I'm so afraid he will end his life...how can I ever break free?

[WindofChange]

Hello All. It's been months since I posted on here. I moved out of the apartment I shared with my BPD ex-fiancé last April. We still saw each other for a couple of months, then in July of last year, he took a bunch of pills and spent the day in the hospital getting his stomach pumped. (And he was angry with me for calling 911 after he told me he did this on the phone.) I couldn't take it anymore and broke off all contact with him.
That lasted two months. Then he started contacting me, telling me he was seeing a therapist every week, had an official diagnosis of BPD and cPTSD from his childhood trauma, and was working on getting better. I started seeing him again, once or twice a week. For a while, it was great. I had missed him so much, and he really seemed better, and seemed as though he was working hard to make up for all the pain he had put me through before.
But then he seemed to spiral down again. The lack of a job is getting to him. He started acting jealous and suspicious of me again, and getting upset if I wouldn't drop everything and come over when he was feeling down or anxious. I set a boundary and explained to him that with working full time and now going back to school, I could not always drive 30 minutes to see him at 8:00 at night just because he was depressed. It sounds harsh, I guess, but I was worn out myself and at one point nearly lost my job over all the anxiety I was dealing with a year ago. The past few months I've been hoping he'd rally a bit and find a job and get into a better place emotionally, so that I could gently end things.
But he is still unemployed, and has been having bad nightmares and flashbacks the past few weeks.  He is deeply, deeply depressed. When I suggest that he get some exercise (as his therapist told him to do), or give him other suggestions that I think might help, he just gets annoyed with me and tells me I'm not his therapist. He is still going to therapy every week, and he does take his antidepressant (most of the time). I got him to buy a weekly pill dispenser and I load it up every week for him--yet still he forgot twice last week and once this week. I see it when I visit on the weekends.
So, I know I complained and vented on here quite a bit several months ago, and was trying to move into a better place then. Now it seems I'm back here again, and can't seem to find a way to break free. How do you walk away from a drowning man? That's how I feel.
But I'm so tired, so worn out from it all. I hate that he's depressed, I hate it for him. But at what point is it okay to walk away? Ever? I am terrified that if I leave him now, he might kill himself. My own counselor has told me I am not responsible for another's actions... .but it doesn't feel that way. I feel stuck, trapped. I do still love him, but I know this isn't a relationship that fulfills me, and it hasn't been for a long time.
He is perfectly willing to let me pay when we go to dinner, and to borrow money from me (although I don't give him very much, he does owe me about $600 right now). He's also willing to let his ex-wife pay for dinner when they take his daughter out, and he has borrowed money from her as well.
I am very sympathetic to him for his depression, but I want an equal partner. I think he needs someone who makes a good living and who can take care of him. But that isn't me. Can anyone tell me how I can end this relationship in the most gentle way possible? And when? Should I wait a few more weeks to see if he gets better? I have been doing that for months, and he seems to get worse. I just don't know what to do. But I know I'm not happy, and I don't want to do this anymore. Sorry if I sound like a whiner, I'm just desperately seeking advice.

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[JNChell]

Hi, WindofChange. Welcome back. First off,   Sounds like you’re very torn on what the right thing to do is. I’d like to go a tad bit deeper and ask, what is the right thing for you to do for yourself? You clearly care about him and show a great deal of compassion. It’s also evident in your words that you’re emotionally drained, exhausted and unhappy. He’s clinically diagnosed with BPD and C-PTSD. I’m diagnosed with C-PTSD and it is a real struggle that I’m working on. I couldn’t imagine being borderline along side of it. I imagine that I wouldn’t be able to function. Much like your person of concern.

You want to exit the relationship so that you can live a more fulfilled life, but are concerned with how he might react to you taking charge of your life and doing what is best for you. I understand your concerns. I have some questions, if that’s ok with you. pwBPD can often times be very manipulative. Have you ever seen this in him? Also, do you feel responsible for taking care of him? Mentally ill or not, he’s an adult and needs to learn how to care for himself.

Here’s a link for a book that might be helpful if you’re interested in reading it.

https://www.amazon.com/Stop-Caretaking-Borderline-Narcissist-Drama/dp/1442238321/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?crid=3RZH6ZH2C7MSS&keywords=stop+caretaking+the+borderline+or+narcissist&qid=1551087680&s=gateway&sprefix=stop+care&sr=8-1

Only you can make the decision to leave if that’s what you believe to be the best thing for you is. Maybe one way to help you make a decision is to try to sit, set your feelings aside and determine what good can come to you by remaining where you are. What does it look like when you’re able to look at it objectively and without emotions fogging your view?

