a failure (i'm not good for this and that reason, etc...)
- she is always seeking complete attention and support from me when she have a problem (every day, multiple times usually), but when I try to explain my issues (health issues, work related issues, etc...) most of the time she doesn't even try to understand how I feel and how can this have an impact on my mood and our relationship

3) Another thing is that we live a bit far away now (2h flight, but it has always been like this).

This situation ofc complicate everything.

We are quite good to keep in touch for a while, but then things turns bad after we don't meet for some time. She is mostly seeking my effort to move close to where she is or where she want to be, and she hardly agrees on what I want.

Can you please advise me on how to deal with this situation?

4) She thinks she has ADHD, and one time while talking I suggested to check for BPD. I'm pretty sure she told me that she was diagnosed with this in the beginning of our relationship, and when I looked into the matter everything adds up. But when I mentioned the issue, she dismissed immediately the problem, telling me that she never mentioned that.

I'm trying to address the underlying causes of our fight or her mood changes, negativity, etc... without mentioning BPD openly, cuz I fear her reaction. Sometimes I think I should openly tell her about this, but last time I mentioned I thought she was upset with me because the hard relationship she has with her mother (which is probably also BPD and maybe NPD), we broke up for 6 months. What would you do in my position?

5) One last note...

I realized that I truly love her when she is not like this.

She is funny, cute, smart and we get along together quite well.

But on the other hand, now that I'm more aware of the problem, I often ask myself if this is the life I really want?
It will ever stop? I will ever feel relaxed that she is not gonna leave me from a day to another or blame me for something?

Thank's y'all!

I really appreciate your help.

Sincerly,
P

[kells76]

Hi, welcome back, ilpablo 

Glad to hear you've had a chance to try again. That must have felt really good.

These are important overall questions you're asking:

now that I'm more aware of the problem, I often ask myself if this is the life I really want?
It will ever stop? I will ever feel relaxed that she is not gonna leave me from a day to another or blame me for something?

I think in terms of your first question -- asking yourself if this is the life you want -- it's like asking yourself if you could be in a relationship with a person who uses a wheelchair. There are no right or wrong answers. Some people might be fine with that, and could easily accept and work with the partner's limitations. Another person, with different values or priorities (maybe someone who hikes outdoors a lot or climbs mountains for fun), would have to be realistic about entering into a relationship with someone limited in an area that's so important to them. If that second person couldn't radically accept the wheelchair user's limitations, he might start down a path of resentment and frustration: "Why can't you just try harder, I think you could actually walk if you tried more or got help, you know how important hiking is to me".

I would assume that "what you see is what you get" with her -- that the way she's behaving, the cycles of moods, the highs and lows, will be exactly how she will be (unless she, deciding on her own, seeks treatment). I wouldn't necessarily enter in/stay in a relationship on the hope that "she might get better". Maybe it'll help your decision making process to accept that she'll be this way for the foreseeable future.

...

In terms of your second question -- if you'll ever feel relaxed about her leaving or blaming -- it could be that the power rests with you, there, not with what she does or doesn't do.

We don't have control over what others do or say. There is not some level of control, interaction, "saying the right words", "using the tools", etc, that unlocks our ability to control or manage a partner.

Even in a "generally normal" relationship, I don't control whether or not my H stays with me, and whether or not he blames me.

I do control my values, boundaries, and responses.

Again, there are not necessarily "right or wrong" answers about our boundaries and values. Those are personal. One person may not be able to stay in a relationship with any blaming. Another person may stay in a relationship where the partner blames, but make choices to not stick around to listen to the blaming. It depends on what you are OK with letting into your life.

I wonder if it could help to reframe the issue away from "will I ever feel confident that she won't just leave me, and that she will finally stop blaming me", and towards: "As much as I feel afraid that she will suddenly leave me, and as much as I do not like being blamed, I am currently choosing to stay in this relationship. My feelings about leaving and blame are my feelings to manage -- they aren't caused by her. When I have fears about her leaving, I can accept that I don't control her, and can only do my best to work with myself. When I feel upset at being blamed, I will know that I have a choice about continuing to listen to blame, or taking a break by leaving the room."

...

I know you have more detailed questions -- we can drill down into those, too -- just thought I'd share some thoughts on your big questions first.

Any of that sound on target? Anything off base?

[ilpablo]

Hey Kells! Thanks for your prompt reply.

Yes ant advice is super welcome.

I think you addressed the most philosophical questions, and I'm thankful for that.

I will try to focus more on this for sure.

Now I'm in a bad situation again and I really need some help on the most practical issues I mentioned.

If anyone could give me any help, it will be very much appreciated.

Thanks y'all