[WindofChange]

Hi JNChell, thanks so much for responding to me. I really appreciate it.
To answer your questions:  Yes, he has often been manipulative over the years. I did something that was hurtful to him early on (an inappropriate friendship with another man for about a month--nothing physical), and he used that for years to punish me, making me feel guilty, reminding me how much I hurt him, how he couldn't trust me any more. I felt Horrible about it, because I was in the wrong, after all, and I did hurt him. But for five years, I allowed him to make me feel like a terrible person and to feel that I owed him and needed to make it up to him. About a year ago, I caught him in several lies involving having dinner and drinks with other women when he was out of town for training for his job at the time. At that point, I was done being made to feel guilty over something in the past. I broke off our engagement and moved out.  
Since then, to his credit, he has made an effort to let go of the past. For me, it's been more challenging, as it was just a year ago, not six years. And there were multiple lies, not just about the dinners with other women (which he says was innocent, he just lied to "avoid conflict").  He also lied about going to work (when he still had a job). I came home early from work because I was sick one day and there he was, after telling me just a couple of hours ago that he was at work. I wondered if he was having an affair. He swears he hasn't been intimately involved with another woman. I just honestly don't know, especially after all I've read on this site about pwBPD and how unfaithful they often are.
But anyway, to (try to) summarize, I went through a painful time of detaching last spring and summer, because the intensity of my emotional involvement with him had gotten so unhealthy. When we started seeing each other again, I was very guarded with my emotions.  I have stayed that way. Although I've held onto this small hope that he would be able to heal and change, I've seen only limited evidence of it. And while I do get that it can take years of therapy for a pwBPD to really see results, I am personally just tired. I'm 52 years old. I'm done with drama.
So when I look at it objectively, what I think is that this relationship was and still is not healthy for me, and not fulfilling. I'm going to school to get my master's in counseling, which means working with people with emotional issues on a daily basis. I don't want my personal relationship to be with someone with the severe issues he has. I need to be in a Mutually supportive relationship with a relatively stable person (obviously understanding that everyone has some issues). Preferably someone who can support himself financially.  I don't want to always be the one giving, encouraging and building up. Sometimes I need that myself, and I don't get it from him, because he's just unable to do it. His issues are so all-consuming that there is no room for anyone else in the relationship to have any issues that need attention. And being completely honest, I am sometimes an emotionally intense person myself. I think he and I each need to be with someone more grounded and easy going to balance us out.
While logically, I feel it's best that we part, I have been stuck because of worrying about him. He doesn't have a strong support system. He has his therapist and his only good friends are a married couple he's known 20 years. He's not close to his family, although his stepmom does her best to be supportive of him. She suffers from anxiety issues herself, though. He has his young 8 year old daughter, so when he's down I try to remind him of her and how much she loves him and needs him.
Anyway, that's where it's at for me. I appreciate your posting the link to that book, and I will definitely check it out. Thanks!

[WindofChange]

And in reply to your other question, I have for a long time felt responsible for his mental health. I used to think if I loved him enough, supported him enough, prayed enough, that he would get better. After being in that mindset for a while, I knew no other way to relate to him. At this point, I know intellectually that I am not responsible for his actions or his current mental state. But it's still hard for me to just end things. I'm afraid of what he might do, and how could I live with myself if he did attempt (or succeed in attempting) suicide?

[JNChell]

Hi again, WoC. Thanks for responding and opening up. Congratulations on pursuing a Master’s degree in counseling. I imagine that it’s a pretty heavy work load to try to focus on that and feel a level of responsibility for your partner. It comes as no surprise that you’re entering the counseling field. Your compassion is evident.

To answer your questions:  Yes, he has often been manipulative over the years

Do you think that it’s possible that your worries over him harming himself are manipulative actions that cause you to stay in a place that you don’t want to? Suicide should be taken very seriously. I’m not minimizing by any means. You always have access to 911 should he ever threaten it.

What else has he done to manipulate you?

You mentioned an inappropriate situation with another man early on in the relationship. What happened? 5 years is a long time to hold onto a grudge and still continue in the relationship with you. This sounds like FOG. I’m sure you’ve read about it here. That’s manipulation on his part, or an unwillingness to let go of the mistake. Either way, what do you think?

there were multiple lies,

From what I’ve learned, this doesn’t change unless a conscious effort is chosen by the liar. S4’s mom once told me after being caught in a lie, and at the beginning of a recycle, that she was trying not to lie as much. Hmm. For some reason, that didn’t set the alarm bells off in my mind. I’m 42. You’re 52. I have to assume that your partner is close to you in age. Do you think that he is likely to stop lying at this point in his life?

Abusive and manipulative people stick with what works for them. As distorted as it looks to us, what they do works for them, although not really, but you get the picture.

It’s highly unlikely that he will change. You are not feeling well with him in your life. What do you want to see happen?

[once removed]

So, I know I complained and vented on here quite a bit several months ago, and was trying to move into a better place then. Now it seems I'm back here again, and can't seem to find a way to break free.

i would really encourage you not to go underwater from your support group, and to work here consistently. dont wing it.

what is going on between the two of you right now, day to day? are you living together?

[WindofChange]

JNChell, he hasn't threatened to harm himself lately. He's just very depressed, sleeping a lot. He says he's still applying for jobs but having no luck. His unemployment will run out soon. He talks about being a loser and tells me I'm too good for him and that he knows I'll find someone else eventually. He talks about being a bad father because he can't really provide for his daughter. Mom pays for health insurance and probably most of her school expenses.
In the past, he has threatened to kill himself when he was angry with me. Left the apartment and then would call and say he was standing on a bridge over the river, trying to decide whether to jump. Took several Xanax a few years ago and went driving around. It's a miracle he didn't wreck and harm himself or someone else.
As far as manipulation, he always tried to make me feel guilty for ever wanting to get together with my girlfriends or family. He isn't welcome around my mom because she strongly dislikes him. Most recently, he asked me to do something on a Saturday, go to a nice dinner that he would pay for (I often pay lately because he doesn't have much money). When I told him I had already made plans with family, he said that he's really down and really needs me, that Saturday is the only time I am usually willing to spend the night with him (we aren't living together anymore). When I told him we could do it in a week or two, he said he thought that knowing how down he is and how much he needs me would make me cancel my plans. But when I didn't, he said he feels like maybe he loves me more than I love him, because he would cancel his plans for me. I told him that sounded manipulative and he said no, he was just upset and telling me how he felt.
As for the other man 5 years ago, this was a neighbor I had asked advice from on some contracting work when I still lived in my old house. This man started coming over to check on the work, then started calling me and telling me he and his wife were having trouble and it helped him to confide in me. Then he told me he had feelings for me, etc. I told him he should talk to his wife or consider counseling...but I still kept talking to him and didn't set a firm boundary and tell him to stop calling me. And, full disclosure, I met him for dinner once as well, but nothing physical happened. Shortly after that, he started talking about divorcing his wife. I told him if that was something he wanted to do because he was unhappy, that was his decision, but not to do it because of me. I had told him numerous times I didn't feel the same as he did...but because I kept talking to him, obviously that was a mixed message. I finally told him not to call me anymore and that he should work things out with his wife.
Well, BPD bf found out after all was over because he read my journal. He went to the man's house and told his wife. My mother was angry because this was a neighbor of the family's (yeah, it's an ugly story). From that time on, she said he wasn't welcome at any family gatherings. That made it difficult to get past what had happened. Every family gathering was a reminder of the fact that I had talked to this man behind my bf's back. My mom didn't like my bf before though, and I think this was her excuse to not have to see him at all. She is a very domineering, unforgiving person--but that's another story.
So that's some background into where our relationship issues began. Now since he's been in therapy, over six months, he has referred to the stuff that happened much, much less. He's said he understands if we are to have a future together he has to work on letting it go.
The lies...We got into an argument at a restaurant when we were still engaged because he was being hateful to me. I got up and walked out, and called a female friend to pick me up. This was another time he was unemployed. When I asked him the next day if he was able to pay, he said no, he couldn't because he had no money. I went back to the restaurant and they said there was no one who hadn't paid the night before. I confronted him and he said yes, he lied to make me feel bad. He's lied to his ex-wife about things, he's lied to me numerous times over small things as well as big ones. He swears he doesn't lie anymore...but then he told me he lied recently to his ex. JNChell, he's three years younger than me. Is he likely to change? I really don't know.
Once removed, to back up a bit, he and I were engaged for a year, until last April. We had lived together a year and a half. I moved out in April, but we still saw each other for a couple of months, then were apart for two months. We are living separately. I see him once or twice a week and spend the night 2-3 times a month. We talk via phone every day and text. But my sons (both in early 20s) don't like him, my mother, sister, and friends don't like him. I'm not happy with things as they are. I keep putting off ending things, both because I'm worried about what he'll do, and because I do still have feelings for him. The physical component of our relationship was always good. I was holding out this small hope that he really was getting better and would get a job and become a responsible adult...But I still see him being manipulative and even whining to try to get his way.
He's unwilling to take a job unless it's first shift and he has weekends off, because he doesn't want it to interfere with visitation with his daughter. His apartment is a wreck (but that could be due to the depression). He sits and plays games or gets on social media or sleeps during the day. He might function better if he wasn't alone during the times his daughter isn't there. But I don't want to live with him again. I'm just tired. I feel I tried very hard for a long time. I just don't think it can work, considering my sons don't like him. And I want an equal partner. But I feel guilty.
Sorry, this is very long. Had a lot built up, I guess.

[JNChell]

Hey, WoC. I could type away, but I’d rather suggest something. Read your post. Maybe from an outsider’s POV. What do you think?

[WindofChange]

JNChell, I think I need to end the relationship, soon. Ideally, I'd like to do it without feeling the whole FOG thing. I want to just gently let go and walk away. This fear that he might harm himself and it would be my fault is what has been paralyzing to me. And the fact that when I'm with him, that attraction (amazingly) is still there, and he will hug me and bury his face in my neck like he is just desperate for comfort and affection. I still feel compassion for that injured little boy inside. But I know it's not healthy. When I'm not actually with him, I'm able to think more logically and I know that this can't work.
When I went back and read through my post, I could see the manipulation all through it. And obviously when no one else likes him because they see how he is, and they see how he treated me before.  It's just me being stuck. I know it's going to be a bad scene, and I worry about him because of his lack of a good support system. But he does have a few friends and his therapist. And he is an adult, and despite how I Feel, I Know intellectually that I am not obligated to stay. I just wanted to talk to people who have been there, who know what it's like being in this kind of relationship. He does seem very depressed and says he's having bad flashbacks at night. Do you think he's exaggerating his symptoms to me for sympathy, to keep pulling me in?

[WindofChange]

I do get that part of my problem is the fact that I have issues with codependency. That's why his seemingly intense need for me to comfort him pulls me in. I am better than I was a year ago, but I still have a ways to go. I do see a counselor twice a month, but I've been so stuck with not being able to end things that I'm also stuck as far as advancing in dealing with my own issues. I just have to take the step and then go completely NC, pray for him, and let it go. I do feel that's what I'm supposed to do. It's been so very hard for me to just take that step and Do it.

[once removed]

I just have to take the step and then go completely NC, pray for him, and let it go. I do feel that's what I'm supposed to do.

i think this would likely be pretty hard on you both, and im not sure how high the success rate would be. its a lever that would be very difficult to pull to begin with.

we have an article here that discusses "exit strategies": https://bpdfamily.com/bpdresources/nk_a125.htm

[WindofChange]

Thank you for posting the link to the article, Once Removed.  I remember reading this article last year but had forgotten about it. I guess I was thinking since I don't live with him anymore (I'm staying with my mother while I'm going back to school so I don't have to take out any loans), that it would be easier to just end things.
So the strategy is to be boring, say I'm depressed and overwhelmed, burnt out, emotionally numb, etc. At what point do I say I need time away? I'm sorry, I probably sound needy myself. I want to do this the right way. Not sure that I understand the article completely. It says to say you need time away, but not to say that maybe someday in the future things could be different. So when I say, "I need time away," he will then ask things like, "Why? For how long? Is there someone else?" Then I should just tell him, "I don't know how long,"? This part confuses me.  Wouldn't the vague answer imply that sometime in the future things could change? I get that acting depressed and dull is supposed to bore the pwBPD, but what if it doesn't work?
I'm sure I need to review these articles. I read many of them a year ago, but stress and depression have affected my memory.  If you don't mind offering any further insight on the article about exit strategies, I would very much appreciate it!

[once removed]

i think generally, the idea is to slowly detach, rather than a big bang (especially if you are worried about things escalating). tailor the specifics to your specific circumstances and the context of your relationship.

short term, he will probably press for your attention, increasingly. it sounds like hes doing that to some extent now, he probably senses your distance. the point is to not "reward" that, but to be emotionally flat, not too distant, not too present...boring.

does that make sense?

[WindofChange]

Okay. Yes, that makes sense. That will be a challenge for me. But if it's better this way, I'll work on it.

Once Removed and JNChell, I appreciate your input on this so much. My counselor agrees that I should end the relationship, as she feels it isn't healthy for me (understatement, ).  But she just advises me to pray about it and says that I'll know what to say and do when the time comes, which is a little vague for me. I've just been at a loss as to how to get it done. Thank you both!

[once removed]

i would also encourage you to stay in touch (dont go underwater), and get feedback on the developments. as i said, he is likely to sense your detachment on some level, and push for your attention, and that will probably test you. this is a strategy, and it will need tweaking as it plays out.